# PC or Mac... HELP!



## ORourkeK (Jan 22, 2019)

I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?


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## Jeff15 (Jan 22, 2019)

I would never buy anything Apple, ever..........


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## SquarePeg (Jan 22, 2019)

I will start by saying I resisted all things Apple until I started traveling for work and wanted to be able to Facetime with my daughter and I'm not the biggest fan of iPhones but... My teenager has thoroughly abused her MacBook Pro - even stepping on it and cracking the screen, dropping it so it has a big dent on one corner and loading it to the max with videos and it still works perfectly (much to her dismay as I won't buy her another one while this one still breathes).  I bought myself an iPad Pro and I truly love that as well - no issues and I love editing photos on it (is that an option for you?).  Meanwhile, my 4 year old Dell laptop which has sat on my desk attached to an external monitor and has taken no abuse at all is down to only 2 working usb ports out of 4 and runs slower than I do.  When and if I ever decide to get another laptop or desktop, it will be a Mac.


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## dxqcanada (Jan 22, 2019)

As you noted ... Apple products work great when the entire environment is unified.
I have a MacBook 15" and had a MacBook 13", both worked great with my other Apple products (iPhone/iPad).
I also have an XPS 13 touchscreen running Windows 10 and Linux.
I use LS and PS on both ... and they work (for what I need them for).
It is difficult to say what would be best ... the MacBook has that cool Apple thing, but my XPS really does look awesome ... smaller than my MB 13 ... yeah, it is about appearance and portability.
OK, don't bother reading what I have to say ... just rambling ... it's up to you.

Note: it is really handy having a touch screen when your cat is lying partially on the computer while trying to sleep on the lap.


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## Nwcid (Jan 22, 2019)

I am a huge fan of my MacBooks, but that is only Apple stuff I own.  They are hard to beat and I have been using them since the G3.  Mine are not abused, but extremely well used.  I travel constantly and they survive. 

If you are looking for a little better price, or at least one with more options in memory size you can alway try, Refurbished Mac


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## DarkShadow (Jan 22, 2019)

Mac all the way.Never going back to winblows and macs hold there value.


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## Derrel (Jan 22, 2019)

Jeff15 said:


> I would never buy anything Apple, ever..........



Yeah...it's a lot like Nikon. $hi+ just works and works well, for years and years and years, with no virus issues, no kernel panics, no blue screen of death nonsense, has amazing screen quality, HIGH resale value (unlike Win-doze PC gear), and amazing up-time... Macintosh is awful...I've owned it since the 1990's, and no matter how much I want them to break down so I can easily rationalize a new machine, that's never happened. meanwhile....in 2002, my $2,999 then-top-of-the-line Sony Vaio PC, my first-ever PC, got hit with a virus, then an irrepairable kernel virus (a nice, malicious one,complete with a hacker's taunt...Oh,how much I LOVED that!!!). Yeah, a $2,999 PC that was destroyed in less than two years' of light duty use...

Again...stay away from Macintosh...the high-quality hardware and the slick,reliable, easy-to-use Operating System that is specifically designed _FOR_ your computer and made _BY_ the company that builds the hardware will last a long time, and will keep working for years, and those two awful things (long duty life, and integrated hardware and integrated OS) will leave you with no choice but to pass the old Mac along to a significant other, or to sell it for a high resale amount--should you choose to modernize. Macintosh sucks as much as Nikon gear and Nikkor lenses suck. Macintosh the machine, and Mac OS, both are utter crap. As stupid a choice as is Nikon.


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## D7K (Jan 23, 2019)

Switched to MacBook Pro last year (16GB, i7), after years of building my own PC's and owning several laptops, I'm more than happy and don't ever see me returning to the Windows world.  My only gripe is that I need to invest in some decent sized external storage as shooting 47MB RAW files on the D850, the space is eaten up quickly.  I have no performance issues with LR or PS and as has been said, and as I have also promoted to others even when not using Apple products, they just work... Updates are consistent to the OS and there's no company that have yet been able to get the performance between software and hardware tweaked to the level of Apple.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

I figured this would be the verdict (Mac). It will just kill me spending $300 more for something that has 1/3 the storage and half the memory. If the MacBook had the same specs and was $300 more, I would be having an easier time with this decision.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

Jeff15 said:


> I would never buy anything Apple, ever..........


