# With the regulations, is a drone even worth it?



## Destin (Sep 23, 2017)

I’ve been considering picking up a DJI Mavic Pro to capture new angles of landscapes, sports, etc.  

But the more I research it the more it seems like there is so much red tape regarding the use of drones that it’s not even worth the hassle. I live in rural NY, where drones are banned in all state parks. Almost every scenic area near me has rules and regulations against drone use. 

Any opinions on this guys? Is it really as bad as it seems?


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## smoke665 (Sep 23, 2017)

Have you ever thought of low tech. Helium filled balloons, attached to the monofiliment line of a fishing rod. No restrictions that I know of. Low cosr


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## Destin (Sep 23, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> Have you ever thought of low tech. Helium filled balloons, attached to the monofiliment line of a fishing rod. No restrictions that I know of. Low cosr



NYS parks don’t even allow you to fly a kite without a permit. I’m sure they’d have a problem with it still.


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## smoke665 (Sep 23, 2017)

Destin said:


> NYS parks don’t even allow you to fly a kite without a permit. I’m sure they’d have a problem with it still.



Birthday balloons with long strings


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## OGsPhotography (Sep 23, 2017)

Get a permit?

Is it cost prohibitive or time?


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## smoke665 (Sep 23, 2017)

FAQ as I read it you aren't required to register unless you are using it for commercial purposes or it exceeds the weight limit


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## Destin (Sep 23, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> FAQ as I read it you aren't required to register unless you are using it for commercial purposes or it exceeds the weight limit



Yeah but I own a photography business. They’re automatically going to call it commercial based on that if it gets questioned I’m sure.


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## smoke665 (Sep 23, 2017)

Destin said:


> I own a photography business



Maybe, maybe not. I own a truck that exceeds the weight limits for a CDL requirement. I hold a Class A CDL but until I put a load on that truck for hire, none of the FMCSA rules apply to me. I suspect the same applies here. However if you want to do it commercially I would check into the liability insurance requirements. That may be the killer


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## snowbear (Sep 23, 2017)

I think most have to be registered, regardless if it's for commercial use, or not.  Commercial use, IIRC, requires a license to fly it (like a downgraded pilot license).  Should be some info at FAA.


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## smoke665 (Sep 23, 2017)

snowbear said:


> Should be some info at FAA.



Posted above  but here it is again, from the FAA FAQ


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## snowbear (Sep 23, 2017)

Unmanned Aircraft Systems (UAS) Frequently Asked Questions  This one goes into the UAS certificate (I referred to it as a license) for commercial flying.


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## CharlzO2k (Sep 23, 2017)

As registration goes, they changed it - non-commercial users won't need to any more (not that it was that big a deal, really). But to use it for commercial use, you do. Again, it's not exactly a big deal to do so. 

Americans no longer have to register non-commercial drones with the FAA

Also, the commercial aspect has changed for the laws as well. It USED to be you needed to be licensed and all that, but they've changed it for small business usage, video and photography included. More here:

Drone law: How new rules and evolving tech are changing the path of UAVs in construction

 I have a Yuneec Q500 4K myself that I got last year. This summer, we took a car cruise to Sampson state park, and I flew it for about 10-15 minutes around the grouping, and no one said a word or batted an eye to me about it. Likely because it was a controlled setting, it wasn't like I was harassing other patrons or wildlife, and where we were in the park, was pretty secluded. If you were flying it over populated sections, I would expect they might make an issue of it. But that's been the case for a while, that you aren't supposed to fly over gatherings. Also, one of the common parks that they talk about is Taughannock (went there today actually for a hike). One thing that I did notice, and hadn't thought about, is the proximity of Ithaca and areas to the airport. Maybe that has something to do with that park being more restrictive in cracking down.

As far as the rest though, I still find it very worth having my quad. I'm heading back to NC soon, and there's just no way to get the incredible aerial shots over the mountains without one. Yes there are still some restrictions  but there are still a lot of places and opportunities for it, especially in rural areas.


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## KmH (Sep 24, 2017)

Selling prints is editorial, not commercial.

State park regulations aren't FAA regs and may be more about preserving the tranquility of the parks than being about commercial purposes for flying a drone in the state park.
It would suck to be in a state park that has as many drones flying around as birds flying around.


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## benhasajeep (Sep 26, 2017)

KmH said:


> Selling prints is editorial, not commercial.



The FAA does not see it that way!  If your using a drone for pay.  No matter if you take a picture or not.  Or make a print or give a digital file.  It requires a commercial drone license!  It's the act of using the drone itself and money exchaning hands.


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## 480sparky (Sep 26, 2017)

benhasajeep said:


> KmH said:
> 
> 
> > Selling prints is editorial, not commercial.
> ...



It doesn't even have to be money.  Bartering for something is considered commercial (including 'recognition').  Even if you receive a handful of belly button lint for a drone image, you're considered 'paid'.


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## benhasajeep (Sep 26, 2017)

480sparky said:


> benhasajeep said:
> 
> 
> > KmH said:
> ...


Actually, yea bartering goods, for a service would be considered commercial by the FAA.  And they are very strict with rules for private pilots and commercial like flights.  But they do allow sharing of expenses on a "private" flight.  Many have pushed that leeway a little too far.  But it happens all the tme.  The private pilot has to have an actual reason to be going to the destination.  And the passenger who would like to go there can "share" in the expenses of the trip.  They will let that go as long as the "share" is not too obvious like 30/70 pilot / pax.  Can probably get away with 40/60.  Some push it, and got their tail feathers trimmed some.


