# 500/1000mm lens for $129 - Too good to be true?



## stick35 (Nov 25, 2003)

I found this Phoenix 500mm/1000mm Telephoto Lens at eBay for only $129:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2967037521&category=48556

Does anyone have any comments about such a lens?  I'm sure it's not the most well built lens ever made, but for $129 to get 500mm and even double to 1000mm with the 2x telconverter!  It seems like it would be worth a try anyway.

It says it has a 33' minimum focusing distance.  Does anyone know if the focusing distance would change (probably double to 66') with the 2x teleconverter attached?

OK - now give me the bad news.


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## Prophet (Nov 25, 2003)

I dont' know about this lens but I saw it on Ebay today too. I thought about giving it a try but I am not sure yet. It is a slow lens and it is being sold by a reputable eBay dealer. The lens is an f8 throughout the range. It is an incredibly slow lens, you would probably need direct sunshine or a really well lit stadium to use it. Give it a try and let me know, then I can buy one!

-Jeremy-


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## stick35 (Nov 25, 2003)

When you say it is an incredibly slow lens - do you say that because the maximum aperture is f8?


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## voodoocat (Nov 25, 2003)

For the most part those mirror lenses are junk.  Nobody has ever endorsed this lens as a good deal.  Most purchase it, try it once and never use it again.


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## Jeff Canes (Nov 25, 2003)

I have a similar 400mm lens; think I paid around $100 for it 6 years ago. Its has a generic thread mount and requires a mounting ring (about $25) that fits to your camera, this in itself is not bad, the lens is fully manual, including the aperture (f stop setting), when taking a light read you well need to manual open the aperture, and them make setting manual, also with at 1000mm you will need to use a mono or tripod, and fast film

I do not know if the minimum focusing distance will change, but I do know the aperture will


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## voodoocat (Nov 25, 2003)

Jeff Canes said:
			
		

> the lens is fully manual, including the aperture (f stop setting), when taking a light read you well need to manual open the aperture, and them make setting manual,


The lens in question actually has a fixed f stop of f8.  You would need to adjust the shutterspeed to accommodate an aperture of F8


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## photobug (Nov 25, 2003)

A couple of things to keep in mind re: this combo-

1- As a mirror lens it's very short & very light. This is good as it won't take up a lot of room in your bag.

2- Adding a doubler to a f8 mirror lens gives you a f16 that will be _extremely_ hard to focus except in the brightest light. Trust me, I know.

3- A mirror is okay for the ocassional long shot, but if you plan to do this you need to bite the bullet and spend the bucks on some good glass. The mirror lens if fairly dark to view through. If you have a split prism focus screen you're probably going to lose half of it (making it nearly useless).

4- DOF is really (and I mean _really_) short. At 10 meters it's only 0.2 meters. That's like, what?... seven inches or so? Subject better be static!

5- Macro (if it has that mode) actually works pretty well for those things you'd really rather not get *that* close to, but want to fill the frame with. Mine will focus down to about 5.5 feet if I remember correctly.

6- Infinity focus (and beyond)... because these things are made of plastic (except for the really spendy ones) they all focus past infinity. This allows for temperature expansion/contraction in the plastic barrel so the lens actually _will_ focus to infinity all the time. You have to pay attention to your focus control.

In short, it's a nice occassional-use lens that I wouldn't want to have to use all the time.  

hth


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## stick35 (Nov 25, 2003)

Thanks for all of the comments, but I don't think this one is a mirror lens.  It is long and heavy.

Anyway - I guess I have decided not to bother with it.  It just can't be that good at that price.  Normal 500mm lenses are generally over $1,000 from what I have seen.

I love taking nature shots and I would love to get closer to the birds than my 300mm gets me.  That's why I was hoping that the 1000mm would be usable.


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## photobug (Nov 25, 2003)

Oops! I should have followed the link. Having done that now I'd be more inclined to get a mirror than this thing.

And to answer your other question, no, the min focus distance shouldn't change with the doubler attached.

Why not try using a doubler with your 300 to see how that works? Should be able to pick up a used one cheap.


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## Mitica100 (Nov 25, 2003)

stick35 said:
			
		

> I found this Phoenix 500mm/1000mm Telephoto Lens at eBay for only $129:
> 
> Does anyone have any comments about such a lens?  I'm sure it's not the most well built lens ever made, but for $129 to get 500mm and even double to 1000mm with the 2x telconverter!  It seems like it would be worth a try anyway.
> 
> ...



