# Are Our Ladies Treated Differently?



## PixelRabbit (Aug 20, 2013)

Ok I know this has the potential to go nowhere good but I'm very curious because I've seen it mentioned twice now.  

Are the women here treated differently than the men?  Handled with kit gloves? Treated nicer? Given more leeway? Held to a lower standard? 

 I've participated in male dominated forums and past times and I've definitely seen women be treated that way but I don't see it here, am I just not seeing it?


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## tirediron (Aug 20, 2013)

Other than that which is socially appropriate, I'm not aware of any difference; certainly I don't think that gender plays any difference in the critique one receives or how one's work is perceived.


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## PixelRabbit (Aug 20, 2013)

That's pretty much spot on for how I see it also John, sure there is some girl/boy banter now and again but I don't see people flocking to threads we make and overflowing it with attention or help above and beyond the norm.


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## sm4him (Aug 20, 2013)

I haven't really noticed a difference based on whether it's a male or female; I think what differences do sometimes crop up in how people are treated are more about attitude than gender. Those who come in with arrogant attitudes tend to get virtually slapped into the middle of last week (not next week, LAST week--but if I'm gonna slap someone that hard, I don't really wanna SEE 'em again in a week!). Those who seem to want drama, tend to get drama. Those who just like to debate and argue, get a lot of debates and arguments.

Those like Pixel and I, who are just sweet and lovable...well... :lmao:


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## runnah (Aug 20, 2013)

I hadn't noticed it.

Do I treat woman differently on here? Not really except for harmless flirting and anti-canadian jokes.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 20, 2013)

yes


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## amolitor (Aug 20, 2013)

I think that there is a small population of men who treat a small population of women with exceptional gentleness. Is this merely "hey, they're my friends" or is it creepy "I like to pretend she'll sleep with me if I am nice to her"? I dunno. Sometimes it feels like one thing, then another.

It jumps out at me, occasionally. Less so, lately, perhaps as some of the more obnoxious negative critique -- against which the radically different gentle critique stands out -- has been quashed.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 20, 2013)

tirediron said:


> Other than that which is socially appropriate, I'm not aware of any difference; certainly I don't think that gender plays any difference in the critique one receives or how one's work is perceived.



this sentence is a contradiction in that 'other than socially appropriate' implies that there should be a difference in how females are treated and the second half says there is no differnece.

I agree with Andy.


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## PixelRabbit (Aug 20, 2013)

Interesting so far!
Lew, more than just a yes? We started almost this very conversation on skype specifically about how some people were responding to my work and I asked for more then and again now will you expand on your thoughts this time around?


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## runnah (Aug 20, 2013)

amolitor said:


> I think that there is a small population of men who treat a small population of women with exceptional gentleness. Is this merely "hey, they're my friends" or is it creepy "I like to pretend she'll sleep with me if I am nice to her"?



Sleeping with people aside I think the "be nicer to your friends" thing is going to be hard to change regardless of the format.


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## kathyt (Aug 20, 2013)

No. I don't think so.


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## Designer (Aug 20, 2013)

I'm a push-over when some newbie girl posts here asking for help.  

I sometimes offer help to men if I know the answer and if I feel like it.


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## amolitor (Aug 20, 2013)

Another, more specific, way to ponder it.

There are quite a few people on this forum who are pretty restrictive in what they like. They want specific lights to appear in specific places. They want the white balance to be so, and so, and thus. And so on. Garnering positive critique on TPF is often a matter of hitting the proper technical notes.

This means that artistic efforts that defy these technical standards, for instance abstracts, or semi-abstracts (not to QUITE name names, but close, eh?) are often looked at askance by the, um, general population. Lacking technical measures by which to offer critique, many of the more prolific posters are a bit stumped by abstracts, especially, but also by any effort to make anything that doesn't look like Standard Wedding Photograph #1, #2, or #3.

It my overall sense that there are certain things which will tend to make this population of technically oriented people respond positively to these pictures:

- bright colors
- high contrast
- the apparent use of macro lenses
- being female, especially a flirty female

and certain things that make this population less likely to respond well to these pictures:

- unsharpness
- muted colors
- aggressive use of HDR
- being runnah


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## tirediron (Aug 20, 2013)

The_Traveler said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > Other than that which is socially appropriate, I'm not aware of any difference; certainly I don't think that gender plays any difference in the critique one receives or how one's work is perceived.
> ...


  Of course there should.  Men and women _*ARE*_ different, so there will be fundamental differences in the way one treats another.   My point was, as far as the artistic aspect goes, the giving and receiving of critique, etc, I am not aware of any pervasive difference.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 20, 2013)

I think it is inevitable that some subjects are treated more gently than others and I don't want get into details because I don't want to turn any spotlight on specific posts.
I try to be exactly even with my comment, no matter the gender or the subject, but it's not always possible.


