# "Wow, you have a nice camera!"



## Jon_Are (Aug 13, 2008)

I know this is an old story to most of you, but it's the first time it's happened to me and I feel the need to share.

I brought a stack of vacation photos in to work, all taken with my new D80. I counted six different people over the course of two days remark to me that I have a really good camera to have taken such nice shots. 

_Six._

I guess I should forward all the compliments to Nikon. 


Jon


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

well, that is how people are. that is why so many people buy expensive gear in the hope to take good photographs.

if you criticize their work, some of them will even say, not, my camera did cost XXX, so those shots are perfect! (Bit simplified, but in principle I already found such attitude in some people )


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

A good photographer can easily take a great photo with a crappy camera but a bad photographer has a hard time getting a good photo with a great camera.

This is one of my biggest peeves.

Someone posted on another forum I'm on...

"Hand them your expensive camera and tell them to take a great picture."

Someday should the opportunity present itself, that is what I'm going to do.


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> A good photographer can easily take a great photo with a crappy camera but a bad photographer has a hard time getting a good photo with a great camera.
> 
> This is one of my biggest peeves.
> 
> ...



Never hand anyone your expensive camera who does not know how to treat it well...


----------



## usayit (Aug 13, 2008)

Thats just the state of people's understanding of photography.   Its no longer seen as a creative art driven by human creativity and effort but an activity driven by a consumer electronic.  No different from people who use computers, watch TV, etc...  

Marketing by companies are also geared this way.  They make a lot of money from the typical consumer purchases.  The biggest chunk of profit is not driven by professionals and enthusiasts.   

Ad 1:
"Buy our new camera and with practice you might be able to take photos like a professional"

Ad 2:
"Buy our new camera and you too can shoot like a professional"

Which ad is going to have a better chance of driving sales?


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> Never hand anyone your expensive camera who does not know how to treat it well...


 
 Yes, this was discussed after the statement was made. Like I said, "if it was ever the "right" circumstance...I'd love to do it. Now whether I'd ever have the balls to do it is another story. 

My family is the worst for 'playing' with my camera. They just can't wrap their brains around the fact that it isn't a p&s. 

Now when I get my 1D someone will lose a limb if they touch it.


----------



## tirediron (Aug 13, 2008)

Sad but true. I've heard it from a friend of the family who considers herself a photojournalist... "Well of course John takes nice pictures, look at how expensive his camera is" I like LuckyStar's idea; I think I'll try that when I get home from this trip. I wonder if she will find the thus-far hidden feature in my D300 which automtically levels horizons!


----------



## usayit (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> "Hand them your expensive camera and tell them to take a great picture."
> 
> Someday should the opportunity present itself, that is what I'm going to do.



Over my dead body...


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> Yes, this was discussed after the statement was made. Like I said, "if it was ever the "right" circumstance...I'd love to do it. Now whether I'd ever have the balls to do it is another story.
> 
> My family is the worst for 'playing' with my camera. They just can't wrap their brains around the fact that it isn't a p&s.
> 
> Now when I get my 1D someone will lose a limb if they touch it.



It does not need balls, but a good insurance which covers everything


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> It does not need balls, but a good insurance which covers everything


 
So true.:thumbup:


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

abraxas said:


> **** yes, if you don't appreciate them for what they are, compliments, by all means forward them to Nikon.


 
It's really more of a back-handed compliment if you ask me.


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

I'm always jealous when I see the pictures my mum takes with her p&s. OK, it is quite a good p&s (I selected it for her) .. still that does not justify her taking perfectly exposed and well composed images which I would even print large scale and hang up on my wall.


----------



## abraxas (Aug 13, 2008)

Jon_Are said:


> I know ...
> 
> I guess I should forward all the compliments to Nikon.



Yes, if you don't appreciate them for what they are, compliments, by all means forward them to Nikon.


----------



## dEARlEADER (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> ..  which I would even print large scale and hang up on my wall.



that's only because she just takes pictures of you....


----------



## Jon_Are (Aug 13, 2008)

> yes, if you don't appreciate them for what they are, compliments, by all means forward them to Nikon.



