# When to just say screw it all?



## flyingPhoto (Sep 6, 2021)

Ive spent alot of time in the last few years trying to find a live, human female model to photograph.  

Just absolutely no freaking luck at all.   

Nothing but endless scams, frauds, upselling, non existent people, being sent to multiple platforms to make contact   ie  model mayhem to instagram to facebook  and so on. 

I tried facebook last year but for some reason once i joined photography groups my account kept being disabled and demanding proof like photo copies of my state ID, passports, birth certificate, social security cards, etc. 

I dont have model mayhem account as the people who approve the mandatory photos do not accept ANYTHIGN other then nude or swimsuit photos of women, i know because in the 5 times i tried to make an account, the ONLY image that was not rejected as being "car/selfy/snapshot/animal/landscape"  was a photo of a young woman sitting on a rock wearing a bikini. Although a photograph of her sitting on the same rock but wearing a t shirt and shorts was called "an unallowed landscape photo".

All the other sites want the same photos of humans, and money.  Or are just in FOREIGN countries and have nothing for the USA. 

On the 4th about 8 pm i created a new facebook page, and a business page for my photo side... the 5th i was given a deactivated account due to "behavior violating community standards". All i did was join a few photographic groups in my state.  I had to have them send me an id number to my cell phone AND my email.. 
Today i was on it twice.   third time i went to go on, i was told my account was deactivated due to the same "violating community standards" and it is now DEMANDING i send them a face photo. 

DO i just say screw human photography or just start letting myself get screwed in a miserable endless cycle of wasting money left and right?


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## NS: Nikon Shooter (Sep 7, 2021)

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There was a time — long ago — where models were easy to come by. Times
have change though. Caused by not always clean toggers, social media, and
others, people are more aware of their image and reputation. Clean toggers
fell victim to social trends too — a good man colleague of mine had a bad ex-
pertinence some years back and that was the end of it for him. Dangers are
lurking from both sides of the camera.

Personally, I don't have such problems but I am never alone with a male model
or female — always an assistant or two.


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## flyingPhoto (Sep 7, 2021)

Its at the point that the only self described models willing to do a shoot are also the ones that require sex for money. As im not willing to go that route, its a rather hard spot for me.


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## NS: Nikon Shooter (Sep 7, 2021)

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I recently met a beautiful 13 yo girl from SE Asia ethnic. I went to talk to 
her and told her of my idea. Gave her my card and said: "Your parents 
must agree to this and be present at the shoot." I met the parents a week 
later and a shoot was planned in Fall.

Building a portfolio with parents and friends may help.


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## weepete (Sep 7, 2021)

Do you have a portfolio?


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## NS: Nikon Shooter (Sep 7, 2021)

weepete said:


> Do you have a portfolio?




If the question was directed to me then yes.
I have a multiple folders portfolio on my iPad.


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## Rickbb (Sep 7, 2021)

When an account gets blocked as soon as you join a group, that's a big red flag for me. I'd report the group to FB as being a scam, which IMHO it must be.

Models are hard to come by as most now think you just want something else. Try getting to know a local dance troupe or theater group, back in the day, (when I was interested in shooting people), it's where I met some really great models looking to build their portfolios.


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## flyingPhoto (Sep 7, 2021)

Lol the only local "dance group" is well underage girls, and i have no interest in dealing with that age bracket.  There is a local theater thing but they have been dead since covid hit, and I have tried to tfp with them,,, but they have no interest. So little interest they cant even say get lost. 

All of my photos have been animals and landscape.


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## West - (Sep 7, 2021)

flyingPhoto said:


> All of my photos have been animals and landscape.


You have no experience.
Assuming you live in a decent size city, you will find that pro photographers hold studio workshops, you can pay a small fee and practice in a studio setting with proper lighting and professional models.    Look into it.


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## Rickbb (Sep 7, 2021)

Those underage dance classes are taught by adults that either used to be or still do dance as adults. I bet they would like some updated shots for their portfolios. Call them up and explain you need to expand your portfolio from nature to include people shots. You might be surprised.


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## SquarePeg (Sep 7, 2021)

West - said:


> You have no experience.
> Assuming you live in a decent size city, you will find that pro photographers hold studio workshops, you can pay a small fee and practice in a studio setting with proper lighting and professional models.    Look into it.


Great idea.  

OP - Also check out the meetup website.  The photography centric groups frequently have group model shoots and if/when the photography expos start again they also have breakout sessions with models.


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## smoke665 (Sep 7, 2021)

I don't do a lot of paid work, I turn down most of it, I'd rather be selective in my shooting. I've found though that those who've paid a deposit are more likely to show up on time.


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## weepete (Sep 7, 2021)

NS: Nikon Shooter said:


> If the question was directed to me then yes.
> I have a multiple folders portfolio on my iPad.


No, I meant that question for the OP. 

I'm just wondering if they are getting constantly KB'ed, could it be because their portfolio is putting models off? Kinda curious as this isn't the first post they've complained about this, but I've not seen any examples of their work. If so getting some experience via a camera club might be an option. I know the one near me runs regular sessions with various models, and it could be a good way to get a foot in the door.


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## CherylL (Sep 7, 2021)

My local photography Facebook group is for fun and aspiring photographers & models.  They have meet ups every so often and plenty of models volunteer.  Find a local group that has meet ups.   There are several members that like to dress up for Halloween or other theme type shoots.


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## flyingPhoto (Sep 7, 2021)

ah yes another round of lets disregard that the OP has been locked out of facebook until he provide a photo of him and  his photo ID card.. 