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## Ilovemycam (Aug 20, 2013)

PixelRabbit said:


> Ok I know this has the potential to go nowhere good but I'm very curious because I've seen it mentioned twice now.
> 
> Are the women here treated differently than the men? Handled with kit gloves? Treated nicer? Given more leeway? Held to a lower standard?
> 
> I've participated in male dominated forums and past times and I've definitely seen women be treated that way but I don't see it here, am I just not seeing it?




I try to be kinder to the ladies. Their skin is more delicate all the way around. 

What would the world be like if we didn't have the ladies...a hell-hole.


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## runnah (Aug 20, 2013)

Ilovemycam said:


> What would the world be like if we didn't have the ladies...



A real pain in the ass.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 20, 2013)

tirediron said:


> Of course there should.  Men and women _*ARE*_ different, so there will be fundamental differences in the way one treats another.



The difference between men and women may be relevant in terms of the ability to write their name in the snow without moving their feet or nursing a child but, as far as photography goes, there should be no recognized difference.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 20, 2013)

First, look at how the question is phrased: 'Ladies' is used, implying some measure of expected respect.

From the FreeDictionary:
1) A well-mannered and considerate woman with high standards of proper behavior. 
2. a. A woman regarded as proper and virtuous. 
b. A well-behaved young girl.

I don't know any of the females, they might be unpleasant harridans, they might be quintuply-married alcoholics, they are only females, as we are males - not 'ladies' and 'gentlemen.'

Let's ignore that silly kind of social posturing and just allow everyone just to be adults and hear the unvarnished truth without it being strained through some false filter of social convention.


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## Buckster (Aug 20, 2013)

From my observations here, it looks _*to me*_ like many of the men totally suck up to the women here, as though they're buying them drinks at a club in hopes of a happy ending.  

That's especially true toward the women who post photos of themselves that are considered very attractive in today's culture, or avatars that men find attractive, whether the avatar is actually them or not.


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## tirediron (Aug 20, 2013)

The_Traveler said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > Of course there should. Men and women _*ARE*_ different, so there will be fundamental differences in the way one treats another.
> ...


Hence the meaning of this part of my post:



tirediron said:


> My point was, as far as the artistic aspect goes, the giving and receiving of critique, etc, I am not aware of any pervasive difference.


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 20, 2013)

tirediron said:


> Men and women _*ARE*_ different, so there will be fundamental differences in the way one treats another.


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 20, 2013)

runnah said:


> Ilovemycam said:
> 
> 
> > What would the world be like if we didn't have the ladies...
> ...



Because....you would be...um...."playing catcher" whereas before you were always just the pitcher?  :mrgreen:


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## JacaRanda (Aug 20, 2013)

Now I have more suggestions for friends or acquaintances thinking about joining the forum. [h=3][/h]


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## bunny99123 (Aug 20, 2013)

I don't feel I am treated any different then the gentleman's on the forum. I have had my share of harsh critiques. On the positive, i have learned from them. As an artist, I believe it is a level playing field. 

Now in a social aspect, I prefer to be treated like a Lady. I like my car door opened for me


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## Derrel (Aug 20, 2013)

Keeping in mind what The_Traveler brought up about the loaded terms "ladies" and "gentlemen", I'll stick with the colloquial and less-loaded terms "guys" and "gals", mmkay?

I think the answer is probably a qualified "Yes," the gals are treated differently in many cases. Why? The majority of them are less likely to act like d***s, and so they are treated in a different manner than more-aggressive or more impertinent posters. A small minority of the gals play the "innocent babe in the woods, help me, help me" card to a degree, but that act's only good for a few performances. A small, but significant percentage of the gals here sail _under the flags of other nations_; realized or not, there are a number of gals who participate here regularly under screen names and avatars that are gender-neutral or even gender-camouflaged, and a small group seem to take great pains to disguise their gender, or at least not to openly reveal it.


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## Tailgunner (Aug 20, 2013)

Meh...I really don't think much about ones gender when posting.


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## pgriz (Aug 20, 2013)

Gender, smender.  If "they" is good people, they get treated nice.  If there's lots of attitude and posturing, well, then some virtual smacking aside the head may be appropriate.  :greenpbl:


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## JacaRanda (Aug 20, 2013)

How do I really know anything about anyone on here without personally knowing them or doing some heavy duty snooping? My avatar/profile pic is fake. I am really fair skinned and weigh 70 lbs more or less than the picture shown.


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## sm4him (Aug 20, 2013)

JacaRanda said:


> How do I really know anything about anyone on here without personally knowing them or doing some heavy duty snooping? My avatar/profile pic is fake. I am really fair skinned and weigh 70 lbs more or less than the picture shown.



You have NO idea how much this disappoints me, Jaca, because that profile picture rocks, hard. It always somehow reminds me of a young Morgan Freeman, and so I kinda hear his incredible voice in my head when I read your posts. :lmao:
Or else, I don't.


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## Tee (Aug 20, 2013)

PixelRabbit said:


> .... but I don't see people flocking to threads we make and overflowing it with attention or help above and beyond the norm.



You've never seen a thread started by e.rose. 

