# D600 + D810 or just a D4.  (Weddings/family)



## pab (Jul 31, 2014)

Currently have a d600 and looking for an upgrade.   I notice at times during weddings im bumping the iso and exposure compensation more than I would like and im normally shooting with my fast glass (1.4/2.8's)     I hate swapping glass in a hurry so I was really considering adding another fx body.     

Do I buy the D810 and mount glass on each or do I sell the D600 and buy a used D4  with the cash I was going to spend on a D810??


Thanks in advance

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## JustJazzie (Jul 31, 2014)

If I did weddings. (Which I don't) I would choose 2 bodies so I had 2 lens options at all times


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## Trever1t (Jul 31, 2014)

you NEED 2 bodies to shoot a wedding, even if you only carry one at a time. What if you had a mechanical failure, what would you do? (seems to me you may not be ready for shooting as primary) That said the D800 series sucks as a wedding camera (Unless you like 20 Gigabyte folders) It's not. It's a portrait and landscape body. D4 is top notch, D3 is also just fine, back that up with a D700.


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## tirediron (Jul 31, 2014)

If you've got the money, two used D3s's, if not two used D700's.


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## tirediron (Jul 31, 2014)

Trever1t said:


> you NEED 2 bodies to shoot a wedding, even if you only carry one at a time. What if you had a mechanical failure, what would you do? (seems to me you may not be ready for shooting as primary) That said the D800 series sucks as a wedding camera (Unless you like 20 Gigabyte folders) It's not. It's a portrait and landscape body. D4 is top notch, D3 is also just fine, back that up with a D700.


I think i'ts improved on the 810, but I know the buffer on the 800 fills up VERY quickly... nothing would suck more than being halfway through the recessional and then taking a 1-2 minute break while the camera 'digests' the shots.


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## chuasam (Jul 31, 2014)

Get a d610.
Stop worrying about the noise grain. For dark candid shots, just use desaturate or noise reduction in Lightroom. Only time you need the low noise low ISO is for the formal shots anyway.


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## runnah (Jul 31, 2014)

Trever1t said:


> you NEED 2 bodies to shoot a wedding, even if you only carry one at a time. What if you had a mechanical failure, what would you do? (seems to me you may not be ready for shooting as primary) That said the D800 series sucks as a wedding camera (Unless you like 20 Gigabyte folders) It's not. It's a portrait and landscape body. D4 is top notch, D3 is also just fine, back that up with a D700.



Does my iphone count?


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## Trever1t (Jul 31, 2014)

only with the optional stick on lenses.


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## runnah (Jul 31, 2014)

Trever1t said:


> only with the optional stick on lenses.



Nah, I am a purist.


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## CAP (Jul 31, 2014)

I do not know much about Nikon bodies,  But what i can say for weddings is i use my 1DX with a 70-200mm f/2.8 and my 5D Mark III with a 28-70mm f/2.8 and that is my weeding set up and i have seen many other use that or a similar setup. 


It HELPS ALOT to have 2 bodies with different lenses as there is no need to switch lenses for the ever changing environments and focal lengths at a wedding.


But i have never hit the buffer on both of my canons bodies at a weddings,  and my 1DX and 5D Mark III reports a maximum burst of about 167 continuous shots at 12/FPS on 1dx and on the 5D mark iii i don't count the buffer as at 6/FPS it never will hit the buffer with 1066x CF cards it writes faster then it can fill it up.


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## Tailgunner (Jul 31, 2014)

D4 hands down.

The D4 can click off 10 shots at one time and has a 98 capacity buffer...thats RAW files! Nikon increased the buffer with the D810 to about double the old D800 buffer size, 58 shots for RAW compressed 12 Bit for example but it's still only 5pfs. That 5fps and 40 frame buffer difference could make a huge difference in catching that right moment or missing it. Why chance it? I'm no wedding photographer but that is what I would go with if I was to start shooting weddings.


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## chuasam (Jul 31, 2014)

Tailgunner said:


> D4 hands down.
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> The D4 can click off 10 shots at one time and has a 98 capacity buffer...thats RAW files! Nikon increased the buffer with the D810 to about double the old D800 buffer size, 58 shots for RAW compressed 12 Bit for example but it's still only 5pfs. That 5fps and 40 frame buffer difference could make a huge difference in catching that right moment or missing it. Why chance it? I'm no wedding photographer but that is what I would go with if I was to start shooting weddings.



We call that technique spray and pray. 5fps is more than adequate when shooting a regular wedding.


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## Tailgunner (Jul 31, 2014)

chuasam said:


> Tailgunner said:
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Ya, I've heard that term before but it usually involves a Machine Gun, not a camera. 

Anyhow, how is 5fps any less "Spray and Pray" than 10fps if your camera only does 5fps? You understand what I'm saying? Is 5fps the magical threshold? Shooting 6 fps or more equates to "Spray and Pray? Why do you even need 5 fps when "Good Technique" is all you need to get that one good shot? I'm not saying I would click off 10fps every second, I just want the option and don't want to be standing around waiting for the buffer to clear out. I'm sorry if that bothers you, you're more than welcome to buy me the camera you feel I should use


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## tirediron (Jul 31, 2014)

chuasam said:


> Tailgunner said:
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I don't think I've EVER shot even remotely close to "full speed" - even shooting fast sports like basketball CL (Continous, Low) is more than adequate.


