# Shoot Through Umbrellas



## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

Recently purchased a Cowboystudio outfit with 105w CFLs and shoot through umbrellas. was expecting to get a "Full Moon" type of light but am getting an 8 point star effect. Am I doing something wrong or is this normal and should I be looking at reflecting umbrellas instead to give me more light.This is my first time useing studio lighting but have been an enthusiastic amature photographer for many years, currently useing a Nikon D7000.


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## Derrel (Jan 22, 2013)

Well, that umbrella has eight ribs, and eight fabric segments...its reflection will have an eight-sided shape.Now, on "people shots" the eight-sided shape is barely noticeable; on things like glassware and highly reflective, hard-surfaced objects, yes, the reflections will likely be larger and much quite-noticeable.


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## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

Thanks for the reply but my point is the amount of light getting to the subject is not what I was expecting, and without pushing the ISO considrably thus giving me a grainier shot I would have to use my SB600. Sould I consider investing in a couple of reflecting umbrellas, or is there anyway I can get more light from the shoot through's.


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## 480sparky (Jan 22, 2013)

picky54 said:


> Thanks for the reply but my point is the amount of light getting to the subject is not what I was expecting, and without pushing the ISO considrably thus giving me a grainier shot I would have to use my SB600. Sould I consider investing in a couple of reflecting umbrellas, or is there anyway I can get more light from the shoot through's.



Either try a reflecting umbrella, a softbox or buy more speedlights (or a more powerful one).


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## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

Thanks for that Sparky, looks like the reflecting umbrella is my best (subsitute cheapest lol) option, unless anyone else has any ideas. Can you buy 4 rib umbrellas?


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## kundalini (Jan 22, 2013)

Can you post a photo of the unsatisfactory results from a shoot-through brolly?  They really don't zapped that more illuminance from an SB600.  A reflective brolly will contain the bounced light better than a shoot-through, but the thing to consider it it will also cast a more contrasy light as opposed to the softer light of a shoot through.  There are multiple factors that may contribute to your dissatifaction that may not be the shoot-through's fault.


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## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

Just a quick point kundalini, I am useing 2 x105w CFL lights on stands with the umbrellas,I thought I would have enough light with that but this is not so, I just thought it was my inexperience,however it does seem reflective is the way to go, or soft boxes. to avoid useing flash. Any advice is most welcome though.


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## tentwo (Jan 22, 2013)

Here is a tip I like to tell: 

shutter speed = ambient light
aperture = Strobe lights

With strobe you should get enough light, try testing at different apertures at 200 iso. 

Also posting some photos of the "unsatisfactory results" would help.

Also 105w is more for product, backlighting or hair lights IMO. The SB600 would be perfect for a shoot through and you shouldn't have any issues. Even at 1/4 power.  

Shoot the flash in manual mode and control the amount of flash.


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## Derrel (Jan 22, 2013)

picky54 said:


> J *I am useing 2 x105w CFL lights on stands with the umbrellas*,I thought I would have enough light with that but this is not so, I just thought it was my inexperience,however it does seem reflective is the way to go, or soft boxes. to avoid useing flash. Any advice is most welcome though.



Well...there's the root of the problem, right there!!!!  "*2 x105w CFL lights"*


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## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

Ok Derrel, could you expand on that for me please


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## tentwo (Jan 22, 2013)

I completely agree.  Those are hardly ever used with a diffuser in my studio unless they are really close to the subject, ie. product photo.


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## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

As for unsatifactory results , None to show I deleted them but will take some more and repoat another day .


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## kundalini (Jan 22, 2013)

My bad.  I did read your original post, but when I read post #3, that thought flew out the window.  FYI, continuous lighting will never give you the punch of a speedlight.  Softboxes will require more luminance (eat up more lumens') than a brolly, but they will also direct (concetrate) your light spread to a better degree, more so the a reflective brolly.

Flash is your friend.  Don't be scared to use it.


