# 12 Excuses to shoot for FREE



## KmH (Jul 16, 2010)

No holds barred here! If you can't handle blunt - DON'T READ. 

12 Excuses for Shooting Photos for Free ? and Why They?re Bogus | Black Star Rising


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## supraman215 (Jul 16, 2010)

What a whiner. This is another one of these people who wants to be able to charge whatever they want and expect people to pay. 

 "How about helping those who earn a living producing photographs by not  undercutting them?"

What? So I should try to beat someone elses price? What if I give the same price but add more value? Maybe we should get rid of Free Market photography and just have set prices that we all adhere to. Based this comment that would be the author's ideal world. 


*I like my day job in IT, but at night I am passionate about  photography.  I don&#8217;t mind self-funding my work because it gives me more  creative freedom.*


Guess what, IT guy?  When India&#8217;s night work takes over your day job,  don&#8217;t call me crying about it.  Also, don&#8217;t bother trying to make a  living from your &#8220;passion,&#8221; because you&#8217;re already doing all you can to  undermine your chances &#8212; as well as everyone else&#8217;s.
What?

How about, "If I don't charge any money people won't expect anything from me?" When they always will even if you don't charge anything.


Bottom line: If you don't value your time then no one else will either. Put the value on your time and set it at that. If your time shooting is worth $100, and your time editing is worth $200 then charge $300. If it's per photo then charge that. If someone else in your area can do the same quality work for less money than you might lose out on some work. In the same way that you might charge less then someone else and steal work from them.


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## wesd (Jul 16, 2010)

KmH said:


> No holds barred here! If you can't handle blunt - DON'T READ.
> 
> 12 Excuses for Shooting Photos for Free ? and Why They?re Bogus | Black Star Rising


hte only thing I have to say is for the people starting out "to whom his own" if you can do "free" stuff then cool, just have some balls to know when to say I need to get paid for this.  Ocational free time is one thing and free materials is anothe thing.  Maby a free shoot but charge for prints or full res shots.  To the amatures out there do what feels right, but dont give up your day job until you are comfortable with what you can and are doing with your photography.
Wes


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## Eco (Jul 16, 2010)

Excellent blog post!

With that said, I've done my fair share of free gigs to build up my portfolio....


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## Derrel (Jul 16, 2010)

I have my own 12-point list of Acceptable Free Shoot Conditions

1. She is really hot    2. Her sister is really hot    3. Her roommate is really hot
4. Her roommates (plural) are really hot    5. Her mom is really hot     6. Her daughter is really hot     7. Her cousin is really hot     8. Her niece is really hot    9. Her cousin is really hot   10. Her bar-cruisin' gal pal is really hot    11. She looks mighty cute in them jeans    12. She's got a great bikini bod

I hope you understand how important it is to do these free shoots, provided that conditions are 'right'.   Ahem....


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## carvinrocks2 (Jul 16, 2010)

Derrel said:


> I have my own 12-point list of Acceptable Free Shoot Conditions
> 
> 1. She is really hot    2. Her sister is really hot    3. Her roommate is really hot
> 4. Her roommates (plural) are really hot    5. Her mom is really hot     6. Her daughter is really hot     7. Her cousin is really hot     8. Her niece is really hot    9. Her cousin is really hot   10. Her bar-cruisin' gal pal is really hot    11. She looks mighty cute in them jeans    12. She's got a great bikini bod
> ...



Ha ha ha ha ha!  Couldn't agree more!

But I do think that doing a few free gigs when your starting out is the way to go. I hope to do a few free gigs to build up my portfolio without worrying about being sued or having a reputation ruined because I didn't meet expectations. 

So a DSLR really has a shutter life? Wow, sort of makes me think twice about buying the used 300D...


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## cfusionpm (Jul 16, 2010)

> *I like my day job in IT, but at night I am passionate about photography. I dont mind self-funding my work because it gives me more creative freedom.*
> 
> Guess what, IT guy? When Indias night work takes over your day job, dont call me crying about it. Also, dont bother trying to make a living from your passion, because youre already doing all you can to undermine your chances  as well as everyone elses.


While I'm not in IT, I do have a decent day job that I enjoy and I shoot photos as a hobby.  Then again, I'm not trying to turn that into a career.


