# B & W Conversion



## gw2424 (Dec 26, 2012)

I am having quite a bit of trouble creating a successful black and white conversion.

--Are there any tips and tricks?
--I am editing in Picasa.

Thanks,
Gabe


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## 480sparky (Dec 26, 2012)

We first need to know what is failing.


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## gw2424 (Dec 26, 2012)

I am interested in getting images with greater contrast. (Such as this one: _MG_5040 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!)

This is an image I would like to improve: IMG_9643 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!


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## 480sparky (Dec 26, 2012)

Let's start off by taking a look at what you're working with.  Post what you have now.


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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

First... use Photoshop (or GIMP because it's Free) 

Second, don't "Desaturate", rather "Channel Mix to Monochrome".

This is the digital post processing equivalent of applying filters (say RED #24 or YELLOW #4) to the b&w film.


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## gw2424 (Dec 26, 2012)

I like the image in color a bit more but I would like to see its black and white potential


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## gw2424 (Dec 26, 2012)

I am on Gimp and X11


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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

Download gimp v2.8.2

Gimp -> colors -> components -> channel mixer

[x] monochrome
plus red (152.6), minus green (-7.4) minus blue (-25.2)

Export as JPG.


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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

I didn't do any sharpening or other processing... I figure once you get into gimp, you can start learning all that that too ;-)


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## gw2424 (Dec 26, 2012)

nycphotography said:


> I didn't do any sharpening or other processing... I figure once you get into gimp, you can start learning all that that too ;-)



Sharpening is pretty much self-explanatory :greenpbl:. Those highlights are really harsh!

Thank You


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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

gw2424 said:


> nycphotography said:
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> > I didn't do any sharpening or other processing... I figure once you get into gimp, you can start learning all that that too ;-)
> ...



You said you wanted more contrast... I got you more contrast w/o even touching the contrast sliders ;-)

You can always work in layers...  desaturate the bottom layer, and channel mix the top layer... then transparency erase blown out areas  of the top layer (with a ~25% feathered eraser brush) to restore detail in "blown out" areas.  Then flatten down into a single layer.

(I don't know how to do this in gimp... but that's what I would do in CS3.  I'm assuming you can do this in Gimp in the year 2012.)


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## gw2424 (Dec 26, 2012)

nycphotography said:


> gw2424 said:
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Thanks for the help! Much appreciated.


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## Ysarex (Dec 26, 2012)

gw2424 said:


> I am having quite a bit of trouble creating a successful black and white conversion.
> 
> --Are there any tips and tricks?
> --I am editing in Picasa.
> ...



Don't edit in Picasa. Don't edit anything in Picasa ever.

You mention GIMP further down the thread. GIMP will do the job. When translating color to B&W you want to pay attention to how colors convert to B&W tones. Not only is GIMP's channel mixer a good tool, but you can take the channel mixer far beyond simply a single overall conversion for the entire photo. It's possible to use different channel mixer values for different parts of the photo. Another trick is to actually alter the colors of the original before conversion to then alter the resulting tones. I did that with this example.

Joe


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## gw2424 (Dec 26, 2012)

Ysarex said:


> gw2424 said:
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I really like that conversion! Was that through Gimp?


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## 480sparky (Dec 26, 2012)

To increase contrast, I wouldn't even touch the contrast sliders.  Use the Curves instead.... much more control.


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## Ysarex (Dec 26, 2012)

gw2424 said:


> Ysarex said:
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I used Photoshop as I'm more familiar with it, but GIMP is capable. I used Photoshop's Channel Mixer which is very similar to GIMP's. The idea behind the channel mixer is to control how colors translate into B&W. Your photo is a portrait and that makes the man's face most important. Human skin tones, especially men, are better rendered through the Green channel and so I made that channel dominant. Dark blue translates to black but when seen in color it looks lighter. To avoid his jacket from turning black and blocking up I desaturated and changed it's color before I did the conversion.

