# some other studio shots



## pdcphoto

I have taken a fancy for black dog on black BG.
Let me know what you think.















This one I had to turn b&w  because there was a lot of flare on the head, but the pose was Too sweet to let it go






My studio is very small, very limited and working with cheap lights too. 

I have yet to try my studio with my d750 (these are with d7100)

I usually do outside photography action etc


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## beagle100

pdcphoto said:


> I have taken a fancy for black dog on black BG.
> Let me know what you think.
> 
> 
> 
> This one I had to turn b&w  because there was a lot of flare on the head, but the pose was Too sweet to let it go
> 
> 
> My studio is very small, very limited and working with cheap lights too.
> 
> I have yet to try my studio with my d750 (these are with d7100)
> 
> I usually do outside photography action etc



My thinking ?

Black dog on a black background ???
cheap lights?
dude, what were* you* thinking ?

(hint: stick with your "outside photography action")


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## tirediron

Black on black can work but it does need some care and attention.


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## vintagesnaps

I rather like some of them, The dog is all black but yet not quite all black, there's a bit of color and some nice texture in the dog's coat.


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## cherylynne1

I like the bottom left photo on the top picture. Nice catchlights, good expression. I think a kicker light is really essential for black on black photos (whether it's a dog or a shirt or hair.) 

 But for me, the rest look accidental, the type that would probably get deleted right away. The good news is, they look better than your last photo shoot. Keep practicing!


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## pdcphoto

beagle100 said:


> pdcphoto said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have taken a fancy for black dog on black BG.
> Let me know what you think.
> 
> 
> 
> This one I had to turn b&w  because there was a lot of flare on the head, but the pose was Too sweet to let it go
> 
> 
> My studio is very small, very limited and working with cheap lights too.
> 
> I have yet to try my studio with my d750 (these are with d7100)
> 
> I usually do outside photography action etc
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My thinking ?
> 
> Black dog on a black background ???
> cheap lights?
> dude, what were* you* thinking ?
> 
> (hint: stick with your "outside photography action")
Click to expand...

Hmm I'm only one week into these type of photos. 

Now im thinking. You stick with photography but stay away giving criticism.  I love comments and critique. .but only if I can do something with it


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## pdcphoto

cherylynne1 said:


> I like the bottom left photo on the top picture. Nice catchlights, good expression. I think a kicker light is really essential for black on black photos (whether it's a dog or a shirt or hair.)
> 
> But for me, the rest look accidental, the type that would probably get deleted right away. The good news is, they look better than your last photo shoot. Keep practicing!


 Can you explain accidental please?
And thank you.  I won't give up.


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## cherylynne1

pdcphoto said:


> cherylynne1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I like the bottom left photo on the top picture. Nice catchlights, good expression. I think a kicker light is really essential for black on black photos (whether it's a dog or a shirt or hair.)
> 
> But for me, the rest look accidental, the type that would probably get deleted right away. The good news is, they look better than your last photo shoot. Keep practicing!
> 
> 
> 
> Can you explain accidental please?
> And thank you.  I won't give up.
Click to expand...


Sure. 

What I mean is, it looks like you were randomly pressing the shutter button without waiting for "the moment."

Remember that when you're taking pictures of pets, we humans like to project human emotions and personalities onto them. Therefore, even though their facial structure is vastly different to our own, we like to look for similarities. 

Look at all of your pictures and try to imagine a human face. Would it be a keeper if the man were looking off, not paying attention, not engaging the camera, or with no emotion on his face? Of course not. That's why it doesn't work with the dog in the three other pictures in the top square. 

The two large black photos both have us looking straight up the dog's nose. Again, imagine a human tilting his head back so we're staring at nose hairs. Not attractive. 

As for the last one, I understand what you felt you were capturing...the dog showing love for the stuffed animal. And in the moment, it's possible he was. But in the picture, he's just looking at it. It's not a terrible picture, and if not for the flare I'd have kept it too. But it definitely doesn't quite capture what you were looking for, and with the technical problems on top of that if throw it out. 

