# I heard Canon 50Ds dont work well with a fish eye lens, any truth to this



## RumDaddy (Jun 28, 2009)

Im really wanting one. I had just about made my mind up to get it and while at a wedding the photogrpher told me that 50Ds dont work well with fisheye lenses. He said something about the 50ds sensors.

Anyone heard of this problem?


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## UUilliam (Jun 28, 2009)

simple answer: dont use fisheyes

but i have no clue tbh but dont understand how they wouldnt work...
the sensor should pick the image up just like any other lens
after all the sensor isn't what makes the fisheye effect, it is the way the lens is designed that creates the effect


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## KmH (Jun 28, 2009)

The issue is pretty much with any camera having a APS-C size sensor which means most DSLR's, unless the fisheye lens in question is designed specifically for the smaller APS-C sensor size.

A true fisheye will work best on a full frame sensor.

Make note that a true fisheye lens is a fairly expensive type of lens. A Canon EF 15 mm f/2.8 fisheye is $650.


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## dxqcanada (Jun 28, 2009)

Are you referring to a Fisheye lens designed to mount on the Camera ... or are you talking about those Fisheye lens adapters that mount on the end of a lens (like a filter) ?


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## RumDaddy (Jun 28, 2009)

I would like to buy a sigma fisheye lense, not the mounted kind but a actual lense, if it makes more sense to spend the extra couple 100 bucks to get a canon to feel more secure about the purchase I will.


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## RumDaddy (Jun 28, 2009)

KmH said:


> The issue is pretty much with any camera having a APS-C size sensor which means most DSLR's, unless the fish-eye lens in question is designed specifically for the smaller APS-C sensor size.
> 
> A true fish-eye will work best on a full frame sensor.
> 
> Make note that a true fish-eye lens is a fairly expensive type of lens. A Canon EF 15 mm f/2.8 fisheye is $650.


 

So I have to look into what kind/size APS-C sensor I have on my 50D and get reassurance from whom ever I buy it from is familiar with APS-C Sensors and also that there wont  be any limitations.

Ill probably get it from BnH later this week.

If theres anymore input or info to share from other members here please chime in and thanks to you guys for helping me out.


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## icassell (Jun 28, 2009)

I have seen beautiful fish-eye images taken with a crop-sensor camera.  The problem with fish-eye's, however, is that the images start to get boring if you're not careful.  You might consider renting prior to purchase to make sure you really like it.  I think you would normally get more use out of an ultra wide angle lens (e.g. Sigma 10-20mm or Canon 10-22mm).

Ian


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## KmH (Jun 28, 2009)

RumDaddy said:


> KmH said:
> 
> 
> > The issue is pretty much with any camera having a APS-C size sensor which means most DSLR's, unless the fish-eye lens in question is designed specifically for the smaller APS-C sensor size.
> ...


Your 50D has an APS-C sized sensor. They are virtually all the same size. In Canon cameras the mount to sensor distance is slightly greater than in Nikon's so your 50D has a 1.6 crop factor and Nikon's have a 1.5 crop factor.


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## musicaleCA (Jun 28, 2009)

It's the crop factor that messes with fisheyes. Think about taking a fisheye shot, and then only using the centre portion of the image. It'll probably just look more like a really weirdly distorted shot than a fisheye. In any case, I think Nikon has the best fisheye out there. The images from that 16mm f/2.8 are outstanding for a fisheye.

My opinion, I agree with Ian. Fisheyes are a little bit of a novelty item; a lens for the sake of photographers to geek out about. I also think you'd get more out of a good ultra-wide.


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## RumDaddy (Jun 28, 2009)

Let me try to rephrase the original question. Are their any set backs, or disadvantages to using a fish-eye lens on a 50D compared to a different Canon body?

 Like for instance, I heard,_ "yeah fish-eye lenses are great for creative wedding shots but you dont want to use one on a 50D."_ When it comes to a fish-eye lens on a canon, do you get a better fish-eyed image off a different canon?

Are 50Ds compared to other Canons at some sort of disadvantage in the fishy dept.