People who haven't logged on in years practically kill themselves to pile into her thread to get pats on the head.  For the record, this isn't a dig or anything negative towards e.rose.  But, it is hilarious watching all the dudes trip over themselves vying for her attention.


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## tirediron (Aug 20, 2013)

sm4him said:


> ...You have NO idea how much this disappoints me, Jaca, because that profile picture rocks, hard. It always somehow reminds me of a young Morgan Freeman, and so I kinda hear his incredible voice in my head when I read your posts. :lmao:
> Or else, I don't.


What disappoints me is out of 21 respondents, only FOUR voted "Bacon!"


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## JacaRanda (Aug 20, 2013)

sm4him said:


> You have NO idea how much this disappoints me, Jaca, because that profile picture rocks, hard. It always somehow reminds me of a young Morgan Freeman, and so I kinda hear his incredible voice in my head when I read your posts. :lmao:
> Or else, I don't.



LOL.   It's me it's me honestly.  I was just kidding. For real it is me!  Xoxoxo


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## PixelRabbit (Aug 20, 2013)

Well, I was going to pick out some responses and reply to them but after some thought I've decided to just read it all, take it all in and learn a bit instead 

I will say some replies so far surprised me and some totally didn't but its all interesting


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## mishele (Aug 20, 2013)

Did someone mention something about having a sexy avatar getting you more attention?

Oh and yes, I do believe women are treated some what gentler...unless they're a MWAC and then it is no holds barred.


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## terri (Aug 20, 2013)

mishele said:


> Did someone mention something about having a sexy avatar getting you more attention?



Oh yeah, bay-bay!!!   I get slammed!!


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## runnah (Aug 20, 2013)

mishele said:


> Did someone mention something about having a sexy avatar getting you more attention?



Haha what a funny and witty post! You sound smart and very pretty! I bet you are also very deep and have a sensitive side but of course you still know how to have a good time!


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## DarkShadow (Aug 20, 2013)

Only if you are not on board with Bacon. I don't really thing so from what i have seen.


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## leighthal (Aug 20, 2013)

I find it funny that all you gals don't think your treated with kid gloves. It's like watching the dating game in here for the regular members. What's even funnier is the fact that the men are stuck in codpiece wars with each other. Look at the results of the poll so far. Case closed. As a non deluded MWAC, I get helpful advice mostly, but it's sugar coated. If I was a FWAC I'd be ripped apart on a daily basis. Seems silly to me that it has to be either extreme. Why not treat ALL (men, women, deluded, newbies, professionals) members the same. Respectful critics, honest opinions.


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## manaheim (Aug 20, 2013)

Oh is this why mish changed her avatar? 



runnah said:


> Ilovemycam said:
> 
> 
> > What would the world be like if we didn't have the ladies...
> ...



I CAN'T believe you did that.




Anyway...

The pattern I usually see is:

1. New gal shows up with sexy/pretty avatar.
2. Lots of men clamber over themselves with her for a bit.
3. Eventually it settles down minus the occasional more familiar flirtatious remark.
4. (if your name is mishelle then you periodically encourage this behavior, fanning the flames) 

Overall I don't think the gals get too much preferential treatment, but initially I think they get quite a bit... but again... I think it's based almost entirely off the avatar.


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## Ilovemycam (Aug 20, 2013)

When it comes to great photogs. I got as many lady photogs I like as men. (I'm talking big name greats.)


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## bc_steve (Aug 20, 2013)

not sure what all these abbreves like MWAC and FWAC are .... 

Don't really think that gender matters much when it comes to the C&C, but the ladies get some extra flirty attention for sure


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## gsgary (Aug 21, 2013)

It makes no difference to me they still both barrels


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## peter27 (Aug 21, 2013)

On TPF if you aren't a girl, don't shoot with the newest toys or find yourself somewhere other than North America, it can be quite frustrating watching your work being ignored; and it takes a long, long time (if at all) to get anywhere near the kind of response the members in one or all of the aforementioned groups enjoy. Many very good photogs simply give up after a while and go away.

Not wanting to take the thread in a different direction, but

TPF tends to be:

Soft on girls

Keen on equipment

Deeply rooted in American culture and values


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## manaheim (Aug 21, 2013)

Are you including Canada in that?  Because I often feel like a minority compared to the Canadians.   Well, actually, what I should say is "a significant percentage of the people on here who I am fond of or who have stand-out photographic skills are Canadians".  Which, in and of itself, is weird.  I need to move to Canada I guess.

But anyway, none of what you say surprises me terribly... I think the bulk of people here are American (I think), so naturally the culture would swing with the populace.  Soft on girls we covered.   Equipment... that's an easy one.  Understanding equipment is easier than understanding photography, AND understanding equipment is also a barrier in many cases to good photography... it's where most new folks start because it's tangible and it's something you have to deal with in order to be able to execute.  Since there is a constant stream of newer folks on here, lots of the topics and discussions veer that way.  Not all... but many.


