# Sumpin' I Cain't Figger Out...



## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

There's something going on that I can't seem to figure out.

Not long after I signed up here, I started to dabble with HDR stuff. In my view, that's all I still do with it. It's fun and it's different, but it's also kinda' goofy. I've always considered it the new "selective coloring". More than one friend has implored me to stop posting HDR stuff on my Facebook page because it shows that I'm not a "serious" photographer. Well, I am, actually. I'm just not serious about HDR.

But here's the thing: Of the last ten prints I've sold, seven of them have been HDR. I have a few more people now deciding which prints they want, but _all _are considering HDR prints.

What am I missing?

It's not like I'm being contracted to shoot HDR for anyone. I shoot when I travel, edit the photos and then post them to Facebook. Some are HDR, most are not. Then I get a message that says "Hey, Steve, can I buy a print of some umptyscratch photo that you took?" Hell, I don't see them as being anything special but, then again, I'm not the person buying it.

SO when they ask about purchasing, of course I say "Yes", and a check shows up.

Honest to God, man, I look at HDR as a goof. Well, at least I did. It's actually making me a little bit of coin on the side now, and I just didn't think that would happen. As it is, though, I'm gonna' ride this train 'til the tracks run out, and then I'll figure out something else, I guess...


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## Derrel (Dec 26, 2012)

Most Popular TV Shows | TVGuide.com

The Most Popular Fast Food Restaurants In America - Business Insider

Top 500 Posters and Prints - Bestselling Wall Art to Buy Online from PopArtUK

"No one ever went broke underestimating the taste of the American public." H.L. Mencken.

Just sayin'...popular taste is pretty *lowest common denominator*...


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## Buckster (Dec 26, 2012)

^What Derrel said.  I'm still scratching my head over disco...


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## BrianV (Dec 26, 2012)

You mean you're not focus-stacking your HDR images!

Ahh, ahh, ahh, ahh, Staying Alive, Staying alive...


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## jake337 (Dec 26, 2012)

HDR is still a tool, not a style.  But anyways.....

Is the stuff your selling the over saturated, overcooked variety?

This is the kind of HDR's that I like.  Specifically the last image of "Pano of Paris left bank".  I'm not sure how many of the other photos on his site use HDR as a tool.

Recent Additions and news - Photography by Cem Usakligil


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 26, 2012)

The general public is stupid. And fickle.

I know this because Jersey Shore, Ke$ha, Nicki Minaj and Twilight movies are all "popular". :er:

'grats on making some coin off your snapshots!


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## thetrue (Dec 26, 2012)

jamesbjenkins said:


> The general public is stupid. And fickle.
> 
> I know this because Jersey Shore, Ke$ha, Nicki Minaj and Twilight movies are all "popular". :er:
> 
> 'grats on making some coin off your snapshots!


I literally LOL'd whe I read this.


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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

To me... HDR is in many ways more accurate than we give it credit for.  Our eye can see into the shadows and pick details out of the hightlights.. it's our cameras, our film, and our prints that have proven inadequate to the task.

Now our digital cameras and our film (RAW files) have the ability to "see" better than ever before.  And HDR lets you, as a photographer, as an artist, when "printing" your "film", pick out and preserve that broad range of that was present in the scene when you were there to see it.

I have an image of a box car that I shot where I underexposed by 3to 5 stops to force a moody sky, then farted around with a car battery, an inverter, a studio flash, and a 20 ft sync cord in order to get some kind of a foreground rather than a silhouette.  I think it's one of my better images.  But today, shooting RAW and using either layers in Photoshop and multiple exposures from the raw, or using HDR, I could probably get BETTER results with less farting around with heavy, expensive, pain in the ass equipment.

Yes, HDR can be also used for lots of horrid crap.  But here's the funny thing... it turns out that I like some of that horrid crap better than the non horrid crap versions of the same images.  And that part I can't explain away.


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## pic_chick (Dec 26, 2012)

You don't have to like to sale it. I don't understand why to be a pro you have to cut yourself of from some tools. doing Hdr make you no less a pro but I would say selling more photos might make you more a pro. The idea that this is or is not pro is kinda silly and a tad snobbish.


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## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

jamesbjenkins said:


> 'grats on making some coin off your snapshots!



