# How much money have you invested?



## rwilliams (Apr 22, 2014)

I was talking to another local photographer the other day and she told me that in the past year, she has invested $28,000 into her photography business (portraits, weddings, events). This is her first year in photography and even after her investments, I personally don't see any quality in her photography and certainly would not hire her.

That being said, I'm also in my first year and have a lot to learn, but I can't imagine investing that much money this early.

So, this spiked my curiosity... How much money have you invested into your photography business? Over what period of time? And did you get a business loan to help with these investments?


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## The_Traveler (Apr 22, 2014)

There is no necessary correlation that I can see between investment into a photography business and quality of photography.
I could go out now and buy lots of stuff, including advertising and bricks and mortar stuff, that wouldn't make my photography any better.


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## RyKindig (Apr 22, 2014)

I agree with what was said above, but just to answer your question if you think it helps - I am about half way through my first year and I have invested ~$2,500-3,000 in total including all of my gear & camera.

Here's a portfolio: https://www.flickr.com/photos/119804975@N07/


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## ronlane (Apr 22, 2014)

I would estimate that I've spent about $4,000 on photography stuff in the last 2 years. I am just starting my third year.


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## wyogirl (Apr 22, 2014)

Doing some math in my head.... I think I have about $2500 invested.  That includes my camera, gear, website and some classes.  I'm going into my third year.

ETA:  I'm non in business... I take the odd job now and again.


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## rwilliams (Apr 22, 2014)

I agree. I really just couldn't understand where $28,000 would even go in just one year.



The_Traveler said:


> There is no necessary correlation that I can see between investment into a photography business and quality of photography.
> I could go out now and buy lots of stuff, including advertising and bricks and mortar stuff, that wouldn't make my photography any better.


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## Scatterbrained (Apr 22, 2014)

Are you specifying people who are pursuing photography as a business?  Does that mean you're pursuing it as a business?  If you just started photography, why are you already trying to go into business?   Does she seem like she actually made enough to cover almost $30k in business expenditures, or is she a well to do housewife pursuing a hobby?   I've encountered that kind before.   Met one just the other day at the playground with my girls.  Of course if she's well networked she could be making a decent amount of money.  Hell, I do this for a hobby and I have well over $30k worth of equipment in my loft.   It's easy to sink a lot of money into it if you have it, but that doesn't mean you need to or should.  On another board I'm on there used to be a Russian fashion shooter doing phenomenal work using an old Rebel and kit lens with some old, cheap lights. The guys work was incredible.   
  Work with what you have and don't worry about what she's doing.  When you find yourself limited by your equipment, then you'll know what you need to do to be able to achieve your vision.  That may not cost too much at all.


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## Robin Usagani (Apr 22, 2014)

It is around $16,000.


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## ronlane (Apr 22, 2014)

Scatterbrained said:


> Are you specifying people who are pursuing photography as a business?  Does that mean you're pursuing it as a business?  If you just started photography, why are you already trying to go into business?   Does she seem like she actually made enough to cover almost $30k in business expenditures, or is she a well to do housewife pursuing a hobby?   I've encountered that kind before.   Met one just the other day at the playground with my girls.  Of course if she's well networked she could be making a decent amount of money.  Hell, I do this for a hobby and I have well over $30k worth of equipment in my loft.   It's easy to sink a lot of money into it if you have it, but that doesn't mean you need to or should.  On another board I'm on there used to be a Russian fashion shooter doing phenomenal work using an old Rebel and kit lens with some old, cheap lights. The guys work was incredible.
> Work with what you have and don't worry about what she's doing.  When you find yourself limited by your equipment, then you'll know what you need to do to be able to achieve your vision.  That may not cost too much at all.



I can't speak for anyone else, but I am not trying to sell myself in business full time. I'll take the jobs that come to me or that I can get when I want some cash. I've not made anywhere near enough to pay for more than one of my lenses, let alone a profit.


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## HitenNainaney (Apr 22, 2014)

What scatterbrained said, even before I got into photography as a freelancer I had invested well over $15k while it was just a hobby. 

I have a friend who's invested over 30k but doesn't want to make it a career, nor are his picture worth it either. 

There no relation with money and quality of work. 



Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk


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## Scatterbrained (Apr 22, 2014)

HitenNainaney said:


> ....I have a friend who's invested over 30k but doesn't want to make it a career, nor are his picture worth it either. ...............


Hey man, no need to call me out like that!


