# Homeless Guy



## SensePhoto (Jun 25, 2011)

Took this one last night with my iPhone. I guess no matter whats happening in your life at the moment it could always be worse...




Picture (3 of 4).jpg by Anton Bachuk, on Flickr


----------



## The_Traveler (Jun 25, 2011)

this is homeless porn.
you are using this man's helplessness and problems to get some response yet the picture is poorly conceived and tells nothing more than 'hey, look at me, i'm poor and lying here in a doorway.'

if i was a mod these kinds of pictures would not be allowed.


----------



## SensePhoto (Jun 25, 2011)

The_Traveler said:


> this is homeless porn.
> you are using this man's helplessness and problems to get some response yet the picture is poorly conceived and tells nothing more than 'hey, look at me, i'm poor and lying here in a doorway.'
> 
> if i was a mod these kinds of pictures would not be allowed.



I know u gotta be an asshole cause thats your thing, but i can care less if i get any responses on this picture, it was a quick poor quality snapshot by a cellphone that i liked cause it puts things in perspective, it sure did for me.


----------



## The_Traveler (Jun 25, 2011)

Colldfire said:


> I know u gotta be an asshole cause thats your thing



I don't have to be but in this case, it's almost enjoyable and certainly deserved.




Colldfire said:


> but i can care less if i get any responses on this picture,



Actually, in written English, the proper phrase would be 'I couldn't care less'; but then you probably couldn't care less about proper English.




Colldfire said:


> it was a quick poor quality snapshot by a cellphone



Well, we do agree on something.



Colldfire said:


> cause it puts things in perspective, it sure did for me.



You mean like being poor, out of work, homeless means one might be sleeping in a public place? That must have been quite a revelation to you considering how the plight of being poor and homeless has been so hidden from the public eye. 
Clearly you will now be pawning your camera and cellphone to work among the needy.

While reading your post I remembered this quote from the movie Blazing Saddles when the hero has been sorely disappointed at how people act and he is being consoled by his friend.


> You've got to remember that these are just simple people. These are people of the land. The common clay of this country. You know... morons.


----------



## kundalini (Jun 25, 2011)

This certainly deserves "Quote of the Day" status....................



The_Traveler said:


> While reading your post I remembered this quote from the movie Blazing Saddles when the hero has been sorely disappointed at how people act and he is being consoled by his friend.
> 
> 
> > You've got to remember that these are just simple people. These are people of the land. The common clay of this country. You know... morons.


----------



## SensePhoto (Jun 25, 2011)

The_Traveler said:


> Colldfire said:
> 
> 
> > I know u gotta be an asshole cause thats your thing
> ...



The fact that you sit down and find it necessary to rip anyone to shreds once you find something you disagree with is simply pathetic and shows that you're just a poor soul with absolutely nothing to do and probably not very happy with your own life. But i do appreciate your great wisdom and criticism, thanks for the entertaining me


----------



## shortpants (Jun 25, 2011)

You know, I have to agree with The_Traveler. I'm not trying to be snarky, shots like this just feel cheap.


----------



## The_Traveler (Jun 25, 2011)

Colldfire said:


> The fact that you sit down and find it necessary to rip anyone to shreds once you find something you disagree with is simply pathetic and shows that you're just a poor soul with absolutely nothing to do and probably not very happy with your own life. But i do appreciate your great wisdom and criticism, thanks for the entertaining me



Dear Anton,

I didn't 'rip  (you) to shred', I responded to the picture. 
I imagine that you wanted and expected a reaction, just not the one you got.
 That you took this as a personal attack is your own issue.  



Colldfire said:


> But i do appreciate your great wisdom and criticism



Again we agree about one thing - or two things.


----------



## Overread (Jun 25, 2011)

Since its kind of the way things are going in the thread I'm curious now - are we saying that street photography cannot/must not include those less affluent parts of society? That they must be excluded unless some specific level of quality result or some other criteria is full-filled before they join the rest of society on the street - between the viewfinder brackets of the street photographer?


----------



## The_Traveler (Jun 25, 2011)

Overread said:


> Since its kind of the way things are going in the thread I'm curious now - are we saying that street photography cannot/must not include those less affluent parts of society? That they must be excluded unless some specific level of quality result or some other criteria is full-filled before they join the rest of society on the street - between the viewfinder brackets of the street photographer?



I think that people, who by circumstances live a more public life than we, should be accorded some respect.  That their condition shouldn't be exploited cheaply.  If the picture says something more than pointing to them as a sad object then it becomes a statement and is useful.  If it is just exploitative of their condition or situation, however good it is technically it is, imo, unethical.


