# Fisheye Lens Troubles...



## Stepherly (Jun 19, 2015)

I recently purchased a fisheye lens for my Nikon D3200.  I have the camera set on manual, but the pictures are all still coming out dark, almost no image.  Anyone have any tips?

Thanks Ya'll
Stepherly


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## 480sparky (Jun 19, 2015)

What lens?  What camera settings?  Post a sample so we can see so we're not (pun intended) in the dark.


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## Stepherly (Jun 19, 2015)

Rokinon FE8M-N 8mm F3.5 Fisheye Lens 
All my settings are currenty on the "normal" or "auto" setting.
And Im attempting to upload a picture, but its too big


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## 480sparky (Jun 19, 2015)

Just resize it down to about 600 pixels on the long end and save it as a different filename.


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## Stepherly (Jun 19, 2015)

In this one, I actually pointed my camera directly at my ceiling fan


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## 480sparky (Jun 19, 2015)

Camera Maker: NIKON CORPORATION
Camera Model: NIKON D3200
Image Date: 2015-06-19 20:45:57 (no TZ)
Aperture: ƒ/0.0
*Exposure Time: 0.0003 s (1/4000)*
ISO equiv: 100
Exposure Bias: none
Metering Mode: Center Weight
Exposure: Manual
Exposure Mode: Manual
White Balance: Auto
Flash Fired: No
Orientation: Normal
Color Space: sRGB
GPS Coordinate: undefined, undefined
Software: Ver.1.03

I think there's your problem.  You need bring the shutter speed way down.


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## Stepherly (Jun 19, 2015)

I brought the shutter down to 1 sec, photos are the same.  hmmm...
Thanks for trying.


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## 480sparky (Jun 19, 2015)

Stepherly said:


> I brought the shutter down to 1 sec, photos are the same.  hmmm...
> Thanks for trying.



Are you still in manual?  If so, is the shutter speed all you're changing?


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## jake337 (Jun 19, 2015)

480sparky said:


> Stepherly said:
> 
> 
> > I brought the shutter down to 1 sec, photos are the same.  hmmm...
> ...



Since it is an all manual lens, and the aperture is showing fo.o, I would guess the aperture is way to small as well.   You will have to change the f-stop on the lens.


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## 480sparky (Jun 20, 2015)

If the aperture is being reported as f/0.0, that means the lens isn't chipped.  So we have no idea what aperture is actually being used.


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## wfooshee (Jun 20, 2015)

Don't give us the EXIF data, tell us what the camera was set to, including ISO.

The Rokinon for Canon is not chipped, so the camera has no idea what the lens is set for, therefore can't put it in EXIF data. For Nikon, there is a chipped version as well as the less expensive unchipped. I have the chipped version myself, and I like the lens. It's a lot of fun!

The image is obviously underexposed. You say the camera is in manual, and 1/4000 is a very fast shutter. You said you set it to 1 second and it was the same, but we didn't  see the image there, just you saying it was the same. Still no idea what the aperture or ISO is set to.

I think the camera can be set to manual yet the ISO still could be automatic, which means the meter is STILL adjusting your exposure, even though you're in M mode, as you're only controlling two sides of the exposure triangle. If ISO is Auto, you DON'T have manual exposure control.


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## dennybeall (Jun 20, 2015)

Does sound like the iris is closed all the way. Try taking the lens off and look through the back while you move the iris lever. The iris opens for the viewfinder but when you fire -  the camera releases the iris and it goes to whatever is set on the lens.

LATE EDIT - changed "shutter" to "lens iris" duh!!


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## Stepherly (Jun 20, 2015)

My Nikon is in manual mode.  If I have it set to any other mode, it tells me that no lens is attached.  The settings are as follows...

Image quality- norm
Image size- large
White balance- auto
ISO sensitivity- 100
Max sensitivity- 6400
Min Shutter speed- 1 sec
Active D lighting- on
Auto distortion control- off
Color space- sRGB
Noise reduction- off
AF- area mode- '--'
Built in AF-assist illuminator- on

Attached is a picture after the shutter had been changed to 1 s


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## Overread (Jun 20, 2015)

What is the aperture on the lens set to - far as I know with these you have to set the aperture on the lens itself as the camera can't communicate with it. If the aperture is set way small to say f22 then you'd need a very very long shutter speed to get any kind of exposure


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## Stepherly (Jun 20, 2015)

I don't see any aperture in the settings...


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)

You need to physically change the aperture on the lens. Turn the aperture ring.


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## Stepherly (Jun 20, 2015)

That seemed to only make the pictured worse...


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)

What number did you turn it too?

Turn it to the smallest number.


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## Stepherly (Jun 20, 2015)

I set the top number to 5/1.5 and the bottom to 3.5... its pointed at a very bright light...


