# How did you get your photography job?



## Forkie (Feb 16, 2011)

If you have one that is!!

Are you self employed/Freelance with a client base, working for a single company on a freelance contract, on a single company's payroll?  Or any other type of photography employment?

Now, I'm by no means a professional photographer, I'd barely have the guts to call myself an amateur yet, so I was really lucky to get my job as a Product Photographer.

I went for an interview for my company for an administration job, and in the interview we happened to get chatting about photography because they spotted it on my CV as an interest.  I didn't get the job I went for, but about 6 weeks later they called me asked if I would like to work for them as a product photographer.

After some pay negotiations I said "yes", and was given the choice of going on a freelance contract or being put on their payroll.  

I chose to go on their payroll, basically because I can't be bothered to sort out my own taxes and it gives me more security whilst I build up some experience for a couple of years before looking for a more adventurous job in the field.

It's not the most creative or exciting area of photography, but at least when someone asks me what I do, I can say "I'm photographer, don'tya know!".

How did you start your photography career and where are you now?


----------



## Formatted (Feb 16, 2011)

You would barely call yourself amateur, but you've taken a job as a "professional" photographer.

Right...


----------



## Forkie (Feb 16, 2011)

Formatted said:


> You would barely call yourself amateur, but you've taken a job as a "professional" photographer.
> 
> Right...




What I mean by that is that my level of experience of photography as a hobby before getting this job would not be anywhere near enough to label myself as an accomplished amateur, let alone a professional. Before this job I was quite definitely a hobbyist, not an amateur photographer (which I think implies a higher degree of knowledge and experience).

I was lucky to get my job - particularly in a time where jobs are scarce, and hopefully this entry level job will provide the important experience needed to eventually become 'proper' professional.


----------



## Formatted (Feb 16, 2011)

> I was lucky to get my job - particularly in a time where jobs are scarce, and hopefully this entry level job will provide the important experience needed to eventually become 'proper' professional.



Well congrats

So I guess you'll be sorting out your public liability insurance, professional indemnity insurance, new cameras, new lenses and a new lighting rig then.


----------



## Forkie (Feb 16, 2011)

I'm not sure I like your tone, but at some point in the future, yes.  :meh:


----------



## KmH (Feb 16, 2011)

I'm not sure how it works there, but here in the US by being on the payroll as a photographer, the company would own the copyright to *all* the photographs you make for them. Here it's called work-for-hire. You would need permissson from the copyright owner (the company paying you) to use the photos in any way, like a portfolio.

The flip side of that is that on a feelance contract basis you would retain copyright to all the photos you made and not only charge a creative fee for your time, but also license usage fees. As long as exclusive use was not needed by the licensee additional incom,e could be made selling the phots as stock.

In short here in the US, photographers on the payroll usually make considerably less money than do freelance shooters.


----------



## Forkie (Feb 17, 2011)

That is correct.  I don't hold the copyright for the images I take.  However, a perk of the job is that I have free use of the studio whenever I like, so there would be no problem with me taking a few shots on my own time, with my own camera (the company provides a camera to prevent wear and tear on my own) for my portfolio.

The reason I chose to go on their payroll is because jobs are hard to come by in these recession times, and right now I prefer the security of being employed.  And as this is my first photography job, I plan on staying for at least 2-3 years to get a reasonable amount of commercial experience under my belt before taking on the big cruel world on my own.


----------



## Formatted (Feb 17, 2011)

> That is correct. I don't hold the copyright for the images I take.



Why would you give away copyright?!


----------



## Forkie (Feb 17, 2011)

Formatted said:


> > That is correct. I don't hold the copyright for the images I take.
> 
> 
> Why would you give away copyright?!



The copyright isn't mine in the first place.  I am an in-house photographer taking photos of the stock for the company to place on their website.  Before I arrived they sent most of the stock to a third party product photography company to take the photos -  they didn't and don't have copyright either.  

Whoever takes the photos for Argos, Ikea, B&Q, Boots, or whatever other company also don't own the copyright to the photos, the copyright is owned by the company.  

The cameraman doesn't own the copyright to his camera work in a movie and neither does the designer of Coca Cola's logo own the copyright to that.


----------



## Formatted (Feb 17, 2011)

> I am an in-house photographer taking photos of the stock for the company to place on their website.



You'd be much much better off working as a third party, charging them stock prices rather than a set salary, you will be knocking out more photos for less money that way.


----------



## spacefuzz (Feb 17, 2011)

good luck, I hope its a lot of fun!

Funny thing about owning your work.  I am an aerospace engineer and I certaintly dont own the rights to the work I do for my company, so no reason to expect that if you are working as an in-house photographer you would own your own pics.  In fact some NDA's and contracts I have signed pledged all of my thoughts and ideas (even on my own time) to the company.  

Can you imagine the uproar here if companies started owning the rights to ALL of your photographic work while your employed by them?


----------



## Cinka (Feb 17, 2011)

Figures a company would hire a civilian for a product photography job. They couldn't possibly hire a pro. No offense. It's why, you'll start to notice, how terrible product photography on the web is. 

I did product photography for 3 years (100-150 images shot per day plus email blasts and marketing material). It was a thankless job and I was creatively stifled. When I departed, I went freelance. I now shoot weddings and portraits - couldn't be happier.


----------



## Formatted (Feb 17, 2011)

> Figures a company would hire a civilian for a product photography job. They couldn't possibly hire a pro.



Finally someone said what I was thinking.


----------



## MichiganFarts (Feb 17, 2011)

I don't get why it's such a sin around here to not hire a pro, when that gets done in so many other professional fields too.

Heck, when I was 15 me and a buddy mowed lawns for local businesses who didn't want the cost of professional lawn maintenance.  I never heard any local lawn care services balk about my piss poor work, and the customers were happy.  