Why is that? I used to be this way, but it is starting to get harder and harder to keep my hatred going.


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## D7K (Jan 23, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I figured this would be the verdict (Mac). It will just kill me spending $300 more for something that has 1/3 the storage and half the memory. If the MacBook had the same specs and was $300 more, I would be having an easier time with this decision.



Apple know how to use their software to get the absolute beast from their hardware, I've often spoken to and seen people with higher spec windows or linux machines, they don't run like my MacBook... It...Just...Works...


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

I get that. But storage has nothing to do with software. I will only be getting 1/3 the SSD space. How do you explain that? 

EDIT: Storage size* has nothing to do with software.


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## Nwcid (Jan 23, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I figured this would be the verdict (Mac). It will just kill me spending $300 more for something that has 1/3 the storage and half the memory. If the MacBook had the same specs and was $300 more, I would be having an easier time with this decision.



https://www.apple.com/shop/refurbished/mac/1tb-512gb-15-inch-macbook-pro

First 9 machines are either 512 GB or 1 TB and are under $2400.


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## D7K (Jan 23, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I get that. But storage has nothing to do with software. I will only be getting 1/3 the SSD space. How do you explain that?
> 
> EDIT: Storage size* has nothing to do with software.



Storage is now cheap.... In everything in life there is a trade off, I'd rather have a solid reliable piece of kit and buy storage - be-it cloud or external or both, There's not a single reason I'd chose a windows box now, and like I said, I built them for years..


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

But now we are talking refurb, and not new. And I am not trying to argue for the sake of arguing. I know the MacBook is the right choice here, I just don't understand how we as consumers have allowed this to happen. Apple is selling a product with less hardware (a lot less), for hundreds more. The next Dell XPS 15 has the same i7 processor and graphics card but 16 GB ram and 512 GB SSD for $1700. So that is still better specs than the MacBook Pro, and it's $700 cheaper. I know the MacBook "just works", I know they last, I know they hold their value, but HOW do we let them get away with that big of a difference?


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

D7K said:


> Storage is now cheap.... In everything in life there is a trade off, I'd rather have a solid reliable piece of kit and buy storage - be-it cloud or external or both, There's not a single reason I'd chose a windows box now, and like I said, I built them for years..



It's the principle behind it though. 1 TB of SSD is a couple hundred bucks. So, as a consumer, we are just OK with spending a couple hundred bucks more, for less, and then going out and spending a couple hundred more to compete with the competition? Again, I really want to reiterate that I am going to most likely buy the MacBook, it is just killing me lol.

EDIT: Also, the "Trad off" would be spending a few hundred bucks more for the same specs, not less specs. I want to make that clear. I agree that Apple does a great job with their machines, but we shouldn't be paying them more for that, as well as for less specs.


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## jcdeboever (Jan 23, 2019)

Open up a Dell laptop, open up a Macbook, enough said. It helps if you know what your looking at but it is night and day. The quality of the capacitors alone, make it a better purchase. The VRM (CPU voltage regulator module) in a Dell is a joke that's not funny. The display alone is worth the extra. As mentioned, durability, resale, operating systems are all clear advantages irregardless of linking in home. I have built servers, engineering computers, home computers, graphic art workstations, and many Windows installations. I loathe Windows. The only reason I use one is because I have high end hardware and it's illegal to install Apple OS or Inwould have done it years ago. My main rig is a multi boot system running Linux Slackware, and Windows 10. The only time I boot Windows is if I need to edit a Fujifilm RAF file.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

Alright, Alright. I give up. Thank you all for putting up with me and helping me with my decision. Time to sell my soul and head to the Apple store.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

Just found out I can get a discount through work, so that helps. It looks like there is a "Pro Apps Bundle" which lists Final Cut Pro in it. I thought Final Cut Pro came with the computer?


