# My 5x7 and 8x10 pinhole cameras, plus photo



## Dick Sanders

Here's a photo I made with my 8x10 pinhole camera of the Albert Frey designed "Flying Wedge," which was a gas station in Palm Springs, CA for many years. Today, it's the Palm Springs Visitors Center. At the time I made this photo, it was an art gallery and the owner had a collection of Japanese fish-net floats he spaced around the grounds.







Here are the 8x10 and 5x7 pinhole cameras. Both are 4 3/4 inch focal length. Note the sight lines for framing. And also the orange filter that adds contrast, and lens cap for shutter (8x10).






Note the hinged back frame that drops away for 8x10 sheet filmholder insertion. When closed it's held firmly in place by two small tapered dowls that squeeze into latches on the sides. Just pull the slide, pull the cap, and expose. The 5x7 uses two big dowls that slide into an angled track and press on the filmholder. When no film is in use, the filmholder is replaced by a flat wooden pressure plate (shown here). My cabinet maker made these cameras for me. Both have tripod sockets (and sight lines) for vertical and horizontal orientation. 






Here's the inside of the 5x7. The Flying Wedge photo is pretty sharp because the pinhole is the optimal size for 4 3/4 inch focal length. I have a 4 x 8 foot print in my living room and people can't believe it was made with just "a pinhole." I always have to drag the camera out and show them. 






Thanks for looking. Comments welcome, questions gladly answered.


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## compur

Wow -- beautiful!  Thanks for posting.


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## terri

That is awesome. I had to read it twice to make sure I understood that this is, indeed, a pinhole shot - very sharp, indeed. Wow! Beautiful cameras - I bet you have a lot of fun "proving" you used a pinhole. 

Would love to see more of your work.


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## pm63

I love the shot at the top. Very abstract. Lovley cameras too.


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## Dick Sanders

Thanks for the comments, guys. And Terri, here's another Flying Wedge photo made with the same 8x10 pinhole camera, from the other side of the yard. It's also black-and-white, but I did some selective coloring in PhotoShop here. By the way, I checked out your Beaten Path web site. Nice work. And I love your collection of older cameras and what you wrote about them. Very enjoyable presentation. 






If you look closely in the middle-left rear of this picture, you can make out the balls (fishnet floats) that appear in the top picture. They look pretty tiny in this photo, and pretty big in the other one. Remember 4 3/4 inch on 8x10 is very wide angle -- about a 20mm lens on 35.


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## dxqcanada

Very nice shot.
Great composition.

Hmm ... and the rest of us are spending $$$'s on high quality optics ... to get something half as good.

Ah, I miss large format film.


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## compur

Another beautiful photo!

The idea that one needs the latest whiz bang camera and lens to create a 
great photo is the height of ignorance!


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## Steph

Beautiful pictures. I once tried to make a 8x10 pinhole camera that would accept double dark slides out of an old wooden box. I used paper for my trials. The pictures came out OK (fairly sharp) but the camera suffered from severe light leaks. Your great pictures made me want to go back to the camera and fix those light leaks. It would be great to see a close up of the device you use to close the back on your 8x10 camera; that could help me to cure the problems on my camera.


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## terri

Steph: You have a great imagination - I'd love to see you overcome the light leak issues and see what you could do. :thumbup: 

Dick - I really appreciate your comments on the site and my work. Thank you!

This colorized version now boasts a Polaroid look (which from me is meant to be high praise).  I love this building and imagine it gets photographed alot. So many possibilities!


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## Dick Sanders

These pics are for Steph and everyone else who would like to see in closer detail how the hinged back (and filmholder slot) on the 8x10 works. Please excuse the quality of these pics. They are snaps from my wife's digital P&S and are over bright deliberately to show detail. 

In this first picture, showing the back of the camera, note the black foam weatherstripping that also serves as a cushion and light lock when the filmholder is pressed against it. 





In this second photo, showing the hinged back pulled open, note the black photo tape around the perimeter, discouraging any miscellaneous light that might creep in. Also note how the back is built, with a pocket to precisely hold the 8x10 sheet filmholder.





This third pic shows the bottom of the camera, and the hinges that allow the back frame to drop open (for filmholder insertion).





