# Wanna Make $100,000 a year?



## KmH

Put the camera away. Learn how to fix cars.
Shortage of Auto Mechanics Has Dealerships Taking Action


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## Hermes1

No question there are more certain and lucrative ways to earn a living than photography which has become increasingly more difficult and getting close to impossible.


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## 480sparky

I plan on continuing my chosen career:  Professional Lottery Winner.


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## Scoody

After a stellar amateur career as a boxer I decided to turn pro.  Pro boxing is a completely different animal.  I was stopped in the second round of my very first fight and never set foot in the ring again.


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## table1349

Welcome to the world to come.  The service industry is growing exponentially.  A college education will one day come second to an education into one service trade or another.


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## SoulfulRecover

Having worked as a tech for Dodge/Chrysler/Jeep, good luck making any where near 100k


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## Vtec44

I was an IT network engineer for 20 years making about that much.  I quit and started my own photography business making 50% more than when I was working for someone else.  It's a good thing because self employment tax is ridiculous!


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## unpopular

gryphonslair99 said:


> Welcome to the world to come.  The service industry is growing exponentially.  A college education will one day come second to an education into one service trade or another.



Young people are increasingly dissatisfied with traditional liberal education anyway. I don't think it will be long before universities start catching on and offer more technical four-year degrees that skip the general education nonsense.

I for one dropped out after getting enough experience in college to get a career before finishing gen eds.

Though, I'm not making 100k/year.


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## CdTSnap

Without being a show off... I make more than that from photography. I think the trick is the ones that don't stop growing and don't give up 


Sent from my iPhone using ThePhotoForum.com mobile app


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## CdTSnap

Depends on the field of course obviously. You'll never make a solid living off landscapes but it would be one of freedom and travel. Some would say that's more important. 


Sent from my iPhone using ThePhotoForum.com mobile app


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## smoke665

I left the corporate world in 1985 to start my last company. This wasn't the first time I'd started from the ground up, so that part didn't bother me, but it was the first time leaving a nice 6 figure job with all the frills to do it.  Looking back I'm glad I did, but at the time there was a lot of self doubt.  A lot of people are content to give up their independence to work a 9 to 5 job, and settle for a mediocre living. Doesn't matter if they have a college education or not, they get in a rut and stay there out of fear of the unknown.



gryphonslair99 said:


> A college education will one day come second to an education into one service trade or another.



This is one of the great fallacies of the modern world. Young people have been led to believe that a college degree is their automatic ticket to a high paying job, but the reality is there are a lot of degrees out there that aren't worth the paper they're printed on. In the 90's I had drivers making more than college graduates, in fact I had drivers with college educations that had left the jobs they trained for to drive, because of the pay difference. "A recent survey by the  National Association of Colleges and Employers found that for 10 broad degree categories ranging from engineering to communications, 2016 graduates are projected to have an average salary of $50,556. That’s up 5% from 2014, when new grads earned an average of $48,127." Here's What the Average Grad Makes Right Out of College  WTH, I had drivers with nothing more than a CDL and a clean driving record earning 50k 20 years ago.


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## KmH

There are exceptions to every rule.

According the the US Dept. of Labor only the top 15% or so of professional photographers have income (not revenue) of more than $50,000 a year.
The % of photographers in that 15% making more than $75,000 is also about 15%.
To make a living wage a working photographer needs to have yearly _revenues_ approaching $150k.

Photographers wanting to start in the business today have a tough row to hoe.
The 'churn' at the entry level has always been impressive but these days seems to be a negative percentage.
Many more people start a photography business that fails, or has to be supported with other income because the business doesn't at least break even, than there are photographers that earn a living income by the 3rd year they are in business and manage to stay in business until their 5th year.

Most new businesses, of any type, fail for 1 or both of these reasons:
1. Insufficient start-up capital.
2. The business owner lacks fundamental business management skills.

Way back in the day, as I was growing up I learned my business management skills in my families restaurant business.
They were very disappointed that I opted to become a photographer rather than a restaurateur.


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## unpopular

smoke665 said:


> Young people have been led to believe that a college degree is their automatic ticket to a high paying job



There is truth to this, but there are very few options out there for high paying jobs without a college degree and what a lot of older people don't understand about younger people is that we feel that there is value in doing something that we want to be doing, and we feel that this should be accounted for as well.