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## Trever1t (Apr 22, 2014)

No idea but I just dropped $3K on a lens. If I added it all up probably well over 20K in gear. I'm afraid to add it up.


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## JerryVenz (Apr 22, 2014)

Nikon camera gear and port. flash: $9025.00

Canon camera gear and port. flash: $8500.00

Tripods and support:  $1850.00

Studio Flash: $3725.00

Studio soft boxes and light modifiers: $5075.00

Misc. studio: $1889.00

Studio Props: $7250.00

Studio Backgrounds: $7950.00

The camera gear is just the digital gear we have retained--It does not count the digital body upgrades we purchased since 2001 along the way--those are FIVE DIGITAL BODIES--before those listed.

That would add another: $9500.00 

This does not count ANY of the MEDIUM FORMAT CAMERAS we bought before we went digital--that was THREE SYSTEMS ( Big Money ).


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## astroNikon (Apr 22, 2014)

Yikes, I'm under $6k with about 2 years into it after using the camera for more than astrophotography stuff.

non-business
none of it pays


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## IronMaskDuval (Apr 22, 2014)

The question that really matters is what's the ROI on your current investment.


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## bribrius (Apr 22, 2014)

im surprised people are calling this a investment to begin with since most photography is known to be a loss from the beginning (not all most). Not sure if this is to make people feel better or...

how about "how much money have you pissed away on photography in which you hope to get some of it back"


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## ronlane (Apr 22, 2014)

Whether it's investment or "pissed away" as bribrius puts it. I just got to thinking about what would/could I buy with $28,000. So I went to B&H's website had a spending spree (virtual of course). Here's what I could have gotten and still have a few grand.


Canon 5D Mk III $ 3,399.00Canon 5D Mk III $ 3,399.0070-200 f/2.8 L II $ 2,499.0024-70 f/2.8 L II $ 2,299.0024-105 f/4 $ 1,149.0070-200 f/2.8 L $ 1,449.0016-35 f/2.8L II $ 1,699.0085 f/1.8 $   419.00Elinchrom Quadra 2-light Kit $ 2,354.99Elinchrom Quadra 2-light Kit $ 2,354.99Lexar 16GB CF cards x2 $   112.01Total $21,133.99


That's a pretty good start as far as equipment goes.


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## tirediron (Apr 22, 2014)

Hard gear costs:  $27,550 (as of my most recent insurance paperwork)

Insurance, website, 'phone, etc:  $2500/year

Miscellaneous:  another couple of thousand a year...


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## Tee (Apr 22, 2014)

A little under $9,000 as a serious hobbyist and I have no regrets.  I paid for it all with cash and finding deals on buy and sell forums.


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## Vince.1551 (Apr 22, 2014)

24 years, $35,000 sunk cost, $0 income. lol


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## kundalini (Apr 22, 2014)

I have $20K insured for the big ticket items such as bodies, lenses and lights.  That does not include the s-e-v-e-r-a-l thousands in ancillary items which I am willing to absorb that are usually less than $100 each.

It's a hobby that I enjoy.


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## MSnowy (Apr 22, 2014)

$30,000 to chase the birdies.


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## runnah (Apr 22, 2014)

MSnowy said:


> $30,000 to chase the birdies.



I've spent millions chasing birds.


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## CdTSnap (Apr 22, 2014)

Plus you have to take into account that some people are just full of s**t

BUT ive spent around $3000 give or take and I dont even really have a business, just when people ask me to shoot on the odd occasion.


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## KmH (Apr 22, 2014)

Row your own boat.

Don't waste any of your time pondering about some other business spending, or not spending.

Most new business fail because the business owner does not have the financial management skills running a business requires.


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## bribrius (Apr 22, 2014)

CdTSnap said:


> Plus you have to take into account that some people are just full of s**t
> 
> BUT ive spent around $3000 give or take and I dont even really have a business, just when people ask me to shoot on the odd occasion.


some, probably not all. craps expensive. im somewhere around where you are. Maybe a little over for the last couple years. How many years is this supposed to go back?
I get to thirty k it will be because I just put a downpayment on a new boat or another piece of realestate it wont be for camera gear...:mrgreen: Photography is like my third  or fourth mistress (ah hobby)...
i can see someone dropping big money on their first love though.


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## Rgollar (Apr 22, 2014)

$7000 just for a hobby so far but I got another $3000 Im going to spend real soon lol.


