# First mirrorless camera



## Jonahnieuwe

As the title suggests, I'm looking for my first mirrorless camera to buy and I hope you are willing and able to help me with my choice. First of all I will give u some information about me and my budget and what kind of photos I want to take.

I'm "only" 16 years old and earned my money by walking the morning papers, my budget is €2000 so $2180. I'm telling you this so you know that I really worked long for this and I'm not going to spend it without some serious consideration, that's why I am making this forum post right now.

I do have some experience with cameras I shot many pictures with a small point and shoot, an all in one camera and the last few years with my phone. I'm really interested in photography and willing to learn about the exposure triangle and the rule of thirds etc.

Our family loves adventures and active vacations, like walking in the mountains in Italy, canoeing in Sweden, Skiing in Austria and going on city trips like: Paris, Barcelona, Stockholm, Prague etc. So I would like a sturdy camera, with exchangeable lenses and maybe water-resistant because I live in the Netherlands and rain is never far away. I was looking into mirror less cameras because of the compact size wich can be useful when going on a city trip.

I made a list of thinks I (think) I need/want in a camera:

1. Portability, the best camera is the one you have with you. I believe that having a portable camera is one of the nicest thinks when going on city trips, hikes, snowboarding etc.
2. Ruggedness, when walking in the mountains, climbing, setting down a camera on a rock or fallen tree, snowboarding and exploring the rainy Netherlands and Scandinavia ruggedness could ensure a longer lifespan.
3. Decent video, I am not planning on doing real movie productions but having the option of shooting some descent looking video can come in handy sometimes.
4. Good lens selection, a relatively cheap, large and good (secondhand) lens selection could help keep down the cost in the long run. Although this is one of the not so important points.
5. Image stabilization, I "suffer" from pretty shaky hand and image stabilization in body or lens or both would ensure better images and video.
6. Budget, body and one lens for a max of €1500,-

So if I hold my list next to existing cameras I end up with:
1. Panasonic gx8 + 12-60mm €1068
2.Olympus om-d em-1 + 12-40mm Pro €1200
3. Fujifilm x-t1 + 18-55mm €1200
4. Olympus om-d em-5 m2 12-50 ez €1000 or 12-40 Pro €1500
5. Panasonic g85/g80 + 12-60mm €899

I hope you have all you need to help me with this (for me) though choice, wich has kept me busy for over two months now, between these cameras or maybe another better option although more choice might not make it easier ;-).
I would love to hear your thoughts on this topic! If you have more questions feel free to ask me.

Greetings


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## waday

This seemed familiar to me... Buying my first real camera

To help us answer your question, any reason why you chose not to go with any of the Nikons you mentioned?

In other words, what changed your mind to go with mirrorless?



Jonahnieuwe said:


> Thank you for the reply, the Fujifilm 18-55 is a high Quality lens but als you set its ver expensive, I think I will go for a Nikon d7100, d5500-5600 or d7200


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## jcdeboever

I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.


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## BrentC

I can only comment on the Olympus cameras.   Unless you are going to do a lot of action shots I would go with the EM5 MKII over the The EM1 ( I am assuming you mean the MK I).   More features.   Go with the 12-40 Pro if you can.   You may also want to consider the 12-100 IS Pro instead if you can fit into your budget.   It is an fantastic travel lens that has great range.  Also the synced IS between camera and lens gives the best stabilization out there.  The EM5 MKII, 12-40 and 12-100 are all weather sealed and durable.


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## Jonahnieuwe

waday said:


> This seemed familiar to me... Buying my first real camera
> 
> To help us answer your question, any reason why you chose not to go with any of the Nikons you mentioned?
> 
> In other words, what changed your mind to go with mirrorless?
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for the reply, the Fujifilm 18-55 is a high Quality lens but als you set its ver expensive, I think I will go for a Nikon d7100, d5500-5600 or d7200
Click to expand...