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## TreeofLifeStairs (Jan 23, 2019)

Derrel said:


> Jeff15 said:
> 
> 
> > I would never buy anything Apple, ever..........
> ...



I think I need a towel since I just took a bath in your sarcasm.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 23, 2019)

I am now a happy owner of a MacBook Pro. Time to become familiar with the OS. SO different.


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## Nwcid (Jan 23, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I am now a happy owner of a MacBook Pro. Time to become familiar with the OS. SO different.



The hardest thing I had to learn is how much easier many things are.  It was hard to understand how things that use to take several steps now only took 1-2 so I felt like I was doing something wrong.


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## dxqcanada (Jan 23, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> Time to become familiar with the OS. SO different.



Yeah, it is weird place, though it has a Linux feel to it ... read up on the shortcut keys !!!


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## Dave442 (Jan 24, 2019)

I also had to become familiar with the OSX commands and ways of doing things after 25 years in a business that only used PC's. It was a pain at first, but now I prefer it over those times I turn around and use one of the PC's still running behind me. And don't tell microsoft that I have Windows XP running under Paralles desktop for when I need to run one very old program that non of my Windows 10 machines can run. I only have a 250gb HD and have no problem with disc space - all my photos and videos are on external drives and I have kept the number of installed programs to those that I use all the time. A three year old MBP with an i5 chip and 8gb memory and it still runs through processing D800 files in LR (catalog is on the SSD drive).


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## JoeW (Jan 24, 2019)

I'm a Nikon shooter, have been for decades.  Love Nikon.  But I don't think Canon shooters are crazy and I"m not one of those people who argues "you should use the same brand I use or you're an idiot."  

Same with computers.  Lots of good reasons to use PCs.  But I was an early PC user (hey--I've owned an Osborne and then a couple of Kaypros, then a Zenith, a Dell, several Dells actually, a couple of HPs).  I converted to Mac because of a business disaster and the persuasiveness of my son, and have never looked back.  So any ,way you bought a Mac.  I won't spend time convincing you why that was a good decision--you made that decision.  But I'm going to share a couple of tips with you that might have you going "woah--this decision is looking better every day!"

1.  Apple stores.  Bring in your hard drive with a power source and they'll put it all on the HD of your new Mac--no charge.  And the Genius Bar is a great way to get troubleshooting and problem solving.  I brought in a frayed power chord (I rolled over it with my office chair--totally my fault) and it got replaced for free because it was in the first year.  I believe that if you did NOT buy AppleCare, you still get a full year of free support and also online classes or classes at the Apple store.  Maybe you're someone who'd prefer to read a manual or go to YouTube.  For me, having F2F answers to my problems and hands-on instruction is just a really huge plus.

2.  Affinity Pro.  I really hate paying a monthly rental fee to Adobe--despise it.   I know others don't mind.   I also know it's the industry standard.  And people make the argument that you can stop paying (but yeah, then what the hell do you do with your photo library?).  No, to a serious photographer, once you start renting the PS/Creative Suite package you're doing so for as long as you're in photography.  Unless you switch options.  Affinity Pro was designed to be a direct competitor to PS.  It was originally designed for the Mac.  And you pay one fee and that's it--no monthly lease/rental charges, no fees for upgrades.  I think I paid $30 and I believe it's up to a hefty $40 now.

3.  iPhone and other Mac devices are seamless.  As a photographer, it's really nice to have a phone and iPad and MacPro that will all easily update and share information.  So you can be at a shoot and the photos are downloaded to your Mac in another room and then shared with your phone which you can pull out to compare with a model and make quick adjustments.  As Derrel pointed out, there is a seamlessness about all the stuff and it just "works."


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## vin88 (Jan 27, 2019)

anyone like working with windows 7 ?


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## BananaRepublic (Jan 27, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?



Do you need a laptop?, you could get a high spec iMac as a refurb or second hand.


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## dxqcanada (Jan 27, 2019)

vin88 said:


> anyone like working with windows 7 ?