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## Juga (Aug 21, 2013)

sm4him said:


> You have NO idea how much this disappoints me, Jaca, because that profile picture rocks, hard. It always somehow reminds me of a young Morgan Freeman, and so I kinda hear his incredible voice in my head when I read your posts. :lmao:
> Or else, I don't.



That is because Morgan Freeman thinks he is God...according to him.

Fox411 QA: Morgan Freeman on why he believes he is God and which successful film he hated making | Fox News


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## Stevepwns (Aug 21, 2013)

I actually just wrote a paper on this very subject.  

I have only been here a short while, but I do see a difference in the way women are talked too here.  Not in a bad way, IMO.  I treat women differently on purpose,  not because of some superiority thing, because women are different than men.  I am not as crass or vulgar, the tendency seems to be you can be more upfront and brutally honest with a man than you can with a woman.  I see those trends here.  I don't think its a bad thing. Men and women are different, big deal.  As long as we are all respectful....  I don't see where the problem is.  Just for the record, I am voting bacon, I always vote bacon....  regardless of the question.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 21, 2013)

peter27 said:


> On TPF if you aren't a girl, don't shoot with the newest toys or find yourself somewhere other than North America, *it can be quite frustrating watching your work being ignored; and it takes a long, long time (if at all) to get anywhere near the kind of response the members in one or all of the aforementioned groups enjoy*. Many very good photogs simply give up after a while and go away.
> 
> Not wanting to take the thread in a different direction, but
> 
> ...


*Point 1)* 
I don't exactly agree with the bolded statement.
I do think that what gets someone involved is being willing to put in some heavy lifting in terms of critique.  If you care to measure responses, I think tht my pictures get the fewest responses of any long term poster here however I feel like I am somewhat part of 'the group.'

*Point 2)*
Photosig has a very interesting thread.  
If anyone has an image that they feel has been under-critiqued ,they can put a comment at comment at the end of the thread saying something about the image, asking for critique with a link to it.
I think that would be an interesting Sticky.

Lew


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## Juga (Aug 21, 2013)

The_Traveler said:


> peter27 said:
> 
> 
> > *it can be quite frustrating watching your work being ignored; and it takes a long, long time (if at all) to get anywhere near the kind of response the members in one or all of the aforementioned groups enjoy*.
> ...



I tend to agree with Peter that there IS a clique on this forum who share inside jokes, comment frequently on each others' photos, etc. There are exceptions to this idea though and a couple of those members are tirediron and Derrel are the first two that come to mind as members that post frequently and spread the wealth of knowledge across the board. I have also looked at quite a few of your photos, Lew, and agree that as part of the clique you really don't get that many comments on your stuff. But having spent some time on this forum now it is very frustrating to see this clique chatting it up on one thread while many are trying to learn by posting their stuff on here, myself included. I know my photos aren't the greatest but I do appreciate feedback in all forms and I am sure others feel the same way as I do. No matter how frustrating it can be though the fact is that the clique is part of this online community and has been built by this forum which is the way it is suppose to work. So am I complaining, no, but it is hard to not notice that there is pretty tight group among this community.


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 21, 2013)

sm4him said:


> JacaRanda said:
> 
> 
> > How do I really know anything about anyone on here without personally knowing them or doing some heavy duty snooping? My avatar/profile pic is fake. I am really fair skinned and weigh 70 lbs more or less than the picture shown.
> ...




Me too!  I'm feeling bummed out now that I know you are not who I thought you were....that kinda sucks.


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## sm4him (Aug 21, 2013)

Stevepwns said:


> I actually just wrote a paper on this very subject.
> 
> I have only been here a short while, but I do see a difference in the way women are talked too here.  Not in a bad way, IMO.  I treat women differently on purpose,  not because of some superiority thing, because women are different than men.  I am not as crass or vulgar, the tendency seems to be you can be more upfront and brutally honest with a man than you can with a woman.  I see those trends here.  I don't think its a bad thing. Men and women are different, big deal.  As long as we are all respectful....  I don't see where the problem is.  Just for the record, I am voting bacon, I always vote bacon....  regardless of the question.



I have an editor friend who had two kids, one boy and one girl. This was back when it was first becoming popular to try to raise your children in gender-neutral ways. I've always remembered her remark on this trend:
"You can give a boy a doll--but you cannot keep him from bashing its head in against a rock or stabbing it with a stick sword." :lmao:


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## sm4him (Aug 21, 2013)

Juga said:


> The_Traveler said:
> 
> 
> > peter27 said:
> ...



Hmmm--this is an interesting point. I'll be the first to admit that I share inside jokes with some here, that I comment frequently on the photos of those whom I've come to "know" here (AND whose photos are the sort of thing I either enjoy and/or feel I can add anything to a discussion on). However, I *also* try to be welcoming to newcomers, and I make an effort to comment frequently on their photos or threads as well.  To me, there is a fine line between a "clique" and a Community, and--at least for me--there is more of a "community" feel to TPF than a cliquish one.  