Well, they're not "snapshots", actually. The non-HDR versions are actually quite nice. It's just that, when I start messin' with the HDR, some people get all gooey inside and decide they need to have one.

It's all good with me; I'm cool selling whatever it is someone wants to buy. I just didn't see it comin'...


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## Mully (Dec 26, 2012)

Funny thing with HDR is that so many good subject images are ruined by it.  Especially the overcooked images that look like a scene from an old video game.  For the buying public it is common for them to want something with vivid color which HDR certainly has.


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## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

pic_chick said:


> You don't have to like to sale it. I don't understand why to be a pro you have to cut yourself of from some tools. doing Hdr make you no less a pro but I would say selling more photos might make you more a pro. The idea that this is or is not pro is kinda silly and a tad snobbish.



Who said anything about cutting myself off from anything?

I think HDR is goofy, especially given how most people (myself included) tend to totally overcook stuff. In my view, as a professional, it looks goofy. It's fun and I like messing around with it; I just never took it seriously. I never said it couldn't be done professionally. In fact, I know people who do it ridiculously well. I just never considered that anyone would want to buy some of the HDR stuff that I've done, that's all. I never considered it because HDR is miles away from being my photographic forte.

If you could point out where I said it can't be professional, I'd love to see it...


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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

So HDR may be goofy.... So is Warhol.  So is Lichtenstein.  So is Dali.  So is Picasso.  So what if it's goofy?

When I put on my crystal ball goggles... What I see is that (the same way they adjust color balance now) "cameras" are going to eventually start doing a lot of what HDR is automatically when rendering RAW to JPG, and at that point they'll just be "pictures".

And the pop art aspect of HDR will eventually just become a genre in which some artists can make a living selling to the masses.  After all, Spencer's will always need posters to sell to pothead teens ;-)


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## pic_chick (Dec 26, 2012)

"More than one friend has implored me to stop posting HDR stuff on my  Facebook page because it shows that I'm not a "serious" photographer.  Well, I am, actually. I'm just not serious about HDR."

Not you but your friends seem to think so.


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## e.rose (Dec 26, 2012)

The only thing you're missing is that some photographers can be increadibly pretentious.

If you like it, do it.
If people wanna buy it, sell it
If you think yours look goofy, work to get better at it.

I don't think there's anything wrong with well done HDR. I haven't seen your work cause I'm on my phone, but my statement stands either way haha.


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## jake337 (Dec 26, 2012)

Links to your HDR goofiness?


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## Derrel (Dec 26, 2012)

Mully said:


> Funny thing with HDR is that so many good subject images are ruined by it.  Especially the overcooked images that look like a scene from an old video game.  For the buying public it is common for them to want something with vivid color which HDR certainly has.



Here is a GREAT selling concept!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOADS of rich, vivid color!!! Millions of copies sold. MILLIONS! It's freaking awesome! And I say that in a non-pretentious, open,accepting way. Well, I gotta run...I need to go get a handful of 99 cent Taco Bell 4th Meal entrees because I'm higher than a kite, and, as we all know, Taco Bell is the shizz-nit!!!! Gotta pick up a 40 ouncer of Colt 45 malt liquor too to wash it all down...the metallic, pre-vomitus-like flavor of Colt 45 malt liquor makes ALL food better!!!!

Dogs Playing Poker Prints at AllPosters.com


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## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

pic_chick said:


> "More than one friend has implored me to stop posting HDR stuff on my  Facebook page because it shows that I'm not a "serious" photographer.  Well, I am, actually. I'm just not serious about HDR."
> 
> Not you but your friends seem to think so.



They don't think it's serious. "Serious" doesn't necessarily equate to "professional", or vice versa...


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## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

jake337 said:


> Links to your HDR goofiness?



Well, here's the last picture I sold. I don't even know why I bothered uploading it. But, I did, and the check got here about a week ago:


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## ronlane (Dec 26, 2012)

Steve,

With today's impulse buying, people will buy anything. (Just check out all the infomercials that are out there.) To me you don't have to understand it, because that would be futile. Just keep dabbling in HDR and making a little money off of it.


