# If you haven't seen it...



## Yemme (Oct 13, 2012)

Here it is... A woman gets hit so don't watch it if that makes you uncomfortable. Cleveland Ohio RTA Bus Driver Uppercuts Female Passenger


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## Heitz (Oct 13, 2012)

Good God that dude totally uppercut that chick.  Note to self: don't move to Ohio.  Further note to self: if you do, be polite on RTA.


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## Yemme (Oct 13, 2012)

I am not one for a man putting his hands on a woman.  However, she spit on him and she hit him, he just broke.  Women keep your hands to yourself.  If you want to give a ass whippin'... you better be ready to take one.  I just didn't see it coming... I've watch it about 3 times and I still don't know it's coming... maybe a little mush in the face yeah maybe... But a full fledged upper cut.  I bet she's walking around with a concussion right now.


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## usayit (Oct 13, 2012)

I'm not one to lay a hand on a woman... more accurately... I wouldn't lay a hand on *anyone* unless its in self defense. 

I don't subscribe to the notion that a man should never hit a woman under any circumstances.   Its archaic notion that assumes a man is always stronger and a woman is always dainty helpless.  

IMO, you assault anyone unprovoked, you deserve to get what you get... it doesn't matter the gender of either party.   I'm all for equality for women.... applied to all aspects of life... not just selectively.



The video.... hmm... can't tell but I think both acted inappropriate.  I believe the bus driver who represents the company/organisation he is employed by has the right to remove anyone from the bus.  If their policies include notification of the police, that's exactly what he should do.


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## mishele (Oct 13, 2012)

Yemme!! Hey girl, look me up Sunday night.


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## Derrel (Oct 13, 2012)

She was crusin' for a bruisin. I'm not surprised he hit her, given the way she was provoking him. I'm not condoning what he did, but the disrespectful way she was taunting him and threatening him...not too surprising that he slugged her. Some people are on very thin ice. Sometimes it cracks. Standing toe to toe with somebody like that bus driver and flicking him $h!+, in public like that, in front of many people....pretty aggressive behavior on her part. Stupid. The situation turned bad.


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## Rick58 (Oct 13, 2012)

Yep, I think her jaw beat her off the bus by a good half a second


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## Netskimmer (Oct 13, 2012)

I never got why it was ok for women to slap and hit a man with no physical provocation, but if he reacts in any way physically, he a woman abusing bastard.


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## IByte (Oct 13, 2012)

Watch, I bet she is going to file a lawsuit and in our lawsuit happy country, win and set a bad precedent. Ugh makes me sick.


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## Trever1t (Oct 13, 2012)

He was just trying to get her to close her mouth....didn't work!


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## 4meandthem (Oct 13, 2012)

A man should never hit a lady. That was no lady! She got what she deserved for acting like an ass.


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## JClishe (Oct 14, 2012)

This video makes me sick. When are people going to learn....to hold their phone in LANDSCAPE orientation when shooting video?


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## KmH (Oct 14, 2012)

Word &#8593; &#8593; &#8593; &#8593; &#8593;


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## rdl65 (Oct 14, 2012)

He pulled an Ike Turner on dat Hoe.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

He had absolutely no right to hit her like that.  That **** is despicable.  I know that her actions were inappropriate but do any of you really believe that he was in danger and needed to sucker punch her like that?

He should of removed her from the bus.  If she wouldn't comply he should of stopped and called the police and had her removed.  But to hit a women like that when you're not in any real danger is cowardly and despicable.


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## 4meandthem (Oct 14, 2012)

She spat on him then came at him and shoved or hit him.There are several videos floating around that show it clearly.


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## mishele (Oct 14, 2012)

Women just need to know their place. I mean, you just don't talk to men like that. She'll show some respect next time.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

4meandthem said:


> She spat on him then came at him and shoved or hit him.There are several videos floating around that show it clearly.



So what.  Take it like a man and do the right thing.  He is no better then her when he decided to act like that.


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## usayit (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:


> 4meandthem said:
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Archaic.... notion...

Next up.. women should know their own place and stay in it?


I think (I hope) we have progressed beyond that..   If it were a man on the receiving end of that upper cut, we wouldn't have this discussion; A double standard.  I believe women in our society deserve better than that.


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## jhodges10 (Oct 14, 2012)

mishele said:
			
		

> Women just need to know their place. I mean, you just don't talk to men like that. She'll show some respect next time.