When using the channel mixer always watch a histogram of the photo if you can and make sure you aren't clipping highlights or blocking shadows. GIMP unfortunately won't do that. Get the color original into reasonably good tone condition first. If you're going to need extra contrast or some local control don't try and achieve that in the channel mixer, get the tone translation you need and then continue editing. Watch the values in the channel mixer with a goal that all three channel values add together to equal close to 100. Never use a negative value in the channel mixer.

Joe


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## 480sparky (Dec 26, 2012)

Ysarex said:


> ......... always watch a histogram of the photo if you can and make sure you aren't clipping highlights or blocking shadows. GIMP unfortunately won't do that..........
> 
> Joe




Windows > Histogram.  

Walla:  Histogram!


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## Ysarex (Dec 26, 2012)

480sparky said:


> Ysarex said:
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> > ......... always watch a histogram of the photo if you can and make sure you aren't clipping highlights or blocking shadows. GIMP unfortunately won't do that..........
> ...



Yep, but it's not live. It won't show the change until after you've made it, at least not in my version of GIMP.

Joe


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## 480sparky (Dec 26, 2012)

Ysarex said:


> 480sparky said:
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CTRL + Z.


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## Ysarex (Dec 26, 2012)

480sparky said:


> Ysarex said:
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Fair enough.

Joe


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## nathfromslg (Dec 26, 2012)




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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

BTW, just for the record, I could have done a better b&w conversion... I just took 30 seconds to get the OP pointed at the right tools for the job ;-)


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## ianpett (Dec 29, 2012)

Hi Gabe. I see on the original thread you referenced one of my pics on Flickr. That image of the moustached-man was shot in RAW with a 5DMII using the 85mm 1.8 lens, a very very sharp lens for portraits.
Some of the conversions above are very well done. Essentially a GOOD bw conversion starts with a good photo in good light. The focus is a tiny bit off on your pic, but overall is pretty good. For my conversions
I use Lightroom first, then I sometimes make smaller tweaks with SilverFX. Keep practicing - thats all it takes.


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## STIC (Dec 29, 2012)

...


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## gw2424 (Dec 29, 2012)

^^^ I really like how you brought out the details in his face.


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## STIC (Dec 29, 2012)

...


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## tevo (Dec 29, 2012)

Here's my 2 minutes... perhaps the quality would have been better had I used the original image, and not dragged the thumbnail onto the Photoshop icon... 
EDIT: Here's my second whack at it. As Stic pointed out, the last one looked a mess. Keep in mind I am no expert..


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## STIC (Dec 30, 2012)

tevo said:


> Here's my 2 minutes... perhaps the quality would have been better had I used the original image, and not dragged the thumbnail onto the Photoshop icon...



TBH, it's a bit of a mess, and the detail isn't all that good, the white and black levels are blown out but, hey what do i know...at least it doesn't look HDR...


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## debraj (Dec 30, 2012)

It can be done in several ways, in photoshop,in camera, in printing. For me one has to really decide before shooting whether the picture demands B&W treatment or will it be in color. Once decided one can shoot from the camera with its monochrom picture style. In some high end digital slrs they give filter options also and it works great according to subject.


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## thanhbinh1 (Dec 30, 2012)

Use the PTS program is the most convenient. I like it
There are many ways to be one beautiful picture.
Use the keyboard shortcut Ctrl + U or Image -> Adjustments -> Desaturate (shortcut Shift + Ctrl + U)


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## gsgary (Dec 30, 2012)

Very quick edit in CS3


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## tevo (Dec 30, 2012)

STIC said:


> tevo said:
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> > Here's my 2 minutes... perhaps the quality would have been better had I used the original image, and not dragged the thumbnail onto the Photoshop icon...
> ...



Yeah, perhaps I'm a bit used to RAW processing. I tried to bring up the highlights a bit, and sharpen the details in the face, increased local contrast and went for a more Black-and-White than grayscale. In doing so, it looks like a lot of detail was lost in the face. Then again, the original .jpg looked soft to me, so perhaps this was the result of trying to bring detail out of no detail to begin with.


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## tevo (Dec 30, 2012)

Another whack at it..


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