Yes, there a few jobs out there that pay higher than what I make that wouldn't require a college degree. Recently I saw an ad for sanitation workers that are paid about what I make - and not to knock the profession, I certainly do appreciate the garbage being taken away so I don't have to think about it - don't get me wrong.

But that's not something I'd actually want to do, and if that means I have to pay $100/month on my student loans, then doing something I've always wanted to do is worth $1200/year.

On the flip side I think there are some young people out there with really unrealistic ideas about what a genuine career is; and it's pretty easy after being told for a lifetime to "follow our dreams" while every single odd-specialty becomes super visible to us on the internet - giving a false impression that there is a burgeoning demand of underwater basket weavers, when in fact the ones we're inspired by are exceptional craftspeople in a very limited market.


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## table1349

unpopular said:


> smoke665 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Young people have been led to believe that a college degree is their automatic ticket to a high paying job
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On the flip side I think there are some young people out there with really unrealistic ideas about what a genuine career is; and it's pretty easy after being told for a lifetime to "follow our dreams" while every single odd-specialty becomes super visible to us on the internet - giving a false impression that there is a burgeoning demand of *underwater basket weavers,* when in fact the ones we're inspired by are exceptional craftspeople in a very limited market.
Click to expand...

Crap, and I just signed up for Underwater Basket Weaving 101 at The Phoenix University. 






Any one want to buy a snorkel and mask???


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## KmH

The job market is changing faster today than it ever has, making it a crap shoot to pick a college major that will have long term traction traction.
Young people should expect to go to college 2 or 3 times and have 5 or more 'careers'.

Young people could be facing a life of constantly being burdened with lots of education debt.


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## Derrel

Aren't their some nice career openings in unathorized pharmaceutical sales and delivery? And some high-paying jobs in sports- and horse- and dog-performance contest wagering and predictive outcome prognostication? Pretty sure none of those require advanced degrees...


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## table1349

KmH said:


> The job market is changing faster today than it ever has, making it a crap shoot to pick a college major that will have long term traction traction.
> Young people should expect to go to college 2 or 3 times and have 5 or more 'careers'.
> 
> Young people could be facing a life of constantly being burdened with lots of education debt.



There are jobs that 1. need no degree and 2. you will not have to change you career path 5 or 6 times and still make good money.

Every one wants clean water coming into their house so plumbers aren't going anywhere.

People want the crap, literally their crap gone from their house so septic and sewer works aren't going anywhere.

People want heat in the winter and cool in the summer so HVAC technicians aren't going anywhere.

People want their lights to turn on and off with out burning the house down.  Electricians aren't going anywhere.

They may not be glamorous jobs but if you have had to call any of the above recently you know that they are making good money.  The need for college will recede in the future as we are more and more becoming a service driven society.


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## smoke665

unpopular said:


> what a lot of older people don't understand about younger people is that we feel that there is value in doing something that we want to be doing, and we feel that this should be accounted for as well.



Sorry man, that’s another fallacy promogulated by my generation. My parents had first had knowledge of the great depression, they knew what real hardship was. Life for them was not so much about happiness as it was working to make sure they never had to endure it again. Then we came along, once removed from that life, and we just couldn’t believe our parents knew what they were talking about.  When we hit college, we were free from the gloom and doom mentality of work hard and save. We became the promoters of the free love, if it feels good do it mentality. We believed the crap until we graduated, and the realities of life smacked us in the face. Fortunately, we still had the words of our parents ringing in our ears and quickly realized the great Nirvana Society was false and our hopes of Xanadu were dashed.


We put our heads down and went to work, vowing to make life better for our kids and grandkids, which brings us to the present. The generations today are even further removed from what hardship really is, they erroneously believe that life will be good regardless of their actions.


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## unpopular

You can get off your high horse already. Millennial work more hours for less pay and we take fewer vacation time than any other generation in history. We're left with a four trillion dollar repair bill (and that's just for the highways and bridges) and we're expected to pay your retirement as part of a social contract that we never agreed to and will not likely benefit from.

So yeah. Forgive us if we value the time spent paying for your winter condo in Florida.


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## 480sparky




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## table1349

unpopular said:


> Millennial work more hours for less pay and we take fewer vacation time than any other generation in history.



