# What is a budget friendly lighting setup for e-commerce? [Serious answers only]



## NedM (Mar 24, 2017)

I shoot e-commerce for a clothing company and they have been providing me with their lighting setup which included:

x3 Bowens Gemini 500R
x2 90cm Silver/White Umbrella
x1 Bowens Lumiair 60-80
I used a typical 3-point lighting setup: Example 
Here's what the shot looked like: Full Body, Close-up
Camera settings: 5DMII, f/11, 1/200 sec @ ISO-100
I used a speedlite as a master slave to trigger the flashes.

I had the main light set to 4.5 power, the fill light set to 3.o power and the back light set to 2.5 power.

My client loved the results and have hired me several times since but they will no longer be providing their lighting setup. As the title suggest, I am looking to invest in my own lighting setup that can provide similar results for e-commerce and is budget friendly.

Budget: $1000

What are some of your suggestions as to what kind of lighting setup/accessories I should look into? Any feedback and advice is very much appreciated! I also prefer a setup that is easily portable so if I can get away with one flash, I wouldn't mind.

 I will update this as needed.


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## tirediron (Mar 24, 2017)

Speedotron Brownline.  Four heads, an 800 or 1200 w/s power supply, light stands and modifiers should be easily obtainable for well <$1000.


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## NedM (Mar 24, 2017)

tirediron said:


> Speedotron Brownline.  Four heads, an 800 or 1200 w/s power supply, light stands and modifiers should be easily obtainable for well <$1000.



I won't be needing a power supply as I can just use power outlets and extension cords to power the heads. What kind of flash heads do you recommend? Do I need four flash heads or can I get away with using less?  I've never heard of Speedotron Brownline.


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## Derrel (Mar 24, 2017)

Same here, Speedotron Brown Line is very low-cost on the used market. I like the D402 power supply which has four flash outlets, and simple power distribution options, well-suited to working on white, gray, or black backgrounds. I think the D402 power supply is the best value. As far as flash heads, each one plugs into the pack (black connector flash heads), or screws into it, in the case of older flash heads with the silver connectors.

This is an old-school, dependable, long-lasting, rugged system of flash, and it has been around mostly unchanged for 40-some years or so. A four-light system can often be had on eBay for $350-$500, all day, every day, week after week. This system is VERY affordable. Tirediron uses it, I use it, thousands of people use Speedotron Brown Line stuff.

The big advantage is the Speedotron Universal Mount system found on their M-11 flash heads. These flash heads MUST be used with any of the many Brown Line Power supply units made since the 1950's. Speedotron was one of *the very-first *manufacturers of American professional electronic flash generators and flash heads, and is a well-known name among professional studio and commerical and portrait photographers. The do not advertise in the popular press, nor on the web. This is not cheap stuff made to last 2,3 years-it is made to last for decades. Speedotron flash equipment is ruggedly built, simple, and dependable, and made in the USA.

I still have two, 1986-made flashtubes that still flash, one a 2,400 Watt-second tube, the other a 1,600 W-s tube.


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## tirediron (Mar 24, 2017)

This is a 'pack and head' system, not a moonlight system.  Speedotron is a US company out of Chicago, they make extremely rugged, straight forward gear that is built very solidly, last forever and just plain works.  Unlike monolights, pack and head systems have a central power pack so that you only need one electrical outlet and one trigger.


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## Derrel (Mar 24, 2017)

here...look at one of my Kitchen Countertop videos


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## NedM (Mar 24, 2017)

Derrel said:


> Same here, Speedotron Brown Line is very low-cost on the used market. I like the D402 power supply which has four flash outlets, and simple power distribution options, well-suited to working on white, gray, or black backgrounds. I think the D402 power supply is the best value. As far as flash heads, each one plugs into the pack (black connector flash heads), or screws into it, in the case of older flash heads with the silver connectors.
> 
> This is an old-school, dependable, long-lasting, rugged system of flash, and it has been around mostly unchanged for 40-some years or so. A four-light system can often be had on eBay for $350-$500, all day, every day, week after week. This system is VERY affordable. Tirediron uses it, I use it, thousands of people use Speedotron Brown Line stuff.
> 
> The big advantage is the Speedotron Universal Mount system found on their M-11 flash heads. These flash heads MUST be used with any of the many Brown Line Power supply units made since the 1950's.



As appealing as these Speedotron Brownlines sound, I am looking for something a bit more modern and less dated. I am more familiar with monolights.