Oh, they're compliments to me alright; I'm being complimented for selecting and purchasing a quality camera.

Jon


----------



## abraxas (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> It's really more of a back-handed compliment if you ask me.



I don't believe so.  Shouldn't expect people to be so refined in the discipline- If someone really wants to overthink it, imagine it as a really polite way for someone to say your photography absolutely sucks, but you have a nice camera.


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

Jon_Are said:


> Oh, they're compliments to me alright; I'm being complimented for selecting and purchasing a quality camera.
> 
> Jon


 
:thumbup:


----------



## abraxas (Aug 13, 2008)

Jon_Are said:


> Oh, they're compliments to me alright; I'm being complimented for selecting and purchasing a quality camera.
> 
> Jon



Then by all means, tell them how little they know- make them sorry they said anything at all.


----------



## Steph (Aug 13, 2008)

Oh come on! Us photographers have to be honest with ourselves. Part of the quality of our pictures *does* come from the equipment we use, otherwise we would all be using cheap P&S or even pinhole cameras made out of shoe boxes. In the end, they said your shots were good and that is a compliment in my book.


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

abraxas said:


> I don't believe so. Shouldn't expect people to be so refined in the discipline- If someone really wants to overthink it, imagine it as a really polite way for someone to say your photography absolutely sucks, but you have a nice camera.


 
It's like telling a painter his painting is great because he had good brushes or the best canvas. Or telling a surgeon he did a great job on the heart transplant because he had the best scalpel. Or telling a Nascar driver he's only won because he had the best car. 

What that person is complimenting is your tool, not your talent. Granted, this may be out of ignorance, (on their part) but it's still more of an insult than a compliment. IMHO. eacesign:


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

Steph said:


> Oh come on! Us photographers have to be honest with ourselves. Part of the quality of our pictures *does* come from the equipment we use,



yes, it does. just saying if you use a p&s to its full capabilities, then you can produce outstanding results.

my reason for not using a p&s is simply its limitations. there are just many shots in complicated/interesting light, which I could not take with a p&s.


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

your tool sets the limits, and it is up to you and your talent/experience to fill out those limits!


----------



## Steph (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> my reason for not using a p&s is simply its limitations. there are just many shots in complicated/interesting light, which I could not take with a p&s.


 
Excactly my point!! So your 5D is in part responsible for the quality of some of your shots (at least the ones you would not be able to take with a P&S).


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

Steph said:


> Excactly my point!! So your 5D is in part responsible for the quality of some of your shots (at least the ones you would not be able to take with a P&S).



I would say it enables me to make full use of my talent (how small that talent may be .. not saying I am extremely talented  )


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

Steph said:


> Excactly my point!! So your 5D is in part responsible for the quality of some of your shots (at least the ones you would not be able to take with a P&S).


 
But the photographer who has increased their skill & knowledge to be able to use a 5D to it's full potential and take amazing photos with it does so because of THEIR skill, knowledge, hours of learning, hours of practice, creative eye, and passion. It is not in the camera. I could take five 1Ds out right now & hand them to five unskilled, untrained people and one might get a good shot purely because of luck and a good quality camera. 

I could jump in the seat of the worlds fastest, best made, highest quality race car today and I promise you I'd still come in last in a race. Why? Because a race car doesn't make a race car drive and a good camera doesn't make a good photographer.

IMHO  Now I need a drink...

:redwine:


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

> skill, knowledge, hours of learning, hours of practice, creative eye, and passion



Hmm, as for myself, I just got used to taking photographs over the years ... 



LuckyStarPhotography said:


> IMHO  Now I need a drink...
> 
> :redwine:



Can I join in? :mrgreen:


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> Hmm, as for myself, I just got used to taking photographs over the years ...
> 
> 
> 
> Can I join in? :mrgreen:


 
You can, but I warn you, I have hours of practice, hours of learning, skill, & passion when it comes to drinking. So bring your best bottle.


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> You can, but I warn you, I have hours of practice, hours of learning, skill, & passion when it comes to drinking. So bring your best bottle.



Hmm, as for myself, I just got used to drinking over the years ... 

