# Predict the future for me!



## JustJazzie (Jun 20, 2014)

I'm seeing a few reviews pop up of people using the a6000 to catch birds in flight, and saying it's a perfectly capable action camera, but I'm really thinking I want FF. How long do you think it will be before they put the AF of the a6000 into the a7 type body?  I've never followed cameras before so I have no idea how long it take newer versions to emerge....a year? Five years?....it's gotta be coming....


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## robbins.photo (Jun 20, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> I'm seeing a few reviews pop up of people using the a6000 to catch birds in flight, and saying it's a perfectly capable action camera, but I'm really thinking I want FF. How long do you think it will be before they put the AF of the a6000 into the a7 type body? I've never followed cameras before so I have no idea how long it take newer versions to emerge....a year? Five years?....it's gotta be coming....



Well not a sony guy myself but from the reading I've done the a6000's autofocus system really isn't all that it's cracked up to be:

Photototo: Sony Alpha A6000 - World&#39;s fastest AF?

Probably the best portion there is the part where an a6000 user is actually trying to use it to track a kid running - rather funny that they are saying the kid is really "fast", because from my persepctive at least a running kid is dirt slow.  Unfortunately a lot of folks who test this stuff will often neglect to test whether or not the camera will actually track a moving target an cointinously autofocus, or if they do they use a very high contrast target like a bird against the open sky, so in both situations the camera is given maximum advantage.

In more real world tests, like kids playing or birds flying with trees / etc in the background, well AF systems and tracking often don't measure up to the marketing.


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## sm4him (Jun 20, 2014)

Not a clue here. The only future I can predict is that I predict that in about two hours, I will be sitting at a table somewhere, drinking a margarita and&#8230;no&#8230;.wait&#8230;I see&#8230;the vision is a bit blurry&#8230;wait for it&#8230;yes&#8230;TWO margaritas. :lmao:


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## SCraig (Jun 20, 2014)

You know, people were capturing action shots such as birds in flight long before autofocus was even invented.  In other words, virtually ANY camera is perfectly capable of action shots if used properly. Just a thought.


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## JustJazzie (Jun 20, 2014)

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/53667691

This is the review I was looking at this morning. 

You guys all convince me the a6000 isn't up to par, then I find these reviews and try to convince myself otherwise. *sigh*

Put it is possibly that the next a7 AF will be even better right?!


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## dxqcanada (Jun 20, 2014)

Who knows what Sony will do ... hard to predict what they want the A7 line to be.

AF comparison test ...


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## table1349 (Jun 20, 2014)

My prediction, since you asked for predictions, is that in about 2.8 billion years our sun will burn out ending with a beautiful yet deadly expanding of our sun that will eventually swallow up our earth and all life will of course cease to exist.  This expansion will result in a supernova of spectacular results.  

As for what Sony will do in the future?   One word of caution.  Beta Max.  

God only knows and he's to busy laughing to tell us.


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## JustJazzie (Jun 20, 2014)

gryphonslair99 said:


> My prediction, since you asked for predictions, is that in about 2.8 billion years our sun will burn out ending with a beautiful yet deadly expanding of our sun that will eventually swallow up our earth and all life will of course cease to exist.  This expansion will result in a supernova of spectacular results.  As for what Sony will do in the future?   One word of caution.  Beta Max.  God only knows and he's to busy laughing to tell us.


had to go google Betamax...... :-(


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## table1349 (Jun 20, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> gryphonslair99 said:
> 
> 
> > My prediction, since you asked for predictions, is that in about 2.8 billion years our sun will burn out ending with a beautiful yet deadly expanding of our sun that will eventually swallow up our earth and all life will of course cease to exist.  This expansion will result in a supernova of spectacular results.  As for what Sony will do in the future?   One word of caution.  Beta Max.  God only knows and he's to busy laughing to tell us.
> ...