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## CdTSnap (Apr 22, 2014)

bribrius said:


> CdTSnap said:
> 
> 
> > Plus you have to take into account that some people are just full of s**t
> ...



That for me would be the last 2 months. 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## MSnowy (Apr 22, 2014)

bribrius said:


> CdTSnap said:
> 
> 
> > Plus you have to take into account that some people are just full of s**t
> ...



I hear ya. Hobbies get expensive. I have $25,000 in motorcycles and $30,000 in a new kitchen so I can take up cooking as a hobby.


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## CdTSnap (Apr 22, 2014)

MSnowy said:


> bribrius said:
> 
> 
> > CdTSnap said:
> ...



My divorce cost me $15000 probably. Maybe I should be a pro divorcé lol

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## sm4him (Apr 22, 2014)

rwilliams said:


> I was talking to another local photographer the other day and she told me that in the past year, she has invested $28,000 into her photography business (portraits, weddings, events). This is her first year in photography and even after her investments, I personally don't see any quality in her photography and certainly would not hire her.
> 
> That being said, I'm also in my first year and have a lot to learn, but I can't imagine investing that much money this early.
> 
> *So, this spiked my curiosity... How much money have you invested into your photography business? Over what period of time? And did you get a business loan to help with these investments?*



Since this clearly states that you are interested in what we've spent on our photography BUSINESS, I'd say nothing yet--since I don't have a photography "business"--and in my own personal opinion, anyone who has been DOING photography for such a short period of time before launching into "business" is jumping the gun in a very big way. But THAT is a conversation we've already beaten with several sticks.

If I *were* going to go into business--in the sense of doing portrait photography or something like that--I can EASILY see spending $30K on it. Not necessarily just on gear, but your post doesn't seem to restrict it to gear.  By the time you buy the f/2.8 lens, the pro-grade cameras (at least two), the quality tripods, the flashes and triggers, etc, you'd already be well on your way to 30 grand. Then add insurance and marketing expenses--yeah, I can see 30K invested pretty quickly.

MY goal is not to do photography as a business, or at least not as a business with clients, like portraits, weddings and such. My goal is more to enter the fine art/gallery side of photography.  But this is a goal that I've only decided on for sure after MANY years of simply learning and ENJOYING the hobby of photography. Mostly, I still just want to learn it and enjoy it. If getting my work published and accepted into galleries and such ends up making me enjoy shooting less, I'll quit faster than an Osprey dives and catches a fish. ;-)

With all that said--I do find it interesting to hear the varying amounts being spent, whether as a hobby or a profession.
I just recently had to create a list of everything for insurance purposes (yes, I'm just now getting my gear insured...don't judge me, people!! lol), and was pretty surprised to find that I have probably $10K worth of gear. However, that would be the "new"/replacement value of everything--and most of what I have I got used, so actual total investment is somewhat less than that. Oh, come to think of it, that also includes my computers, so even less than that.

That's just my digital investment, over the past 3 years. THEN there's all the film cameras and lenses that I still have. MOST of those aren't "worth" a plug nickel today, but would add quite a bit to my total "investment" number.  I shudder to think what the final total would be...



bribrius said:


> *im surprised people are calling this a investment to begin with since most photography is known to be a loss from the beginning* (not all most). Not sure if this is to make people feel better or...
> 
> how about "how much money have you pissed away on photography in which you hope to get some of it back"



It's still very much an investment. A BAD investment, perhaps, but an investment nonetheless. :lmao:


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## imagemaker46 (Apr 22, 2014)

35 years, no idea really, over $250k I expect.


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## skieur (Apr 22, 2014)

IronMaskDuval said:


> The question that really matters is what's the ROI on your current investment.



My ROI was too good, because I owed the tax department an additional 10,500 over more than that in installments.


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## bribrius (Apr 22, 2014)

im still trying to figure out the gear insurance thing.... granted, i don't have huge money in gear but generally speaking my house is in is insured with its contents up to 100k in belongings or some stupid number (way more than my stuff is worth here, so are you guys insuring for theft out of your cars or something?


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## TheFantasticG (Apr 22, 2014)

bribrius said:


> im surprised people are calling this a investment to begin with since most photography is known to be a loss from the beginning (not all most). Not sure if this is to make people feel better or...  how about "how much money have you pissed away on photography in which you hope to get some of it back"



Ha. I agree from a non-business prospective when you expect no returns using the equipment you have purchased.

