# Beauty dish from today's session



## smakelijk11 (Nov 20, 2017)

Feel free to give C&C. I think I already know what was done well and what could be improved. But... Your opinion is always helpful. 

Cheers


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## DanOstergren (Nov 21, 2017)

If you already know what you could do better, why ask?


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## tirediron (Nov 21, 2017)

DanOstergren said:


> If you already know what you could do better, why ask?


Validation?  I often think I know what could be improved, and frequently people raise points that hadn't occurred to me.


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## jaomul (Nov 21, 2017)

DanOstergren said:


> If you already know what you could do better, why ask?


Why the attitude? Help out with advice or don't bother


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## jaomul (Nov 21, 2017)

smakelijk11 said:


> Feel free to give C&C. I think I already know what was done well and what could be improved. But... Your opinion is always helpful.
> 
> Cheers


I couldn't do better myself but, the first one the pose seems forced a little, the second one in my opinion could be cropped a little better, I wouldn't change the third. All nice, just small things I would change buy YMMV. Very nice


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 21, 2017)

DanOstergren said:


> If you already know what you could do better, why ask?


Exactly... your comment is not helpful at all. I was looking for help, not a jerk comment. Your work is really nice though btw. I checked out your website


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 21, 2017)

tirediron said:


> DanOstergren said:
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> 
> > If you already know what you could do better, why ask?
> ...


Bingo! That is exactly what I was thinking too. I think the posing with the hands needs work. I tried so hard to work on that during the shoot and would love advice from others. As a 340 pound man, trying to show a beautiful woman by posing myself isn't working out so well. Not to mention I have back problems too lol


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## Donde (Nov 21, 2017)

I like the first and third, you make her look very fetching. In the middle one though she looks like she's posing for a passport photo.


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## DanOstergren (Nov 21, 2017)

You completely misread my comment, there was no hostility or attitude intended, believe me. People ask questions like this face to face all the time, and no one seems to get bent out of shape. I am genuinely curious to know what it is that you have to say about your own photos and how you could improve. Posting for critique but saying that you feel like you already know what could be done better seems like a bit of a contradictory statement, so I had to ask because I have an inquiring mind. 

Some details that jump out at me:
In the first image, she's putting pressure on her face with her fingers. You can have someone pose with their fingers up to their face, but it's best not to have them actually touch their skin so you avoid the indentations created by the pressure of the touch.

Image 2, I think the posing would be more harmonious to the image composition if there were symmetry in the positioning of her hands, rather than having one hand higher than the other. To me it throws off the balance and flow of composition.

Image 3 to me is bottom heavy in the composition, and cutting her off at the sides of her shoulders like that creates an illusion of very wide-set shoulders. As well, I think it would look better to have her hair flipped to the other side rather than covering the side of the neck that's facing the camera. Utilizing the lines and shape of the neck is a good way to enhance the composition of a portrait, while covering it in my opinion can make some of the shapes in the image seem blocky and large, rather than sleek and graceful.

Lighting is ok in all three, but as I said before in your other thread, a beauty dish is great because it creates high contrast light while still being able to achieve soft transitions between lit areas and areas cast in shadow; I think you could really improve your photos a lot by using that light as more of a sculpting tool to contour and highlight the face, rather than just using to illuminate the face.


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## DanOstergren (Nov 21, 2017)

jaomul said:


> DanOstergren said:
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> 
> > If you already know what you could do better, why ask?
> ...


https://orig00.deviantart.net/a1f9/..._21_at_5_05_35_pm_by_danostergren-dbugkce.png


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 21, 2017)

DanOstergren said:


> You completely misread my comment, there was no hostility or attitude intended, believe me. People ask questions like this face to face all the time, and no one seems to get bent out of shape. I am genuinely curious to know what it is that you have to say about your own photos and how you could improve. Posting for critique but saying that you feel like you already know what could be done better seems like a bit of a contradictory statement, so I had to ask because I have an inquiring mind.
> 
> Some details that jump out at me:
> In the first image, she's putting pressure on her face with her fingers. You can have someone pose with their fingers up to their face, but it's best not to have them actually touch their skin so you avoid the indentations created by the pressure of the touch.
> ...


Thank you so much for taking the time to write this. And you see, I predicted the comment with the hand on the face. This is hence why I wrote what I think I got wrong. Do you think the backlighting is working for the portraits?


