# When do you think it is right to upgrade?



## hamlet (Aug 7, 2014)

I'm wondering if these is a way of figuring out how and when the strengths of the newer cameras become so much that it warrants an upgrade? Like i've taken two important factors here of the d3x00 series here, is there really a way of knowing when the right time is other than personal biases or gas?


The evolution of the series(you can look up the rest of the specs yourself on the nikon website):

Dynamic range:
d3000: *11,1 EV*
d3100: *11,3 EV* 
d3200: *13,2 EV*
d3300: *12,8 EV*

Color depth
D3000: *22,3 bits*
D3100: *22,5 bits*
D3200: *24,1 bits*
D3300: *24,3 bits*


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## Designer (Aug 7, 2014)

Anyone who can afford it can do that at any time he wishes.  I was under the impression that you are not suffering from a lack of money.


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## hamlet (Aug 7, 2014)

That is not relevant to my question.


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## SnappingShark (Aug 7, 2014)

I think when somebody has exhausted all of the limitations of their current gear should it be time to upgrade.
For example if you're really into shooting in low light and want a better capability in that area, you're gonna look into a body and/or lenses which are better for that purpose.

However, GAS will always getcha, no matter what spin you put on it! hehe


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## D-B-J (Aug 7, 2014)

The only time an upgrade is warranted is when your current gear limits you.  For me, the lack of bracketing options, a full frame sensor, noise performance, weather sealing, etc were all limiting me with my D7000.  So I upgraded.  And don't regret it one bit.


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## DevC (Aug 7, 2014)

I believe this is the correct answer.

Whenever you'd like.


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## hamlet (Aug 7, 2014)

BrightByNature said:


> I think when somebody has exhausted all of the limitations of their current gear should it be time to upgrade.
> For example if you're really into shooting in low light and want a better capability in that area, you're gonna look into a body and/or lenses which are better for that purpose.
> 
> However, GAS will always getcha, no matter what spin you put on it! hehe



Is there a more specific way to find out when you should upgrade? Lets say you own a d800, when do the differences become so great that it warrants an upgrade?


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## jaomul (Aug 7, 2014)

I think-Stop looking at colour bit dynamic range iso numbers. Upgrade if you want to just because you want to, or if it's on a need be basis, upgrade when your own camera fails to do something you think you need- just my opinion


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## SnappingShark (Aug 7, 2014)

hamlet said:


> BrightByNature said:
> 
> 
> > I think when somebody has exhausted all of the limitations of their current gear should it be time to upgrade.
> ...



This, I have no idea - I would say that's only something an owner of that piece of equipment should be knowing.
For example if you get into bird / fast sports photography and you seriously can't handle the slow frame rate on the D800 vs large file sizes, you'll live with it, but start looking into perhaps the D4s for the lightning 11fps, or a faster crop sensor (downgrade?) for more reach to go with the 7-8 fps offered by the D7100 for example.


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## astroNikon (Aug 7, 2014)

1 - when you feel as if your equipment is holding you back
2 - when you know your equipment is holding you back
3 - when you just feel like upgrading just because you can


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## astroNikon (Aug 7, 2014)

hamlet said:


> I'm wondering if these is a way of figuring out how and when the strengths of the newer cameras become so much that it warrants an upgrade? Like i've taken two important factors here of the d3x00 series here, is there really a way of knowing when the right time is other than personal biases or gas?
> 
> 
> The evolution of the series(you can look up the rest of the specs yourself on the nikon website):
> ...



I think one question you have to ask yourself in regards to an upgrade is

Why upgrade in the same consumer level body?
The incremental changes will seem insignificant between each body, with most in the sensor I think.

If you upgrade from a d3200 to a d7100 there is much more difference in everything and it would be a much more measureable and identifiable upgrade. (better focusing system and controls, more of everything).


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## ronlane (Aug 7, 2014)

It's when you convince yourself (and SO, if applicable) that you need the newer technology.

You can come over here and try until you are blue in the face to convince me that I don't need the 5d mk iii but you'll just be contributing to global warming, because I have made up my mind that I want to go FF.


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## JustJazzie (Aug 7, 2014)

Here was my method:
Make a list of everything you "require" in a camera. Actually, make that list twice. Then rate each camera (current, and the one you are eyeballing) on a scale of importance ranging from 1-10 for each requirement. Add up your results at the end. There is no set number that designates a right answer, but perhaps it will help make the decision a little clearer. 

The kicker for me was when I told all you TPF'ers I needed a new camera and NOT ONE reasonable person told me to "learn my current gear" 

If all else fails, ask the tarot. ;-)


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## Tailgunner (Aug 7, 2014)

Where is it written that a person can *only* upgrade their gear when they reached the limitations of said gear? 

