# How are reflectors used?



## Jon_Are (Jun 7, 2011)

I see much talk about using reflectors for outdoor portraits, but nothing about how to use them.

Do you simply hold or prop them so the sunlight is reflected onto your subject? There must be something more to it than this, I would think? How do you determine placement? Or angle? Are they useful even when the sunlight is not particularly bright?

Thanks,

Jon


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## c.cloudwalker (Jun 7, 2011)

Jon_Are said:


> There must be something more to it than this...



No there isn't. Can't it be good enough if it is too easy?

Just walk around your subject with your reflector and you see the result right away. Period.


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## Hatch1921 (Jun 7, 2011)

Jon_Are said:


> I see much talk about using reflectors for outdoor portraits, but nothing about how to use them.
> 
> Do you simply hold or prop them so the sunlight is reflected onto your subject? There must be something more to it than this, I would think? How do you determine placement? Or angle? Are they useful even when the sunlight is not particularly bright?
> 
> ...



Hi Jon,

There are many different types of reflectors... with different color reflective surfaces...and of course all shapes and sizes.  You can use them in a number of way outdoors.  I typically "feather" the light with them... meaning... I will find the direction the sun in coming in at... then angle the reflector to bounce/reflect the light back to the subject.  Once I have the full force of the reflected light on the subject I will then move the reflector slightly to where the light is not full force on the person... but.. where you can see an increase in the fill light.  It will make more sense when you give it a try.  

Typically my partner will hold the reflector, if she isn't on a shoot... odds are family and friends will be.  You can put them to work holding the reflector for you... just educate them in a nice way on how you want them to use the reflector. 

Yes... they can be useful to push a little light back on the subject even if there isn't a ton of light in your scene. 

So many uses for a reflector.. .and diffusion panel.  I have a couple of 4x6 reflector/diffusion panel kits. One way I use them... if the light from the reflector is coming across hard/harsh... I will place a diffusion panel in front of the subject... couple feet back from them... and then use the reflector to push light on the diffusion panel... which then gives me a nice soft, diffused light... just like having a nice softbox on location.

Reflectors/diffusion panels are a great investment IMO.

Hope this helps.
Hatch


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## PhotoTish (Jun 7, 2011)

As someone who has just bought a set of reflectors - your post was very helpful to me.  Thank you :thumbup:


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## Hatch1921 (Jun 7, 2011)

PhotoTish said:


> As someone who has just bought a set of reflectors - your post was very helpful to me.  Thank you :thumbup:




Glad to help 
Hatch


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## dallasimagery (Jun 7, 2011)

Jon_Are said:


> I see much talk about using reflectors for outdoor portraits, but nothing about how to use them.



I don't like reflectors. I feel like, if I'm going to go toting around some huge reflector, I'd much rather have another light.  It's much more versatile to have another light where you can use modifiers to control with pinpoint precision what you want to do, or even create crazing lighting shapes.  Reflectors, IMHO, are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting.  I've work with many "real" pros, and they rarely use reflectors. Why woudl you? It's just a subsitute for another light.



Jon_Are said:


> I see much talk about using reflectors for outdoor portraits,



I wouldn't know, I haven't used one since I started in photography.


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## HWesh (Jun 7, 2011)

This video may help you guys as well

Digital Photography 1 on 1: Episode 46: Using Natural Light: Adorama Photography TV


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## flea77 (Jun 7, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> I don't like reflectors. I feel like, if I'm going to go toting around some huge reflector, I'd much rather have another light.  It's much more versatile to have another light where you can use modifiers to control with pinpoint precision what you want to do, or even create crazing lighting shapes.  Reflectors, IMHO, are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting.  I've work with many "real" pros, and they rarely use reflectors. Why woudl you? It's just a subsitute for another light.
> 
> I wouldn't know, I haven't used one since I started in photography.


 
ummmmm... Scott Kelby ... Dean Collins ... Ken Rockwell ... David Hobby Yep, all rank amateurs! :lmao:

It's not like Scott Kelby wrote the book on photography.....oh wait! He did! Several of them!:er:

It's not like Dean Collins was regarded as a lighting guru, or published any commercially available DVDs on the subject....wait, I think he was and did!:thumbup:

It's not like David Hobby is a recognized portable lighting expert who has distributed DVDs and books, given classes and seminars all over the country or anything....wait for it... he did and does!