I admit that there ARE some people whose photos I rarely comment on--Lew is one of those people. But it has absolutely nothing to do with him, and everything to do with the difference between what he shoots, and what I shoot. Lew rarely, if ever, comments on my photos either, because what I tend to shoot is nothing that interests him in the least...and that's OKAY.  Now, if a newcomer posts the sorts of photos that Lew often posts, I might comment--but only to say I think it's under/over-exposed, or the horizon's off, something like that. With Lew's photos, I know that if the horizon is off, he durn well WANTED it to be off and my brilliant observation would hardly be of any use to him.
Not to pick on Lew, that was just an easy example since you'd already mentioned it.

So, yeah, I guess I *DO* think there are differences in the way certain people treat certain other people here, but I don't think it's really *predominantly* just a male/female thing, nor do I think it's a clique. I just think it's community.  In my OWN community--there are members of my family, there are those who are my close friends, there are my co-workers, my acquaintances, and then there are those who are strangers to me. There are differences in the way I interact with each group--but isn't that just the WAY we are?


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## Juga (Aug 21, 2013)

sm4him said:


> Juga said:
> 
> 
> > The_Traveler said:
> ...




That is the way we are as humans. You are absolutely right and like I said it is part of the community to become familiar with each others' work and such. What I said was to bring out that 'point' not complain about. I really like to see people interacting as such but it is frustrating to NOT receive any feedback what so ever.


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

I mostly see a community/friends biases in play, yes.

The point is that the community/friends biases are themselves skewed toward women, in some cases. There are regular members here who behave very much as if they want TPF to be them, two or three male friends at most, and all the women, especially the new ones. They behave as if all women are their friends, to the extent that I suspect strongly that we lose female members regularly who are not willing to put up with creeps "flirting" with them all the time. They also behave as if virtually no men are their friends. I like women too, but I'm not a jerk to men in hopes of persuading them to please leave so that I can mack on the women like a slobbering old fool all damn day long uninterrupted.


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> I suspect strongly that we lose female members regularly who are not willing to put up with creeps "flirting" with them all the time.



I suspect it's the opposite. You get these "hot" women who have never been told no in their lives. They come on here thinking they are the next big ticket and get all upset when they are not complimented and praised like they are accustomed to.


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## kathyt (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> I mostly see a community/friends biases in play, yes.
> 
> The point is that the community/friends biases are themselves skewed toward women, in some cases. There are regular members here who behave very much as if they want TPF to be them, two or three male friends at most, and all the women, especially the new ones. They behave as if all women are their friends, to the extent that I suspect strongly that we lose female members regularly who are not willing to put up with creeps "flirting" with them all the time. They also behave as if virtually no men are their friends. I like women too, but I'm not a jerk to men in hopes of persuading them to please leave so that I can mack on the women like a slobbering old fool all damn day long uninterrupted.


The creeps are my favorites!


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## JacaRanda (Aug 21, 2013)

I love freedom.  Freedom to ignore, freedom to comment, freedom to participate or not. Freedom to search for another forum or create my own.  Freedom to privately message someone if I like or don't like something they have written.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 21, 2013)

I have made this offer before.
If anyone feels they are unseen and wants another comment on on a specific picture just PM me and, if I can find something useful to say, I'll say it.


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## rexbobcat (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> I mostly see a community/friends biases in play, yes.
> 
> The point is that the community/friends biases are themselves skewed toward women, in some cases. There are regular members here who behave very much as if they want TPF to be them, two or three male friends at most, and all the women, especially the new ones. They behave as if all women are their friends, to the extent that I suspect strongly that we lose female members regularly who are not willing to put up with creeps "flirting" with them all the time. They also behave as if virtually no men are their friends. I like women too, but I'm not a jerk to men in hopes of persuading them to please leave so that I can mack on the women like a slobbering old fool all damn day long uninterrupted.



That's because you haven't reached the highest rank of Playaism known as the "Mack Daddy" where all the women be wanting yo affection.


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## Tee (Aug 21, 2013)

leighthal said:


> As a non deluded MWAC, I get helpful advice mostly, but it's sugar coated. If I was a FWAC I'd be ripped apart on a daily basis. Seems silly to me that it has to be either extreme.



There was a time when gender played no part in destroying "I just bought a camera and am going pro" members. I kinda miss CGipson's rants, actually. I think what you're seeing is a change in moderation and members. Because TPF tends to  attract more female members who just bought a Canon Rebel and want to pursue their "passion", you're going to statistically have more threads by females. The new membership and moderation aren't into the Thunderdome approach as it was 3 years ago. 

To reply to another members comment about it being an American themed site: do we really need to cover why that is?  Although, I'll add that we have a nice mix from our friends up north, too. 

Lastly, if you're not getting replies it may be from the following reasons:
1. Your work sucks and its not worth mentioning
2. There's nothing good nor bad about it. 
3. They are snap shots and previous posting history (or no history at all) indicates constructive critique is futile 
4. There are many 1 post and run. 
5. You are not participating and making an effort yourself
6. You're attempting to shoot a wedding with a D3200 and an 18-105 lens 
7. See #1 

P.S. in an effort to remain gender neutral, this snarky post is aimed equally at chicks and dudes.