False.  My great grandparents worked 10 hours a day, 6 days a week and did not get vacations. They also started doing so at a much younger age.  My grandparents worked 8 hours a days 6 days a week.  Neither did so by choice, that was the way it was if you wanted a job and wanted to live.  Nor did they have sick time or sick pay.  You worked or you didn't get paid and risked loosing your job.   They didn't have college loans to pay off, but then they didn't have either the time or the money to go to college.  In my great grandparents day 1/3 of the labor force was between 10 and 15 years of age. For my grandparents if fell to 25% of the work force between 10 and 15 years of age.  If you want to talk about farming the number for both generations was 2/3rds of the labor force were between 10 and 15 years of age.  
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/d3/87/57/d38757247db83a49f1f6cffefa4f2856.jpg
I will say that the Millennials have done an excellent job of exacerbating the work martyr concept by their own choice.   

Solution!


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## smoke665

unpopular said:


> Millennial work more hours for less pay and we take fewer vacation time than any other generation in history



What exactly does that have to do with your statement  "But that's not something I'd actually want to do, and if that means I have to pay $100/month on my student loans, then doing something I've always wanted to do is worth $1200/year" and your claim that you're willing to take less in earnings to do something you want. Isn't that the position you voluntarily put yourself in?

My comment never questioned your work ethic. Choosing to work a lower paying job with a college degree because it makes you happy, is a decision you said you made. If I understand that correctly no one forced you to make that decision.  I made a decision to follow a different path using a degree as a starting point, and I can assure you that the retirement I enjoy was self funded, because I chose a route that provided for my an end goal.


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## smoke665

gryphonslair99 said:


> My great grandparents worked 10 hours a day, 6 days a week



Depending on their occupation it was likely more than that.


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## Gary A.

Who actually cares about generalizations on any topic?  Generalizations are as true as they are false, as easily defensible as they are to attack. 

Besides it's all about quality of life.


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## limr

It's always amazing how certain people are in their opinions about their generation compared to the ones before or after it, and how little evidence they actually have to support any of those opinions. And yet, the spouting continues...

As for a college education, don't expect them to go away any time soon just because there's some job growth in the service industry. Sure, there is the potential for high salaries in those fields, but a person is more likely to earn those top salaries if they have even a 2-year degree.

And general education requirements aren't going anywhere either. I know it's oh-so-popular to disparage the value of these courses, but again, most lay criticisms are thrown out without any evidence to prove the supposed uselessness of the courses.


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## Gary A.

It is not about money, but quality of life. (Lol). (Personally and Generally, lol, I don't think college should be about earning money.  College should be about learning.  College should be about chasing your desires and interests.  College should be about advancing knowledge and the arts. If one can combine love of a major with employment then more power to you.  That is called upping your quality of life.)


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## table1349

Millennial College Graduates: Young, Educated, Jobless
More College Grads Finding Work, But Not in the Best Jobs
College Graduates Struggle to Find Employment Worth a Degree
‘I don’t know what to do with my major’ and other reasons college grads can’t find jobs
So Long, Middle Class: Middle-Income Jobs Are Disappearing the Fastest

Colleges will not go away, but change in their education model, who and how they educate are inevitable in our more rapidly evolving society.  Drs. Bruce K. Blaylock, Tal Zarankin, and Dale A. Henderson wrote an excellent article on the subject of restructuring the learning environment in the college system of education.  
The Higher Education Teaching and Learning Portal |   Restructuring Colleges in Higher Education around Learning


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## smoke665

Gary A. said:


> I don't think college should be about earning money.



Hate to disagree with you but, with total costs from $10- $100k per academic year (depending on the school), you better believe it's about the money. Sorry, I saw a lot of job applicants come in my door over the years with useless degrees, I for one believe encouraging a young person "to expand their horizon" with a degree that's totally unmarketable, while emptying (theirs & their parents) pocket of thousands of dollars, is wrong.


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## limr

Gary A. said:


> It is not about money, but quality of life. (Lol). (Personally and Generally, lol, I don't think college should be about earning money.  College should be about learning.  College should be about chasing your desires and interests.  College should be about advancing knowledge and the arts. If one can combine love of a major with employment then more power to you.  That is called upping your quality of life.)



I understand your point. I used to agree with it more, but recently, I've been changing my mind. College is certainly about all those things, but for it to be _only_ that is a luxury for most people. Gone are the days when college served to create well-rounded individuals fit for polite society. It's much more utilitarian these days. The fact is, there is room for both purposes.


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## limr

I think it's disingenuous to think of a person's degree as "useless" because it doesn't fit into the job description. Inappropriate for the context, perhaps, in some cases, but not useless.


