# Infrared



## iluvphotography (Jun 8, 2006)

OK this question might sound stupid, and you guys might even ban me from this site for asking this, but I am new to photography and I am still learning...and I must say I have learned a lot from this site....

I really like the look of infrared pictures, although I am not sure what is the technology behind it... I know it has something to do with the type of the film and the filter... But I was wondering if it will be possible to get the same effect with digital or is it something that can be done in Photoshop?


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## fotogenik (Jun 8, 2006)

Here is a link that explains a little bit about digital infrared.

http://www.bermangraphics.com/digicam/d70-infrared.htm

http://www.pbase.com/lasombradelosdiablos/nikon_d50_infrared_ir

This one is specific to a Nikon D70 but the same principles apply to all digital infrared.  The big difference is how sensitive a specific camera is to infrared light, some mfgs are using better (for visual photo's anyway) infrared filters over the sensor of their camera's which makes the camera's less sensitive to infrared light.


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## Mohain (Jun 8, 2006)

Digital IR.

http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=50784

http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46933

You will need: 

A Hoya R72 filter. 
A graphics program that can swap the red and blue channels of your RGB image.
Custom white balance taken from some grass, with the filter on. 
To deal with the hotspot your lens/filter combo is bound to make.

I used a Fuji s9500 (s9000 in US) to produce these shots. Nikon DSLRs are supposed to be good at IR, Canons less so. Some lens/filter combos produce a hotspot too hot to handle! Google for digital IR for more info. 

Cheers, 

Mohain


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## iluvphotography (Jun 8, 2006)

Thanks for the info.. I didn't know you could do IR with digital cameras..

Wow I love your photos Mohain... and the IR works perfect for cemetry shots...

So am I pretty much out of luck with Canon? What graphic program do you use?

Now that I know it is possible I guess I will do a bit of a research on it for Canon..


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## terri (Jun 8, 2006)

You could also pick up a manual film SLR and shoot the IR film (Kodak HIE). You can use a very inexpensive plain #25 red glass filter. It's no more time consuming than learning it in PS, if you chose to go that route. Any good B&W photo lab will process it for you.


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## Mohain (Jun 8, 2006)

iluvphotography said:
			
		

> So am I pretty much out of luck with Canon? What graphic program do you use?
> 
> Now that I know it is possible I guess I will do a bit of a research on it for Canon..


 
No no, not at all. Some digi cameras have 'hot filters' in front of the sensor which blocks out some Infrared light. It means that some cameras are less sensitive to infrared light than others. I have seen some great IR shots done on Canons tho.

Hoya R72 filters are pretty cheap so you can probably afford to experiment. 

I use Photoshop CS2 and an action to swap the channels (then tweak lvls, curves, selective desturation and general fiddling until I'm happy).

You will also need a tripod as most of my exposured are around 30 seconds. 

(Shameless plug to more IRs I've posted here )

www.thephotoforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47640
http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47739
http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47639

Cheers,

Mohain


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## Digital Matt (Jun 8, 2006)

I shoot digital IR with Canon equipment.

http://www.anti-rejection.com/photography/Infrared/


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## iluvphotography (Jun 8, 2006)

Thanks guys...I love all your photos and when I look at them (stare at them) I think to myself.... Will I ever be able to take shots like these????
And Terri, I should say I was inspired by your photos first to do infrared... the picture of the old garage(on the Gallery Forum)... it's just so beautiful, and all the techniques, time and effort that has gone into it.. it's just amazing..

I am off to Germany (for World Cup) tomorrow and then 2 weeks in Italy.. I am planning to take a lot of pictures!!  I will try to pick up an IR lense before I go and see if I can get some nice shots...But I don't expect anything like you guy's photos.... it just seems I have to do a lot of practice before I get it right... So expect more questions from me along the way...

Thanks again for all the help....


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## bytch_mynickname (Jun 8, 2006)

I have a couple of questions: Does anyone have any examples or experience of shooting IR shots with a Canon Rebel XT? Is it worth it to spend $40 on a Hoya R72 or is it going to be a waste with my camera?
I am really drawn to the IR shots and would love to be able to get such beautiful shots but not too sure if my camera is sensitive enough to do it?

Does photoshop elements 4 give the option to do what I would need to do with switching the color channels? I have seen mention on photoshop doing it but not sure if that is one of the things that were cut out of elements?

And is $40 for the Hoya R72 a good price? I have no camera shops or anything around me so the only comparison I can do is online which I am assuming would be cheaper anyhow. 

I am just a newbie with tons of questions, I want to be able to produce images like I see on here. Thanks


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## doenoe (Jun 9, 2006)

The pics you can HEREsee here are shot with a Rebel XT and as you can see, it works just fine. The only difference (as far as i know) is that you need longer exposures. And the filter wont waste your camera, its just a filter which you screw on to your lens. The same thing as a, lets say, a UV filter.
If it is worth spending money on a filter is up too you, but i really am happy with the filter and am glad i spent the money on it. I think its a good price, i paid a bit more for mine when i bought it online.
Dont know anything about elements 4, so i cant help you there.