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## rufus5150 (Jul 16, 2010)

I shot a few shoots initially at cost-of-prints only to build portfolio. They were people I already knew, however, and I drew up an NDA to sign about the prices.


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## Dwig (Jul 17, 2010)

Derrel said:


> I have my own 12-point list of Acceptable Free Shoot Conditions
> 
> 1. She is really hot    2. Her sister is really hot    3. Her roommate is really hot
> 4. Her roommates (plural) are really hot    5. Her mom is really hot     6. Her daughter is really hot     7. Her cousin is really hot     8. Her niece is really hot    9. Her cousin is really hot   10. Her bar-cruisin' gal pal is really hot    11. She looks mighty cute in them jeans    12. She's got a great bikini bod
> ...



Excellent list, though the older I get the more #5 moves up the list.

Seriously though, I don't believe a pro-wantabe should ever shoot for free. That doesn't mean that every shoot requires a money transaction. It means that all shoots should have some transferred value.

I've never shot professionally in the true sense of the term. I've never made a significant portion of my income from my photography. I have, though, on quite a number of occasions shot a job for hire or sold art prints. There have been a few occasions where there was no money exchanged.

The only two reasons that I feel a no-money transaction is justified are:

1. The shoot or album is a gift to a friend or relative. I shot a small beach wedding a few years back as a gift for a young lady that I worked with. It was my wedding present to the couple who really couldn't afford to hire a photographer.

2. Barter exchange where the photographer gets as much value as the "client". A common situation is where the model works "free" in exchange for pictures for their portfolio or other use and the photographer gains experience and perhaps images for their portfolio.


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## usayit (Jul 17, 2010)

I've never met a pro who blamed the amateur for their business problems.....


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## Morpheuss (Jul 17, 2010)

I am so amused by number 7 on the list about the IT guy. because I am an IT guy and I feel pretty secure about having a job someplace especially because I hear so many complains about the people on the other end of the phone when they call tech support... they would just rather take it to geek squad and have them fix it. He just sounds angry about his business has gone down hill a bit so he decided to ***** and complain.


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## Rekd (Jul 17, 2010)

What a whiny little douche. Seriously.

I stopped reading after the first couple of reasons, here's why:



> I&#8217;m trying to get into concert photography, so when bands have called to ask about pricing, I&#8217;ve told them, &#8220;It&#8217;s on me.&#8221;


That's right. Because bands ALWAYS call people that don't. shoot. concerts. Does he think we're stupid? Really?

And his response was just as idiotic:



> It&#8217;s a great way to break into that market known as &#8220;free.&#8221; How many times do you think musicians have screwed themselves over and given away the farm to music labels? Too many to count. Don&#8217;t make the same mistake.



What's he talking about, shooting photos or doing record labels? Stay on topic, man! If you can't base your convictions around the topic at hand you really need to find another topic.

Seriously, if this guy was worth his salt he wouldn't have to bash on people for controlling *his *destiny. 

And did anyone catch this tidbit from a previous article from this flip-flopping crybaby?



> *3. Disrespecting other photographers.* Treat others with respect and due consideration. This means, when you&#8217;re at a news event, don&#8217;t be the ass who goes in with a 14mm lens while everyone else is respecting their colleagues and staying back where a 35mm lens works so everyone can get the shot. Using the 14mm means you just may get a monopod across your skull; I&#8217;ve seen it happen.


From a guy that gets paid to both write AND do photography, all I can say about this guy is "whaaaa". :mrgreen:


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## c.cloudwalker (Jul 17, 2010)

usayit said:


> I've never met a pro who blamed the amateur for their business problems.....



:thumbup:

This article (rant) sounds like an insecure photographer who hasn't got his act together.

I've done free shoots myself and who cares? Not me because even though no money changed hands there was value in the shoots. I learned something.

The problem is not one of doing free shoots but, rather, one of how to go about it. For example, I will not shoot for free anything that will make someone else money, period. When I wanted to get into band studio work, I did a few free shoots of promo images. First, it is not the kind of photos most band would want to sell to their fans. And second, to make sure they didn't, my contract spelled out that the photos were to be used only for promotion and any other use(s) would have to be re-negotiated.

So, yes, go ahead and shoot free for experience, portfolio, etc. But do it intelligently.


