# How can I get more clients??



## lauraceja (Aug 19, 2014)

I'd like to think my website, photography, skills are pretty good (PLEASE critique my photos!). I have a decent online website with a good amount of photos, and I was getting inquiries about 3 times a week, and followed up with my price list and everything (since I'm new, I don't charge more than $120 for an hour, unless it's a wedding) and they receive digital format prints, all edited and displayed in their own private online album. Even though I tell all prospective clients this and more, no one seems to want to meet with me to talk more, or let alone book a date for a session. 

Help me please, and feel free to critique me in every way possible.



 :???:

Here's my website Laura Ceja


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## astroNikon (Aug 19, 2014)

I'm no pro, but 2, 3 & 4 are over exposed and it washes out the colors
for example: Her black dress in 2 isn't so black
and I think 3 would have been better as a portrait and not chopping off her lower legs.
but the pros will respond with better and more detailed C&C


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## sm4him (Aug 19, 2014)

Okay, I'll bite.

First, a positive:
I actually quite like your website. It's clean and neat, the pictures load quickly, the fonts are professional looking--very nice.
However: If what you are trying to accomplish with the website is to get clients for portrait work, then I'd lose all the non-portrait photos you have on the website, especially the ones that rotate on the home page. They do absolutely nothing to sell a potential client on your portraiture skills.
The other thing that really stood out to me is that your website does not state where you are. Yes, the "about me" section references the University of California, but a potential client wouldn't know if you are still in California or not. 

As to the rest: That's a LOT of material to cover, but here's just a couple of quick thoughts.
1. Your photos are decent. Not stellar, imo, but okay. But if you want to do this as a profession, you need more than decent. You need to stand out. You need to be able to demonstrate to a client why YOU would be better than any other Craigslist photog they could hire for $50. I do see some issues with some of your photos--some badly slanting horizons, some focus issues, some harsh light and shadows, some posing awkwardness. 

Okay, so. How do you get more clients? Well, first let me say, I'm not in business as a portrait photographer and really don't want to be. In fact, I have somewhat the opposite issue--how do I get people to QUIT trying to get me to do portrait work for them? 
But, I will say this--if you are getting queries from your website, and not a SINGLE one of them are booking you, you definitely have a problem.
Are you following up with them? Are you just emailing them and then leaving it at that? If I wanted business, I'd make phone calls, REAL contacts--I wouldn't make it so simple for someone to not at least give me a chance.  Are you setting up client meetings? Reaching out in any way beyond that initial email to "hook" them?
What is your marketing plan, beyond just having a website and hoping people will find it and send you a query?  The nicest website in the world will not get you enough clients to make a living, unless you are doing something else to drive traffic to the website, and marketing yourself in other ways as well. 
Are you doing mostly engagement shoots? Maternity? High School seniors? Weddings? Families? What are you doing to get the word out to those specific target markets?  
A successful photography business is more about successful marketing and business skills than anything else.

Speaking of business, how did you arrive at charging $120? Do you actually KNOW your CODB (cost of doing business)?
One thing I do feel strongly about--do NOT charge an amount simply based on what you feel your "experience level" is or you will forever mire yourself in that price-range. Charge what you need to charge to make a living. If your photos aren't "good enough" to warrant that, then perhaps you should keep working on your skills instead of starting a business.

Personal opinion here certainly, but to me, $120 for an hour seems problematic.  Why? Well, at least around here, I can almost certainly find a photographer on Craigslist to do a shoot for $50-75 and give me all the files on a CD.  
On the other extreme, I can pay some a LOT more than that and get a true professional photographer. They will deliver fewer photos and charge a lot more, but they will be high quality, I'll get prints that I'd proudly hang on my wall, and they will be confident about how to pose, compose and get the absolute best shots possible.
Now, let's say I'm either cheap or broke and decide I can't "afford" that great, professional photographer. 
So, I start looking at the "cheap" photographers, hoping to find someone who will deliver the same stellar quality for next to nothing.  WHAT makes YOU--at $120--stand out to me from someone I can hire for $50, or $75?  
My point is this: If I'm just looking to save a buck and hire someone on the cheap, I'm going to go with the REALLY cheap folks.  If I'm interested in real quality and professionalism, I'm going to hire the people who charge considerably more but can be relied on to get the job done.