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## table1349 (Mar 24, 2017)

NedM said:


> Derrel said:
> 
> 
> > Same here, Speedotron Brown Line is very low-cost on the used market. I like the D402 power supply which has four flash outlets, and simple power distribution options, well-suited to working on white, gray, or black backgrounds. I think the D402 power supply is the best value. As far as flash heads, each one plugs into the pack (black connector flash heads), or screws into it, in the case of older flash heads with the silver connectors.
> ...


"Modern" means spending a lot more money, usually for a bunch of crap that you won't use.   Pack lights have much lighter heads, better color temp control, easier to hang and actually much easier to control from a single location.  Plus I can fire all 5 of my Novatrons (far more expensive than you want to spend) with two Pocket Wizards.  They run cooler, and tend to have brighter modeling lights unless again you spend more money.   For studio work they don't continue to be the favored workhorse for commercial photographers for nothing.


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## tirediron (Mar 24, 2017)

Light is light; it hasn't changed in a couple of billion years, and while it doesn't have fancy digital displays, it isn't in fact dated ('though I grant you, they could probably significantly improve their market share by redesigning things), it works!  The electronic components are modern and very high quality. 

This is what three Brownline heads can do:


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## Derrel (Mar 24, 2017)

If you want CONSISTENT color temperature at high-, medium-, and lowest-power, you'll want a pack and head system...low-cost monolights are infamous for major color temperature shifts across the power level, which is one of the major benefits of pack and head systems: minimal color temperature shifts across the spectrum of power output levels.

Take a look at Brown Line in Tony Northrup's video...




The issue really also comes down to accessory modifiers. Bowens S-mount and Speedotron Universal are very common mounts for accessories like softbox speed rings, octaboxes, beauty dishes, etc. Speedotron also has some of the most-useful accessories: diffusers, barn doors, grids, snoots, etc..

What I like is the cost and the system of 400,600,800,1200,and 1600 Watt-second power supplies. You can add or subtract power supplies for different needs. When you need a powerful light, you can get 1,600 Watt-second through a $200 D1604 power supply. Keep in mind, a Speedotron 200 Watt-second output is about what Paul C. Buff's Einstein 640 or White Ligtning 3200 puts out. This is a well-known issue with many monolights that have a model-number that is way higher than the Watt-second rating; consider the Einstein E640 versus the White Lightning 3200 (same company) versus a Speedotron Brown Line at 200 Watt-seconds.

Anyway...*for low-cost monolights*, I recommend Adorama's house brand Flashpoint 320M units, at around $100 each. These are 160 Watt-seconds, and use an older Photogenic (?) mount for hard-mount accessories, but Adorama has enough modifiers to get you started. If you stay with *umbrella-shaft-mounted accessories*, this brand will be okay. Umbrellas and umbrella boxes will work GREAT with the Flashpoint 320M lights, and I have been recommending them as the best value in affordable lights for years. Buy the accessory honeycomb grid set, and the barn doors set for the Flashpoints, you will be very glad you did. I bought their generic, universal barn door and gel holder/grid set and have used it a lot on Speedotron 7-inch reflectors.

A LOT of people like Alien Bee 400 and Alien Bee 800 monolights, which cost a lot more than the FLashpoint 320M units cost. Paul C. Buff company has extremely good marketing for the Alien Bee lights, and they sell a lot of them. The issue is you have only $1000 to spend, and their lights are fairly costly for the power they give. Still...for umbrella-lights, the Bees are perfectly fine, and are well-marketed.


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## NedM (Mar 24, 2017)

Derrel said:


> If you want CONSISTENT color temperature at high-, medium-, and lowest-power, you'll want a pack and head system...low-cost monolights are infamous for major color temperature shifts across the power level, which is one of the major benefits of pack and head systems: minimal color temperature shifts across the spectrum of power output levels.
> 
> Take a look at Brown Line in Tony Northrup's video...
> 
> ...



What is the recycle time for a Speedotron Brownline? I'm looking at their website and most of their power supplies are well above $800. I don't understand how this is budget friendly. I am just looking an affordable way to do e-commerce or simply recreate the shots I made using the Bowens in the initial post.


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## Derrel (Mar 24, 2017)

Recycle time depends on the power level fired, and the pack model. Anywhere from 1.6 seconds on a D402 pack, up to to 3.5 seconds on a 1600 Watt-sec pack with full discharge. If you run the 1600 Watt pack at Low power (400) the recyle time is around eight-tenths of one second to 1.1 seconds.

