# “Early Morning Stretch…”



## enezdez (Sep 5, 2017)

Thanks For Looking Any Comments/Criticism Will Be Appreciated.

Enezdez


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## timor (Sep 6, 2017)

I think there is nothing special about this shot. Your other, recently shown pictures are more moving. Even the "Weight Of The World".


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## enezdez (Sep 6, 2017)

timor said:


> I think there is nothing special about this shot. Your other, recently shown pictures are more moving. Even the "Weight Of The World".




You Are Brutal!  And I thought you would approve of this shot...There is always next week!!!  lol


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## timor (Sep 6, 2017)

enezdez said:


> timor said:
> 
> 
> > I think there is nothing special about this shot. Your other, recently shown pictures are more moving. Even the "Weight Of The World".
> ...


Brutal ?!? I am same on you as on myself. The difference is you shoot with camera, which in essence is a computer, I am using most simple ( single speed, single aperture, single element fixed focus lens) box camera and 120 film. The name of this game is "composition". You should start to play this game to. In b&w photography it is the most powerful tool.


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## timor (Sep 6, 2017)

Read for you.
Arno Rafael Minkkinen - Introduction
Let me know, what do you think about that.


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## smoke665 (Sep 6, 2017)

timor said:


> Read for you.
> Arno Rafael Minkkinen - Introduction
> Let me know, what do you think about that.



I would never knock an artist on their approach be they purist or Teckno geek, but I admit I have a tendency to roll my eyes when one or the other seems to feel their method is the only way. If your simplistic approach works for you and you're happy with the results, then great. I follow a more liberal agenda of picking the right tool for the job, be it in camera, or in the computer. 

While we can agree that composition is a key element, it's not the only element of a shot. Sometimes the best image is the one that presents itself.  If Big Foot walked out of the woods and stood in the street in front of you, would you refuse to take a picture because there were light poles in the way??? Or a meteor falling from the sky??? Then there is lighting???? The best composition in the world still sucks if you can't get enough light to properly expose the shot. 

I really don't mean to offend anyone, but as to the link you posted, he may be the best thing since sliced bread to some, but to me most of it is a line of  artsy fartsy BS. Seriously??? Limit yourself to only shooting self portraits??? Don't age???? And as to the "only shoot in the nude part", in my area of the country  you'd get arrested on a good day for doing it,  the crap beat out of you on a bad day, and a bad case of chiggers or poison ivy if you tried to stay out of sight in the woods.


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## smoke665 (Sep 6, 2017)

enezdez said:


> Thanks For Looking Any Comments/Criticism Will Be Appreciated.



Just a personal opinion, but I think this could be improved by using a portrait crop. Just to the left of the light pole on the left, and just to the right of the runner.


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## timor (Sep 6, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> timor said:
> 
> 
> > Read for you.
> ...



Are you shouting just for sake of making noise ? Looks like the only thing you noticed was a naked male body. Kudos to you.
Minkkinen is an accepted and published artist. Scholar and teacher recognized world wide. The intro I posted link to is very concentrated slice of his philosophy. If you think his pictures are "artsy fartsy" (beautiful term, lots of imagination) don't look. Or maybe you should look more closely to better understand, why you don't like them. (I hope that will not violate any laws in your country.) Anyway no one is asking anyone to emulate Minkkinen photography. I am not big fan of his pictures as well. This is a man, with certain, firm approach, to himself and his way and this is, what he is talking about. This is, after all Intro about him.
You may wait for the Big Foot to come your way of course. There is a good chance, that if you will persist in this, eventually it might happen. Or, you may take to the woods and actively look for it. This will give you much bigger probability that you gonna achieve something. But you have to persist in it.


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## smoke665 (Sep 6, 2017)

timor said:


> Are you shouting just for sake of making noise ? Looks like the only thing you noticed was a naked male body. Kudos to you.



Think you missed something, I said nothing about a naked male body. I said  quote "As to the only shoot in the nude part" nothing gender specific there. This was in reference to his  point. "8 Work in the Nude"*. *Nothing gender specific there either. Male or female bodies can and have been the subject of the arts for years. Though I will say I find no redeeming qualities in an disembodied butt sticking in the air (male or female) or some dude standing in the water with a trash can over his head.



timor said:


> Minkkinen is an accepted and published artist. Scholar and teacher recognized world wide.



My comments were not directed at his attire or lack there of, but of his egomania. Seriously, from his list "1. Make Them Self Portraits". Apparently only thinking himself worthy of being photographed, also his quote "I title them self portrait, so the viewer knows who is in the photograph and who took it". How about " I do not use an assistant to look through the camera; otherwise she or he also becomes the photographer". This guy is so full of it, that he has crap dripping out of his ears. I thought the "artsy fartsy" comment (which Merriam- Webster defines as pretinsously artistic) was quite appropriate.

As to being an "accepted and published" artist, I've found that "acceptance" isn't necessarily a sign of an good artist. Thanks to the NEA there  was expansion of the likes of those like Malenthorpe and Serrano's "Piss Christ". Tell enough people it's art and you'll find some that will agree so as to not appear philistine, yet not have a clue.  Me, I follow the quote most often attributed to PT Barnum "There's a sucker born every minute".



timor said:


> I am not big fan of his pictures as well.