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## Overread (Jun 20, 2015)

Aperture -
Bigger the f number the Smaller the aperture thus the less light that goes through the lens, but the greater the depth of field

Smaller the f number the Bigger the aperture thus the more light that goes through the lens, but the less the depth of field

Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson - a good introductory book to exposure that will help you a lot.



Edit:
The Aperture Ring is the lower of the two rings (the one closest to the lens mount/camera body). The more forward ring is the Focusing ring and the numbers marked on it are the focus distances (in meters and feet with the sideways 8 being infinity focus).


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)

Try stepping outside.   Is it daytime where you are?


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## Stepherly (Jun 20, 2015)

Ill definitely check into that book you recommended. Its 6:30 pm so there's still some light out.  Just for clarity, is the aperture ring above or below the part that says Fish-eye cs?


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)

I think you need to get the basics of exposure to use an ALL manual lens.


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)

Stepherly said:


> Ill definitely check into that book you recommended. Its 6:30 pm so there's still some light out.  Just for clarity, is the aperture ring above or below the part that says Fish-eye cs?



It's below.   That 1.5 is your focus distance.   The top ring is your focus and the bottom is your aperture.


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)




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## Stepherly (Jun 20, 2015)

I gotta say, you are my favorite person right now!   The subject in the photo wasn't very cooperative, but I can actually see it! Thank you sooo much!


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)




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## Stepherly (Jun 20, 2015)

Oh that's really helpful!  Thanks again!


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## wfooshee (Jun 20, 2015)

Also, your listing of data (again, this was EXIF data and not camera settings....) shows "Max sensitivity 6400" which implies to me that ISO is still Auto. The metering system set it to 100 because of the brightness of the subject. Allowing the camera to set ISO WILL take some exposure control away from you.

Also, this may be a difference between the chipped version and the un-chipped version, or a difference between your D3200 and my D7000, but I have to set aperture on the camera, not the lens. I'm pretty sure that's because my Rokinon is chipped, though. I have some older non-electronic lenses that do require the aperture to be set using the lens's ring, which seems to be how you have to use yours. But yeah, the default f:22 is awfully dim for most work! 

You're probably also finding that focusing isn't exactly child's play with manual-focus lenses. Modern AF dSLRs don't have tyhe viewfinder aids for manual focusing that older cameras had, like the split-image or micro-prism ring in the center.



dennybeall said:


> Does sound like the shutter is closed all the way. Try taking the lens off and look through the back while you move the shutter lever. The shutter opens for the viewfinder but when you fire the camera releases the shutter and it goes to whatever is set on the lens.



I marked your post "Disagree" because the shutter is not set on the lens, then I realized that you may be speaking of aperture iris and not the shutter. Just explaining the clicking I did....


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## jake337 (Jun 20, 2015)

wfooshee said:


> Also, your listing of data (again, this was EXIF data and not camera settings....) shows "Max sensitivity 6400" which implies to me that ISO is still Auto. The metering system set it to 100 because of the brightness of the subject. Allowing the camera to set ISO WILL take some exposure control away from you.
> 
> Also, this may be a difference between the chipped version and the un-chipped version, or a difference between your D3200 and my D7000, but I have to set aperture on the camera, not the lens. I'm pretty sure that's because my Rokinon is chipped, though. I have some older non-electronic lenses that do require the aperture to be set using the lens's ring, which seems to be how you have to use yours. But yeah, the default f:22 is awfully dim for most work!
> 
> ...




Just a question as I've never used auto ISO with a non-PCU lens.   How would the camera know which iso to use of there is no metering going on?


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## wfooshee (Jun 20, 2015)

Unchipped doesn't mean unmetered. It just means the camera and lens don't communicate electronically. The camera doesn't know the f-stop unless it has a non-CPU menu listing and reads the aperture ring (which my D7000 has - it knows when I've mounted my 85-1.8 and reads the aperture ring) and it doesn't know the distance being focused so there is no 3D zone metering. The camera can still measure light through it, and it would work in aperture-priority, just like the old Nikon cameras used.


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## jake337 (Jun 21, 2015)

wfooshee said:


> Unchipped doesn't mean unmetered. It just means the camera and lens don't communicate electronically. The camera doesn't know the f-stop unless it has a non-CPU menu listing and reads the aperture ring (which my D7000 has - it knows when I've mounted my 85-1.8 and reads the aperture ring) and it doesn't know the distance being focused so there is no 3D zone metering. The camera can still measure light through it, and it would work in aperture-priority, just like the old Nikon cameras used.



But the D3200 will not meter ais lenses.  I don't believe they added that feature to prosumer dx models till the d7000.  At least my D90 was completely manual with ais lenses except for focus confirmation.


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## pez (Jun 21, 2015)

I love this lens. I have one for my Pentax k-mount, and it came with auto aperture setting- works great.