Reflectors are great because they are light, portable, cheap, easy, and don't require batteries. Now don't get me wrong, I like lights too, carry way more strobes than I need with stands, umbrellas, wireless remotes, gels, etc too, but I also won't leave without my reflectors.

Just sayin...:mrgreen:

Allan


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## table1349 (Jun 7, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Jon_Are said:
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> > I see much talk about using reflectors for outdoor portraits, but nothing about how to use them.
> ...


 
How many lights do you have?  There are times when the 9 I have are not enough.  I've been using reflectors for 30+ years from small hand held to large frame held for reflecting, absorbing and diffusing light.  A rank amateur is one that drags around a bunch of extra stuff they don't need, making a setup more difficult, just to make themselves look professional.  Frankly, the term professional or "pros" means nothing to me.  I have worked with a lot of "professional" photographers, but I learned from and enjoyed working with Accomplished photographers that knew their craft and made their living from it.  Reflectors are good for directing light, easy to use when you are setting lighting ratios, light in weight, convenient to carry and setup, require no power, and if you know how to use them make setups a breeze.  

Couple of tutorials for the OP: 
Photoflex Lighting School - Lighting Principles
How to Use Light Reflectors in Photography Tutorial
Lots of tutorials on lighting including reflectors and reflector use with lighting Photography techniques and tutorials - learn photography - Studio Lighting and Flash


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## Kerbouchard (Jun 7, 2011)

Uh, oh, the KR reference came out.  This thread is sure to go to hell in a hand basket.


> Reflectors, IMHO, are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting.


IMO, anybody who thinks reflectors or diffusers are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting, probably shouldn't own a camera and certainly should not call themselves a photographer.  

FWIW, just about every actual pro shoot where the results matter use reflectors and diffusers.   They also have people for hair, make up, warddrobe, grips, lighting techs, electricians, etc, etc, etc.  I would venture to guess that you have actually never even seen a real photo shoot.  And no, you watching a pro set up a light, take a meter reading, and shoot group after group cookie cutter style doesn't count.


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## table1349 (Jun 7, 2011)

flea77 said:


> dallasimagery said:
> 
> 
> > I don't like reflectors. I feel like, if I'm going to go toting around some huge reflector, I'd much rather have another light.  It's much more versatile to have another light where you can use modifiers to control with pinpoint precision what you want to do, or even create crazing lighting shapes.  Reflectors, IMHO, are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting.  I've work with many "real" pros, and they rarely use reflectors. Why woudl you? It's just a subsitute for another light.
> ...



Don't forget to add the late Monte Zucker in the mix.  One of the fathers of modern wedding photography and classic portraiture.  A master photographer and a great teacher.


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## Hatch1921 (Jun 7, 2011)

Lots of really good info passed on to Jon.  Reflectors are just another great tool to add to the kit.  I have several different sizes for different uses.  It really should be one of the first things a person starting out in photography should invest in.  For $30-50 a  5-n-1 can really turn a snap shot in to a nice portrait. 


About the other person...   if you click the name... and add it to you ignore list... you won't be bothered by the negative posts.  He's posted all over my links... no clue what he has said after the 1st couple of negative postings...if we all ignore the ignorance... maybe it will just go away? . Don't feed the trolls  

Best of luck Jon... hope the info helps.
Hatch

This message is hidden because *dallasimagery* is on your *ignore list.*


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## Derrel (Jun 8, 2011)

dallasimagery said:
			
		

> Reflectors, IMHO, are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting.  I've work with many "real" pros, and they rarely use reflectors. Why woudl you?



ROFLMFAO.

Dude...come on...reflectors,scrims, panels,whatever you want to call them, are essential in many situations.

Can you teach me how to douggie, dallasimagery?


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## Village Idiot (Jun 8, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Jon_Are said:
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> 
> > I see much talk about using reflectors for outdoor portraits, but nothing about how to use them.
> ...



