# Help With First Studio Light Purchase



## smoke665 (Nov 30, 2016)

Here's the deal. My dear wife has given me the green light to purchase lighting hardware, but only under the following condition:


It has to be something that will do the job for the intended purpose without going back to the store for something else. (Note she didn't specifically say I couldn't "add to in the future, just that it had to be something that would continue to be used in any future expansion)
The primary intended purpose: The photography of our granddaughter, a 14 month old, very mobile  toddler, from full body to head and shoulder. Secondary purpose: learning and practice on grown ups.
The space available: Great room area 40 x 20 with a two story cathedral ceiling. One (40) wall faces NE and is floor to ceiling windows with blinds on lower windows. Morning light can be good, but need added flexibility. Furniture is movable (difficult), but obviously any lighting would need to be easy to set up and disassemble quickly for storage (can't be left in place)
Currently have 3 speedlights with wireless triggers and umbrellas, but keeping "Speedy Gonzales" evenly lighted while she's moving is next to impossible, because they just don't put out the necessary light over a larger area.
Would like to stay under $500 for the first purchase.

I've  thought maybe a monolight with  large softbox or strip light that would adjust down low enough to be on her level (floor to 4' range) and capable of flooding a larger area with light. How about it any suggestions on what to get before the wife changes her mind?????


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## Derrel (Nov 30, 2016)

Speedotron: Flash Lighting | eBay

Aim something powerful, and low in cost, off of the ceiling, and get a good, small f/stop. My last house had vaulted 16-foot ceilings and was 20 x 20 feet in the livng room and 14 x 14 in the adjoining dining room. A 400 Watt-second Speedotron Brown Line power pack gave me about f/8 across the living room when the flash head was placed high up, about 8 feet from the ceiling, and aimed properly with the 7-inch stock reflector on an M11 flash head. I ran a second head into the dinging room,and plced it on top of the china hutch. Got really good overhead bounce light, and a good deal of fill-in from overall lightm sand-colored carpet in the living room.

Keep in mind that what Speedotron calls "400 Watt-seconds" can be an "800" or "1200" in cheaper flashes. In Speedotron, with a 65 degree reflector, the Guide Number is 210 at 400 Watt-seconds, meaning f/21, at 10 feet, with ISO 100--across a 65 degree beam spread. Quite a bit more POP! than cheap, Made In China or low-end flash units. In other words, I lost about three full EV from Guide Number (f/21), but got a massive area covered (at f/8 at ISO 100).

Brown Line D402 pack, M90 flash head would be a good low-cost purchase.


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## smoke665 (Nov 30, 2016)

@Derrel


Ceiling at the peak is closer to 30'. Walls are are some shade that only women have names for, but men lump into the group beige. Floors are red oak hardwood, with a high gloss.
Half the long dimension on the main level is wall up to the second story balcony. The other half on main floor is hallway, and open bar into kitchen, 2nd story is a wall.
Still think one light? What about fill from the windows? And lastly, would this still fit in an expansion plan in the future?

We built this house with plenty of outlets, would prefer something that didn't use the power pack. Would something like an Elinchrom D-Lite Rx4 work in this application


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## OGsPhotography (Dec 1, 2016)

I use an el cheapo neewer 200T I bought of Amazon. Its plenty of power for my small room. I have to shoot it at minimum power.

 I would get 3 of them if I had a 500 budget and didnt want to use my speed lights anymore. Then I'd set one up in 2 corner of the room, a large clamshell setup, and one light on the ceiling or fill on a specific spot, ie wherever you think gonzales will play the most. Modifiers will eat up the other 200 pretty quick. 

Shooting at a specific spot,  like a 6 x 5 area,I can dial in the light and just get my daughter to play there and adjust my perspective to get a clean background.


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## smoke665 (Dec 1, 2016)

@OGsPhotography one of the concerns the "wife" brought up is congestion on the floor (stands, cords, modifiers, etc), she is constantly bumping into them while trying to corral "little bit". I really like Derrel's suggestion of using the ceiling to light the room, but my concern is if one 400WS light would provide enough, because of the height.


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## tirediron (Dec 1, 2016)

One 400 w/s light is more than sufficient to illuminate that space, but it might not illuminate it artistically.  The good thing about Speedo gear (what I use as well) is that the Brownline stuff is dirt cheap when bought used, and is built like a tank.  It's all steel, and the flash tubes seem to be made out of impervium; you can drop the heads from a significant height on to the floor and it doesn't phase them a bit (don't ask how I know this). 

Monolights all have a cord to an electrical outlet; pack & head systems all have a cord to the power pack, so there's really no difference in terms of the mess on the floor.


