# Canon 60D out of focus?



## terry7cook (Oct 30, 2013)

The other day I was shooting with the 5d MarkIII, and I noticed it didn't have those focusing squares in the middle of the screen helping you focusing on the subject. (The guy who owned it might shut down this option- I don't really know)
I just fired and shoot whatever I wanted and all pictures came out perfectly focused, this was on a wedding with not much light by the way.

When I'm shooting with my 60D I'm using the middle square as my focusing point, and a lot of times I'm getting out of focus pictures. I'm mostly shooting weddings which has low light conditions and then I get out of focus, but not just that, it also happens in many different occasions outside while shooting in the middle of the day. Most of the pictures, if not all of them are just portraits so there is not a lot of movement.

I'm trying as hard as I can, really not to move and hold my breath if the object is moving and etc, I have no much experience with many other camera's so I don't know what to compare to.


How can I fire "like crazy" as I did with the 5D? I know there is a "bit" of a difference between those two 

My lenses are:
70-200 f2.8l II
24-70 f2.8l II


----------



## Big Mike (Oct 30, 2013)

Welcome to the forum.

Can you post some examples and the settings used?


----------



## terry7cook (Oct 31, 2013)

Big Mike said:


> Welcome to the forum.
> 
> Can you post some examples and the settings used?



http://i.imgur.com/kQhjoy7.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/61ln08Z.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Eg9OaBI.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/cLKpZ1L.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/oreLaEY.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Py8GTLW.jpg

I don't have many others because I delete them right away.


----------



## bratkinson (Oct 31, 2013)

Low light indoor photography (no flash) is what I have been attempting to do for the last 10 years, give or take. I think I have, at last, beaten the exposure triangle...fast glass, fast exposure, fast ISO and a monopod. I kind of knew that was the solution all along. I just had to wait for the 5D Mark iii to come along to get the fast ISO speeds and 'drop dead sharp' focusing.

Until about a year ago, I was having less than stellar results shooting indoor events at church (not weddings) without a flash. With my 60D and Canon L glass, my discard rate due to undesired blurring was like 5 out of 6 shots. Throw away perhaps 75% of those remaining for under exposure, poor framing, too many distractions in the photo, etc. I was lucky to keep 1 in 20. The reason was that to get at least 'close enough I can fix it in post' exposures at ISO 1600 was the need to have shutter speeds in the 1/30 - 1/60 range, which is too slow to stop subject motion. Shooting at ISO 3200 with the 60D frequently produced more noise than Lightroom (more likely, me) could correct. So I used ISO 3200 quite sparingly.

Since moving to the 5D3, I can shoot at ISO 3200 and even 6400 with little noise. What that has done is to get the shutter speeds at 1/125 on the low end, pretty much stopping all subject motion, regardless of how slight. Throw in super sharp AF and that's 99% of the reasons I upgraded to the 5D3. The silent shooting capability 'sealed the deal' for my taking the plunge. Shooting with a 135 f2L and 80-200 f2.8L (magic drainpipe) wide open or nearly so has resulted in some incredible images. Even the 24-105 f4L produces great results...the IS helps, too. 

As for outdoor shots out of focus, I'm thinking perhaps you are stopped down so far and/or ISO so low that too slow shutter speeds are the result. Perhaps you are using One Shot rather than AI Servo AF mode for all living/breathing/moving subjects. Even with 'posed' subjects, the time from focus lock to shutter open frequently results in a motion blur in One Shot mode. 

Don't get me wrong. The 60D is a great camera. The size and weight increase of a gripped 5D3 vs gripped 60D somewhat surprised me. But before you think it's your camera or lenses causing the sharpness issues, make sure you've done everything possible to ensure you ARE getting everything as right as possible. And yes, even the 5D3 takes some out of focus pictures in low light...as far as I can tell, the problem is me.


----------



## enzodm (Oct 31, 2013)

Are you sure you are focusing using the central point? No automatic focus point selection?
It would be useful also to have EXIF data for at least a couple of them, to verify Bratkinson hypothesis (slow shutter speed).


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 3, 2013)

enzodm said:


> Are you sure you are focusing using the central point? No automatic focus point selection?
> It would be useful also to have EXIF data for at least a couple of them, to verify Bratkinson hypothesis (slow shutter speed).



Thanks all for your comments, I'm really sure that *bratkinson* has the whole idea covered and the "problem" is the camera and not something else.
I'm pretty sure that with the 5D it's not going to happen, as least not as many times it happens with the 60D.

How do I get the EXIF data for you?


----------



## enzodm (Nov 4, 2013)

terry7cook said:


> enzodm said:
> 
> 
> > Are you sure you are focusing using the central point? No automatic focus point selection?
> ...