I've rarely seen a pro not use some type of reflector or light panel for auto photography. I've seen many real pros use reflectors. I think it's a sign of an amateur to dismiss tools just because they believe there's a negative status symbol attached to it. Hell, if I need a snoot and don't have one, It's not beneath me to use a Captain Crunch box to create one. If you can't get a photo because you think your too good to improvise or use some peice of equipment, I'll be happy to take the job from you.


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## Village Idiot (Jun 8, 2011)

Derrel said:


> dallasimagery said:
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It's teach me how to duckie. Apparently learning how to dougie won't keep you alive.


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## jake337 (Jun 8, 2011)

You would think of it as a light source, just like a flash.  All the same rules may apply, and may be bended per situation.  Just remember it can't stop motion like flash, as it is continuous lighting.


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## dallasimagery (Jun 9, 2011)

Derrel said:


> dallasimagery said:
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WHy are people putting words in my mouth? I ONLY spoke about reflectors, not any other modifier that you listed. Yes, I'd MUCH rather have another light I can control with pinpoint precision.


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## o hey tyler (Jun 9, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Jon_Are said:
> 
> 
> > I see much talk about using reflectors for outdoor portraits, but nothing about how to use them.
> ...



Holy crap batman! The Douche-o-meter is going OFF THE CHART. 

Not using reflectors, IMHO, is a sign of lack of general resourcefulness as a photographer who doesn't know much about lighting.


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## MWG (Jun 9, 2011)

lawls


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## Dao (Jun 9, 2011)

Reflectors works great with lights as well when it is under the control by the photographer.


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## Aye-non Oh-non Imus (Jun 9, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> ...... Reflectors, IMHO, are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting. I've work with many "real" pros, and they rarely use reflectors. Why woudl you? *It's just a subsitute for another light*.
> 
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> 
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Precisley the reason to use one...... as a substitue for another light.

If you've never used one, how can you advise someone on the use of a reflector, much less the disuse of it.


OP, this is the reason you have to weed through the crap that is spewed on the internet.


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## Dao (Jun 9, 2011)

I saw some examples that the model was instructed by the photographer to hold a smaller white reflector to at her waist level to bounce some defused light (lights from the strobes) upward.  And I think it can be done by an additional small power light, but it will be much easier with a reflector.

And sometimes, I use the black side of the reflector to block some light.  It really comes in handy sometimes.


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## Mike_E (Jun 9, 2011)

One thing a reflector can do that a strobe can't is to give shade for subtractive lighting.. subtractive lighting techniques - Google Search


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## VirtualPhotographyStudio (Jun 9, 2011)

Mike_E, You are correct there. A solid object can also be used as a subtractive  lighting source. If you are next to a column and move your subject forward or backward into the shadow, you will see a huge difference in the quality of light.


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## table1349 (Jun 9, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Derrel said:
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Perhaps you should check out some of Christopher Gray's books on lighting such as: Master Lighting Guide for Portrait ... - Google Ksi

He does a nice job of explaining the value and uses for reflectors.  Some people seem to think that he knows what he is talking about when it comes to studio and portrait lighting.


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## Derrel (Jun 9, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Derrel said:
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Who is putting words in your mouth? Apparently you have been around photography not long enough to realize that a "reflector" is often referred to as a "panel". Dean Collins, my 1980's videotape "mentor" taught an entire generation of us to light using what he called LightForm "panels". A reflector can be called a reflector, a reflector  panel, or simply a "panel". So, I was not putting words in your mouth...

A scrim can be made by placing a diffusion screen of silk, nylon, rayon, cotton, gauze, or Fibreglas (Trade Mark) screening onto a metal, PVC pipe, or wooden panel frame. So, a scrim is just a reflector panel, stripped of its reflecting material, and fitted with a diffusing material instead. Using two or three panels fitted with diffusion material is what used to be called "scrim lighting" in the 1940's and 1950's.

So....again...I was not putting words in your mouth.A reflector is a panel is a scrim...

See how that works?  See how well another flash works at synching with sunlight with a medium format camera with a focal plane shutter. The majority of today's d-slr shutters will synchronize only up to 1/200 second, and many have base ISO levels of 200. In bright sunlight, that means that flash fill is always limited by the camera's top shutter speed. That is not an issue with a reflector--it can be used at ANY shutter speed, and the reflected light is a WYSIWYG, and can be metered and balanced using the camera's built-in light meter. Sorry, but saying that "another light" is in some way magically better than a reflector/panel/scrim is really not a very complete look at the situation from a real-world point of view.