Sure, I think people should figure out how to use their current gear and that upgrading isn't a substitute for skill. I just think if a person has the money, and it's not going to put them in debt, go for it...and they shouldn't be guilted for doing it. I once upgraded camera bodies just for the ergonomics. People wasn't all that impressed then with my reasons for upgrading. I just simply hated the feel and controls of my old camera at that time. 

Anyhow, thats my .02 rant on this subject.


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## cgw (Aug 7, 2014)

hamlet said:


> BrightByNature said:
> 
> 
> > I think when somebody has exhausted all of the limitations of their current gear should it be time to upgrade.
> ...



Is this really keeping you awake at night? My sympathies if it is.


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## hamlet (Aug 7, 2014)

BrightByNature said:


> hamlet said:
> 
> 
> > BrightByNature said:
> ...



You are a slippery one.  I haven't thought this through enough to pin the question down.

Thanks everyone for the replies, i'll think about it.


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## goodguy (Aug 7, 2014)

LOL 

You are asking a question which has lots of answer, upgrading your camera is not a mathematical problem with a streight forward answer, it depends of lots of personal and practical variants.
My simple view is if you can afford the newest and best then get it, if you cant then use the camera for as long as it produces the results you expect it to produce and when it doesnt then get a loan and buy a new camera.

Really its all about the photographer and less about the equipment.


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## gsgary (Aug 7, 2014)

JustJazzie said:


> Here was my method:
> Make a list of everything you "require" in a camera. Actually, make that list twice. Then rate each camera (current, and the one you are eyeballing) on a scale of importance ranging from 1-10 for each requirement. Add up your results at the end. There is no set number that designates a right answer, but perhaps it will help make the decision a little clearer.
> 
> The kicker for me was when I told all you TPF'ers I needed a new camera and NOT ONE reasonable person told me to "learn my current gear"
> ...



Then send it back


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## robbins.photo (Aug 7, 2014)

For me I look at the camera I have and the camera I want and I first figure out what advantages I'll get by buying the new camera.

Then I ask myself, are having those advantages worth it to me?


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## KmH (Aug 7, 2014)

hamlet said:


> I'm wondering if these is a way of figuring out how and when the strengths of the newer cameras become so much that it warrants an upgrade? Like i've taken two important factors here of the d3x00 series here, is there really a way of knowing when the right time is other than personal biases or gas?
> 
> 
> The evolution of the series(you can look up the rest of the specs yourself on the nikon website):
> ...


Use Case Scores - DxOMark
*Color Depth*



> A color sensitivity of 22bits is excellent, and _differences below 1 bit are barely noticeable_.


*Dynamic Range*



> A value of 12 EV is excellent, with differences below 0.5 EV usually not noticeable.


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## hamlet (Aug 7, 2014)

Something quantifiable is what i was thinking of, thank you.


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## PaulWog (Aug 7, 2014)

For someone who's getting a job done, they should purchase whatever they need to get that job done well. If what they currently have is insufficient, or something newer is significantly better, then it makes sense to seriously considering an 'upgrade' (or purchasing additional gear).

For someone who's shooting for leisure (enthusiast, hobbyist), the answer is different. First, if you've got bucket loads of cash, then it's a lot easier: Do what you like. However, if you don't want to throw money at everything, or you can't, then I think my philosophy applies. My philosophy is this: Your first purchase with almost anything won't be ideal. Buying your first laptop, speakers, big screen tv, couch, whatever... you have a huge chance of making a mistake and learning from it. For those who don't expect the world out of what they buy, and they aren't picky, then they probably won't have issues. But, for an enthusiast, the D3200 probably won't cut it forever. I have the D5200, and I can make due. It's great, I love it. I can expand and learn forever with it. However, my mistake was not putting money into full frame right away and skipping the crop sensor. However, I learned A LOT from going with a crop sensor, and ultimately I don't think I regret it based on how much I've learned by starting out with the D5200. I applied my purchasing philosophy when I got the D5200: I wanted the D600, and I considered the Canon 6D, but I got the D5200 since I thought I got 90% of the more expensive cameras for 25% of the price. I made a mistake, but not a big one: I still have an awesome camera which I'll likely keep even when I do upgrade to something better (to have a crop sensor camera as a backup / travel beat-around camera). 

I'm in a similar position to you, Hamlet. I have a D5200 and I want to go full frame. You have a D3200 and you want to move up as well. The right time to buy is when you feel comfortable opening your wallet up. If I were earning money doing photography, I would jump on the D810 right now... but that's not what I'm doing. So, I'm waiting to see what the D620 will offer, and then I'll wait for the D630, and so on. Or, maybe I'll decide to justify getting better gear and try taking on some work... but that's unlikely in my current position.

My advice to you is to wait, or to get the D810. Whichever better suits your wallet.


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## Bender (Aug 7, 2014)

Buy what you need when you need it.