W7 is the best MS operating system they ever made.


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## otherprof (Jan 27, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?


I can't comment on your specific needs, but I was using pc's running windows for a long time. When I switched to Mac years ago, it was an epiphany. Everything worked flawlessly. It seemed designed for a person to use. It is more expensive, but I think that is justified.


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## n a m (Jan 27, 2019)

My 12 year old son just brought back to life a 2010 MacBook Pro after I thought it was unrecoverable.  That box has been through two hard drives, two batteries, and a frayed ribbon cable.  I doubt you will be unhappy with your purchase. 

MTA. I just picked up a 2011 model for about £400 for my other son.  They just speak for themselves. :shrug:




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DanOstergren (Jan 27, 2019)

I bought an iMac in early 2017, and it has performed poorly ever since I bought it (I got the one that the salesman recommended for photo editing). I took it to the Apple store where I bought it and had them check it out, and they told me there was nothing wrong with it, even though I consistently have problems with this thing. Worst purchase of my life, really. I will never buy an Apple computer again. Before this I had a Macbook Pro with top of the line specs. The graphics card fried on it, 1 month after the time period in which Apple would have fixed it free of charge as it was a known defect to them.

Probably going to get a Surface Book very soon. I've used my friend's a few times and it's amazing.


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## jcdeboever (Jan 28, 2019)

dxqcanada said:


> vin88 said:
> 
> 
> > anyone like working with windows 7 ?
> ...


I always thought Windows 2000 was.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 28, 2019)

DanOstergren said:


> Probably going to get a Surface Book very soon. I've used my friend's a few times and it's amazing.



Did you try using PS or LR on the Surface Book? I have been using the Macbook every day since owning it, and I am just not getting the hype. It will most likely be going back this week. I know I am probably not giving it enough time, but I think I have just spent too many hours on a PC to get past the differences.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 28, 2019)

jcdeboever said:


> dxqcanada said:
> 
> 
> > vin88 said:
> ...



I don't get what people dislike about Win 10. I think its fantastic.


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## jcdeboever (Jan 28, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> > dxqcanada said:
> ...


Updates, driver issues, file system, security, layout not logical, print system, to name a few. I get it works fine for a lot of people, but some people used to other systems, it seems totally cumbersome. My main gripe is the file system and not having control of updates and dependencies.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 28, 2019)

Hmm. To me, all of those things you mention were flawless transitions from 7 to 10. Maybe you work at a deeper level than I do, but I would be impressed with you, or sadly disappointed with myself, considering I work in IT.


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## DanOstergren (Jan 28, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> DanOstergren said:
> 
> 
> > Probably going to get a Surface Book very soon. I've used my friend's a few times and it's amazing.
> ...


I used Photoshop CC 2019 on the Surface Pro 3, and it was excellent, especially in comparison to my iMac.


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## jcdeboever (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> Hmm. To me, all of those things you mention were flawless transitions from 7 to 10. Maybe you work at a deeper level than I do, but I would be impressed with you, or sadly disappointed with myself, considering I work in IT.


It boils down to what your used to using I guess. Both systems work


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## sordnotsword (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?



It mostly depends pn the equipment you already have and its compatibility with Windows or MAC OS.  Since a lot of photographers use macs there might be better driver support for them over a windows based pc. I do suggest that whatevet you get you should opt to have an SSD theyre faster than a typical hard drive and will make using programs like photoshop less frustrating.


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## DGMPhotography (Jan 29, 2019)

As someone who has been a Mac user since high school, and recently bought a Windows desktop, I will tell you this:

Mac's do last. But they will slow down after awhile. Having a SSD and at least 16gb RAM is probably your best deterrent there. And the Mac OS is a great and intuitive OS and the integration with other Apple products is great. However, Apple has gotten lazy in the last couple of years. Ever since Steve Jobs died, the company has stopped innovating, and any changes/updates are very incremental.