My motorcycle has seen WAY more money than my photography and I've only been into bikes since September 2013... When I bought a brand new 2013 Kawasaki 650 ABS off the show room floor. I've paid it off and since bought upgrades. The only thing I "invested" in would be my safety gear which I hope never have to collect a return on. I have spent somewhere in the neighbor hood of $45,000 on modifying cars and now bikes. Photography is a drop in the bucket.


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## manaheim (Apr 22, 2014)

The minute you start saying stuff like "so and so spent $$$$$ and their photography still sucks", you are falling victim to the specter of jealousy and spite. The person you are focusing on has got some money to blow, and you wish that person... because man, you sure as hell could do better with that gear than her! Etc.

Maybe that's not your EXACT thought process, but I'll bet you dollars to donuts that it's damned close.

Here's some advice that won't cost you a red cent...

...don't worry about what other people are doing. Don't even pay attention to it. Focus your energies on yourself... how you want to improve... the things you need to make yourself a success.

Stick with that and you'll save yourself a lot of frustration, and a fortune on antacid.


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## bribrius (Apr 22, 2014)

manaheim said:


> The minute you start saying stuff like "so and so spent $$$$$ and their photography still sucks", you are falling victim to the specter of jealousy and spite. The person you are focusing on has got some money to blow, and you wish that person... because man, you sure as hell could do better with that gear than her! Etc.
> 
> Maybe that's not your EXACT thought process, but I'll bet you dollars to donuts that it's damned close.
> 
> ...


  [h=3]Proverbs 14:30[/h] English Standard Version (ESV)

   [SUP]30 [/SUP]A tranquil[SUP][a][/SUP] heart gives life to the flesh,
    but envy[SUP][b][/SUP] makes the bones rot


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## TinySquid (Apr 22, 2014)

JerryVenz said:


> Nikon camera gear and port. flash: $9025.00
> 
> Canon camera gear and port. flash: $8500.00
> 
> ...



So... are those inflation adjusted numbers?


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## nzmacro (Apr 22, 2014)

rwilliams said:


> I was talking to another local photographer the other day and she told me that in the past year, she has invested $28,000 into her photography business (portraits, weddings, events). This is her first year in photography and even after her investments, I personally don't see any quality in her photography and certainly would not hire her.
> 
> That being said, I'm also in my first year and have a lot to learn, but I can't imagine investing that much money this early.
> 
> So, this spiked my curiosity... How much money have you invested into your photography business? Over what period of time? And did you get a business loan to help with these investments?




Be very glad you are not a sports or bird shooter 

Danny.


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## Scatterbrained (Apr 23, 2014)

TinySquid said:


> JerryVenz said:
> 
> 
> > Nikon camera gear and port. flash: $9025.00
> ...




Not likely.


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## petrochemist (Apr 23, 2014)

Since getting my first DSLR in May 2010 I've spent £6310 in photography hardware. Much of it on very cheap items (adapters etc.), and most of the rest second hand, no single item cosing me more than £500 (The Bigmos as £599, but it was a long service award I only paid the postage).
However I'm purely a hobbyist, if running a business there are many expenses that wouldn't fall into the hardware bracket that would need to be invested, to cover the business described:

Rent of a studio.
Insurance.
Advertising.
Staff costs (No one should be doing wedding photography without a second shooter)
Props...

$28k would to me seem to be realistically on the low side for a sucessful photography business.


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## Virgil (Apr 23, 2014)

If you're working as a pro you have to have a back up for all your gear, so, $30,000.00 isnt all that bad. Could you imagine doing a wedding and your camera or light pack stopped working. One bad wedding and your name is ruined forever.


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## rwilliams (Apr 23, 2014)

Not quite what I was thinking, but I suppose I could see how it came across like that.  I honestly just couldn't figure out where they had spent all of that money.  After reading over this post, I have a better understanding on how things could add up.  I still think it's silly to have spent so much in one year, especially if they're obviously not knowledgeable of the equipment they're using. 

And no, I don't think I could do better with that much gear. I would be totally in over my head with all of that. I'm trying to learn how to use what I have the best that I can before I venture off into too many purchases. However, after reading some of these posts, I am a bit anxious to purchase some new lenses. 



manaheim said:


> The minute you start saying stuff like "so and so spent $$$$$ and their photography still sucks", you are falling victim to the specter of jealousy and spite. The person you are focusing on has got some money to blow, and you wish that person... because man, you sure as hell could do better with that gear than her! Etc.
> 
> Maybe that's not your EXACT thought process, but I'll bet you dollars to donuts that it's damned close.
> 
> ...