I have done the meetup thing and the problems i have run into with them is the following

1. the actual group photo shoots are not meant for the person paying to attend to actually get photos.  I am not going to pay 1 to 200$ to attend a 2 hour shoot, THEN stand around for 1.5 hours holding lights and reflectors for the people who created that group shoot to take photos, and then leave me stuck trying to do 2 hours of shooting in half an hour or less of the worst light possible to shoot.

2. The meetup photo groups that i have actual experience with are simply male and female "guys with camera" who meets once or twice a month to show off their most expensive lens or camera body and deride anyone who doesnt have those items


And if landscape and animal photos arent "good enough" for the world... why do i always hear about this ansel adams guy


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## SquarePeg (Sep 8, 2021)

Well I’m out of ideas.   Good luck.


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## mrca (Sep 8, 2021)

If you need warm bodies in front of your camera, unlike painters we do to make a portrait, the meetup groups that specialize in lighting, strobist are great places to get a few images you can  use to start building a portfolio.   You can then meet "models" and I use the term loosely, and try for a trade or minimal payment to shoot one on one without the typical limited time, limited use of your lighting in a group setting.  Be cognizant, as a guy, you must not project a creep factor.   Then be sure to test your shots without them before hand , then get some tasteful, great shots.  I have been shooting for decades so have a portfolio for most genres with killer images in each so all I have to do show my work.  Once you shoot a "model" ask if she knows any others who might be interested.  And by "model" I mean some scrawny girl who thinks she is going to have a career standing around getting paid for looking good.  She will probably have not clue on posing or working to the camera/lights.   I have shot professional models who make small adjustments to pose with every click or flash going through dozens if not hundreds of great shots in a short period.    If you can,  have a woman you know present, an assistant or mua to make the subject feel comfortable and for your liability protection.  Let her know you will do have another woman there.   That will increase your chances of her agreeing.   If that gets her to shoot for trade, you can spend the money on a mua who will give you even better results.


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## RAZKY (Sep 11, 2021)

flyingPhoto said:


> Ive spent alot of time in the last few years trying to find a live, human female model to photograph.
> 
> Just absolutely no freaking luck at all.
> 
> ...


Could be that people photography is not your genre!


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## unpopular (Sep 13, 2021)

Do you have any portraiture experience at all?

judging by your other recent thread you’re interesting in jumping right into boudoir; which is … suspect, but not only suspect but also about the most difficult genre to do well in and If you don’t have any photos of people in your portfolio, do you really expect women to just take off their clothes for you?

and why exclusively women? I’m not in a position to really evaluate your motives here, but you are, and if your motives aren’t about photography, id say the time is now.


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## mrca (Sep 13, 2021)

I can't help but notice you only want "female" subjects.  Why?   Realize that can send off the creep alarm.   And do they have to be attractive?   Attractive people are easy to shoot, skill is required to make ordinary people look good.   Are you asking for boudoir or sexy shots?   That will turn off many ladies also.   If you have no portforfolio, perhaps men or couples would  get you some response.


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## flyingPhoto (Sep 13, 2021)

oh what a great example of the bullshit one runs into when they are trying to get into human photography. posts 19 and 20. 

The insult you apply to me is not even good enough to qualify as a cliché. 


As to what I shoot or do not shoot is my OWN damn choice.  Im surprised if you would demand to know why mapplethorpe spent so many years taking polaroids of photos of nude men he cut out of porno mags


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## mrca (Sep 14, 2021)

Motivation or not, if you are getting constant rejection, something you are doing is causing it.   You are "insulted" because folks took the time to caution you about the way some people could perceive your motivation, particularly young attractive ladies you seek to photo?  Cliche my butt.  Had a guy approach me to "assist" me in my boudoir work.  Not for  family  portraits or environmental portraits, only boudoir.  My creepdar went off and since I need a female assistant because I ALWAYS  have a female present at  such shoots, mua or assistant, and that feeling, I declined.  A year or so later turned on the local news to see him being led out of his house in handcuffs for having videoed the high school girls he was photoing changing in his bathroom.   And if you are around this industry long, you will note time after time, it is males who want to do such photography, not women.  Connect the dots.  You have been given several suggestions on how to get started, without so much as a sign of appreciation, only more whining.  And before you start hurling accusations, I shoot some of my artistic photography with a Mamiya RB67, a homage to someone who photoed the human body as an art form but without an edge of kinkiness, Herb Ritts, the guy who moved to Hollywood with Richard Gere.  You have 2 choices, start trying some of the advice given from people who all started  where you are or do nothing but keep complaining.  Oh, and my boudoir business started from a casual request from a client and I NEVER ONCE had to  advertise  or markete  it.   I kept it separate from my other work because of exactly the advice you have been given.   It will be off putting for some folks who could be important clients.   That's reality, not cliche.  Knew a guy who liked photoing the kinky stuff and had it on his website along with his other work.  He also had the contract for supplying prints to the local Cathedral which sold them in the back of the church.   They ran out of prints and the priest went to his website to contact him, saw that work and he lost that business.


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## Sharpshooterr (Sep 25, 2021)

Sometimes when I turn on the TV at just the right time I tune in, right in the middle of the Photo Forum Comedy Hour. It's the funniest show I've seen since I started doing photography more than a few years ago!! LoL
I shoot about a hundred model sessions per year so I find this one of the funniest things I've read in a long time.   
I'm probably just way better looking than the OP. I used to have the same problem but then had all the fat in my belly transferred to my booty and chest. Now I get all the models I want!!
Words of wisdom to the OP,  just make sure to tell the Doc to put enough in your booty to get a good twerk going on!!! LoL
SS


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## Space Face (Sep 25, 2021)

😁😁😁😁


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## terri (Sep 26, 2021)

This has gone on long enough.    Thread closed.


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