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## wfooshee (Jun 21, 2015)

jake337 said:


> wfooshee said:
> 
> 
> > Unchipped doesn't mean unmetered. It just means the camera and lens don't communicate electronically. The camera doesn't know the f-stop unless it has a non-CPU menu listing and reads the aperture ring (which my D7000 has - it knows when I've mounted my 85-1.8 and reads the aperture ring) and it doesn't know the distance being focused so there is no 3D zone metering. The camera can still measure light through it, and it would work in aperture-priority, just like the old Nikon cameras used.
> ...



You're right with that, and I'd forgotten the link to metering only "smart" lenses in the consumer cameras. I stand corrected.


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## jake337 (Jun 21, 2015)

wfooshee said:


> jake337 said:
> 
> 
> > wfooshee said:
> ...



But that still leaves the question as to what your camera will do if left in auto ISO with a non-PCU lens on a camera that doesn't meter.

Does it just go with the highest ISO you have selected?


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## wfooshee (Jun 21, 2015)

If it's not metering, it probably does nothing. But still, I don't like auto-ISO, generally.


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## TCampbell (Jun 21, 2015)

Cameras in full auto mode tend to use something called the "program line".  The camera attempts to use a middle/safe exposure.  In very low light you force it's hand and it has to max the ISO and max the aperture size in an effort to not have an extremely slow shutter speed.  But once the shutter speed is fast enough for handheld photography based on the focal length of the lens, the camera will start backing off on the aperture and ISO.

If the camera can get back to base ISO and the shutter speed is fast enough for hand-held photography, it will start using a faster shutter speed AND using a smaller aperture and it will do this in roughly equal parts.

You can do a Google search for "program line" and should be able to find articles that explain how it works.  It will be different for every lens.

For a manual lens, however, it can't read or control anything about the lens.  I don't know what it will try to do.


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## Derrel (Jun 21, 2015)

This is a non-CPU lens in F-mount, so on a baby Nikon both ambient light exposures AND flash exposures can be made ****ONLY**** in manual modes. The pop-up flash must be set to manual flash power control; there is no automatic flash metering. Since the baby Nikons (D40,D40x,D60,D3000-series, and D5000-series) also have no AI-indexing system (located at 1 o'clock around the mount) AND they ALSO LACK the minimum aperture sensing tab (located at 7 o'clock, outside of the lens mount), this type of lens has absolutely ZERO automated functions on the baby Nikons and ZERO communication with the metering systems. This non-CPU lens design allows a really basic lens like this Samyang to adapt to a number of generations of Nikon cameras.

On a D3200, the user must set the lens aperture on the lens; do not set the lens aperture to minimum aperture on any of the baby Nikon models, unless you wish to shoot at that aperture. Set the desired lens aperture on the lens's f/stop ring, and set the shutter in manual mode to the right speed value for the exposure, and set the ISO by hand, as desired.


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## jake337 (Jun 22, 2015)

Derrel said:


> This is a non-CPU lens in F-mount, so on a baby Nikon both ambient light exposures AND flash exposures can be made ****ONLY**** in manual modes. The pop-up flash must be set to manual flash power control; there is no automatic flash metering. Since the baby Nikons (D40,D40x,D60,D3000-series, and D5000-series) also have no AI-indexing system (located at 1 o'clock around the mount) AND they ALSO LACK the minimum aperture sensing tab (located at 7 o'clock, outside of the lens mount), this type of lens has absolutely ZERO automated functions on the baby Nikons and ZERO communication with the metering systems. This non-CPU lens design allows a really basic lens like this Samyang to adapt to a number of generations of Nikon cameras.
> 
> On a D3200, the user must set the lens aperture on the lens; do not set the lens aperture to minimum aperture on any of the baby Nikon models, unless you wish to shoot at that aperture. Set the desired lens aperture on the lens's f/stop ring, and set the shutter in manual mode to the right speed value for the exposure, and set the ISO by hand, as desired.



All this I knew and understand.   But the question is if the user had the camera set to auto ISO and switched to this,  non-cpu, lens what does the camera do with ISO?  In this case it used the highest setting @6400.  Does the camera use the highest ISO in auto or revert back to whatever ISO the camera was set to in non-auto ISO mode?


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## wfooshee (Jun 22, 2015)

If you're referring to my comment about seeing "max sensitivity" in the EXIF data, it did not use 6400, it used 100, but it showed max at 6400. That implied that auto-ISO was on, but I'd forgotten about the lack of metering on that camera with a non-CPU lens, so in this case, nothing I said about auto-ISO was actually relevant.

It will change your expected results with a chipped lens if you set exposure manually but leave auto-ISO on, or on higher cameras with an un-chipped lens (that can still meter.)


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