# would you risk...



## mentos_007 (Nov 11, 2005)

dunno if this is the right section for such a things.. but yesterday I was at the photogs meetup, and we had a gues. He is a famous Polish photojurnalist, who had been to Iraq for 5 times during the last 2 years. He talked a lot about how the life of the photog there looks like, about the risk, and everything. and at the end he showed us his pictures from the last trip. They were breathtaking... so would you risk, and if offered a well-payed job as a photog, go to a country "eaten" by a war??


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## LaFoto (Nov 11, 2005)

Some may very well take the risk, as it is their means to make ends meet, but I would be too chicken. Well, I am too little pro, anyway, think: "not at all", I am quite old, I am a mother of two... so that might as well be three good reasons against going to a country that suffers from war.

In 1977, at 17, I thought it pretty harmless to travel to Northern-Ireland ... which made everyone else's hair stand up! Ah well, but I did not go there to take photos (I did take a few, all quite bad, mind) but to see friends, so with them I was well protected. But I am mentioning it to show you that when you are younger and less "settled" and "bound" with kids and so on, you might think about such matters differently.


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## Rob (Nov 11, 2005)

Nope!

I've read loads of books by great journalists, from TV to radio to photography and newspapers. Although their experiences are often breath-taking and the results are unquestionably admirable, especially when bringing news back to the rest of the world, I can't possibly imagine actually doing it.

There's enough uncomfortable nastiness close to home, which would merit photographing and documenting, but I just don't have that pull towards it. Some do, however, and they're good to do it.

That's just me though - plenty of people have that inspiration to go and cover wars, especially when they want to change the world with their images. I don't consider it much of a life though and I can't think of anything more dangerous to do as an occupation! I'm glad there are other people out there doing it though.

Rob


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## ferny (Nov 11, 2005)

If I thought I could take the stress and actually be of any use to anyone, then I would. I've no-one to leave behind if something happens so that's not going to be a worry to me. Chance are though I'd **** myself and want my mummy.


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## Marctwo (Nov 11, 2005)

No... but I wouldn't go chasing celeb's either.  It's just not what I want to take photo's of.


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## airgunr (Nov 11, 2005)

30 years ago I would have.  Young and no attachments and looking for adventure, sure.

Now, married to the most wonderful woman in the world, (for me....) I wouldn't think about it.  Had enough adventures and don't need any more.


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## Verbal (Nov 11, 2005)

Yes, I think I would.  For some reason God forgot to give me fear of violence, even though I myself am a ver peaceful guy... so doing something like that wouldn't really rattle me, it would excite me.  Hah, I'd probably get killed though!  

But chasing celebrities is NOT something I'd ever do.  IMO that's not even art.


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## Corry (Nov 11, 2005)

Verbal said:
			
		

> Yes, I think I would.  For some reason God forgot to give me fear of violence, even though I myself am a ver peaceful guy... so doing something like that wouldn't really rattle me, it would excite me.  Hah, I'd probably get killed though!
> 
> But chasing celebrities is NOT something I'd ever do. * IMO that's not even art*.



It's not. It's "I WANT FAME! I WANT MONEY! I WANT FAME! I WANT MONEY!GREEDY GREEDY GREED GREED!"


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## Unimaxium (Nov 11, 2005)

I hate the idea of celebrity-chasing.

But going to a war zone as a photjournalist I would think of as a really exciting opportunity. I think I'm pretty much on the same page as Verbal. Sure there are risks, but there would be so many incredible opportunities. Travelling and exploring other cultures like this is something I would really like to do, and going somewhere like Iraq would be really exciting IMO.


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## Verbal (Nov 11, 2005)

Unimaxium said:
			
		

> I hate the idea of celebrity-chasing.
> 
> But going to a war zone as a photjournalist I would think of as a really exciting opportunity. I think I'm pretty much on the same page as Verbal. Sure there are risks, but there would be so many incredible opportunities. Travelling and exploring other cultures like this is something I would really like to do, and going somewhere like Iraq would be really exciting IMO.



Road trip? :mrgreen:


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## tmpadmin (Nov 11, 2005)

Family would get in my way, just exclude the fact I would be away from them for too long the possibility I may never come back makes it impossible for me.  I do not know how the troops do it.



On the other hand, I would LOVE to go to third world countries and document some of the villages ways of life.  Maybe help out a little too by delivering clean water to the villages.  As for celebs, I do not even care enough to comment - guess I just did.