Your Honor, the Prosecution rests.:mrgreen:

FYI, if you are so young that you had to google Beta Max perhaps you should check out this thread.  There may be some information that could be important to you in the future as you grow older.  http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/off-topic-chat/362784-ladies.html


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## JustJazzie (Jun 20, 2014)

gryphonslair99 said:


> Your Honor, the Prosecution rests.:mrgreen:


:giggle: *sigh*


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## IzzieK (Jun 20, 2014)

SCraig said:


> You know, people were capturing action shots such as birds in flight long before autofocus was even invented.  In other words, virtually ANY camera is perfectly capable of action shots if used properly. Just a thought.



What Scott said......^^^


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## JustJazzie (Jun 20, 2014)

IzzieK said:


> What Scott said......^^^



I do agree! And I would LOVE to be able to take the time to figure out how to manually focus a BIF, or action shots; My main issue is (and this is a repeat from another post) it's hard for me to find the balance between being a mom, enjoying the moment, AND getting the shot. I can't really run behind a two year old on a dirt bike with my (hypothetical) 5dmkiii, (I wiped out the other day doing this with my nex7- thank goodness I had a lens hood on!!) and when I spend so much time trying to catch that perfect BIF shot and manually focus- my toddler is trying to catch a fish by jumping In the water. I guess I am hoping that by upgrading and finding the right equipment for my needs, that I could do two things at once, since it might be faster and easier to catch that moment.....

Then I am left wondering if that's really just a pipe dream, and perhaps I should just put off that kind of photography until the kids are a little older.... Kwim?


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## TreeofLifeStairs (Jun 20, 2014)

I know the feeling of wanting to capture moments  vs wanting to enjoy those moments. My wife has been telling me to leave the camera at home lately.


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## gsgary (Jun 21, 2014)

I don't want that AF in my A7 not when you get ISO like this 
iso 16,000 no noise reduction 210mm hand held at 1/20


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## dxqcanada (Jun 21, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> IzzieK said:
> 
> 
> > What Scott said......^^^
> ...



Talk to Danny ... manual focus 500mm Canon FD lense + NEX 7 = awesome BIF


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## gsgary (Jun 21, 2014)

dxqcanada said:


> Talk to Danny ... manual focus 500mm Canon FD lense + NEX 7 = awesome BIF



Simple use focus peaking


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## JustJazzie (Jun 22, 2014)

gryphonslair99 said:


> Your Honor, the Prosecution rests.:mrgreen:  FYI, if you are so young that you had to google Beta Max perhaps you should check out this thread.  There may be some information that could be important to you in the future as you grow older.  http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/off-topic-chat/362784-ladies.html


:giggle: hey I'm not THAT young. I'm 26 years 17 weeks and 6 days okay? I don't know why everyone has to treat me like a baby still. Is it because I'm short? I'm practically 27, and for my 27th birthday I want a pony, in case you were wondering. But not just ANY pony. I want a white pony with a rainbow mane. :eyeroll: #Iamnotababyanymore



TreeofLifeStairs said:


> I know the feeling of wanting to capture moments  vs wanting to enjoy those moments. My wife has been telling me to leave the camera at home lately.


My hubby doesn't say it, but I can tell he gets annoyed sometimes....



gsgary said:


> I don't want that AF in my A7 not when you get ISO like this iso 16,000 no noise reduction 210mm hand held at 1/20


I am more impressed with the fact that you were able to get a sharp shot HANDHELD at 1/20 of a second 210mm IMPRESSIVE! I am not that steady.



dxqcanada said:


> Talk to Danny ... manual focus 500mm Canon FD lense + NEX 7 = awesome BIF


 hmmm.... Is Danny his UN? I'm drawing a blank right now on who that is, but I am pre coffee at the moment.  





gsgary said:


> Simple use focus peaking


  I've tried a few MF shots, but but the time the shutter lag is over they have usually moved. Although it came far closer than any AF shots I've tried with my camera. It actually looked in focus on the LCD.

Guess I need more practice.


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## robbins.photo (Jun 22, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> gryphonslair99 said:
> 
> 
> > Your Honor, the Prosecution rests.:mrgreen:  FYI, if you are so young that you had to google Beta Max perhaps you should check out this thread.  There may be some information that could be important to you in the future as you grow older.  http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/off-topic-chat/362784-ladies.html
> ...


