# Question About Weddings - Client is Unhappy and threatened to sue



## LMKPhotoFilm

I shot a wedding for a friend of a friend in October 2016. Their wedding was on the October 15th and I delivered the images by the middle of November. I gave the client around 1100 images and a 5 minute video of the wedding. I only charged $1400 as it was for a friend and I work as an editor so I am pretty quick.

The issue that came up was I also promised a photo album. I said it would take a while since I still had to receive payment for the album which wasn't remitted until the beginning of December. I ordered the album two different times and both were done incorrectly which delayed it. I probably should've been more persistent with getting it complete but between holidays and it being delayed I didn't send a completed one until the beginning of April.

The client threatened to sue me and wanted me to give her $500 as payment for a different photographer or service to do their album. I had already offered to give her a refund but she said just send the album instead. I sent it straight to her instead of me so of course it has her name spelled incorrectly.

She was very upset and told me I was unprofessional and also said I left her wedding early and I didn't use any of the images she asked me to for her album. She is incorrect on both accounts as I charged for 8 hours and my second shooter and I were at her wedding from 11AM until 9PM. She also sent me a list of the images that she wanted in the album which is what I used to create it. I didn't use random images.

Is this something that's normal for weddings? I've done a few and this one has been particularly disheartening and I feel like I really tried to deliver what she wanted in a timely manner as best I could. I gave her all the images and video in less than a month but was having trouble with the album. I made that clear but she wasn't having it. On top of which I only charged $180 for it. I attached some of the images I took and I don't feel like they are bad or look unprofessional and I only charged her $1400 for everything in total. Thoughts on the situation? Is my client fair in how she is handling the situation?

Here's a few links to the photos :
<a href="Meet Google Drive – One place for all your files</a>
<a href="Meet Google Drive – One place for all your files</a>
<a href="Meet Google Drive – One place for all your files</a>


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## Don Kondra

Five months ?  That's bad, no matter the cost. 

Also need permission to view images...

Cheers, Don


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## LMKPhotoFilm

Permission Granted


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## Cody'sCaptures

Bottom link has access to the whole album (I think). The photos look nice! Some duplicates in color then b&w it looks like. Over all she got a damn good deal.  $1400 including a second shooter with delivering over a thousand photos. I've also never seen a photographer stay to the end of a wedding.
5 months from payment does sound kinda long but not out of the  ordinary, I'm no pro thou.
 Do you have anything in writing? Any paper trail of emails? Did you put a deadline on when this item would be revived? Frankly I would offer her the refund again for the album then cut ties. At $1400+$180 your probably already making less than minimum wage with time spent. 
Interested to see what some of the pros here have to say

Zenfolio | Captures By Cody


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## LMKPhotoFilm

I have some emails. I never promised a date for the album since I knew there might be issues with small errors or the client not liking a design etc. But she did have her images and a video in about 3-4 weeks from her wedding date. 

I offered her a refund before I sent the third album and she said just send it anyway. Received it then complained in a very long text message about why it looks awful. I asked her to send it back and I'll refund her.


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## vintagesnaps

She doesn't want a refund, she wants her pictures.The ones that she's waited an awfully long time to get. I know she has the digital copies but I can understand why she's upset and wants her albums.

I'm sure some on here that do weddings will give input but in general I feel like if I take on a responsibility it's up to me to take care of it as best I can, and figure out what to do to correct any mistakes that might happen. It seems reasonable to me at this point to give a partial refund, enough to cover cost of the third album so she can get it redone herself if that's what she'd like to do. I think it's necessary to do what it takes to make it right. 

Live and learn... maybe look at some resources for future use. I've used http:///asmp.org , or PPA is another pro photographers organization that has info. on contracts, licensing usage, etc. etc.


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## Designer

LMKPhotoFilm said:


> Is this something that's normal for weddings?


I wouldn't call it "normal", but we see that a lot on here.  More typical of new photographers trying to do a professional job without the skills required to make excellent photographs and conduct his/her enterprise in a professional manner.


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## PasqualettoM

Processing delays and errors can be a huge battle no matter what your working with. 

I think this would come down to what your contractual obligations were in writing between yourself and the client. While I respect this is a friend, this transaction makes her a client. And it seems clear to me from the break down that you are describing, she is treating this more like a client/business situation than a friendship.

I didn't go through all the images but I do think some of them are blown out and some of them the DOF is off for what I would have created.(Personal preferences vary person to person though) That being said I do not see any notes where she is complaining about the images but more about the photo album and its content selection. 