Haha you remember, I tried reviving my old post but didn't get any new replies so being unable to remove it it's still there... I decided to go mirrorless after using a canon 80d for a day (and really liking it) but I think it's just to big and heavy to take everywhere especially when going backpacking. Secondly I'm not sure what kind of photographs I will take the most in the future but I am considering a Tele lens in the future, and bringing a dslr + normal zoom + Tele is for my hobby use maybe a little too much to carry around.


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## Jonahnieuwe

jcdeboever said:


> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.


Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me


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## Jonahnieuwe

BrentC said:


> I can only comment on the Olympus cameras.   Unless you are going to do a lot of action shots I would go with the EM5 MKII over the The EM1 ( I am assuming you mean the MK I).   More features.   Go with the 12-40 Pro if you can.   You may also want to consider the 12-100 IS Pro instead if you can fit into your budget.   It is an fantastic travel lens that has great range.  Also the synced IS between camera and lens gives the best stabilization out there.  The EM5 MKII, 12-40 and 12-100 are all weather sealed and durable.



The em1 and em5.2 have the same sensor, right? I can get an as new em1 body for €499 so that's considerably cheaper than the em5.2? Is it worth the price difference?


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## jcdeboever

Jonahnieuwe said:


> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
Click to expand...


Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.


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## BrentC

Jonahnieuwe said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I can only comment on the Olympus cameras.   Unless you are going to do a lot of action shots I would go with the EM5 MKII over the The EM1 ( I am assuming you mean the MK I).   More features.   Go with the 12-40 Pro if you can.   You may also want to consider the 12-100 IS Pro instead if you can fit into your budget.   It is an fantastic travel lens that has great range.  Also the synced IS between camera and lens gives the best stabilization out there.  The EM5 MKII, 12-40 and 12-100 are all weather sealed and durable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The em1 and em5.2 have the same sensor, right? I can get an as new em1 body for €499 so that's considerably cheaper than the em5.2? Is it worth the price difference?
Click to expand...


Take a look at the features between the two to decide.  It does have the same 16MP sensor.   A feature that maybe desired that is on the em5.2 and not the em1.1 is hi-res, 40MP image.   Great for landscapes, you get amazing detail.   Also I believe the em1 does not have a fully articulated screen as the EM5 does.

Have the features side-by-side to see if any og them are requirements for you.


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## BrentC

jcdeboever said:


> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
Click to expand...


Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.


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## jcdeboever

BrentC said:


> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
Click to expand...

Ok. Better you than me.


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## Jonahnieuwe

BrentC said:


> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
Click to expand...


I have read this too in many posts, and a tough magnesiumaloid body never hurts does it?

Any thoughts on the dmc g85 or gx8?


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## beagle100

Jonahnieuwe said:


> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> This seemed familiar to me... Buying my first real camera
> 
> To help us answer your question, any reason why you chose not to go with any of the Nikons you mentioned?
> 
> In other words, what changed your mind to go with mirrorless?
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for the reply, the Fujifilm 18-55 is a high Quality lens but als you set its ver expensive, I think I will go for a Nikon d7100, d5500-5600 or d7200
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Haha you remember, I tried reviving my old post but didn't get any new replies so being unable to remove it it's still there... I decided to go mirrorless after using a canon 80d for a day (and really liking it) but I think it's just to big and heavy to take everywhere especially when going backpacking. Secondly I'm not sure what kind of photographs I will take the most in the future but I am considering a Tele lens in the future, and bringing a dslr + normal zoom + Tele is for my hobby use maybe a little too much to carry around.
Click to expand...


For backpacking, bicycling, hiking, etc. I use mirrorless and 'pancake' style lens - small, light 
(but with the occasional use of the big DSLR telephoto lens)
*www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless*


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## Jonahnieuwe

jcdeboever said:


> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
Click to expand...

 I'm not planning on taking a swim or standing under a waterfall, just having more peace of mind in soft rainfall.