----------



## Hill202 (Jun 25, 2011)

Sigh...some things never change.


----------



## Edsport (Jun 26, 2011)

I think a photographer should photograph things like this and bring more awareness about these homeless people. Maybe and just maybe someone just might help a stranger just because of seeing a photo like this. Just my 2 cents worth...


----------



## JA_Photography (Jun 26, 2011)

Awareness raising or not, this photo is awesome. The lines are fantastic and the light is great. I think the perspective it offers is an added bonus... Just my 2 cents...


----------



## usayit (Jun 26, 2011)

I'm not going to get into the debate about whether or not the homeless should be photographed BUT I have a question...

Why must people who photograph the homeless must always do it while they are asleep?  

Honestly... most of us more fortunate would look just as vulnerable taking a nap on some bench.  You want to do some street journalism/photography?  tell a story.. that means capturing something about the person.  Sleeping doesn't say much except that they are human and need their sleep just like the rest of us.


----------



## Destin (Jun 26, 2011)

I disagree with everyone saying shots like this are tasteless. Do you remember anything from high school? Ptogressive era, yellow journalism, specifically muckrakers, and more specically Jacob Riis? He was a photographer/journalist who helped expose poor conditions in the city, and put pressure on the government to improve conditions. 

It's life. It isn't always going to be pretty. That doesn't mean we should turn our heads. Without awareness, the problem will only get worse. Photos are part of awareness


----------



## usayit (Jun 26, 2011)

There's a lot more to Jacob Riis' work than sleeping conditions....

His most powerful work was featuring the poor working in harsh conditions including child labor.  That's what I meant about telling a story beyond a person sleeping.


----------



## Destin (Jun 26, 2011)

usayit said:


> There's a lot more to Jacob Riis' work than sleeping conditions....



Correct, but I've seen some of his work, and alot of it is sleeping homeless people... just saying. I don't see a problem with taking photos like this, because it can help raise awareness.


----------



## usayit (Jun 26, 2011)

Neither do I... actually...

BUT

I simply would like people to try to get beyond sleeping people...... actually tell a story.


I've been known to take a photo of a homeless person (doing something), then tip them a $20.  They are very thankful.. for the most part.   The thing is.... I'm usually not really satisfied with the results.   Its tough actually.  Taking a person while asleep and EXTREMELY vulnerable... as already mentioned, these people live on the streets... is way to freakin easy, its been done, and doesn't really bring awareness any longer.   Back in Mr. Riis' time perhaps.. but not now.


----------



## Destin (Jun 26, 2011)

usayit said:


> Neither do I... actually...
> 
> BUT
> 
> ...



Honestly, I can't disagree with you at all on any of this.


----------



## Virtuosos (Jun 26, 2011)

I think the idea of taking photo's of homeless people are fine...I do not think, however, the description for the photo was appropriate.

Using a homeless person as a method of showing other people how better off their life is? No thanks. Its distasteful. It's like taking a photo of a kid riddled with disease and saying "Well, atleast you aren't him". 

Taking a photo of a homeless guy and simply stating "Down on his luck, but still sleeps soundly" would of been much more appropriate, atleast to me.



Anyways, the photo itself is pretty well-done...especially for using a phone camera. I am willing to bet the 2 pages this picture caused would of been avoided with a little more tact in the comment though.


----------



## bogeyguy (Jun 26, 2011)

Somebody needs a nappy! i don't think the OP was trying to exploit the person in the photo.


----------



## shortpants (Jun 26, 2011)

I'm not saying homeless people shouldn't be photographed. To me, a drive-by shot of some guy sleeping in an alley is exactly what it is, exactly what people see every single day in the city. It's not meaningful. It's not opening anyone's eyes unless they've been living under a rock, and to me it's disrespectful. Like they're not human and some exhibit for sheltered people to gawk at. 

 I had a friend that did a documentary series with some less fortunate people in our area. She got to know them, talked to them, listened to them cry, actually found out what their life stories were and who they were as people. She didn't just shoot some guy sleeping in an alley and act like it was something profound.

I don't know, I'm sorry if I can't explain myself well. Of course nothing is just black and white, so I can't say where to draw the line with street photography. 
To the OP, I'm not trying to attack you, I honestly don't think you meant any harm. This is just how I feel about the subject, very much my opinion so feel free to ignore.


----------



## Edsport (Jun 28, 2011)

A photograph of a sleeping person do tell a story...