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## SoulfulRecover

Not sure where I am going with this but; I wanted to go to a community college when I was 18 because I had no idea what I wanted to do. My fathers exact words were "No kid of mine is going to a community college" so I ended up paying out of state tuition going to Colorado State. I was lucky and my grandfather left my siblings and I money which was then invested into Apple and Dell. My brother and sister wasted away their money on fun things. I was responsible and paid for my tuition. (Had I just held onto the stock till now, I wouldn't have to worry about working) I was there for three years and found that I enjoyed photography. No photo program there so I transferred back to Austin to go to the Art Institute. All my tuition money was used up in those 3 years because of being an out of state student.

Went for a couple semesters, dropped out. Family issues meant I was "homeless" so I moved into my friends place. He got me a job working at a dealership for $8 an hour. It was a job and managed to get myself to the point of having enough money to get my own place. Barely though. I lived in "low income housing" and could only afford to eat noodles for dinner. It was rough but hell, I had my own place. I took classes for work with the promise of a raise but it never came. 5 years at the same job, kicking ass and still 8 an hour.

During that time I went back to the Art Institute to continue photography and I loved it. Got to the point on 23k of debt and knew if it was any more, I wouldn't be able to pay it off. Its 80k to get a photo degree from them. Its insane. So I dropped out again.

My now wife's boss's best friend was looking for a new accountant for his office. I resisted because I didn't want to be behind a computer but the dealership pissed me off so I left and took the accounting job. I knew nothing of it but was taught and now my boss is paying for my education as long as I pass my classes. I make salary (32k) have 3 weeks paid vacation, Christmas bonus and raises every year. I do not like my job but it provides so I do it.

So between the wife and I we make more than the average income for our area. Being placed into the entitled Millennial category because of my age really sucks. I do not feel I am apart of "their" culture as I am closer in age to Gen X but even that's pointless. 

My question is who's pocketing all this tuition money??? Instead of trying to not pay your tuition, people should be trying to figure out why the cost is so high to begin with. The teachers don't make anything. Is all the money going to sports? Why? Shouldn't the money go to education?

I have friends in my field of work and they make twice what I do because they have a degree. No idea what their student loans are like though


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## limr

SoulfulRecover said:


> My question is who's pocketing all this tuition money??? Instead of trying to not pay your tuition, people should be trying to figure out why the cost is so high to begin with. The teachers don't make anything. Is all the money going to sports? Why? Shouldn't the money go to education?
> 
> I have friends in my field of work and they make twice what I do because they have a degree. No idea what their student loans are like though



Read this: The Invisible Force Behind College Admissions


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## SoulfulRecover

limr said:


> SoulfulRecover said:
> 
> 
> 
> My question is who's pocketing all this tuition money??? Instead of trying to not pay your tuition, people should be trying to figure out why the cost is so high to begin with. The teachers don't make anything. Is all the money going to sports? Why? Shouldn't the money go to education?
> 
> I have friends in my field of work and they make twice what I do because they have a degree. No idea what their student loans are like though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Read this: The Invisible Force Behind College Admissions
Click to expand...


Very good read. Thank you for posting. Its nuts that its operated in such a way but I guess a business is a business and money is king.

Schools do a very poor job of informing the students what the various loans mean too and how theyre paid back. Basically I remember them just saying "heres loan 1 and loan 2. Now sign here" then scooted me out the door. Always slow to pay me but as soon as I owed $1, they would yell and scream about getting their money.


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## smoke665

Something that was still going when I was kid were the Apprenticeship Programs, for skilled trades. Then it kind of died away as not being cool. I've been pleasantly surprised in recent years to see a reemergence of the it as a partnership between the state and business. We've had a lot of industry move in (automotive, aerospace) that require skilled employees. Classroom training, followed by OJT is providing opportunities for not only young people but adults seeking to earn a decent living. It's a shame that it isn't being expanded for other fields.

@limr a very wise and successful businessman took me under his wing as a mentor during my college years. His words still hold meaning. "A degree in anything doesn't qualify you for a job, it provides a foundation to build on". The "useless" degrees I referred to earlier were "general studies" with nothing to build on, and no job experience.


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## limr

smoke665 said:


> @limr a very wise and successful businessman took me under his wing as a mentor during my college years. His words still hold meaning. "A degree in anything doesn't qualify you for a job, it provides a foundation to build on". The "useless" degrees I referred to earlier were "general studies" with nothing to build on, and no job experience.



