# Late fee blame game -- would you respond, and how?



## dxdn (Dec 17, 2012)

*UPDATE #1: Survey says, "Waive the fee!" Thank you, TPFers.*
*UPDATE #2a: **Overread **parsed the situation best. *:study:
*
UPDATE #2b: My Conclusion (with a lot of help from my friendly commenters):*

In the end, this comes to what I will call "The Number One Question to Answer": Is the benefit of collecting the fee greater than the potential cost to my reputation as a photographer/businessman and to my relationship with a contact?

My answer in this specific situation, in agreement with and guided by the super-majority in the replies above, is "NO."

Original post:

Hi there, first-time poster here.

I'm starting my first photo business (first business ever) and I just had my first truly unpleasant experience as a paid photographer today. I'm coveting advice from others about handling it.

*TL;DR (short version)
*Mid-size business blaming their rep/photo buyer for the accounting department paying me late (six business days) for event coverage because of an undisclosed paperwork requirement. Accounting department seems to bear responsibility since they received my invoice, not the photo buyer; and they received it up to six business days prior to needing to cut my check. Invoice stated due date and my contact information; they never contacted me. I delivered my images days early.

Payment was late and only sent after buyer prodded accounting department after I e-mailed him to see if it had been sent; buyer was always quick to communicate and help me. I mailed invoice to accounting department for contractual late fees after receiving late check. Buyer now blamed for not getting the form from me himself and apparently being pressured/forced to pay fees out of pocket. Buyer angry at me for not waiving fees, plus other less-relevant things.

Was impressed by the buyer when I worked the event with him. Tried to offer a reduced late fee during call settling the late fee; buyer would not listen, explicitly refused to listen or let me speak. Buyer sent similarly short follow-up email after call. Frustrated because I like the buyer and empathize with him but am surprised by his anger and lack of professionalism in our interaction today over the late fee.

*Questions*
Would you respond at all to this, or just wait for the check?
How quickly would you respond?
How would you respond, and would you offer any kind of refund (since the payment is likely already in the mail)?

Thank you!

-DX

*In case you want the fuller version...
*I recently covered a business event and the client's accounting department paid me late; unbeknownst to me, they needed me to complete and sign a form as a new vendor before they paid me. I mailed the finished images to the client six calendar days before the agreed delivery due date (postmark date). Someone at the reception desk at the client's offices signed for receipt of the images six business days before the payment due date.

An invoice was included in the delivery and clearly stated the payment due date (postmark date) and my phone number and e-mail in case they needed to contact me with any questions. A copy of the full contract was also included, in which no mention of any paperwork was made by the client. Instead of contacting me when they realized they needed this information from me before they paid, they simply held my payment silently and did not ask until...

Finally, I e-mailed my contact about my payment and he contacted his employer about the status of my check. The next morning the accounting department sent me an e-mail with the required form: their first contact. I filled it out and sent it back to them digitally the same day. I then received my check postmarked six business days late. The next day I mailed out an invoice for the late fees specified by our contract, accompanied with an explanatory letter, documentation, and a copy of the contract, all addressed to the accounts payable department.

Today I receive a nearly simultaneous pairing of e-mail and voice mail from my contact. He wants to talk about the late fee. I call him and he is irate. He asks if I will waive the late fee; I say, "No, but I will reduce it." He only hears, "No." He continues, talking over me, letting me know (or implying) that he is paying the fee personally, and telling me correspond only with him, and not "bother" (excuse me?) the accounting department or their administrative assistant by corresponding with them. Note that he had never made any such request before, and carrying out financial transactions with the accounting arm of a business is standard.

I tried multiple times to interject and repeat my offer to reduce the fee, but each time I asked, "May I say something?" he talked over me, actually answering me: "No, I won't." He then said something abrupt and ended the call. I was flustered since I was impressed by his organization and communication. I was very disappointed that this fee blew back on him, but also surprised at his attitude.

I wanted to write an e-mail response offering the reduced fee, but then, only a few minutes after the call ended, I received another e-mail, short and blunt, recapping our phone conversation and payment agreement. I now feel that offering the reduced fee might be like telling someone who is mad at you to calm down, only to make them more angry.


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## PinkDoor (Dec 17, 2012)

Too many words for me. Sounds like you should take this as a learning experience, forget about your late fee for this one, and save your business relationship.  In future, you may want to understand in advance how you are to be paid, and have very detailed paperwork and timing for your client to sign.


