# My first tin type, wet plate collodion



## MK3Brent

I recently took on this project to make my own tintypes. 
After accumulating all the chemicals and mixing them myself, I was able to make my first plate. 

I have a cadet 4x5 view camera and I modified a sheet film holder to accept a quarter plate. 

My first plates are pretty bad...  but I'm trying to get the process down. 
The developer for these wetplates are very short.. around 15-20 seconds, and I'm having a little bit of difficulty getting the exposures correct and also keeping the plates properly light sensitive out of the silver nitrate bath. 

Here are a couple pictures of what I've done so far.

The camera: 







All the chemicals I needed:






Modified film holder:






And my crappy first plate, haha:







And, here's the best one I could do today. 
Light-years better, but still awful: 






The blotchy white areas are most likely hot spots from handling the plate after the silver bath, and the exposure + over developing accounts for a lot of the collodion artifacts. My goal is to have an artifact free plate with total control over the process. 

I'll update this thread with more plates as I get better. 

Thanks for looking!


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## slackercruster

How much time did it take to do it? Learning, chemical procurment, making plates? You must have worked a long time on it. Very impressive.


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## limr

How exciting! Even if the images are not where you want them to be, it must be so satisfying to get recognizable images (and what a pretty Pentax, too  ) Well done!


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## Light Guru

First off vary nice for a first try.  I've been wanting to try it myself. 

Second, the tittle of your post is quite off.  You have not made your first Daguerreotype. The Daguerreotype process is quite different then the collodion process.


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## timor

Very cool ! Keep good notes of everything you do, one day we might ask you for advice.


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## MK3Brent

slackercruster said:


> How much time did it take to do it? Learning, chemical procurment, making plates? You must have worked a long time on it. Very impressive.



Not very long. (About 3-4 weeks.) 
There are several videos on youtube that are great inspiration. The following is on of my favorites:





I registered at Wet Plate Collodion Forum and just read everything I could.

My chemicals came from http://www.bostick-sullivan.com

Thanks!



limr said:


> How exciting! Even if the images are not where you want them to be, it must be so satisfying to get recognizable images (and what a pretty Pentax, too  ) Well done!



That IS the best part, as rare as it is though...  I must have gone through 13 plates of just NOTHING. Shot after shot of various exposures and develop time, and just pitch black plates. I think my silver nitrate bath isn't working very well horizontally. 
Currently, I just put the plates in a small tupperware container lying horizontal. Perhaps this isn't best as most baths I've seen are pretty much vertical. 



Light Guru said:


> First off vary nice for a first try.  I've been wanting to try it myself.
> 
> Second, the tittle of your post is quite off.  You have not made your first Daguerreotype. The Daguerreotype process is quite different then the collodion process.


Thanks and sorry, my mistake. 



timor said:


> Very cool ! Keep good notes of everything you do, one day we might ask you for advice.


Will do!

I'm going to try again today after I make a different silver nitrate bath container.


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## terri

Very good work!   You are exhibiting THE skills it really takes with alt processes: patience, patience, and more patience.        If you have these skills, you will get to where you want to be.  

That second image is definitely recognizable - huge improvement.   I know you are after perfection, but a_ little_ bit of artifact is part of the charm - kind of like the "dry" emulsion lifts I used to do with Polaroid film, knowing some of the emulsion would tear off.    It's both a  controlled but uncontrolled process...you can visualize something,  and the results may be different than your vision, but sometimes even  better, if that makes sense.    

Looking forward to seeing more of your work!


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## terri

Light Guru said:


> First off vary nice for a first try.  I've been wanting to try it myself.
> 
> Second, the tittle of your post is quite off.  You have not made your first Daguerreotype. The Daguerreotype process is quite different then the collodion process.



I've edited the title for the OP, so it reads more exactly now.


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## MK3Brent

Shot about 10 plates today using some lamps for lighting.
None came out. Very frustrating. 

I think I have to shoot these under overcast/sunny light. 