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## bace (Nov 11, 2005)

I would totally do it.

I'm young, stupid, and at this point think I'm completely invincible.

And as for chasing celebrities. That's retarded. One day, I'll be getting paid to take pics of celebrities, BY the celebrities...or whatever magazine I work for...or whatever.

Yeah, I'd totally go to a war torn country, but I'd be packin a glock too.

Kill or be killed. BLAP BLAP BLAP BLAP! LICK SHOT PON DE MAN DEM POOP.

IT'S FRIDAY!!!!


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## terri (Nov 11, 2005)

> Kill or be killed. BLAP BLAP BLAP BLAP! LICK SHOT PON DE MAN DEM POOP.


 Stop channeling MD! It's freaking me out.  

I _think_ I would like to try it, only as a test for my nerves and ability to shoot on the fly. The camera, that is. But seeing as how I'm a girly-girl pacifist at heart, I'd likely crumble and wish myself gone with stuff blowing up all around me, and miss the best shots. :x 

I'd sell underwear at Sears before I'd point a camera at a so-called celebrity. (yawn)


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## bace (Nov 11, 2005)

terri said:
			
		

> Stop channeling MD! It's freaking me out.


 
I don't know what you're talking about.


			
				terri said:
			
		

> I'd sell underwear at Sears before I'd point a camera at a so-called celebrity. (yawn)


 
I wouldn't go THAT far. I mean, unless we're talking victoria secret or la senza, specifically for hot chicks, I would not sell underwear.

I think I'd be the guy that just secretly took pics of celebrities. Like with a really good telephone camera or something.


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## Verbal (Nov 11, 2005)

bace said:
			
		

> Yeah, I'd totally go to a war torn country, but I'd be packin a glock too.
> 
> Kill or be killed. BLAP BLAP BLAP BLAP! LICK SHOT PON DE MAN DEM POOP.
> 
> IT'S FRIDAY!!!!




Aww yeah.  I'd personally take an H&K USP .40 tactical though.


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## bace (Nov 11, 2005)

I just called H&K's headquarters.

They were rude.

They can suck on my glok.


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## LittleMan (Nov 11, 2005)

I would definately go to a war torn country... I would do it for free... (if they paid for my flight/stay)
It's my kinda thing...


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## terri (Nov 11, 2005)

> I don't know what you're talking about.


 You sound just like him at times, that's all. You don't know you're doing it, though. 



> I wouldn't go THAT far. I mean, unless we're talking victoria secret or la senza, specifically for hot chicks, I would not sell underwear.


 I would. A typical 9-5 jobbie-job, no pressure. :thumbup: Sounds kinda good after the week I've had!


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## mygrain (Nov 11, 2005)

Verbal said:
			
		

> IMO that's not even art.



Why? I agree it is invasive and at times insane and I would probably be one of the folks who become very aggressive and violent towards them if ever faced with it but it still captures a side of spontaneous life and I'm sure to some paparazzi photogs consider what they do art. Art is relative isn't it? It's what ya make it...at least I think.



			
				core_17 said:
			
		

> It's not. It's "I WANT FAME! I WANT MONEY! I WANT FAME! I WANT MONEY!GREEDY GREEDY GREED GREED!"



And yes they make money but who doesn't when your work is in such high demand. Hell I don't go to work for the fun of it and many many times i do not create art for the fun of it...I do it to survive (aka "payin' the bills").

And back to what The Minty One was talking about...sure, if the opportunity presented itself...there's nothing like watching humans kill each other.


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## bace (Nov 11, 2005)

terri said:
			
		

> You sound just like him at times, that's all. You don't know you're doing it, though.


 
Yes I do. I'm trying my hardest to become the next mod.

Tralalaaa


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## photogoddess (Nov 11, 2005)

bace said:
			
		

> They can suck on my glok.



Nothing but tupperware for target practice.  I'll be bringing my Beretta 40 cal. along with my camera gear. None of that Glock crap for me. :mrgreen:


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## Hertz van Rental (Nov 11, 2005)

bace said:
			
		

> Yes I do. I'm trying my hardest to become the next mod


What's that I hear? Sounds like Hell freezing over


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## bace (Nov 11, 2005)

To be honest I always though Jack Bauer's gun was a glock.

Upon further investigation he carries an H&K.

Damn my assumptions.