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## nycphotography (Dec 17, 2012)

Short version:  If you value the client, or the word that will be spreading from the client's mouth, for 6 days late, waive the fee.  Late fees are for habitual offenders and people who are _really_ late.

There are too many REAL problems lurking out there for any small business to be creating extra problems that really don't need to be there.

What's the interest on 6 days?  10%/365*6 = what?  0.16% that's what.   or on $5000, roughly $8.21.

Get over your sense of indignation and get on with being in SMALL business.

And tell him that you'd really hate to wreck a great working relationship over something trivial.


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## Bitter Jeweler (Dec 17, 2012)

Late fee? LOL

6 days?


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## fjrabon (Dec 17, 2012)

just waive the late fee.


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## dxdn (Dec 17, 2012)

Alrighty. It's crystal clear, then. Needed some perspective on it and I got it. Will waive the fee and do my best to mend what can be mended. Thank you to all!


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## pic_chick (Dec 17, 2012)

I would think about if I wanted to work with this company again...if you would like to work for them then to keep the fire away from your bridge, you may need to drop the late fee being clear that this is a one time expectation as your contact is very unlikely to let go of this. If you do not forsee working with them again then stick to your guns and get whats owed and cut ties that is the only way I for see this working out.


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## Overread (Dec 17, 2012)

I agree with the others; it sounds like the guy made an honest mistake within the structure of the company he works for. Like as not he's already had his ear chewed off by accounting or his own superior for the mistake (or at least feels he has by mucking up a simple bit of company policy). 

6 days isn't that long and whilst the company didn't reach out to you, they didn't try to withdraw and when the mistake was noticed and flagged by yourself it was swiftly settled. 

I would take a few moments to calm yourself and then compose a returning email, stating that you have decided to wave the late fee. I would also add some element of smoothing over the rocky patch (especially if you suspect the company will hire you again). State something along the lines that your wavering it since its the person paying not the company or somesuch. 

Yes you have every right to demand the fee and it is upon your terms only that the fee can be waved; but in the instance you describe it doesn't sound like playing hardnose will gain you any allies or favours and could mar your relationship with a client.


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## Mully (Dec 17, 2012)

Late fee .... are you serious, do you want to work with them again?   Ad agencies are always late, I always pad my expenses to cove the lateness.


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## thetrue (Dec 17, 2012)

Waive the fee, apologize for the misunderstanding, and subtley suggest that you'd like to continue the business relationship. That form you filled out for them, I'm going to assume its something like a W9, which you'll need for most b2b jobs. I would add a copy of it with the paperwork for every contract you sign.


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## dxdn (Dec 17, 2012)

I sent an e-mail to the buyer just a few minutes ago waiving the fee and apologizing for not looking out for his interests more quickly. I do not really know whether or not the buyer would have brought/will bring me any more jobs (traveling, based out-of-state) even if everything had gone perfectly, but with the perspective you guys have brought to bear, it's so trivial to force the fee through that waiving it is the only way to be the kind of owner I want to be. If it heals the relationship, great. If not, and I can really see that, I've done my best and I'll learn from it and keep truckin'.

Thanks again.

-DX


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## STIC (Dec 17, 2012)

...


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## thetrue (Dec 17, 2012)

OP, what form was it?


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## panblue (Dec 17, 2012)

Keep truckin'


dxdn said:


> I sent an e-mail to the buyer just a few minutes ago waiving the fee and apologizing for not looking out for his interests more quickly. I do not really know whether or not the buyer would have brought/will bring me any more jobs (traveling, based out-of-state) even if everything had gone perfectly, but with the perspective you guys have brought to bear, it's so trivial to force the fee through that waiving it is the only way to be the kind of owner I want to be. If it heals the relationship, great. If not, and I can really see that, I've done my best and I'll learn from it and keep truckin'.
> 
> Thanks again.
> 
> -DX


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## dxdn (Dec 18, 2012)

thetrue said:


> OP, what form was it?



W-9, as you surmised.

-DX


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## dxdn (Dec 18, 2012)

*STIC*, I had mirroring late fees, x% of total event fee deducted per business day late by either party. We were both on the hook. Everything was as airtight as I could get it on short notice without an attorney to look at it. While I likely had the legal right to demand the late fee, it just is not worth it to me compared to how I want to represent myself and any business I run.

-DX


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## STIC (Dec 19, 2012)

...


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## digital flower (Dec 19, 2012)

Welcome to business:mrgreen:


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## gsgary (Dec 19, 2012)

6 days is a joke, you should try working in the building industry how about 13 months late, in the late 80's main contractors were writting in contracts pay when paid


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