My best bottle? In terms of red wine that would currently be a 
*Chateau Lafitte-Carcasset 2002 Saint-Estephe

*In terms of Single Malt whisky:

*Lagavulin*, 16 years, and a *Glentromie *17 years (bottled ages ago)

(unfortunately my Balvenie Port Wood Finish 21 years has just been emptied)


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> Hmm, as for myself, I just got used to drinking over the years ...
> 
> My best bottle? In terms of red wine that would currently be a
> *Chateau Lafitte-Carcasset 2002 Saint-Estephe*
> ...


 
I think I need to learn to "just get use to stuff":hail:


----------



## tirediron (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> Hmm, as for myself, I just got used to drinking over the years ...
> 
> My best bottle? In terms of red wine that would currently be a
> *Chateau Lafitte-Carcasset 2002 Saint-Estephe*
> ...


 
Just make sure that it either comes in a cardboard box, or has a screw top!


----------



## Steph (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> But the photographer who has increased their skill & knowledge to be able to use a 5D to it's full potential and take amazing photos with it does so because of THEIR skill, knowledge, hours of learning, hours of practice, creative eye, and passion. It is not in the camera. I could take five 1Ds out right now & hand them to five unskilled, untrained people and one might get a good shot purely because of luck and a good quality camera.


 
Yep! We don't disagree. I never said that the camera on its own was responsible for the good shots. What I am saying is that photographers should aknowledge that the quality of their shots depends *in part* on the quality of their equipment. For some photographers it seems to be a problem to acknowledge that with better tools you get better results. And is not that why most photographers feel the need to constantly upgrade their equipment?


----------



## Village Idiot (Aug 13, 2008)

see sig.


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

Steph said:


> Yep! We don't disagree. I never said that the camera on its own was responsible for the good shots. What I am saying is that photographers should aknowledge that the quality of their shots depends *in part* on the quality of their equipment. For some photographers it seems to be a problem to acknowledge that with better tools you get better results. And is not that why most photographers feel the need to constently upgrade their equipment?


 
Agreed.

But...

For someone to look at a photograph I took and the first thing out of their mouth is, "Wow! You must have a great camera." "Or...what kind of camera do you have?" or anything similar it would be like looking at a Picasso and saying, "Wow! He must've had one hell of a brush!" 

(Note: I am not comparing my photographs to Picasso's paintings./note)

So back to the OP's point... It's not really a compliment to the photographer. It's a compliment to the tool and thus the compliments could very well be forwarded to Nikon or Canon or wherever.

Oh dear I've enjoyed this conversation entirely too much this morning. 
eacemrgreen:


----------



## kundalini (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> What that person is complimenting is your tool, not your talent.


 I'd be more than happy, even delighted, to get complimented on my tool.  :taped sh:


----------



## Battou (Aug 13, 2008)

At one forum I was on I got that constantly, I tried being nice and hinting that my camera was nothing spactacular and they too could have and use the same twenty five dollar wonder. Then I grew tired of hinting to them about it and told them they obviously wern't getting the point and gave a sphiel about the camera is only a tool....Not long after that I find I can not connect to the site....I almost think I was IP banned for it. 

Does this Link work for anyone here?


----------



## Jon_Are (Aug 13, 2008)

> Then by all means, tell them how little they know- make them sorry they said anything at all.



Well, that would be rude, wouldn't it. 

I'll concede that the nice camera comments were, deep down, not intended to be negative. What prompted me to post, though, was that person after person after person came up with that remark, and not _one_ mentioned that there may be some level of skill involved in producing a beautiful shot.

These are educated, nice folks - some actual friends - who were offering a standard (but still, I maintain, semi-ignorant) reaction to a nice photo.

Such a viewpoint, it seems to me, does a disservice to both photographers and the art of photography.

Oh well, life goes on.

Jon


----------



## dEARlEADER (Aug 13, 2008)

LuckyStarPhotography said:


> Agreed.
> 
> But...
> 
> ...




I can see cause for the miscommunication.  A crappy point and shoot can even get in the way of non-photographers with it's limitations.  When I traded in my p&s for DSLR I had greater expectations.  I thought I was buying my way out of the P&S limitations.  This ended up only being partially true.  While my images ended up being somewhat better it became clear to me that camera limitions are only a contributing part of what makes a desirible image.  A non-photographer who has never moved beyond P&S would generally not know this.  As such, when they see a good image it is assumed it became good due to the quality of the camera.