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## IByte (Aug 21, 2013)

Well of course Mishy gets special treatment. 

A) She's a Mod
B) She has an iWhip
C) Sexy avatar
....nuff said.


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 21, 2013)

kathythorson said:


> amolitor said:
> 
> 
> > I mostly see a community/friends biases in play, yes.
> ...



This is why I get all the nudies sent to my via PM.  Thanks, baby cakes....:hug::


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## peter27 (Aug 21, 2013)

manaheim said:


> Are you including Canada in that?



Yes, although I understand there are some differences.... bacon being an example that springs to mind having seen numerous posts on this apparently touchy cross-border subject.


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## Juga (Aug 21, 2013)

JacaRanda said:


> I love freedom.  Freedom to ignore, freedom to comment, freedom to participate or not. Freedom to search for another forum or create my own.  Freedom to privately message someone if I like or don't like something they have written.



Yes...I love Amurica to.


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## texkam (Aug 21, 2013)

"They're called boobs, Ed."





How would this scene had gone down if her boss, Ed had visited the Water Board?


It goes both ways.
Preferrential treatment? Many times
Not being respected for one's talent? Many times


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## kathyt (Aug 21, 2013)

texkam said:


> "They're called boobs, Ed."
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Exactly! Love that movie.


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## snerd (Aug 21, 2013)

Cheap out with bacon because I haven't been here long enough to notice it if it is happening. But on most forums I frequent, any female usually gets the slobber treatment.


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## kathyt (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> I mostly see a community/friends biases in play, yes.
> 
> The point is that the community/friends biases are themselves skewed toward women, in some cases. There are regular members here who behave very much as if they want TPF to be them, two or three male friends at most, and all the women, especially the new ones. They behave as if all women are their friends, to the extent that I suspect strongly that we lose female members regularly who are not willing to put up with creeps "flirting" with them all the time. They also behave as if virtually no men are their friends. I like women too, but I'm not a jerk to men in hopes of persuading them to please leave so that I can mack on the women like a slobbering old fool all damn day long uninterrupted.


In all honesty, if I truly felt that someone was being "creepy" I would tell them right then and there. There would be no beating around the bush. There would be no tattle telling. There would be none of that stuff. We are all adults, and if someone can't handle playful fun then they know how to log out. Simple as that. This forum is based on building relationships with people who share a common interest which is photography. We then find out that a lot of us share other common interests that spread way beyond that. Which is amazing. This is the common course if human nature. Let it ride......


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

Creepiness is in the eye of the beholder. While it is wonderful that you're willing to simply confront people you perceive as creepy, you might find that other people would behave differently. For example, by logging out.


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> Creepiness is in the eye of the beholder. While it is wonderful that you're willing to simply confront people you perceive as creepy, you might find that other people would behave differently. For example, by logging out.



Aren't you contributing to the special treatment by coming to the rescue of the female members?


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

IByte said:


> Well of course Mishy gets special treatment.
> 
> A) She's a Mod
> B) She has an iWhip
> ...



I'm a dude, remember?!


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

runnah said:


> amolitor said:
> 
> 
> > Creepiness is in the eye of the beholder. While it is wonderful that you're willing to simply confront people you perceive as creepy, you might find that other people would behave differently. For example, by logging out.
> ...



I certainly hope so!


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## bentcountershaft (Aug 21, 2013)

Amolitor, if you're trying to get me to flirt with you, you're gonna have to work it a bit more.


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

IByte said:


> C) Sexy avatar



Let the preferential treatment begin!!!


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

runnah said:


> IByte said:
> 
> 
> > C) Sexy avatar
> ...


Nice tattoo. :heart:


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> IByte said:
> 
> 
> > Well of course Mishy gets special treatment.
> ...




:shock:  :shock:  :shock:
  
uke: uke: uke:


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## bentcountershaft (Aug 21, 2013)

Oh, a new avatar.  I blame you for this, runnah.

Edit: Referring to mishele's av.


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

I have better abs! :mrgreen:


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> I have better abs! :mrgreen:



That's ok, while you are at the gym I am with your woman. Cuddling and doing small household projects.


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## bentcountershaft (Aug 21, 2013)

That's no excuse.


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## JacaRanda (Aug 21, 2013)

runnah said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > I have better abs! :mrgreen:
> ...


 :hail:

Runnah for Pres. 8/21/13 to 8/31/13.  Laughter, snorting (even when it involves french fries), and milk does the body good.  Avoid soy milk, it gave me man boobs


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 21, 2013)

JacaRanda said:


> runnah said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...



Running Man is KING of the one-liners...sadly, I can't compete.


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## kundalini (Aug 21, 2013)

jwbryson1 said:


> Running Man is KING of the one-liners...sadly, I can't compete.


..... and all this time I've been pronouncing it rue-nah to myself. Probably still will.


I voted for bacon since the answer is so obvious.


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

kundalini said:


> ..... and all this time I've been pronouncing it rue-nah to myself. Probably still will.



