# Canon AE-1 Program or Nikon FE?



## ParanoidHiro

Hello there! This is my first post on this forum (how could i not bother you with a beginner's question?)

The problem is pretty simple...

I'm a student (law) who took up my uncle's film camera (Praktica MTL3 with a 50mm / 1.8 MC Pancolar)  and fell in love with it. Point is i will have to give it back to him since he is really fond of it. I've been saving for a while and at last i can afford to buy my very own first film camera. Searching on the internet i came up with these

Canon AE-1 Program + Canon FD 28mm 2.8 + Canon FD 50mm 1.8 + Canon FD 135mm 3.5

Canon AE-1 Program + Canon FD 50mm 1.8 + Vivitar 28-85mm 3.5-4.5 + Vivitar 70-200mm 3.8-4

Nikon FE + Nikon Series E 35mm 2.5

all are around the same price but i'm stuck and i cant decide which to buy... i would mainly shoot street photography \ portraits \ architecture \ and would really like to be able to shoot at night

thanks for your patience, i look forward to an answer!


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## vimwiz

All Canons are cheap on EBay. To start, get a body with the FD f/1.8 50mm lens, it is very good and not expensive. The fast speed means itas good at night, if you use fast film.

Nikon lenses work on Nikon DSLRs. Canon FD lenses wont work on an EOS. Therefore, they are cheaper. This is why I use Canon FD mount film bodies, as you dont have to spend much on glass to get strated and get good results.

The A and F bodies are usually a bit expensive because hipsters like them (as they are chrome and manual wind), but you can get a more modern 1980s T models for cheaper usually, and it has more features, like LCD menus, better modes and metering, auto-wind / rewind, more common (AA) batteries, and takes the same lenses. Thats what I did - the T90 in my pic is a "pro" body, and it with the lens I mentioned was like £50 incl. shipping and a bag, on ebay.


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## timor

I would agree with T70 or T90 (expensive and rare) as a better bodies than AE-1P. Better shutter and newer electronics. AE-1 and this family of Canons have issues with that, often they go bersek. I don't know about T90, never seen one in my life, but T70 needs special remote control for long exposures. They are fairly cheap (like $5), but hard to find.
I would go with Nikon. Much better body, electronics in this cameras never fail, common, cheap batteries. Lenses costlier, but the camera may take the newest (providing there is aperture ring) Nikon lenses. Then there is a plethora of F mount third party lenses from Vivitar (look for Vivitar Series 1), Cosina and many more producers. Some of them really good.
On the other hand hang on to Practica and Pancolar. This combo gives you same capabilities for long exposure shots like FE or AE-1 and I know Pancolar. Optically it is very good, however, if there is a problem with the housing... What version of Pancolar do you have ?


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## minicoop1985

I would also recommend the Nikon. It's totally subjective, but my experiences with the Canon film cameras, while well developed and designed, just left me uninspired. Again, that's all subjective, and your experience may vary.


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## vimwiz

timor said:


> I would agree with T70 or T90 (expensive and rare) as a better bodies than AE-1P. Better shutter and newer electronics. AE-1 and this family of Canons have issues with that, often they go bersek. I don't know about T90, never seen one in my life, but T70 needs special remote control for long exposures. They are fairly cheap (like $5), but hard to find.



The remote cost me about £5 online on like amazon or ebay. I started with a T70 (Cost about 30 quid) and upgraded to a T90. Beware the 90 though, as they were used by pros, they tend to have a very high shutter count whereas the 70s tend to be in bettter condition. Only buy ones which say working shutter magnets, bright LCD, working internal battery.

My Av-1 is very reliable, though somewhat limited. An AE-1 would not be a bad staring camera for you, hard to break


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## webestang64

Canon AE-1 Program + Canon FD 28mm 2.8 + Canon FD 50mm 1.8 + Canon FD 135mm 3.5     ...........if you get all 3 lens with the body.....go for it.


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## minicoop1985

OK, I tested an AE-1 Program today. I take that back-this one was somewhat inspiring, actually. Not as manual as I like, but actually kinda fun to use.


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## djacobox372

Ae1 shutters are quite unreliable these days.  They often start to squeak before they fail.

I'd go with Nikon, they age really well.


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## vimwiz

djacobox372 said:


> Ae1 shutters are quite unreliable these days.  They often start to squeak before they fail.



An easy repair though. Easier than fixing the electromagnets or LCDs on later canons at any rate.


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## ParanoidHiro

timor said:


> What version of Pancolar do you have ?


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## ParanoidHiro

I'd like to thank you all for the answers! This morning i have spent even more time searching for alternatives and (always in my budget area) i have found some interesting stuff... Could any of you tell me which to choose between Nikon EM \ FG \ FE \ FM? The price range is very close and i'm afraid to pick the ''wrong'' one (if such thing even exists!)