----------



## The_Traveler (Jun 28, 2011)

Edsport said:


> A photograph of a sleeping person do tell a story...



yes, Ed, and if I caught a picture of you while you were bareass naked, sleeping in your bed, it would tell a story.  
Here is this grandfather, lots of wrinkles, maybe a little extra weight, hair all mussed, dick shrunken to a nub - ho, ho, ho - all asleep in a strange position

But you would be really pissed because your helplessness while you were asleep and your vulnerability was exploited.

That's my point.
Not everyone and every situation should be exploited for nothing, for adding nothing to the sum of our knowledge, there is a balance and most homeless porn goes over it.

Treat every person, no matter their circumstance, with the same respect that you would give your father or mother. Don't use their dignity for yet another in an infinite chain of meaningless photos.


----------



## SensePhoto (Jul 1, 2011)

bogeyguy said:


> Somebody needs a nappy! i don't think the OP was trying to exploit the person in the photo.



Not at all and i feel bad that ppl took it as if i was.


----------



## vtf (Jul 3, 2011)

I've seen this shot a thousand times, going to have to do better and different than this to capture my interest, up the game.  
Better luck next time. :thumbup:


----------



## Hooligan Dan (Jul 3, 2011)

Traveler, I have to ask, since you are so passionately taking a stand against this guys shot, how is coldfire's shot any different from your shot of the old , not homeless looking man sleeping on the bench, taken from far away, the homeless man eating, taken from far away, or your closeup of the homeless man sleeping? 

As a photojournalist who has done a lot of work with the homeless, beyond just seeing one on the street and snapping a photo, I do prefer, like you, photos of the homeless to be taken for a purpose and not just because one can take the photo, but to call someone out for something that it appears you have done yourself is quite hypocritical. 

As far as the Coldfire's photo goes, I'd say it's not a bad since it was taken with an iPhone. Interesting composure and the noise level is better than I would have expected.


----------



## The_Traveler (Jul 3, 2011)

Hooligan Dan said:


> Traveler, I have to ask, since you are so passionately taking a stand against this guys shot, how is coldfire's shot any different from your shot of the old , not homeless looking man sleeping on the bench, taken from far away, the homeless man eating, taken from far away, or your closeup of the homeless man sleeping?



Since I can only assume that you were talking about pictures I took in SEA, all of those are part of documenting life as I saw it in that part of the world and showing all of it to people that haven't seen it up close. It is not any different, except in quality, from any PJ in shoots in a foreign country or in a difficult situation. When I do shoot people in extremis, I try to show more about the person than just 'here he is a homeless guy and that's all there is' so look. I don't do them casually and I don't do lots of it. I do enough of the ugly things where I travel to show that real and sometimes unpleasant life exists behind the scenic stuff.


----------



## Timoris (Jul 4, 2011)

I am planning to shoot the homeless, but, the way I am going to go about it is hand them a cigarette or dollar as payment for a few shots. That seems fair.

The homeless, when staring, have interesting faces. Cracked, scarred, deep. Interesting to explore with a Red filter in B&W.

While asleep, it makes them seem more like a zoo exhibit, IMO.


----------



## joealcantar (Jul 4, 2011)

I imagine if we were to interview both the subject and the photographer as to why the shot was taken in front of each other it would be another story.  We really don't know what was going through the photographers head when they took the shoot , were they with friends and laughing "hold on let me get this homeless guy".  Was he walking around putting together something so he could make a statement of conditions?  Was he showing off on what the I-Phone could do?  To me it does not tell me a story , just a shot of a guy down on his luck that could be any of us at any time.  Is the guy a victim of our government since he is wearing a GI's Field Jacket?    
-





-
Shoot well, Joe


----------



## K8-90 (Jul 4, 2011)

Wow. Snarky people here...

I think the shot is great, actually. The lighting, the angle, the lines and the subject come together nicely.


----------



## Glycerol Sound (Jul 5, 2011)

Color and geometry/composition are okay, not the greatest, but not completely terrible either. I have no issue with taking photos of homeless people, and I'm not sure how much we should be worried about "taste" in art anymore anyway :razz:

I have also taken a few photos of people who were probably homeless (can't always tell ya know), although my photography is considerably less candid than this. I usually go right up to a person and get my camera pointed right at their soul, which usually requires permission. Often times they ask for a dollar or a cigarette (which is of course exactly what the homeless need) and I don't mind paying people small amounts for a street portrait. But to each his own style of course. 

I feel like going out of the normal standards of art, but especially people photography (senior portraits, weddings, crap like that), theres always a chance of turning out less than tasteful work by some standards (which might actually be the artistic intention, artists are strange people aren't we?), but like anything that you want to make your own, you have to work to develop it and with that will come taste (or distaste, I suppose). My 1¢


----------