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## keyseddie (Aug 19, 2014)

sm4him said:


> I can pay some a LOT more than that and get a true professional photographer. They will deliver fewer photos and charge a lot more, but they will be high quality, I'll get prints that I'd proudly hang on my wall, and they will be confident about how to pose, compose and get the absolute best shots possible.


To me, the key word is professional. It takes more than a watermark. Your images show no knowledge of posing, correct exposure, or ability to uses existing light or introduce effective artificial light. Learn those things first.


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## astroNikon (Aug 19, 2014)

I'll agree with sm4him to about your website.  
If you are going to be a people (weddings, portraits and families) photographer then dump all the flower pictures which just look like an exercise in wide open apertures, and show weddings, portraits and families.

also .. no one knows where you are located.  You can guess "santa cruz" if you read everything. but maybe list where you go for photography sessions - how far south, north, east (list counties or major cities), or if they have to come to your studio.


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## Braineack (Aug 19, 2014)

Adler had a pretty good webinar with tips on marketing yourself last CreativeLive:  https://www.creativelive.com/courses/new-media-and-social-networking-lindsay-adler

there are so many free ways to promote yourself to hundreds/thousands of potential clients nowadays youre doing yourself a disservice if you're missing the opportunities.  A website alone is not enough.


 I would also dump your entire "Details" gallery unless they are shots from sessions/weddings that showcased your work.

I'd trim your "Portraits" gallery down to 5 shots, because that's how many different models you've used.  If not, trim out all the sub-par ones--there are a few I see that wouldn't want online.


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## KmH (Aug 19, 2014)

Craigslist photographers that shoot for $50 - $75 and deliver all the images on a disc aren't actually making any money.

I noticed that your domain name does not include any indication you do photography. IMO, that is a big mistake.

Marketing and promoting your business should be taking up about 75% of your time.
Do you have any salesmanship or business marhketing, management experience or training?

You can't let your blog sit there "Under Renovation" since May 1, 2013. You need to get some content in there and you need to add new content at minimum of 3 times a week.

How many hits a day is your web site getting? How does that compare to the number of inquiries you get?
What is your web site bounce rate?

You need a business presence on Flickr, YouTube, Twitter, Tumblr, and Facebook.
You need to be continually adding new content to those sites as a way to drive traffic to your website.

Learn about SEO - Search Engine Optimization - or hire someone who already knows how to leverage SEO.

It takes a lot of hard work and a lot of hours to get a business started. Once started the need for heard work and lots of hours doesn't slack off.
To be a full time business and earn a minimal salary you need 10-12 shoots per week with an average sale of about $400 per shoot. 

A well run full time retail photography business can earn income at a rate of 25% of revenue.

If you want a gross (before taxes) salary of $30,000 a year this is the basic math:
$30,000 salary / 25% = $120,000 a year in gross revenue your business needs to break even.
That's $10,000 a month - average - of revenue, but photography is seasonal and you're likely to only be shooting 42-45 weeks or so a year.

More basic math:
45 weeks x 10-12 shoots per week = 450 - 540 shoots per year.


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 19, 2014)

astroNikon said:


> I'll agree with sm4him to about your website.
> If you are going to be a people (weddings, portraits and families) photographer then dump all the flower pictures which just look like an exercise in wide open apertures, and show weddings, portraits and families.
> 
> also .. no one knows where you are located.  You can guess "santa cruz" if you read everything. but maybe list where you go for photography sessions - how far south, north, east (list counties or major cities), or if they have to come to your studio.



Along with the addition you have made in concerns to this I would consider adding your location or state/area you do work in to your contact section as many potential clients will not read your entire about me, they may just be there to look at the pictures.


Another thing you want to be doing is making a lot of connections in the photography industry, these friends and acquaintances will help introduce you to clients who may be in need of a service they themselves cannot or do not feel like providing.