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## Kerbouchard (Jun 9, 2011)

Derrel, you obviously don't know what you are talking about.  I read somewhere on the internet that anybody who uses reflectors is a rank amateur who doesn't know anything about lighting.  I wish you would stop trying to fill people's heads with nonsense.


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## Gaerek (Jun 9, 2011)

Kerbouchard said:


> Derrel, you obviously don't know what you are talking about.  I read somewhere on the internet that anybody who uses reflectors is a rank amateur who doesn't know anything about lighting.  I wish you would stop trying to fill people's heads with nonsense.


 
I wish I could be a pro like Dallasimagery. I guess in the mean time, I'll have to be a rank amateur, like Derrel, and use my reflectors for lighting.


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## camz (Jun 9, 2011)

Kerbouchard said:


> Derrel, you obviously don't know what you are talking about.  I read somewhere on the internet that anybody who uses reflectors is a rank amateur who doesn't know anything about lighting.  I wish you would stop trying to fill people's heads with nonsense.



Don't buy that BS.  I know a lot of photographers who shoot without one and photographers who shoot with the use of reflectors(including me).  

Answer this question...there are tons of natural/ambient light photographers out there.  How do you think they're pulling this off?


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## Kerbouchard (Jun 9, 2011)

camz said:


> Kerbouchard said:
> 
> 
> > Derrel, you obviously don't know what you are talking about.  I read somewhere on the internet that anybody who uses reflectors is a rank amateur who doesn't know anything about lighting.  I wish you would stop trying to fill people's heads with nonsense.
> ...


 Come back when you have actually read the thread.


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## camz (Jun 9, 2011)

Kerbouchard said:


> camz said:
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I take it you were being sarcastic


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## Kerbouchard (Jun 9, 2011)

camz said:


> Kerbouchard said:
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Ahh, what a difference a little bit of context makes...


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## table1349 (Jun 9, 2011)

Kerbouchard said:


> camz said:
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Give the poor guy a break, he is from the Bay Area.  :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:


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## dallasimagery (Jun 9, 2011)

Aye-non Oh-non Imus said:


> dallasimagery said:
> 
> 
> > ...... Reflectors, IMHO, are a sign of a rank amateur who doesn't know much about lighting. I've work with many "real" pros, and they rarely use reflectors. Why woudl you? *It's just a subsitute for another light*.
> ...



My point is, it's a piss poor substitute, and VERY large and clumsy at that... there's no reason to use one at all.


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## MWG (Jun 9, 2011)

obvious troll is obvious


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## flea77 (Jun 9, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> My point is, it's a piss poor substitute, and VERY large and clumsy at that... there's no reason to use one at all.


 
I have to admit, when doing many of my macro shoots I do get annoyed at the large size and clumsiness of those dang index cards I use to fill in shadows. Instead of those huge clumsy 4"x6" 50mil index cards what I really need is a 500ws monolight! Yeah right 

Allan


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## table1349 (Jun 9, 2011)

Somewhere in Texas there is a village missing it's idiot.


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## Kerbouchard (Jun 9, 2011)

gryphonslair99 said:


> Somewhere in Texas there is a village missing it's idiot.


 I take offense to that...my village knows exactly where I am at.


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## camz (Jun 9, 2011)

gryphonslair99 said:


> Kerbouchard said:
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  Should I close my eyes and click my heals twice?


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## Gaerek (Jun 9, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> My point is, it's a piss poor substitute, and VERY large and clumsy at that...* there's no reason to use one at all.*


 
I seriously hope you aren't a professional...you know, actually selling images for a living. I haven't seen a more ignorant post by a someone who's supposedly a seasoned photographer, well, in at least a couple months.

Maybe I'll just pretend you're actually just a troll, because someone who actually knows something about making images would know how ridiculous this statement actually is. Yeah, that's it, must be another troll...