What's the problem if the end product pleases the customer?  

Even here at my current job we have lower quality presses, and higher quality presses.  Some customers demand the high quality, some don't care and just want to save money.


----------



## y75stingray (Feb 17, 2011)

Forkie said:


> If you have one that is!!
> 
> Are you self employed/Freelance with a client base, working for a single company on a freelance contract, on a single company's payroll? Or any other type of photography employment?
> 
> ...


 


Well  you and I sir are one of the same! I too am a product photographer. When I started this position two years ago I literally knew nothing of photography. not even the basics but I knew some photoshop and B.S.ed my way through an interview and got the job. I then spent every moment of my freetime for the next three weeks in the bookstore researching photography "thank you Light Science and Magic" along with many other books. so now even though the company I work for owns most of my product shots I have a pretty impresive portfolio and can brag about all the magizines my images have been in to my friends!
Further more I get to use ALL of the photography equiptment for my personal use and projects  and have learned a ton while getting paid! Gotta love it!


----------



## Rekd (Feb 17, 2011)

Wow. 

Lots of RAWR!!! in this thread.  

Congrats on the job. It's a start and you should be proud of that. 

Back on topic: I fell into photography as a part of my part-time writing jobs. I started out blogging for free, realized other bloggers got paid, and applied at CreativeWeblogging and got hired on at like $7.00 per post writing about family-based motorsports recreation.

I was able to leverage that to get track access to some CORRacing events and other motorsports things, which increasingly encouraged me to get better camera equipment.

That helped me land my first international print magazine gig with ATV Magazine, my first internet magazine gig with ATV Source Magazine, and then many other gigs including on-line gigs, newspapers, local magazines etc.

Now I've got a steady gig with About.com (New York Times Company) and continue to write for magazines and newspapers, both online and in print.

This week was another milestone for me. ATV Source Magazine contacted me and asked me to represent them at a Kawasaki Press Ride for their new quad. Kawasaki is going to fly me up to Medford Oregon and pay for everything and I get to ride quads and take pictures all day, then sell the articles/photos to the magazine.

I've done a press ride before for Yamaha but Yamaha contacted me via my About.com site. This time a magazine contacted me instead of the other way around. (I usually query the magazine and offer articles/reviews etc).

Probably a small step in the eyes of some here but it's a good feeling to know I was the first choice for the magazine to represent them.

So far my writing has not only helped me get into photography but it has also literally paid for ALL my equipment many times over. :thumbup:


----------



## Forkie (Feb 17, 2011)

Formatted said:


> > I am an in-house photographer taking photos of the stock for the company to place on their website.
> 
> 
> You'd be much much better off working as a third party, charging them stock prices rather than a set salary, you will be knocking out more photos for less money that way.



I totally agree that if I was a freelancer, or had a third party company I could probably charge them a lot more, but as a photographer starting out, the offer of a fairly good salary for taking photos all day was too good an offer to pass up.

And right now, the experience is golden to me rather than a huge salary and as I can use the studio in my own time, I can add to my portfolio as I wish.  We all have to start somewhere, right?



Cinka said:


> Figures a company would hire a civilian for a  product photography job. They couldn't possibly hire a pro. No offense.  It's why, you'll start to notice, how terrible product photography on  the web is.
> 
> I did product photography for 3 years (100-150 images shot per day plus  email blasts and marketing material). It was a thankless job and I was  creatively stifled. When I departed, I went freelance. I now shoot  weddings and portraits - couldn't be happier.



Hi Cinka, you're right, of course companies will hire a non-pro if it saves them money and it's not the most creative of photography genres!  I'm taking up to 250 shots per day (useable ones that is) and the thanks is more a pat on the back than a financial bonus.  However, the experience is invaluable, regardless of all that.

Rekd, that's a great story.  Thanks!  That gives me some encouragement (not that I'm not already encouraged!)


----------



## Stephen.C (Feb 17, 2011)

Congrats on the job! 
I've always been told part of getting a job is being in the right place at the right time, and also just being lucky. 

Reading this thread though has made me lose some faith in the professional photography career game lmao.


----------



## Forkie (Feb 18, 2011)

Stephen.C said:


> Congrats on the job!
> I've always been told part of getting a job is being in the right place at the right time, and also just being lucky.
> 
> Reading this thread though has made me lose some faith in the professional photography career game lmao.



You're right, it is all about about luck.  If I hadn't kept photography as an interest on my CV (which apparently, is a CV faux pas) and had got the job I originally applied for, I may never have this job.

I think professional photography (certainly as a freelancer) must be hard.  I do worry about eventually hating it if I go freelance and don't enjoy the rest of the stuff that goes along with being a freelancer (marketing, financial stuff, etc.), but I guess there's only one way to find out!


----------



## spacefuzz (Feb 21, 2011)

Forkie said:


> I think professional photography (certainly as a freelancer) must be hard.  I do worry about eventually hating it if I go freelance and don't enjoy the rest of the stuff that goes along with being a freelancer (marketing, financial stuff, etc.), but I guess there's only one way to find out!


 
I would have the same worry if I was to ever go into photography with the need to make enough money to eat.  Seems to be a lot of unhappy pro photographers out there.


----------



## SCraig (Mar 1, 2018)

And third ... it's a 7 year old thread.


----------



## jcdeboever (Mar 1, 2018)

And 4th, it took away 5 minutes of my life reading it, will never recover those 5 min


----------



## MidnightUK (Mar 7, 2018)

Well, I am glad this thread resurfaced as I have now read the OPs bio (which is updated to at least 2015, possibly more recent?) and he seems to have continued as a pro photographer doing various subjects, there is hope for us all.
Ian Forknall - Biography - IMDb


----------

