# New Photographer Looking for Advice



## fireworks1059 (Jan 20, 2014)

I have recently graduated from college with an Associates degree in digital photography. Im looking for advice into what my next step(s) should be.

I have spent the last year (from graduation in the Fall of 2012 until now) building my portfolio & looking for a way to start a career in photography. Im most interested in landscape & travel photography. Aside from one freelance job last year (which taught me how little money was available in freelance work), I have been unemployed. On the bright side, I do have my own website to show my work, as well as a blog. I have some images available on Dreamstime as royalty free microstock. Ive also recently started using Twitter to try & build my audience.

Even though I am lucky enough to have parents that will let me live at home, with no rent, until I can finically support myself, Im beginning to doubt if I have a future in the career I have spent so much time preparing for. Their advice is to get a part time job, even something not directly related to photography, to start getting a steady pay check & to build job experience.

Because, despite my best efforts, I have no job experience on my résumé.

I feel like I have to decide, soon, how to live my life. It seems like these are my only options:
-I can keep attempting to make it on my own, submitting to stock agencies (especially rights managed ones) & finding a rep to help me get assignment work.
-I can try to make a living through a part time job & stock sales.
-I give up completely & seek a full time job.

I have been driving myself crazy trying to figure this out, so Im turning to the anonymity of the Internet for help. What should I do? I certainly dont want to give up, but Im starting to feel like the career Im looking for doesnt exist. I dont want to divide my time between photography & a part time job, especially after only trying this for a year, but I have to admit that the finical stability is a major attraction, as well as the possibility of increasing my social life (Im still in contact with friends from high school & college, but theyre chasing their own dreams as well). I love what I do, but I never pictured myself running my own business& Im not sure if I want to do that

I was never the best of the best or the top of the class. In fact, I felt lucky if I wasnt the worst in the class. I feel like whatever I decide to do at this point in my life will determine what I can do later in life. I feel so much pressure to make the right choice, that Ive been driving myself insane.

Any & all advice is welcome & appreciated!


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## Derrel (Jan 20, 2014)

I do not think there's much of a career these days in the travel and landscape photo side of things; the world is FLOODED with fantastic images, available for literally PENNIES.

If you want to make any money, you need to pick another specialty, like shooting and selling PRINTS of families, to families. Or, struggle for a few years until you can break into commercial photography.

The majority of photos that sell have people in them, and the buyers are the people in the photos, for the most part. Landscape and travel photos are basically, almost value-less these days.


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## TheFantasticG (Jan 20, 2014)

Perhaps pick up another trade to pay for living expenses until you get your niche settled in photography?


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## table1349 (Jan 20, 2014)

To add to what Darrell said, if you wanted to do Travel and Landscape photography these days a double major that included Journalism would have been helpful.  Many of the publications that specialize in Travel articles etc. expect the journalist to also be the photographer.  More bang for their buck.  The way of the National Geographic model is past.  Pretty much NG is the only one that uses it and you have to be real good to become a staffer at NG.  

Learn to love weddings, senior portraits, family portraits, school photos etc.  Those are the bread and butter these days.  If you live in an area that has a large commercial base that could, as Darrell mentioned, be an area you could break into.


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## CCericola (Jan 20, 2014)

There was a guy I worked with when I graduated. He help our studio with the school season until he made enough money to go travel somewhere to take photos.  When he ran out of money he came back . I don't think he had a residence. Just crashed wherever. He would sell some shots to magazines but not enough to live off of. 

What else do you like to do?


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## pgriz (Jan 20, 2014)

My father expected to be employed pretty much for life by one company.  Making sure that he had the "right" company was important.
My generation has learned to change employers and even careers every 5-12 years.  Because employers figured out that senior guys are expensive, and teaching "the system" means that you can use more junior staffers.  
My kids are learning that all jobs are temporary, and you'd better be able to reconfigure yourself every six months or so.  While that is not true for the professions (engineering, medicine, dentistry, nursing), it's pretty much the rule for everyone else. 
So, stop worrying about making a bad choice, and get involved.  If it's not the right thing for you, you'll know pretty quickly.  If it does turn out to be peachy, then ride the wave as long as it lasts, but be prepared to change when the ride ends.
Another way to look at this is that you're your own employer.  Now your job is to find customers for your services.  If you go for the full-time job, you're essentially getting one "long-term" client.  If you're going for print sales, then you are getting many non-repeating customers.  If you're going for part-time work and part-time photography, then your customer mix is one semi-reliable customer, and a number of non-repeating customers.   Once you understand that there is no single "service" that will bring you customers, you'll see how to prospect for customers.  