What do you tell a woman with two black eyes?  Nothing she hasn't been told twice already.  See domestic abuse can be funny.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

usayit said:


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So answering violence with violence isn't archaic?  An eye for eye isn't archaic?

Please...its called rising above and being the better person.  And I truly believe there are some traditions that are honorable and right.

One of those is a man not hitting a women.  I don't care if its a double standard.  Men should not hit women.


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## Yemme (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:


> He had absolutely no right to hit her like that.  That **** is despicable.  I know that her actions were inappropriate but do any of you really believe that he was in danger and needed to sucker punch her like that?
> 
> He should of removed her from the bus.  If she wouldn't comply he should of stopped and called the police and had her removed.  But to hit a women like that when you're not in any real danger is cowardly and despicable.



The hit was extreme I do agree.  Even I felt it and I didn't get hit.  Like I said he just broke, I can't fault him.  We have no idea what is going on in that mans head... Maybe he's having a bad day, year, decade, we don't know.  There are other videos where it shows her taunting him while the bus is in motion. Now when that woman was attacking him and if that bus was in motion, if he lost control, and people were killed.  We would want this woman's head on a platter.  She put her hands on him first and spit in his face... imagine someone spitting in your face and see if you can hold your composure.  He got out of his seat that was his mistake and I'm sure all the years of driving that has never happened to him and he lost it. That's a old man... not a young one, old.  He probably said f*ck it I'm retiring and POW.  They both acted horribly.  At the end of the day though... keep your hands to yourself if you don't want to get hurt.  Women keep putting there hands on men and use that double standard.  You don't want a beat down... keep your hands to yourself.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

Yemme said:


> JAC526 said:
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> > He had absolutely no right to hit her like that.  That **** is despicable.  I know that her actions were inappropriate but do any of you really believe that he was in danger and needed to sucker punch her like that?
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We can certainly agree on one thing.  They both acted horribly.  But I don't understand how a group of well educated, intellectual people can watch that video and say he was right in sucker punching a women.


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## rexbobcat (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:
			
		

> So answering violence with violence isn't archaic?  An eye for eye isn't archaic?
> 
> Please...its called rising above and being the better person.  And I truly believe there are some traditions that are honorable and right.
> 
> One of those is a man not hitting a women.  I don't care if its a double standard.  Men should not hit women.



And women should no hit men, but she did, and she probably won't do it again. I dot condone either of their actions, but I understand why he did what he did.

Gender roles and the like are archaic as well.

If it wasn't a woman you'd probably have a different opinion. Equality means total equality in my opinion.

I personally don't have any qualms with hiring a woman if I feel I am threatened, just like I would a man. Women aren't anything special when compared to men (at least that is the contemporary view...supposedly)


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

rexbobcat said:


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If he had done that to a man I still would call it a cheap shot.  You want to fight someone call them out and go for it.  But to walk up to someone man or woman and sucker punch them is a **** thing to do.


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## rexbobcat (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:
			
		

> If he had done that to a man I still would call it a cheap shot.  You want to fight someone call them out and go for it.  But to walk up to someone man or woman and sucker punch them is a **** thing to do.



Except you specifically said hitting a woman is wrong. It sounded like you were being gender-specific instead of being more objective.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

rexbobcat said:


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Hitting a women is wrong.  Sucker punching someone is also wrong unless you truly feel it is in defense of your life.  If you feel your life is threatened I can completely understand and condone preemptive action.

I guess I'm old fashioned but I believe that unless your life is in danger a man should not physically attack a woman.  I'd rather take the black eye.


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## Yemme (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:


> We can certainly agree on one thing.  They both acted horribly.  But I don't understand how a group of well educated, intellectual people can watch that video and say he was right in sucker punching a women.




His reaction was impulsive, there was no thought.  If I was a woman driving that bus I would have beat the crap out of her.  The double standard allows her to get away with her behavior.  It doesn't give her an excuse.  The driver said it clear and true... you want to act like man I'll treat you like one.  If we go by your well educated people version that whole bus would have beat her to death including me.  Treat they neighbor as thyself... you want to mess with my life while the bus is in motion and cause an accident.  The same way she disregarded all those passenger lives is the same way I would done hers.  His action was too severe... if he slapped her I would have accepted it in all honesty.  He punched her like a man.  It's uncalled for.  But that's me being a woman with my double standard.  She hit him with a closed fist.  An eye for an eye, it's a new dawn its a new day.  Society has changed.  Keep your hand to yourself.