I also think my developer was a tad too concentrated, so I mixed some new developer. 

Will try again tomorrow in the sunlight and see if there's any difference.


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## MK3Brent

terri said:


> Very good work!   You are exhibiting THE skills it really takes with alt processes: patience, patience, and more patience.        If you have these skills, you will get to where you want to be.
> 
> That second image is definitely recognizable - huge improvement.   I know you are after perfection, but a_ little_ bit of artifact is part of the charm - kind of like the "dry" emulsion lifts I used to do with Polaroid film, knowing some of the emulsion would tear off.    It's both a  controlled but uncontrolled process...you can visualize something,  and the results may be different than your vision, but sometimes even  better, if that makes sense.
> 
> Looking forward to seeing more of your work!


Thanks!

I spent all day and no progress. I guess that's how it goes when you're learning.


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## maris

That second plate, the one of the Pentax, is pretty subtle for a first timer. Who else would think of shooting the Pentax via a mirror so the name wouldn't come out backwards!


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## MK3Brent

maris said:


> That second plate, the one of the Pentax, is pretty subtle for a first timer. Who else would think of shooting the Pentax via a mirror so the name wouldn't come out backwards!


I tried to do 10 more today... and couldn't get a single to develop.  

I've got a fresh plate with collodion soaking in the silver nitrate bath over night. 
I'll pull it out tomorrow night in an attempt to iodize the silver bath more sufficiently. 

Then... I guess try again.

Maybe the first plates were lucky, because every subsequent plate after were just worse and worse.


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## webestang64

Very cool. Look forward to seeing more.


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## amolitor

It is remarkably hard to get this stuff straight.

Taking a class and watching someone do it might be a good idea?


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## vintagesnaps

Are you familiar with Mark Osterman? He did a tintype excursion on the Erie Canal sponsored by the Eastman House and was posting photos of it over the summer. He teaches workshops but I don't remember offhand if he has instructions or resources on his website. I think it would be an interesting process to learn. 

Terri thanks for the clarification; from what I understand daguerreotypes involved a hazardous process using mercury which could potentially cause brain damage (similar to a millinery process used in the past and where the term 'mad hatter' came from.) Which is why they switched to tintypes! 

Photobooth SF in San Francisco does tintype portraits among other things. Photobooth | About Tintypes

(And now that I look at the link, I see they have some resources including Scully & Osterman who have a new book out that I hadn't seen before - Freestyle carries it.)


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## MK3Brent

amolitor said:


> It is remarkably hard to get this stuff straight.
> 
> Taking a class and watching someone do it might be a good idea?


Yeah, I could see that happening. I did however make a plate! So I'm determined to keep going teaching myself. 

There's a guy in NC that does these. 
harrytaylorphoto.com - Tintypes/Ambrotypes from the Cape Fear

I could probably contact him and see if he would offer a workshop. 



> Are you familiar with Mark Osterman? He did a tintype excursion on the Erie Canal sponsored by the Eastman House and was posting photos of it over the summer. He teaches workshops but I don't remember offhand if he has instructions or resources on his website. I think it would be an interesting process to learn.



I'll check him out, that name sounds familiar. 
I've mostly been reading about the solution chemistry but have been also looking at some other people's process / workflow.


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## amolitor

My tips are:

be insanely clean. no, cleaner than that. cleaner than that, too.

A friend of mine was trying to figure out where this HONEYCOMB pattern was COMING FROM and eventually realized that he was resting the cleaned plate on a paper towel some time after the final wash and before flowing the collodion. That was enough. Stuff that you literally do not even notice even when you're paying close attention will screw you thoroughly. A biochemist probably develops the right habits, but pretty much nobody else does.

work as slowly and with as much attention as possible, and only change one thing at a time!


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## MK3Brent

Well, I was able to make a slight improvement tonight. 
And I have learned that daylight makes a WORLD of difference, but unfortunately learned this after the sun went down. 

This exposure was 2.5 minutes f/8.