A lot of Windows machines have finally caught up with Apple's quality and reliability, at least to a degree where the price difference is no longer worth it. You're mostly paying for the brand and the environment now. And the trackpad. Macbooks have the best trackpads (which I use for editing). I don't know why Windows laptops can't get a decent trackpad. It's literally one of the main reasons I use a Mac for laptop (mobile, fine edits, photoshop, etc), and a desktop for batch editing and video work (stronger). 

I got a ASUS ROG desktop twice as strong as an iMac would have been, for about half the price.

I've never owned a Windows laptop, so maybe it's different, but I had no problem adapting to another OS (I grew up on Windows) and the added power was worth it. I also had an iPhone and switched to Google Pixel 2. Again, Apple is no longer innovating, whereas Google and other companies are pouring a ton of money into R&D. Their Google Assistant is testament to that, and lightyears beyond Siri. Plus, it's one of the best cameras on the market.


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## D7K (Jan 29, 2019)

I'm tempted to agree with some of the above, but still, I am not sure I could be convinced that even the quality of materials used is close from Windows offerings (laptops) to Apple.  Apple have indeed gotten lazy, but there is no need to innovate every week, every month, there's no need to continue to push and push; we're at a point now where technology is so saturated and so similar that it comes down to the detail and to personal preference.  Personally, I've used linux (various), Windows and now Mac, I love my MacBook Pro, for sure I went with the latest model and 16GB RAM for "Future-proofing" but still, the quality offered by Apple outweighs what I have seen available from most if not all.  I'm not a fanboy, I know my technology, I worked in IT for 20 years, I just like to open my Mac, it's on and ready to go, it's quick, it's solid, it out-performs my higher spec windows laptop and it's more portable.  For me, I use what I like and what works,  I'm yet to see a screen match that of the MBPro, but to each their own, this is a Canon / Nikon argument for millennials haha the best tool is the one that works for you.. after all, that's all they are, unless you're one of these people who like to connect to WiFi in Starbucks or something and feel a sense of pride and power when you "whip out your equipment"


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## mdruziak (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?




I use both PC and Mac and it really doesn't matter.   Mac is nice for me because it interfaces quite well with my iPhone and iPad.  But other than that....


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## ORourkeK (Jan 29, 2019)

D7K said:


> unless you're one of these people who like to connect to WiFi in Starbucks or something and feel a sense of pride and power when you "whip out your equipment"



Hey, stop talking about me like that.  But in all seriousness, 16 GB is no longer future proof and at the price point Apple is selling their machines (the above $2k models), 32 GB should be standard, as well as 500 GB of SSD storage. We are just allowing these companies to over price their products because we have started to accept that whatever Apple does, is OK. Now we how companies like Microsoft jumping on board and selling their Surface Book 2 for about the same price as Macbook Pro's. They are also not including the pen, so you have to go out and spend more money on that. We as consumers have allowed these companies to set the standard, and now we must live with it. I am so torn right now whether I am going to keep the Macbook or not. The reason I gave in and bought it was because every PC laptop I find, there are split reviews (even thought I think half the bad reviews are left by Apple users XD). It makes it impossible for me to decide what to do. I really dislike the Mac OS though, which is most likely a product of my hours spent on PC. But, it really feels like they try to "simplify" everything to the point of confusion. Maybe I should take that free online session they keep shoving down my throat.


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## D7K (Jan 29, 2019)

Mac OS for me is more like Linux, it just does what it does...gone are the days I wanna play around with tweaks and overclocking and minimising everything, I just like that I have a machine that has a superb screen, sweet speed and will service me a long time.  As I said, to each their own, I used Apple years ago and would jailbreak and play around but now, I just want to open, use and close, and for that experience, and the performance I have from it, I need nothing else...

EDIT:  I do need additional storage! Thanks 49MP RAW files!


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## Revolution Photograp (Jan 29, 2019)

I stopped buy Macs. (for me) They were not worth the premium I was paying.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 29, 2019)

See below for my likes and dislikes so far. 