But this still assumes that the only purpose for a degree is to train someone very specifically for a specific job. It dismisses the value of the critical thinking, research, and communication skills, for example, that are often hallmarks of liberal art curricula, and are often much more applicable to the 'real world' than most people realize. There are very few degrees that have built-in "job experience" (internships or clinical work, for example.) Otherwise, one gets job experience from, y'know, having a job.


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## waday

My few cents:

In my field especially (engineering), it seems as if a bachelor's degree is increasingly being seen as "not enough". Master's degrees are now typically preferred. One problem is that there isn't much of a pay difference between bachelor's and master's. But, I guess you make it up in marketability.

Too bad they don't generally teach "marketability" to college students. Let alone what "billability" means, or the fact that they'll be writing reports more than they'll be designing. 

Also, there are a considerable number of people that are no longer retiring and are staying around as long as they can. This puts a burden on us younger folk who are now having difficulty with upward mobility and taking on additional responsibilities that are no longer being passed down to us. Some of these soon-to-be retirees are even refusing to help teach and mentor these younger folk (likely for obvious reasons for being replaced). Problem is that hurts all of us.

It's not the same everywhere, but I've noticed this in at least three different companies I've worked for.

No longer can college graduates start in the mail room and become CEO. We have to jump from job to job every few years to get pay bumps and different titles. Otherwise, you stay at the same level and, if you're lucky, get a 1-3% raise. Sometimes I didn't get a raise. In the last 8 or so years, I've worked for 3 different companies. It was the only way for me to increase my pay AND increase my level of responsibility (despite the company being an international company with the "ability" to move and work on various projects.. ha!). 

As a side note: You want to be a factory worker without a degree? Sometimes that's not enough, either.


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## smoke665

@limr read my post "A degree in anything doesn't qualify you for a job, it provides a foundation to build on". There's not a big demand for free thinkers in the world without some basic understanding of the field they are entering, unless it's the government, and we all know how that's worked out. If the only thing you have to offer is a general studies degree and nothing else, would you want to go to a doctor who's assisting nurse has no basics? How about an accountant who lets a "free thinker with good communication skill" and no accounting basics, do you income tax?


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## limr

smoke665 said:


> @limr read my post "A degree in anything doesn't qualify you for a job, it provides a foundation to build on". There's not a big demand for free thinkers in the world without some basic understanding of the field they are entering, unless it's the government, and we all know how that's worked out. If the only thing you have to offer is a general studies degree and nothing else, would you want to go to a doctor who's assisting nurse has no basics? How about an accountant who lets a "free thinker with good communication skill" and no accounting basics, do you income tax?



I didn't say "free thinker"; I said "_critical_ thinking." Again, you are assuming that a general liberal arts curriculum is not providing a foundation. It's not all heads-in-the-clouds stuff they're learning.  And what general studies graduate is applying for nursing or accounting jobs? Of course that's not what I'm talking about. If that is happening, then it still doesn't mean that the degree is useless, but, as I originally said, "inappropriate for the context." There could be many reasons the person is applying for a job for which he or she is not trained, but it's still disingenuous to call their degree "useless" just because they're applying for the wrong jobs.

I'm talking about a person who graduated with a degree in, for example, humanities but applies for entry-level business positions and doesn't get hired because the assumption is that the person has no "useful" skills when in fact, many of the skills can transfer to a business environment.


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## table1349

SoulfulRecover said:


> limr said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SoulfulRecover said:
> 
> 
> 
> My question is who's pocketing all this tuition money??? Instead of trying to not pay your tuition, people should be trying to figure out why the cost is so high to begin with. The teachers don't make anything. Is all the money going to sports? Why? Shouldn't the money go to education?
> 
> I have friends in my field of work and they make twice what I do because they have a degree. No idea what their student loans are like though
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Read this: The Invisible Force Behind College Admissions
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Very good read. Thank you for posting. Its nuts that its operated in such a way but I guess a business is a business and money is king.
> 
> Schools do a very poor job of informing the students what the various loans mean too and how theyre paid back. Basically I remember them just saying "heres loan 1 and loan 2. Now sign here" then scooted me out the door. Always slow to pay me but as soon as I owed $1, they would yell and scream about getting their money.
Click to expand...

Sadly, it seems that higher education is less about education and more about making money.  