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## usayit (Jul 18, 2010)

Morpheuss said:


> I am so amused by number 7 on the list about the IT guy. because I am an IT guy and I feel pretty secure about having a job someplace especially because I hear so many complains about the people on the other end of the phone when they call tech support... they would just rather take it to geek squad and have them fix it. He just sounds angry about his business has gone down hill a bit so he decided to ***** and complain.



I worked, IT, DR, and Software development..   Don't be so quick to judge as the situations heavily depend on where you live and what you do within that type of market.   Software development has taken such a big hit in the NE that it has become almost non-existent.  IT too has been outsourced heavily.  Don't be so quick to judge on salary either... the way things are here in the US, the technology worker is at a great disadvantage.  Even if we all worked for free, the cost of health care alone would still make it cheaper to send the jobs over seas.  The same is true for manufacturing people (I feel really sorry for them).  Since capitalist competition works completely different in other countries (subsidies, lower worker rights, etc)  there's no way for our manufacturing center compete on fair ground.  Again, they could pretty much work for free and it still would be cheaper to ship over seas.  

Then add on top the increasing cost of living, flat salaries (for those that are lucky to have one), falling strength of dollar, it I would be hard pressed to say "It must be ok because I'm not feeling the effects".   

Even at my current employment, I'd say 80% of my group are H1 visa workers.   Workers that had job opportunities to improve and hone their skills while the rest of the US citizens worked whatever jobs they needed to survive.  In my case, a speciality that a lot of people don't like.. so less competition.  Its depressing but that's the state of what we have to deal with as we as a country focus on the wrong things.  

I've been through a 2 year unemployment stretch which started with the loss of my "Dream" job in Unix Kernel Development in 2001.  I have just now recovered financially even thought job satisfaction is no where close.  As such, I am pretty critical of those that pass judgement on those who also have gone through hard times.

As relating this back to the topic here,   Again.. I've never heard of a professional complaining about amateurs hurting their business.  The same goes for IT and technology.  I don't feel threatened because the kid next door can build his own computer.  The professional landscaper should be threatened because I help my retired neighbors with their lawn work once in a while.. etc..   Its pathetic to do so.


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## BKMOOD (Jul 18, 2010)

I'd give this guy a firm talking to but I'm on my way out the door to shoot some hot model chick -- for free.


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## smokinphoto (Jul 24, 2010)

Good list but.. 
It's all well and good stating that you shouldn't shoot for free, but how is someone supposed to get experience/portfolio without starting somewhere.
I personally stand by that you shouldn't charge less than what you're worth, either charge full price or do it for free. As long as the reason it's free is agreed to upfront then you shouldn't have any problems down the road.
Whilst you argue it isn't, it is actually a fantastic way to network and gain confidence in the field of photography you want to go into.
Only last week I shot a conference having had no experience shooting conference's at all. As there was no price involved, there was no pressure on me so I was able to fully investigate conference photography and what I should be looking out for. It's a great way to learn. It's actually now led to some paid work due to the good job I did. Would the paid work have come about if I hadn't have worked for free? No of course not. I met lots of people there, was able to network and gain contacts and I'd now be fully confident in charging for event/conference photography.
I think a one-time free shoot in whichever genre you're looking to get into is the ideal way to be able to move into chraging. You'll have encountered all the pitfalls, and it'll be clear to your client that you're doing it for free for the experience.


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## Browncoat (Jul 25, 2010)

The writer sounds like a pretentious jerk.  He recently wrote a followup article where he explained that he meant *pros* shouldn't work for free.  Judging from the outpouring of STFU comments on forums (this link has been posted on several that I frequent) and after the blog post, it was more of an attempt at damage control than anything.

Most of his other posts revolve around money too, so I'm not surprised by his arrogance, and ignorance for that matter.  He's just another blowhard with access to the internet, so I take his words at face value: worthless.


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## Josh66 (Jul 25, 2010)

supraman215 said:


> "How about helping those who earn a living producing photographs by not  undercutting them?"
> 
> What? So I should try to beat someone elses price? What if I give the same price but add more value? Maybe we should get rid of Free Market photography and just have set prices that we all adhere to. Based this comment that would be the author's ideal world.
> 
> ...


What he's trying to say, is that if you want it to be a business, treat it that way.

Doing photography as a hobby, and doing it as a business are entirely different.