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## BrentC

Jonahnieuwe said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have read this too in many posts, and a tough magnesiumaloid body never hurts does it?
> 
> Any thoughts on the dmc g85 or gx8?
Click to expand...


Not a lot.  I think its a matter of holding each in your hand if you can and see which you prefer.  What I know for sure is you will get better stabilzation with Olympus and better video with Panny.   I then comes down to features and camera ergonomics.    But remember they are all m43 so if you decide in the future to change you body from Oly to Panny or vice-versa the lenses will work on both.   Between Oly, Panny, Sigma and others you have tons of lenses to choose from.


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## waday

BrentC said:


> Also I believe the em1 does not have a fully articulated screen as the EM5 does.


I remember telling my wife when I was buying the EM1.1 that I didn't care for a fully-articulating screen. I didn't, at the time.

After traveling with it, I can surely say that wish it had a fully-articulating screen, haha.


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## BrentC

waday said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Also I believe the em1 does not have a fully articulated screen as the EM5 does.
> 
> 
> 
> I remember telling my wife when I was buying the EM1.1 that I didn't care for a fully-articulating screen. I didn't, at the time.
> 
> After traveling with it, I can surely say that wish it had a fully-articulating screen, haha.
Click to expand...



Yes it does come in handy for high and low shots.  Also it has the selfie function that I have sued a couple times.


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## Jonahnieuwe

BrentC said:


> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have read this too in many posts, and a tough magnesiumaloid body never hurts does it?
> 
> Any thoughts on the dmc g85 or gx8?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not a lot.  I think its a matter of holding each in your hand if you can and see which you prefer.  What I know for sure is you will get better stabilzation with Olympus and better video with Panny.   I then comes down to features and camera ergonomics.    But remember they are all m43 so if you decide in the future to change you body from Oly to Panny or vice-versa the lenses will work on both.   Between Oly, Panny, Sigma and others you have tons of lenses to choose from.
Click to expand...


The lens selection, size of the lenses (smaller than a apc or ff counterpart) and form factor is what is compelling for me from m43


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## BrentC

Jonahnieuwe said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd look at the Fujifilm XT20 body, new. Buy the 18-55mm or 18-135 used. You'll be under a grand. If your into landscape, pick up a used 10-24mm. Both have excellent image stabilization, micro contrast, and sharpness.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have read this too in many posts, and a tough magnesiumaloid body never hurts does it?
> 
> Any thoughts on the dmc g85 or gx8?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not a lot.  I think its a matter of holding each in your hand if you can and see which you prefer.  What I know for sure is you will get better stabilzation with Olympus and better video with Panny.   I then comes down to features and camera ergonomics.    But remember they are all m43 so if you decide in the future to change you body from Oly to Panny or vice-versa the lenses will work on both.   Between Oly, Panny, Sigma and others you have tons of lenses to choose from.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The lens selection, size of the lenses (smaller than a apc or ff counterpart) and form factor is what is compelling for me from m43
Click to expand...


Yes and like @beagle100  said, if you need even smaller you can get decent pancake lenses.


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## Jonahnieuwe

BrentC said:


> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply, although not weather sealed the x-t20 is a really cool camera, my dream camera is a Olympus em-1.2 or Fuji x-t2/x-Pro sadly these are just not in budget and also not necessary, the cameras I'm looking at now seem to hit the balance between price and use for me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have read this too in many posts, and a tough magnesiumaloid body never hurts does it?
> 
> Any thoughts on the dmc g85 or gx8?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not a lot.  I think its a matter of holding each in your hand if you can and see which you prefer.  What I know for sure is you will get better stabilzation with Olympus and better video with Panny.   I then comes down to features and camera ergonomics.    But remember they are all m43 so if you decide in the future to change you body from Oly to Panny or vice-versa the lenses will work on both.   Between Oly, Panny, Sigma and others you have tons of lenses to choose from.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The lens selection, size of the lenses (smaller than a apc or ff counterpart) and form factor is what is compelling for me from m43
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes and like @beagle100  said, if you need even smaller you can get decent pancake lenses.
Click to expand...