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## tsaraleksi (Jun 29, 2009)

There is no disadvantage that is specific to a 50D. My guess is that the person you were talking to didn't know what they were talking about.


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## musicaleCA (Jun 29, 2009)

Or that they were referring to the crop sensor of the 50D; the 5D or 1D would produce more fishy results because they're full frame.


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## inTempus (Jun 29, 2009)

Here's a fish-eye shot taken on Saturday using my 5D Mark II.







If you would have used the same 15mm Canon fish-eye lens on a 50D from the same spot, it would have looked something like this.


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## JerryPH (Jun 29, 2009)

"A 50D doesn't like fisheyes"

*Specifically* which lens was being discussed?  Some fisheyes are good, some are bad.  There are fisheye lenses made for DX and FX lenses.  If you use a Fisheye made for a FX on a DX, it is less "fishy" but still functional.

A DX fisheye on a FX camera depends on the camera, but not optimally.





Click on pic above for little larger pic.  This shot was taken by me at a strobist meet a while back using the Sigma 15mm F/2.8 fisheye on my D700.  Personally, I have nothing against fisheyes, I like them enough that paid for one and it is part of my wedding kit and a lens that I carry with me most all times.  Very fun!





Click on the picture above not to see a larger one, but to go to my flickr set "Montreal, 180 degrees at a time".  A series of 180 degree shots taken with a fisheye of the Old Port of Montreal area.  Check it out and make your own decision if you first like the effect or not.

One thing that I will say... it is very easy to get tired of this effect quickly.  Used sparingly, it is fun.  I do not "de-fish" any of my pictures.  I bought the lens for the vast distortion and leave it in all of my pics that I make with it.  If I wanted an ultra wide shot that is not "fishy", I use the Sigma 10-20mm on DX or the soon coming Nikkor 14-24 on FX.


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## Sachphotography (Jun 29, 2009)

The 50d is an APS-C sensor. I have a fellow photographer that shoot a 40d with this lens and yields some amazing pictures. He shoots weddings and is known in the area for creating quirky artistic pictures with his fish eye. Check it out. It has free shipping from b&H right now to. 

CHEERS

Sigma | 10mm f/2.8 EX DC HSM Fisheye Lens for Can | 477-101

The 50d will do fine with a fish eye that is made for APS-c sensors. I have seen his work and it has the effect you are looking for.


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## Village Idiot (Jul 1, 2009)

Sachphotography said:


> The 50d is an APS-C sensor. I have a fellow photographer that shoot a 40d with this lens and yields some amazing pictures. He shoots weddings and is known in the area for creating quirky artistic pictures with his fish eye. Check it out. It has free shipping from b&H right now to.
> 
> CHEERS
> 
> ...


 
This is the lens you'll want. The Sigma 10mm f/2.8 will be almost identical in field of view on a crop sensor Canon (disregarding the APS-H sensor crops) as the Canon 15mm f/2.8 FE on a full frame Canon. The Sigma is probably your best bet for a fish lens. 

Also, people were telling me constantly that it's a specialy lens and you can over use it. I say bull. If you can pull of the look and the style, you can use it for a lot of things. Fish eye portraiture anyone?


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## inTempus (Jul 1, 2009)

Yeah, I think they're fun.


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## Joves (Jul 1, 2009)

I love mine but, I shoot Nikon and, it was made for DX sensors. All you will lose is field of view and, some curvature from the cropping factor. Unless you get a built for DX lens ofcourse.


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## Sachphotography (Jul 2, 2009)

tharmsen said:


> Yeah, I think they're fun.



HAHA I thought she was smoking a joint at first. LOL  :greenpbl:


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## Sachphotography (Jul 2, 2009)

Village Idiot said:


> Sachphotography said:
> 
> 
> > The 50d is an APS-C sensor. I have a fellow photographer that shoot a 40d with this lens and yields some amazing pictures. He shoots weddings and is known in the area for creating quirky artistic pictures with his fish eye. Check it out. It has free shipping from b&H right now to.
> ...