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## bace (Nov 11, 2005)

Hertz van Rental said:
			
		

> What's that I hear? Sounds like Hell freezing over


 
Thanks.


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## photo gal (Nov 11, 2005)

I think I would take the risk.  I've always been a risk taker and quite a gypsy too so it's right up my alley!  : )


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## Avis (Nov 11, 2005)

I'd go to a War zone and take pictures on the front line whilst wearing women's underwear if it made me famous and rich.


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## Hertz van Rental (Nov 11, 2005)

bace said:
			
		

> Thanks.


I can never resist a cheap shot  


And Avis has already tried the war photographer in scanties routine. I believe a Sheik bought him for 3 Camels (and they weren't even filter-tipped).


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## danalec99 (Nov 11, 2005)

I would go.


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## mygrain (Nov 11, 2005)

Avis said:
			
		

> I'd go to a War zone and take pictures on the front line whilst wearing women's underwear if it made me famous and rich.



You wouldn't have to go to a war zone to make money if you were to wear women's underwear on public. just drop a hat down and start dancin.


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## photo gal (Nov 11, 2005)

mygrain said:
			
		

> You wouldn't have to go to a war zone to make money if you were to wear women's underwear on public. just drop a hat down and start dancin.



woo hoo I'll second that!!!!   :lmao:


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## Hertz van Rental (Nov 11, 2005)

photo gal said:
			
		

> ... it's right up my alley!  : )


 :shock: ...on second thoughts I won't ask 'what is?


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## photo gal (Nov 11, 2005)

Hertz van Rental said:
			
		

> :shock: ...on second thoughts I won't ask 'what is?



Well, actually nothing, at the present!!!


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## jstuedle (Nov 11, 2005)

I am another who would have gone when younger, before wife and kids and other "responsibilities". The older I get the less things like that excite me. I had planned to go to 'nam when I got out of school, but the war ended about that time. And by then Cathy had other plans for me. Yes, I'm wuped.



> Nothing but tupperware for target practice.  I'll be bringing my Beretta 40 cal. along with my camera gear. None of that Glock crap for me. :mrgreen:



I've always favored my Colt .45 ACP model 70. Good, dependable, accurate if handled properly, and put a sizable leak in your ticker.



> I'd go to a War zone and take pictures on the front line whilst wearing women's underwear if it made me famous and rich.



Money ain't everything. But then again, you could have put on a Wookie suit and made a film and been rich and famous.


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## mentos_007 (Nov 11, 2005)

mygrain said:
			
		

> And back to what The Minty One was talking about...sure, if the opportunity presented itself...there's nothing like watching humans kill each other.



wooohoo I'm The Minty One  hehehe my new nick name


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## photo gal (Nov 11, 2005)

mentos_007 said:
			
		

> wooohoo I'm The Minty One  hehehe my new nick name



I guess you didn't know we've been calling you that behind your back for ages now! :mrgreen:


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## mentos_007 (Nov 11, 2005)

hey.. .so many people who would like to go there... maybe... we will organize the next tpf meet-up in camp babilon or divanija (sp??) ... somewhere there ??  if somebody was so kid and sponsor us, we may even bring him a camel


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## mentos_007 (Nov 11, 2005)

photo gal said:
			
		

> I guess you didn't know we've been calling you that behind your back for ages now! :mrgreen:



great to know that  but it sounds nice  ehhh somebody here used to call me "georgeous" but the Minty One is also very nice  eheheheheheh j/k


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## photo gal (Nov 11, 2005)

mentos_007 said:
			
		

> great to know that  but it sounds nice  ehhh somebody here used to call me "georgeous" but the Minty One is also very nice  eheheheheheh j/k





Well you are GORGEOUS but your nic  is "minty one"!!


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## Hertz van Rental (Nov 11, 2005)

Will you settle for 'the gorgeously minty one'?




Or 'the mintily gorgeous one'?

I think 'the one gorgeous mint' is a bit of a non-starter.


Get your navel pierced so we can call you 'Polo'.


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## photo gal (Nov 11, 2005)

I vote for "the mintily gorgeous one"!!


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## icondigital (Nov 11, 2005)

Verbal said:
			
		

> Aww yeah. I'd personally take an H&K USP .40 tactical though.


huh? thought you said you were a "very peaceful guy"?