Stick, I know it sounds really good, a lot of lens for the money.  $129 for a fixed, manual focus 500mm lens seems pretty reasonable, I have seen many a lens at about the same price.  I believe the same lens sells overseas as a Vivitar.  All in all, if you want to experiment with the 500mm you'll have to buy it and, worse case scenario, sell it if you hate it.

If I were you I would save $$ and buy a Nikon lens of excellent quality.  Not to say that the Phoenix is a bad lens or anything but one cannot compare it with a Nikon lens.  At least I wouldn't.


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## stick35 (Nov 26, 2003)

I looked into the 2x teleconverter, but I found that my 70-300mm lens will not work with it.

Thanks for the suggestion anyway.


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## Jeff Canes (Nov 26, 2003)

stick35 said:
			
		

> I looked into the 2x teleconverter, but I found that my 70-300mm lens will not work with it.
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion anyway.



The 2x you looked into was it the same brand as your 70-300 :?:


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## stick35 (Nov 26, 2003)

The 70-300mm lens is a Nikkor and in it's instruction manual it says that it will not work with the TC-201 AI Teleconverter that is shown to be compatible with my Nikon N75 (in the N75 System Information guide).

I'm so new at all of this, and I'm embarrased to be asking a lot of stupid questions.  I'm finding it difficult to find information about so many things.  I found a "120-600mm F5.6/8 Vivitar" lens that says it is for a "Nikon AI", but I can't tell if my N75 will work with it.  My N75 book says that you can use AI-P lenses.  Is that the same???

Sorry to drag this thread out.  I found a local camera shop that rents out lenses, so I think I might thry them to make sure any lens I might buy will work with my N75.


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## Prophet (Nov 26, 2003)

Stick,

yes when someone refers to a lens as being slow it is because of the aperature. It take smore time to let all the light in, so your shutter speed must be slowed down to get in all the light.

-Jeremy-


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## Mitica100 (Nov 26, 2003)

stick35 said:
			
		

> I found a local camera shop that rents out lenses, so I think I might thry them to make sure any lens I might buy will work with my N75.



Excellent! I'm sure you will come to a decision, a good one too, as to which lens will suit you better that way.

Good luck.


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## pilgrim (Dec 8, 2003)

Sorry for the newbie question but are there lenses for film cameras, and lenses for digital cameras? Or can you use on each camera?

Oh and I posted this question in here rather then making a new thread.

Thanks to who ever can answer my newb question.


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## Mitica100 (Dec 9, 2003)

pilgrim said:
			
		

> Sorry for the newbie question but are there lenses for film cameras, and lenses for digital cameras? Or can you use on each camera?
> 
> Oh and I posted this question in here rather then making a new thread.
> 
> Thanks to who ever can answer my newb question.



Hey Pilgrim, no question here will remain unanswered, so I'll take the first try:

The digital SLRs (ie Canon 10D, Canon 1D) accept USM lenses, the same lenses that a regular film Canon SLR uses (like EOS).  So, it really depends on what kind of digital camera we are talking about.  There are some that have a 'one-lens-does-all' (from WA to TELE) which cannot be removed but to which you can attach extra lenses, such as extreme WA (fish-eye).  

But all things considered, lenses are the same kind and of the same quality, whether they are made for digital or for regular film use.

Also, maybe you do want to start a new thread, if you want more answers.  

Hope this helps.

Stay warm... :camera: 

Dimitri


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## pilgrim (Dec 9, 2003)

Thanks alot Mitica! that pretty much answered my question. 

I have been looking and looking and looking at different cameras. Right now the camera of choice is the Sigma SD9.  Its more then I wanted to spend, but I really want to focus and learn more about photography and I dont want to be upgrading my camera in a few months. I am also taking a photography course in January, so I am hoping that will help me out. 

A friend of mine said that his dad has a case full of old lenses that he never uses, that I would be able to buy for relatively cheap, so since the Sigma SD9 is an SLR camera the lenses should be able to work? I think ill go look at them one of these nights and ill post up on here what lenses he has, just to get some opinions or advice. 

Thanks again Mitica, and anyone else who takes the time to comment.
 

haha im really starting to think I could use my own thread soon, but I just keep putting more and more into this one....


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## Mitica100 (Dec 9, 2003)

> A friend of mine said that his dad has a case full of old lenses that he never uses, that I would be able to buy for relatively cheap, so since the Sigma SD9 is an SLR camera the lenses should be able to work? I think ill go look at them one of these nights and ill post up on here what lenses he has, just to get some opinions or advice.