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## rexbobcat (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:
			
		

> Hitting a women is wrong.  Sucker punching someone is also wrong unless you truly feel it is in defense of your life.  If you feel your life is threatened I can completely understand and condone preemptive action.
> 
> I guess I'm old fashioned but I believe that unless your life is in danger a man should not physically attack a woman.  I'd rather take the black eye.



You keep our principles and I'll keep mine. In my eyes women are human and should be treated equally as men should.

I don't want to sound like someone who goes around kicking babies and abusing people but I've had a woman try to beat up on me before, and, well, she hasn't messed with me since then.

I believe in personal responsibility and consequences. You don't f**** with someone bigger than you. That's a general rule that I live by, and I'm not surprised when those who break that rule suffer the consequences.

(Now that I've actually seen the video I would have done the same thing. We can go on and on about how we would have handled it but adrenaline is one hell of a drug. "Being the bigger man" is easily overridden by "you think you can just hit me *****?") lol


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

Yemme said:


> JAC526 said:
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> > We can certainly agree on one thing.  They both acted horribly.  But I don't understand how a group of well educated, intellectual people can watch that video and say he was right in sucker punching a women.
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The double standard would not allow a women to get away with what he did either.  Violence is wrong unless you are defending yourself.  When he or the hypothetical she hit that women he/hypothetical she did it offensively and not in self defense.  

Second, she didn't act like a man should act.  They both acted like idiots and neither's actions were justified and both should be punished.


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## Yemme (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526, this is the double standard.  Watch closely.  This woman kept beating her man.  This is the original footage.  Guess how long she served, 4 months.  If she was a man her sentence would have been YEARS.

Riverline Fight - YouTube


I don't condone men just hitting women.  But if you put your hands on someone you opened the pot, don't be shocked when you get burned.  I commend you JAC526 for still having those views in this world.  It is the right thing to do if that's your nature.  What I won't do though is fault someone for a action that was provoked.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

Yemme said:


> JAC526, this is the double standard.  Watch closely.  This woman kept beating her man.  This is the original footage.  Guess how long she served, 4 months.  If she was a man her sentence would have been YEARS.
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> Riverline Fight - YouTube
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I do fault him.  For caving to impulse.  I'm saying he made a mistake.  That is much different than condoning his actions because he was provoked.

Honestly, I could probably find some video where a man beat a women and got less than a year of actual prison time.  Hell, child molesters routinely serve less than 5 years.

Your metric sucks for proving a double standard.  I'm not even trying to debate with you whether a double standard exists.  I know it does and furthermore I think its right.

But that is my opinion.  And as the saying goes opinions are like *******s.


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## Derrel (Oct 14, 2012)

Yemme said:


> JAC526, this is the double standard.  Watch closely.  This woman kept beating her man.  This is the original footage.  Guess how long she served, 4 months.  If she was a man her sentence would have been YEARS.
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> Riverline Fight - YouTube
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Wow...THAT kind of physical violence, with the woman inflicting MULTIPLE kicks to the head on a seated man, in public, *in front of witnesses--who were videotaping!!!!*, + verbal abuse against a man who just stood there and took it over and over and over...wow...*DOUBLE STANDARD is right*...if that had been a male kicking a woman or kid in the head like that, and punching another person 40-50 times...a male would have been sentenced to YEARS in prison--easily a 3-year sentence...almost anywhere in the USA...


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## mishele (Oct 14, 2012)

Can I ask......why didn't he get up? Really, why?


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

I didn't watch the video but the OP point in that post was that she only got 4 months.

My response to that is this isn't b/c of some gender double standard but b/c the justice system can just suck sometimes.

There are others who commit heinous crimes that have nothing to do with a gender double standard who receive sentences that are considered much too short.


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## Derrel (Oct 14, 2012)

mishele said:


> Can I ask......why didn't he get up? Really, why?



Yeah. Let's blame the victim!!! He was asking for it.


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## Yemme (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:


> I do fault him.  For caving to impulse.  I'm saying he made a mistake.  That is much different than condoning his actions because he was provoked.
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> Honestly, I could probably find some video where a man beat a women and got less than a year of actual prison time.  Hell, child molesters routinely serve less than 5 years.
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That video was to show you what happens when you do nothing.


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## Yemme (Oct 14, 2012)

mishele said:


> Can I ask......why didn't he get up? Really, why?