Personally, I'm a hobbyist - and I like it that way.

Hobbies cost money - businesses earn money.

Hobbies are also a lot more fun than businesses.  That's not to say that you can't have fun at your work, but if it is 'work' - 'fun' isn't the reason you're doing it.


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## IlSan (Jul 25, 2010)

I did find it a very amusing article, must admit 

On the one hand I can understand him to a certain degree. Can't say much about the USA or Europe, but here in Asia every second fellow has a DSLR and about every fourth is all of a sudden a photographer with website and all and charging money - whenever they can. Most of them however live by the - I do for free, then you come back and pay for second time - yeah, that hardly ever works - as I'll just go down the hall to the next guy offering a free shoot.

Yes, in my experience the free-of-charge-photographers have the ability to ruin some potential business for others, just due to the fact that hey, if I can get it for free, why pay.
Then, on the other hand, those that are serious about having great pictures taken, will pay for it - quality has it's price after all.

I am not saying that all the hobbyist and photo-enthusiast are less good at taking photos, honestly not. I have seen photos by amateurs (in the sense that it is not their full time profession) that blew my mind - I have worked with quite a few of them and find their attitude very enlighting - very fresh.

So, of course I understand hobbyists and people starting out in the world of photography.

But - yes, there is a but 

But the people that honestly ruin it for others are those, that buy a decent camera, flip through the manual, and take 5-10 pictures of their garden and claim they are now a landscape / garden scape photographer. Or others that buy their gear, walk through the city for a day or two and now are photojournalists....you see where I am going with this. They do not ruin it because they do that, but because they will most likely advertise themselves as photographers, either work for free or undercharge other photographers and thus - well, yes, ruin potential business.
Especially if they are not dependent on the income of photography as professional photographers are.


Hmm, how can one built a portfolio in the beginning. Well - just my 2 cents on this, but I guess one way would be to take pictures of friends, family, landscape, wildlife, urban, etc... does not have to be events / gigs or anything along those lines - and then, honestly, nobody can complain / rant that they are taking away anything from anyone - after all, I never charge my friends or family when going on vacation or for a day in the park...


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## magkelly (Jul 26, 2010)

The whole idea of the article is that you're supposed to stick with tradition and go through the whole school-master-apprentice scenario and build a portfolio that way before you charge for your services

I don't think there's anything wrong per se with that providing the school you attend has a good program and the photographer you're apprenticing with is willing, professional, and can actually teach you something worthwhile. 

That being said 99% of the supposedly "professional" photographers that I've met within the area I now live in are not willing, and seemingly can't shoot anything I'd ever really want in my own book anyway. Living in a really big city you have a lot more options and a lot more quality in terms of potential mentors. But if you're living anyplace else? Someplace more limited? 

Good luck finding anyone even minimally qualified to really mentor you or a photography program that's worth the serious money they are going to ask you to put out to pay for it. Back when I lived in CA I had several really good photographers offering to mentor me and more great classes available to me than I could take. 

But here? There's half a dozen supposedly "professional" photographers in this town and the towns around us. Only one of which here in my town is actually making any money, and from what I understand he's now struggling and has gone back to doing day job teaching just make ends meet. 

He's nice enough guy, and he seems to be a decent photographer, but there's no way he'd ever take on a student-apprentice. He's so jealous of his territory as it is that the minute I even mentioned I was going to go pro eventually he made a really big point of asking me where I intended to have a studio, what type of work I intended to do, and what time frame I was looking at for it all. 

He was downright relieved when I said I was at least 3 years down the road from having my own business to hear that I wasn't going to be doing the same type of work he was. That I said I was also likely going back to the west coast and was planning to have my business there. 

Fact is I could not do the business I want to do here. The clientele here is different and most photography jobs are geared towards doing the kinds of photography work I don't want to do, like weddings. I'm actually pretty set on going into doing portfolio work for entertainers of a particular sort, wanna be model head shots, boudoir work, maternity shoots, stock work, that kind of thing. I have no intentions of going the Bar/Bat mitzvah, wedding, party, corporate event route. 