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## compur

*EM*: Auto exposure only, no manual mode, plastic construction (often found with missing/broken parts) -- AI, AIS or AF Nikkor lenses 
*FG*: same size as EM and a bit more robust, adds manual and program modes, TTL flash and and a few other features -- AI, AIS or AF Nikkor 
*FG-20*: same as FG but no program mode, no TTL flash
*FE/FM:* metal bodied, reliable, FM is manual, FE is manual + aperture pref. auto + optional screens -- AI, AIS, AF Nikkor, pre-AI in stop down mode 
*FE2, FM2*: updated FE/FM with faster shutter speeds, brighter viewfinders, optional screens, TTL flash on FE2 -- AI, AIS or AF Nikkor 
*FM3a:* updated combination FM2/FE2 with some refinements 

(all are manual focus)

In my opinion the FE/FM/FE2/FM2 cameras are *among *the best manual focus 35mm SLRs ever made.


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## cgw

compur said:


> *EM*: Auto exposure only, no manual mode, plastic construction (often found with missing/broken parts) -- AI, AIS or AF Nikkor lenses
> *FG*: same size as EM and a bit more robust, adds manual and program modes, TTL flash and and a few other features -- AI, AIS or AF Nikkor
> *FG-20*: same as FG but no program mode, no TTL flash
> *FE/FM:* metal bodied, reliable, FM is manual, FE is manual + aperture pref. auto + optional screens -- AI, AIS, AF Nikkor, pre-AI in stop down mode
> *FE2, FM2*: updated FE/FM with faster shutter speeds, brighter viewfinders, optional screens, TTL flash on FE2 -- AI, AIS or AF Nikkor
> *FM3a:* updated combination FM2/FE2 with some refinements
> 
> (all are manual focus)
> 
> In my opinion the FE/FM/FE2/FM2 cameras are *among *the best manual focus 35mm SLRs ever made.



Probably the biggest single difference among these is the meter display. The EM/FG/FG20/FM variants(except the FM3a) use LEDs; the FE/FE2 use a match needle display. With the exception of the late model FM3a, all sold strongly which means no shortages on the used market. I often see the remarkably capable FG+50/1.8E kit in very nice shape for peanuts. If it matters, the EM/FG/FG20 bodies are a bit smaller than the FM/FE variants.


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## timor

cgw said:


> I often see the remarkably capable FG+50/1.8E kit in very nice shape for peanuts.


I have one like that, even with the winder. Very nice to shoot.


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## cgw

timor said:


> cgw said:
> 
> 
> 
> I often see the remarkably capable FG+50/1.8E kit in very nice shape for peanuts.
> 
> 
> 
> I have one like that, even with the winder. Very nice to shoot.
Click to expand...


It's a sweet little camera that's often overlooked. Have the 45/2.8 Ai-P that makes the FG almost pocketable. Funny but the new Fuji X-T1 is the same size as the FG.


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## Gromit801

To thoroughly confuse things, look hard at a Minolta XD-11


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## dubiousone

Canon A series are my favorites! The AE-1 Program and Ae-1 are very similar. Both are shutter priority meaning you set the lens on A and the camera picks the aperture according to what shutter speed you select. With the AE-1 Program you also have auto exposure with the shutter set on program. Just focus, compose and shoot. The AE-1 has a needle that indicates the aperture the camera is using (or recommending) and the Program uses LED's. Like all A series when the shutter flywheel lubricant dries up they squeak. They usually squeak for a while before it seizes but this DOES NOT RUIN THE CAMERA. it is a simple fix to do (BEFORE it seizes) either by a CLA at a shop or a DIY fix. Search Youtube for Canon shutter squeak fix. I have a drawer full of Canons and they all work fine. Like anything old there's occasional maintenance involved. Like having an old car LOL, but usually with cameras once its right they run for a long, long time. I have plenty of that old gear that's not seen a CLA service this century and they're good!

The Nikon FE is more manual, it has a match needle. One for shutter one for aperture. Select both until those two needles align, perfect exposure. The FG is a bit different, the FG-20 has a needle to show the shutter speed and a little window that reflects the aperture right in the viewfinder. The FE2 has TTL flash but is mostly the same as the FE. The Nikons have an exposure compensation dial the Canon's do not however they do have a little button to up the exposure for backlit subjects.

The Canon A-1 is more automated; full auto where the camera selects shutter and aperture and has an exposure comp dial on top. There's LEDS in the viewfinder that show the selected aperture and shutter which will flash if the exposure is not correct. The A-1 also does shutter priority, aperture priority or full manual. It might be a little simpler to use though ANY of the cameras you mentioned are pretty simple, about as point and shoot as 70-80's cameras get!