Another issue is the shift in faculty make up.  
College Professors: Before You Teach, Learn How!
More Than Half of College Faculty Are Adjuncts: Should You Care?

At the university I attended in the early 70's most of the instructors were full time employees of the university.  Most of them were also carrying a large class load.  Their office hours were necessary as it was usually the only time they weren't in the classroom.   65% of expenditures by 2 & 4 year institutions is for salaries alone these days.  Surprisingly 35% are for non teaching positions.  

I am personally familiar with several instructors at that same university that teach only one or two classes.


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## smoke665

waday said:


> it seems as if a bachelor's degree is increasingly being seen as "not enough". Master's degrees are now typically preferred.



My adult kids have found this out as well. Both went back after their MBA. One is accountant, one is the head of and IT department.

_No longer can college graduates start in the mail room and become CEO. We have to jump from job to job every few years to get pay bumps and different titles_

Unfortunately this hasn't changed all that much. I was taught from the beginning never stay at a company less than 2 years (or you'll be called a job jumper) or more than 5 (or they forget about you). Oldest son worked for a large Federal court system in one state in IT for 15 years and had stagnated. Took a job at a larger Federal court system in another state for a lot more pay and rapidly moved up the ladder to the IT Manger, and already eyeing Administrative Deputy Clerk spot. Had he stayed in the old spot he would still be in the toilet.


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## ClickAddict

limr said:


> ........There are very few degrees that have built-in "job experience" (internships or clinical work, for example.) Otherwise, one gets job experience from, y'know, having a job.



Actually, that was a major issue that Universities in at least our province have worked to overcome.  Many of the faculties have developped "Co-Op" type programs or other work related internships.

My son right now is working an 8 month term after about 4 terms of study (he studied through his first summer after year 1 and only started his work term in January).  Then back to school for probably 8 months before being back to another work term.  Will add about 1-2 years of university life, but once he's graduated he should have about 2 years worth of Practical job experience in his field.

computer Science, Engineering, Nursiong, Teaching... all have long ago developed internships.  I've heard many of the business programs have some now as well (not sure how well implemented they are yet)

There's big money to be had in education so they are not sitting around on old ways... they are listening and adapting as much as they can.


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## waday

smoke665 said:


> Unfortunately this hasn't changed all that much. I was taught from the beginning never stay at a company less than 2 years (or you'll be called a job jumper) or more than 5 (or they forget about you). Oldest son worked for a large Federal court system in one state in IT for 15 years and had stagnated. Took a job at a larger Federal court system in another state for a lot more pay and rapidly moved up the ladder to the IT Manger, and already eyeing Administrative Deputy Clerk spot. Had he stayed in the old spot he would still be in the toilet.


Glad to hear that he's moving up after changing jobs! I've found the same. I'm moving into more of a managerial role, which would not have happened at my last job. As you very correctly put it, I was "forgotten" after about 5 years. I was only remembered when I quit.


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## smoke665

@waday sometimes the forgetfulness isn't intentional. Sometimes you simply hit a barrier with a company, as in there isn't anywhere to go above you, until someone else is promoted, fired, or retires.


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## limr

ClickAddict said:


> limr said:
> 
> 
> 
> ........There are very few degrees that have built-in "job experience" (internships or clinical work, for example.) Otherwise, one gets job experience from, y'know, having a job.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, that was a major issue that Universities in at least our province have worked to overcome.  Many of the faculties have developped "Co-Op" type programs or other work related internships.
> 
> My son right now is working an 8 month term after about 4 terms of study (he studied through his first summer after year 1 and only started his work term in January).  Then back to school for probably 8 months before being back to another work term.  Will add about 1-2 years of university life, but once he's graduated he should have about 2 years worth of Practical job experience in his field.
> 
> computer Science, Engineering, Nursiong, Teaching... all have long ago developed internships.  I've heard many of the business programs have some now as well (not sure how well implemented they are yet)
> 
> There's big money to be had in education so they are not sitting around on old ways... they are listening and adapting as much as they can.
Click to expand...


Yes, I'm aware that there's a push to include more "experiential" or "applied" learning opportunities and requirements into programs that traditionally didn't have them previously (I was on a committee  ). The other buzzword term is "guided pathways" especially in community colleges. It's all a push to drive not just enrollment in programs but _completion_ and entry into the workforce. 