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## DanOstergren (Nov 21, 2017)

smakelijk11 said:


> DanOstergren said:
> 
> 
> > You completely misread my comment, there was no hostility or attitude intended, believe me. People ask questions like this face to face all the time, and no one seems to get bent out of shape. I am genuinely curious to know what it is that you have to say about your own photos and how you could improve. Posting for critique but saying that you feel like you already know what could be done better seems like a bit of a contradictory statement, so I had to ask because I have an inquiring mind.
> ...


I think if you have thoughts about how you could do better on your own photos, you should post your self critique in your original post, which is very helpful to those who view your thread.

Back light is fine in the first one, and a bit too hot for my liking in the second one.


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## orf (Nov 21, 2017)

smakelijk11 said:


> Do you think the backlighting is working for the portraits?



Can I offer a layman's opinion on this? It's a bit intense in the colour images, competing for attention, particularly in picture 2.


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 21, 2017)

Well the huge problem with me is that I post a photo and I think it's great and sometimes can even get a little bit cocky. I don't want someone to tear me down. But I do want to know where I can improve and what I did right. I will state that I admire classical photography and want to try to get better at that style. I also don't do the self-critique, because I want to see if others will come to the same conclusion. Make sense?


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 21, 2017)

orf said:


> smakelijk11 said:
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> > Do you think the backlighting is working for the portraits?
> ...


Should I tone it down a bit? I mean that is a simple fix in Photoshop.


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## tirediron (Nov 21, 2017)

Things that strike me:  Background highlights are too hot by at least a full stop, try and keep the figers together; hand positioning is fine (IMO), but keep the fingers together and generally pointed up (as in #1) or down (#2), rather than right at the viewer.  #2 is a bit too much of a 'football shoulders' pose for; 20 degrees to one side or the other would be better.  #3 is very nice; lovely lighting, BUT the background really hurts it (IMO).


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## DanOstergren (Nov 21, 2017)

smakelijk11 said:


> Well the huge problem with me is that I post a photo and I think it's great and sometimes can even get a little bit cocky. I don't want someone to tear me down. But I do want to know where I can improve and what I did right. I will state that I admire classical photography and want to try to get better at that style. I also don't do the self-critique, because I want to see if others will come to the same conclusion. Make sense?


I think you could give self critique a try.


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## orf (Nov 21, 2017)

smakelijk11 said:


> orf said:
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Burn it or use a multiply with a mask? That might then make the shadows too dark (competing with her clothing). Hard to tell if it's worth it.


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 21, 2017)

tirediron said:


> Things that strike me:  Background highlights are too hot by at least a full stop, try and keep the figers together; hand positioning is fine (IMO), but keep the fingers together and generally pointed up (as in #1) or down (#2), rather than right at the viewer.  #2 is a bit too much of a 'football shoulders' pose for; 20 degrees to one side or the other would be better.  #3 is very nice; lovely lighting, BUT the background really hurts it (IMO).


Thank you! What is it about number 3 that hurts the background? It's a pretty shallow depth of field? Is it the ugly object in the top?


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## tirediron (Nov 21, 2017)

smakelijk11 said:


> What is it about number 3 that hurts the background?


The distinct linear elements "growing" out of her head.


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 21, 2017)

Any better?


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## jaomul (Nov 22, 2017)

DanOstergren said:


> jaomul said:
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Are these your best photos?


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## smakelijk11 (Nov 22, 2017)

I wouldn't say so. But they are three of my favourites from the session.


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## jaomul (Nov 22, 2017)

smakelijk11 said:


> I wouldn't say so. But they are three of my favourites from the session.



Sorry OP, this question was not directed at you, it was directed at the person I quoted who gave me a he finger with an amusing gif on an earlier link


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## DanOstergren (Nov 22, 2017)

jaomul said:


> DanOstergren said:
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Indeed they are. [emoji8]


Sent from my iPhone using ThePhotoForum.com mobile app


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## AlanKlein (Nov 23, 2017)

I'm not an expert but will mention a couple of things. First, she's a pretty model, better if she's a friend as well.  The backgrounds are too busy and draw my eye away from the model.  The "Z" and the crooked vertical lines detract in the first shot.  The sweaters in the first two are too busy as well.  They also draw my eye away from the girl's face. The side BW portrait seems to be funny in that her nose runs with her right cheek and makes her face look slightly distorted.   Also, she's looking out of the picture frame.  More space on the left and less on the right would balance it better.  You've made her hair the subject.  Her hair in the back of her head looks unkempt.  It detracts from her prettiness.   The second picture seems too bright burning out her face.  Why do you have her on the left side of the picture?  There's nothing on the right that adds anything.  Hope I helped.


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