# bike races - c/c welcome



## The_Traveler (Jun 5, 2012)

I go to a good number of bike races and, except for the start and  finish, they are pretty boring.  One sees the cyclists once each loop  and then they're gone again.

The neat part is that you can get  close to national class athletes who are made sort of like us, no  special size, no steroid muscles or height, just incredible endurance,  some degree of genetic gift and great tenacity to put in the hours of  work necessary to stay at that level.

(my son-in-law is a category one cyclist - the highest amateur category - and typically enters the cat one/pro races)
(if you think racing is just peddling hard you might read *this blog post written by another cat 1 racer.)*

This race was a _criterium_,  a short course usually a mile or so, 39 laps, about 30 miles - and they  finished in just a tiny bit over an hour. Picture the continuous effort  and concentration to peddle a bike 30 miles in an hour, wheel to wheel  surrounded by other riders all trying to keep us and even squeeze ahead.

It's  interesting to stand at a curve like the one below and see a category  four race go through and then see the difference with the cat one and  pros. The category 4 field is all herky jerky as they brake, downshift  and make the curve and then push up over the hill, sounding like  somebody shaking a tin box full of forks and spoons.  The cat one and  pros go through that same curve like a metal snake, smooth and quiet -  and so much faster.


Here are two shots to see and comment if you care to.

_one man breakaway_





_girlfriends_


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## brian_f2.8 (Jun 10, 2012)

I'd like for them to be a bit tighter, fill the frame.


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## The_Traveler (Jun 10, 2012)

where would you cut stuff off and how would it change the picture?


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## Destin (Jun 10, 2012)

Haha I'm a Cat 2 mountain bike racer and I occasionally enter Cat 3 road races just for additional training. It's definitely fun, although I can't stand racing crits. If I'm putting out the effort, I want to actually go somewhere.. not pass the same spot 30 times. Most of my races are more like 2 25 mile laps. 

As far as the photos... the best cycling photos show the emotion and pain in an athletes face. Find a short climb where they're coming out of the saddle to power over it, and turn the camera to portrait orientation. Fill the frame with nothing but the bike and rider (maybe a little road), and try to capture the pain visible on their face as they put out the effort. Sports photos are all about feeling and emotion, and the most important part of that is the athletes face. 

Being a mountain bike racer, I've actually been the event photog for some mountain bike races and sold the photos to the riders. I take photos the way I'd want to be photographed if I was racing. If you want to see what they look like, check out this link: DestinDanser.com


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## The_Traveler (Jun 10, 2012)

Destin said:


> As far as the photos... the best cycling photos show the emotion and pain in an athletes face. Find a short climb where they're coming out of the saddle to power over it, and turn the camera to portrait orientation. Fill the frame with nothing but the bike and rider (maybe a little road), and try to capture the pain visible on their face as they put out the effort. Sports photos are all about feeling and emotion, and the most important part of that is the athletes face.



Destin,

Thank you for letting me know that there is a best way to shoot cyclists.  To be honest, I never realized that there was a best way to make any kind of picture.  I did look at your site and, again to be honest, seeing virtually the exact same picture of 5 or 600 riders did get a bit, mmmm, boring.  

I imagine since these pictures aren't shot in the best way, that explains why you didn't mention the pictures that I did post.
Thank you for taking the time to comment and if you hear of the best way to shoot any other types of pictures, please let me know so I won't keep making the silly mistake of trying to create original things.

Lew


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## Destin (Jun 10, 2012)

I'm just saying that... Sports photos where the subject occupies 1/20th of the frame are a bit.. Lifeless. It doesn't show any action. There is no emotion to it. You can barely tell who the riders are in one frame, and they are also riding out of the frame. Heck, the cyclists aren't even the first thing I notice in that photo. My eyes first go the the road, building, and girls, and then out of the frame. Didn't even notice the cyclists the first time I looked 

Believe it or not, there is a best way to take just about any kind of photo, and it should be learned and mastered before working on other ways of doing it, because there is usually a good reason that most sports photos are taken the same way, from the same angle. And those are the shots the continue to make magazines. Why? Because they show what's happening and convey the action/emotion the best. Period. 