I mean to work, but I also mean to LIKE what I am working on and it happens I tend to like shooting some very interesting things that generally don't go over too well where I live. There's good money to be made in doing what I want to do, and I won't have to court it really because once the word gets out that I do the types of stuff that I do and that I do it well? Word of mouth will take care of the clientele just fine. Fact is I wasn't even qualified to do that kind of work when I was studying out there with a photographer and yet I was always getting asked. If I have had a bit more experience and a DSLR? I would have had far more work than I could have done every week. Then again I'm not really aiming on making $100,000 a year so that suits me that level of work. I really don't need too many gigs a week to get to making what I need. 

I do believe in doing some free shooting if it benefits my portfolio. I don't see any other way to get started. Not here anyway. It's not like I have local assignments dropping into my lap every other day and it's either do a few free shoots or pay models. Actually I prefer the latter and probably will go more that route to build my portfolio because that will give me more control over where my photos end up and what they are used for. But swaps are perfectly okay by me too, so long as I get my model release and a photo credit if they are used by the client online or whatever. I'll have to do some more shots when I get to where I want to set up my studio anyway to attract the clients I want. End result I'll have a killer portfolio. I don't really care how I will get there so long as I end up there eventually. As long as I stay on track with my goals, I'm fine with doing "some" free work for a while if I have to.

That being said I usually do charge for most photo sessions, even small ones, unless I'm doing it for close personal friends because not to charge at all just leads to too many offers of work sans payment and there are only so many photos that can fit into my book, you know?

People do have to understand that a photographer has bills to pay. Once in a while no cash work is okay, particularly if it's filling a niche in my book, or I'm doing something for charity, or I'm swapping for something maybe, but even now, with mostly using a deluxe digital point and shoot, I get so many requests to do things like senior portraits, new baby shots et all, that it gets to be a bit much sometimes. 

The other day I had someone ask me to do a whole retail website. Pics and coding and all. I'm talking hundreds of items, all of which I had to take all the pics for, several hundred pages I had do all the graphics and coding for. I had to create a shopping cart for it all. It was several weeks of work really.

Now I know from asking a web guy pal here who does this all the time that a site like this usually runs in the $1500 range locally, and it can run considerably more depending upon what security is used and all. I advised the woman of that, but because I could use the money and because she is a good friend of a good friend I was prepared to do it for about half that, maybe a bit more? 

She balked at paying anything really. $100 was the figure she threw out there. My friend that she knows tried to talk me into it saying that she really needed it done, couldn't afford it when others quoted a real rate at her, and that her expanding her business depends upon it, ya ya ya, but it was very obvious to me that neither one of them had ANY idea of what it would take in terms of hours to get the job done. 

I did explain and they took the "no" nicely but I could tell that they were both a bit put out with me for not volunteering my services pro bono even though I tried to tell them what was involved and what the usual costs were for this kind of thing.  

I mean honestly though? $100 You probably couldn't even get all the product pictures all done for less than $500. The only way she is ever going to get it done for what she can afford is to shoot the pics herself with her small point and shoot, grab some free software and go for it.

I mean that's just IT.

My web guy friend, he just about died laughing when I told him she wanted to pay $100 for all that work. 

But that's the mentality you're up against when you do any kind of graphics work it seems anymore. People have no concept of what it actually takes for you to do what they want half the time. 10 hours doing a wedding pro bono is actually a lot of time, and you're also sometimes talking about engagement pics, fitting pics, shower pics, rehearsal pics etc. A quickie 2 dozen snaps at the Justice of the Peace for a couple who's wedding guest list is a dozen people at most is one thing. But being asked to show up at a church and do a 200 person wedding where the CAKE cost them 1K pro bono is just too, TOO much, and yes, I've been asked, with an upscale point and shoot no less!

(I think I told this story on here once, but stay with me, because it bears telling again it was so utterly absurd!)

This one couple asked me point blank to do their wedding pro bono. They had a big church, 200 plus people, fancy cake, caterer, limo, crystal covered dress, a whole crew of bridesmaids and groomsmen, reception with live music, the works. 

Their excuse for asking me to do it all for free? 

The wedding was running over budget and they now had to have the photos done for free or settle for pictures taken by their Moms using pocket digital cameras. Oh and btw, the band was playing for free as a wedding gift and they were hoping I'd donate my services as well for the same reason, since I knew them and all. 