LMKPhotoFilm said:


> I sent it straight to her instead of me so of course it has her name spelled incorrectly.


- I am not 100% sure if I am grasping what you are saying here, is this a situation where the name in the album is incorrect or the packaging it was shipped in was incorrect. 

If the album itself, the media YOU designed for her is incorrect then I can certainly understand her upset and frustration with this. If this is not an error caused by the printer, then you owe her another Album(or a refund) on that part hands down. If it is an error by the printer, they then owe you a replacement album. _(Of course the above is void if your contract indemnifies you from such errors) _

This is a tricky situation to comment on as it is someones _(hopefully)_ once in a lifetime event. Potential delays should be spelled out in the contract, to protect you both in this situation. What we don't know is what timelines were originally discussed and how the conversation flowed from there as the road got bumpier.  

This may be a case where you end up having to bite a loss and use it to strengthen your protection for future events. I wish you the best with the situation!


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## PasqualettoM

Side note - I am pretty sure your permissions are currently set to allow anyone accessing these images to download all of your JPEG files from the wedding. May want to lock that down unless you are covered for liability on that as the links are in an open forum, and the couples last name and identifiers are easily found. 

(Just hoping to help look out for you and not see you run into more headaches)


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## tirediron

1100 images???  Good gawd, what were you trying to do, drown them?  With respect to your statement on the quality of the images, I would strongly disagree.  This one:  IMG_0395.jpg  has blown highlights and deep shadow on the face/head, and virtually no detail in the dress.  There is way too much DoF and the background is extremely distracting.  It looks to me like It was shot with a consumer lens and/or crop-sensor camera and without any off-camera lighting at all.  An image like that should NEVER have been sent to the client.

As far as timelines & deadlines, what did your contract say?  Four to six weeks is a very respectable turn-around time for wedding images, four to five months?  Not so much.  I can't imagine what kind of album you can get for <$200, but move up to something better, eat the cost and file it under "Lessons learned".


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## Designer

LMKPhotoFilm said:


> .. 1100 images ..and I work as an editor ..


Maybe you should have done some editing.  

Even if you run your camera on "continuous", and accumulate that many snapshots, maybe you could toss out all the bad ones and produce only good ones.  And if you think that might take too long, well, you're the one who shot 1100 images.


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## LMKPhotoFilm

The 1100 was shot between me and my second shooter. I originally gave her around 600 but she kept asking for more. Also in her album I said pick around 50 that are your favourites and she picked 200. Tried to explain that's a lot but she was insistent on having an enormous album. By sent to her I meant I had the printer mail it directly to her and not to me to check. 

I'm not super new to photography. I've been at it about 8 years now. Mostly shooting live music, real estate and portraits. Shot 6 weddings in the past so it's not really a normal thing for me. Never had a client that was this unhappy though.


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## PasqualettoM

LMKPhotoFilm said:


> The 1100 was shot between me and my second shooter. I originally gave her around 600 but she kept asking for more. Also in her album I said pick around 50 that are your favourites and she picked 200. Tried to explain that's a lot but she was insistent on having an enormous album. By sent to her I meant I had the printer mail it directly to her and not to me to check.
> 
> I'm not super new to photography. I've been at it about 8 years now. Mostly shooting live music, real estate and portraits. Shot 6 weddings in the past so it's not really a normal thing for me. Never had a client that was this unhappy though.



The questions still remain though, did you have a written agreement - contract in place? If so did it outline how many images she was supposed to have? 

Was the spelling error a failure to catch during proofing, or a printer error?

Don't get me wrong, prior to reading all the post on here that I have had time to I would have thought it safe to forgo a contract with a "friend" but have readily learned that the contract is a smart move to cover both parties expectations and avoid confusion. With a contract stating X images you wouldnt have had any issues with her asking for more as it would have spelled out she would receive "up to X" number of images etc. (I'd always use "up to" rather than a set number to avoid getting burnt, but hey I'm no lawyer)


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## Designer

LMKPhotoFilm said:


> Never had a client that was this unhappy though.


I feel bad for you, and I wish you the best at trying to resolve the issues.  

Some contracts have a set price for overages, because it's fairly common for clients to want additional photos/poses/albums, etc. after the event.  If your client knew that each additional photo would cost (x) more dollars, then she could set her own level of purchasing, and you could still be paid.  

Good luck!


