# Pricing: Sessions vs. Prints



## GothamTommy (Jul 1, 2012)

Hi All,

I'm adjusting my pricing and curious how everyone else works, what they've found works better (this is for portraits, seniors, engagements, etc.). I'm trying to balance my session and print fees. Does anyone have any feedback on pricing session fees higher (the majority of your margin) over prints or vice-versa?

Thanks!


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## cgipson1 (Jul 1, 2012)

Pricing should be based on your CODB!


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## GothamTommy (Jul 1, 2012)

cgipson1 said:


> Pricing should be based on your CODB!



I apologize that a question about markups and margin on products you sell was too complicated for you to understand.


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## pixmedic (Jul 1, 2012)

I dont think its a simple question of "what should I charge" since different people might have different costs involved with their products. Also, those costs can vary a lot. 
I think cgipson1 means that you need to know what it actually "costs" you to do the work, in time and resources, and then try to figure out what your markup will be based on 
those numbers. People with higher or lower overhead costs might have a drastically different number, due also in part to the area they are in, competition in that area, and what services and
quality of services they provide. I dont think its a simple enough question that people can just throw a number at it and be in any way accurate or relevant to your particular situation.


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## Bitter Jeweler (Jul 1, 2012)

$2000


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## Overread (Jul 1, 2012)

Guys I think Gotham is asking more about how people balance the whole fee they charge between the sitting/session cost (ie the fixed cost) and the print cost (ie the variable cost per session). Rather looking at how people balance their whole fee over both - either weighted toward one or the other more strongly (eg high session fee, but low print costs; or low session fee, but high print costs) or if they balance them evenly or only charge one or the other. 

This isn't a basic "how much do I charge" so much as a "where should I put my bread winning money in the event".


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## CCericola (Jul 1, 2012)

GothamTommy said:


> cgipson1 said:
> 
> 
> > Pricing should be based on your CODB!
> ...


Don't be rude to the person that gave you the correct answer. There are soooo many factors that go into pricing that cgipson1's answer is the only one we can give you with the information you gave us. If you want a more in depth opinion then we will need to see your business plan and CODB. Also, because this forum is easy to find via google, most pros will not post specifics like margins. Too easy for clients to find. If you are still have questions, the PPA has a business development service that can help if you do not want to pay your accountant extra for business management services.


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## cgipson1 (Jul 1, 2012)

GothamTommy said:


> cgipson1 said:
> 
> 
> > Pricing should be based on your CODB!
> ...



Having owned and run several successful businesses, I can assure you that is not the case!


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## GothamTommy (Jul 1, 2012)

Overread said:


> Guys I think Gotham is asking more about how people balance the whole fee they charge between the sitting/session cost (ie the fixed cost) and the print cost (ie the variable cost per session). Rather looking at how people balance their whole fee over both - either weighted toward one or the other more strongly (eg high session fee, but low print costs; or low session fee, but high print costs) or if they balance them evenly or only charge one or the other.
> 
> This isn't a basic "how much do I charge" so much as a "where should I put my bread winning money in the event".



Thank you for being the only person who understood what I was asking.

For everyone else:

SESSION FEES and PRINT FEES. Both have their markups. My question was how does everyone balance (not what I/you/anyone charges). I'm not asking for dollar amounts, I'm asking for balances.

[EDIT: I originally had an example listed but I'd rather just end the topic.]


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## Bitter Jeweler (Jul 1, 2012)

Oh, I see what you're asking. 

I will change my answer to  "it depends".


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## tmjjk (Jul 1, 2012)

Bitter Jeweler said:
			
		

> $2000



This looks familiar  
I am having trouble finding the "like" button on my mobile version..
And for the record.. I would "like" the "it depends" response as well.