Twenty seven? My goodness.  I have socks that old.  In fact I'm wearing a pair..  lol.

As for the pony with the rainbow mane, good call there.  They really are much tastier than the plain mane variety.

Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk


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## JustJazzie (Jun 22, 2014)

robbins.photo said:


> Twenty seven? My goodness.  I have socks that old.  In fact I'm wearing a pair..  lol.  As for the pony with the rainbow mane, good call there.  They really are much tastier than the plain mane variety.  Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk


You eat ponies?!?   Robbins, I think you just broke my heart. Bunnies are one thing- but PONIES?!? :'-( ponies are unforgiveable.


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## robbins.photo (Jun 22, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> > Twenty seven? My goodness.  I have socks that old.  In fact I'm wearing a pair..  lol.  As for the pony with the rainbow mane, good call there.  They really are much tastier than the plain mane variety.  Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk
> ...


Well if you have a my little pony lunch box what else are you supposed to put in it? sheesh... lol

Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk


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## JustJazzie (Jun 22, 2014)

robbins.photo said:


> Well if you have a my little pony lunch box what else are you supposed to put in it? sheesh... lol  Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk


  Well I usually stick with a juice box, string cheese, and goldfish crackers.


Ps: I'd like to know what brand of sox those are. The last 4 packs of sox I've bought haven't lasted more than 3 months! They just don't make things like they used to!


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## Derrel (Jun 22, 2014)

Thom Hogan ridicules that video, without mentioning the stores that priduced it by name in this article about the state of mirrorless AF. Focus Focus Focus | Sans Mirror &mdash; mirrorless, interchangeable lens cameras | Thom Hogan   A few excerpts from a guy who makes a living shooting, AND writing about d-slrs and mirrorless cameras.

" I took an X-T1, E-M1, and D7100 to the Galapagos in April and shot with them side-by-side. Generally, I had one of the mirrored cameras plus the D7100 with me on most shore excursions, so I was able to do real life scenario testing on some of the toughest subjects there are: small birds flying close to me and somewhat randomly. Its a real stress test of focus systems and how well they handle constant and random change in subject position."

"The more focal length youre usingespecially if its fast glassthe more the DSLRs shine compared to the mirrorless cameras."

"Most of the mirrorless continuous autofocus systems shot in bursts have some discontinuity to the burst (e.g. they slow down), even when Release Priority is selected." (ie, with the Fuji 8 frames per second slows to 4 frames a second...

"Where things start to change is when you want to shoot more than one photo in sequence (either via a burst or by pressing the shutter release in quick succession), where the subject is moving randomly and at/away from you, and when you cant keep a single autofocus sensor on the subject with reliability. Then, DSLRs (and the Nikon 1 with native lenses) start to show off their advantage. "

As far as the allegation that people have been shooting birds in flight for years: YES, mostly with EXPENSIVE, cutting-edge lenses like the old Killfit trigger-squeeze telephotos that appeared in the 1950's, so only the true experts had them. And, the "bar" has BEEN RAISED. Getting ONE or two in-focus frames is not the same thing as a modern d-slr that can shoot 29-frame buffers of 14-bit RAW files with basically almost every frame in crisp focus, all day long, for years on end. I own two of the world's BEST internal focusing telephotos from the 1976-1987 period, the 300/4.5 and the 400/3.5 ED-Internal Focus "sports/wildlife" lenses, and while they are good, a modern AF Nikkor can focus better, faster, easier, for more in focus frames over a 2-hour event than either MF lens could or can. Plus, the viewfinders on today's AF cameras are not optimized for focus ascertainment as much as for a BRIGHT view.

Like the guy in the review robbins linked to: a telezoom that's an f/3.5 to f/5 or f/6.3 or whatever is the kind of SMALL, light, affordable zoom that pairs well, and sells well with mirrorless cameras; the bigger f/4 70-200 and f/2.8 70-200 tele-zooms let in double, or four times, or eight times or more light than the slower,lighter tele zooms can, so that means the big cameras have an advantage by having more light, and greater IN-focus versus OUT-of-focus data differentiation information difference (which is how phase-detect AF works), which helps the bigger camera in tough lighting, as well as in good light conditions. Bottom line though is what Thom said: the current state of mirrorless AF,*especially for ONE-shot AF acquisition* might be good enough for the needs of *many people!!!!