*Pros*

The build quality is amazing. Seriously, for how thin it is, it feels SOLID.
It is BEAUTIFUL.
The screen is incredible. 
While I am not a huge fan of the build in keyboard, I love the magic keyboard.
I love how I can open it and start working almost instantly. (This is pretty common now on the PC side though, with Win10 and SSD)
It is fast and switching between programs is flawless. Especially when selecting a photo in LR to "edit in PS". (Although, this is mostly due to the SSD and the fact that it is a $3k machine)
I didn't think I would, but I love the touchbar. 
*Cons
*

Learning all of the new "Shortcuts". This was expected, but phew, it is a pain. 
I HATE the file system. PLEASE APPLE, JUST LET ME DRAG FILES. This could be my newness to the OS, but right now I feel like I have to move everything to the desktop before I can move it to where I want it to go. 
Still can't get the price out of my head. It isn't that I can't afford it, it is mostly just trying to justify the money I spent. 
The world is not ready for all of the ports to be lightning. I hate having to have adapters just to use all of my equipment. I would have loved two USB 3.0 and two Lightning. 

Well crap, the Pros are bigger than the Cons. I do want to pick up the Dell XPS 15 just to run stress test comparisons. Everyone is saying Macbook's do not need 32 GB of ram, but I will believe it when I see it.


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## williamptitus (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?


I owned Apple for a relative brief amount of time and was pleased with the computer itself except for the fact I felt very limited concerning software. There was much more choice of editing software when using PC. It has been a few years ... and things may be different and even improved at this time in regard to Apple software selection.


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## DGMPhotography (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> See below for my likes and dislikes so far.
> 
> *Pros*
> 
> ...



What's the issue with the file system? I've found it to be much better than Windows 10 file system.


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## eja (Jan 29, 2019)

I have been a MAC user for about 15 years and recently when it came time to upgrade various machines around the house I did not choose mac.  I like the MAC OS and am very comfortable with it.  I would have preferred to stay with the mac but I did not want to pay a premium for MAC hardware that was in comparison, older than that available for windows machines.  MAC has only recently upgraded the MINI and that has taken over 4 years if I'm not mistaken.  I don't want to be tied to MAC and their slow implementation of upgrades.  The process of switching has taken some time but now I will not go back because I have found WIN 10 to be very reliable.  I purchased 4 Lenovo laptops for the family use.  2 are being used by college students and one is being used by me.  I also purchased a Dell tower that was taken back from a lease and am very pleased with the price and components that were installed.

So, in summary, I left the mac because I don't want to be tied to their upgrade cycle.  I don't want to pay a premium for older hardware.  I do want to be able to easily swap a hard drive, add memory, and I don't want to pay a premium when I need to buy that hardware.  Would I go back to MAC.  At this point, I would go back even after making an investment in WIN machines if they began to build machines that were keeping up with current hardware, and were building machines that were more easily upgradeable and customizable.   However, I would not go back becaue of displeasure with Windows 10.  I have found it to be very reliable and I have more software opportunities in the WIN world.  But, after working in OS 10 for so many years, I still have a soft spot for it.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 29, 2019)

DGMPhotography said:


> What's the issue with the file system? I've found it to be much better than Windows 10 file system.



It turns out I do not have write privileges to my disk, so it is not being displayed when I go to save. I am unable to change these settings on my profile, which is the admin. Currently looking into this more.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 29, 2019)

When you go to save a file, do you see your Hard drive? I do not, and feel like I should be able to, but the only way I see to change the read/write settings is to boot to the terminal and disable the integrity protection, log in and change permissions, then reboot to terminal and enable integrity protection. But, i am also reading that you shouldn't do this.


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## DGMPhotography (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> When you go to save a file, do you see your Hard drive? I do not, and feel like I should be able to, but the only way I see to change the read/write settings is to boot to the terminal and disable the integrity protection, log in and change permissions, then reboot to terminal and enable integrity protection. But, i am also reading that you shouldn't do this.



Yeah, that's not normal. I don't have any issues like this.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 29, 2019)

So much for "It just works".  Waiting for the head of MAC support to call me after lunch. I do not want to mess with anything since I am not familiar with the OS.

EDIT: Never mind, I figured it out. 