I seriously doubt that any such lens will fit the Sigma SD9.  Each manufacturer of camera/lenses makes their own lenses with a very singular and specific mount,  although there might be adapters which could convert one mount to another (i.e. Canon to Nikon).  I know Sigma makes lenses with virtually every camera mount, I have two for Canon FD mount and a tele for a Pentax AF mount.  Very good lenses indeed.

But in any case, I'll look forward to see your post and what lenses you might or might not be able to use with the Sigma.

Meanwhile take care,

Dimitri


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## drlynn (Dec 9, 2003)

A couple of things about digital cameras and lenses:

1. A lens made for a film camera will work for a digital camera of the same brand, usually (ie Canon AE lenses will fit on the 10d and Digital Rebel, etc) BUT will NOT cover the listed focal length. 

For example, a 28-90 zoom would actually cover 45-145mm on a Digital Rebel.  This is because the digital camera's image sensor is smaller than a 35mm negative, so the lens focal length is effectively longer.  This means thatyou will need a very wide angle lens to get to a moderate wide-angle shot on a digital SLR.

2. Think twice about the Sigma digital cameras.  There have been some folks on here who bought them and have found that they couldn't do certain things like long exposures (>15 seconds, such as for night photography).  
Also, they are 3.4MP cameras, the lowest resolution of any digital SLR.  The image sensor they use supposedly gives the equivalent of roughly 4-5MP, but most other digital SLR's are 6MP or higher.
And finally, there is no ability to shoot in JPEG mode, only in RAW, which means that you have less ability to edit your shots in the camera, but have to download to adjust your white balance, etc.

Other folks on here could give you a better comparison between the Sigma and other digital SLR's but these are the points I have picked up while studying the range of available products.  I'm hoping to be able to afford one at some point, so I'm starting to do my homework.

Hope this helps.


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## pilgrim (Dec 9, 2003)

wow, thanks alot drylnn!
I manged to understand most of what you said, and a few bits made my head hurt  :?.
hmm, I have also heard a few bad things about the Sigma's, so I guess its time to look around some more   
I have come to a conclusion that all I am looking for in a camera is a digital camera that can take different lenses, and has mainly manual controls, doesnt have to be completly manual. Iwant to build up a lens collection and once I know more, I could purchase a better camera body and still have all these lenses.


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## voodoocat (Dec 9, 2003)

drlynn said:
			
		

> And finally, there is no ability to shoot in JPEG mode, only in RAW, which means that you have less ability to edit your shots in the camera, but have to download to adjust your white balance, etc.


Some consider that a nice feature.  One of the other things it does not offer is anti-aliasing which I would prefer as well.  This camera and sensor still needs more r&d but I believe it to be a pioneer as far as sensors go.  Here you can see how with half the megapixels you get a sharper image.  Some people forget that photography, for the most part, is the print.  When it comes down to it, its more than just megapixels that make a nice print. 
White balance and softening can happen quite easily in photshop, psp, gimp, etc... 

I'm excited to see their booth at PMA's.  I'm sure they'll have the SD10 on display.  


To the original question regarding the SD9
I don't really recommend the SD9 because it's not there yet.  I think right now canon or nikon would be a better choice depending on if you already have lenses that fit.  I suggest getting prints made of samples from the cameras that interest you.  Think about what things you want to do and find the camera that fits you.  Some are faster as far as images/sec for applications such as photojournalism.  There is no one camera that fits everyone.


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## intensesupernova (Dec 12, 2003)

If it sounds too good to be true, it usually is.


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## raisins (Dec 5, 2007)

This is a gallery shot with a mirror lens apparently.   
http://www.pbase.com/dadas115/sigma600mm


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## Big Mike (Dec 5, 2007)

WOW...this thread is 4 years old.


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## frXnz kafka (Dec 5, 2007)

Big Mike said:


> WOW...this thread is 4 years old.



Do you reckon the OP made his decision yet?


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## Paolo Duzioni (Dec 5, 2007)

lol, a Matsukov sigma.

fixed focal ratio and lenght, manual focus, primary mirror with secondary lens, and a correcting lens in front. I use an MTO, a russian matsukov-type like this, in astrophotograpy.  
F/8 in really NOT BAD for a mak like this, my MTO is F10..  but color aberration and coma correction at the edges must be considered..  A nice, cheap toy, not for everyday use


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## sabbath999 (Dec 5, 2007)

Yep, the search function definitely works around here.


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