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## Derrel (Aug 19, 2014)

keyseddie said:


> sm4him said:
> 
> 
> > I can pay some a LOT more than that and get a true professional photographer. They will deliver fewer photos and charge a lot more, but they will be high quality, I'll get prints that I'd proudly hang on my wall, and they will be confident about how to pose, compose and get the absolute best shots possible.
> ...



Laura, Your photos are just not 'professional' in appearance. Today, young people, like the young women shown in your web gallery, have high-quality cameras in high-end smart phones, and they can take all the selfies and family snaps they want, at any time. Your photos need to differentiate your work from what can be done with a high-quality modern cell phone camera. Young single females, as shown, are LOUSY clients for professional photo services, until they have a BABY. New babies sell TONS of new cars, strollers, clothes, cameras, security systems, life insurance, and professional photo sessions. Not kidding.


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## HikinMike (Aug 20, 2014)

For one thing, your website is not very SEO-friendly. Nobody is going to search for your name. You REALLY need to read my SEO for the Photographer link in my sig below.


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## lauraceja (Aug 20, 2014)

Thank you a lot for the suggestions! I've been having a lot of trouble getting the color on my photos to align with the way they look on my macbook and in photoshop. When I open my website on my iPhone or iPad the colors are significantly washed out. Even when I posted them here, the saturation significantly decreased in comparison to my original photos.


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## astroNikon (Aug 20, 2014)

Have to use an external colorsync'd monitor for post processing work.

For my laptop I have to be at exactly perpendicular to the screen for things to be "normal"
If my eyes are not then colors, exposure etc go off.
There's threads here about it .. I'll find some

here's one .. ---> http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/beyond-basics/362226-capturing-correct-colors.html

MacBook Pro --> http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/digital-discussion-q/298390-monitor-calibration-macbook-pro.html
--> http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/digital-discussion-q/366300-calibration-tool.html
--> http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/...ng-macbook-pro-s-retina-screen-photoshop.html


there's more if you search calibration


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## vintagesnaps (Aug 20, 2014)

The photos you posted seem like you have good ideas and were able to engage well with your subjects, but the technical aspects seem to be where there's a need for improvement. While you continue to learn and practice you could spend time also on developing business skills as needed. (I've used resources on American Society of Media Photographers or you could try PPA) 

I like the idea of using a window reflection but it seems distracting more than interesting, try changing your vantage point to 'move' the reflection and think about your framing. I'd also make sure your camera is straight especially with lines in the background like the blue wall, and think about the perspective such as in the second one here - the foreground looks straight but the building and windows seem to have a lean to them. Maybe try shots without a subject to get practice in general in framing and thinking about the backgrounds - good choices I think, just a need to double check your framing and notice the details more. 

Seems like you might be more successful in time if you can improve your technical skills so you can provide professional results on a consistent basis. Then you could be able to price competitively instead of underpricing for work that seems to still be in a learning stage.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 20, 2014)

The portraits link never loaded for me at all.
The pictures on the home page look more like 'selfies' than pro portraits.
The About page is totally unprofessional.


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## Derrel (Aug 20, 2014)

lauraceja said:


> Thank you a lot for the suggestions! I've been having a lot of trouble getting the color on my photos to align with the way they look on my macbook and in photoshop. When I open my website on my iPhone or iPad the colors are significantly washed out. Even when I posted them here, the saturation significantly decreased in comparison to my original photos.



Set your camera to capture and tag to sRGB mode. Edit in sRGB. Export in sRGB. Issue mostly contained. Look into an ALL-sRGB workflow, start to finish. Seriously. If you work on the web, and show on the web, and advertise/promote on the web, and have prints made or sell discs with files that will be seen on the web, or printed by customers, you need to get a workflow that is sRGB-centric; that's the way the larger world actually works. Not the rarified air of people who shoot and process four files per day in the world's widest-gamut color space-Wooo-hooo!.

Read this as a start:  sRGB vs. Adobe RGB

Save yourself a TON of headaches, and get your entire workflow and output/display/printing house in order and in accord with what is **expected** at the greatest number of points, across the widest range of devices, across the entire real world.