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## Derrel (Jan 22, 2013)

picky54 said:


> Ok Derrel, could you expand on that for me please



Well...those just do not put out "that much light"...they typically require relatively long shutter speeds at moderate ISO values...an example might be ISO 320 at 1/15 second at f/5.6...


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## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

So basiclly I have purchased a dud outfit, despite the reviews from cutomers saying it worked, as I said I have no previous experience with studio lighting.


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## kundalini (Jan 22, 2013)

picky54 said:


> So basiclly I have purchased a dud outfit, despite the reviews from cutomers saying it worked, as I said I have no previous experience with studio lighting.


I think that is dependant on your subject matter.  For static subjects, I presume they are quite effective, but then, I've never used continuous lighting.


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## picky54 (Jan 22, 2013)

Well I thank you all for the help, wife is calling me for supper anyother advice would be greatly appreciated.


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## tentwo (Jan 22, 2013)

Derrel said:


> picky54 said:
> 
> 
> > Ok Derrel, could you expand on that for me please
> ...



Also I have seen many individuals do a 2 or 4 light setup behind the umbrellas to get enough light from a distance.  I personally use strobes.

I was also wondering was is the color temp on that bulb and how much did you spend on it?   I know doing something cheap always sounds good, but in the long run has always came and bit me on the butt, everytime.


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## KmH (Jan 22, 2013)

Use 2 500w CFLs instead. 2 105w CFLs don't deliver very much light.

Also you can get a shoot through umbrella a lot closer to your subject than you can a reflective umbrella.
Convertible umbrellas can be used both shoot-through or reflected. Impact Convertible Umbrella - White Satin with Removable Black Backing - 45" 

Most Cowboy Studios gear is not worth what it costs.

Last point, those 210 watts (2x105w) are delivered in 1 second. If you use a shutter speed shorter than 1 second, like 1/100, your photo doesn't get to use all 210 w.
Your SB-600 delivers a full power flash in about 1/900 of a second - see page 88 of the SB-600 user's manual.


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## tentwo (Jan 22, 2013)

picky54 said:


> So basiclly I have purchased a dud outfit, despite the reviews from cutomers saying it worked, as I said I have no previous experience with studio lighting.



What did you buy and where?

Do a little research before buying.  If you are looking for a great stobe for the money and have versitility, I have 3 of these and they are great for all situtations.  And as a beginner, these will help you learn. Also these allow for you to connect to external battery and pc sync.  These are highly inexpensive and work outstanding.  If you can return that setup, I would! Just my opinion.

Amazon.com: Yongnuo YN 560 Standard Hot Shoe Flash: Electronics


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## cgipson1 (Jan 22, 2013)

They will work for non-moving objects... period! Where you can use a long shutter speed! If you can, return them! Get some inexpensive monolights.. or speedlights..

I hate it that they advertise those cheap CFL kits to people that don't know what they are buying...  but you see it all over. Just remember you get what you pay for....


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## Village Idiot (Jan 23, 2013)

You can purchase a decent flashpoint monolight from adorama for about $100. That would give you a ton more light. Metric ton.


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## 12sndsgood (Jan 23, 2013)

from the quality of light stand i picked up from cowboy studio i wouldn not recomend them to anyone.


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## cgipson1 (Jan 23, 2013)

12sndsgood said:


> from the quality of light stand i picked up from cowboy studio i wouldn not recomend them to anyone.



+10000 on this! Junk.... although I am speaking second hand, since I have never purchased any Cowboy Studio Stands. The two ultra simple flash brackets I did try, fell apart (and how hard is it to build a flash bracket? I think they make their rivets from metallic wax or something, lol!)


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## KmH (Jan 23, 2013)

Pretty much everything Cowboy Studio sells is cheap, very low quality, won't last very long - gear.

You usually get what you pay for. If it's a lot cheaper than other similar gear, expect less performance, quality, and durability from the cheap stuff.


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## Mike_E (Jan 23, 2013)

You are getting 8 hotspots on the umbrella from not having enough light to fully illuminate the umbrella (much less anything else).

Chalk it up to experience and go with the above advice on a monolight.


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