# Kodak Filing For Bankruptcy ??



## bruce282 (Oct 3, 2011)

I heard on the radio this morning that Kodak has retained a law firm, denies it is getting ready to file for bankruptcy. 

Hope it's not true, I love their B&W films.


Bruce


----------



## compur (Oct 3, 2011)

Kodak 9/30/2011 said:


> in response to rumors circulating in the capital markets ... Kodak is committed to meeting all of its obligations and has no intention of filing for bankruptcy. ..."



Full press release here.


----------



## Derrel (Oct 3, 2011)

Yeah, and the Beatles said they'd be together forever...then John hooked up with Yoko Ono...


----------



## PhotoWrangler (Oct 3, 2011)

The same story was on Yahoo news on the 30th. 

Kodak shares plunge as bankruptcy fears escalate - Yahoo! Finance


----------



## compur (Oct 3, 2011)

Time to stock up on Kodak film!


----------



## ghache (Oct 3, 2011)

i have about 130 rolls in the fridge! im good


----------



## compur (Oct 3, 2011)

Buy more film!  When Kodak goes belly up you can sell it on eBay and make a fortune. Hurry!








(Disclaimer: the author of this post has no clue what will happen in the future and nothing 
in this post should be construed as investment advice.)


----------



## 2WheelPhoto (Oct 3, 2011)

Back in the 80's when we were shooting some film for fun in europe I'd have not bet on fuji-film being around longer than King Kodak.


----------



## JosephKubik (Nov 15, 2011)

The day Kodak goes under will be a sad day...  then people with massive stocks in their freezers will be filling ebay with the extinct product.


----------



## compur (Nov 15, 2011)

Yes, you should buy more Kodak film now and stock up!


----------



## JosephKubik (Nov 15, 2011)

I already put in my order for 100' of Kodak Portra, T-max, and Tri-x... should last me a few months, I hope.


----------



## MLeeK (Nov 15, 2011)

They've been hinting at this FOREVER... It will come to pass sooner or later.


----------



## Derrel (Nov 16, 2011)

"Every dinosaur has his day."

Buggy whip makers went under. "Hurricane" lamp makers used to sell millions of lamps every year...then along came electricity and the incandescent bulb. Muzzle loading firearms gave way to cartridge loaders. Glass plates gave way to film.

Kodak has announced that it will soon stop making 35mm motion picture film, since now video has taken over the role of film in the movie and documentary biz. The 8-track tape is dead. Sony's Betamax is dead. VHS is basically dead. People buy 99 percent of their music as downloads now, not tapes or vinyl records. Even though all the things above are not commonplace as they once were, they're still obtainable, with the right sources and some persistence at locating sellers. (Well, not sure about glass plates, ready-made, but maybe???).

Kodak is not the only imaging company in dire straits--Olympus is in grave danger.

As far as Kodak filing for bankruptcy, there was a really good article on Kodak's many,many missteps and ridiculous efforts at creating markets in which they wished to become competitive in. This article was written by Ctein,and must have been published on The Online Photographer (TOP) in September I think. Kodak has been shedding divisions, and tens of thousands of employees for the last 15 years or more. Kodak was once a huge, diverse company--and one that made a long series of critical mistakes and failures to adapt,and those miscues were terribly costly for the company and its investors. It seems to me that the management never really was tuned in to the "real world"...they just made loads of stupid business decisions. Over and over and over again. And, the biggest blunder was their failure to prepare for digital imaging to take over the film business as quickly as it did, and then, to try and deny, or head-in-sand it out...

Kodak really probably ought to be closed down, and several NEW business names created...it's a brand from the past...almost like an outdated car maker name like "Humpmobile" (a real name for a real brand of cars!!!)--a brand that has an "old-school" association, and not in the good way, like an old brand of beer or whisky, but of an archaic, outdated, out of touch sort. Like some brand of old-timey patent medicine, or whale oil for lamps...


----------



## dots (Nov 16, 2011)

What would you suggest is the most profitable sector for Kodak these days, Derrel?


----------



## MLeeK (Nov 16, 2011)

Derrel is right. I actually expected to see Olympus file before this... I suspect it will come before the official Kodak announcement


----------



## compur (Nov 16, 2011)

Derrel said:


> Buggy whip makers went under. "Hurricane" lamp makers used to sell millions of lamps every year...then along came electricity and the incandescent bulb. Muzzle loading firearms gave way to cartridge loaders. Glass plates gave way to film.



These industries certainly did take a hit as new technology was introduced, *but* ...

Buggy whips, hurricane lamps, and muzzle loaders are all still manufactured and sold.  In fact, muzzle loaders are big business and most states have special hunting seasons for them. Glass plates are still home-made (as they always were) and used by collodian enthusiasts today.