Make no mistake: you will have forum-based experts telling you that Adobe RGB and wide-gamut this and uber-wide-gamut this is "the way". Uhhhhh...no. That's the way anal-retentive, closed-loop, one-man band type shooters work, and they loooove to tell others how great it is to have those extra colors, you know--for "some day". Always worried about theoretical color spaces and infinite shades of esoteric, peripheral hues, instead of creating images that do not look like crap on everybody else's machines.


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## Browncoat (Aug 20, 2014)

Very impressive (and totally accurate) anti-Adobe RGB rant, Derrel.

*golf clap*


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## The_Traveler (Aug 20, 2014)

Derrel said:


> Make no mistake: you will have forum-based experts telling you that Adobe RGB and wide-gamut this and uber-wide-gamut this is "the way". Uhhhhh...no. That's the way anal-retentive, closed-loop, one-man band type shooters work, and they loooove to tell others how great it is to have those extra colors, you know--for "some day". Always worried about theoretical color spaces and infinite shades of esoteric, peripheral hues, instead of creating images that do not look like crap on everybody else's machines.



And this little extra paragraph, unnecessary except to vent some spleen, to discount other people's opinion.


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## chuasam (Aug 21, 2014)

Derrel is actually right here 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 21, 2014)

He is 100% correct about images intended for web display only. As I shoot for print I am more than inclined to disagree. But since this thread is about web-display images only I will keep my thoughts to myself so as to not confuse anyone.


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## CameraClicker (Aug 21, 2014)

Derrel said:


> lauraceja said:
> 
> 
> > Thank you a lot for the suggestions! I've been having a lot of trouble getting the color on my photos to align with the way they look on my macbook and in photoshop. When I open my website on my iPhone or iPad the colors are significantly washed out. Even when I posted them here, the saturation significantly decreased in comparison to my original photos.
> ...



Well, the Canon manuals say you should set the camera to sRGB unless you have a specific reason to set Adobe RGB.  But, the Epson folks say you should shoot to raw files, convert to the Prophoto colour space (larger than Adobe RGB) and once you are happy with your editing, you should boost mid-tone contrast and send the result to their printer, since it can handle the bigger space.  If you are using a custom lab for printing, instead of Walmart, ask what they want you to provide.  The majority of devices may only handle sRGB properly today, as time passes more devices are handling other colour spaces properly.  Photoshop can be set up so one or two clicks does a final flatten of layers, final sharpening, conversion to the desired colour space, conversion to 8 bits, and saves the result in a folder where you can find it when you upload to the web.  It's not really much slower to work with raw files, large colour spaces and 16 bit files.  I do it because I like the results better.

This was a super brief summary.  A professional should have at least a passing understanding of colour spaces.

What you don't know won't help you, either.


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## KmH (Aug 21, 2014)

CameraClicker said:


> A professional should have at least a passing understanding of colour spaces.


And at least a passing understanding of the overall topic of color management.

Tutorials on Color Management & Printing


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 21, 2014)

KmH said:


> CameraClicker said:
> 
> 
> > A professional should have at least a passing understanding of colour spaces.
> ...



As well as a passing understanding of when and where to use these systems and methods most effectively.

Color Systems and Spaces


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## Derrel (Aug 21, 2014)

The_Traveler said:


> Derrel said:
> 
> 
> > Make no mistake: you will have forum-based experts telling you that Adobe RGB and wide-gamut this and uber-wide-gamut this is "the way". Uhhhhh...no. That's the way anal-retentive, closed-loop, one-man band type shooters work, and they loooove to tell others how great it is to have those extra colors, you know--for "some day". Always worried about theoretical color spaces and infinite shades of esoteric, peripheral hues, instead of creating images that do not look like crap on everybody else's machines.
> ...



Unnecessary? Spleen? Hardly. I write with passion, Lew. I studied journalism in junior high school, in high school, and at the university level. I studied editorial writing. I wrote many,many published editorials. I'm preparing my readers to confront the prevailing "wisdom" so commonly spewed by the idiotic one-man band forum types who rant up and down about the superiority of wide-gamut color spaces, and who are ignorant of the realities of shooting for a wider audience than one's self. I sell and shoot images that OTHER people have printed. 