That specific Sigma lens is made for the smaller APS-C lenses. So no cropping effect with it at all.


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## Village Idiot (Jul 2, 2009)

Sachphotography said:


> Village Idiot said:
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> > Sachphotography said:
> ...


 
But the crop of the APS-C sensor makes the FOV equal to about a 15mm fish on a FF camera, regardless of whether or not the lens was made for a smaller sensor or not. You can't say that Putting a 10mm lens on a crop sensor camera, even though the lense is made for that type of camera, will give you the same FOV as a 10mm lens on a FF camera.


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## Village Idiot (Jul 2, 2009)

Joves said:


> I love mine but, I shoot Nikon and, it was made for DX sensors. All you will lose is field of view and, some curvature from the cropping factor. Unless you get a built for DX lens ofcourse.


 
It's based on the focal length and not what mount it's built for.


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## Joves (Jul 2, 2009)

Village Idiot said:


> Joves said:
> 
> 
> > I love mine but, I shoot Nikon and, it was made for DX sensors. All you will lose is field of view and, some curvature from the cropping factor. Unless you get a built for DX lens ofcourse.
> ...


 No where in my post did I mention mount type. I talk about the leses optimization for the specific sensor. If the lens is FX you do not get the full effect, if the lens is made ofr DX then it is optimized for the crop of the snesor. I have played with both thypes of lenses and, the FX lens loses much of it field of view and, the curved effect on a DX sensor. Any lens made for a cropped sensor will be full field of view and, full curvature.


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## Baaaark (Jul 3, 2009)

Sachphotography said:


> tharmsen said:
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> 
> > Yeah, I think they're fun.
> ...



I thought she had a straw in her nose to snort something... 

Be careful how fishy you go, too.  I know this guy (he was rich) who bought an 8mm fisheye lens without using one first to see what it was like.  He hated it and never used it again.


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## Sachphotography (Jul 3, 2009)

Village Idiot said:


> Sachphotography said:
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> > Village Idiot said:
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WHAT?????? What on earth are you talking about. Manufactures are making lenses now that are made for the smaller sensors. A 10mm lens made for a small sensor gives 10mm. If the lens is made fr that sensor there will be no crop factor. That is why the lenses were made. To eliminate that problem. That 10mm lens is made for APS-C sensors and gives a 10mm FOV. So yes it does matter that the lens was made for the smaller sensor.It is the whole point of getting a lens made for it. It eliminates it.


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## Baaaark (Jul 3, 2009)

Sachphotography said:


> Village Idiot said:
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> > Sachphotography said:
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I think I might be misunderstanding you, but even a new lens built for a crop sensor needs to be multiplied by the crop multiplier in order to tell what the equivalent would be on a full frame.  So even if it is a 100mm made for crop sensor, it would still be like a 160 (Canon) on a full frame camera.  The focal length of the lens will be the same distance in mm on a crop as it would full frame.


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## Moglex (Jul 3, 2009)

Sachphotography said:


> Village Idiot said:
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> > Sachphotography said:
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The underlined sentences are wrong.

The reason for making a lens specifically for a small sensor is that it  is smaller, lighter and usually cheaper.

A 10mm lens for a small sensor still has a focal length of 10mm. If you were to mount it on a full frame camera it would give exactly the same result as a full frame 10mm but with vignetting.

If you mount a full frame 10mm on a small sensor camera the result, in terms of coverage, will be identical to a crop frame 10mm.


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## Sachphotography (Jul 3, 2009)

HMMM... I am confused. I talked to a rep from Sigma, B&H as well as a local shop today. All three told me that lenses designed for smaller senors such as DX and APS-C are made to eliminate the crop factor and give true focal length. The lenses are not made "just to be lighter and cheaper" They Said and I quote" the purpose for making lenses separate from full frame lenses is to help eliminate to cropping or zoom problem known to plague smaller sensors." I have check with three different companies and they all told me the same thing. Why would three completely different people tell me similar responses.  