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## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

ronlane said:


> Steve,
> 
> With today's impulse buying, people will buy anything. (Just check out all the infomercials that are out there.) To me you don't have to understand it, because that would be futile. Just keep dabbling in HDR and making a little money off of it.



Well, frankly, I don't think my life would be as complete without a set of kitchen knives that can cut through a ten penny nail...


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## nycphotography (Dec 26, 2012)

Well its definitely an overcooked HDR.

But if I had an old hot rod, maybe even the same model as the picure, and I had staked out a man cave that I was allowed to decorate w/ my interests... I can't say I wouldn't buy a print of that to hang there.

To me, taste is not absolute... there's also an element of context.


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## Pallycow (Dec 26, 2012)

People look at it like "art".  They like the vibrant colors and the detail.  They like it BECAUSE it is different.  

Not many have a respect for a well taken photo anymore.  They always want more or different.

One thing I see here, and it's not directed at you steve, is that too many are trying to shoot to impress or be accepted by their community of photogs/and here on tpf, instead of creating images or art they like and enjoy or creating images and art the public might enjoy.

Some of what the public eye would consider some of my best stuff are images I shot, then inverted, and tonemapped the chit out of.  I would assume because it is different...has an artistic spin on an image from a photograph, not just a nice photograph.  These are things I did for fun usually due to boredom...lol. 

anyway, my 2 cents.


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## Derrel (Dec 26, 2012)

Sweet power lines, Steve!!! And that old shed? Sweet!!! There's nothing that says wall decor like an HDR shot of the ass-end of a couple of old, decrepit cars.

Hey, I say, "Just keep cashing the checks!!!" 

Ask not why they want the shot, but rather, ask *how LARGE* the print they want is!!!


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## e.rose (Dec 26, 2012)

Pallycow said:
			
		

> People look at it like "art".  They like the vibrant colors and the detail.  They like it BECAUSE it is different.
> 
> Not many have a respect for a well taken photo anymore.  They always want more or different.
> 
> ...



+1


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## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

Derrel said:


> Sweet power lines, Steve!!! And that old shed? Sweet!!! There's nothing that says wall decor like an HDR shot of the ass-end of a couple of old, decrepit cars.
> 
> Hey, I say, "Just keep cashing the checks!!!"
> 
> Ask not why they want the shot, but rather, ask *how LARGE* the print they want is!!!



I particularly like the gray halo around the roof of the Plymouth...


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 26, 2012)

Steve5D said:


> jamesbjenkins said:
> 
> 
> > 'grats on making some coin off your snapshots!
> ...



Post a couple pictures people have "gotten all gooey" over. I'll be the judge.


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## unpopular (Dec 26, 2012)

HDR doesn't have to be glitzy. The problem is, that most people wouldn't recognize it as HDR if it wasn't. They'd see it as a really well exposed photo!

Last winter Bynx posted some really nice HDRs of some houses, and some of VIP's latest stuff, while clearly HDR, doesn't have the same glittery crap appeal.

A good HDR is just a photograph with high dynamic range. All the crayola processing stuff is just a trend that will pass.


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## fjrabon (Dec 26, 2012)

What I've essentially learned is that when it comes to sporadically selling prints, there is absolutely NO way to know what people will end up buying.  I've sold prints of fairly junky HDR, I've sold moody cityscapes that I would have thought only I would like, I've sold sports images to people who were in no way affiliated with the high school.  It's not ever going to be a whole lot of money (nobody makes much money selling non-contracted prints unless they're famous), but it will occasionally fund an extra speed light, pocket wizard, extra battery or weird prime.  

Sometimes the reason they bought the print is literally because it matched this hideous fuchsia couch they just bought from IKEA.  

Basically, what I'm saying is don't worry why they're buying whatever it is theyre buying, and dont depend on them to be buying the same stuff tomorrow.  Just be happy for the extra play money.


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## amolitor (Dec 26, 2012)

People buying a photographic print are almost always buying a piece of decor. They don't want a visual monologue about man's inhumanity to man, they want something that goes well with their couch. Bright colors lend themselves to that. Punchy images that are clear about the subject work well. Murky, subtle, complex? No. Not interested.

Of course they want the HDRs. And they're right.


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## Steve5D (Dec 26, 2012)

jamesbjenkins said:


> Steve5D said:
> 
> 
> > jamesbjenkins said:
> ...