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## SnappingShark (Apr 23, 2014)

I'd say about $7000 and that's on stuff I've picked up since August 2013 (I had a huge gap in not having any equipment since I moved from the UK to US a couple of years ago)


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## tirediron (Apr 23, 2014)

bribrius said:


> im still trying to figure out the gear insurance thing.... granted, i don't have huge money in gear but generally speaking my house is in is insured with its contents up to 100k in belongings or some stupid number (way more than my stuff is worth here, so are you guys insuring for theft out of your cars or something?


First of all, check your home-owners policy carefully; irrespective of the total dollar amount covered many (most?) have limitations on the amount that they will reimburse for a specific type item.  $5000 seems like a very common number in my experience, so in practical terms, you could have $10,000 in gear in your home, your house is burgled, and all your gear stolen ($10K can easily fit into one gadget bag these days); if you have a $1000 deductible and a $5000 cap on camera gear, all you would get would be $4000!


My insurance covers my gear no matter where it is.  House, venue, vehicle, bus-station locker up to $50,000.  It also covers me if someone else damages my gear, or if my gear hurts someone ($2,000,000 liability).  It also allows me to add a venue as a 'co-insured' so that if I'm shooting in a big hotel for example and something happens that relates to me or my gear, my insurance and not the hotels will take the hit.  This is a VERY common requirement of many venues.


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## bribrius (Apr 23, 2014)

tirediron said:


> bribrius said:
> 
> 
> > im still trying to figure out the gear insurance thing.... granted, i don't have huge money in gear but generally speaking my house is in is insured with its contents up to 100k in belongings or some stupid number (way more than my stuff is worth here, so are you guys insuring for theft out of your cars or something?
> ...


excellent post. i don't think i need the gear insurance in my case i have more valuable items i should probably be concerned with though? It does seem to be important the difference between who needs it and who may not and what might be covered in what situation? i had someone break into my house once (well, i don't lock it anyway they walked in), but because of the dog i think they managed to get away with about three minutes and maybe a hundred dollars in stuff? i DO WISH i had caught them. i do i do. And i think they hit the dog with something when i got home it looked a little hurt acting but was okay. For curiosity sake, if i drop a camera in a river or if it is stolen out of a vehicle what does this insurance cost? so we all know?


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## robbins.photo (Apr 23, 2014)

I guess the equation is a lot different depending on the individual, and what sort of photography they do the most.  For me I'm strictly amatuer, no desire to turn pro whatsoever.  At the moment I've got two Nikon D5200's - for me it made sense to purchase a second one recently because my daughter has expressed an interest in photography and now I'll have something she can shoot with when she tags along.  When she's not, I have a second body I can mount a lens on (usually my 85 mm prime) so I can have it ready to go at a moments notice without swapping lenses.

I've found that works exceedingly well for me personally, I don't have to spend time swapping lenses anymore before I'm ready to shoot, and I don't need to carry around a camera bag with me on my zoo walks.  For lenses I've got a very good selection that works well for what I do, I currently have a Sigma 70-200 mm F/2.8 as my primary zoom lens, I've got two different teleconverters for it so I can add one or the other in and turn it into a 140-400mm at F/5.6 or a 98-280 mm at F/4 as needed.  Gives me both fast glass and good zoom capabilities without having to carry a lot of extra lenses.

I have an 85 mm AF-S G F/1.8, which might seem like a strange selection to some since I already have that focal length in 2.8, but for what I shoot it is a fantastic lens.  It is amazingly sharp, works great for portraits, and is very fast - I've found that 85 mm is also one of the most useful focal lengths when shooting indoor at the zoo so it is definately worth having in the bag even though I can acheive the same focal length with the Sigma.

I also have a 50 mm AF-S G F1.8, which works great in a wide variety of situations, it's good for portraits, aquarium shots, and stuff where I need a little wider angle than what the other two can provide.  All in all my kit pretty much delievers great results in about 95% of the shooting situations I generally find myself in so really I probably won't be making a lot of additions to it at least in the near future, other than something a little wider angle at some point.  

I've been shooting for a little less than a year now, but so far at least I've been very happy with all my equipment selections.  As far as how much money I have invested, rough guess would be a little over $2000 at this point.  One thing I did discover though is that I realized that for me this isn't going to be just another hobby, this really has become a lifelong pursuit.  