So m43 and mirrorless it is, now the only thing left is deciding on a body and starter lens... what would you guys go for for let's say 1200-1300€? If you were me?


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## waday

BrentC said:


> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Also I believe the em1 does not have a fully articulated screen as the EM5 does.
> 
> 
> 
> I remember telling my wife when I was buying the EM1.1 that I didn't care for a fully-articulating screen. I didn't, at the time.
> 
> After traveling with it, I can surely say that wish it had a fully-articulating screen, haha.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Yes it does come in handy for high and low shots.  Also it has the selfie function that I have sued a couple times.
Click to expand...

Agreed! The EM1.1 does ok with high/low shots, but can't do selfie or odd angles.


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## Jonahnieuwe

waday said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Also I believe the em1 does not have a fully articulated screen as the EM5 does.
> 
> 
> 
> I remember telling my wife when I was buying the EM1.1 that I didn't care for a fully-articulating screen. I didn't, at the time.
> 
> After traveling with it, I can surely say that wish it had a fully-articulating screen, haha.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> Yes it does come in handy for high and low shots.  Also it has the selfie function that I have sued a couple times.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Agreed! The EM1.1 does ok with high/low shots, but can't do selfie or odd angles.
Click to expand...

I learned to blindly take pictures of myself with the point and shoot, maybe not ideal but I nail it most of the time. I also tend to place the camera on a rock, frame the shot and run for it, got us some hilarious family pictures. Although I can't deny that it's tempting to have a fully articulated screen while you can protect the screen by folding it against the body.


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## waday

Jonahnieuwe said:


> BrentC said:
> 
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> Jonahnieuwe said:
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> BrentC said:
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> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
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> BrentC said:
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> jcdeboever said:
> 
> 
> 
> Weather sealed is BS. Any camera in the rain is trouble. The 18-55 lens is not weather sealed. It's a gimic, incidental is as far as I would go with my XT2 or XP2. You really want a sealed camera, buy one of those Fujifilm XP120.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have read this too in many posts, and a tough magnesiumaloid body never hurts does it?
> 
> Any thoughts on the dmc g85 or gx8?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not a lot.  I think its a matter of holding each in your hand if you can and see which you prefer.  What I know for sure is you will get better stabilzation with Olympus and better video with Panny.   I then comes down to features and camera ergonomics.    But remember they are all m43 so if you decide in the future to change you body from Oly to Panny or vice-versa the lenses will work on both.   Between Oly, Panny, Sigma and others you have tons of lenses to choose from.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The lens selection, size of the lenses (smaller than a apc or ff counterpart) and form factor is what is compelling for me from m43
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes and like @beagle100  said, if you need even smaller you can get decent pancake lenses.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So m43 and mirrorless it is, now the only thing left is deciding on a body and starter lens... what would you guys go for for let's say 1200-1300€? If you were me?
Click to expand...

In my opinion...

Body: EM5.2

Some good lenses (these are all Oly) to get you started:

12-40 f/2.8
14-150 II f/variable (this is probably more delicate than the other two lenses)
17 f/1.8
All used, if possible. Also can't guarantee these are all in the 1200-1300€ range... You'll also need a good tripod and strap or bag or clip or all the above. Don't forget about those!