I'm not asking for critiques or approval of the photos. I'm merely commenting on the amount of HDR prints I'm selling versus non-HDR stuff.

I do think it's interesting that you were comfortable characterizing them as "snapshots" without having seen them, though...


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 28, 2012)

Steve5D said:


> I do think it's interesting that you were comfortable characterizing them as "snapshots" without having seen them, though...



If your car picture posted above is any indication of the rest of them that people are buying... Then yeah, I feel completely comfortable calling them snapshots. Any schmuck with a cameraphone could have taken that picture. And that's not saying you're a poor or even mediocre photog, just that people are drawn to those images based on something other than photographic or artistic quality. They like the bright colors, the sharpness, blah blah.


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## Steve5D (Dec 28, 2012)

jamesbjenkins said:


> Steve5D said:
> 
> 
> > I do think it's interesting that you were comfortable characterizing them as "snapshots" without having seen them, though...
> ...



The issue is that you hadn't seen the photo yet.

See my point? Actually, it probably escapes you.

After all, any schmuck with an internet connection can opine on something he's never seen...


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## Steve5D (Dec 28, 2012)

For those of you who mention the "colors" seen in HDR, what about black & white HDR?

Where would that fit into the mix?


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## Buckster (Dec 28, 2012)

Steve5D said:


> For those of you who mention the "colors" seen in HDR, what about black & white HDR?
> 
> Where would that fit into the mix?


_Any schmuck could make them b&w...  _


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## Steve5D (Dec 28, 2012)

Buckster said:


> Steve5D said:
> 
> 
> > For those of you who mention the "colors" seen in HDR, what about black & white HDR?
> ...



Hehehehe...


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## unpopular (Dec 28, 2012)

I personally feel extreme HDR works better in b/w


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## thetrue (Dec 28, 2012)

What do you mean, sir donkey? Link to an example?


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 28, 2012)

Steve5D said:


> jamesbjenkins said:
> 
> 
> > Steve5D said:
> ...



You act like you've never posted anything here before. Maybe you've never heard the phrase "prior performance is an indication of future performance"...


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## Steve5D (Dec 28, 2012)

Edited.

Some trolls just aren't worthy of a response...


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 28, 2012)

You're not worth the raised blood pressure. Better to block you and carry on. 

Thanks for the infraction point!


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## Steve5D (Dec 28, 2012)

jamesbjenkins said:


> You're not worth the raised blood pressure. Better to block you and carry on.



Buh-bye...



> Thanks for the infraction point!



Don't mention it...


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## dewey (Dec 30, 2012)

This thread reminds me of the "boom roasted" scene from the office.

*Boom roasted.*


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## unpopular (Dec 30, 2012)

jamesbjenkins said:


> Thanks for the infraction point!



They keep score?


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 30, 2012)

unpopular said:


> They keep score?



As Terri was kind enough to point out in her PM to me, yes they do.

Apparently, they don't care for me using foul language to describe the behavior of overly rude and childish people. I was out of line for letting Steve-O get to me and so I got slapped on the wrist. 

Nothing to see here, folks. Carry on...


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## unpopular (Dec 30, 2012)

.. so what's your score? is it one point per infraction, or do some infractions carry larger penalties? How many infraction points do we get before we're banned?

Is there any way I can review my score? Will it affect my ability to join other forums or buy a house? Can I obtain this information from Equifax?


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## thetrue (Dec 30, 2012)

After a certain amount of time, do you lose points? How does it work?


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## The_Traveler (Dec 30, 2012)

I've been to a lot of summer craft shows and what is selling from the booths are these large, hideously over saturated color prints of European cities. Theya re put-your-eyes out color.

My own library has a set of large, huge nature prints where they are so hideously over-saturated all the detail in colors are gone.
The librarians, usually people I respect, like them.


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## unpopular (Dec 30, 2012)

thetrue said:


> After a certain amount of time, do you lose points? How does it work?



I think that after seven years, any infraction is removed from your Report providing that the reporting agency doesn't refile the infraction, but I could be wrong.


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## thetrue (Dec 30, 2012)

unpopular said:


> thetrue said:
> 
> 
> > After a certain amount of time, do you lose points? How does it work?
> ...