So really when it comes to getting new gear, I really think your best bet is to take a look at what you have, figure out what need your current gear isn't meeting, and then look at adding something to address that need.  The other thing to keep in mind is that when folks look at your pictures, they for the most part won't have a clue what it was shot with unless you tell them.  So if like me your getting the kind of results you want out of a D5200 it just doesn't make a lot of sense to spend a ton of cash on a say a D800 if the only reason for that purchase is so you can say, "Hey, look at me, I own a D800".

But the equation is different for everybody.  For some folks a D800 or maybe a D4 is a good investment for what they do - I certainly wouldn't want to try photographing weddings for example with my crop sensor D5200's.


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## JerryVenz (Apr 23, 2014)

TinySquid said:


> JerryVenz said:
> 
> 
> > Nikon camera gear and port. flash: $9025.00
> ...



NO. And my wife pointed out that I did not include: studio furniture, Wall Decor--all of the many framed and unframed large wall portraits, our projection equipment and very large screen, AND our studio computers, monitors, printers, and raid array.


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## tirediron (Apr 23, 2014)

bribrius said:


> ... if i drop a camera in a river or if it is stolen out of a vehicle what does this insurance cost? so we all know?


Prices vary widely depending on area and desired coverage.  Mine costs $750/year.


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## The_Traveler (Apr 23, 2014)

Insurance on only equipment loss/damage (not liability or other professional stuff) costs me about %1 but I'm not a pro, don't shoot for $.


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## TinySquid (Apr 23, 2014)

JerryVenz said:


> TinySquid said:
> 
> 
> > So... are those inflation adjusted numbers?
> ...


But how could you forget _that_ boat anchor?! :roll:


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## The_Traveler (Apr 23, 2014)

Just a mention that when you use the term 'investment', the implication is that one hopes for a return on this investment.

For those of us who are realists, the word is probably not investment but sunk costs.


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## spacefuzz (Apr 23, 2014)

The question made me curious....

Shooting heavily for the last 5 years, professional for the last 3 in Fine Art, Stock, and Aviation: 

Gear: $20k
Printing and Shows: $7.5k
Outdoor gear to get on location: $5k
Travel to locations: $45k

Total: $77,500 give or take


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## table1349 (Apr 23, 2014)

Too much....... and not enough!


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## bace (May 13, 2014)

I can't be bothered to read most of the posts in the this thread so I'm sorry if this is repetitive.

I started with a $500 film camera.

A few years later I bought a 300D (cheapest and first DSLR from Canon).

I literally only every invested after making the money from the gear I had. If you can't make money with a $500 Camera, then you're not a good photographer. Period.

If and ONLY if you can make money with a $500 camera should you ever invest in more gear, as you reach your creative limitations. 

My first investment was a lens, then studio lights, then camera upgrade, then light modifiers, then strobes, then blah blah blah.

I became a people photographer, so that route worked for me, but rest assured that at no point was "investing" in a business past renting gear worth it. Spending lots of money does not a photographer make. In-fact spending lots of money on gear is great news for real photographers, because it's just another "pro" that will be going out of business soon and selling all that amazing gear on craigslist for mad cheap.

Like my most recent investment of a 5D MKIII. Which literally paid for itself in 2 months (probably the only thing I've financed since I started).


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## kathyt (May 13, 2014)

I would say between $21,000-23,000.


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## tirediron (May 13, 2014)

bace said:


> ...If you can't make money with a $500 Camera, then you're not a good photographer. Period....


I'm sorry, but this statement is rubbish.  Period.


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## bace (May 14, 2014)

So you're saying you couldn't make money with a Rebel? I've literally taken product photography for a client with my iPhone. Understanding composition and light has nothing to do with the gear you have.

Understanding photoshop and editing doesn't require money. Just time.

Also, you make a great argument.


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## table1349 (May 14, 2014)

Bring your iPhone and your Rebel and pick the big 12 football game or basketball game you would like to shoot and I will get you on the sidelines/baseline with me and well see how many photos are of publication quality.


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## kathyt (May 14, 2014)

bace said:


> So you're saying you couldn't make money with a Rebel? I've literally taken product photography for a client with my iPhone. Understanding composition and light has nothing to do with the gear you have.
> 
> Understanding photoshop and editing doesn't require money. Just time.
> 
> Also, you make a great argument.