The anal-rententive, closed-loop, one-man band type of shooters, you know,"the forum types", the guys who never sell any images, or have any files sent to be printed outside, the guys who keep their work on their own hard drives, plugged into their own computers...those are the types who fill forums across the world, and who rant against sRGB. There's really nothing spleen-like about telling somebody seeking guidance in solving a very common and persistent yet vexing problem that what you are telling them runs strongly counter to "common wisdom" as found all over the internet. it's called writing with passion; it's called writing to make a point; it's called preparing the reader to accept a challenge to preconceived notions. What I did is part of being able to write at a high level--it's the type of technique one learns when one studies writing at one of the finest journalism universities in the USA. It's called writing effectively: it drew you into the fray. It got you off your butt. It caused an emotional reaction. From across the country.

Let me ask: what color space do you work in, Lew? Do you have a recommendation on this subject?


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## tirediron (Aug 21, 2014)

OKAY... 'nuf's enough!!  The OP asked about increasing her client base, NOT for a dissertation on the merits of one colour-space over another.  Please confine all future responses to the actual question, mmmkay?

Thanks!


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## lauraceja (Aug 21, 2014)

Can you elaborate a little more on the "about page"? Do you think it would be better if I had that page as a post on my blog instead? And do something slightly more simple on my webpage?


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## astroNikon (Aug 22, 2014)

lauraceja said:


> Can you elaborate a little more on the "about page"? Do you think it would be better if I had that page as a post on my blog instead? And do something slightly more simple on my webpage?


The first 3-1/2 paragraphs doesn't really do much to sell yourself to anyone, I think it does the opposite.

"yes" that is your life as it is today, but someone who wants a wedding photographer is looking for someone talking about their wedding photography and how they will use their experience to capture the moment and the event, not their life up to becoming a photographer from a hobby.  I want a photographer, not a hobbyist.  your first few paragraphs I get the distinct impression, as you say, this is a hobby.

Talk about your photography and why they should hire you.
and get a better self portrait.

btw, on your blog page about wedding photographers I get the concept that great wedding photographers are easy to find. Truthfully with that gigantic picture of a flower immediately following it that all I read.  Instead, which is alluded too in the 2nd paragraph way down the page after the picture of a flower (?) not of a lady in a wedding dress .... you allude too a wedding photographer takes into account every nuance of a wedding to make sure the images captured are lifetime memories.  And instead of listing what people should look for, why not tell them WHY you are great at wedding photography?

you basically give people a shopping list of what to look for in a wedding photographer, and basically tell them .. now go out and find yourself a wedding photographer.  well, aren't *you* trying to get them to hire you as the wedding photographer ??

If you don't have a pic of someone in a wedding dress, find a friend with a really nice white dress, or someone who already got married, and take some shots.


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 22, 2014)

lauraceja said:


> Can you elaborate a little more on the "about page"? Do you think it would be better if I had that page as a post on my blog instead? And do something slightly more simple on my webpage?



Everything astro said.

Your about me shouldn't be too long winded but if you want to entertain your viewers with some writing do it in a way that will make them want to buy you rather than relate to you. Like you said, thats much better done in a blog

Edit: This is not to say that being relatable is a bad thing. Just that it is better done in conjunction with things like "I take good pictures", "I have experience with photography", and "I won't screw up your wedding"


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## CameraClicker (Aug 22, 2014)

Paragraph 1 says you don't plan ahead and aren't normal.  Paragraph 2 says you were unsure about school.  Paragraph 3 says you had a lot of doubts and photography was a hobby.  Paragraph 4 you use the word "passion", which is the word every mom-with-a-camera uses.  Paragraph 5 is pretty good, until you get to the part about anything you need photographed will be etched in your heart!  The last paragraph is OK.  You should probably re-write the whole thing.  Mention your school, and your degree.  You don't need to say when you went to school.  Say where you are located, the city if it is small, or the area of the city if it is very large.  Think about adding a few positive things about your life for human interest.  Have someone write it for you if you are uncomfortable talking about yourself.  It could be written like the Foreword in a book.