Is it a conspiracy? 

I mean come on seriously.


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## Moglex (Jul 3, 2009)

Sachphotography said:


> HMMM... I am confused. I talked to a rep from Sigma, B&H as well as a local shop today. All three told me that lenses designed for smaller senors such as DX and APS-C are made to eliminate the crop factor and give true focal length. The lenses are not made "just to be lighter and cheaper" They Said and I quote" the purpose for making lenses separate from full frame lenses is to help eliminate to cropping or zoom problem known to plague smaller sensors." I have check with three different companies and they all told me the same thing. Why would three completely different people tell me similar responses.
> 
> Is it a conspiracy?
> 
> I mean come on seriously.




Well, there is *enormous* confusion being caused by different sensor sizes.

Quite often people say something which is ambiguous and if you interpret it the right way is correct, but if you pick another (perhaps more obvious) interpretation is wrong.

This part of what you quoted: "is to help eliminate [the] cropping or zoom problem known to plague smaller sensors", doesn't really mean anythng.

Cropping and zoom problems do not 'plague' smaller sensors. If you tried to put small sensor designed lenses on full frame cameras they would be 'plagued' by vignetting problems but that is another issue.

The only 'problem' you have when you put a full frame lens on a small sensor camera (apart from the fact that the lens is bigger and heavier than it might be) is that if you look at the marked focal length the resultant 'negative' will cover a different area of the scene than you would expect if you were used to dealing with full frame cameras.

However since with an SLR you compose the picture according to what you see, this isn't really a problem.

The only problem that I can see is if someone who was very used to working with full frame cameras bought a crop frame and assumed that, say, a 20mm lens would have the same effective FOV as it did on his full frame. (e.g. if someone needed to use a very wide angle lens for their particular type of photography wanted to switch from film to digital and bought a crop sensor camera, their current lens would probably no longer be 'wide' enough.)

Providing you don't try and mount a lens designed for a crop frame camera on a full frame one the problem is really limited to one of communication.


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## Sachphotography (Jul 3, 2009)

Im confused then. They each told me that the cropping problem is not an issue with the new lenses as a 20mm dx lens is 20mm.(Nikon respectively)  They were made for the reason of giving true Focal Length to small Sensors. But hey in the end who knows. I guess I don't.
The Main numbers I care about are the F/stop. That is the big one.


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## Moglex (Jul 3, 2009)

I'll leave it to someone else to answer now just in case we're talking at cross purposes and I'm spouting complete rubbish.


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## Sachphotography (Jul 3, 2009)

I am probably the one who is wrong here but IDK. Like I said. I am not really usually worried about focal length numbers. They are just a reference. I frame my shots by what I see.


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## Joves (Jul 3, 2009)

Sachphotography said:


> I am probably the one who is wrong here but IDK. Like I said. I am not really usually worried about focal length numbers. They are just a reference. I frame my shots by what I see.


 If you buy a lens made for a cropped sensor then it is the true focal lenght. So a 10mm is a 10mm. If you buy a Film/Fullframe lens then yo tkae whatever your bodies crop is and, multiply the focal lengthX crop factor= Actual focal lenghth. So a 10.5mm film lens is 15.75mm on a body with a 1.5 crop.


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## Moglex (Jul 4, 2009)

Joves said:


> If you buy a lens made for a cropped sensor then it is the true focal lenght. So a 10mm is a 10mm. If you buy a Film/Fullframe lens then yo tkae whatever your bodies crop is and, multiply the focal lengthX crop factor= Actual focal lenghth. *So a 10.5mm film lens is 15.75mm on a body with a 1.5 crop.*



The underlined sentence is incorrect.

A lens has a focal length (or range of focal lengths) and that that is inherent to the lens. If a lens has a focal length of 20mm it will have that focal length whether on a crop sensor camera, a full frame camera, or sitting in its box!

What you can say is that if yo wanted to get the same field of view with a full frame camera as you do with a crop sensor camera with a 20mm lens mounted, then you would need to use a lens with a focal length of ~32mm.


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