I shot with a Rebel for a long time. I out grew it very quickly. I don't think showing up at an event with a Rebel would be a wise decision. Backup? Lenses? Lighting?


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## bace (May 14, 2014)

First of all I don't shoot sports. BUT I would take that challenge any day. A rebel T2i with a 70-200 is totally fine to shoot fast action. You're probably the kind of photographer that shoots constant 6fps until you get your magic shot. It's safe of course, but not necessary if you can anticipate a great shot.

Also as if anyone at a wedding or event knows the camera gear you have, or your abilities with it.

This is exactly what I hate about other photographers. You actually think that the money you spend on gear is directly related to your professional "qualifications" and you scorn anyone who's "stealing" jobs from you because they can do it for far less.


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## bace (May 14, 2014)

tirediron said:


> bace said:
> 
> 
> > ...If you can't make money with a $500 Camera, then you're not a good photographer. Period....
> ...



After looking at your website sir it is very clear, that you are not qualified to give any critique on anyones work.

Getting retards to pay you to take pictures is business. Getting awards and having talent is photography.

Everything on the front page of my website was shot with a rebel. And all of it was published/paid work.


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## tirediron (May 14, 2014)

bace said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > bace said:
> ...


All right, first of all, let me clarify my statement:  When I said your comment was rubbish, I meant that the camera has precious little to do with the job, and whether it's a $50 camera or a $50,000 camera should not matter a whit.  My first money in photography was made with a second or third-hand $35 Miranda all-mechanical film camera.  It's the photographer that matters, NOT the gear.

Let's not get personal with each other's work or skill shall we?  I made no comment about the quality of your work, nor did I express my opinion on it; you and I clearly shoot in two different styles  and for two very different market segments.  You have a long list of publishing credits.  That's great!  It does NOT however mean that your work is better than someone elses and *I very much do NOT appreciate my clients, some of whom have become good friends, being referred to as "retards".  *


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## kundalini (May 14, 2014)

bace said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > bace said:
> ...


Bad form.


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## spacefuzz (May 14, 2014)

bace said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > bace said:
> ...



What? Just why was this called for?  Brace yourselves for another locked thread.


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## table1349 (May 14, 2014)

bace said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > bace said:
> ...



Still a troll I see...

Front Page:



Picture from front page with Exif Data:


Funny the Exif data says Canon EOS 5D Mark III, not rebel.  A Troll and a liar.

Buh-By....
[video=dailymotion;xgu5tb]http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xgu5tb_total-bastard-airlines_shortfilms[/video]


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## BrickHouse (May 14, 2014)

And......for the first time ever, I just used the ignore button!!!!! Thanks for stopping by Bace.


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## photoguy99 (May 14, 2014)

But what if I don't particularly care about making money?


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## TheNevadanStig (May 14, 2014)

I need about tree fiddy.


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## Raj_55555 (May 14, 2014)

Come on guys, can we get back to the $$s please? This was such an interesting read before people started with the personal attacks for no apparent reason.


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## manaheim (May 14, 2014)

I wonder if the ignore button works when you're a moderator...


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## manicmike (May 14, 2014)

bace said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > bace said:
> ...



Classy. 

You are obviously someone we can take seriously.


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## kathyt (May 14, 2014)

tirediron said:


> bace said:
> 
> 
> > tirediron said:
> ...


Wow. Just wow. If someone had the audacity to say something like that about MY clients they would no longer be a member of this forum, because when I was done with them they would NEVER want to come back. I am surprised tirediron is still allowing you to post! Using that word (the "R" word) is downright disgraceful. Bace.....you need to take a hike.....a very long one!


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## tevo (May 14, 2014)

bace said:


> After looking at your website sir it is very clear, that you are not qualified to give any critique on anyones work.
> 
> Getting retards to pay you to take pictures is business. Getting awards and having talent is photography.
> 
> Everything on the front page of my website was shot with a rebel. And all of it was published/paid work.





bace said:


> First of all I don't shoot sports. BUT I would take that challenge any day. A rebel T2i with a 70-200 is totally fine to shoot fast action.



I trust your breakfast is digesting well? Because it would seem your head is so far up your own ass that you can give us real time updates as it moves through your intestines.


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## manaheim (May 14, 2014)

Ok, I think that's quite enough of that.

For those of you who fired this thread up... and you know who you are... consider yourself given the evil eye.


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