There are other things to consider - the customer "acquisition" cost, the customer "maintenance" cost, the customer "revenue" potential, and the customer "opportunity" potential.  Each of these impact on your assessment of whether the "customer" is worth the effort.


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## Derrel (Jan 20, 2014)

Listen to griffon's liar. He knows what he's talking about.


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## wyogirl (Jan 20, 2014)

I have a professor who is considered one of the best if not the best landscape photographer in the state.... he works full time for the health department, part time as a professor and even more part time as a photographer.  He has photos hanging in museums and still has to supplement income.


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## KmH (Jan 20, 2014)

You did not put a location in your profile.

Are you somewhere in North America, or do you live on some other continent?

To have any chance at making a living doing travel and landscape photography you need to develop connections with lots of the commercial users of those type of photographs.
Most of those commercial users are in the USA.

As mentioned the market is flooded with photographs and companies have discovered a couple of things:

1. Photographs that are only OK, and not professional quality images, are now acceptable for consideration for advertising and marketing use.

2. There are millions and millions of usable, OK photos that can be gotten for free from any number of amateur photographers that post their photos on Flickr. SmugMug, Photobucket, and other photo sharing web sites.
Most are flattered that some company wants to use one of their photos, have no idea how valuable their copyright is, and don't think about how much money the company wanting to use their photo is going to make from using it. So they give it away, and hurt some of the photographers trying to make a living doing photography.

There are some types of commercial photography that can provide a living income.
 Would $13,750 for 1.5 days worth of work keep you fed, housed, and clothed? - Case Study: Producing A Successful Estimate | DigitalPhotoPro.com


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## Pav10566 (Jan 20, 2014)

Derrel said:


> Listen to griffon's liar. He knows what he's talking about.


Indeed...there is wisdom in his lines. I'm just surprised that during your studies of Digital photography the question never came up about what you can do with your diploma after your study. Of course there is always the paparazzi road one might want to follow


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## imagemaker46 (Jan 20, 2014)

Unfortunately you have graduated from one of the worst career paths. Photography world wide has taken such a hit over the past 7-10 years that making a living in it has become next to impossible.  It doesn't really matter what area you go into you will find a lot of closed doors.  As a full time freelancer for over 35 years I hate the way photography has ended up. Many of my friends in the newspaper business that have been there for decades are now looking for work after being laid off. I wish you luck, but would start looking for a job outside of photography for now and keep at it on the side and hope something comes up.


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## table1349 (Jan 20, 2014)

Derrel said:


> Listen to griffon's liar. He knows what he's talking about.



You calling me a liar or are your fingers dyslexic?????????????


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## Derrel (Jan 20, 2014)

gryphonslair99 said:


> To add to what *Darrell *said, if you wanted to do Travel and Landscape photography these days a double major that included Journalism would have been helpful.  Many of the publications that specialize in Travel articles etc. expect the journalist to also be the photographer.  More bang for their buck.  The way of the National Geographic model is past.  Pretty much NG is the only one that uses it and you have to be real good to become a staffer at NG.
> 
> Learn to love weddings, senior portraits, family portraits, school photos etc.  Those are the bread and butter these days.  If you live in an area that has a large commercial base that could, as *Darrell *mentioned, be an area you could break into.



Enough whining, griffon's liar.


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## Pav10566 (Jan 21, 2014)

imagemaker46 said:


> Unfortunately you have graduated from one of the worst career paths. Photography world wide has taken such a hit over the past 7-10 years that making a living in it has become next to impossible.  It doesn't really matter what area you go into you will find a lot of closed doors.  As a full time freelancer for over 35 years I hate the way photography has ended up. Many of my friends in the newspaper business that have been there for decades are now looking for work after being laid off. I wish you luck, but would start looking for a job outside of photography for now and keep at it on the side and hope something comes up.


What about starting a shop, boutique or studio selling photographic equipment, making passport photos or portraits? On quite a few posts I read about people complaining there aren't enough places where they can get the right equipment or advice?