When I wasn't into photography, I was always cursing my Sony 6meg severe shutter lag, processing time, red eye etc etc...


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

tirediron said:


> Just make sure that it either comes in a cardboard box, or has a screw top!



I am shocked


----------



## Alex_B (Aug 13, 2008)

Battou said:


> Does this Link work for anyone here?




no, does not.


----------



## Battou (Aug 13, 2008)

Alex_B said:


> no, does not.




Ok good, it ain't just me then :thumbup:

If I could get access to the site I would have quoted my reply but....I guess that ain't happinin


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

kundalini said:


> I'd be more than happy, even delighted, to get complimented on my tool. :taped sh:


 
I knew it was only a matter of time. 



Battou said:


> At one forum I was on I got that constantly, I tried being nice and hinting that my camera was nothing spactacular and they too could have and use the same twenty five dollar wonder. Then I grew tired of hinting to them about it and told them they obviously wern't getting the point and gave a sphiel about the camera is only a tool....Not long after that I find I can not connect to the site....I almost think I was IP banned for it.
> 
> Does this Link work for anyone here?


 
Doesn't work for me either.



Alex_B said:


> I am shocked


 
I'm shocked too! (but totally in agreement) 
Although I'm pretty sure Arbor Mist doesn't come in a box


----------



## Puscas (Aug 13, 2008)

on the other hand: I had two times where people, seeing my 'bigger' camera, came up to me and said 'ah, you are a photographer, could you take a picture of us?'. So I was given their p&s to shoot them.
See, they thought I was good, purely based on my tools. 

 Oh, the irony....



pascal


----------



## ksmattfish (Aug 13, 2008)

Different strokes for different folks.  For plenty of photogs it's mostly about the gear and process.  For others gear just doesn't seem as important.  Most people probably fall somewhere in between.  

Admittedly having the right tools for the job tends to make the job easier, but the differences between this camera and that aren't anywhere near as important to the creation of good photos as what's going on in the photographer's mind and the world around them is.  I don't want to have to shoot wedding with a point-n-shoot camera, but if for some crazy reason I had too I could still get the job done and please the client.  

I love my cameras.  I'd bet I own more cameras than most folks on this forum.  That's because for about 10 years I was obsessed with the tools.  It took a long time for me to notice that I was sucking the same with 4x5 or point-n-shoot, and everything in between.  It didn't matter at all if I was using a "better" camera, because I was spending too much time and energy concentrating on the hammer, and I should be concentrating on building the house.  

I think most people aren't trying to cut you down when they compliment the tools rather than the artist, craftsperson, whatever...  But if you think they are just give them a steely stare, and with a dramatic tone in your voice lay some wisdom from the masters on them.  

"We don't take pictures with our cameras. We take them with our hearts and we take them with our minds, and the camera is nothing more than a tool." -Arnold Newman

"The mystery isn't in the technique, it's in each of us." -Harry Callahan

"Photography has not changed since its origin except in its technical aspects, which for me are not important." -Henri Cartier-Bresson

"...a lot of photographers think that if they buy a better camera they'll be able to take better photographs. A better camera won't do a thing for you if you don't have anything in your head or in your heart." -Arnold Newman

"Pictures, regardless of how they are created and recreated, are intended to be looked at. This brings to the forefront not the technology of imaging, which of course is important, but rather what we might call the eyenology (seeing)." -Henri Cartier-Bresson

...and my current signature from Minor White...


----------



## LuckyStarPhotography (Aug 13, 2008)

ksmattfish said:


> Different strokes for different folks. For plenty of photogs it's mostly about the gear and process. For others gear just doesn't seem as important. Most people probably fall somewhere in between.
> 
> Admittedly having the right tools for the job tends to make the job easier, but the differences between this camera and that aren't anywhere near as important to the creation of good photos as what's going on in the photographer's mind and the world around them is. I don't want to have to shoot wedding with a point-n-shoot camera, but if for some crazy reason I had too I could still get the job done and please the client.
> 
> ...