----------



## Jonahnieuwe

waday said:


> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry no gimic with the Olympus.  I have used mine in heavy rain.   Got it completely soaked many times for extended times.   There is plenty of proof out there on how good the weather seal on the Olympus gear is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have read this too in many posts, and a tough magnesiumaloid body never hurts does it?
> 
> Any thoughts on the dmc g85 or gx8?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Not a lot.  I think its a matter of holding each in your hand if you can and see which you prefer.  What I know for sure is you will get better stabilzation with Olympus and better video with Panny.   I then comes down to features and camera ergonomics.    But remember they are all m43 so if you decide in the future to change you body from Oly to Panny or vice-versa the lenses will work on both.   Between Oly, Panny, Sigma and others you have tons of lenses to choose from.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> The lens selection, size of the lenses (smaller than a apc or ff counterpart) and form factor is what is compelling for me from m43
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yes and like @beagle100  said, if you need even smaller you can get decent pancake lenses.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So m43 and mirrorless it is, now the only thing left is deciding on a body and starter lens... what would you guys go for for let's say 1200-1300€? If you were me?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> In my opinion...
> 
> Body: EM5.2
> 
> Some good lenses (these are all Oly) to get you started:
> 
> 12-40 f/2.8
> 14-150 II f/variable (this is probably more delicate than the other two lenses)
> 17 f/1.8
> All used, if possible. Also can't guarantee these are all in the 1200-1300€ range... You'll also need a good tripod and strap or bag or clip or all the above. Don't forget about those!
Click to expand...


Right now there is a €100,- cash back on a new em5.2 + 12-40 Pro making it €1500. I also saw the 14-150 and it's definitely a contender. I know that I need some "accessories" that's why I don't want to spend more than approximately €1400 on body and one lens at first.


----------



## BrentC

Yes the 14-150 is a great cheap travel lens, plastic fantastic and its weather sealed.  So you can start off with that lens.  But not great in low light so if you can pair it with the 17mm f1.8 you will have everything covered.   The 17mm is not weather sealed.

These would be my recommendations for body and lens, in no particular order.

Body: EM5 MKII

Lens

1.  12-100 IS Pro

Benefits of good range, great IQ,  sharp, fast AF and amazing dual IS so you can stop down shutter for low light.  Weather sealed

2.  14-150mm + 17mm 1.8

14-150 - Great range, good IQ, weather sealed.  Not good low light.
17mm - Great IQ, sharp, super fast AF, great for video.  Low light.  Not weather sealed.

3.   12-40 f2.8 Pro

Great IQ, fast AF, sharp, good for video, low light.  Weather sealed.   Short range.


----------



## BrentC

I don't know enough of the pancake lenses but maybe @beagle100  can recommend one.


----------



## waday

BrentC said:


> 1. 12-100 IS Pro
> 
> Benefits of good range, great IQ, sharp, fast AF and amazing dual IS so you can stop down shutter for low light. Weather sealed


I want that so bad, but I don't think my wife would be happy with me buying another lens so soon, haha.


----------



## BrentC

waday said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 1. 12-100 IS Pro
> 
> Benefits of good range, great IQ, sharp, fast AF and amazing dual IS so you can stop down shutter for low light. Weather sealed
> 
> 
> 
> I want that so bad, but I don't think my wife would be happy with me buying another lens so soon, haha.
Click to expand...


Although its a bit expensive for me right now I have been slowly convincing myself I need it. .  
I am also trying to find a used 50-200 f2.8-3.5 SWD which is a FT lens that works really well with the EM1.2.


----------



## waday

BrentC said:


> I am also trying to find a used 50-200 f2.8-3.5 SWD which is a FT lens that works really well with the EM1.2.


I think I thought I saw one for sale over here, but I'm not sure when I saw it... it could have been a couple months ago.


----------



## BrentC

waday said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am also trying to find a used 50-200 f2.8-3.5 SWD which is a FT lens that works really well with the EM1.2.
> 
> 
> 
> I think I thought I saw one for sale over here, but I'm not sure when I saw it... it could have been a couple months ago.
Click to expand...


Thanks.  Just checked and unfortunately it was the non-SWD version.


----------



## waday

BrentC said:


> I have been slowly convincing myself I need it.


Oh, and BTW, I've long since convinced myself that I need that lens and the 40-150 2.8..