Your "Choosing A Great Wedding Photographer" blog reads like it was written by a wedding planner.  The last line just needs to say "We can save you all that work by recommending a great wedding photographer."  Scott Kelby frequently says flowers are naturally beautiful, if you are going to put them in your portfolio the photo has to be awesome.  The photo that you chose for the blog has one of the saddest flower photos I have seen.  The colours are posterized, the flowers are not healthy, the background has blurry dead blooms.  So, where an exceptional wedding photo should be, there is a bad flower photo?  If you are shooting weddings, your page should be limited to weddings, or perhaps also include portraits and baby photos.  The only flowers should be at weddings: background gardens, bouquets, boutineers and table centre pieces.

Customers cover the spectrum from wanting the least expensive photos possible to asking for very expensive photos.  They also cover the spectrum from not having any idea what a good photo looks like, to being quite discerning.  Those spectrums don't always align, but usually those willing to pay more are also more discerning.  There are lots of moms with cameras that are doing shoot and burn weddings who advertise very low rates.  Some take terrible photos, some are not so bad.  As the price goes up, so (usually) does experience and quality.  There is a lot of competition at all levels.

Customers don't care how much you have invested, or what your costs are.  Customers are interested in themselves.  What are they going to receive, and how much will it cost them.  If they perceive your fee is in alignment with your quality and your quality is acceptable, you will make the short list.  If your fee is either too high or too low compared to quality, you will be discarded quickly.  If the customer finds a few photographers in their price range with commensurate quality, they will choose the photographer who's photos they like best, or who is charging least, depending on the customer's valuation of wedding photos.  Almost everyone puts their best photos on their web page.  Customers will frequently want to see a couple of complete weddings to make sure you didn't get a couple of lucky shots.

If you are personable, priced for your quality and presenting reasonable quality, you should be able to attract customers.

So, decide what your best photos are.  Run them through post processing again to make them look their best and make sRGB JPEG files to post.  Then, try to look at all the other photographer's pages in your area and figure out where your quality fits in.  Set your pricing accordingly.


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## photog4life (Aug 22, 2014)

Derrel said:


> lauraceja said:
> 
> 
> > Thank you a lot for the suggestions! I've been having a lot of trouble getting the color on my photos to align with the way they look on my macbook and in photoshop. When I open my website on my iPhone or iPad the colors are significantly washed out. Even when I posted them here, the saturation significantly decreased in comparison to my original photos.
> ...


This just solved alot of my problems. I was one of the photographers that fell into this idea of Adobe RGB is the way to go.After producing one image with s-rgb exclusively I realized that the colors are WAY better on other screens such as my tablet. Just wanted to say thanks because you have saved me countless nights trying to figure out how to get colors to match up!


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## pgriz (Aug 22, 2014)

Small businesses do well when they occupy a well-defined niche.  Usually in that niche:
1)  You are heads and shoulders better than the competition,
2)  You have a well-defined client "type" that wants your services and is prepared to pay your price
3)  You have an effective way to reach out to new prospects that meet the "type" you're going for.

So the business lessons are:
 - know who your customer is, what they want, and what they are prepared to pay (also known as "customer profile").
 - know what their hot-buttons are, what they are looking for, and how to get their attention (also known as "buying need" and marketing)
 - know how to convince them you're the one (also known as "selling")
 - know how to deliver on the promises made (production, delivery, collections)

This applies to your web site in that EVERYTHING about that web site needs to address the first three business issues.  Anything that will distract or put doubts in their minds, is a negative.  And you really need to be tracking the number of visits to the site, relative to the number of inquiries you're getting.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 22, 2014)

lauraceja said:


> I'd like to think my website, photography, skills are pretty good (PLEASE critique my photos!).
> Help me please, and* feel free to critique me in every way possible.*



May I edit and repost a couple of your pictures?
(your profile says no editing)


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## Tee (Aug 22, 2014)

Two comments:

1. Find another word for "passion" in your about me.  It's overused and associates with the mom with a camera clique.

2. You have a degree in art with a concentration in photography?  Was the business angle never touched upon?  I truly don't know.  I just can't imagine one getting a concentration in photography and the subject of running a business never coming up, even in casual conversation.  What exactly did the concentration in photography concentrate on?  Did you learn studio lighting, posing, etc?