Finder > System Pref > General > Select check box for "Hard disks". 

My sarcasm comes back to bite me. User settings: 1/ Me: 0.


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## DGMPhotography (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> So much for "It just works".  Waiting for the head of MAC support to call me after lunch. I do not want to mess with anything since I am not familiar with the OS.



I would say your case is an exception to the rule. I've never heard of that happening.


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## ORourkeK (Jan 29, 2019)

@DGMPhotography I edited my last post. Turned out to be in the settings. I didn't disable it though, so I am not sure why it was not checked off by default. I am so much happier with the machine now.


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## dxqcanada (Jan 29, 2019)

The only thing that turned me off of MacBooks was GPU (soldering) hardware failures ... though I figure they have fixed that some time ago.


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## LCL999 (Jan 29, 2019)

I am as biased in favour of PCs almast as much as Apple lovers are biased towards Macs. I gave up on Macs when my first one kept crashing. After two warranty replacements it died again out-of-warranty, Never again.
I'm very happy with MS Surface Pros. I use one as a PC with lots of extra storage and USBs attached, another as a laptop, and my wife uses one also. They are all on the same wifi network and that works well.
From your info, if you are comfortable with Windows and Google, why change? There are now ample quality s/w packages for the MS world.


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## thereyougo! (Jan 29, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I figured this would be the verdict (Mac). It will just kill me spending $300 more for something that has 1/3 the storage and half the memory. If the MacBook had the same specs and was $300 more, I would be having an easier time with this decision.



DO what I did and get it from the refurb shop - though I had to get mine from the UK shop which is less attractive financially.  I forgot about the refurb shop when I was in California for a month (d'oh) and got a i9 with 1TB and 32GB RAM for about £600 off list price.  The pain in the arse is having to use hubs for USB-A and card slots.


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## dxqcanada (Jan 29, 2019)

When you really don't know what OS to use, do what I did with my MacBook ... triple boot MacOS, Windows 10, and Linux.
If you get angry with one, just reboot to another !!!
The only problem that I had with that combo was lack of HD space ... though today storage space is no longer such an issue.


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## Bollygum (Jan 30, 2019)

Interesting read with lots of emotion..  I have a Dell XPS and it is quite good.  No real thought of paying 50% more for an almost equivalent Macbook Pro.  My partner is a cinematographer and she has always used Mac as video software was always better, but not now.  So she now is moving to Windows.


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## emanphoto (Jan 30, 2019)

Easy answer.  Buy Mac used.  
My Mac Pro 2008 is still running strong, I use it EVERYDAY for heavy work.  I paid $1000 for it over SEVEN years ago and have only had to replace the video card 6 months ago.  Everything else I added were just upgrades.
16GB RAM, 500GB SSD boot drive, plus 3 more internal drives, one just for photoshop scratch disk space ONLY.  Installed an eSATA PCI card and transfer speeds from my RAID external went up significantly.  
Downside for changing is learning to work with a new OS.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I don't like laptops.  I use them only when absolutely necessary.  Little screens and little keyboards annoy me. 
As a professional, I would not buy an iMac.  You're locked into one monitor and when it goes off, then what?  You're in for major surgery to get a color accurate monitor back into the thing.  
Mac Pro towers were the last really professional Macs they made.  You can get one for cheap now and upgrade the heck out of it.  Small commitment $-wise and you can decide whether you like it or not.

New MacBooks are impaired with minimal ports and yet they call them professional.  Pffft.  Upgradability is very important to me and I'd rec. a PC laptop, despite the horrid OS, with changeable batteries and multiple ports, USB 3, Thunderbolt 3,  etc, over a brand new Mac laptop which only has Two Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) ports and a headphone jack!


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## ORourkeK (Jan 30, 2019)

emanphoto said:


> New MacBooks are impaired with minimal ports and yet they call them professional.  Pffft.  Upgradability is very important to me and I'd rec. a PC laptop, despite the horrid OS, with changeable batteries and multiple ports, USB 3, Thunderbolt 3,  etc, over a brand new Mac laptop which only has Two Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) ports and a headphone jack!



