# Developing my first roll!



## tevo (Feb 10, 2013)

Hello all,

I purchased a small developing tank, reel, and chemicals (for black & white films) at a local photo fair, and I am going to develop my first roll of film!

The chemicals I have are:

Lauder Formula 76 (D76 I presume..) Developer
Lauder L763-1 Fixer
Lauder HCA Hypo
Kodak Photo Flo 200



From what I have gathered talking to people / researching the internet, my process should go like this (PLEASE correct me if I am wrong!):

1. Load film onto reel and in tank 
2. Pour in developer (68F) and leave in for appropriate time for film, agitating on and off ever 30 seconds.
3. Pour out developer, pour in water and rinse, agitating on and off every 30 seconds.
4. Pour out water, pour in fixer (68F) for 2-4 minutes, agitating on and off every 30 seconds.
5. Pour out fixer, pour in water and rinse, agitating on and off every 30 seconds.
6. Pour out water, pour in hypo (7 parts water, 1 part hypo concentrate) and agitate on and off every 30 seconds for 1 - 2 minutes.
7. Pour out hypo, pour in water and rinse for 5 minutes agitating on and off every 30 seconds.
8. Add a few drops of Photo Flo and agitate for 10 seconds or so.
9. Pour out chemicals, remove film, squeegee off liquid, and hang to dry.

Is this on the right track? I'm going develop an old roll of Tmax 100 for my first try.


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## dxqcanada (Feb 10, 2013)

I use Stop Bath instead of water after the developer and I don't use Hypo.

Stop Bath is cheap and easy.
Hypo is good if you want to conserve water during washing.

Developer
Stop Bath
Fixer
Wash
Photoflo
Dry


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## Rick58 (Feb 10, 2013)

If memory serves me correctly, HCA is used more for removing fixer (hypo) from prints.
I also always used stop bath instead of water

Your process sounds about right, but I think what you're refering to as "hypo" is actually Hypo Clearing Agent...HCA. Hypo is actually in fixer and the HCA is used to clear the hypo in the fixer. I never used it on film. Just prints.


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## tevo (Feb 10, 2013)

Rick58 said:


> If memory serves me correctly, HCA is used more for removing fixer (hypo) from prints.
> I also always used stop bath instead of water
> 
> Your process sounds about right, but I think what you're refering to as "hypo" is actually Hypo Clearing Agent...HCA. Hypo is actually in fixer and the HCA is used to clear the hypo in the fixer. I never used it on film. Just prints.



The bottle does say Hypo Clearing Agent, you're right.



dxqcanada said:


> I use Stop Bath instead of water after the developer and I don't use Hypo.
> 
> Stop Bath is cheap and easy.
> Hypo is good if you want to conserve water during washing.
> ...



I neglected to buy Stop Bath, would using water work the same way?


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## dxqcanada (Feb 10, 2013)

http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/darkroom/91498-stop-bath-water.html


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## Rick58 (Feb 10, 2013)

I've heard of the vinegar treatment but never tried it myself. You'll also see the internet is full of advice on using a water rinse. I really can't say because I always used stop bath.


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## Mully (Feb 10, 2013)

Vinegar would work as they are both an acid ... 2 oz per quart should work just fine.... I have done this many times... even for paper


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## tevo (Feb 10, 2013)

Mully said:


> Vinegar would work as they are both an acid ... 2 oz per quart should work just fine.... I have done this many times... even for paper



What kind of vinegar? Would rice vinegar work?


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## tevo (Feb 10, 2013)

How would I compensate fixing times if I use water instead?


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## BlackSheep (Feb 10, 2013)

Rice vinegar would work, it's lower on the acid level but would still work fine. But I personally wouldn't use it because it costs like 3X more than plain white vinegar...

Your fixing time would be the same, the only change is the stop bath would be 30 seconds vs a longer wash if you use water instead of stop.


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## tevo (Feb 10, 2013)

Well I developed the roll and it is completely clear. The frame numbers show, and there is a black leader. But the film itself all the way through is entirely clear. Did I do something wrong, or did I just inadvertently develop a roll that had no pictures on it?


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## christop (Feb 10, 2013)

If all of the film were clear, that would be caused by improper development, but since you can see the frame numbers and a black leader, it sounds like you developed an unexposed roll.