Also still manufactured are typewriters & ribbons,  vinyl records & turntables, acoustic musical instruments, mechanical pocket watches, and many other "obsolete" products which many people think died out decades ago. 

Even if Kodak stops manufacturing film tomorrow it will be a long time before film disappears.  They stopped manufacturing B&W photo paper years ago and the result was not the end of B&W printing -- other manufacturers simply picked up the slack and some new ones even appeared as well.

I'm sure Ilford, Fuji and the others will happily do the same if Kodak throws in the towel on film. Maybe even Freestyle will get into the film manufacturing business. They already sell film under their own brands and packaging that are manufactured by Kodak, Ilford, Fuji and others.


----------



## Paul Ron (Nov 17, 2011)

Fill your freezers... then the power outage!

Better get use to LUCKY film n papers kids. 

You can always depend on the Chineese n WalMart to take up the slack.

.


----------



## Buckster (Jan 5, 2012)

Fresh news on Kodak's impending demise:

Kodak Preparing for Chapter 11 Filing - WSJ.com


----------



## Fred Berg (Jan 5, 2012)

From the article in Buckster's link:


The company, for instance, invented the digital camerain 1975but never managed to capitalize on the new technology. 

​
Ironic.


----------



## KmH (Jan 5, 2012)

Because their business was primarily invested in film and film processing chemicals rather than cameras.


----------



## 2WheelPhoto (Jan 5, 2012)

KmH said:


> Because their business was primarily invested in film and film processing chemicals rather than cameras.



Many missed the boat. Newer technologies are always the future, any company who cannot or will not embrace change won't be around.


----------



## compur (Jan 5, 2012)

2WheelPhoto said:


> Newer technologies are always the future ...




Yeah, like this:


----------



## nickzou (Jan 5, 2012)

Doesn't Kodak make the Leica sensors?


----------



## Josh66 (Jan 5, 2012)

KmH said:


> Because their business was primarily invested in film and film processing chemicals rather than cameras.


And that will remain unaffected by this.  The film & chemical side is separate from "Eastman Kodak".  If "Eastman Chemical Company" were filing, then you could worry about developers and films disappearing.  Worst case, the name on the box might change, but the emulsion will still be there.

From what I read, the part that is going under are the sensors and printers and all that stuff.


Even if Kodak film did disappear, there's only one film I would have to replace in my bag.


----------



## imagemaker46 (Jan 6, 2012)

It shouldn't come as any surprise, just another victim of the digital age.  Fifteen years ago not too many people would have thought film would be replaced, ten years ago film was being replaced by digital and now iphones are producing better images than alot of the high end digital cameras of five years ago.........and in another five years, video will be replacing stills.  There are times when I really don't like progress.


----------



## Josh66 (Jan 6, 2012)

imagemaker46 said:


> It shouldn't come as any surprise, just another victim of the digital age.  Fifteen years ago not too many people would have thought film would be replaced, ten years ago film was being replaced by digital and now iphones are producing better images than alot of the high end digital cameras of five years ago.........and in another five years, video will be replacing stills.  There are times when I really don't like progress.


I don't think you understand what is going on.  This is not "another victim of the digital age".  Kodak's DIGITAL side is the part that's failing.  Bad marketing, bad R&D choices, bad perception of what the consumer wants.  None of that has anything to do with film.


----------



## unpopular (Jan 6, 2012)

Exactly. This is why Polaroid fell, too. Poor transition to digital photography.

...

But. just to keep this discussion hopping, Kodak film was always my least favorite. I prefer Illford, Agfa and Fujifilm myself.


----------



## Josh66 (Jan 6, 2012)

unpopular said:


> But. just to keep this discussion hopping, Kodak film was always my least favorite. I prefer Illford, Agfa and Fujifilm myself.


I have to agree.  Kodak has never been my "go to" film.  I like Fuji, personally.

T-Max 400 is the only Kodak film I use regularly, and it could easily be replaced by Ilford or Rollie if it needed to be.


----------



## imagemaker46 (Jan 7, 2012)

O|||||||O said:


> imagemaker46 said:
> 
> 
> > It shouldn't come as any surprise, just another victim of the digital age. Fifteen years ago not too many people would have thought film would be replaced, ten years ago film was being replaced by digital and now iphones are producing better images than alot of the high end digital cameras of five years ago.........and in another five years, video will be replacing stills. There are times when I really don't like progress.
> ...



I expect that the statements are correct, but the average person associates Kodak with film.  Before the digital age, pre 2000, Kodak was film.  I know that Kodak worked in partnership with Nikon developing the early and very expensive digital cameras used by the Associated Press, but it was still a "film" company.  They are still a victim of the digital age.


