# Questions about turning photography in full-time career



## JH100

Hello,

I really enjoy photography and while I know I have ways to go before I could start a business, I think that it might be something I'd enjoy doing professionally. I have some questions about it, though:

Is it extremely difficult to break into this field? There seem to be a lot more photographers now since DSLRs are really accessible. How difficult is it to maintain a steady income?

About how much equipment is necessary to be well-equipped? Are there any other considerations that I am missing?

Thanks in advance.


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## cmra8407

I have found it that anyone with a DSLR is now a photographer. 

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## Designer

JH100 said:


> Is it extremely difficult to break into this field? There seem to be a lot more photographers now since DSLRs are really accessible.


Apparently it's not difficult at all.  Many people have the price of a DSLR, and have proclaimed themselves "professional" photographers.  They're all over the place.   



JH100 said:


> How difficult is it to maintain a steady income?


That's the hard part, and the part at which many newbies fail.  They fail for a variety of reasons, some of which can be corrected.



JH100 said:


> About how much equipment is necessary to be well-equipped? Are there any other considerations that I am missing?


The equipment that is required will range in scope and cost, depending on what type of photography you specialize in.  

What you (and many others) are missing is that you have to be able to run a small business.  

Besides that, being a good photographer always helps.


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## JH100

JH100 said:


> How difficult is it to maintain a steady income?


That's the hard part, and the part at which many newbies fail.  They fail for a variety of reasons, some of which can be corrected.




> What you (and many others) are missing is that you have to be able to run a small business.



I guess that is what I was looking for...what are the common pitfalls made? To answer the first quoted question, I just need to educate myself on small business ownership?


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## cmra8407

Can you elaborate on the reasons why they fail?

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## FotosbyMike

Not thinking of all the costs involved, camera *bodies, *lenses, strobes(min. of 2-3), stands, backdrops, rentals, insurance, marketing(not Facebook), travel, rentals, taxes, software, PCs, storage/backups...etc.

One of the biggest failing points is thinking a full time pro shots all day, this is a small business first not photography. Must successful photographers shot photos 5-10%, 10-20% editing, and other 60ish% is marketing, answering emails, cold calls, finding clients, reaching, paying bills, cleaning, maintaining equipment(not having a camera body/lens unless you have an extra one), updating website/portfolio.

Good luck.


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## astroNikon

People never seem to totally understand how a business makes money.
but if you simply ask yourself what you currently do to make money?  If you work for someone think of how they make money.  

Do they own/rent a building?  Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
Do they pay utilities? Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
Do they pay any medical insurance stuff? Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
Do they pay for new equipment? Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
Do they pay your a salary?  Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
They pay state and federal taxes ... Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
The pay unemployment taxes .. Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
Do they have a website .. Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.
Do they want any profit?  Then they need to have that cost built into their billables.

All those costs (and profit) are built into how much they charge someone.
If you don't cover all of your expenses, such as doing the Craigslist $99 wedding photographers, then they are normally missing a large part of their expenditures and only charging  a "work fee".

After a while they want a better lens so they start charging more as most of their expenses are compensated by some other job income.

This is the same whether you work for McDonalds, an engineering company, a school, trash hauling business, landscaping, mowing lawns, or any other job you can think of.

But new businesses have to compete against existing businesses.
Photography is one where many people get their first  "real" camera for Christmas.  Are supported by family and friends of how "good" their pictures are on social media and then are urging on to go into business, where they find out people actually critique their work based on quality and consistency and comparatively to other photographers.

One key is knowing what skills you lack and having the resources to improve your abilities.
The better you are, the more you can have a steady income.
The better you are generally the better equipment you have either in the original image or post processing, or both.

Without really specific information about the demographics of your area, your current skill level and equipment, the local competition, etc it's hard to say how hard it is to break into "photography".
Weddings?
Sports?
Business Portraiture?
Family Portraiture?
Fashion?
Do you live near a large cosmopolitan city?  Or the middle of nowhere?  This would help identify how far you have to travel to get into, possibly, high paying jobs.

Then how are you are selling yourself and your skills?
Do you show up in a clunker car and wearing a T-Shirt and talk badly?  Or show up ready to work?

But then most people just jump into it and charge some low flat fee to get their "foot in the door"


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## Designer

JH100 said:


> I guess that is what I was looking for...what are the common pitfalls made? To answer the first quoted question, I just need to educate myself on small business ownership?


Simply put, you have to make a profit.  You need to get a handle on your cost of doing business, including overhead and profit, keep the customers coming in, and the cash flow positive.

Even if you were a prodigy at photography, you would still need to turn a profit or go out of business.


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## theshortwhiteguy

FotosbyMike said:


> Not thinking of all the costs involved, camera *bodies, *lenses, strobes(min. of 2-3), stands, backdrops, rentals, insurance, marketing(not Facebook), travel, rentals, taxes, software, PCs, storage/backups...etc.
> 
> One of the biggest failing points is thinking a full time pro shots all day, this is a small business first not photography. Must successful photographers shot photos 5-10%, 10-20% editing, and other 60ish% is marketing, answering emails, cold calls, finding clients, reaching, paying bills, cleaning, maintaining equipment(not having a camera body/lens unless you have an extra one), updating website/portfolio.
> 
> Good luck.