----------



## waday

BrentC said:


> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am also trying to find a used 50-200 f2.8-3.5 SWD which is a FT lens that works really well with the EM1.2.
> 
> 
> 
> I think I thought I saw one for sale over here, but I'm not sure when I saw it... it could have been a couple months ago.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Thanks.  Just checked and unfortunately it was the non-SWD version.
Click to expand...

Ah, darnit.


----------



## beagle100

BrentC said:


> I don't know enough of the pancake lenses but maybe @beagle100  can recommend one.



all the mirrorless cameras have "pancake" style lens (I think)
I use Canon ...but the key point was I can still use the larger DSLR lens.  kinda hard to make a "pancake" 400mm 2.8 lens

*www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless*


----------



## PropilotBW

I think it's a smart choice going with the EM5ii over the EM1.  There are a lot of nice features included in the EM5ii that were improved upon from the original EM1.   
  I think you'll be happy with the EM5ii.  First hand opinion, It's an excellent camera.


----------



## waday

@PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.


----------



## PropilotBW

waday said:


> @PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.



I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).   

*- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.


----------



## waday

PropilotBW said:


> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> @PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).
> 
> *- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.
Click to expand...

Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.

Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens


----------



## BrentC

waday said:


> PropilotBW said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> @PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).
> 
> *- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.
> 
> Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens
Click to expand...


I have one as well.  It's a nice flash but I got it because I needed a flash to use off the hot shoe.  If you don't use flash much or need one off the camera the one that comes with the camera is actually good and all you probably need.  So save the money for lenses.

Remember in another thread I said I have no money to buy lenses?  I just picked up the 12-100 and a used 50-200 and EC14.   I couldn't stop myself.


----------



## waday

BrentC said:


> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PropilotBW said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> @PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).
> 
> *- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.
> 
> Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have one as well.  It's a nice flash but I got it because I needed a flash to use off the hot shoe.  If you don't use flash much or need one off the camera the one that comes with the camera is actually good and all you probably need.  So save the money for lenses.
> 
> Remember in another thread I said I have no money to buy lenses?  I just picked up the 12-100 and a used 50-200 and EC14.   I couldn't stop myself.
Click to expand...

Oh. My. God.

What?! I'm so excited for you!

How do you like them? Need details!


----------



## BrentC

waday said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PropilotBW said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> @PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).
> 
> *- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.
> 
> Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have one as well.  It's a nice flash but I got it because I needed a flash to use off the hot shoe.  If you don't use flash much or need one off the camera the one that comes with the camera is actually good and all you probably need.  So save the money for lenses.
> 
> Remember in another thread I said I have no money to buy lenses?  I just picked up the 12-100 and a used 50-200 and EC14.   I couldn't stop myself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh. My. God.
> 
> What?! I'm so excited for you!
> 
> How do you like them? Need details!
Click to expand...


Have only been doing some test shots with the 12-100 but so far I am really impressed.  I think its going to be a fantastic lens.  Very sharp and great IQ.  Everything I was hoping it would be.  can't wait to take it travelling.  The 50-200 and TC I am still waiting for it in the mail and hope it will compliment my 300 for wildlife.  I will post some pics from both of them when I get a chance.


----------



## waday

BrentC said:


> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PropilotBW said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> @PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).
> 
> *- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.
> 
> Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have one as well.  It's a nice flash but I got it because I needed a flash to use off the hot shoe.  If you don't use flash much or need one off the camera the one that comes with the camera is actually good and all you probably need.  So save the money for lenses.
> 
> Remember in another thread I said I have no money to buy lenses?  I just picked up the 12-100 and a used 50-200 and EC14.   I couldn't stop myself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh. My. God.
> 
> What?! I'm so excited for you!
> 
> How do you like them? Need details!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Have only been doing some test shots with the 12-100 but so far I am really impressed.  I think its going to be a fantastic lens.  Very sharp and great IQ.  Everything I was hoping it would be.  can't wait to take it travelling.  The 50-200 and TC I am still waiting for it in the mail and hope it will compliment my 300 for wildlife.  I will post some pics from both of them when I get a chance.
Click to expand...

