# learn by lighting something simple



## redbourn (Oct 17, 2016)

Instead of driving myself crazy cooking a meal, photographing it and then eating it only lukewarm, only to find that the lighting wasn't good, and then realizing that I'd have to go through the same procedure again .. "tractor language!".

I've decided to take some advice that's been offered to me by several kind people here.

Practice lighting something simple first!

So I tried something today.

The light source was on the right and there was a reflector on the left.

I will make any changes suggested and then replace the props with a cooked meal.

So what do you think?

Only about the lighting.

Thanks, 

Michael


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## astroNikon (Oct 17, 2016)

Lighting is good but the image subject itself is physically flat so lighting is easier.
Use one of your plates, use the same background you commonly use.
Then try using fruit and candies and mix up objects as your food on a plate is multiple shapes and colors creating various shadows and textures.  ie, try to recreate the complexities you have in shooting food without using cooked food.


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## tirediron (Oct 17, 2016)

astroNikon said:


> Lighting is good but the image subject itself is physically flat so lighting is easier.
> Use one of your plates, use the same background you commonly use.
> Then try using fruit and candies and mix up objects as your food on a plate is multiple shapes and colors creating various shadows and textures.  ie, try to recreate the complexities you have in shooting food without using cooked food.


Exactly this!  Make a prop meal.  It doesn't even have to be food.  Some reflective liquid (coffee & glycerine), so random shapes, some linear shapes, various colours...  You could even work with packaged food, sort of a 'still life' approach.


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## redbourn (Oct 17, 2016)

astroNikon said:


> Lighting is good but the image subject itself is physically flat so lighting is easier.
> Use one of your plates, use the same background you commonly use.
> Then try using fruit and candies and mix up objects as your food on a plate is multiple shapes and colors creating various shadows and textures.  ie, try to recreate the complexities you have in shooting food without using cooked food.



Very good advice, thank you ..


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## redbourn (Oct 18, 2016)

OK  today I set up a red plate with some props and tried to get the best lighting.

There was some glare on the plate at around 11:00 o'clock and I couldn't get rid of it.

Moved the camera and moved the reflector but it wouldn't go away.

I actually took a photo of if but lost it after formatting before take the food shot.

Anyway a little of the glare is still there in the food shot.

So how do you establish where a glare is coming from? And how to remove it?

I also need to figure out how to make skinless chicken look cooked and not rare.

 

I could drop them into a hot cast iron pan for a few moments to singe them but the dressing would get singed too.

Thanks for any feedback,

Michael


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## dennybeall (Oct 18, 2016)

If you remember that professional food photographers do not use edible food, hardly ever. So use chemicals and such to make it look good.
As to the chicken, Yes, it looks raw. Mix a wash with food color and brush them darker??
Remove the reflection in post-processing if it's being obstinate.


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## redbourn (Oct 18, 2016)

dennybeall said:


> If you remember that professional food photographers do not use edible food, hardly ever. So use chemicals and such to make it look good.
> As to the chicken, Yes, it looks raw. Mix a wash with food color and brush them darker??
> Remove the reflection in post-processing if it's being obstinate.



Thanks for the reply.

But my issue is regarding the  lighting.  I saw an unwanted reflection but couldn't find a was way to block it.

Jamie Oliver has sold over 250 million dollars of books and as far as I know he and David Loftus only use real food.

They use somebody to do the plating.

http://www.davidloftus.com/food


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## tirediron (Oct 18, 2016)

Don't worry about a tiny little reflection like that.  Fix it in post.  If you try and get it down to that level of perfection, you will drive yourself bat-s**t crazy.


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## redbourn (Oct 18, 2016)

tirediron said:


> Don't worry about a tiny little reflection like that.  Fix it in post.  If you try and get it down to that level of perfection, you will drive yourself bat-s**t crazy.



Thanks. 

But why when I saw the lone plate on the table with the reflection was I unable to get rid of it by moving both the plate and softbox.

I knew it would show in the final photo.

Mchael


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## zombiesniper (Oct 18, 2016)

redbourn said:


> There was some glare on the plate at around 11:00 o'clock and I couldn't get rid of it.


Put a piece of food in front of it. Looks like one piece of greenery would have covered it.


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## tirediron (Oct 18, 2016)

Looking at the table behind the plate, I see three white streaks which look like it might be a window with vertical blinds, narrow windows, or something similar directly behind.  I'm guessing that's the source of the reflection on your plate.


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## astroNikon (Oct 18, 2016)

redbourn said:


> dennybeall said:
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> > If you remember that professional food photographers do not use edible food, hardly ever. So use chemicals and such to make it look good.
> ...


And David Loftus is a professional photographer.
And he has a professional plater also?

I wonder if they use professional equipment too.
David Loftus has many "Masterclass" youtube videos.  He seems to be very artistic about his images using DOF to soften the image to his liking, using a Medium Format or D4 cameras.  Of the few I've looked at he does prefer natural lighting, with reflectors.


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## dennybeall (Oct 18, 2016)

........


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## chuasam (Oct 19, 2016)

Your biggest impedance is your insistence on eating the food you're trying to photograph.
Prep the food for photography and not eating if you want the photos.


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## table1349 (Oct 19, 2016)

Don't let the instagram part fool you.  Some good info here including ditching the cell phone and using a real camera.  
11 ways to take a better food photo on Instagram


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## tirediron (Oct 19, 2016)

chuasam said:


> Your biggest impedance is your insistence on eating the food you're trying to photograph.
> Prep the food for photography and not eating if you want the photos.


Can't over-stress the importance of this (and I think it might have already been mentioned once or twice).