I'm sure that 5DIII will be better, of course. Gear upgrade is often the most desired solution, but is not always the solution. EXIF is stripped from the pictures you have put online, so just look at info with any decent image viewer, including Lightroom (look at shutter speed, aperture, ISO). If your problem is also during the day... I suspect is not only the camera. This one: http://i.imgur.com/oreLaEY.jpg cannot be out of focus for any camera cause, except hardware problems. In this one: http://i.imgur.com/Py8GTLW.jpg focus is on the driver's arm. 

For your reference, this is ISO3200 with a 60D: 8 mesi | Flickr - Photo Sharing! , this one: Luisa Gastaldo | Flickr - Photo Sharing! ISO3200 in low light (and also others in the set). This one is ISO1600, 1/40s with a way cheaper Canon 1000D (noisy, yes): Emanuel Donadelli | Flickr - Photo Sharing! .


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 4, 2013)

http://i.imgur.com/b4ztpx1.jpg

Camera: Canon EOS 60D
F-stop: f/2.8
Exposure time; 1/200 sec
ISO speed: ISO-100
Focal length: 24MM
Exposure program: Manual
White balance: Auto
Metering mode: Pattern
EXIF version: 0230


http://i.imgur.com/rzVGEut.jpg

Camera: Canon EOS 60D
F-stop: f/2.8
Exposure time; 1/100 sec
ISO speed: ISO-100
Focal length: 135MM
Exposure program: Manual
White balance: Auto
Metering mode: Pattern
EXIF version: 0230


Not sure if you really need all this details, I just copied as many as I saw.
The second picture is just a sign, I mean what can go wrong when taking a picture of a sign


----------



## Steve5D (Nov 4, 2013)

Sometimes the solution is something you never think of. I'm not saying this is it, but I've done this in the past and the results were similar to what you've posted.

Have you checked the AF/MF switch on the barrel of the lens?


----------



## enzodm (Nov 5, 2013)

Steve may be right - the latter two are so easy that cannot be the camera for its features, and 60D is not among the cheapest too. Or, again, some hardware problem. Bratkinson pointed out some possible issue in low light, but this is no low light.


----------



## gsgary (Nov 5, 2013)

terry7cook said:


> Big Mike said:
> 
> 
> > Welcome to the forum.
> ...



I see what you mean fire like crazy and get loads of crap with no thought of composition white balance i feel sorry for the couple

Sent from my GT-I9100P using Tapatalk 2


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 5, 2013)

Steve5D said:


> Sometimes the solution is something you never think of. I'm not saying this is it, but I've done this in the past and the results were similar to what you've posted.
> 
> Have you checked the AF/MF switch on the barrel of the lens?



Yeah I did, and this can't be the situation either way, cause I couldn't take any photo in this way because all of the pictures would come out out of focus.
So that's not possible in this case.


----------



## gsgary (Nov 5, 2013)

Another thing you cannot compare the 60D to the 5Dmk3, have you checked what ther shutter speed was for these shots

Sent from my GT-I9100P using Tapatalk 2


----------



## kathyt (Nov 5, 2013)

I have a feeling your focus point is set to another point other than the middle. It is easy to accidentally change it and not be aware of it. Bust out the manual and turn on the screen to show your focal points. You need to see these. I know on the Mark III it will not show my focal points when shooting in al servo. I am not sure if this is the same case with the 60D. Try switching it to one shot.


----------



## centauro74 (Nov 5, 2013)

One thing I'd suggest is try to get another body from a friend and use your lens a take a few pictures with both cameras with same settings in different times of the day indoor and outdoor with both cameras,  then you'll know if is the your camera or you're doing something wrong.


----------



## centauro74 (Nov 5, 2013)

But try to borrow something more closely to your camera,  like a t3i.


----------



## Steve5D (Nov 5, 2013)

terry7cook said:


> Steve5D said:
> 
> 
> > Sometimes the solution is something you never think of. I'm not saying this is it, but I've done this in the past and the results were similar to what you've posted.
> ...



While you've confirmed that wasn't the issue, that switch can, in fact, result in what you describe. 

If the lens is focused at, say, ten feet, and you're throwing away four out of five shots, the subjects in those four could be nine feet away, or eleven feet away. Coincidence could easily put the subject in the fifth shot at ten feet, which would be in focus.

So, I'm glad you were able to rule it out, but it's simply not accurate to say it couldn't happen...