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## Derrel (Jul 31, 2014)

Shooting with one active camera is easier I think, and less prone to settings errors. If the light is so crappy that you need extraordinary ISO levels, maybe added light would atually be better than just mega-high ISO levels.


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## runnah (Jul 31, 2014)

Derrel said:


> If the light is so crappy that you need extraordinary ISO levels, maybe added light would atually be better than just mega-high ISO levels.



What you have to ask about ISO specs is what is the highest usable ISO. My mark 3 goes up to 25,600 but really stops being "good' much earlier. Frank High ISO numbers are just a bit of marketing hoopla.

Add a frigging flash.


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## Tailgunner (Jul 31, 2014)

tirediron said:


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I'm glad CL is more than adequate for you, which body was you using? My D7100 and D800 did better on CH shooting baseball and basket ball. My D300 did better on CL. 

Anyhow, for me, the speed of the D4 is important. It may not be important for others.


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## pab (Jul 31, 2014)

I guess I should have mwntioned I take my old faithful d90 with me as well.  Just try not to use it unless I need it (emergency or just have no time to switch glass).   My last three weddings I had my second shooter step back with different focal lengths as long as we are shooting the same subjects.   For example when in church I dont swap many lenses  but for say outside I shoot 50 or 85 while he steps back and hits it with the 70-200...   so again we generally work as a team..  

I carry my satchel with the essentials in it  including my glass.   Lets be honest its only 10 or 15 seconds max to swap glass so I dont feel like I have ever missed something because of it.


I figure the only thing holding me back from getting the D810 is the file size.   I use 64 gig class 10 csrds that start at 95mb/s so the read write I imagine would not be horrible.   But I average 1600-2000 photos on my camera per wedding.   Just wondering if I shoot in raw+jpeg how many cards that will fill..


Thanks for the good opinions though

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## Tailgunner (Jul 31, 2014)

pab said:


> I guess I should have mwntioned I take my old faithful d90 with me as well.  Just try not to use it unless I need it (emergency or just have no time to switch glass).   My last three weddings I had my second shooter step back with different focal lengths as long as we are shooting the same subjects.   For example when in church I dont swap many lenses  but for say outside I shoot 50 or 85 while he steps back and hits it with the 70-200...   so again we generally work as a team..
> 
> I carry my satchel with the essentials in it  including my glass.   Lets be honest its only 10 or 15 seconds max to swap glass so I dont feel like I have ever missed something because of it.
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I'm not sure about Jpeg since I shoot exclusively Raw. 

Anyhow, I get 400 exposures on a single 32gb card shooting in 14 Bit Raw on my D800...the second card slot is set to back up (14-bit raw as well). 

Another thing I would consider before I made up my mind is shutter life. The D800 is tested to around 200,000 while the D4 is 400,000. Thats like 100 weddings  (2,000 photos) using the D800 and 200 weddings using the D4. Probably half those numbers for me being trigger happy


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## ruifo (Jul 31, 2014)

D610 + D810


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## MSnowy (Jul 31, 2014)

D3s and flash, best of both worlds. D3s for those venues that don't allow flash and flash when you need the extra light. You can get away with pretty high iso with the D3s and good glass.

iso 12,800 nikon 70-200 vrii



iso 12,800 nikon 500 f4 vr w/ 1.4 tc


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## chuasam (Aug 2, 2014)

Tailgunner said:


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Nah, buy your own camera. It is spray and pray when you're depending on the speed of a camera to carry you. It's a wedding! Not a high speed sporting event. 

I know you're not a wedding shooter so you wouldn't know this, but having the shutter go off like a machine gun all the time would annoy the guest pretty quickly.


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## jaomul (Aug 2, 2014)

While speed on a camera is great and the D4/d3 type main bodies are probably that bit better for a wedding, anyone who would struggle with a d800 to shoot one would want to brush up on skills. 4fps is enough, as is 20 odd buffer. When the 1ds was king it wasn't near this and guys "managed". Just my thoughts, ymmv


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## greybeard (Aug 2, 2014)

How in the world did I ever manage to take weddings with my Mamiya C330 back in the day?  I will say that if I were to take it up as a business today I would use pr of D4's, one with a 24-70 and the other with a 70-200 f2.8.


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## julianliu (Aug 2, 2014)

tirediron said:


> I think i'ts improved on the 810, but I know the buffer on the 800 fills up VERY quickly... nothing would suck more than being halfway through the recessional and then taking a 1-2 minute break while the camera 'digests' the shots.



Yes it's much improved on D810. It can shoot up to 20 raw images continuously before it slows down with 30M/s SD card, I think that's enough for wedding. May not enough for sports though.


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## Tee (Aug 2, 2014)

The D4 seems to be pretty popular amongst the Nikon wedding photographers.  However, based on your scenario, I think having having two bodies is more beneficial and practical than just one.  So...based on your opening post, a D600 and D810 would be my vote.  Don't be afraid of the noise!