When I started shooting for pay 30+ years ago, I was taught by an old curmudgeon photog that 90% of what we do is business, 10% might be photography. Was he right! Of course, he followed it with photography is the #2 most failed business in the world. I'm not sure if that last one is correct, but photography has a lot of bad business people, and digital has made it worse.

You can rely on all the Facebook marketing, website traffic stats, tweets, social media interactions, but at the end of the day, if you are not willing to network or even pick up a phone to make a sales pitch, I would consider sticking with your current line of work. It took me a decade or so of part-time shooting for pay after coming out of the one of the top schools in photography - I slogged it out in several different industry's, learning sales and being a business owner. If it weren't for that previous experience, I might not have been able to last these 15+ years as a full time professional photographer.


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## Gary A.

Being a great businessman is more important for your success than being a great photographer.


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## KmH

Yep. Gary A. hit the nail on the head.


cmra8407 said:


> Can you elaborate on the reasons why they fail?


The *#1* reason they fail is that they lack business skills (marketing, salesmanship, accounting, cash flow management, etc) and the business never makes enough money for them to live on, let alone to keep the business open.

Step #1 is to produce a well researched, written business plan. That's how one determines if there is a sufficient market to warrant starting up a new business.
Step #2 is to make sure you have sufficient capital ($$$$$$) to live on the 2 to 5 years it takes before the business makes enough money you can afford to pay yourself a salary or wage.

Historically only 15% (15 out of 100) of all new businesses survive beyond their 2nd year of being in business. Then only 15% of those 15 that do survive - 2.25 out of 15 - survive through their 5th year.
In other words - only 2 out of 100 (2%) are still around at the beginning of year 6.


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## dennybeall

"A BUSINESS PLAN!!!!!!!!"
So many folks think a Business Plan is unnecessary and a waste of time BUT, the Plan *answers all the questions* if done correctly. Some successful people will say they "didn't need no stinkin plan" BUT they did.
If asked, it soon becomes apparent that they knew the questions and the answers to complete the plan - just didn't put it in a formal plan.


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## fmw

Back in the day when I did commercial photography I used to spend a lot of my time making sales calls.  You can't really do that with retail photography so that would mean advertising and marketing.  Nothing would get me involved in retail photography personally.


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## Flash Harry

First off you need money, money to fall back on when the business isn't going great and in photography certain times of the year it flatlines, I found the period between Christmas and Easter the worst time to make a penny which is why I always had a pre-Christmas deal well advertised in local rags plus online marketing, the money coming in from that kept me solvent till the summer weddings spree. Apart from what the above posters mention your ability to comminicate positively with other professionals (businesses) and creative ideas to conjure up work is another must, its no good announcing you're opening up on your local high street then sitting back expecting customers to just start rolling through the door, it won't happen till your 'name' is out there and even then photography is a luxury item which many won't bother with unless its a big family occasion, as for equipment and the ability to use all of it effectively plays a big part, its no good buying lots of stuff you might only use once or twice in a career and so you need also to target your purchasing towards the sector of the market you're hoping to serve. All business is a risk, a business selling 'dreams' needs to be top notch so snappy snaps aint gonna cut it either.


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## Olivia Green

Photography is one of those few professions where you need to work on a lot of things in order to make it a sole source of income. Apart from taking great pictures, you need to know learn how to edit them, start your photography business, work on a portfolio website, optimize it, manage relationships with clients, grow your business and much more.
If you're really passionate about capturing moments and feel this is something you can work on day and night even through ups and down, there's no doubt you should pursue it. Having said that, most people learn everything I stated above through experience and as time comes you will too.
Found a great resource on starting your photography business:
How to Start a Photography Business - 10 Step Handbook
If it makes you happy, its worth taking the risks.


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## chuasam

The cake is a lie
You can have tons of smarts and all that but are you willing to work your arse off for what really amounts to a little more than minimum wage?
I know a ton of photographers but I can count the number of full time photographers I know personally who make more than poverty wages with one hand.


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## Jeff15

Good luck.......


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## Vtec44

chuasam said:


> The cake is a lie
> You can have tons of smarts and all that but are you willing to work your arse off for what really amounts to a little more than minimum wage?
> I know a ton of photographers but I can count the number of full time photographers I know personally who make more than poverty wages with one hand.



<--- full time professional photographer who makes more than poverty wages.


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## chuasam

Vtec44 said:


> chuasam said:
> 
> 
> 
> The cake is a lie
> You can have tons of smarts and all that but are you willing to work your arse off for what really amounts to a little more than minimum wage?
> I know a ton of photographers but I can count the number of full time photographers I know personally who make more than poverty wages with one hand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> <--- full time professional photographer who makes more than poverty wages.
Click to expand...