 
Thank you for the quotes.


----------



## abraxas (Aug 13, 2008)

Jon_Are said:


> Well, that would be rude, wouldn't it.
> 
> I'll concede that the nice camera comments were, deep down, not intended to be negative. What prompted me to post, though, was that person after person after person came up with that remark, and not _one_ mentioned that there may be some level of skill involved in producing a beautiful shot.
> 
> ...



Exactly.  I wouldn't read too much into it.   I believe the best response would be simply say "thank you" and get on with your life--art.


----------



## Mike_E (Aug 13, 2008)

If you are unwilling to say thank you, just look at them and say, "No, I have really talented fingers.".  Smile and walk away.


----------



## JerryPH (Aug 13, 2008)

You could just say "thanks, everyone is always quite impressed with my... tool. It's something that I am very proud of..."

I bet you get several raised eye brows... lol.

Look, seriously, it used to irk me a little too, but you have to understand... they do not have anymore understanding of photography than you would have of something that they specialized in.

We all dance to the beat of a different drum. Respect their comments, thank them... and move on.  They were not being disrespectful, indeed, they were trying to be complimentary, nothing more.  You cannot fault them for a lack of understanding nor their inability to construct the compliment to your standards.


----------



## castrol (Aug 13, 2008)

How new are you to showing your photos to these people? It took me couple of years to
get past the "nice camera" comments. After my friends started seeing more and more of
my photos, we got past those comments and into the realization that I may have a teensy
bit of talent. 

I don't think the "nice camera" comments will ever cease, but they have ceased from the
people I actually care to hear comments from...

Our equipment allows us to take a better _quality_ photo in clarity and color, and when
you add that into a properly exposed, well thought out photograph, it makes for a comment
worthy image.


----------



## Vautrin (Aug 13, 2008)

As a n00b I've got to say there is a lot for the camera.

I just bought an olympus evolt 510 to chronicle a vacation I'm taking.

I took photography back in college -- 3 credits of how to take black and white photos on a used pentax I bought for like $50.

So I know a little bit, but honestly not much at all.  And I'm am amazed by the shots I'll take sometimes.

I'll dial in the camera to landscape mode, and magically it changes the f-stop and the shutter speed and the iso, and everything so that the shot is perfect -- the fstop gives me good focus throughout (I don't even know if I want it a small number or a big number for that!), the shutter speed gives the right exposure for everything.

Then if a building is underexposed or the sky is overexposed, I just tell photmatix to change the level of the shadows.

If the subject is moving fast I turn on the sports mode and it takes a bunch of shots and I don't worry about hitting the shutter at the exact right moment.

I'm clueless, really.  But my photos get oohs and ahhs...  I just don't mention that it took me 150 bad shots to get the one random good one.  

-Dan


----------



## Jedo_03 (Aug 14, 2008)

My boss and her husband were invited to our house for dinner - she saw some of my framed pics on the wall and said "Oh, Joe - Your photographs are so lovely..." to which my wife retorted "Well, he has got a great camera..." I was fuming...
Anyways, at the dinner table the boss congratulated my wife on the meal "You are a lovely cook..." she said. To which I retorted "Well, she has got a great oven..."
I was in the dog-house for weeks...
Jedo


----------



## Battou (Aug 14, 2008)

Jedo_03 said:


> ... To which I retorted "Well, she has got a great oven..."
> ...
> Jedo


Fair is fair right


----------



## Tiberius47 (Aug 14, 2008)

Jedo_03 said:


> My boss and her husband were invited to our house for dinner - she saw some of my framed pics on the wall and said "Oh, Joe - Your photographs are so lovely..." to which my wife retorted "Well, he has got a great camera..." I was fuming...
> Anyways, at the dinner table the boss congratulated my wife on the meal "You are a lovely cook..." she said. To which I retorted "Well, she has got a great oven..."
> I was in the dog-house for weeks...
> Jedo



Awesome story.


----------



## Jon_Are (Aug 14, 2008)

> Well, she has got a great oven...


 
Love it.

LOVE IT!!!

Jon


----------