Creative attempts are a great thing, however there are fundamental rules that generally speaking, should be adhered to in sports photography. If you break them, you should have a reason for doing so. What's the reason for the cyclists occupying only a small portion of the corner of the frame? It appears you were taking a photo, and just happened to catch a little of the bike race going on. If that's the intent, then great. If not, then you failed to achieve what you were aiming to do.


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## Destin (Jun 10, 2012)

Ps: the redundancy in my photos is because I was trying to sell them, so time spent changing angles/moving to new locations cost me money pretty much, because I was missing photos of passing riders. if I was just shooting for fun I would have moved around more and taken more creative freedom with shutter speed and OCF, etc.


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## Bitter Jeweler (Jun 10, 2012)

Balogne.

These are conceptual images, not sport photos.
Too bad you don't see that.


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## The_Traveler (Jun 10, 2012)

Destin said:


> I'm just saying that..
> 
> Believe it or not, there is a best way to take just about any kind of photo, and it should be learned and mastered before working on other ways of doing it, because there is usually a good reason that most sports photos are taken the same way, from the same angle. And those are the shots the continue to make magazines. Why? Because they show what's happening and convey the action/emotion the best. Period.



Now, I know you're putting me on.


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## brian_f2.8 (Jun 10, 2012)

I agree with BJ, they are not sports images. They are good portraits to sell to someone. Id prefer some panning or slower shutter speeds to show the speed. However I do like the lighting and how the images show a 3rd dimension as opposed to a flat 2-D style. I also agree that sports images need to be tight and fill more than 1/20th of the frame.

Destin - What camera/lens were you using? What were your settings? I have seen some good shots that are wide, when they are wide shots the focus is on the scenery. Imagine a rider climbing up a hill. If you shoot it wide, the focus is on the hill climb and the alps or whatever. If its tight, fills the frame then its a sale to someone. Now if you get into panning through the trees, slow shutter speed etc... then the art is coming out which becomes a good photo. I guess its more about how you shoot it tells the story as any photo.


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## Ysarex (Jun 10, 2012)

Girlfriends -- love it! :thumbup: Really nice B&W quality as well. I'm not into sports but I learned photography from a sports professional and I have the appropriate respect for the discipline. Bike racers are the ultimate athletes. I'm jealous -- splendid photo.

Joe


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## Destin (Jun 11, 2012)

brian_f2.8 said:


> Destin - What camera/lens were you using? What were your settings?



Nikon D80, Sigma 70-200, with a few off camera speedlights in some of the photos. Settings.. I'd have to check exif data.. those shots are pretty old.


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## The_Traveler (Jun 11, 2012)

This may seem inhospitable but I would ask that if you are having a conversation about pictures that are not posted in this thread, I ask that you do it anywhere but in this thread.


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## imagemaker46 (Jun 11, 2012)

First one I would have cropped in front of the pack at the top, just tightened the whole shot up. The second one doesn't really work, it's too loose as a good sports picture, the pilon in the middle separates the riders from the girls too much, a lot of dead space in the middle. I know what you looking for in the shot but don't think you managed to really put it together.


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## The_Traveler (Jun 11, 2012)

imagemaker46 said:


> First one I would have cropped in front of the pack at the top, just tightened the whole shot up. The second one doesn't really work, it's too loose as a good sports picture, the pilon in the middle separates the riders from the girls too much, a lot of dead space in the middle. I know what you looking for in the shot but don't think you managed to really put it together.



Two good points.
I'll try both of you suggestions and see how they work.

Thanks for taking the time to look and comment.

Lew


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## imagemaker46 (Jun 11, 2012)

No problem, sometimes all it takes is a couple of small changes to turn average into great.


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## The_Traveler (Jun 11, 2012)

In an odd coincidence, my daughter sent me a link to some work this pro sports photographer had done (he had taken a picture of my grandson at a big bike race) and I followed the link back to his portfolio.

It's clear he hasn't gotten the message that there is only one way to take sports images.
His work is beautifully done, innovative and pretty damn exciting.


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## imagemaker46 (Jun 11, 2012)

Like everything I've ever said about photography, there are no rules.  What works for someone may not work for another, but as long as the imagination and a sence of what might work live together, anything is possible.


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