# Old Lenses on New Camera?`



## jonahr (Aug 26, 2008)

I am planning on purchasing a DSLR and i have quite a few old (60s-70s) Nikon film lenses. Which DSLR's could accomadate these lenses?

I heard that If you use a dlsr with a lens which has an aperature ring, you cannot use the aperature ring. Is this true?


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## Garbz (Aug 27, 2008)

Most definitely not.
If you use a lens with an aperture ring AND a microcontroller (D series Nikkors) then you can not use the aperture ring, and you must control the aperture from the camera. Otherwise the aperture ring is the only way the camera can take a picture.

As for cameras the D40 and D200/D300 both have the necessary tools to use nearly any Nikkor back to the AI series (exception are a few DC Nikkors because their rear elements focus too far back into the camera body. Pre-AI nikkors do not work with modern SLRs without modification. I am unsure about the D70/D80. The D50 does not have an aperture ring latch to my knowledge.

When you use these old lenses you often need to specify in the camera menu what focal length and what the maximum aperture is, so it knows if your camera is set at f/1.2 or f/2.8 when the ring is fully open.

Some older zoom Nikkors which have varying aperture not in multiples of 1/3 stops may also throw off the metering system slightly. The workaround is to just use centreweighted average metering.


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## epp_b (Aug 27, 2008)

You can theoretically use any Nikon lens on any Nikon body made since 1959.  Where they differ is what features will work.  I have a Series E f/1.8 on my D40.  It mounts perfectly, but I can only use the camera in M where I have to meter and focus manually.  The focus indicator does still work, though.


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## djacobox372 (Aug 27, 2008)

Garbz said:


> Most definitely not.
> If you use a lens with an aperture ring AND a microcontroller (D series Nikkors) then you can not use the aperture ring, and you must control the aperture from the camera. Otherwise the aperture ring is the only way the camera can take a picture.
> 
> As for cameras the D40 and D200/D300 both have the necessary tools to use nearly any Nikkor back to the AI series (exception are a few DC Nikkors because their rear elements focus too far back into the camera body. Pre-AI nikkors do not work with modern SLRs without modification. I am unsure about the D70/D80. The D50 does not have an aperture ring latch to my knowledge.
> ...



So does the d40 meter with no-cpu lenses? I thought only the D200, D300, and D3 metered with non-cpu lenses.


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## Garbz (Aug 28, 2008)

epp_b said:


> You can theoretically use any Nikon lens on any Nikon body made since 1959.



No read the manual. There are specific lenses that will physically damage the camera if you try to take a photo with them. But it's only a handful. Specifically 17 lenses in the AI AI-S PC D AF AF-S series.

Also with non-AI lenses information is not available. Nikon states they are not compatible, which typically means all you can do is release the shutter. The camera has no knowledge of how the lens' aperture is set and as such the camera must be used in full manual mode. It does work but that said it's a game of Russian roulette, since Nikon does not publish information about which of these lenses do not physically fit like they do for the AI AI-S AI-P series on page 96 of the manual. There are success stories with pre-AI lenses, and there are "sent camera in for repairs" stories. I suggest google each individual lens that is pre-AI in your collection.



djacobox372 said:


> So does the d40 meter with no-cpu lenses? I thought only the D200, D300, and D3 metered with non-cpu lenses.



WRONG:
AI-P and pre-AI Nikkors are the only one it does not meter with. The D40 will even work with matrix metering. Compatibility table with lens series is on page 95 of the manual.


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## Tiberius (Aug 28, 2008)

Garbz said:


> AI-P and pre-AI Nikkors are the only one it does not meter with. The D40 will even work with matrix metering. Compatibility table with lens series is on page 95 of the manual.


AI-P are the only ones it _does_ meter with.  The D40 will mount AI and AI-S glass, but only the D200/D2*/D300/D3 will meter them.

Also, it's true that you control the aperture with the body, not with the Aperture ring, even in M mode.  If the aperture ring is set to anything but the minimum value, the camera will give an error and not function.


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## reg (Aug 28, 2008)

FWIW, Olympus DSLRs meter in Manual and Ap. Priority with any lens that you can mount on a cheapo ebay adapter, and adapters with an AF Confirm chip (I paid about $35 shipped for an adapter w/ a chip) on them also give, of course, AF confirm.