Now look back at the bottom right of the first picture. Like I said, it could be improved with a kicker to separate him and a reflector on the dark side just so he doesn't melt away into the background. Imagine a human face there. He's engaged, he's focus, he looks cheerful and natural, his chin is down so we're not looking up his nose. That's the kind of thing you should be looking for. Flattering light, sparkling catchlights, natural expressions. Humans and posed pets are photographed in very similar ways, so studying up on portrait photography could help a lot. Running dogs are photographed more like sports, which it sounds like you're used to. I think you'll agree that sports and portraits are two very different genres, even if they're of the same person, and someone who wants to do both with have to study techniques for each.


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## pdcphoto

I do agree to a certain point, a human poses. A dog does not. and making a dog sit in a studio and taking photos especially portrait will not capture moments, but more generic images. Not a lot of feeling to it. 
The reason I like black on black is because it does make that bit of difference.

for example, when I am out with the dogs I do take portraits or facial shots too as there I get expressions more clearly, the dogs are having fun. Especially when I take them swimming and I am in the water with them.
A dog in a small studio is forced, difficult to catch expressions, exept for them wanting the ball you are holding or the treat.
which happened in all of the above shots.

I will take on your advice of lighting as that is where i struggle the most.  I only just got a reflector, an d I think if I use my FF camera I may get easier resulkts and I dont have to use as much light either or i can even it out easier in a smaller room>

All the above were taken with my d7100. so i needed to push more light without having a light catching the black background which was the biggest challenge,


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## gsgary

pdcphoto said:


> I do agree to a certain point, a human poses. A dog does not. and making a dog sit in a studio and taking photos especially portrait will not capture moments, but more generic images. Not a lot of feeling to it.
> The reason I like black on black is because it does make that bit of difference.
> 
> for example, when I am out with the dogs I do take portraits or facial shots too as there I get expressions more clearly, the dogs are having fun. Especially when I take them swimming and I am in the water with them.
> A dog in a small studio is forced, difficult to catch expressions, exept for them wanting the ball you are holding or the treat.
> which happened in all of the above shots.
> 
> I will take on your advice of lighting as that is where i struggle the most.  I only just got a reflector, an d I think if I use my FF camera I may get easier resulkts and I dont have to use as much light either or i can even it out easier in a smaller room>
> 
> All the above were taken with my d7100. so i needed to push more light without having a light catching the black background which was the biggest challenge,


Your new camera will make no difference to the shots unless you get the lighting better

Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk


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## pdcphoto

gsgary said:


> Your new camera will make no difference to the shots unless you get the lighting better
> 
> Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk



What I am saying is, that I can get more in frame with FF without catching the other lights in my lens. also the lights dont have to be as strong as the camera deals better in lower light.

As for the lights position etc,.. yes I am experimenting and added a reflector as suggested.


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## gsgary

pdcphoto said:


> gsgary said:
> 
> 
> 
> Your new camera will make no difference to the shots unless you get the lighting better
> 
> Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What I am saying is, that I can get more in frame with FF without catching the other lights in my lens. also the lights dont have to be as strong as the camera deals better in lower light.
> 
> As for the lights position etc,.. yes I am experimenting and added a reflector as suggested.
Click to expand...

That's not how you work in a studio, I'll post some shots where I set up a studio at a dog show and printed on site

Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk


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## pdcphoto

here one i just did,.. lights moved around added reflector


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## gsgary

Black on black 2 lights and a reflector, i think they capture the dogs character


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## pdcphoto

could you please tell me where the lights are? these are fab


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## pdcphoto

another one,.. but found the background too light here


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## cherylynne1

Yes, gsgary's photos are exactly what I was trying to explain about separating the black dog from the background! I think those expressions are good too. 

As far as not being able to pose them, you can't pose a two year old either, and I'll take a dog over a two year old any day of the week. It's difficult to capture non-generic photos of anyone in a studio, that's just the nature of the beast. But the parents (and pet parents) want that money shot. So you just have to find techniques that work for you. 

The last two you posted are a little better, but still not as good as the first one in expression. In the last one it looks like you're lighting the background instead of the dog, which is another technique you could use, but you have to fix those wrinkles. You're getting there, keep trying!