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 22, 2014)

Tee said:


> Two comments:
> 
> 1. Find another word for "passion" in your about me.  It's overused and associates with the mom with a camera clique.
> 
> 2. You have a degree in art with a concentration in photography?  Was the business angle never touched upon?  I truly don't know.  I just can't imagine one getting a concentration in photography and the subject of running a business never coming up, even in casual conversation.  What exactly did the concentration in photography concentrate on?  Did you learn studio lighting, posing, etc?



Whats everyone's problem with the word passion? I have a deep burning passion for that word!!! 




photog4life said:


> Derrel said:
> 
> 
> > lauraceja said:
> ...



I'm not gunna go too deep into  this but just know that if you ever produce images for high quality  printing you will want to re-process them in Adobe-RGB, sRGB is most  definatly the best way to process for web and digital display but for  Prints on quality printers adobe will give you much more variation and  quality in color.

I recommend processing everything in sRBG so  you can display to the web and then saving the lightroom edits and  photoshop layers to reuse if you ever decide to print your images using a  larger color space.


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## lauraceja (Aug 23, 2014)

Yeah, Lew! Please go ahead and edit some of them. I recently purchased a few Kubota actions and Totally Rad Lightroom presets as well, so maybe that'll help me a little more. Also, I moved my old "about me" to the blog area of my website because it's not as professional as I would like, and wrote a condensed version in its place. Also, the sRGB comment really helped me! I'm editing my photos over again (they are RAW), and making sure that they are edited in sRGB to keep the colors as consistent as possible. Also, my goal is to become a wedding and portrait photographer, but am willing to take photos of anything right now as I get started. Should I not even bother taking family photos or newborn--since that's not what I want to be considered as.


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 23, 2014)

If its not what you want to do than definitely don't include it. If you don't mind doing it but would rather not publicize yourself as a family portrait photographer than you can let potential clients know in other ways, like through word of mouth. (ask other clients if they have friends or family who would like portraits done)


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## unpopular (Aug 23, 2014)

> Make no mistake: you will have forum-based experts telling you that Adobe RGB and wide-gamut this and uber-wide-gamut this is "the way". Uhhhhh...no. That's the way anal-retentive, closed-loop, one-man band type shooters work, and they loooove to tell others how great it is to have those extra colors, you know--for "some day". Always worried about theoretical color spaces and infinite shades of esoteric, peripheral hues, instead of creating images that do not look like crap on everybody else's machines.



This is a bit like saying shoot jpeg because learning raw processing is just too hard.

Here is a better idea, learn color management and make an informed decision about what color workflow is better suited.


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## Derrel (Aug 23, 2014)

unpopular said:


> > Make no mistake: you will have forum-based experts telling you that Adobe RGB and wide-gamut this and uber-wide-gamut this is "the way". Uhhhhh...no. That's the way anal-retentive, closed-loop, one-man band type shooters work, and they loooove to tell others how great it is to have those extra colors, you know--for "some day". Always worried about theoretical color spaces and infinite shades of esoteric, peripheral hues, instead of creating images that do not look like crap on everybody else's machines.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That way your work can look like crap when OTHER people view it and print it! Again, the one-man-band guys are weighing in here...when you shoot for a WIDE audience, you need to go to what most machines, most browsers, and most printing out places are actually expecting. sRGB has become the de facto standard across society. Again, the people who operate in closed-loop conditions are trying to give you bad advice--*exactly as I predicted they would*.


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 23, 2014)

^This threads gunna get shut down if you guys keep arguing about s vs adobe on here. (Lets make a separate thread about it, shall we?)