Nice! That's awesome. Do you feel limited at all with the f/4 as opposed to something faster?

ETA: something faster being the 40-150 2.8, haha


----------



## waday

I want one... im going to have to save up.


----------



## BrentC

waday said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PropilotBW said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> @PropilotBW , how do you like your Olympus flash (FL-600R)? I've been toying with the idea of getting one, but I'm not sure I really want to sink $250 into one when I feel like I'd get better use of that money saving up for a lens I really want.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).
> 
> *- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.
> 
> Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have one as well.  It's a nice flash but I got it because I needed a flash to use off the hot shoe.  If you don't use flash much or need one off the camera the one that comes with the camera is actually good and all you probably need.  So save the money for lenses.
> 
> Remember in another thread I said I have no money to buy lenses?  I just picked up the 12-100 and a used 50-200 and EC14.   I couldn't stop myself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh. My. God.
> 
> What?! I'm so excited for you!
> 
> How do you like them? Need details!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Have only been doing some test shots with the 12-100 but so far I am really impressed.  I think its going to be a fantastic lens.  Very sharp and great IQ.  Everything I was hoping it would be.  can't wait to take it travelling.  The 50-200 and TC I am still waiting for it in the mail and hope it will compliment my 300 for wildlife.  I will post some pics from both of them when I get a chance.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nice! That's awesome. Do you feel limited at all with the f/4 as opposed to something faster?
> 
> ETA: something faster being the 40-150 2.8, haha
Click to expand...


No, I think the f/4 will do me fine for what I need.


----------



## Jonahnieuwe

I just ordered the Olympus omd em5 m ii and 12-40 Pro (both camera store occasions) for €1130,- and my parents will pay €250 for my birthday. This brings the price I have to pay to €880, leaving me with more than enough for a tripod and maybe a second lens if I eventually know what I shoot the most (40-150 Pro or 12-100 Pro). They will both be here today so I'm super excited!


----------



## BrentC

waday said:


> I want one... im going to have to save up.





Jonahnieuwe said:


> I just ordered the Olympus omd em5 m ii and 12-40 Pro (both camera store occasions) for €1130,- and my parents will pay €250 for my birthday. This brings the price I have to pay to €880, leaving me with more than enough for a tripod and maybe a second lens if I eventually know what I shoot the most (40-150 Pro or 12-100 Pro). They will both be here today so I'm super excited!



Good stuff.  Let us know what you think when you get and post some pics.


----------



## waday

Jonahnieuwe said:


> I just ordered the Olympus omd em5 m ii and 12-40 Pro (both camera store occasions) for €1130,- and my parents will pay €250 for my birthday. This brings the price I have to pay to €880, leaving me with more than enough for a tripod and maybe a second lens if I eventually know what I shoot the most (40-150 Pro or 12-100 Pro). They will both be here today so I'm super excited!


You're going to like it. 

@BrentC , did you get the 50-250 in the mail?


----------



## BrentC

waday said:


> Jonahnieuwe said:
> 
> 
> 
> I just ordered the Olympus omd em5 m ii and 12-40 Pro (both camera store occasions) for €1130,- and my parents will pay €250 for my birthday. This brings the price I have to pay to €880, leaving me with more than enough for a tripod and maybe a second lens if I eventually know what I shoot the most (40-150 Pro or 12-100 Pro). They will both be here today so I'm super excited!
> 
> 
> 
> You're going to like it.
> 
> @BrentC , did you get the 50-250 in the mail?
Click to expand...


My mistake in my sig its a 50-200.   No still waiting.  Probably won't get it till sometime next week.