The new Macbook Pro has four Thunderbolt ports, not two. The not being able to really upgrade anything does seem to worry me, however, I never usually upgrade my machines. I usually end up upgrading to a new machine. So I think for me, this is more of something to complain about rather than something that will actually affect me. It is sort of like how I complain about the lack of ability to change much on the iPhone, yet at this stage in life I find myself not tinkering with my phones as much. I switched back to android after owning the iPhone for three months, mainly because I missed widgets (Mint especially), but also because I "needed the ability to customize my phone more". Yet here I am a few months later and all I have set up are the widgets, and nothing else. My point is, for most of us, I think we look at features, or the lack of features, and just complain about it, when in reality we don't use most of them. I am not saying this is true for everyone, but majority of consumers.


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## santino (Jan 30, 2019)

Imo it's a question of OS. Recent Macs are basically pcs in stylish cases. If I had the money I would always buy the most recent mac because of macos.


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## Gary Bridger (Jan 31, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?


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## Gary Bridger (Jan 31, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?



Hi  this should resolve matters : 
Let me tell you mu story Mac Vs PC...  :
I used to be the PC Doctor here in Devon and Dorset, in the year of 200o when it was windows 98 up to XP I quickly learned to build computers and format them Spend days de fragging, time after time de hacking viruses and other stuff. Scary what you find on a hard drive run by windows just by typing in the word Model or nude! What goes through the back door that you have not seen , is more likely why Gary Glitter got arrested . I mean, Who looks at illegal stuff then goes and put their computer in for a service? 
This happened to a few clients i services computers and they had lost all information. i have a recovery program , It pulls out everything, Its frightening.
Even at a Convent !   So destiny   and my want to do under water photography took me as a dive instructor to Borneo. 
I bought a PC as well has having my old laptop. I though my lap top was the great. 
I paid allot for the best I could get.  Then I met the filming company, they said I need to buy a mac, As for the graphics are much better. 

I bout a mac book pro. Took getting used to. Once I got used to it, I felt silly wasting all my money on the PC they get going wrong. 

I discovered I could have windows on my mac too , best of both worlds. 
Running so many application I still have to day. This was back in 2007 . The lap top got out of dat, I sold it back here for £500.  I bought another 15 inch 2011. I am still using it right now! 
Macs do not get viruses, Ad ware is easy to remove, back up is easy to install. You spend more time using it then it sitting there wanting to be fixed. Less stress, then having to work matters out!
You pay fare a damn great service on line or from a free phone call. Get stuck. You go to help


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## DanOstergren (Feb 1, 2019)

Gary Bridger said:


> ORourkeK said:
> 
> 
> > I finally pushed my 6-year-old laptop to its limits and it is no longer with us. Now I have to decide if I want to stick with PC, or sell my self to the devil and go Mac. Right now I am stuck between the Dell XPS 15 with an 8th gen i7, GTX 1050 Ti, 1 TB SSD and 32 GB ram, or a MacBook Pro with the same processor, 1/3 the storage, half the ram, and an AMD processor... The MacBook Pro is $2400 while the Dell is $2100. The biggest thing stopping me from switching isn't even the price, but the environment. I have a full smart home setup with everything Google. A google pixel 3. A PC desktop (which I would probably end up turning into a server). So I have nothing invested into Apple which I think is Apple's biggest selling point. Owning everything Apple and having it just work everytime you need it, with ease. The biggest selling point for me on the MacBook side is the 4 USB-C (Lightning ports) as well as the rendering speeds in final cut pro. But, I edit photos way more than I do videos. So, I am just not sure I can justify going with the MacBook Pro. What do you all use? Any recommendations or insight from either side?
> ...


This resolves nothing. It's just a vague, out of date nonsense story.


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## BananaRepublic (Feb 1, 2019)

ORourkeK said:


> Learning all of the new "Shortcuts". This was expected, but phew, it is a pain.
> 
> I HATE the file system. PLEASE APPLE, JUST LET ME DRAG FILES.
> No it isnt and yes you can


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