Canon lenses are cheaper than Nikon. Buy a bundle with the camera and two or three lenses is often more cost effective. Stick to Canon/Nikon/Tamron/Sigma/Vivitar brand lenses. Some of the 'hashimotomat' or 'vexor' brand lenses aren't all that well made BUT...I have a few of those off brand lenses that are pretty decent. Stick with the name brand stuff so you don't end up fighting your gear. Now, go GET a camera and have some fun!!


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## Canoneer

Some comments on what others have said above.

1.  Canon FD lenses are definitely cheaper than Nikon.   If you are into street photography, you probably want a fast medium telephoto plus a versatile wide angle, the 35 is a good choice.    I don't like zoom lenses any more, too long, heavy and slow.   But used zooms of all brands tend to be cheap on eBay, while fast primes are bid up.  

2.  Canon rules the roost now in digital.   But through the 1980s, it was the other way, with most pros using Nikon.  Nikons have very good build quality, more so than most Canon film cameras.   An AE-1 was my first SLR, and it is still in great condition, accurate meter, but it does have plastic parts inside.  The "chrome" is really plastic.   By contrast the FE (which was $100-150 more expensive in 1980 than the AE-1) is smaller but more solid, with ball bearings where they count and pro level components (Nikon for some reason tended to bring out new tech first in advanced amateur level cameras before they introduced it in their flagship line.   True of the FE and also the N90s).     If you can get a Canon in good shape cheap, then great.   But in quality and mystique, the edge goes to Nikon.     

3.   Nearly all old film cameras are dirt cheap.   You can get a Nikon F3 now in good usable shape for $100 or less.  An N90s for $30-45.   And these are cameras that ran close to a thou new.   Be careful about pro level cameras, because they may be about worn out.   Nikon FMs tended to be used professionally, and those I've seen appear to be heavy users.    Canon F1s are still pricey on eBay, and I suspect most are worn out and not a good buy.     EBay prices on everything are all over the map, so there is no substitute for watching and learning before you bid.

4.  I disagree with some of what was said above about certain cameras.   Correct me if I am wrong.     The Nikon EM is a small aperture priority only camera with a needle that shows the shutter speed the CPU selected for you.   Some film enthusiasts still carry one because they are cheap (<$30) and pocketable, ideal for street photos.   If one breaks, small loss.  (There is a pancake 50mm lens that makes them seem even smaller.)    The EM is plastic on the outside and you think it is a dinky little plastic thing, but I understand it has a solid metal chassis underneath and has some impressive tech under that plasticky exterior.  I prefer the FE which has a needle in the viewfinder that shows shutter speed when you go aperture priority, works like a match-needle if you go full manual, has easy exposure compensation +/- 2 stops, and will do multiple exposure.   A great thing about the FE and the F3 is that they will take any Nikon F-mount lens, from 1959 on including non AI lenses;  not true of later Nikons, which will not mount the old lenses.     The Canon AE-1 is not built like the AE-1 Programmable;  structurally they are different cameras with the programmable a half-generation ahead but behind the T-70.

5.  For me, I like knobs and dials and needles better than LCDs and multi-function buttons.   So I am cool with the FE, AE-1, F3, and so on.   However, in a camera like the N90s you can buy incredible technology with wonderful viewfinder readouts and autofocus for under $50.   I am not familiar with post FD mount Canons.


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## djacobox372

vimwiz said:


> An easy repair though. Easier than fixing the electromagnets or LCDs on later canons at any rate.



Easy for who?  Were talking $50 cameras, paying a shop $100 to repair it is silly.

Better off buying the less likely to need repair camera which is the Nikon. Speaking from personal experience buying and selling cameras, old Nikon's are FAR more reliable than old canons.


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## timor

Atg some point we gonna have to start repairing cameras. But then good luck with parts. That will be the real ens of film photography.


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## compur

"Parts cameras," that is, broken bodies, are plentiful and cheap. I have lots of them. When I want to sell them I list them as an auction on eBay with a starting bid of $0.99 (otherwise I can't _give _them away). Sometimes they only sell for that 99 cents, sometimes a little more. It's better than throwing them away, I guess. With some cameras, I _do _throw them away because they won't even sell at 99 cents and I can't use them myself (mostly the broken plastic AF SLRs of the 1980s-90s). If I have time I remove the screws before tossing because that's about the only parts I can use from them.


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## timor

compur said:


> "Parts cameras," that is, broken bodies, are plentiful and cheap.


Problem is, that mostly the vital parts are broken. Like shutters, gears and electronics.


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## minicoop1985

I have a lot of parts cameras with good shutters if anyone's interested. Pay shipping and they're yours. Lemme know what you need and we'll work it out.


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