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## tevo (Feb 10, 2013)

Developed another roll, successfully! Can't wait to scan these


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## gsgary (Feb 11, 2013)

How did you manage to develope a roll that was not exposed you plonker


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## tevo (Feb 11, 2013)

gsgary said:
			
		

> How did you manage to develope a roll that was not exposed you plonker



I ask myself the same question, especially considering there was no leader sticking out and it was in a canister that said "Develop Me" on the lid.


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## tevo (Feb 11, 2013)

Day 38: February 10, 2013 by theofficialtevo, on Flickr


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## bsinmich (Feb 11, 2013)

It is very common for people to have a clear roll of 35mm film.  The film does not get caught on the wind spool and therefore does not ever go through the camera. If you have a rewind crank you can see it  turn when film is winding.  The auto wind and rewind miss that.  If that is really  a D76 clone you should try mixing it 1:1 with water.  That will give more manageable time control and agitation.  a rinse with water will work.  Plain distilled vinegar with about 1/2 oz. to 15 1/2 oz of water will work as a stop solution for 1 minute, rinse and then fixer for 10 minutes, followed by 10 minutes of wash in water.  Fixing time should be double the time it takes for the film to clear.  Use a small end piece to try this.


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## Compaq (Feb 12, 2013)

Just be sure to fix sufficiently! Here's a tip I learned from a friend:

When you pour fixer into the tank, be sure to pour a little bit of fixer into a small cup. In this cup, you put a small part of the film leader. You can cut this film leader part off when you get the film onto the spool. When you have poured fixer in the small cup with the film leader, observe how long it takes for the leader part to completely clear. Note the time, and double it - that's the approximate time required to sufficiently fix your film (with a little room). This way, you can observe with your eyes when your fixer solution is getting old. It's nothing more than a rule of thumb, though, but it works great. I look back on my negatives from before I started doing this, and see definite foggyness on them, they're not sufficiently fixed.


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## bsinmich (Feb 12, 2013)

I must have the fixing of negatives down pretty good.  I took about 80% of the pictures in my HS yearbook for my last 2 years of HS.  They are still good and I graduated in '56.  I pulled some out to print for the last reunion and they were very good yet.  We have a reunion every year since we were a small school.


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## tevo (Feb 12, 2013)

Compaq said:
			
		

> Just be sure to fix sufficiently! Here's a tip I learned from a friend:
> 
> When you pour fixer into the tank, be sure to pour a little bit of fixer into a small cup. In this cup, you put a small part of the film leader. You can cut this film leader part off when you get the film onto the spool. When you have poured fixer in the small cup with the film leader, observe how long it takes for the leader part to completely clear. Note the time, and double it - that's the approximate time required to sufficiently fix your film (with a little room). This way, you can observe with your eyes when your fixer solution is getting old. It's nothing more than a rule of thumb, though, but it works great. I look back on my negatives from before I started doing this, and see definite foggyness on them, they're not sufficiently fixed.



Great tip! Thanks much. Any method for testing developer?


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## Compaq (Feb 13, 2013)

Maybe one can measure the reduction potential in the solution or something, with proper potensiometric equipment, and consult table values... but I don't really know. Testing on a roll you don't care about might be the best way.


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## dxqcanada (Feb 13, 2013)

tevo said:


> Great tip! Thanks much. Any method for testing developer?



Hmm, are you mixing one-shot developer and then dumping ... or you make a large working solution then dump as you go ... or large working solution and replenishing ?


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## tevo (Feb 13, 2013)

dxqcanada said:
			
		

> Hmm, are you mixing one-shot developer and then dumping ... or you make a large working solution then dump as you go ... or large working solution and replenishing ?



I've only developed one roll and I just disposed of all the chemicals I used since I was afraid of pouring them back into their respective containers


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## dxqcanada (Feb 14, 2013)

I do one-shot developer (mix and dump), and keep Stop Bath and Fix.

If you use Indicator Stop Bath, then you can tell by the colour.
With the Fixer, keep a running tab of how many rolls (35 and 120), then you will get a general idea of when it may be exhausted (the manufacture data sheet will have numbers of rolls you can do).

Undiluted chemicals in the bottles will last a long time if you compress the air out of.