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## epp_b (Aug 29, 2008)

> No read the manual. There are specific lenses that will physically damage the camera if you try to take a photo with them. But it's only a handful. Specifically 17 lenses in the AI AI-S PC D AF AF-S series.
> 
> Also with non-AI lenses information is not available. Nikon states they are not compatible, which typically means all you can do is release the shutter. The camera has no knowledge of how the lens' aperture is set and as such the camera must be used in full manual mode. It does work but that said it's a game of Russian roulette, since Nikon does not publish information about which of these lenses do not physically fit like they do for the AI AI-S AI-P series on page 96 of the manual. There are success stories with pre-AI lenses, and there are "sent camera in for repairs" stories. I suggest google each individual lens that is pre-AI in your collection.


My bad, sorry.  It's AI lenses that you can use on just about any Nikon body, right?



> AI-P are the only ones it _does_ meter with.  The D40 will mount AI and AI-S glass, but only the D200/D2*/D300/D3 will meter them.


He's right.  My AI lens does not meter in any mode on my D40.



> Also, it's true that you control the aperture with the body, not with the Aperture ring, even in M mode. If the aperture ring is set to anything but the minimum value, the camera will give an error and not function.


For what lenses?  Pre-AI?

You can mount AI lenses as well, and you control the aperture with the ring, not the body (I just tested this with my Series E AI-S lens on my D40, it mounts just fine no matter where the aperture is set, no errors, takes pictures just fine in M)


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## Garbz (Aug 29, 2008)

Sorry guys I miss read the page. It's AF-I lenses that meter correctly :er: 

At the bottom of page 97 it says all AI, AI-modified (pre-AI lenses which have had their ring changed), AI-S, or E series lenses will work only in Manual mode.

epp_b Tiberiu's comment applies to CPU lenses such as D series. They need to be set at minimum aperture or the camera just shows f-- and disables the shutter release. Non CPU lenses naturally need to have their aperture set at the ring.


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## epp_b (Aug 29, 2008)

> epp_b Tiberiu's comment applies to CPU lenses such as D series.


Woah, so if I mount a brand new AF f/1.8D on my D40, the aperture *needs* to be set at f/22 to mount?  Surely, I'm misunderstanding something.


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## bhop (Aug 29, 2008)

Some confusing posts in this thread.. maybe i'm just reading wrong, i dunno..

Ai and Ai-S lenses won't meter on most Nikon DSLRs and pre-Ai won't mount and may damage the bodies, plus you have to set to camera to 'manual' to use them.  There are some body exceptions (see link below) I know they don't on my D70 from experience, so you have to either use an external meter or just guess and look at the lcd till you get it right.  That's what I have done and it works ok.  The aperture thumb wheel doesn't do anything when a manual lens is attached, so you HAVE to use the aperture ring, and it works fine.

So you want to know which bodies will meter?  Here's a lens compatibility chart:

http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/compatibility-lens.htm



> Woah, so if I mount a brand new AF f/1.8D on my D40, the aperture *needs* to be set at f/22 to mount? Surely, I'm misunderstanding something.



Correct, because the camera buttons and wheels control the aperture, not the ring on the lens.  You can actually mount it in any setting, but it will show as an error in your lcd until you put it on f/22.  As far as I know, all Nikon AF bodies do this eh?


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## epp_b (Aug 29, 2008)

> Correct, because the camera buttons and wheels control the aperture, not the ring on the lens. You can actually mount it in any setting, but it will show as an error in your lcd until you put it on f/22. As far as I know, all Nikon AF bodies do this eh?


That....doesn't make sense to me.  How is the aperture adjusted via the command dial?  Does the aperture ring actually move when you adjust it via the command dial?  Is there some mechanism that disconnects the aperture ring from the blades?


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## bhop (Aug 29, 2008)

epp_b said:


> That....doesn't make sense to me.  How is the aperture adjusted via the command dial?  Does the aperture ring actually move when you adjust it via the command dial?  Is there some mechanism that disconnects the aperture ring from the blades?



It's all electronic.  The ring doesn't move.  When you're turning the command dial, nothing happens till you press the shutter, or use the depth of field preview button.  Basically the command dial is telling the lens to 'get ready'.. i guess is one way to put it, and when you press the shutter the blades adjust automatically just before the shutter opens.. dunno.. does that makes sense at all or am I bad at explaining it?

Wait a minute.. didn't you say you have a d40?  It should work the same way when an AF lens is attached, only instead of a dial specifically for aperture, you have to press a little button first.  Or do you only have manual lenses at the moment?