Mish he did and where ever he went she followed.  The girl that took the video said she even pushed him on the train tracks before the train even came.  I wouldn't have got on the train with her.  I would have pretended to get on the train and right before the doors closed ran out.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

Yemme said:


> JAC526 said:
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> > I do fault him.  For caving to impulse.  I'm saying he made a mistake.  That is much different than condoning his actions because he was provoked.
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I think you misunderstand my view somewhat.  I am all for defending oneself.  That is not my issue.  But the man on the bus was not defending himself.  He was in no danger.


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## Yemme (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:


> I think you misunderstand my view somewhat.  I am all for defending oneself.  That is not my issue.  But the man on the bus was not defending himself.  He was in no danger.



I understood your point of view.   My point is, you put your hands on someone don't be surprised if the outcome is not what you expected.

You believe in a man doing the right thing and the right thing for a man when he is hit is to not retaliate or/and unless he's in danger.  That's the norm. 

Both videos are filled with the way society teaches us how to respond.  Its many double standards.  Times are changing and people are not accepting of that excusable behavior anymore.  That's all I'm trying to say. 

Did you notice how quick everyone ran to the girls aid when she was hit.  When the bus driver was hit only the man at the front of the bus attempted to intervene.  No one held her back and told her no, don't hit him he's a old man. 

See the train line incident.  No one came to the mans aid because he was a man.  Double standard.  He's a man so he can take it. 

You said you don't understand how educated people would be ok with this situation.  The reason most are is because equality for all is taking effect.  Keep your hands to yourself.  Simple.


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## rexbobcat (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:
			
		

> I think you misunderstand my view somewhat.  I am all for defending oneself.  That is not my issue.  But the man on the bus was not defending himself.  He was in no danger.



But I'll bet she doesn't bully anymore bus drivers. Lol


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## mishele (Oct 14, 2012)

Derrel said:


> mishele said:
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> > Can I ask......why didn't he get up? Really, why?
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lol Yep, that's what I was doing, blaming the victim. Derrel, please tell me you wouldn't just sit there like that.


rexbobcat said:


> But I'll bet she doesn't bully anymore bus drivers. Lol


Oh, I think she'll mouth off again. She got up after the first beat down and started at it again.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

Yemme said:


> JAC526 said:
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> > I think you misunderstand my view somewhat.  I am all for defending oneself.  That is not my issue.  But the man on the bus was not defending himself.  He was in no danger.
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You make a very valid argument.

Thanks for the civil debate.


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## JAC526 (Oct 14, 2012)

rexbobcat said:


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Don't underestimate the power of stupidity.


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## o hey tyler (Oct 14, 2012)

She should have bypassed all the taunting and erratic behavior and just asked for an uppercut. The YouTube clip could have been much shorter and much more violent. 

What is this world coming to? If you're going to be a dick and want to get fist pounded in the jaw, just ask for it outright. Don't draw it out like some Hemingway novel. Jeeze.


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## Netskimmer (Oct 14, 2012)

JAC526 said:


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## IByte (Oct 15, 2012)

JAC526 said:
			
		

> We can certainly agree on one thing.  They both acted horribly.  But I don't understand how a group of well educated, intellectual people can watch that video and say he was right in sucker punching a women.



Probably at one time or another all of us had that one person we had to deal with like that.  Secondly, a lot  of people are tired of that double standard "You can slap me, but if I hit you it's abuse", respect goes both ways.


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## JAC526 (Oct 15, 2012)

IByte said:


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Apparently a lot of people are tired of "two wrongs don't make a right."  But yeah I can see how it is frustrating.


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## IByte (Oct 15, 2012)

I think it's safe to say that everyone on this forum doesn't condone any type of violence against anyone.  But in the Digital/Information Age where people have access to any kind of recording media; it's really not a cut and dry situation anymore.


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## usayit (Oct 15, 2012)

rexbobcat said:


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^^ What he said...!!! ^^

My original response was that I wouldn't hit *anyone* and that both parties probably didn't make the right choices.  *regardless of gender*.   This has absolutely nothing to do with violence vs violence or educated vs non-educated.  This has everything to do with the double standard that IMO is an insult to women population.    

JAC526, you didn't say hitting was wrong.  You specifically  said hitting a woman is wrong implying if the rider were a man it would more acceptable.   You also said you are all for protecting yourself, does the exception include if the attacking person were a woman?   You are diluting your original position with exceptions... or shall I say.. "doubling down".


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## JAC526 (Oct 15, 2012)

If I had to defend myself I would defend myself from man or woman.

I don't understand how it is an insult to a woman that if she hits me I am unwilling to hit her back.  How is that an insult?