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## tevo (Feb 14, 2013)

dxqcanada said:


> I do one-shot developer (mix and dump), and keep Stop Bath and Fix.
> 
> If you use Indicator Stop Bath, then you can tell by the colour.
> With the Fixer, keep a running tab of how many rolls (35 and 120), then you will get a general idea of when it may be exhausted (the manufacture data sheet will have numbers of rolls you can do).
> ...



I use water as a stop bath, so that's no problem. So I think I can save fixer and use Compaq's rule of thumb with that, and just dump developer and buy new when needed. What about the HCA / Photo Flo?


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## dxqcanada (Feb 14, 2013)

Hmm, I don't use hypo.

Photoflo ... use a small cap-full. The stuff lasts for decades.


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## Josh66 (Feb 14, 2013)

tevo said:


> How would I compensate fixing times if I use water instead?



Your times won't necessarily change, but your fixer will last much longer if you use stop bath.  I usually get around 60 rolls out of a gallon of fixer (using stop bath).  That figure was about 40% less when I was shooting a lot of Efke film (you can't use stop bath with Efke - just water).


Stop bath is insanely cheap - there's really no reason not to use it.  A bottle of Kodak Indicator Stop Bath is like $6 ... I've been working out of one bottle for like 2 years now...  It turns purple when it's spent.  I mix up a liter at a time.

If you do the math, stop bath is actually cheaper than water.  That one bottle will make about 30 liters of stop bath.  You get like 50 rolls per liter...


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## Josh66 (Feb 15, 2013)

tevo said:


> dxqcanada said:
> 
> 
> > I do one-shot developer (mix and dump), and keep Stop Bath and Fix.
> ...



Yeah - I count my rolls with fixer.  I just put some masking tape on the bottle a make a mark for every roll I fix.  I try to always have a fresh bottle of anything that I have mixed in case I have to make a new batch - but when my fixer gets up to about 30 rolls - I make sure I have a spare bottle of fixer, just in case.  When it hits 50 rolls, I test it before using each time.  If in doubt, I make a new batch.

35mm (36 exposure) and 120 are both the same area, so count either of them as 1 roll.  220 would be 2 rolls.  If you wanted to get really picky, you could count 24 exposure (35mm) rolls as 2/3 of a roll (I do count them as 2/3 of a roll for C-41, but I don't get that picky for B&W...).


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## StoneNYC (Feb 15, 2013)

dxqcanada said:


> Hmm, I don't use hypo.
> 
> Photoflo ... use a small cap-full. The stuff lasts for decades.



Everyone uses hypo... Hypo is Fixer...

Hypo Clear is what you probably mean...


~Stone

Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II  /  Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII /  Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic   |   Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk


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## tevo (Feb 15, 2013)

StoneNYC said:


> dxqcanada said:
> 
> 
> > Hmm, I don't use hypo.
> ...



HCA = Hypo Clearing Agent

..is what I meant.


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## KenC (Feb 15, 2013)

Everyone has their own methods - here are my prejudices in film developing.

Water is fine as a stop bath, I just don't waste any time getting the fixer in there.

TMax developer is the best developer for TMax films - better highlight and shadow detail, less grain - dilute the concentrate for each use and discard.  You should try it!

Fixer is pretty cheap - no point making extra effort to re-use it many times - pour it back a few times and then toss it.

Photo Flo always gave me trouble, so after the wash, I used to rinse twice in distilled water (easy to get in the store) and just hang, squeegee and dry.  The distilled water has no minerals in it, so you shouldn't get any spots.


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## Mully (Feb 15, 2013)

Agitation when fixing is crucial, especially in small tanks, you don't need HCA if you wash the film for the prescribed time..... I would rinse with with distilled water due to minerals and I never had any problem with photo flo just use a few cc's I never would squeegee, just hang wet in an enclosed drying cabinet..... there are many wasy you just have to pick a procedure that works for you.


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## bsinmich (Feb 20, 2013)

You can get a small squeeze bottle of hypo check for a couple of dollars. Put 2 drops into your fixer and if it gets cloudy it is time to change. The one I have now is Arista but I think I had Edwal in the past.


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## gsgary (Feb 20, 2013)

I always stopbath then fix for 3 minute constant agitation then have a look to see if they have fixed ok ( always use Ilford stopbath and fix changes color when it has had it) and use a paterson force film washer attached to domestic tap


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