So yes, in the future, there will be more new graduates who apply for their first jobs with more job experience, like you have in many more technical, skill-oriented, STEM field majors. 

But even so, general education requirements aren't going to go by the wayside, nor should they. They still teach valuable "soft" skills that are needed in the workplace. A college education should still mean that a person is _not _just learning job skills and knowledge, but is also learning critical thinking, communication, autonomy...it should give a person a broadened perspective on the world. Even the most skill-oriented college program is not the same as (and should not be the same as) a program at a trade school or apprenticeship.


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## KmH

gryphonslair99 said:


> KmH said:
> 
> 
> 
> The job market is changing faster today than it ever has, making it a crap shoot to pick a college major that will have long term traction traction.
> Young people should expect to go to college 2 or 3 times and have 5 or more 'careers'.
> 
> Young people could be facing a life of constantly being burdened with lots of education debt.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are jobs that 1. need no degree and 2. you will not have to change you career path 5 or 6 times and still make good money.
> 
> Every one wants clean water coming into their house so plumbers aren't going anywhere.
> 
> People want the crap, literally their crap gone from their house so septic and sewer works aren't going anywhere.
> 
> People want heat in the winter and cool in the summer so HVAC technicians aren't going anywhere.
> 
> People want their lights to turn on and off with out burning the house down.  Electricians aren't going anywhere.
> 
> They may not be glamorous jobs but if you have had to call any of the above recently you know that they are making good money.  The need for college will recede in the future as we are more and more becoming a service driven society.
Click to expand...

Robots are already taking over many service jobs. There are even robotic surgery suites in some hospitals, so even surgeons can be replaced by robots. 

Plumbers, electricians, HVAC techs are all going to lose their jobs to robots in the not distant future.
Those systems will be designed by robots to facilitate the use of robots to install and repair them.
For a short time humans will still be needed to repair the older systems still in use, but robots will quickly be able to repair even those systems.

So the real question becomes - As robots proliferate, how will people make enough money to live?


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## table1349

KmH said:


> gryphonslair99 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> KmH said:
> 
> 
> 
> The job market is changing faster today than it ever has, making it a crap shoot to pick a college major that will have long term traction traction.
> Young people should expect to go to college 2 or 3 times and have 5 or more 'careers'.
> 
> Young people could be facing a life of constantly being burdened with lots of education debt.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are jobs that 1. need no degree and 2. you will not have to change you career path 5 or 6 times and still make good money.
> 
> Every one wants clean water coming into their house so plumbers aren't going anywhere.
> 
> People want the crap, literally their crap gone from their house so septic and sewer works aren't going anywhere.
> 
> People want heat in the winter and cool in the summer so HVAC technicians aren't going anywhere.
> 
> People want their lights to turn on and off with out burning the house down.  Electricians aren't going anywhere.
> 
> They may not be glamorous jobs but if you have had to call any of the above recently you know that they are making good money.  The need for college will recede in the future as we are more and more becoming a service driven society.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Robots are already taking over many service jobs. There are even robotic surgery suites in some hospitals, so even surgeons can be replaced by robots.
> 
> Plumbers, electricians, HVAC techs are all going to lose their jobs to robots in the not distant future.
> Those systems will be designed by robots to facilitate the use of robots to install and repair them.
> For a short time humans will still be needed to repair the older systems still in use, but robots will quickly be able to repair even those systems.
> 
> So the real question becomes - As robots proliferate, how will people make enough money to live?
Click to expand...

Well I doubt that either you or I will live to see this happen.  I have had two surgeries in the "robotic surgery" suites.  Surgeons are not going anywhere, well except to the chair to operate the robot.  The surgeon still performs the surgery, they are however assisted by the robotic machine the surgeon operates.  The robotic machine can be more precise in it's movements than the human hands.  It still takes 2 surgeons to conduct the operation as well as the anesthesiologist, and surgical nurses.  

I seriously doubt we will see robotic HVAC, electrical or plumber robots coming to our homes.  The robots used in all of those professions are assembly robots.  They can perform the same repetitive movement faster and more accurately than humans and don't need bathroom breaks, lunch breaks or 8 hour work days.  They still need humans to program their operations.  Rosie from the Jetsons is still just a TV cartoon.


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## Vtec44

What are we talking about again?


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## smoke665

Looks like this thread is............................


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## table1349

smoke665 said:


> Looks like this thread is............................
> 
> View attachment 140209


These guys would agree........


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