I need to figure out why I get dark spots in the photos... They're underexposed and probably under-developed.
This one I developed for 45 seconds in a tray and agitating like a mad man. 

I think this would have been perfect if shot outside with day light. 

Will shoot some more over the weekend with sun light. (I guess the next camera to photograph is the D3s.


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## vintagesnaps

Now you're getting somewhere! Let the sun shine...

Do you think you could be getting some dust spots? They remind me of that, when I was using a shared darkroom I learned to dust the enlarger first so I didn't have to SpotTone later.

Nice website you posted, maybe if that photographer doesn't do workshops he'd let you sit in on one of his working sessions sometime.


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## MK3Brent

vintagesnaps said:


> Now you're getting somewhere! Let the sun shine...
> 
> Do you think you could be getting some dust spots? They remind me of that, when I was using a shared darkroom I learned to dust the enlarger first so I didn't have to SpotTone later.
> 
> Nice website you posted, maybe if that photographer doesn't do workshops he'd let you sit in on one of his working sessions sometime.



Thanks, feels good to see an image. 
I am cleaning and re-using plates, because I'm more interested in getting exposures and developing time controlled. 
The specs here are probably dust or junk in the water bath after developing. You can usually tell if it's from dust before
by seeing comets from the developer pour. That's a good suggestion about sitting in, maybe he'd do that. After all I can also help with timers or positioning stuff. 
It's almost a 2 person job. 

The next one I post will hopefully be much better. (I spend about 10 hours each day practicing and documenting what I do and how I change the process.)
I'm down to a new batch of collodion that I've mixed that I have removed the Iodide tincture solution and just use collodion+bromo-iodizer. 

After soaking the sacrificial plate in my silver nitrate bath for 16 hours, I was able to get my pH back up to 4.





Overtime, it may get more alkaline and work better for my positives. 

More to come! I think more photographers should dabble with this. It's so much fun.


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## MK3Brent

Made a couple plates today. 
I think I have the processing under control now. 
Next will be composition, of course. 

I was mostly focusing on the processing and less on composition. 
Now, I will focus mostly on that. 

Here are the plates: 













It's coming along!


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## PhotoWrangler

I am completely and T-totally envious right now!!!


I've REALLY wanted to do this for a while, but with a Holga instead.
http://petapixel.com/2012/12/18/how-to-use-a-holga-as-a-handheld-wet-plate-camera/


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## MK3Brent

PhotoWrangler said:


> I am completely and T-totally envious right now!!!
> 
> 
> I've REALLY wanted to do this for a while, but with a Holga instead.
> How to Use a Holga as a Handheld Wet Plate Camera




It's really easy once you get the hang of it. 
What got me at first was the emulsion sensitivity. You need UV!
Without UV light, you're not getting anything. 

Bostick-Sullivan sells everything you need if you want to get started too: 
Bostick & Sullivan - Supplies For Platinum, Palladium and Alternative Photographic Processes


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## PhotoWrangler

What was the total investment in chemicals like?


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## MK3Brent

when I had all my supplies, I was a little over $330. 

But, remember with this amount of chemistry, you can make hundred of plates.


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## limr

Those are fantastic! I *really* want to learn this but I can't just yet, so I'm totally living vicariously through you. Such exciting work 'we' are doing!


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## MK3Brent

limr said:


> Those are fantastic! I *really* want to learn this but I can't just yet, so I'm totally living vicariously through you. Such exciting work 'we' are doing!


Are we bold enough to do a family portrait next? 

I'm visiting some family next week at the beach, and I'm contemplating bringing my darkroom with me.


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## Light Guru

PhotoWrangler said:


> What was the total investment in chemicals like?



You can get a kit for $280
http://www.bostick-sullivan.com/cart/product.php?productid=1077&cat=366&page=1

However in addition to chemicals there are additional items needed besides a large format camera. Things like plate holder, sensitizing tank, drying rack, and or course plates. 