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## chuasam (Aug 7, 2014)

hamlet said:


> That is not relevant to my question.



In that case, "to be, or not to be- that is the question."


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## coastalconn (Aug 7, 2014)

I would love to upgrade since the D7100 limits me in FPS and buffer for the action sequences that I shoot with my birds.  It is a real need for me, but Nikon does not make a camera for what and how I shoot that is better than the D7100 so I just wait, and hope, maybe one day there will be a Nikon DX that is as fast as the D300 with a sensor as good or better than the D7100.... sigh


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## D-B-J (Aug 7, 2014)

coastalconn said:


> I would love to upgrade since the D7100 limits me in FPS and buffer for the action sequences that I shoot with my birds.  It is a real need for me, but Nikon does not make a camera for what and how I shoot that is better than the D7100 so I just wait, and hope, maybe one day there will be a Nikon DX that is as fast as the D300 with a sensor as good or better than the D7100.... sigh



They do. It's called the D4s. But that's what I like to call "WAYYY outta my price range."


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## coastalconn (Aug 7, 2014)

D-B-J said:


> coastalconn said:
> 
> 
> > I would love to upgrade since the D7100 limits me in FPS and buffer for the action sequences that I shoot with my birds.  It is a real need for me, but Nikon does not make a camera for what and how I shoot that is better than the D7100 so I just wait, and hope, maybe one day there will be a *Nikon DX* that is as fast as the D300 with a sensor as good or better than the D7100.... sigh
> ...


Yes it way too expensive and I know it is awesome, but 6MP in DX mode doesn't have the resolution I need for my prints!  I was pretty disappointed when I compared the D3S to the D7100.


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## D-B-J (Aug 7, 2014)

coastalconn said:


> D-B-J said:
> 
> 
> > coastalconn said:
> ...



Maybe one day they'll fix the top-end-DX gap...


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## chuasam (Aug 7, 2014)

I recently upgraded from a D700 to a D810.
I had to upgrade because my D700 was reaching a shutter count of 160,000 plus my GF wanted to borrow it for a 5 week photography assignment as her backup camera. It was a multistage upgrade process starting with a faster computer to handle the massive files. 
Could a D610 have done the job? No, I really wanted the 10pin release since I had that for my D700, the PC-Sync cable, the CF capability since I have a small mountain of those things, the lovely lovely Advanced Multi-CAM 3500FX. 

You'll know when it is time to upgrade. You will feel held back by your current gear in a real way...and not gear envy.
Upgrade to a D810 by all means but realise that your infrastructure needs to handle the file size. My current FireWire800 drive is woefully inadequate so a Thunderbolt array is soon to be.


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## hamlet (Aug 8, 2014)

Perhaps i should have qualified this in the begging, but this was never meant to be anything other than a hypothetical question so i can become less ignorant on the subject of camera specifications.


As for what camera i am going to upgrade to? Well so far i have subverted most of the limitations of my camera, so i'm just holding out to see what the d7200 and the d620 will look like.


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## astroNikon (Aug 8, 2014)

hamlet said:


> Perhaps i should have qualified this in the begging, but this was never meant to be anything other than a hypothetical question so i can become less ignorant on the subject of camera specifications.
> 
> 
> As for what camera i am going to upgrade to? Well so far i have subverted most of the limitations of my camera, so i'm just holding out to see what the d7200 and the d620 will look like.


You only listed 2 very SPECIFIC camera items.  There is so much more to specifications than those 2 items.
So until you figure out what *you* need, it's hard to help.

Maybe you need to go back to simplicity. Then build upon it.

Otherwise, I think you should wait until the d5x comes out, and don't settle for anything less.


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## manaheim (Aug 8, 2014)

hamlet said:


> That is not relevant to my question.



It kinda is.

You buy the camera you want when you want it and when you can afford it.

The only motivating factor beyond that is if your camera is somehow falling short of what you need, such as in the case of a low-light shooter.

When and what to buy is alllllllllllll about budget with a small scattering of needs-based requirements, but at the end of the day far greater works have been produced with far less equipment than even the casual shooter has access to today.


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## hamlet (Aug 8, 2014)

@astro

Go to kmh's explanation, he answered the op pretty well in my opinion. And the d5? Oh yeah, d5 is next in line. Perhaps something for birdsters ? For certain avian photographers?  *hint**hint*


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## astroNikon (Aug 8, 2014)

hamlet said:


> @astro
> 
> Go to kmh's explanation, he answered the op pretty well in my opinion. And the d5? Oh yeah, d5 is next in line. Perhaps something for birdsters ? For certain avian photographers?  *hint**hint*


@hamlet

you are the OP ...


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## hamlet (Aug 8, 2014)

astroNikon said:


> hamlet said:
> 
> 
> > @Astro
> ...