I gave up on your name, I just think of you as the silver fox with sweet kicks.


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

runnah said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > I have better abs! :mrgreen:
> ...


So, it was you that fixed the backdoor. Thanks, it works great now!


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> runnah said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...



...


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> runnah said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...



Try not to slam it so hard or it won't shut properly.


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## IByte (Aug 21, 2013)

runnah said:


> Try not to slam it so hard or it won't shut properly.



I feel a draft


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## pgriz (Aug 21, 2013)

IByte said:


> runnah said:
> 
> 
> > Try not to slam it so hard or it won't shut properly.
> ...



Maybe wrong side of door?


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

runnah said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > runnah said:
> ...



If you'd just lubricate it properly, you wouldn't need to slam it so roughly.


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## kundalini (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> If you'd just lubricate it properly, you wouldn't need to slam it so roughly.


One has nothing to do with the other.


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> If you'd just lubricate it properly, you wouldn't need to slam it so roughly.



It wasn't so much the hinges as it wast the locking mechanism. But a few squirts of lube in the key hole loosened things right.


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

runnah said:


> It wasn't so much the hinges as it wast the locking mechanism. But a few squirts of lube in the key hole loosened things right.



Good call. If that doesn't do it, a couple of good sharp smacks in the right spot will usually do the trick.


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## bentcountershaft (Aug 21, 2013)

It could be a swelling problem as well, depending on humidity in that location.


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

You guys disgust me.


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> You guys disgust me.



VICTORY.


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## DarkShadow (Aug 21, 2013)

I am terribly sorry as I logged on here to what I thought was this wonderful photography forum but by mistake I landed on a pornography forum with no pictures to speak of.Pictures are worth a thousand woody's.:thumbup:


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## IByte (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> You guys disgust me.



From a person that watches, Walking Dead, American Horror Story and reads 59 shades of purple while tough mudding.


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## JacaRanda (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> You guys disgust me.



Dang, I wanted to write that first


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## Derrel (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> You guys disgust me.



When me and Rotanimod got together last Mish, we both discussed you...


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## DarkShadow (Aug 21, 2013)

IByte said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > You guys disgust me.
> ...


LOL


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > You guys disgust me.
> ...





IByte said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > You guys disgust me.
> ...





JacaRanda said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > You guys disgust me.
> ...





DarkShadow said:


> IByte said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...



Look at all this attention I'm getting w/ my new avatar. :mrgreen:


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

Derrel said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > You guys disgust me.
> ...



Sorry, missed this one.


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> Derrel said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...



It was mostly "I would <censored> that dude's 8-pack" and "yeah, well, I would.. " and so on. You've heard it like a million times.


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## kathyt (Aug 21, 2013)

Derrel said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > You guys disgust me.
> ...


Rotanimod....I am waaaaaay more fun than Derrel. I would have sent you home stumbling drunk! Sorry Derrel, it's true. Actually, Mish and I could have took you out R! We would have showed you how to _really_ use your camera.


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## IByte (Aug 21, 2013)

kathythorson said:


> Rotanimod....I am waaaaaay more fun than Derrel. I would have sent you home stumbling drunk! Sorry Derrel, it's true. Actually, Mish and I could have took you out R! We would have showed you how to really use your camera.



Good good egg us on toooo kathy RN!!! Muses I say Muuuuuses.


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 21, 2013)

kathythorson said:


> Derrel said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...




OH my...


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## jwbryson1 (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> You guys disgust me.




It's only gross the first time....
_
or so I'm told...
_


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## amolitor (Aug 21, 2013)

So has this thread proved the point yet?


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## kathyt (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> So has this thread proved the point yet?


Nope, we can go on!


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## sm4him (Aug 21, 2013)

amolitor said:


> So has this thread proved the point yet?



I doubt anyone remembers the point of this thread anymore...but if the point was to find out if men are completely incapable of having any discussion that doesn't turn into a feast of sexual innuendos sooner rather than later...yes, I think you all "nailed it." :lmao:


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

sm4him said:


> I doubt anyone remembers the point of this thread anymore...but if the point was to find out if men are completely incapable of having any discussion that doesn't turn into a feast of sexual innuendos sooner rather than later...yes, I think you all "nailed it." :lmao:



Hey now, mish and Kathy are just as filthy.


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## pgriz (Aug 21, 2013)

sm4him said:


> amolitor said:
> 
> 
> > So has this thread proved the point yet?
> ...



Well, women aren't innocent there either.  It is usually "slightly" reigned in when the participant actually know each other outside of the internet, but not always...  Point it, it's fun and as long as we all kinda know where the rather wide lines are, things are "usually" ok, and understood.  And as for whether there is a different standard for treatment of women compared to men, it probably mirrors the societal attitudes pretty well.  In most western countries women and men are equal under the law, but the many million years of evolution ended up with two sexes because it is a pretty efficient way of shuffling genes, and we aren't going to wish away any of those differences.  Besides, why would we?  It part of the spice of life to be attracted to other people.  How we act on those attractions, is also relevant, but I doubt that "most" of us have difficulty separating the "virtual" from the real.