If the rider had been a man the drivers actions were still wrong.  You want to fight someone call them out and fight them fair and square.  Suckerpunching someone is cowardly.

It seemed to me like the rider wasn't really threatening the bus driver once he stopped the bus.  So why not exit the bus and call the police?


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## rexbobcat (Oct 15, 2012)

JAC526 said:
			
		

> If I had to defend myself I would defend myself from man or woman.
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I've had a woman snap at me because I held a door open for her.

There's a large portion of women who appreciate male chivalry, but there's also a growing group who don't care for it.


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## JAC526 (Oct 15, 2012)

rexbobcat said:


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Well she's an idiot.  I've held doors for men and women and if someone decides to read it in some way other than just a common courtesy they can go kick rocks.


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## Netskimmer (Oct 15, 2012)

rexbobcat said:


> I've had a woman snap at me because I held a door open for her.
> 
> There's a large portion of women who appreciate male chivalry, but there's also a growing group who don't care for it.



I had one go off on me on our first date because I tried to pick up the check. I never got why she got so mad, if she felt so passionate about splitting the bill, why not say so at the beginning? I don't mind an independent woman the likes to pay her own way but give me a heads up before having a meltdown. Of coarse I had another blow me off after our first date because she said she wanted to split the bill and I accepted. Apparently I was suppose to prove my chivalry by insisting that I pay so who the !@#$ knows! Honestly I probably dodged a bullet with both of 'em.


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## IByte (Oct 15, 2012)

Netskimmer said:
			
		

> I had one go off on me on our first date because I tried to pick up the check. I never got why she got so mad, if she felt so passionate about splitting the bill, why not say so at the beginning? I don't mind an independent woman the likes to pay her own way but give me a heads up before having a meltdown. Of coarse I had another blow me off after our first date because she said she wanted to split the bill and I accepted. Apparently I was suppose to prove my chivalry by insisting that I pay so who the !@#$ knows! Honestly I probably dodged a bullet with both of 'em.



That's why I stick to physics, way easier to understand .


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## Overread (Oct 15, 2012)

Netskimmer said:


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If at any point a woman gives you a choice - put your hands up and surrender because there's little hope you can win


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## jake337 (Oct 15, 2012)

JAC526 said:


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He didn't sucker punch here.  She was just taunting him with the old notion that "this old man won't hit a young girl"......



Kinda like the old "mess with the school security guard because he can't do anything"......



Who really knows.  This may have been an ongoing harassment situation and he just snapped.


Personally I believe one should never use violence except in self defense situations.  I cannot tell you if that old man felt threatened or not as I am not him, nor was I there at the time....


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## Majeed Badizadegan (Oct 15, 2012)

Sometimes a spoon full of uppercut is just what the doctor ordered.


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## Haya.H (Oct 15, 2012)

Hell, i'm a female and if I acted like that I sure as hell deserved whatever is coming. If you want to be treated like a lady, act like one.
She was all in his face spitting, slapping and whatever else we didn't see on vid. He snapped, normal reaction from either male or female. I DO NOT see why people always stick up for woman who act like that just because it's a man hitting them. If it we're a women would it be any less wrong or any worse? You wanted a fight, you got that. Simple! Next time I suggest she keep her obnoxious manly behavior behind, she may not know who shes messing with. And frankly I find her lucky... She got punched if that had been a crazy person with a weapon she woulda been screwed.


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## jake337 (Oct 15, 2012)

JAC526 said:


> If I had to defend myself I would defend myself from man or woman.
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> I don't understand how it is an insult to a woman that if she hits me I am unwilling to hit her back.  How is that an insult?
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It is an insult to all the woman who have fought for equality for so many years.  


If one wants true equality it can have no loopholes....


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## jhodges10 (Oct 15, 2012)

rexbobcat said:
			
		

> I've had a woman snap at me because I held a door open for her.
> 
> There's a large portion of women who appreciate male chivalry, but there's also a growing group who don't care for it.



Generally they're called lesbians.   

I had a coworker at a bank that I used to joke around with. One day I got called into the managers office where I was informed she didn't appreciate the good natured joking and wanted me to stop. She never said that directly to me just went straight to the manager trying to get me in trouble. I stopped joking with her immediately and kept a cordial, professional manner with her as I felt bad about offending her. Within 3 days she started teasing and joking with me. I'm sure the look on my face said it all because all she could say was "I know, I know". That psycho got fired a few months later for stealing out of other workers cash drawers. What a b***h.


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