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## smoke665 (Dec 1, 2016)

tirediron said:


> Monolights all have a cord to an electrical outlet; pack & head systems all have a cord to the power pack, so there's really no difference in terms of the mess on the floor.



Please school me on the advantage of a power pack vs direct connection multi voltage head that could also operate off a battery pack for field use?


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## smoke665 (Dec 16, 2016)

After a lot of confusion, worry and research, I finally went with two Alienbee B400's. Doing so allowed me to utilize some stands, triggers and modifiers I already had, plus gives me a base to expand on. I was really impressed with their customer service. Talking directly with people that know and actually use their product helped tremendously. Supposedly will be in today!!!


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## tirediron (Dec 16, 2016)

Sorry, I missed your earlier post on the difference between monolights and pack & head systems... Both monolights and pack & head systems can operate off of portable power (I use Inovatronix inverters for mine).  Some of the key differences are in terms of weight:  Monolights (by teh same company) are all tend to weigh about the same and be the same size, whereas pack & head systems used flash heads of different sizes and weights.  One of the things that I like about my Speedotron system is that I can put two 400 w/s heads and an 800 w/s power supply in a very small bag and take it anywhere.

Monolights on the other hand do not require a connection to anything but power, so you can have lights great distances away from your shooting position as long as there's power, and if there isn't, regular extension cords work just fine.  I think monolights are actually easier to learn on because of the greater onboard power control they offer; dialing in the exact power needed is simply a matter of adjusting a rheostat rather than moving the light, doing semi-complicated math in your head and/or adding ND gels to various lights.

What I really like about my gear is (1) it is cheap like borscht on the used market and (2) it's built like a tank.  AB is decently built consumer gear, but I could use one of my M11 heads to smash a dozed AB heads and still have mine work. 

Overall, I think you made a very good choice, and I'm looking forward to seeing some of the results.


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## smoke665 (Dec 16, 2016)

@tirediron I seriously considered the Speedo's and can see the advantages they might offer, especially for a professional such as yourself. I was also very impressed with the Elinchrome, but the cost was twice the AB.  For me at my age, I have no illusion of photography being any more than a hobby.


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## astroNikon (Dec 16, 2016)

I got stuck on the "very mobile toddler" statement without further definition.  But you've already bought some lights.  So have fun.


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## tirediron (Dec 16, 2016)

smoke665 said:


> @tirediron I seriously considered the Speedo's and can see the advantages they might offer, especially for a professional such as yourself. I was also very impressed with the Elinchrome, but the cost was twice the AB.  For me at my age, I have no illusion of photography being any more than a hobby.


I think you made the right choice.


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## Derrel (Dec 16, 2016)

AB's are very popular, and small and light, part of a good system, easy to learn with, good adjust ability. Power is artificially over-implied via model numbering. But, many companies do the same thing,so...
        The difference between box and cable (Speedo Brown Line for example) and monolights: monolights are "fixed maximum" and self-contained. Box and cable power supplies offer 2,3,4,or 6 outlets,and you can mix and match the number of flash heads plugged in, as needed. Used Speedo Brown Line 402,604,802,and 1604 packs cost $75 to $259 or so, and flash heads are $35 to $100 used.
      A used Brown Line MW3U flash head is $35-$50 with a 400 Watt-second flashtube in it: four of those for $35 each for $120, plus a $99 D802 power supply is like having $1,000 worth of Alien Bee 400 power, but for only $219 total cost. Buuuuuuut, the Bees have finer, easier light output control.
        The huge cost savings come when you need a LOT of power, through a single flash unit: this is when a $100 D1604 used power pack and a $75 used flash head (M-11 unit) is as powerful as two, or three, monolights called "800" or "1600", and priced at $499 to $649, each.
       But, again, monolights are easy to learn with and people like the idea of incremental power adjustment on each lighting unit. Speedo is based on doubling and halving units of output, like speeds or f/stops, and simple " units", like 1600,800,400,200,100 in whole-stop parlance. (That is a 5-stop range that could be simplified as Full, half, quarter, one-eight, and one-sixteenth power on a monolight's power slider or click-dial.)
        If you need ONE light only, monolights make sense, and offer nice adjustment of power very easily, but HIGH-output units cost a lot per Watt-second, where big Speedo packs are low-cost and plentiful, and flash heads on the used market are cheap. Once you start using four, five,or even six or more lights at one time, the economics of big box and cable systems becomes apparent.
      But for 1- or 2-light setups, and with modern digital cameras, 100 to 250 Watt-second monolights are fantastic tools. I am pretty sure you made a good decision to go with the AB 400 pair.


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