ETA: I think two D3s's is a good suggestion (IMO- one of Nikon's best cameras ever) but I feel we're getting to the point where buying an affordable D3s comes with crazy high shutter counts and a lot of wear and tear on the body.  If you're only shooting weddings once and while then a D3s would be a great choice.  If it's more frequent go with something more new.


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## Tailgunner (Aug 2, 2014)

chuasam said:


> I know you're not a wedding shooter so you wouldn't know this, but having the shutter go off like a machine gun all the time would annoy the guest pretty quickly.



Ya, I didn't think about that. I still would opt for a D4 due to the longer shutter life. 

Also OP, 2 of either combination bodies (D600, D800, D810, D4) will qualify you for Nikon's Pro Service membership.


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## chuasam (Aug 2, 2014)

Tailgunner said:


> chuasam said:
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You also need to prove that you're a full time professional and provide tear sheets from recent assignments. Plus you need a member to sponsor you in like the mafia. 

I'm only part time (2 or 3 days a week) working as a photographer so I'm probably considering using the NPS campus program for students.


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## Braineack (Aug 2, 2014)

julianliu said:


> Yes it's much improved on D810. It can shoot up to 20 raw images continuously before it slows down with 30M/s SD card, I think that's enough for wedding. May not enough for sports though.



I couldn't imagine shooting a D810 using a 30 Mb/sec card.


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## chuasam (Aug 2, 2014)

I do. Often for video it is fast enough and a lot cheaper. For my photography, my strobe recycling speed is often the limiter.


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## cowleystjames (Aug 2, 2014)

chuasam said:


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Don't know where you got that from, but I didn't have to do anything like that to join the NPS.


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## chuasam (Aug 2, 2014)

cowleystjames said:


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https://help.nikon.ca/app/answers/detail/a_id/8133/~/nps-membership-in-canada


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## cowleystjames (Aug 2, 2014)

You're correct, just looked. But when I joined, last year, I didn't have to provide client lists, vat, etc. they've obviously upped the ante! 
Sorry chuasam


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## Tailgunner (Aug 2, 2014)

chuasam said:


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Ya, I know. 

I've got the Pro gear and the full time business and still don't qualify. I sell my work through my show room vs licensing it out for publication. I'm not apposed to it, just have't actively pursued it. The same thing with assignments, I've never approached anyone or applied for a photography position. If someone wants to pay me to travel or shoot a game, great but we generally travel a great deal on our own.


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## D-B-J (Aug 2, 2014)

Braineack said:


> julianliu said:
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> > Yes it's much improved on D810. It can shoot up to 20 raw images continuously before it slows down with 30M/s SD card, I think that's enough for wedding. May not enough for sports though.
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Same here


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## Tailgunner (Aug 2, 2014)

D-B-J said:


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Agreed


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## julianliu (Aug 3, 2014)

Braineack said:


> julianliu said:
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I shoot 300 photos yesterday with Transcend 32G SDHC Class 10, card rate 18 MB/s writing speed! I was shooting two kids and most of the time shoot 3-4 shots one time in 2-3 seconds in single frame mode. I had no problem of shooting. Though it was delayed couple of seconds when I scroll through photos immediately after I shoot. What it means is that yes, my card is slow (my new CF card, which is 160 MB/s is on the way), but the internal buffer of the camera is impressive. As I mentioned, I can shoot 20 frames in High speed mode with 30MB/s card, imagine what I can shoot with 160MB/s CF card. I try not to shoot too many high speed photos as it increase the shutter count drastically.


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## Braineack (Aug 3, 2014)

I know immediately if I forgot to put my 90 mb/sec card back in; after just the first shot.


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## Tailgunner (Aug 3, 2014)

julianliu said:


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Which body? RAW or Jpeg? 12-bit or 14-bit?


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## julianliu (Aug 3, 2014)

Tailgunner said:


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D810, shoot raw, 14 bit lossless compressed, about 40 MB per photo.


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## pab (Aug 5, 2014)

julianliu said:


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How is raw s treating you?   I mean the camera is basically a d4s minus battery life, fps, and iso levels I will never use. I generally grip it anyways so all is fine minus the FPS.  Im not a gunner either soooo...     If raw s is manageable for decent workflow then I think im down.    Now the hard part.   $  

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## julianliu (Aug 5, 2014)

pab said:


> How is raw s treating you?   I mean the camera is basically a d4s minus battery life, fps, and iso levels I will never use. I generally grip it anyways so all is fine minus the FPS.  Im not a gunner either soooo...     If raw s is manageable for decent workflow then I think im down.    Now the hard part.   $  Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk



I did not shoot raw s. When I read the description how they process the raw file to get raw s , they lost me as a fan already. It's a type of format that's already altered by the camera, maybe not as badly as jpg. I heard other people dislike the raw small as well. 

Why you are so interested in raw small? Just get a faster and big CF card. And be selective when taking photos, then you maybe still have no problem with the huge file size of the photos. 

Now the large capacity hard drive is so cheap too.


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