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## Garbz (Aug 29, 2008)

Gah this thread actually is confusing. So let's break it down by lens:

Pre-AI - May mount, may damage the camera. Not officially listed as compatible with the camera. On a D200/300 these will meter if you have an AI-Modified ring. These will not meter on a D40. They work in manual only.

AI, AI-S, AI-P, E series Nikkos, Medial Nikkors, AI Teleconverters, Reflex Nikkors, PC Nikkors, bellows, extention rings - Will mount. None of these will meter. All of these lenses work in manual mode only!


CPU D type Lenses:

AF - Will not autofocus, aperture ring must be set to minimum and the aperture controlled electronically using the camera's selection wheel.

AF-I AF-S, AF-S teleconverters - Full functionality, aperture ring must be set to minimum and aperture controlled electronically using the camera's selection wheel. Autofocus may fail at an effective aperture above f/5.6 (note this anyone thinking of buying Tamron's 18-200)

CPU G type lenses:

AF-S - Full functionality, (no aperture ring to complain about  ), Same autofocus deal with larger effective apertures.


Additionally there are 15 lenses listed on page 97 of the manual which may damage the camera if mounted.

Let me know if I missed anything and i'll edit this post so that all the info is kept in one place.


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## epatsellis (Aug 30, 2008)

Garbz said:


> No read the manual. There are specific lenses that will physically damage the camera if you try to take a photo with them. But it's only a handful. Specifically 17 lenses in the AI AI-S PC D AF AF-S series.




And sadly, my 55 1.2 AI is on most of the lists, my favorite lens. I've been talking to a repair person about a minor modification, removal or trimming of the rear baffle that they put there to protect the huge rear element when you set the lens down with the mount facing downward (what kind of idiot would do that?)

erie


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## Garbz (Aug 30, 2008)

It is? Are you sure? http://www.nikonusa.com/pdf/manuals/noprint/D40_noprint.pdf I don't actually see it listed. 
I mounted and used a 55mm f/1.2 on my D200, and the incompatibility list for both cameras is the same. 

Btw I'm jealous. The 55mm f/1.2 is much much sharper wide open than my 50mm f/1.2 

/EDIT: I just looked at some photos online the 55mm f/1.2 looks *and I only say looks* identical to my 50mm f/1.2, and comparing the 50mm f/1.2 to the AF 50mm 1.8, including the protective rim they extend the same distance into the camera body. I would really get this double checked, it would be a shame not to be able to use that lens.


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## epatsellis (Aug 30, 2008)

I know it's a no go on my S2, and my F4. I don't remember where I saw it, but I believe there was a ? as to fit, the 55 1.2 S-C isn't all that common of a lens (and apparently going up in price quickly...). At least some of us agree, seems the usual consensus is that they're dogs, at least according to Bjorn's website. I've been using mine since the late 70's with my F (that I still have), and the biggest single difference I find is that the 50 is a bit contrastier, not always a good thing. I have the same opinion about my 180 2.8, it's the earliest AI version, non ED and has a certain look that the later ones lack. (as does my AI'd 35 f2 Nikkor-O). I shot this with the 55 1.2, probably 20 years ago, when the Vietnam Veterans Memorial first opened, probably around 1983 or 4, with an F3/MD4 (on film, of course)








I do know that the general consensus is the 135 f2 (early AI version) isn't all that great close up, yet this shot (with a PK-13 tube) proves that it's definately sharp and contrasty (not color corrected or sharpened, a test jpg  straight out of the S2):








I've got a friend with a D3 about 2 hours away, he's coming over one of these weekends to spend some time with the Hassy and RBs, as he's looking to get into MF, and I get to spend a few hours with a D3 and my 20+ year old collection of lenses to see which will work well with a FF sensor, not that I can afford a D700 or D3 yet....


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## Garbz (Aug 31, 2008)

Ahh that one. The 4th generation 55mm f/1.2. The one I was referring to having used was the 5th generation one with the round lens barrel, and not the ribbed one.

Not sure how it compares but here's a picture of my 50mm f/1.2, the rib to protect the rear element sits precisely 30mils (.76mm) above the rear element when zoomed to infinity, and is 140mils (3.6mm) above the actual gripping of the F-mount.:





One thing is certain when I finally upgrade to a D700 or D4 (if it's out) in a few years I will try and source 70s era Noct-Nikkor AI 58mm f/1.2. I saw one of those go on ebay for $2800US just recently, oh that's a drool worthy lens.


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## jwkwd (Aug 31, 2008)

http://www.nikonians.org/nikon/slr-lens.html#chart


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