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 5, 2013)

gsgary said:


> Another thing you cannot compare the 60D to the 5Dmk3, have you checked what ther shutter speed was for these shots
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9100P using Tapatalk 2



I know I can't compare those two, As I said the 5D was much better and I wish I could shoot like that with the 60D, which obviously isn't possible..



kathythorson said:


> I have a feeling your focus point is set to another point other than the middle. It is easy to accidentally change it and not be aware of it. Bust out the manual and turn on the screen to show your focal points. You need to see these. I know on the Mark III it will not show my focal points when shooting in al servo. I am not sure if this is the same case with the 60D. Try switching it to one shot.


My focus point is in the middle of the screen, I'm adding a picture I just took a moment ago of my screen, look at the arrow, that's where the focus point is being set and right now it's in the middle as it's always set.
About al servo, I never use this option.
http://i.imgur.com/S1JhZl5.jpg


----------



## enzodm (Nov 5, 2013)

terry7cook said:


> I know I can't compare those two, As I said the 5D was much better and I wish I could shoot like that with the 60D, which obviously isn't possible..



indeed, it is _obviously_ possible in many situations. No healthy dSLR can fail some of the pictures you linked. If not the A/M switch, you have some hardware problem to be solved.


----------



## gsgary (Nov 5, 2013)

Look like poor technique shooting wide open, it takes time to get it right


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 5, 2013)

gsgary said:


> Look like poor technique shooting wide open, it takes time to get it right



what do you mean?


----------



## gsgary (Nov 5, 2013)

terry7cook said:


> gsgary said:
> 
> 
> > Look like poor technique shooting wide open, it takes time to get it right
> ...



You have a very shallow DOF one slight movement and you can be out of focus, another thing were the settings exactly the same as the 5Dmk3 ?


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 5, 2013)

gsgary said:


> terry7cook said:
> 
> 
> > gsgary said:
> ...



The settings were not the same as the 5D, and the DOF might not be perfect in the above picture, BUT!

As I was saying at first, this "out of focus" thing, happens over and over again, it doesn't matter if I shoot at night, middle of the day, lot's of light, no light at all, whatever.
At first I had the 18-135 lens which is a kit lens, then I got the L lenses which costs way more then the camera, and I thought to myself well things are going to go differently, but that's not the reality.

I thought that other 60D users can poor some light on this topic...


----------



## Meeskephoto (Nov 5, 2013)

kathythorson said:


> I have a feeling your focus point is set to another point other than the middle. It is easy to accidentally change it and not be aware of it. Bust out the manual and turn on the screen to show your focal points. You need to see these. I know on the Mark III it will not show my focal points when shooting in al servo. I am not sure if this is the same case with the 60D. Try switching it to one shot.



I have the 60D and have already accidentally done this, it is an easy mistake, very possibly the case. I have found my 60D focused fast and precise, even in low lights.


----------



## Steve5D (Nov 5, 2013)

Anytime I've had photos which exhibit that kind of issue, it has _never _been an equipment problem. It's _always _been operator error...


----------



## Steve5D (Nov 5, 2013)

Get your settings where you want them to be. Put the camera on a tripod and use a remote release. Take a picture of a stationary object.

I really doubt you're going to see similar results...


----------



## enzodm (Nov 6, 2013)

terry7cook said:


> I thought that other 60D users can poor some light on this topic...



Well, I am a 60D user and I tried to poor some light, by convincing you (also with examples) that normally a 60D does not behave like this. Even less expensive cameras do not behave like this in most of the pictures you linked. The EXIF data you provided show safe shutter speeds, normal light scenes. The second one - the sign- is so easy to focus, that is almost impossible to miss it, unless moving one step front or back after having set the focus with half click (i.e., gsgary hypothesis: at 10 meters, 135mm, f/2.8, you have about 60cm of DoF).


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 6, 2013)

Ok guys, thanks to all of you for your answers and suggestions, I will try different things we have discussed and update later for the results.

Thanks!


----------



## bratkinson (Nov 6, 2013)

terry7cook said:


> About al servo, I never use this option.



A valuable lesson I learned the hard way when shooting with 'One Shot' on the 60D or 5D3...

If it's alive or moves by any means, AI Servo, AI Servo, AI Servo.

I just have to remember to set my camera back to AI Servo after doing 'still life' like car shows or various building architecture shots...


----------



## terry7cook (Nov 6, 2013)

bratkinson said:


> terry7cook said:
> 
> 
> > About al servo, I never use this option.
> ...




But what about this case:
If I want to put the object (a person) on the left side of my frame, and then keep holding the button half way move a bit to the right and then shoot. The camera will keep focusing as I'm moving? Or it will let me stay focused on the subject?


----------



## Tinderbox (UK) (Nov 7, 2013)

A long shot but do you use an uv filter on your lens, if so have you tried taking photo`s with the filter off.

John.


----------



## centauro74 (Nov 7, 2013)

You may have back focusing problems in your 60D, like some nikon d7000 been having.


----------