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## 12sndsgood (Jul 2, 2012)

There are so many variables to that. One thing to look at is sales tax. That is going to vary by area. each state is diffrent. For me, I'm not taxed on my sitting fee. but i'm taxed on photos. So I would rather see more money come in from the sitting free since i'm losing less money thru state taxing that way. But someone may be in low or no sales tax situation where it makes more sence for there business to go with lower sitting fees and pick up there money on the photo side. So the real answer is that it does depend.  I have no idea how 
New York businesses are allowed to run so what I am trying to do may not work at all for you. Your clientell may be a factor. Look at your past customers. How much business are you doing in print sales? If your not doing a lot of sales print wise it won't make much sence to raise the prices on that side.


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## GothamTommy (Jul 2, 2012)

12sndsgood said:


> There are so many variables to that. One thing to look at is sales tax. That is going to vary by area. each state is diffrent. For me, I'm not taxed on my sitting fee. but i'm taxed on photos. So I would rather see more money come in from the sitting free since i'm losing less money thru state taxing that way. But someone may be in low or no sales tax situation where it makes more sence for there business to go with lower sitting fees and pick up there money on the photo side. So the real answer is that it does depend.  I have no idea how
> New York businesses are allowed to run so what I am trying to do may not work at all for you. Your clientell may be a factor. Look at your past customers. How much business are you doing in print sales? If your not doing a lot of sales print wise it won't make much sence to raise the prices on that side.



Thanks for that. Actually, since the session fee is technically a "service" and not a "product", you do slide by on taxes in some areas because of that. I didn't realize that. Thanks for pointing that out.

I have competitors in the area charging high session fees with small margin built into the prints while others are charging lower session fees but making up with higher margins built into package prices. I'm defiantly curious if anyone has tried both and what they found.


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## KmH (Jul 2, 2012)

What worked for me in Arizona, had to be changed when I moved to Iowa.

What worked for me in Arizona, and later in Iowa, likely would not work for you in NYC. That's why big companies have to use a variety of marketing and promotional approaches.

As you mention, it can, and is, done successfully in any number of ways. That's what a business managed using best business practices is able to do. One of those best business practices is a comprehensive, written business plan that is routinely updated based on market trends and research into what your competitors are doing. However, a business owner can only guess at the financial condition of any given competitor. 

You might contact Free Small Business Advice | How-to Resources | Tools | Templates | SCORE for assistance.


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## GothamTommy (Jul 2, 2012)

KmH said:


> What worked for me in Arizona, had to be changed when I moved to Iowa.
> 
> What worked for me in Arizona, and later in Iowa, likely would not work for you in NYC. That's why big companies have to use a variety of marketing and promotional approaches.
> 
> ...



I never said I was going to copy-paste what personally worked for you (or anyone) and apply it here. I was just looking for an open discussion, sharing of ideas and what worked/didn't work for everyone.


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## JReichert (Jul 9, 2012)

GothamTommy said:


> I never said I was going to copy-paste what personally worked for you (or anyone) and apply it here. I was just looking for an open discussion, sharing of ideas and what worked/didn't work for everyone.



I don't know why almost no one else understood what you were asking.  But I hope you get some good replies because that is something I am deciding for myself.  It seems to be fairly split - charge a low sit fee and then exorbitant product prices or high sit fee and pretty humble product prices.  I'm still searching for that middle ground that people will respect.


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## Sw1tchFX (Jul 9, 2012)

never ever ever ever shoot for less than $100/hour.


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## Bitter Jeweler (Jul 9, 2012)

JReichert said:


> I don't know why almost no one else understood what you were asking.  But I hope you get some good replies because that is something I am deciding for myself.  It seems to be fairly split - charge a low sit fee and then exorbitant product prices or high sit fee and pretty humble product prices.  I'm still searching for that middle ground that people will respect.[/FONT][/SIZE]



It depends. There are factors that may work for one person, and not for you.

One person may be an exceptional salesperson, And can nail the sales of product every time. 
Another may be a good salesperson, and upsell product half of the time.
Another may not be very good at selling, and has to rely on making money off the sitting fee.

Your locale makes a difference as well. 

Your clientele is another variable.

Do you understand taking a random sampling of what others do, in other areas, with different skill sets, is in the end pretty useless to you or the OP's situation?


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