Now this confused me. If you're not a fan why would recommend his link? First you were talking about composition and then you recommend this link??? How does his work relate to what you were trying to suggest on composition. Why not seek out some of the old masters???

I really didn't mean to ruffle your feathers, but your posts were coming off confusing. Rather than condemning the OP's post, why not offer valid suggestions for improvement.


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## Derrel (Sep 6, 2017)

timor said:


> I think there is nothing special about this shot. Your other, recently shown pictures are more moving. Even the "Weight Of The World".



I have to agree...your other work has been pretty good. This shot has a serious problem: the foreground stretching person has an "attachment" to the the walker in the background, and this shot smacks of bad shutter release timing. The "game" is not all about composition (as I define composition), but also about timing. Either make the walker separate, or omit her...but having her "attached" to the guy doing the stretch? Not good really...this is not a well-exectuted shot, a so,so many of tyour other recent shots have been.

Sorry...if you think Timor's comments above were "brutal", well, so be it...I and many others do not heap praise on photos that we do not like, and I frankly not "like" the shot. Not that I dislike the photo in this post, but if it were on-line on say FB or Instagram, I would not give it a "like", even if you were a friend of mine. There really is nothing at all that is "special" in this photo.

Originally you posted with this comment: "Thanks For Looking Any Comments/Criticism Will Be Appreciated."

Huh...not sure you really meant what you wrote. Slapping up a comment and tacking lol! onto it...not sure what to make of that.


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## timor (Sep 6, 2017)

Answer to smoke665
So, that is the sore point of you, egomania. Well, he is describing himself  and the way he went. If that sounds egomaniac to you, than I can't imagine, how you write yours resume. But then seems, that you know, what are the signs of a good artist. Most good artists were or are egomaniacs obsessed with own creations.
Why link to him ? It already expanded your horizon, stir a bit stagnation, induce discussion. Is he somewhat different in his art ? A bit, but not in such a bad way as you imply, there is a long term meaning in his works.
But that is not the point. Point is there is a man, there is a vision, man persisting in his vision. Man achieving something.This is, what he is saying. No shortcuts, no easy steps, development. And that is my advice to *enezdez.*


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## enezdez (Sep 8, 2017)

timor said:


> Answer to smoke665
> So, that is the sore point of you, egomania. Well, he is describing himself  and the way he went. If that sounds egomaniac to you, than I can't imagine, how you write yours resume. But then seems, that you know, what are the signs of a good artist. Most good artists were or are egomaniacs obsessed with own creations.
> Why link to him ? It already expanded your horizon, stir a bit stagnation, induce discussion. Is he somewhat different in his art ? A bit, but not in such a bad way as you imply, there is a long term meaning in his works.
> But that is not the point. Point is there is a man, there is a vision, man persisting in his vision. Man achieving something.This is, what he is saying. No shortcuts, no easy steps, development. And that is my advice to *enezdez.*




I totally Agree with you Timor, 100%.  You remind me of someone I knew as a child/young man...my art teacher (during grammar school) and later photography (during high school)...I knew him for most of my early life.  He was never satisfied, he always pushed making me realize my "full potential."   He knew what I was capable of doing prior to my own self.  He has been dead now for over thirty years or so.  Whatever little I know about art/photography, I owe it to Mr. Tom Carcich.  I will persist and grow, isn't that what life/art is all about???  Thanks for your encouragement Timor!!!

Cheers,

Enezdez


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## timor (Sep 8, 2017)

enezdez said:


> timor said:
> 
> 
> > Answer to smoke665
> ...


Thank you Enezdez.. The similarities you see maybe cause your teacher and me we belong to to the group of no too extreme people. Moderation.


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## Matt Friedman (Sep 8, 2017)

enezdez said:


> View attachment 146378
> Thanks For Looking Any Comments/Criticism Will Be Appreciated.


It's a good shot, but maybe not a _great _shot. The things that I like are the central form, whichsuggests a kind of suspended rhythm, and the contrast of textures -- grass, tree trunks, and pavement -- and the shadows of branches (though I think they could come out a bit more.

In terms of composition, there are some things that could be improved. The person walking in the background is a distraction, and dampens the central rhythm. It's also very symmetrical and centered -- not necessarily a bad thing, but it makes it seem a bit static. Maybe by going to a lower angle, and off a bit more to a side of the principal form, you could bring out the perspective of the path and give the suspended motion of the stretch some direction.

Alfred Stieglitz once insisted that Paul Strand think about what his pictures _meant. _Not what they were pictures of in a raw pictorial sense, but what idea, emotion, or dynamic they articulated. I think that's very good advice.

As for what device you use... Don't sweat it. Photography isn't about the technology. It's about the eye.


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## sleist (Sep 9, 2017)

The lighting contradicts the title with respect to the subject of this photo.
I suspect different choices during mono conversion might have helped, but it hard to say without knowing the original image.


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