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## Alexandra (Nov 11, 2005)

If I knew I would be safe, I'd definitly go. Well, in country eaten by war, as you said, such things aren't granted, so i'd think seriously about it, and then i'd probably go anyway. When I speak of misery and violence, I wanna know what i'm talking about. I want to see new things and not necessarily happy things. I want to have an overall impression of our world, and actually my knowlege extends to a mere supposition of life in Ontario. I would definitly go, to learn something myself, to have something to show to the others so they can feel what I felt and what people over there felt and if all that fails, to at least be able to fully appreciate my own peaceful life. I would definitly go. definitly.
Nice thread minty.


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## JonMikal (Nov 11, 2005)

i would go


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## Unimaxium (Nov 11, 2005)

I've got an idea!
What do you guys say we hold our next TPF meetup in Baghdad?


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## jstuedle (Nov 11, 2005)

Cool! Now where did I put those plane tickets?


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## craig (Nov 12, 2005)

I would go as long as I did not have to fund the trip. Family and my position in life are fully important. I consider it as "all hands on deck". Meaning that if someone needs my photos to help their readers understand what is going on I am there. In a small way I could be helping out. Basically my passion for photography is stronger then my fear of death. I too am missing the fear of death gene or whatever.  

Personally; well... this could go way off topic, so I will keep my trap shut. Generally I feel that I do not have a firm grasp of why people kill people. That is why I would go and possibly be killed.

Somewhere celeb photos were mentioned. These people work hard man. The photos of J Lo looking pissed at the camera do not sell. These photographers have a rapport. In dealing with the the rich and or famous that is a small miracle in it's self. Come to think of it I would rather shoot Baghdad then the Academy Awards.


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

I would like to go to see if we are getting a true picture of what's going on. We see the bad things, the "if it bleeds, it leads" syndrome. A half a million yanks have been there with 2,000 deaths. I don't know how many thousands from the UK and other countries have gone over there, but I would say a substantial number. A lot of that half a million plus have been there 2 and 3 times. 100,000 people were killed in traffic accidents here last year. Surly, something besides killing is going on over there. The death rate in Washington DC is said to be higher than in Iraq.  I would like to witness some of the good things.


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## darin3200 (Nov 12, 2005)

I would go, but what I find interesting if everyone talking about carrying guns. The problem is at what point do you lose your status as a observer and become a participant in the conflict, and as a participant how could you even claim to have objectivity.


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

> I would go, but what I find interesting if everyone talking about carrying guns. The problem is at what point do you lose your status as a observer and become a participant in the conflict, and as a participant how could you even claim to have objectivity.


 
As a PJ, you can only stay objective if you can stay uninvolved. The sad fact EVERY journalist gets involved. You can't tell me that a PJ in a conflict don't choose a side and that choice is reflected in there work. Humans are emotional, and that emotion comes through in all of our work if we are worth a darn. 

As a neutral "observer" you could not carry a weapon. You then become a target. You would most likely be a target anyway in this conflict. P.J.'s used to be considered neutral observers in a conflict and were "protected" by all sides. Now only Al Jezera PJ's are not a target, everyone else is fair game.

I should stop, this is getting close to a "P" word type discussion, and we can't have that.


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## Hertz van Rental (Nov 12, 2005)

Unimaxium said:
			
		

> I've got an idea!
> What do you guys say we hold our next TPF meetup in Baghdad?


At the moment we only have to go to Paris.
Or if you are really brave you could try New Cross...


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

> At the moment we only have to go to Paris.
> Or if you are really brave you could try New Cross...


 
Very true, just pick the conflict of the week. It's what the cable channels do and look at there ratings.


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

icondigital said:
			
		

> huh? thought you said you were a "very peaceful guy"?



I am, but everyone should know how to use guns... and if someone threatens me, my family, my friends, or my country... he'd better watch his friggin' back. :mrgreen:

Also: Colt 1911 .45 would by second choice.  :hail:


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## icondigital (Nov 12, 2005)

Verbal said:
			
		

> I am, but everyone should know how to use guns... and if someone threatens me, my family, my friends, or my country... he'd better watch his friggin' back. :mrgreen:
> 
> Also: Colt 1911 .45 would by second choice. :hail:


got a sig myself!
but i'd watch out as far as shootin people in the back!:smileys:


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## Hertz van Rental (Nov 12, 2005)

Obviously some people can't take a subtle hint.
Do I have to spell it out? Guess I do.
Be very careful where you start to take this conversation - a little thought before posting and choosing to do the right thing will reduce the risk of tears before bedtime.