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## hamlet (Aug 8, 2014)

manaheim said:


> hamlet said:
> 
> 
> > That is not relevant to my question.
> ...



I supose it was relevant in retrospect. My position on when you need to upgrade your camera depends really on the person themselves.


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## AceCo55 (Aug 9, 2014)

I can't locate it at the moment but there is some software called "Camera Upgrade Index" ... or something like that. (Maybe Google search)

You run it and punch in your data/situation and if you get an index of 42, or more, you should upgrade.

It takes the "urge to splurge" or "gear fascination" out of the equation. It's a pretty good indication of when to upgrade.
You'll spend a lot less time second guessing yourself and you will just be able to concentrate on your photography.

Maybe worth a look.


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## sashbar (Aug 9, 2014)

I think the upgrade has nothing to do with numbers and even less so with marketing tricks presented as "innovations" and "improvements". 
When the time comes for an upgrade you KNOW it. You just know what camera you need and why. You do not ask about it on the forum or anywhere else. If you ask about it, 9 times out of 10 "photographically" you do not need an upgrade, you are just hoping that a "better" gear will bring you "better" images. 9 times out of 10 it will not happen. So 9 times out of 10 you need to stick with your gear in this case and just learn. (If are a gadget lover, that is another thing, you are free to do it of course, but I am talking about the "photographic" side of things). 
Actually I think "upgrade" is a rather misleading term for an aspiring photographer. A photographer should not think in terms of "upgrading" his equipment. He/she just needs to buy a camera and other stuff that suits him/her best and think about "upgrading" his/her skills and vision. I know I sound like I am lecturing somebody, but I am not, I do think this way myself. I just think it is a more productive attitude.  EV? Color bit? I have not got a clue and I do not care.


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## astroNikon (Aug 9, 2014)

Sometimes an upgrade is a motivating factor which, in of itself, can raise your photography to new levels.


you've been talking upgrade forever.  Even at one point getting a d800, then getting rid of it.  Then looking at the d4/s.

After reading the focusing options on the d3x00 manual, I for one, think the focusing options of a higher level body of at least a d7000 is a major difference that can really help one's photography.   A d7000 (or 7100) may not be what you want.  But I think the $550ish upgrade to a used d7000 would be a major stepping stone.  Not exactly the d800 you had but a low cost alternative that is easy to resell.


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## hamlet (Aug 9, 2014)

Lets wait and see what Nikon does at fotokina. I for one would like to see a sports action dx camera. Something like the d4 at half the price.


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## astroNikon (Aug 9, 2014)

hamlet said:


> Lets wait and see what Nikon does at fotokina. I for one would like to see a sports action dx camera. Something like the d4 at half the price.


A d4 is still a $6,000 camera ... so $3k can get you alot.

you could always get a brand new 300s for 1/4 of a d4.  Or a used one for less 1/8th or less than $800


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## hamlet (Aug 9, 2014)

September is just around the corner, there is no need to rush things.


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## greybeard (Aug 9, 2014)

Being an amateur I upgrade when I get bored with my equipment and can afford to get something newer.  I shoot a lot of closeup bugs so crop frame helps me reach them from a comfortable distance with my 105 macro.  I'll probably upgrade my body (camera) with whatever replaces the D7100.


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## hamlet (Aug 9, 2014)

greybeard said:


> Being an amateur I upgrade when I get bored with my equipment and can afford to get something newer.  I shoot a lot of closeup bugs so crop frame helps me reach them from a comfortable distance with my 105 macro.  I'll probably upgrade my body (camera) with whatever replaces the D7100.



Well, seeing as nikon is replacing all their expeed 3 dslr's with the expeed 4, the d7200 is a sure thing since it will be getting the expeed 4. Just contrast the d3300 and the d5300 with their respective predecessors to get an idea what the d7200 will look like.


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## AceCo55 (Aug 10, 2014)

So I guess the answer to this whole thread is "upgrade after fotokina" ... done.


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## Warhorse (Aug 10, 2014)

My feelings about upgrading are these, If you can afford it, do it...if that is what brings you pleasure.


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## hamlet (Aug 10, 2014)

AceCo55 said:


> So I guess the answer to this whole thread is "upgrade after fotokina" ... done.



We kind of went on an aside after i got the answer i was looking for like two pages ago. But yeah, hopefully we'll all be pleasantly surprised by photokina.


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## astroNikon (Aug 10, 2014)

hamlet said:


> AceCo55 said:
> 
> 
> > So I guess the answer to this whole thread is "upgrade after fotokina" ... done.
> ...


You should ask the thread to be locked after you get the answer that you want


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## hamlet (Aug 10, 2014)

Good idea. Lets go out on a good note: Sigma Could Be Busy at Photokina, with 4 Potential Lenses on the Way


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## manaheim (Aug 10, 2014)

I'll take that as a lock request.


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