Speedotron Brown Line has been made for decades,and on the huge used market, it is VERY inexpensive. *e-Bay has huge amounts of it, VERY cheaply*. I bought a D202 and an M90 for $145 used like 10 years ago...still use it, flashtube still works. I would never buy brand-new Brown Line gear. Ever. This stuff does not crap out like "that other brand" does, and it is so inexpensive you can buy it on e-Bay after wedding season is over for 10 to 15 cents on the dollar vs brand new prices. I bought a $1,500 Brown Line D1602 and 3 x M-11 light unit and boom and stands and umbrella/softbox setup in 1986: every single piece of it still works, and has never been serviced or repaired; last week a TPF member told me that he had just bought the same basic 1600-W-s pack and three x M-11 lights for about one-fourth of that cost.

Entire D402 kits and 3 lights are availabel for $300-$375 or so on e-bay all the time.

I like the Brown Line M11 light unit because it can take a 150-Watt quart modeling light bulb OR a low-powered $2 pin-base 25-Watt light bulb that is basically, a heavy-duty truck taillight bulb...

HERE is a very good value in lighting. I own a pair of these! Softbox Umbrella Reflective 42inch   Price is $29.95 for the PAIR of umbrella boxes. Nice light quality, easy set-up, good design.


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## table1349 (Mar 24, 2017)

NedM said:


> Derrel said:
> 
> 
> > If you want CONSISTENT color temperature at high-, medium-, and lowest-power, you'll want a pack and head system...low-cost monolights are infamous for major color temperature shifts across the power level, which is one of the major benefits of pack and head systems: minimal color temperature shifts across the spectrum of power output levels.
> ...


1.75 seconds to full power.  Have a look at their catalog: http://www.speedotron.com/system/application/client/files/materials/Speedotron_Catalog.pdf
Lots of answers there.  

Which is cheaper to you:
Speedotron  DM402 3 Light System 852363 B&H Photo Video
Novatron D1500 Three Fan-Cooled Head Kit with Two N2624KIT B&H
Bowens  Gemini 500R 3-Light Kit BW-8515USP B&H Photo Video


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## NedM (Mar 24, 2017)

Derrel said:


> Recycle time depends on the power level fired, and the pack model. Anywhere from 1.6 seconds on a D402 pack, up to to 3.5 seconds on a 1600 Watt-sec pack with full discharge. If you run the 1600 Watt pack at Low power (400) the recyle time is around eight-tenths of one second to 1.1 seconds.
> 
> Speedotron Brown Line has been made for decades,and on the huge used market, it is VERY inexpensive. *e-Bay has huge amounts of it, VERY cheaply*. I bought a D202 and an M90 for $145 used like 10 years ago...still use it, flashtube still works. I would never buy brand-new Brown Line gear. Ever. This stuff does not crap out like "that other brand" does, and it is so inexpensive you can buy it on e-Bay after wedding season is over for 10 to 15 cents on the dollar vs brand new prices.
> 
> ...



There are not a whole lot of listings of the Speedotron Brownline on eBay. 

I'm really looking for something that I can purchase within a week. I still need to provide my services to my client. The system is very confusing to me (probably less complicated than it really is) and I would have no idea where to start. Do you know of any videos or articles that I can check out to look more into this equipment?


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## Derrel (Mar 24, 2017)

e-Bay listings vary from week to week. I have five videos (probably about one hour of total info) on *Speedotron Brown Line* lights and packs on my YouTube channel. Derrelator - YouTube       The company itself has very limited marketing materials available, which is weird, but it has never had good marketing, just word-of-mouth. 

Here is a rundown of the light units: 




You could get by with a D402, D604, or D802 pack and three light units, three light stands, and a few modifiers.


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## NedM (Mar 24, 2017)

Derrel said:


> e-Bay listings vary from week to week. I have five videos (probably about one hour of total info) on *Speedotron Brown Line* lights and packs on my YouTube channel. Derrelator - YouTube       The company itself has very limited marketing materials available, which is weird, but it has never had good marketing, just word-of-mouth.
> 
> Here is a rundown of the light units:
> 
> ...



OK, I think I am beginning to understand this system It's just a little confusing on some ends but understandable nonetheless. As much as I would love to invest into this system I just don't have the time stalk the eBay listings whenever a power supply or head comes around. I need something a bit more readily available. Very informative!


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## davisphotos (Mar 24, 2017)

I use Speedotron Black Line, more expensive than brown line, but worth every penny. I do production photography for an auction house, and the shot to shot consistency of power and color temperature is amazing. And they are one of the least expensive pack and head systems out there.
I have a Flashpoint XPlor for location work, and the color balance is all over the place. I've also used AlienBees, which are rubbish, aND White Lightning,  which is slightly better built rubbish.
For a budget setup, you can probably find the Bowens lights for a few hundred bucks a pop, and they are decent reliable lights.


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