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## JoeW (Jan 21, 2014)

fireworks1059 said:


> I have recently graduated from college with an Associate&#8217;s degree in digital photography. I&#8217;m looking for advice into what my next step(s) should be.
> 
> I have spent the last year (from graduation in the Fall of 2012 until now) building my portfolio & looking for a way to start a career in photography. I&#8217;m most interested in landscape & travel photography. Aside from one freelance job last year (which taught me how little money was available in freelance work), I have been unemployed. On the bright side, I do have my own website to show my work, as well as a blog. I have some images available on Dreamstime as royalty free microstock. I&#8217;ve also recently started using Twitter to try & build my audience.
> 
> ...



If you want to shoot landscape and travel photography than you need to view it as being part of a larger role...maybe a travel blog (and you get advertisers)...or you set up travel workshops (photographers go to destination X and you set it up and coordinate it), or self-publish/kindle travel guides (maybe it's a "visit Albania" guide that covers areas that Frommers or RickSteves aren't going to cover, maybe the focus is on photography in that country).  Or maybe be a guide to certain areas of the country and you take photos of your clients on-site.  But I agree with the posts that it's really hard to make a living (heck, a decent side-job) selling landscape and travel photos these days.


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## imagemaker46 (Jan 21, 2014)

Pav10566 said:


> imagemaker46 said:
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately you have graduated from one of the worst career paths. Photography world wide has taken such a hit over the past 7-10 years that making a living in it has become next to impossible. It doesn't really matter what area you go into you will find a lot of closed doors. As a full time freelancer for over 35 years I hate the way photography has ended up. Many of my friends in the newspaper business that have been there for decades are now looking for work after being laid off. I wish you luck, but would start looking for a job outside of photography for now and keep at it on the side and hope something comes up.
> ...



There is a big difference between running a camera store and being a photographer. In my home town there used to be 5-6 really good camera stores, they either sold out to chain stores or went out of business. Big box store sell lower, grocery stores have labs that do $5 passport pictures.  We now have a few stores that the pro market can deal with, they offer advice on some things, but basically are just sales people with limited photographic experience.


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## JoeW (Feb 1, 2014)

imagemaker46 said:


> Pav10566 said:
> 
> 
> > imagemaker46 said:
> ...



Yep--totally. 

I live in a suburban, well-off area.  Lots of cameras around here.  The local chains have pretty much gone out of business.  The one camera shop I know if (besides online or big box stores) specializes in:  selling gear (this is expensive and often seasonal), selling used cameras, passport photos, and speciality or high-end printing (like photos to be inserted on the cover of a Christmas card or a corporate newsletter--stuff you wouldn't trust with Kinkos/FedEx Office).  They provide a lot of advice but it's all free--it doesn't come with a price.


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## KmH (Feb 1, 2014)

As far as markets for landscape and travel photos - 2014 Photographer's Market


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## PCimages (Feb 5, 2014)

I didn't go to school and I have a full time job, but I'm also trying to make a living in photography that currently isn't happening as quickly as I'd like.  The most current advice I received is to assist other photographers that have already made the leap to "professional."  This way you learn the trade skills that aren't taught in school and you also start to build a network for yourself, which can eventually lead to your own jobs.  Use that portfolio you've been building to impress these potential photographers you may assist, because even if you aren't taking the pictures, they'll want to know you're on the same page as them.  Lately this has been working for me...  Give it a try!


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## SquarePeg (Feb 17, 2014)

Not sure where you live but something to consider - When in Hawaii last year I went on a photo tour with a photographer who was earning a nice living from taking photography enthusiasts around the island (Oahu).  We had a long discussion about his business after he dropped off the others.  In short, he told me he did 1-2 tours/day, 5 days week.  Each tour accommodated up to 7 people and was usually booked up full well in advance.  He was charging $120pp per tour (which is cheap considering comparable tours) and there were options depending on the day for sunrise, sunset or nighttime tours.  Private tours also available for a steep price.  Minimal overhead.  He said it left him plenty of time to shoot on his own for his website and that he had sold some of his work to and through people that he met on his tours.  The people on the tours ranged from people with just a coolpix to professionals.  

From a consumer perspective, it was great to have someone knowledgeable about all the best spots and the right times to be there.  I could never have managed to find some of these places on my own, in the dark.  And even if I had, it was a much safer and more fun being in a small group.  He provided advice about settings if asked and supplied tripods for those who didn't bring their own.  For me, it was a perfect way to spend 1/2 a day on my hobby while on a family vacation.  It was nice to get away from the family (eye rolls every time I break out the tripod) and not to feel rushed while they waited for me to get my shot.    

Anyway -just an idea.  Had I the talent and no responsibilities, I would be investigating this type of start up for myself!


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