Well, first off I barely knew them. The woman worked with me for a few months and we ate lunch together a few times, that's it. We were not even really friends and I did not know him at all. Secondly, I was not a pro and they knew that, I was only studying with one. Third, they also wanted the various things other than the wedding documented, so I was supposed to sit there and take pics of EVERYTHING over several days for nothing, and get this? They had no intentions of even ordering an extra meal from the caterers for me. They advised me up front that it wasn't in the budget.

So I was supposed to shoot probably for about 20 hours all total. No food, no fun, just work with a glorified point and shoot, at a wedding that probably cost more than I made that year for FREE. 

Think these people are the crazy exception to the rule? 

Nope. Not hardly, every time I turn around it seems someone is sitting there asking via a local listing for a free wedding photographer and most of them aren't planning to get married at the JOP or on the beach with only a few family members attending either. Nope, it's a full scale wedding, but actually paying a pro photographer is apparently the last thing they have a  budget for. 

I've seen that now way too many times. A wedding photographer here can charge 2-3K sometimes more, just an FYI. That's perfectly normal but actually ask someone to pay you 1/4 of the going pro rate as a student and they'll still smile and mention that "They're unfortunately broke now after paying for everything else and that since they're perfectly willing to let me use their pics for my portfolio after all that they don't think any further payment will be necessary."  

They're apparently willing to pay the bar keep, the valets, etc, etc, but a photographer? Nah, and that is why I will likely NEVER do weddings, period, unless the bride is some rich society person or something, and I get paid a million bucks right up front for the whole bloody thing!


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## Browncoat (Jul 26, 2010)

You forgot to start all that with:  "Call me Ishmael."


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## NateS (Jul 26, 2010)

cfusionpm said:


> > *I like my day job in IT, but at night I am passionate about photography. I don&#8217;t mind self-funding my work because it gives me more creative freedom.*
> >
> > Guess what, IT guy? When India&#8217;s night work takes over your day job, don&#8217;t call me crying about it. Also, don&#8217;t bother trying to make a living from your &#8220;passion,&#8221; because you&#8217;re already doing all you can to undermine your chances &#8212; as well as everyone else&#8217;s.
> 
> ...



I am in IT and due to the one above, number 7 on his list, he lost all credibility for me.  1.  I manage 4 courthouses networks/computers....how is some guy in India going to take that job away from me?  2. So...having a day job to support yourself instead of being a struggling photographer as many pros are is a bad thing?  While I don't do portrait shoots anymore, when I was, I was bad because it wasn't my "day job"?  That's pretty silly.

Apparently, according to him, you must quit your day job and jump in full force from day one if you want any chance at succeeding in making decent money from photography.  Interesting as I know a handful of people in my area that do it not as their full time job and probably make a good 30k a year doing it as a side job.


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## magkelly (Jul 26, 2010)

It was a long blurb, but Moby Dick it wasn't. It's about 821 pages too short for that! 




Browncoat said:


> You forgot to start all that with:  "Call me Ishmael."


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## RL. (Jul 29, 2010)

You almost have to start shooting for free in the beginning.  If you were getting married (which is arguably the most important event/day in both you and your bride/grooms life) would you trust and pay someone 1000.00 or 1500.00 to shoot it if they have NO Portfolio.  Let me answer that for you, *helll nooooooooooooooooo.*

I'm a student going to college and have recently begun getting heavily interested into photography.  I love love love portraits(singles/groups), landscapes, and automotive.  

I have done a few car shoots, all for free, because 
a) who would pay someone money for a service they've never done before!?
b) I didn't feel comfortable I could produce great images

But now I am pretty confident in myself with automotive photography(check out my site and let me know what ya think)

With that said I am now charging for automotive shoots, depending on what the person wants and effort it takes I'll charge about 80-120.

Now with portraituire, since I haven't done any work with anyone other than family, I agreed to do my first "client's" shoot for free this sunday.  Depending on how it goes and how comfortable and easy it is, I'll probably start charging after this shoot.

Basically my point is ppl nowadays want a website and want to see what you can produce.  Especially with me being only *22 yrs. old* people are less likely to trust/book me for professional shoots because most if not all of us assume experience/skill goes hand in hand with age.

But considering I've only been shooting for 3 months I think I have improved a lot and will continue to indefinitely with the help/support of this site and others, and all of you.  And my prices with also raise with my confidence/skill level.


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