Edit: I dawgone done it: http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/...rum/367770-srgb-vs-adobe-rgb.html#post3304835


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## robbins.photo (Aug 23, 2014)

Derrel said:


> That way your work can look like crap when OTHER people view it and print it! Again, the one-man-band guys are weighing in here...when you shoot for a WIDE audience, you need to go to what most machines, most browsers, and most printing out places are actually expecting. sRGB has become the de facto standard across society. Again, the people who operate in closed-loop conditions are trying to give you bad advice--*exactly as I predicted they would*.



Oh Pshaw.. this whole internet thing?  Total fad.  It will never catch on.


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## W.Y.Photo (Aug 23, 2014)

http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/...rum/367770-srgb-vs-adobe-rgb.html#post3304835

^ I made a thread for this guys


Lets get back on topic..

Laura, how many clients have you worked with in the past? It would be good for you to keep in touch and direct them to your website so that they may show their friends and families.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 23, 2014)

Come on, Derrel, no one is saying that.
What everyone is saying is that understanding color management is important and knowing that work meant for quick view in browser needs to be in sRGB but a wider spectrum can be useful.
Stop trying to make yourself right only by disparaging other people's opinion.


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## The_Traveler (Aug 23, 2014)

#1 - like the idea but her face is behind the flare

#2 - over-exposed and processed so there is way too much color noise.  She merges with the background and there is just no detail in her face.
     (and is in RGB on the web.)

#3 - overexposed , oof and she is looking down at her feet, but you've cut them off for no reason. When there is lots of space at the sides but you clip the head or the feet, it looks like a framing error.  I understand you want a 'look' but oof isn't always a good look.

#4 way over-exposed, blanched out terribly, in focus but under-processed.
Very flat because she is in the deep shade.
She has skin blemishes and they show.

This can be edited some but her skin is so flat in the shade that the end result isn't great.
Better makeup and better light is needed.


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## Derrel (Aug 23, 2014)

The_Traveler said:


> Come on, Derrel, no one is saying that.
> What everyone is saying is that understanding color management is important and knowing that work meant for quick view in browser needs to be in sRGB but a wider spectrum can be useful.
> Stop trying to make yourself right only by disparaging other people's opinion.



Lara mentioned that she has a real problem with her images on-line looking washed out and, well...sub-par. 

Considering that the MAJORITY of people are viewing on *color-space unaware Windoze browsers*, she NEEDS to get everything into sRGB, so the VAST MAJORITY of clients, and printers, and computers where her work will be shown and viewed looks "right"...maning "as-edited", meaning "as she intended", her work to look. Again...stop being a cantankerous old fart who does not seem to grasp the very fundamental secret to selling images to a mass audience: you need to make *your images look GOOD on OTHER PEOPLES' computers; on OTHER peoples' phones; on OTHER peoples' machine prints. *I have very clearly drawn a distinction between one-man-band, closed-loop image manipulation and selling and shooting for a wide audience.

Why is it sooooo difficult for one man to grasp this fundamental aspect of selling,promoting, and working on the world wide web, with images shown on COLOR-profile-unaware Windows machines, and printed out on Fuji and Noritsu printers which do FABULOUS work from sRGB files?

I am disparaging the opinions of people who have no clue about *how to sell photography to a mass audience, and how to ensure the most-effective presentation of an image across the widest variety of platforms. *I believe I am correct on how to do what it is I am talking about.

Seemingly, you're unfamiliar with selling images to multiple clients, or with how to make a workflow that ensures CONSISTENT image appearance across the widest possible audience on the widest number of displalys and devices. Maybe you have a reading comprehension problem? Or are simply unfamiliar with how people actually view and use photos these days? You can do what you do, if you're a one-man operation with everything optimized for "your" computer and "your" hardware. Lara is experiencing a very common issue, and I've told her how to avoid it, entirely.


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## tirediron (Aug 23, 2014)

tirediron said:


> *OKAY... 'nuf's enough!!  The OP asked about  increasing her client base, NOT for a dissertation on the merits of one  colour-space over another.  Please confine all future responses to the  actual question, mmmkay?
> 
> Thanks!*






Derrel said:


> The_Traveler said:
> 
> 
> > Come on, Derrel, no one is saying that.
> ...



And always I think that I am speaking so clearly...


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