The fourth pic shows the sheet filmholder being inserted and the back closing on it. Once closed it will press firmly on the foam weatherstripping. Note also the latch (one on each side) that will close it tight. 





The last photo shows the latch being closed and a tapered dowl being inserted downward until it's squeezed in tight -- that holds the back frame tightly against the back of the camera. Low tech, but it works really well. This camera has no light leaks. 





Hope these pics did the trick for you. Good luck with your own camera.


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## Steph

Thank you for the reply and pictures. They perfectly illustrate how the closing mechanism holds the DDS perfectly in place. I'll see if I can try something similar on my camera/wooden box. Hopefully, I'll find some time soon: so many things to do and so little time for photography at the moment...


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## windrivermaiden

Wow, what a thoural exploration of the subject/cameras. 

Bring more photos.


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## compur

Yes, thanks for the detailed photos.  I once made a 4x5 PH camera which
works but I thought the back could be designed better. I like how you've
done yours.  Very neat.


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## Dick Sanders

Thanks, guys, for all the nice comments. I confess, I enjoy the "show and tell." 

One last thing. Note the inlaid balsa wood framing lines that extend from the film edges at the rear of the camera to the front center, crossing at the position of the pinhole. If you stand behind the camera and sight down these lines -- and extend them out into the landscape -- everything between them will be in the frame. This is surprisingly accurate. 

*Horizontal:*






*Vertical:*






*Finally...*yes, Terri, this Albert Frey designed Palm Springs CA building is photographed a lot, especially for commercial shoots and they charge plenty for it. *A little more history:* The original gas station (built I believe in 1963) fell into terrible disrepair and was eventually abandoned. Two guys bought it around 1998 and restored it (a huge undertaking), then opened an art gallery. In 2000 I showed up with my camera, and was walking around the yard when the owner came out and asked what I was doing. I told him, and he asked if I would give him prints, and I said, "Of course." He didn't know me from Adam, and probably thought it strange I was carrying this big wooden box camera. In any case, he said, "You can photograph the building, but you'll have to make an appointment." He suggested the following Tuesday at 2 pm." I didn't like the idea because I had no idea what the light would be next Tuesday at 2 pm, and it just happened to be good right then. But I had no choice; it was all very formal. 

I was lucky that, on Tuesday at 2 pm, the sky was somewhat overcast and a little stormy looking (it had sprinkled a bit). This was a real break as Palm Springs is sunny and bright 340 out of 365 days. But here's where it gets interesting...

Later, when I gave the owner the prints (what you see up top), he told me this: When he got the building restored, he contacted the famous architectural photographer, Julius Schulman and asked him if he would like to photograph the Flying Wedge. This was a logical request because Schulman had done some important work in Palm Springs, and Palm Springs has several mid-century modern buildings of historical significance. But Schulman turned him down, said he wasn't interested. I think I showed up shortly thereafter. Later, when there was a great renewed interest in mid-century modern architecture, this building got a lot of press and notoriety and became very popular for commercial shoots. Then, Schulman came by to visit and, this time, told the owner he would like to photograph it. Can you guess what happened next? The owner turned him down.


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## terri

Now, that is a great story!


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## stsinner

Awesome story, Dick..  That camera looks like something Ron Evers would build..  So tell me, are these made by you, or do you buy them, either made by someone else or by a company?  I'm about to go Wiki the questions, but I like the way you detail your posts..

Thanks.


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## Dick Sanders

Thanks, ST. Sometimes I think I'm telling too much, but then I figure somebody might want to know. 

My cabinet maker made these. He's not the most reliable guy, sometimes he does a job in a week, and other times in 3 months, or not at all. Very moody. But I believe he still has a couple of 4 3/4 inch pinholes in his shop and could make you one. If you're interested, let me know. Otherwise you can buy good working pinhole cameras from the Pinhole Resource. And they are very reliable. 