----------



## c.cloudwalker (Jan 7, 2012)

Derrel said:


> Yeah, and the Beatles said they'd be together forever...then John hooked up with Yoko Ono...



:thumbdown:

Please tell me you are not one of those idiots who think Yoko killed the Beatles? Not really...


----------



## gsgary (Jan 7, 2012)

Ive just read a great article in Pro Photo about a wedding photographer that has gone back to shooting film because it makes his workflow faster, he can have photos back to his client in 3 hours or on line for veiwing before with digital it was normally 2 weeks, he also has more people asking for his services because he has gone back to film. So is film dead ? i don't think so by a long way Annie Leibovitz only shot a full shoot on digital last year. This Christmas i shot 6 rolls of 120 and no digital
http://www.ashtonjeanpierreblog.com/


----------



## Josh66 (Jan 7, 2012)

This Christmas, I shot film exclusively (35mm and 120).  Normally, in situations like that (where I'll be taking a lot of pictures, and most of them will just be snap-shots), I would shoot digital.  I have to say, there are no times that I shot film and wished I had shot digital.  There are plenty of times when the opposite is true though.

I know it's my fault for not having better back-ups, but I have 'lost' a lot of digital pictures - children being born, birthday parties, etc...  I feel more comfortable shooting film knowing that the negatives will be around for hundreds of years unless I just lose them all, or my house burns down or something.


As far as Kodak goes...  They dropped the ball when digital came around.  So maybe they are a victim of the digital age in a way, but I don't see it that way.  They are a victim of bad marketing or the inability to stay competitive.  The film side of Kodak is still healthy, so that's a good sign.

What this whole Chapter 11 thing is, is them trying to buy time to sell off some patents.  I don't think selling patents alone will be enough though - they will have to change their whole way of doing business.  What happens when they run out of patents to sell, and find themselves low on cash again?

If Kodak were to go bankrupt, their films would still be made (the chemicals are all outsourced - since 1920) - there just might be a different name on the box.


----------



## imagemaker46 (Jan 7, 2012)

I don't believe that film will ever be completely dead, at least I hope it never is. For the record, I grew up shooting Kodak, but switched to Fuji for many events. During the Olympics that I had the pleasure of covering (eight of them) Kodak had a great setup, processing all the film onsite, offering back film one for one, and there were never any charges, they always ran a slick operation with great people and good friends. I believe that the 2000 Olympics may have been the last lab for Kodak. Fuji had smaller off-site labs that offered the same, they were trying to make in-roads with the professionals, and did pretty well. It was always a gathering point for all the worlds best sports photographers. It was a different generation when film was still king. My first experience with digital was at the 1992 Olympics, Kodak had a first generation camera and huge backpack attached. My Dad and I were allowed to give it a little test run, I still have that first digital image of myself shot by my dad, it's a grainy and off colour 4x5. It means more than it used to, being as it was the beginning of the early digital age, for lack of a better expression, it was like seeing the the first wheel. At that time, it was a gimmick that we figured would never last.


----------



## gsgary (Jan 7, 2012)

O|||||||O said:


> This Christmas, I shot film exclusively (35mm and 120).  Normally, in situations like that (where I'll be taking a lot of pictures, and most of them will just be snap-shots), I would shoot digital.  I have to say, there are no times that I shot film and wished I had shot digital.  There are plenty of times when the opposite is true though.
> 
> I know it's my fault for not having better back-ups, but I have 'lost' a lot of digital pictures - children being born, birthday parties, etc...  I feel more comfortable shooting film knowing that the negatives will be around for hundreds of years unless I just lose them all, or my house burns down or something.
> 
> ...




As long as we can get Tri-x


----------



## djacobox372 (Jan 7, 2012)

People are quick to call kodak a "dinosaur" or a victim of the "digital age."

Dont forget that kodak invented digital photography, and the kodak dcs was the first viable dslr.  Kodaks problem is that they were too early, their first digital enteries didnt do well and they let off the gas and were passed.


----------



## Hereindallas (Jan 7, 2012)

I believe that the bankruptcy would be for reorganization to unload debt, pension commitments, etc.  I  believe they would still make film and other products.  However, I suppose it remains to be seen as to watch actually transpires.


----------



## djacobox372 (Jan 11, 2012)

imagemaker46 said:
			
		

> I expect that the statements are correct, but the average person associates Kodak with film.  Before the digital age, pre 2000, Kodak was film.  I know that Kodak worked in partnership with Nikon developing the early and very expensive digital cameras used by the Associated Press, but it was still a "film" company.  They are still a victim of the digital age.



Kodak basically invented digital photography,  what they didnt do well is protect their patents.


----------



## Josh66 (Jan 23, 2012)

Flickr: Discussing Kodak Gets to 2013 to Reorganize in I Shoot Kodak Film


----------