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## pdcphoto

thank you ,.. its by yours and sgarys comments i can build up on and can keep trying,.. I have found more ideas too since... to give you an idea how small the room is,.. here a 2 fotos,.. first is the left side




next the right

 

 

I will also ty and put a light behind the dog not pointing to the backdrop


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## gsgary

pdcphoto said:


> could you please tell me where the lights are? these are fab



This was where i was given to shoot i had to think fast about how i was going to use the space,
there was also a reflector where my wife was


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## gsgary

pdcphoto said:


> thank you ,.. its by yours and sgarys comments i can build up on and can keep trying,.. I have found more ideas too since... to give you an idea how small the room is,.. here a 2 fotos,.. first is the left sideView attachment 116242
> 
> 
> next the right
> 
> View attachment 116243 View attachment 116243
> 
> I will also ty and put a light behind the dog not pointing to the backdrop



That space is way too small


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## pdcphoto

I have to work with what I got.. I know its too small,.. but nothing is impossible!


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## Derrel

OP---what you need is a separation light, often called a kicker light, behind the subject's posing line, coming in from the back and slightly off to one side. See Gary's shot of the dog portrait shoot, in Post #19? behind the posing line he has mounted a flash with a small-diameter reflector, a barn doors set, and what looks like, maybe, a mylar diffuser over the front of the reflector. This is a common way to light the edges of people in a portrait-type setting, but it works for pets also. Many people, me included, would use a honeycomb grid over the reflector on the kicker light. The mylar diffusing material is something I am very,very keen on using. I normally use a metal reflector, 20 degree grid, barn doors, and one, or two, or sometimes even three sheets of mylar diffusing material slid into the barn door set's "gel holder slot".

In a realllllllly cramped, confined space like this, light falls off  **exceptionally** rapidly; the shooting area you are working on is extremely cramped, and it would be tricky for a beginning studio shooter to get even light over much distance in that room.

If you can rig up some kind of a separation/kicker light that comes in from behind and off to the side and angling downward a bit, you'll get a little "rim" of light that lights up the outline fur/body of the dark animals, and makes them look so much more three-dimensional.

When a background/separation/hair light comes in from a steep angle, like say from 10 or 11 o'clock angle, with the lens aimed from 6 o'clock to Noon in lens-axis angle, it takes very,very little light to create an outline of light that is "hot", or even "too hot"...this is why the use of a grid, and diffusers, and barn doors--as a way to control the amount and spread of the light that is coming mostly toward the camera position.

Even if you just fire a flash off of a big white board placed at 10 o'clock and behind and off to the side of the dog-posing area, you'll get some separation light that would help; the placement of the board can help keep stray light from striking the black background. A small, cheap 8x8 inch softbox and a speedlight at 1/16 power behind and at 10 o'clock might be something to look into. But you *gotta get something*...some way to separate the animals from that black fabric!

When working in VERY close spaces like this, the amount of light needed is very small, and the ability to control the light is really important. The shorter the distance the light travels to the subject--the MORE-variable the light's brightness is over even short differences in distance. Moving the lights farther away from the posing area creates *a more-even illumination *over more inches of real space.


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## pdcphoto

i am not giving up,.. i have placed a light behind the dog this time ant turned on the main light coming from above, hopingnthat would create some rimlight... also turned down the strobe on the right. I think I am getting there


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## Derrel

Yes, that is a significant improvement! You've got a nice and subtle separation of the dark, chocolate fur against pure black! YES! You've made a big improvement!


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## cherylynne1

You've definitely got the concept down now! Just a matter of perfecting it. Darrel had great advice, listen to him!


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## pdcphoto

Derrel said:


> Yes, that is a significant improvement! You've got a nice and subtle separation of the dark, chocolate fur against pure black! YES! You've made a big improvement!


Thank you, I can still improve and have some more ideas,.. as you mentioned rig up a light on top from the side,.. they are selling desk lamps in lidl monday,.. those LED ones you can clip to anything, one of those is behind the dog and I will get another one to hang where you suggested.


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