Welcome to the Pinhole Resource


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## stsinner

Dick Sanders said:


> Thanks, ST. Sometimes I think I'm telling too much, but then I figure somebody might want to know.
> 
> My cabinet maker made these. He's not the most reliable guy, sometimes he does a job in a week, and other times in 3 months, or not at all. Very moody. But I believe he still has a couple of 4 3/4 inch pinholes in his shop and could make you one. If you're interested, let me know. Otherwise you can buy good working pinhole cameras from the Pinhole Resource. And they are very reliable.
> 
> Welcome to the Pinhole Resource



Oh, I wouldn't have a clue about developing, and wouldn't really be interested in making life more difficult for myself..  Digital is turning out to be much more difficult than I had anticipated to produce a "good" picture..  I do enjoy your work and others like you who are willing to do this tedious type of photography..  

I'd love to learn wood working, but I fear that it's something that if you haven't discovered you're good at by now, you're probably not good at it..


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## Fraggo

hey Dick, great shots, makes me want to build another pinhole camera myself. i also took a tour through your website, out-freaking-standng, i really enjoy your work and how you do it.


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## Dick Sanders

Thanks, Fraggo, I appreciate it. I checked out your flickr site with all the pics of Marines on duty. Nice documentary. I'm in the Southern California desert -- not too far from the Marine Corps 29 Palms Air Ground Combat Center. Your shot of Corporal Misha Weisinger playing guitar reminded me of a program that sent guitars to Marines in Iraq that I donated to a while back. Music has got to be a comfort. 

And yeah, we all gotta get out and do more pinhole -- even me!


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## christopher walrath

These are great Dick.  Hey, we're running a pinhole/lensless issue of the magazine in April for WOrld Pinhole Day.  Check out the mag in the sig and if you are interested in contributing fire off an email and we can discuss it.


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## dtornabene1

compur said:


> Another beautiful photo!
> 
> The idea that one needs the latest whiz bang camera and lens to create a
> great photo is the height of ignorance!


 

This can not be understated.  I can not tell you how many times I reply in a thread only to deal with idiots that believe the camera body is the most important piece of the puzzle.  Thank you compur!

Dick illustrates the point perfectly.  The most important piece is the point of entry to the final image.  It all starts with a great lens.  In this case, Dick has taken the time to get the size of the hole perfectly.  The pinhole version of a great lens.

Dick, the inlays are actually the first thing I noticed.  Beautiful and functional.  Great post! :thumbup:

-Nick


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## manfromh

Just wondering, wouldnt it be easier to frame if the sightlines extended from the back of the camera into the corners on the front of the camera. I see its easier to make them the way they are, but with a little measuring "reversing" them should be easy, right? Or maybe im missing something.


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## Dick Sanders

Man from H: I'm not sure what you mean by "measuring and reversing." Do you mean "testing" to determine what would be in the frame? And then making framing lines to match? 

The framing lines inlaid into my cameras are based on the principle of how light enters through the lens (or pinhole) and projects to the film plane. As you know, when you focus a view camera the image is upside down and backwards. That which is on the top ends up on the bottom. That which is at left, ends up at right, and so on. Of course, modern viewfinders on smaller cameras (through mirrors) convert the image back to the way we actually see it. 

No such luxury on these pinhole cameras, but by projecting imaginary lines from the edges of the film plane out through the pinhole and into the landscape, we can follow the path of the light. We will see how light, reflecting off objects in the landscape between the lines, will come back to us through the pinhole and strike the film plane. 

Because this works, I never thought about how it might be done differently. But if you've got another idea that would work, do share it. Thanks!


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## manfromh

Heres what I mean:








As I understood by looking at pictures of your camera, the longer lines represent light coming from pinhole and onto the film. I alse remember seeing smaller lines extending outwards from the pinhole, and into the scene. 
I just think that having longer lines to visualise extending into the scene, would make composing easier. I havent actualy used a pinhole camera, so im just guessing here. With a quick test you could find out where the edges of the frame are, and draw the lines accordingly.


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## Dick Sanders

Seems to me the only way your lines could come close to being accurate is if they were parallel to the lines crossing at the pinhole, but even then, since they are not starting at same place, they couldn't be entirely accurate. In this case, your lines would show a wider view and include things that are not actually in the picture. 

But I think you're right about "longer lines" being easier to use. I suppose one could cut a yardstick (or meter stick) into two pieces and align those with the framing lines, and in this way extend out into the landscape a little further for better sighting. 