THAT is a relief!!!


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## terri (Dec 30, 2012)

> As Terri was kind enough to point out in her PM to me, yes they do.


aww.....*kicks pebble*   :blushing:    Just doin' my job.   




You can't see your infraction points, or read your User Notes.... if there are any.   :twisted:     

  Infractions aren't created equal, some do fall off after awhile, and stick around forever like a stubborn wart.  We aren't here looking for reasons to make trouble for you guys, we just need a history to refer to if behaviors don't improve.   

Abide by the FAQ's and you cannot go wrong!


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## thetrue (Dec 30, 2012)

terri said:


> > As Terri was kind enough to point out in her PM to me, yes they do.
> 
> 
> aww.....*kicks pebble*   :blushing:    Just doin' my job.
> ...


Mmmmmmmmhmmmmmmm. I heard our TPF record is attached to our "permanent record" with the CIA or something, is this true? Do you have access to those government records?


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## nycphotography (Dec 30, 2012)

thetrue said:


> Mmmmmmmmhmmmmmmm. I heard our TPF record is attached to our "permanent record" with the CIA or something, is this true? Do you have access to those government records?



While you were just kidding, I've believed for years that if what you said were true, ie that everything online is done in your own real name, then people would be much better behaved online.


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## thetrue (Dec 30, 2012)

I believe that would be true, for the most part. However, there's a large number of people that do bad online as well as in person so it might not matter as much as you think lol


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## terri (Dec 30, 2012)

thetrue said:


> terri said:
> 
> 
> > > As Terri was kind enough to point out in her PM to me, yes they do.
> ...


:taped sh:


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## nycphotography (Dec 30, 2012)

thetrue said:


> I believe that would be true, for the most part. However, there's a large number of people that do bad online as well as in person so it might not matter as much as you think lol



Perhaps. But the real world seems to be overrun with spineless passive aggressive maggots who smile at your face and talk smack behind your back.

I suspect a large number of them would behave better if the subject of the conversation were always aware of who's saying what.


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 30, 2012)

thetrue said:


> After a certain amount of time, do you lose points? How does it work?



Serious infraction points never expire. It depends on the Mod and the situation whether an action is considered serious or not. 

I have 2 points now that will never expire. I better get behaving better...


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## thetrue (Dec 30, 2012)

How many points warrant expulsion?


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## unpopular (Dec 30, 2012)

I wonder how many points I have. Terri??


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## thetrue (Dec 30, 2012)

unpopular said:


> I wonder how many points I have. Terri??


You just gained another point by asking for proprietary information. Expect your terse PM in the next few minutes. :lmao:


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## unpopular (Dec 30, 2012)

lol. So is that a Level 2 or Level 3 infraction? Pretty sure disagreeing with KMH is a Level 6 infraction ... right Schwetty?


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## thetrue (Dec 30, 2012)

Disagreeing with KmH is instant mandatory minimum 3 month banning, isn't it? I "like" as many of his posts as humanly possible to avoid this


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## Pallycow (Dec 30, 2012)

Can you do something really good to remove a point?  That would be awesome.  I could go to someones ass, then in a new thread be really nice and offset it right?  lol.

check your points at freeTPFscore.com


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## o hey tyler (Dec 30, 2012)

Pallycow said:
			
		

> Can you do something really good to remove a point?  That would be awesome.  I could go to someones ass, then in a new thread be really nice and offset it right?  lol.
> 
> check your points at freeTPFscore.com



Why would you want to go to someone's ass? And would you go by boat or by train?


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## Pallycow (Dec 31, 2012)

o hey tyler said:


> Pallycow said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Sometimes ya just need somethin a lil different.   by train...


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 31, 2012)

terri said:


> You can't see your infraction points



Hate to argue with you, Terri, but yes you can. Under profile on the far right tab, it lists your total points and threads where you received them. I have 2 infraction points that will never expire. I think this is like golf though, where a higher score isn't a good thing.


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## jamesbjenkins (Dec 31, 2012)

thetrue said:


> Disagreeing with KmH is instant mandatory minimum 3 month banning, isn't it? I "like" as many of his posts as humanly possible to avoid this



I literally "lol'd" on this one. Well played.


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