Plate Holder
http://www.chamonixviewcamera.com/wetplateholders.html

Plates
http://www.lundphotographics.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=TN001

Sensitizing Tank
http://www.lundphotographics.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=TT001

Drying Rack 
http://www.lundphotographics.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=DR002

As side from camera and lenses my rough estimate is about $500. At least that is what I'm planing on saving up to get the needed supplies.


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## MK3Brent

Light Guru said:


> PhotoWrangler said:
> 
> 
> 
> What was the total investment in chemicals like?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You can get a kit for $280
> Bostick-Sullivan :: Wet Plate Collodion :: Pre-Mixed Wet Plate Collodion Kits :: Complete Wet Plate Collodion Set For 4x5"
> 
> However in addition to chemicals there are additional items needed besides a large format camera. Things like plate holder, sensitizing tank, drying rack, and or course plates.
> 
> Plate Holder
> wetplateholders
> 
> Plates
> LundPhotographics - StandardThickness0024gageTin
> 
> Sensitizing Tank
> LundPhotographics - TravelingTank4x5
> 
> Drying Rack
> LundPhotographics - DryingRackSmall
> 
> As side from camera and lenses my rough estimate is about $500. At least that is what I'm planing on saving up to get the needed supplies.
Click to expand...

Thanks for posting some links!
You introduced me to Lund Photo Graphics, and I just ordered some plates from them.

I've been buying sheets and cutting them to size with a shear at work. These now will come pre-cut to 1/4 size.
Thanks very much.


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## Tiller

Very cool!


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## limr

MK3Brent said:


> limr said:
> 
> 
> 
> Those are fantastic! I *really* want to learn this but I can't just yet, so I'm totally living vicariously through you. Such exciting work 'we' are doing!
> 
> 
> 
> Are we bold enough to do a family portrait next?
> 
> I'm visiting some family next week at the beach, and I'm contemplating bringing my darkroom with me.
Click to expand...


We say Go big or go home!  We're totally ready.


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## terri

limr said:


> MK3Brent said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> limr said:
> 
> 
> 
> Those are fantastic! I *really* want to learn this but I can't just yet, so I'm totally living vicariously through you. Such exciting work 'we' are doing!
> 
> 
> 
> Are we bold enough to do a family portrait next?
> 
> I'm visiting some family next week at the beach, and I'm contemplating bringing my darkroom with me.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> We say Go big or go home!  We're totally ready.
Click to expand...


You tell him, Leonore!    

Wonderful results today - I'm excited for you, too.       I _love_ the look of these things, and I do think you're ready to try it with an image that means a bit more.   :thumbup:


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## MK3Brent

One last practice shot before making some at the beach in a couple days. 
The TLR in the photo is an old family camera passed down to my gf. We just got it, so I wanted to make a photo of it.


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## limr

Wow, we rock!


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## MK3Brent

Couple more for fun.


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## John_05

Very nice images!

I'd love to try something like this,  but with my luck combined with all those chemicals around, I'd accidentally find a way to blow up my apartment.  lol

Keep up the good work! :thumbup:


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## rexbobcat

How do you meter for wet plates? I was thinking about using a light meter set to like 3 ISO, but idk how accurate that would be.


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## MK3Brent

rexbobcat said:


> How do you meter for wet plates? I was thinking about using a light meter set to like 3 ISO, but idk how accurate that would be.


Trial and error. 

On the back of my dark-slide, I measured about 5 equal length gaps and marked them with a black marker. 
Remove the slide to the first position, and make an exposure... then increase duration for each subsequent gap. 

In the end you'll have something around 6 stops. 

Like this:
http://www.collodion.com/uploads/54/wetplate_test_strip.jpg


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## terri

I really love the look of these things.   The one of the face and the  girl in the yard are real standouts.   Unique and lovely.   

You're really getting the hang of it!


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## MK3Brent

Thanks. 

I did a little work today making a portable darkroom/change bag that is really neat.

Will post some pics soon. 

Right now, trying to find some cellophane to block out the sun to look through the hole.