In any case, I recommend you try pinhole. Here's a good resource to get you started...

Welcome to the Pinhole Resource


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## manfromh

The added "picture" was just a rough, quick way to show you what i mean (im not very good with words). 

Im probably going to make a pinhole lensboard for my Speed Graphic. I actualy want the front bed to be included in some images.


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## Dick Sanders

I think this is exactly the product you need:

Apo II Pinhole/Zone Plate Shutter


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## KrisNavarro

Great work, and thanks for the inspiration, will be building one of these for myself. What I was wondering was the side of the rear hinge, what wood did you use it seems thiner then the 1/2" wood in the rest of the build. 

Thanks

Kris Navarro


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## Dick Sanders

Hi, Kris: I didn't make the camera, my cabinet maker did, and I'm no longer in contact with him, but I believe the body is made of inexpensive wood (plywood?) and then covered with a mahogany veneer and finished natural. The front is a more exotic veneer, not sure what, but it looks cool. The back frame is solid wood and I think that's maple. And you're right the sides that hold the hinges are much thinner; they measure just a tad under 1/4 inch. When I had my cabinet maker build this camera, I showed him an old Leonardo from Pinhole Resource, and he made the 5x7 in a similar way, with those fat dowls going down into a slanted track to hold the film holder tight, but then he came up with his own idea for the 8x10, which I like a lot. It's lightweight, fun to use, and with the sight lines, it frames quite accurately. One of most important aspects, even if you were to buy a Leonardo, is to mount a filter step-up ring in front of the pinhole, say 58mm to 67mm, so you can then use 67mm filters and a 67mm plastic lens cap for a shutter. And for anyone NOT wanting to undertake the building (I can't do it myself) a cabinet maker is a good option, or if you can find a luthier (custom acoustic guitar maker) who also has an interest in photography, you could get a very high level of craftsmanship in your camera, although that would cost more. Look up Jim Worland at jim@worlandguitars.com. We never went through with the project, but at one point I was going to have him make an 11x14 pinhole camera for me. Just need to provide these guys with a film holder, a professionally made pinhole in the correct size for the focal length, and the step-up ring, and let them have at it. You can buy pinholes at Pinhole Resource. Of course, the problem is finding time to do all the different types of photography projects we want to do. Need 3 or 4 lifetimes, I guess. Good luck!


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## KrisNavarro

Thanks for the information and the step up ring info, will make my experimenting more fun. Thanks you have no idea how much this will make my work simpler to make and use. 

Kris Navarro



Dick Sanders said:


> Hi, Kris: I didn't make the camera, my cabinet maker did, and I'm no longer in contact with him, but I believe the body is made of inexpensive wood (plywood?) and then covered with a mahogany veneer and finished natural. The front is a more exotic veneer, not sure what, but it looks cool. The back frame is solid wood and I think that's maple. And you're right the sides that hold the hinges are much thinner; they measure just a tad under 1/4 inch. When I had my cabinet maker build this camera, I showed him an old Leonardo from Pinhole Resource, and he made the 5x7 in a similar way, with those fat dowls going down into a slanted track to hold the film holder tight, but then he came up with his own idea for the 8x10, which I like a lot. It's lightweight, fun to use, and with the sight lines, it frames quite accurately. One of most important aspects, even if you were to buy a Leonardo, is to mount a filter step-up ring in front of the pinhole, say 58mm to 67mm, so you can then use 67mm filters and a 67mm plastic lens cap for a shutter. And for anyone NOT wanting to undertake the building (I can't do it myself) a cabinet maker is a good option, or if you can find a luthier (custom acoustic guitar maker) who also has an interest in photography, you could get a very high level of craftsmanship in your camera, although that would cost more. Look up Jim Worland at jim@worlandguitars.com. We never went through with the project, but at one point I was going to have him make an 11x14 pinhole camera for me. Just need to provide these guys with a film holder, a professionally made pinhole in the correct size for the focal length, and the step-up ring, and let them have at it. You can buy pinholes at Pinhole Resource. Of course, the problem is finding time to do all the different types of photography projects we want to do. Need 3 or 4 lifetimes, I guess. Good luck!


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## laurenvictoria

this is awesome!


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