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## Derrel (Jun 10, 2011)

Reflectors can also be used to bash, bludgeon, smash, and pummel other photographers. I like my ancient Bogen-branded LightForm P22 panels, the black PVC ones, as bludgeons. I fill one of the shorter, bottom cross-members with fine pebbles, effectively tripling its weight. It delivers a mighty blow, and then once the other guy is reeling from the sting of the blow, I like to move in and choke the chit out of him using the internal bungee cord and the other pipe pieces as levers!!! Usually, after 45-70 seconds, he'll stop kicking and will go limp, and then I can re-set-up the panel and get back to shooting.

DIY Collapsible Bungee Light Panel (Lightform P22 Imitation) - a photo on Flickriver


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## Hatch1921 (Jun 10, 2011)

^^^^  Cracked me up  :
Hatch


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## table1349 (Jun 10, 2011)

camz said:


> gryphonslair99 said:
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 There's no place like home, there's no place like home.:mrgreen:


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## table1349 (Jun 10, 2011)

Kerbouchard said:


> gryphonslair99 said:
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 If your village knows where you are at, what should that tell you? :mrgreen:


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## Mike_E (Jun 10, 2011)

I was going to say that Dean Collins is spinning in his grave but then I gave it further consideration and he probably just rolled over and went back to sleep.


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## ghache (Jun 10, 2011)

whHHAAT ! Use a reflector for photography? 

I though there were used on boats to do distress signal in case of emergencies


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## dallasimagery (Jun 10, 2011)

ghache said:


> whHHAAT ! Use a reflector for photography?
> 
> I though there were used on boats to do distress signal in case of emergencies



Nah, they won't fit  Too big and clumsy.


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## SabrinaO (Jun 11, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Aye-non Oh-non Imus said:
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Are you serious??? WOW...your ignorance will get you nowhere!


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## dallasimagery (Jun 12, 2011)

SabrinaO said:


> dallasimagery said:
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## ghache (Jun 12, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> SabrinaO said:
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## dallasimagery (Jun 12, 2011)

ghache said:


> dallasimagery said:
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## flea77 (Jun 12, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Wow you're really stupid aren't you? WHo said anything about that?



Dang I love the Ignore List, #2 added, thank you very much!

Allan


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## Dao (Jun 12, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> Wow you're really stupid aren't you? WHo said anything about that?




:thumbdown::thumbdown:


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## ghache (Jun 12, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


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## flea77 (Jun 12, 2011)

Yeah, he made lots of friends over there too

Allan


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## table1349 (Jun 12, 2011)

Might I offer this bit of advise from the wonderful movie True Grit starring John Wayne, Kim Darby and Glenn Campbell reference the continuation of this thread.*

Mattie Ross*: I will not bandy words with a drunkard.  _(substitute your own word for drunkard)_
*LaBoeuf*: That's real smart. You've done nothing when you've bested a fool. 


You can lead an idiot to a library, but once there all you can do is beat him over the head with a heavy book.


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## Dao (Jun 12, 2011)

Oh wow...  

WTF  No wonder he got banned.  That was BAD...  Not the comment part, it was what he did outside the forum.  

Becca's Bridal in snow yeseterday


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## Hatch1921 (Jun 12, 2011)

Dao said:


> Oh wow...
> 
> WTF  No wonder he got banned.  That was BAD...  Not the comment part, it was what he did outside the forum.
> 
> Becca's Bridal in snow yeseterday



Talk about an interesting read....   sad but interesting. 

Hatch


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## Kerbouchard (Jun 12, 2011)

Dao said:


> Oh wow...
> 
> WTF  No wonder he got banned.  That was BAD...  Not the comment part, it was what he did outside the forum.
> 
> Becca's Bridal in snow yeseterday



After reading that, I can't believe he isn't banned over here.  Heck, there should be a way to ban him from every photo forum on the internet after pulling crap like that.


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## ghache (Jun 12, 2011)

Originally Posted by *lscottpht* 

 
_Ok,  so this jerk up above, Dan, has just somehow reviewed me on Wedding  Wire which only brides and grooms can review your work. He has ruined my  perfect 5 star rating. Here is what he said: Mediocre photography at  best. Poor posing, very rude.

Thanks, Jake!