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## MK3Brent

Using a double lined film change bag, I made a collapsable PVC frame to make a tent inside:





















Next will be to cut a window in the top, and adhesive in a safe like acrylic window. (I've been testing some materials for their light-safe abilities.. but the first off the shelf stuff I could find wouldn't work. 

So I'm looking into some other stuff we have around the house. Might have some amberlith. )


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## terri

I have every faith you'll get there!    Looks great so far.   The frame is inspired - room to work in there.   :thumbup:


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## MK3Brent

Hehe, well... I gave it the ol' college try. 

The sun was coming out... then cloudy, then sunny again.. So the exposures are a little crazy. 

But... here they are. The only ones I could get to sit still long enough.


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## terri

They are each beautiful and unique.   Beautiful, one of a kind portraits!   

Impressive detail in a couple of them, too.   My favorite is the first one - he's an awesome model!


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## limr

Oh how I love! The detail, yes, but there's so much texture, and the light sort of dances around the plate. :heart:


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## MK3Brent

terri said:


> They are each beautiful and unique.   Beautiful, one of a kind portraits!
> 
> Impressive detail in a couple of them, too.   My favorite is the first one - he's an awesome model!


That's my father. He has many stories to tell. 








Thanks for the comments, guys. 

I really want to share how much fun this work is, and maybe pass along tips/tricks that I wish I knew when I first started. 

More photos to come I hope. 
I'm going to take this show on the road as soon as I get my travel darkroom ready.


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## terri

Well, you have made your dad look as timeless and ethereal as Socrates.   He looks amazing in this portrait!   

This is why I love these processes - you get results no one else can.


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## MK3Brent

I am experimenting with some artificial light, since the days are getting short. I'll post some new plates soon. 

I have this obsession for head shots, eyes, and the like. So I'll put together a little set most likely to do these. 

Next, will be glass plates. I'm going to do some salt prints soon. 








There is a fun trick you can do with the plate (much like when developing on paper), take the plate and place it on edge, either horizontally of vertically, and splash developer on areas and keep areas free from developer, and you can control how the image comes through. I might make a video soon too.

Example:


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## Compaq

Cool!
But come one, don't be a tease... list your chemicals!

(chemist present!)


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## vintagesnaps

Ahh the glow of a safe light... Interesting, haven't seen that technique. 

The only thing I'd be aware of is to clean trays and tongs, particularly developer. I've used a shared darkroom at a university and having been in there after the students (oy) if equipment isn't rinsed and chemistry gets mixed from one tray to another you can get black marks on your prints. 

Great photo the guy had done by the end.


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## terri

This is trippy and intriguing.   I love the dream like quality in some of these.   Beautiful!!!!


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## MK3Brent

Thank you.

Continuing on, here are a few plates from last night. 

I've moved on to using compact fluorescent lighting. 
You need to have very direct light, as the fall off is so high, that areas not in direct light will render totally black. 

This makes it interesting in two ways.
First, it allows you to isolate your subject in a very controlled manner.
Second, it's a bit tricky to understand how the light renders the image on the plate. 

To your eyes when setting up the shot... it's just BLASTING light all over, but the image has nice soft light. It can be rather deceiving. 

Here are the plates, and a picture of the setup.


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## minicoop1985

Everything in this thread is incredible. This has to be fun. Great work. BTW, that deer is staring into my soul... Kinda creepy.


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## limr

I have to admit that it took me a minute to work through how you got a deer to model for you! :blushing:  And yes, spooky as those shots are, they're really wonderful. Very impressive work!


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## MK3Brent

Thanks, Leonore.

I'm photographing "Allen" (I call him Allen) for a fellow TPF member.
It was his grandfather's, and when he passed away the deer went to him. 

He wanted some photos, so I volunteered to do them.


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## minicoop1985

That's awesome. Cool way to remember his grandfather for sure. And Allen is the probably the last name I would have expected a deer to have...


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## avraam

unusual work, thank you for sharing it's useful!


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