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## darkblue-x (Oct 8, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> Have you ever thought of low tech. Helium filled balloons, attached to the monofiliment line of a fishing rod. No restrictions that I know of. Low cosr


lolsy, but could potentially work.
if the balloon malfunctions though, RIP to your cam.


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## 480sparky (Oct 8, 2017)

darkblue-x said:


> smoke665 said:
> 
> 
> > Have you ever thought of low tech. Helium filled balloons, attached to the monofiliment line of a fishing rod. No restrictions that I know of. Low cosr
> ...



And drones malfunction as well.  RIP the drone AND the camera.


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## NancyMoranG (Oct 15, 2017)

I have been thinking of getting one too...back to original question...
Is it worth getting one with restrictions on using them?


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## CharlzO2k (Oct 15, 2017)

It all depends on what you want to do and where at. If you want to use them primarily to do things and get shots in areas that are known to be harder on them, then maybe it wouldn't be. But there are a LOT of places out there to fly that are perfectly fine.


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## fmw (Nov 6, 2017)

Regulations?  Meh.


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## ac12 (Jan 15, 2018)

fmw said:


> Regulations?  Meh.



Ignoring regulations is how regulations and laws get tighter.

There has already been cases of drone/quad and airplane/helicopter mid-air collision, do a Google search.
Sooner or later there will be a serious mid-air collision with fatalities.

There are already privacy issues being raised about drone spying/peeking into homes and properties.
What would you do if you saw one of those drones outside your bedroom window, looking into your bedroom?
I recall one where someone used a shotgun to bring down one of those peeking drones.  It has gotten that bad.


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## ac12 (Jan 15, 2018)

NancyMoranG said:


> I have been thinking of getting one too...back to original question...
> Is it worth getting one with restrictions on using them?



Yes it is, just understand the regulations and work within them.


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## smoke665 (Jan 15, 2018)

ac12 said:


> What would you do if you saw one of those drones outside your bedroom window, looking into your bedroom?



12 ga, Buckshot, works quite well.


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## lynxear (Mar 13, 2018)

darkblue-x said:


> smoke665 said:
> 
> 
> > Have you ever thought of low tech. Helium filled balloons, attached to the monofiliment line of a fishing rod. No restrictions that I know of. Low cosr
> ...



It is no different than losing control of your drone and crashing it.


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## ac12 (Mar 26, 2018)

I just did a short study for the yearbook advisor, cuz some of kids wanted a drone to take pictures.  Yeah kids want their toys.
Well the two major issues I found were:

I could not see a way that the intended school use was "hobby or recreational."  

Which then leads to a MUCH more difficult set of FAA rules, which has a rule that the "pilot" has to be certified, which effectively means an adult, NOT a student.

*Cannot fly over people.*  So they can't shoot school events.  So what will they shoot, the empty school ?
So I could not see a justification for the use of a drone for the school.


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## Destin (Mar 26, 2018)

ac12 said:


> I just did a short study for the yearbook advisor, cuz some of kids wanted a drone to take pictures.  Yeah kids want their toys.
> Well the two major issues I found were:
> 
> I could not see a way that the intended school use was "hobby or recreational."
> ...



Yeah, there are a ton of rules. Honestly, I'm not sure I'd trust students with a drone anyway. 

That being said, it seems like almost every drone owner I know and follow online pretty much just blatantly disregards most of the rules with the exception of altitude. Until the FAA decides to make an example out of someone, it doesn't seem that they enforce much. I'm not encouraging breaking the rules, and I try my best to follow them. Just making an observation after my first 6-8 months of drone ownership.


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## ac12 (Mar 27, 2018)

Destin said:


> ac12 said:
> 
> 
> > I just did a short study for the yearbook advisor, cuz some of kids wanted a drone to take pictures.  Yeah kids want their toys.
> ...



Yes, agree with your point.
The responsibility factor goes up significantly.  And many high school kids can't handle it, as evidenced by the insurance rates for teen age male drivers.

The problem is that there are too many drones out there for the FAA to crack down on.  And they are easy and inexpensive to buy.
But that will change when the first drone/aircraft collision happens where there are fatalities.
Then the FAA will have to crack down on the industry and users.  But congress won't change the laws and give the FAA the $$$ and authority, until a fatal collision happens, which is typical after the fact action.

Problem is, they can't just disable/crash the drone, because it may cause injury when it crashes.
The only mechanism that I can think of is for them to somehow take over control over the offending drone, and bring it down safely.  And that has to be done without affecting the avionics of the aircraft in the area, which might be tough to do around an airport.
I can see it now, anti-drone device emplacements around the airport, like AA batteries in WW-II.
But the danger is in the entire landing and take off flight path, when the plane is low and slow.  And that stretches for miles.

As for flying drones, I agree with you.
Breaking the rules is slowly asking for more rules and tougher rules.

But like in California.  When I come to a 4 way stop, I have to expect the other guy to not stop.  Because odds are they won't stop.  Even on a red light, people will continue through the red light.  Not enough cops and traffic cameras to catch them.


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## HigherViews (Jun 13, 2018)

Back to the original question, "Is it really as bad as it seems?" I don't think so, but each person must answer that for them self. I've had a UAV for almost 3 years and been certified under 14 CFR Part 107 for almost 2 years. There are more places to fly legally - commercial or not - than you might think, and there are apps that help you determine where it is safe to fly, in addition to your common sense. The bottom line for me is that I absolutely love the stunning video I can get with my DJI Phantom 4 Pro - I enjoy the whole process of flying and producing the video, and that makes it worth the 30-40 hours (and $150) I had to study for the cert test. At first I was nervous about spending a lot of money for a drone with a good camera, but I'm glad I did!  For business or pleasure, learn the rules that apply to you, fly responsibly, and have fun!!


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