HvR
Moderator


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## photogoddess (Nov 12, 2005)

I'd probably go but I know that this kind of pj work is really tough in more ways than one. Besides the obvious physical risks, there would be moral issues popping up left and right. I don't know how I would handle watching someone being killed, villages or towns being destroyed while documenting the events. I can see the potential for ending up with long term issues. I do seem to remember that there was a pulitzer prize winning photographer that witnessed and photographed an execution that eventually ended up commiting suicide. Bottom line, I'm sure the job is exciting but it's not without long term risks.


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

Hertz van Rental said:
			
		

> Obviously some people can't take a subtle hint.
> Do I have to spell it out? Guess I do.
> Be very careful where you start to take this conversation - a little thought before posting and choosing to do the right thing will reduce the risk of tears before bedtime.
> 
> ...



I think I'm a dunce... was something in this thread getting out of control or something?  It all seemed peaceful to me so far... =\


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

> I think I'm a dunce... was something in this thread getting out of control or something? It all seemed peaceful to me so far... =\


 
Maybe our friendly mod's way of letting us know we venture too cloce to the dreaded "P" word? Just a thought.


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

jstuedle said:
			
		

> Maybe our friendly mod's way of letting us know we venture too cloce to the dreaded "P" word? Just a thought.



"P" word?  I guess I'm lost.


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

Politics


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

jstuedle said:
			
		

> Politics



OH.  That.  No, that's not what I meant... sorry about that! lol, it doesn't have much to do with politics. =)


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

icondigital said:
			
		

> i think hertz car rental has taken a dislike to me verbal! i guess you arent supposed to make any jokes!



Bah, whatever.  What sig you got? P226 seems most common, but I prefer P228 myself... if I'm going to be using a 9mm, that is.


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

icondigital said:
			
		

> dont really know that much about guns! would have to look at it to see for sure but i believe it's the p228. i keep it at the office. it's never even been shot!



Sad!  You should take it out to a rifle range and have some fun!  Target shooting is a blast! (no pun intended)

My dad was a gunsmith years ago, and owned a gun-repair shop, so I know something of guns.  Him and I have built several together, including a Colt .45 revolver, and a duckfoot pistol (see image... not mine, from google)


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## Hertz van Rental (Nov 12, 2005)

The three topics that get out of hand quickly and cause dissent, argument, bad blood and locked threads are: Politics, Religion and personal weaponry.
Probably because the three are quite closely linked.
This thread originated as a discussion about whether or not you felt you had what it takes to go into a war zone to take pictures - I was merely advising you to keep it on topic.
Seems I'm going to have to keep repeating myself.


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

Jon, I have a revolver in colt .45, it's a S&W model 25-5 .45 long colt. Nice piece. My favorite for the range is the .45 ACP though. A lot of fun, I use to compete in IPSC, many a moon ago. And you all thought photography was an expensive hobby. Being old school, I favored S&W wheel guns and Colt SA automatics. Always wanted a Browning SA 9mm, never got around to finding one to spend money on.


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## icondigital (Nov 12, 2005)

do you think that duckfoot pistol would make you *feel you had what it takes to go into a war zone to take pictures* verbal? 
btw how did you come up with "verbal"?


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## craig (Nov 12, 2005)

I would like to add that personally I can not begin to understand what is going on in Iraq. I know nothing of the religions or waring faction's. I now nothing of war. The closest I ever came was a couple of demonstrations and a near riot. I can not say how I would react. 

I would go in a second to understand the culture. And hopefully help.


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## LaFoto (Nov 12, 2005)

How come no one understands that by displaying what types of weapons you keep at home you DIGRESS from Mentos's topic over and again and again and again? What is this? Mentos was asking you a serious question and you can say, yes, I would love to take the challenge of being a photographer in a troubled or even war-ridden country, or not. Giving reasons or even NOT giving reasons.

Why do you keep telling us what weapons you keep in your home?
I don't want to know!


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

Hertz van Rental said:
			
		

> The three topics that get out of hand quickly and cause dissent, argument, bad blood and locked threads are: Politics, Religion and personal weaponry.
> Probably because the three are quite closely linked.
> This thread originated as a discussion about whether or not you felt you had what it takes to go into a war zone to take pictures - I was merely advising you to keep it on topic.
> Seems I'm going to have to keep repeating myself.