*You JUST HAD a Nikon D7100 and the 70-200 f/4 AF-S VR-G Zoom~NIKKOR lens...you saw what that can do. Thom shot his D7100 next to the Sony XT-1 and the Olympus EM-1, two of the finest, best APS-C and 4.3 mirrorless bodies, using mostly the slowish but brand-new Zoom~NIKKOR 80-400 f/4.5~5.6 AF-S G VRII. The D-SALR and the Nikon zoom were better performers on tough targets, without the focus slowdowns, stall-outs, and the hesitations and slowing down of frame rates the mirrorless cams had at times. Prediction: mirrorless will get better, but traditional higher-level d-slrs like D7100 and up will ALSO get better and better. But NOT EVERY PERSON will need the focusing speed and capabilities of the d-slrs! Often, we shoot ONE, single, fast shot of a static subject: mirrorless cameras are very fast at that. And if a camera is too big and heavy, it gets left behind, so the smaller camera that is carried wins the day.


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## JustJazzie (Jun 22, 2014)

Derrel said:


> Prediction: mirrorless will get better, but traditional higher-level d-slrs like D7100 and up will ALSO get better and better. But NOT EVERY PERSON will need the focusing speed and capabilities of the d-slrs! Often, we shoot ONE, single, fast shot of a static subject: mirrorless cameras are very fast at that. And if a camera is too big and heavy, it gets left behind, so the smaller camera that is carried wins the day.



The d7100 was AMAZING. And that lens....  part of me regrets returning it to be honest, mostly because now I'm stuck saving for a mkiii, and I'm not sure how long that will take. I suppose I'm still stuck deciphering my needs, my wants, and practicality. 

I was stoked to save up for a FF, and then days like yesterday happen and I want to chuck my nex7 out the window NOW. I was trying to shoot my nephews birthday at the park (nothing serious, just some nice snap shots would have made me happy!) and when using single point AF with him against the wood chips my camera missed 8 out of 10 times. He's is WILD and there was really not time for MF, because he won't sit or stand still if his life depended on it! Then at dinner with a friend I wanted to get shots of the kids with their ice cream and I really think ff would have given me a huge advantage. I had to drop my iso to 6400 to get a decent shot in that lighting and I know I'm going to cringe when I Upload them!

So sure, I carried my camera in my purse since it was small, but perhaps I just need to invest in a bigger purse. ;-)


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## table1349 (Jun 22, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> > Twenty seven? My goodness.  I have socks that old.  In fact I'm wearing a pair..  lol.  As for the pony with the rainbow mane, good call there.  They really are much tastier than the plain mane variety.  Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk
> ...


You better stay in the good ole USA. They eat horse meat in France and dog in the Pacific rim.  I've tried both and both are good.  I'm no Andrew Zimmerman but I will try just about anything once.


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## JustJazzie (Jun 22, 2014)

gryphonslair99 said:


> You better stay in the good ole USA. They eat horse meat in France and dog in the Pacific rim.  I've tried both and both are good.  I'm no Andrew Zimmerman but I will try just about anything once.



I'd like to start breading meat rabbits, but I just don't think I could EVER eat horse or dog. :-( DH tells me I will never survive the apocalypse, and honestly- I think I'm okay with that.


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## gsgary (Jun 23, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> gryphonslair99 said:
> 
> 
> > Your Honor, the Prosecution rests.:mrgreen:  FYI, if you are so young that you had to google Beta Max perhaps you should check out this thread.  There may be some information that could be important to you in the future as you grow older.  http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/off-topic-chat/362784-ladies.html
> ...




Ive got a white pony


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## JustJazzie (Jun 23, 2014)

gsgary said:


> Ive got a white pony


Now all I need is someone good enough with PS to give me a rainbow mane! ;-) they have until feb. To get it right!


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