----------



## beagle100

BrentC said:


> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PropilotBW said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do like it.  I mostly use it as a remote, off-camera flash in a one-light portrait setup.  I trigger it by the small flash that my EM5ii came with.   It produces some really nice results when I have the time to tinker with settings.  I purchased a secondary Yongnuo 560-iv to supplement.   While the Yongnuo could have done the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost, it is nice having the Olympus for on-camera usage(Sync).
> 
> *- I don't really care for flash photography, so I only use it when I need to.  A lens is a much more fun way to spend the money.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.
> 
> Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have one as well.  It's a nice flash but I got it because I needed a flash to use off the hot shoe.  If you don't use flash much or need one off the camera the one that comes with the camera is actually good and all you probably need.  So save the money for lenses.
> 
> Remember in another thread I said I have no money to buy lenses?  I just picked up the 12-100 and a used 50-200 and EC14.   I couldn't stop myself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh. My. God.
> 
> What?! I'm so excited for you!
> 
> How do you like them? Need details!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have only been doing some test shots with the 12-100 but so far I am really impressed.  I think its going to be a fantastic lens.  Very sharp and great IQ.  Everything I was hoping it would be.  can't wait to take it travelling.  The 50-200 and TC I am still waiting for it in the mail and hope it will compliment my 300 for wildlife.  I will post some pics from both of them when I get a chance.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nice! That's awesome. Do you feel limited at all with the f/4 as opposed to something faster?
> ETA: something faster being the 40-150 2.8, haha
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, I think the f/4 will do me fine for what I need.
Click to expand...


yes, f/4 is nice,  f/2.8 is nicer
*www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless*


----------



## BrentC

beagle100 said:


> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BrentC said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> waday said:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks! That's kinda what I was thinking and likely the reason why I never pulled the trigger on the flash.
> 
> Yeah, I'd rather spend the money on a lens
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have one as well.  It's a nice flash but I got it because I needed a flash to use off the hot shoe.  If you don't use flash much or need one off the camera the one that comes with the camera is actually good and all you probably need.  So save the money for lenses.
> 
> Remember in another thread I said I have no money to buy lenses?  I just picked up the 12-100 and a used 50-200 and EC14.   I couldn't stop myself.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Oh. My. God.
> 
> What?! I'm so excited for you!
> 
> How do you like them? Need details!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Have only been doing some test shots with the 12-100 but so far I am really impressed.  I think its going to be a fantastic lens.  Very sharp and great IQ.  Everything I was hoping it would be.  can't wait to take it travelling.  The 50-200 and TC I am still waiting for it in the mail and hope it will compliment my 300 for wildlife.  I will post some pics from both of them when I get a chance.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Nice! That's awesome. Do you feel limited at all with the f/4 as opposed to something faster?
> ETA: something faster being the 40-150 2.8, haha
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> No, I think the f/4 will do me fine for what I need.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> yes, f/4 is nice,  f/2.8 is nicer
> *www.flickr.com/photos/mmirrorless*
Click to expand...



Ah..but this f/4 is a phenomenally wicked super zoom that retains sharpness and IQ throughout the whole fl range.  And with the Dual IS I can easily do 5 second exposure handheld fully wide when needed.  If I were to get the 2.8 I would need both Pro lenses, 12-40 and 40-150.   2.8 would be really nice but for my needs, being mostly a wildlife shooter, the 12-100 f/4 is the perfect lens for me to travel with.   

Here is a great comparison between the two lenses:

Olympus 12-100mm f/4 PRO vs. 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO – The complete comparison


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## unpopular

My first mirrorless was a Wista D with a 135mm Nikkor. Fit neatly into a breifcase for those spontaneous moments.

o_o


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## Emanuel M

My first mirrorless was the Olympus E-M5 MK 1...
Still love it, but nowadays I'm using the Olympus PEN-F with a 9-18mm, a 17mm 1.8, a 45mm 1.8 and a fantastic 75mm 1.8 (I really really love this lens).

From time to time I use my, also beloved, Nikon D610 

Cheers


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