I happen to believe that guns are pieces of art, not just weapons.  =)  But I'll make sure and steer clear from any negative talk about them.



			
				jstuedle said:
			
		

> Jon, I have a revolver in colt .45, it's a S&W model 25-5 .45 long colt. Nice piece. My favorite for the range is the .45 ACP though. A lot of fun, I use to compete in IPSC, many a moon ago. And you all thought photography was an expensive hobby. Being old school, I favored S&W wheel guns and Colt SA automatics. Always wanted a Browning SA 9mm, never got around to finding one to spend money on.



Nice choices!  And I've wanted a Browning for awhile myself.




			
				icondigital said:
			
		

> do you think that duckfoot pistol would make you *feel you had what it takes to go into a war zone to take pictures* verbal?
> btw how did you come up with "verbal"?



Ha!  I'm not ever going to fire that thing if I can help it! lol, it just looks nice hanging on my wall.  

As far as my screen name goes, have you ever seen The Usual Suspects?  It's a Kevin Spacey movie (one of my favorite actors), and it's absolutely fantastic.  I really enjoyed the character Spacey played, and his name was Verbal Kint.  

One funny part... all these suspects are sitting in a jail cell together for the first time.  Verbal Kint is a cripple, really soft-spoken, and hasn't spoken a word yet.  Someone asks him what his name is, and he said Verbal, because he talks a lot.  Those were his first words though, and one guy was like "Yeah, I was just about to tell you to shut up."

Heheh... I just thought that was rather humorous. =P  But I DO talk a lot, so I thought it fitting.


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

LaFoto said:
			
		

> How come no one understands that by displaying what types of weapons you keep at home you DIGRESS from Mentos's topic over and again and again and again? What is this? Mentos was asking you a serious question and you can say, yes, I would love to take the challenge of being a photographer in a troubled or even war-ridden country, or not. Giving reasons or even NOT giving reasons.
> 
> Why do you keep telling us what weapons you keep in your home?
> I don't want to know!



...is it that big of a deal?  I thought we all answered her question... 

Sorry to upset you, I'll cease to post I guess.


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

We did sort of hijack to thread. Corina was just pointing that out. Sorry.


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## Chase (Nov 12, 2005)

We're careful with these topics because we have repeatedly seen them go very bad. Please have enough faith in my moderator team to understand that they are absolutely NOT picking on you, but they are trying to keep an eye on a topic that has a way of getting ugly very very quickly.


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## mygrain (Nov 12, 2005)

Chase said:
			
		

> We're careful with these topics because we have repeatedly seen them go very bad. Please have enough faith in my moderator team to understand that they are absolutely NOT picking on you, but they are trying to keep an eye on a topic that has a way of getting ugly very very quickly.



Holy crap!! Wisdom from above!! :thumbup:


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## Corry (Nov 12, 2005)

Now everyone bow down before the Almighty Chase before he sends his wrath down upon us!!!!! Er...or you can just talk about Mentos' topic!


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## photo gal (Nov 12, 2005)

core_17 said:
			
		

> Now everyone bow down before the Almighty Chase before he sends his wrath down upon us!!!!! Er...or you can just talk about Mentos' topic!




 :hail:  to the Almighty!!!  :hail:


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## mentos_007 (Nov 12, 2005)

ok I'm afraid I'm a trouble maker here  i started a wrong topic  sorry guys


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## Corry (Nov 12, 2005)

You didn't do anything wrong, Mentos.


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## photo gal (Nov 12, 2005)

no, oh mintily gorgeous one, it is a very good topic!  : )


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## jstuedle (Nov 12, 2005)

Please don't be offended oh minty one, we should have taken it off, off topic. I appoligize again for hijacking your thread. You have nothing to feel sorry about.


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## Verbal (Nov 12, 2005)

mentos_007 said:
			
		

> ok I'm afraid I'm a trouble maker here  i started a wrong topic  sorry guys



Yeah what John said...our fault.  It was a good topic.


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## darin3200 (Nov 12, 2005)

jstuedle said:
			
		

> As a PJ, you can only stay objective if you can stay uninvolved. The sad fact EVERY journalist gets involved. You can't tell me that a PJ in a conflict don't choose a side and that choice is reflected in there work. Humans are emotional, and that emotion comes through in all of our work if we are worth a darn.
> 
> As a neutral "observer" you could not carry a weapon. You then become a target. You would most likely be a target anyway in this conflict. P.J.'s used to be considered neutral observers in a conflict and were "protected" by all sides. Now only Al Jezera PJ's are not a target, everyone else is fair game.
> 
> I should stop, this is getting close to a "P" word type discussion, and we can't have that.