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## redbourn (Oct 20, 2016)

tirediron said:


> Looking at the table behind the plate, I see three white streaks which look like it might be a window with vertical blinds, narrow windows, or something similar directly behind.  I'm guessing that's the source of the reflection on your plate.



 I saw the streaks too. I thought I had closed the shutters 100% but maybe not - lighting is so precise!

Thanks,

Michael


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## redbourn (Oct 20, 2016)

gryphonslair99 said:


> Don't let the instagram part fool you.  Some good info here including ditching the cell phone and using a real camera.
> 11 ways to take a better food photo on Instagram



Thanks. Will check them out.

Michael


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## redbourn (Oct 20, 2016)

tirediron said:


> chuasam said:
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> > Your biggest impedance is your insistence on eating the food you're trying to photograph.
> ...




But there is nothing that I am willing to do about it.

I was a wartime baby and food was rationed so I am not willing to paint etc good food and then throw it away.

I am self publishing and will do the best that I can with real food.

Jamie Oliver and Loftus use real food ;-)

Michael


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## photo1x1.com (Nov 17, 2016)

redbourn said:


> tirediron said:
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I highly value these words. Don´t waste food for whatever purpose. Food is thrown away every day without people thinking what effect that has on your food prices and of the prices of food for the poorer regions in the world. The more you throw away, the more expensive food will get, believe it or not. And it does make a huge difference for poor people if rice costs twice as much or even more.

Beside that real food has been a trend for the last few years. Many people and media (but not all) prefer that to the rather unreal look of the years before, using glycerine, etc.. You can use oil though to keep the food "alive" a little longer.

In regard to your photography: 
In your first image you used a 35mm f1.8 lens, but you closed the aperture pretty much to f5.6. Modern food photography works with rather shallow depth, so experience with smaller numbers and you´ll see a big change. Also try to use longer lenses to get an even shallower focus and more blur.
Get lower with your camera and shoot more horizontal to get even more blur to the background

The light streaks from the table are from the back, but the reflection comes from the right IMO. However, I wouldn´t mind the reflection too much - if you used a white plate instead, that wouldn´ be a problem at all.
You could use the window as a second light source though - open it!!! I´d use it as the main light and use the flash as backlight, BECAUSE: backlight is your biggest friend when it comes to food photography. I wouldn´ worry too much about color temperature of the different lights. Both should be close to daylight when you cook your lunch , and the table probably changes the light color more than a cloud outside would. 
I´m not the biggest food photographer, but here is just one of my straight out of camera shots to show you what pretty simple backlight can do.





I could have cleaned the silverware though 

To be honest I don´t like the table too much. Think about getting some old wood - be it real wood, or parquet floor that you can quickly set up and tear down (not the kitchen material I have used - that looks too artificial).


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## jcdeboever (Nov 17, 2016)

photo1x1.com said:


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Interesting way to eat a can of canned cat food, I would try it this way...


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## redbourn (Nov 17, 2016)

photo1x1.com said:


> redbourn said:
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## redbourn (Nov 17, 2016)

photo1x1.com said:


> redbourn said:
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Thanks very much! Some very helpful stuff!

I have some wood textures and have tried a couple. When I shoot straight  down I think they work, but when I shot at an angle I couldn't get the textures to match the angle of the photo. Maybe easier just to get a few different wood backgrounds.

The attached was shot over a year ago when I was still learning how to turn the camera on - the wood bg is a texture.

And I should have done a better job of cleaning the plate.

 

Michael


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## photo1x1.com (Nov 17, 2016)

redbourn said:


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Haha, yeah - cleaning is sometimes something that is done in photoshop, even though it would be much easier with a piece of cloth . 
I like this one better, but in general try to be a little more creative with how you set up the food. In my shot abov, the cook set up the food - so I´m not a pro in this regard either. But put less food on the plate and maybe use a bigger one. Get some topping, and put some spice on top to give it a nice touch once you´re finished.


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## Dave442 (Nov 17, 2016)

Regarding the reflection, usually a flag or a scrim can be placed to resolve the issue. The best thing to hold these are some C-stands, although I have more microphone stands laying around so I often use those to hold a flag.  The C-stands are heavier and can be placed very close together.


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## chuasam (Nov 19, 2016)

redbourn said:


> photo1x1.com said:
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There's something just not quite right with your photos but I don't know what it is. I don't know a lot about photography but I know a lot about food..I love food. I have a ton of food books


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## OGsPhotography (Nov 19, 2016)

Cook your chicken better!

 Use a bone in skin on breast the presentation would be ten times. 

Add some height to the plate. 

What is that supposed to be. Beets and lemon chicken? Coleslaw? 

Cook something people want to see/ and eat. Plate it like you care, its not a cobb salad, or is it? 

Only other meal Ive ever seen lined up like that is conb salad ir a kids meal. Is it a book for people who are scared to have their food touching? 

Turn the beets into a salad, who eats beets like that? Really where is this food " from", like what nation eats like that. Hard to get a " good" picture of " bad" food.
Maybe Im wrong. Maybe thats what Jamie Oliver does, who knows, I put his cookbooks in with the other British arses ( Ramsey). I dont buy them, them guys are soooo popular people literally give tbem to me as " gifts". I dont even think they write anymore, 99% chance they are too cool to cook, they no doubt use " ghost" writers and have a staff of " food photographers", and cooks, fakes and hacks. 

I do half respect what Jamies trying to donfor the kids school lunch program. I dont understand why hes doing it in America and not his own Island. Ramsey is highly entertaining. They can bith no doubt cook circles around me and thats ok.


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