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## ratssass (Aug 21, 2013)

....has anyone seen my other sock?


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## runnah (Aug 21, 2013)

pgriz said:


> Besides, why would we?  It part of the spice of life to be attracted to other people.  How we act on those attractions, is also relevant, but I doubt that "most" of us have difficulty separating the "virtual" from the real.



I am much taller in person.


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## pgriz (Aug 21, 2013)

ratssass said:


> ....has anyone seen my other sock?



You're not wearing it, by any chance, on a different part of the body?


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## mishele (Aug 21, 2013)

kathythorson said:


> Derrel said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...


lol A good time to be had by all!!
Washington DC here we come!! Did you book the room yet, Sweetie?


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## pixmedic (Aug 21, 2013)

mishele said:


> kathythorson said:
> 
> 
> > Derrel said:
> ...



damn Mish...dem's some sexy azz abs! you been working out? Runnah's catching up though.


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## PixelRabbit (Aug 22, 2013)

I totally know better than to start a thread with such an open ended question lol my bad! It's official, you are ALL nuts, that's probably why I like it here


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## runnah (Aug 22, 2013)

PixelRabbit said:


> I totally know better than to start a thread with such an open ended question lol my bad! It's official, you are ALL nuts, that's probably why I like it here



Naw, best thread in a while.


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## JacaRanda (Aug 22, 2013)

PixelRabbit said:


> I totally know better than to start a thread with such an open ended question lol my bad! It's official, you are ALL nuts, that's probably why I like it here




BINGO!!!!!


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## baturn (Aug 22, 2013)

I voted bacon because I just didn't have an opinion on this topic. I have now read every word of this thread, some of it twice, and I still am not sure how to answer, but I agree with runnah that it's the best thread in a while.


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## IByte (Aug 22, 2013)

PixelRabbit said:


> I totally know better than to start a thread with such an open ended question lol my bad! It's official, you are ALL nuts, that's probably why I like it here



Welcome to the family 8-bit rodent


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## manaheim (Aug 22, 2013)

PixelRabbit said:


> I totally know better than to start a thread with such an open ended question lol my bad! It's official, you are ALL nuts, that's probably why I like it here



pfft.  It's only 8 pages!


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## mishele (Aug 22, 2013)

I think this has at least 10 in her.


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## JacaRanda (Aug 22, 2013)

mishele said:


> I think this has at least 10 in her.



:shock:


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## pixmedic (Aug 22, 2013)

mishele said:


> I think this has at least 10 in her.



are we talking SAE or metric measurements?


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## mishele (Aug 22, 2013)

JacaRanda said:


> mishele said:
> 
> 
> > I think this has at least 10 in her.
> ...


Please...if you're shocked you really haven't been here since Mar 2012...hehe


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## pgriz (Aug 22, 2013)

Mish, your latest avatar is really giving this topic a run...  :blushing:


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## manaheim (Aug 22, 2013)

Mish your latest avatar has a freakin' spelling error.


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## pgriz (Aug 22, 2013)

No it doesn't.  It's where you put the emphasis.  Or were you paying attention?  Hello?  Hello?


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## Whiskeyjack (Aug 22, 2013)

I honestly don't think so. I've received critique that was helpful but neither overly gentle or too heavy-handed when people assumed I was a dude (before I put up a selfie avatar lol). I don't think it's changed at all since I let everyone know that I was not, in fact, male.

ETA: I didn't notice how long this thread was before I posted and now that I'm caught up the only thing I'm left with is confusion about Mishele's gender.


Halp.


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## mishele (Aug 23, 2013)

Mana....Lol I know. I didn't make the damn thing. Just watch the butt and forget about it!


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## e.rose (Aug 23, 2013)

I'd say no, considering how I was kicked around when I first started (which was GREAT.  Cause it helped me grow), however times have changed since I've been here.

Actually, no.  I still say no.

Because a lot of the newbies are gals... and I've seen a lot of them get butthurt over the fact that the pics of their kids aren't photographic gold... which tells me that no, not everyone here is saying, "HEY! GOOD JOB SALLY!  Never mind the fact that it's underexposed and out of focus, but THAT'S ONE FANTABULOUS PHOTO YOU GOT THERE!"

Then again, maybe it's me.  Maybe I'm the only a**hole here that isn't sugar-coating feedback.

I wouldn't know though... I tend not to read through a whole lot of threads prior to or after giving critique.

Hell, I'm not even here as often as I used to be.

Nevermind. 

My opinion doesn't count.

:lmao:


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## Gavjenks (Aug 23, 2013)

Am I the only one who is more distracted by the word (?) "loveing" in that avatar, than by the girl?


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## mishele (Aug 23, 2013)

Haha NO.


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## JacaRanda (Aug 23, 2013)

mishele said:


> JacaRanda said:
> 
> 
> > mishele said:
> ...



But, but I am innocent! Fo-rizzle.


----------