I guess that is true. I remember seeing a show called "Ethics in America" on PBS from the 1980s where all the journalists said they would never, ever get involved. But during Vietnam there were Americans who could follow the vietcong on the basis of being a journalist not an involved person, thus carrying a weapon wouldn't be permissible. However, you do make a good point that most terrorist don't make the distinction between enemy and journalist, which is why Iraq has had the highest number of journalist causilties and kidnappings of any war. BBC camerman Dess Wright said that people say they aren't involved, but by being there they are involved, they can't be bystanders.

Its such a deep and complicated debate


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## mentos_007 (Nov 13, 2005)

well I heard from our guest, that Vietnam was the last place where a photog could go and feel almost safe. now in Iraq they have to move with guards - surrounded by soldiers, they can't walk alone and so on... ahh... I'd like to go there...


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## Xmetal (Nov 13, 2005)

My area of shooting is risky, Mounting my camera to the side of a car is risky - if it falls off the car and breaks i'm up the creek without a paddle. Why do I do it? because i'm willing to take the risk to get a better picture!  Same goes for me directing traffic on location because i'm always running the risk of being run over. 

In all seriousness, PJ's that have been to places like Iraq go for the same reason - they want that killer picture that will set them apart from the rest of the Journo crowds so they are willing to run the risk of either damaging or losing equipment or worse being shot and killed themselves.


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## bace (Nov 13, 2005)

BLAP BLAP BLAP!!!

MON DEM POOP!


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## jstuedle (Nov 14, 2005)

> In all seriousness, PJ's that have been to places like Iraq go for the same reason - they want that killer picture that will set them apart from the rest of the Journo crowds so they are willing to run the risk of either damaging or losing equipment or worse being shot and killed themselves.




It's the adrenalin rush, pure and simple. Some like the thrill of the roller coaster. Some like the thrill of driving fast in traffic on a 1/2 mile oval. Some can't live without jumping out of a perfectly good airplane. And some like to be war correspondents, or SEAL team leaders. It all depends on your personal need for that adrenalin rush. And if you get that killer shot, it just adds to the rush.


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## bace (Nov 14, 2005)

I wish I could be a Fighter Pilot or a F1 Driver. Speed is my ultimate adrenaline rush. 

I can barely see out of one eye though. Which is funny, cause the eye that I can barely see from is the same eye that makes it difficult to take pictures.


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## santino (Nov 14, 2005)

I think I would, money wouldn't be the reason. It would be satisfaction to have the ability to show people what's really going on, victims of war would have a voice to the rest of the world, a voice which I would deliver through my pics. BUT, I'd be scared as hell.


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## jadin (Nov 14, 2005)

I'd go.

I really don't know how I'd cope with what I saw however.

One of the most haunting iraq photos I've seen is here (I couldn't find the original story): A car was headed to a check point. It was ordered to stop but did not. The driver and passenger were shot. The occupents of the car was a family. In the front seat were the mom and dad. In the rear their three children. One of the soldiers took photos : iraq child

I'm posting this from a PJ point of view. Not political. If it still hits too close to no-mans-land, feel free to edit it.

Edit : The event from a PJ. But missing the photo(s) I linked above.


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## panzershreck (Nov 14, 2005)

i'd go

i've already got a beard, and i wouldn't carry a gun, after all what if the people shooting are like bears? you don't shoot at bears, you yell and wave sticks... sounds like a sound plan! 

we can practice our strategies in the ganglands of LA :thumbup:


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## jstuedle (Nov 14, 2005)

You wave sticks, they wave machetes and AK's. Sounds like a plan to me.


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## jadin (Nov 14, 2005)

panzershreck said:
			
		

> i'd go
> 
> i've already got a beard, and i wouldn't carry a gun, after all what if the people shooting are like bears? you don't shoot at bears, you yell and wave sticks... sounds like a sound plan!
> 
> we can practice our strategies in the ganglands of LA :thumbup:


 
Wouldn't you plan your strategies off an area that the people are staying alive??


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## Mansi (Nov 15, 2005)

absolutely yes.. it _*IS*_ what i want to do
and not for the money...


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