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## Mashburn

I produce a ton of edited images as well. And I strive at getting it to the bride in a couple weeks. 

As for albums, I just don't deal with it. I give them the option to buy it from my online print store. And they make it and see the cost and do it and deal with the time frame.

And this is going to happen if you promise something and do not give it to them in the time frame you said. Regardless it was something that wasn't your fault. 

As for her being upset over the name, she can get over it. Yeah I know she's upset with the time frame. But don't piss off the photographer. You can look at your contract and do the minimum and she'll have to live with it...... And same goes for the photographer to their clients. 

When I heated battle starts. Write what you want to back to them, so it's a hard copy if they ever take you to court. But right after you hit send, call them. Because when a client is pissed, talking to them helps a lot better than any sort of letter. 

Sent from my XT1650 using ThePhotoForum.com mobile app


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## LMKPhotoFilm

Makes sense. She calmed down and settled on a refund. She never once commented negatively on the quality or amount of images or the video. It's just disappointing that I couldn't make her satisfied at all though. Lesson learned.


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## LMKPhotoFilm

tirediron said:


> This one:  IMG_0395.jpg  has blown highlights and deep shadow on the face/head, and virtually no detail in the dress.  There is way too much DoF and the background is extremely distracting.  It looks to me like It was shot with a consumer lens and/or crop-sensor camera and without any off-camera lighting at all.  An image like that should NEVER have been sent to the client.



Don't really understand what you're saying.  The bride was running to the alter and we snapped her so no time for external lighting. Also used a Mark IV and an 85mm. Don't really get the DoF comment either. Not sure how it can have too much DoF and be distracting at the same time, especially since it was shot at f8.0.

Very confused about feedback.

Agree with the rest of your point as far as deadlines.


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## tirediron

There's always time for off-camera lighting; that's why you have it with you!  Even a simple hand-held speedlight would have made a huge difference to the exposure here.  As I said, the left side of her face, arm and dress are blown, and her right eye is in deep shadow.  There's very little detail visible in the dress.  A wedding dress is one of the highlights of the event; women can pay $5, 10 or 20K+ for them, and a bit part of your job is nail that dress. 

I understand completely that you may have to "suffer" with the location, but WHY would you shoot this at f8?  do the stairs and handrail and yellow whatever-it-is inside the house have special meaning to the bride?  This should have been a 200mm at f4 shot, NOT an 85mm at f8 shot. 

The problem with wedding photography is that there are no 'do-overs'.  If you mess it up, it stays messed up.  That's why good wedding photographers charge what they do; they have the skill to get it right the first time, [almost] every time.  IMO, based on these points, this image is one that should have been left on the cutting room floor!


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## Scoody

The image with the blown out dress is begging for off camera lighting.  Weddings and quinceaneras are a huge part of my business.  I use off camera lighting on almost every shot.  I know that you can't pose every shot and weddings are very fluid.  You have to adapt and improvise.  My assistant follows me around with a speedlight on a monopod.  She knows how to read the shadows and sets up right where I need her.  Thumbs up means increase the power on the light, thumbs down means decrease.  Point to her means zoom in pointing to my self means zoom out.

What gets me also is the 1100 images.  I promise my client 300 images.  They usually get more but never less.  My contract covers everything I can think including a meal for me and my assistant.  I also provide them edited images for an album but they order that themselves.  I shoot at most 900 images.


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## ClickAddict

I like that "meal for me and my assistant".  I don't do weddings typically, but I've seen a few posts in various forums about photographers not being offered food or a quick break to eat and in some cases being billed afterwards for the meal they did eat.


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## table1349

Your best bet in any situation such as this is to consult someone like:






Lawyers don't photograph weddings for a living and photographers should not attempt to practice law.


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## Dave442

Good to hear you worked out the refund. 

The album sounds like it was a bad idea from the start, especially if you did not have a good history with the service used. 

You may find that bride is also upset with the food, her dress and her new husband so just consider that you are getting out easy.


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## Kroneberger0408

Either way she has no case. Thought it took you way to long to deliver the album you did offer a refund for her to go somewhere else to get it done and she said no. So since you delivered everything else in a timely matter, and that was a great price and a ton of photos, she has nothing to really sue you over... Sounds like shes just being a *****...

5 months is a long time but i just saw the part where you said she wanted 500 images in it? Thats crazy... You should have just picked the best out of em and sent it to her... No one wants to look thru a album with 2oo photos in it..


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