Take net income before taxes, divide by total number of hours worked (anything photography work related, marketing, editing, everything). 
Is it more than $20/hr?


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## Vtec44

chuasam said:


> Take net income before taxes, divide by total number of hours worked (anything photography work related, marketing, editing, everything).
> Is it more than $20/hr?



I generally don't disclose exactly how much I make because it's impolite to do so, but I'm the primary provider of the my household.  I have 4 kids, 2 mortgages, life insurance, health insurance,  car insurance, 4 college savings, etc.  I live in Southern California which isn't the cheapest place to be.  It's not for everyone, it's not easy, but I'm one of the blessed few who's able to do it.  It will be different for each person, and it's a personal decision. 

A lot of risks and sacrifices but very rewarding.


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## chuasam

Vtec44 said:


> chuasam said:
> 
> 
> 
> Take net income before taxes, divide by total number of hours worked (anything photography work related, marketing, editing, everything).
> Is it more than $20/hr?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I generally don't disclose exactly how much I make because it's impolite to do so, but I'm the primary provider of the my household.  I have 4 kids, 2 mortgages, life insurance, health insurance,  car insurance, 4 college savings, etc.  I live in Southern California which isn't the cheapest place to be.  It's not for everyone, it's not easy, but I'm one of the blessed few who's able to do it.
Click to expand...


Congrats then. 
You’re literally one in a thousand pros. 
I didn’t mean to actually ask for an amount rather than to prove how little the vast majority of photographers end up making.


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## smoke665

From what I've seen of @Vtec44 work I'd say he is representative of what a good businessman in any field should be. He produces a somewhat standardized product of exceptional quality that is marketed to a narrowly defined market demographic. Thanks to his due diligence and experience he's been able to classify the needs, wants, and demands of that market segment. Lessons I practiced in my own business over the years with much success.

I see it around here so often. Typically a stay at home Mom gets a camera as a gift, and the next thing she's taking photos for money. She has no real experience or skill, so she charges $25-$75 for a setting fee, and furnishes a DVD with 30-50 images. She has no expenses really, so if she clears a $100 a week, she's happy. What she does though is makes it nearly impossible for any true professional to make a living if they try to compete in her market, because she's set the bar in the clients mind. 

We had two professional studios in town at one time, super quality work, but the market for their kind of work just isn't here. So my advice is if you do it, make sure you've defined the market you plan on working in, who you're competitors are,  and if you can make a living charging competitive rates.  If not you redefine your market to find a segment that you can survive in, then  you define how you can differentiate yourself from your competitors.


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## Vtec44

chuasam said:


> Congrats then.
> You’re literally one in a thousand pros.
> I didn’t mean to actually ask for an amount rather than to prove how little the vast majority of photographers end up making.



It's true that the majority of photographers are not full time because it's hard to make a living with photography.  I think it's common in the creative field, ie actors, web designers, etc.  Most people ask me what is my real job since being a full time photographer is not a common thing.  It's a great conversation topic and a great way to meet women (if you're still single  ) .


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## Gary A.

<---- A former full time pro who made much more than poverty wages.


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## chuasam

Gary A. said:


> <---- A former full time pro who made much more than poverty wages.



Back when newspapers existed


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## Gary A.

chuasam said:


> Gary A. said:
> 
> 
> 
> <---- A former full time pro who made much more than poverty wages.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Back when newspapers existed
Click to expand...

I continue to run into full time staff photographers for the various newspapers in California.


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## Vtec44

smoke665 said:


> From what I've seen of @Vtec44 work I'd say he is representative of what a good businessman in any field should be. He produces a somewhat standardized product of exceptional quality that is marketed to a narrowly defined market demographic. Thanks to his due diligence and experience he's been able to classify the needs, wants, and demands of that market segment. Lessons I practiced in my own business over the years with much success.
> 
> I see it around here so often. Typically a stay at home Mom gets a camera as a gift, and the next thing she's taking photos for money. She has no real experience or skill, so she charges $25-$75 for a setting fee, and furnishes a DVD with 30-50 images. She has no expenses really, so if she clears a $100 a week, she's happy. What she does though is makes it nearly impossible for any true professional to make a living if they try to compete in her market, because she's set the bar in the clients mind.
> 
> We had two professional studios in town at one time, super quality work, but the market for their kind of work just isn't here. So my advice is if you do it, make sure you've defined the market you plan on working in, who you're competitors are,  and if you can make a living charging competitive rates.  If not you redefine your market to find a segment that you can survive in, then  you define how you can differentiate yourself from your competitors.



Amen to this.  The challenge is always differentiate yourself to stand out.  Lucky for me I have a decent amount of Instagram following so that helps a bit.


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## smoke665

Vtec44 said:


> The challenge is always differentiate yourself to stand out



I always found it harder to say no to business that didn't fit my marketing profile. It goes against the entrepreneurial spirit.


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