Thanks, Lyncca! I'm so mad right now! He is trying to ruin my business!


And you call other people retards?
_


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## Hatch1921 (Jun 12, 2011)

That's just the Internet for you. You will have a ton of genuinely nice people trying to help one another out... and then one comes along.... well... that thread and many others on here speaks volumes.


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## table1349 (Jun 12, 2011)

To be sung to the refrain of Copacabana by Barry Manilow.

_*He hails from Dallas, thinks with his phallus,
His manner is crude and oh so callous,
He hails from Dallas, thinks with his phallus,
Stupidity his passion, Its always his fashion,
Down in Dallas, Now Go Away.
Please go away.
Just go away. 
*_


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## ghache (Jun 12, 2011)

Too bad the dallas superstar is never going to reply back to this thread lol


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## dallasimagery (Jun 12, 2011)

ghache said:


> I just wanna see all that crazy work of yours.



Wow, you've been a member here how long, and you don't know how to use the search button? Lol, you really ARE stupid!

As for that "other" forum, there's a reason for that - it goes wwway back, the guy that runs it is a TOTAL asshole. I log on over there every once and a while and purposely wreak havoc


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## ghache (Jun 13, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> ghache said:
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This is why i ask. You talk about the really flat looking wedding picture you posted, or the blurry picture of lady that has 1 arm, or the latex whore?, cmon, this is nowhere around outstanding photography, maybe you should use a reflector


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## o hey tyler (Jun 13, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> ghache said:
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Fix't


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## Mike_E (Jun 13, 2011)

o hey tyler said:


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Yes, yes you did.


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## Village Idiot (Jun 14, 2011)

ghache said:


> Originally Posted by *lscottpht*
> 
> 
> _Ok, so this jerk up above, Dan, has just somehow reviewed me on Wedding Wire which only brides and grooms can review your work. He has ruined my perfect 5 star rating. Here is what he said: Mediocre photography at best. Poor posing, very rude.
> ...



That's a professional child and not a professional photographer right there.


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## Village Idiot (Jun 14, 2011)

dallasimagery said:


> ghache said:
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> > I just wanna see all that crazy work of yours.
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Did you ever get your focusing problem fixed?
Hello - and a few intro shots

It looks like almost every shot is front focused. If you're shooting professionally you might want to try a larger DOF or manually focusing to get the pictures to end up properly focused.


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## table1349 (Jun 14, 2011)

Village Idiot said:


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That there front focusing is how them there big city professinal phoootografers take them there pictures these days don't ya know.


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## Jon_Are (Jun 16, 2011)

Hi all -

I have not checked into my thread in a while because I've been AWIA  (Away Without Internet Access). Eight days in the Dominican Republic.

Anyway, thanks to (almost) all who have replied - particularly *Hatch *and *HWesh*. That Adorama video was extremely helpful. I guess I didn't realize how obvious the effect of a well-placed reflector is, not to mention the specific results obtained from using various reflective surfaces.

I dismissed *Dallasimagery*'s response as soon as I read it; anyone who makes such a blanket statement about a legitimate piece of photographic equipment that is in such wide use immediately loses all credibility with me. 

And *c.cloudwalker* (post #2) - I don't know why you bothered responding; your input was dick-ish and - as it turns out - 100% wrong (as proven by the Adorama tutorial, for one).

Now I have to go shopping for a reflector.

Jon


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## Bitter Jeweler (Jun 16, 2011)

How was cloudwalker 100% wrong?


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## shaunly (Jun 16, 2011)

Reflected...


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## Hatch1921 (Jun 19, 2011)

Jon_Are said:


> Hi all -
> 
> Anyway, thanks to (almost) all who have replied - particularly *Hatch *and *HWesh*. That Adorama video was extremely helpful. I guess I didn't realize how obvious the effect of a well-placed reflector is, not to mention the specific results obtained from using various reflective surfaces.
> n



Always glad to help
Hatch


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## leixialong (Jun 26, 2011)

HWesh said:


> This video may help you guys as well
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> Digital Photography 1 on 1: Episode 46: Using Natural Light: Adorama Photography TV



Wow this is a great find. Their are a few tutorial channels out their but this guy is fantastic, speaks clearly and concisely.


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