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## magicmonkey (Jun 9, 2006)

I've just started shooting IR with a rebel XT and R72, I made a lot of mistakes which people on the board helped me out with. Have a look at this thread if you want a blow by blow on a complete begginer getting off the ground with IR and some really helpful links:

http://thephotoforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51339


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## iluvphotography (Jun 9, 2006)

So what does it mean than the camera can be changed to IR camera.. on the links mentioned above there is this company that would convert your camera to IR?!!!!  $350 for Canon.. what does that mean??

So I went to a camera shop today and asked for IR filter and they didn't know what was I talking about... they said do you mean UV filter???
They said you have to probably special oreder it...

I live in Vancouver, Canada.. does anyone know where can I get the Hoya 72?

Also I am a bit confused about the white balancing part and taking picture of grass....  Could you guys explain that step?

Thanks


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## fotogenik (Jun 9, 2006)

Sounds like your camera shop does not know much about filters.

White balancing on the grass in an infrared photo is done because in infrared grass reflects as white.  Therefore you are setting your white point to white.


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## Digital Matt (Jun 9, 2006)

I'm sure you can flip the colors in elements 4.  As for white balance, you can just shoot raw, and white balance afterwards.  The pictures will come out all red, because the IR filter is basically a very strong red filter.

As for buying the filter, you'll probably have to buy it online.  Check the website of any big Canadian photo store chain, or you could buy it from a US store like Adorama or B&H.


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## bytch_mynickname (Jun 9, 2006)

Digital Matt said:
			
		

> I'm sure you can flip the colors in elements 4. As for white balance, you can just shoot raw, and white balance afterwards. The pictures will come out all red, because the IR filter is basically a very strong red filter.


 
I am confused. So I wouldn't be able to take a picture of the grass to do a custom white balance? I would _have _to shoot raw and do it manually? Is that just b/c of the program I am using or for some other reason? If it is the program, what is a good cheap program that will allow me to do normally. I don't think I am making much sense here


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## Digital Matt (Jun 9, 2006)

You can do a custom white balance if you want.  It's just easier to fix the wb in the raw file, and you'll probably get a more accurate result anyway.  If you want reasons to shoot raw, there's been lots of threads debating raw vs jpg lately.


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## bytch_mynickname (Jun 9, 2006)

Digital Matt said:
			
		

> You can do a custom white balance if you want. It's just easier to fix the wb in the raw file, and you'll probably get a more accurate result anyway. If you want reasons to shoot raw, there's been lots of threads debating raw vs jpg lately.


 
Thanks for clearing that up. I do shoot jpeg+raw and save the raw files to a cd until I become familiar with what exaclty to do with them. I have only had my camera for about 2 weeks and PE4 for about a week so I am not completely sure what I am doing (I am coming from a point and shoot.)

The reason I wanted to do the custom white balance is b/c I am not sure how to process a raw image yet and I like to see results now, not when I learn how to do it. The levels may not be exact as if I did WB with a raw file but at least this way I can see results now and improve them as I get more experience. I guess this way leaves more room for improvement. Thanks for all the help, I am slowly but surely learning.


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## fotogenik (Jun 9, 2006)

Yeah I want to the only local camera store within a 1 hour drive today and they told me they don't carry Hoya Filters but their promaster line is made by Hoya (any truth to this?) and tried to pass off a #25 red filter as being as good for infrared shots as a Hoya 72.

I walked out.


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## Alex06 (Jun 12, 2006)

B&H sells the Hoya 72


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## bytch_mynickname (Jun 13, 2006)

I just got the Hoya R72 from Adorama through amazon for $38


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## fotogenik (Jun 17, 2006)

I got mine from B&H for the amazon price by calling them and I didn't have to wait on amazon's 9 day shipping.


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## Meysha (Jun 17, 2006)

Rashadan, it's true you can use a #25 red filter for infrared. Just search for infrared on the forum for heaps of info re: different filters etc.


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## markc (Jun 17, 2006)

Meysha said:
			
		

> Rashadan, it's true you can use a #25 red filter for infrared. Just search for infrared on the forum for heaps of info re: different filters etc.


But not for many digital cameras. It lets too much visible light through and overrides any IR you get. If you aren't using actual IR film, you probably need to  use a filter that's deeper into IR.

--

That $350 modification you mentioned earlier is just that: a modification to the camera. It swaps the glass that filters out IR and lets visible light through with a piece that filters out visible light and lets IR through. After that, every shot is an IR shot, until you put the original glass back in.

You also mentioned PS filters for the IR effect, but I haven't seen one yet that really looks like IR to me. They might have that "feel" to them, but it's just not the same.


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## fotogenik (Jun 17, 2006)

Meysha said:
			
		

> Rashadan, it's true you can use a #25 red filter for infrared. Just search for infrared on the forum for heaps of info re: different filters etc.


 
Yes,  I know I could have used the #25 but that is not what I wanted and in my eyes it would have been settling for something less than what I wanted.

I have seen photo's done with the #25 and they just don't have the look I am trying for.


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## bytch_mynickname (Jun 18, 2006)

Rashadan said:
			
		

> I got mine from B&H for the amazon price by calling them and I didn't have to wait on amazon's 9 day shipping.


 
I have amazon prime so I would only have 2 day shipping but now that I think of it, it was shipped directly from Adorama and I got it 2-3 days after ordering it. Now if I could only figure out how to swap the color channels to get rid of the red tint...


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