# No idea how to work out a price deal



## Paws&Awws (Aug 24, 2017)

I'm a pet photographer, just starting and a local dog groomer approached me saying she wants to book me for an entire day to do mini sessions with her clients. She will book all the appointments for the day and give me a space to work. I have to come in, set up and shoot. She wants to know how I want to work out pay and prices. I honestly have no idea where to even start with that. How do I approach this?


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## tirediron (Aug 24, 2017)

Depends...  what is the point of the exercise?  Is this to simply get new customers?  Is this a "bonus" for current customers?  What do the customers get?  Are they paying a set fee, or ?


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## Destin (Aug 24, 2017)

Is she looking to use the photos for her own benefit? 

Or is this just a bonus for the clients? Is she paying you? Or are they?


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## Paws&Awws (Aug 24, 2017)

tirediron said:


> Depends...  what is the point of the exercise?  Is this to simply get new customers?  Is this a "bonus" for current customers?  What do the customers get?  Are they paying a set fee, or ?



For me, it is mostly to get new customers. A quick session will be done with their pet(s) and they can receive a copy on site or an email with a link to the images. There will be a set fee, not to sure of what it will be yet. I kind of want to give her a percentage on what I could give her from the profits for hosting the event.


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## Paws&Awws (Aug 24, 2017)

Destin said:


> Is she looking to use the photos for her own benefit?
> 
> Or is this just a bonus for the clients? Is she paying you? Or are they?



No, she will have no use of the photos. She is a friend who wants to help me build clients, but is also a business woman who wants to better herself in this. The clients will be paying me and I would be giving her more or less a finders percentage. I have no idea what to set that as to make us both happy.


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## Destin (Aug 24, 2017)

I would offer her use of the photos for advertising and maybe some framed wall prints as compensation. You already have the photos and it costs you nothing to give her some other than product cost and this keeps more money in your pocket directly. 

As a business person the more you can barter and use things with higher perceived value in place of cash, the better you'll do. 

If she still wants a percentage and turns down the prints, then I'm not sure what I'd set it at. I can tell you that most photographers who do formal portraits at dance studios give 10-15% to the studio owner.


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## Paws&Awws (Aug 24, 2017)

Thank you Destin. I greatly appreciate your input and will consider it when I talk to her.


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## vintagesnaps (Aug 24, 2017)

Think about that Destin - free photos for advertising_ and_ framed prints?? Figure out a value for using the place of business for a day and offering photos to customers, what is that worth? Is it the same as what it will cost you to print and frame photos for her to use to decorate her place of business?

It doesn't cost _nothing_ - there's value to your time, the camera/equipment (which was hardly free), the time spent learning and practicing and developing skills - as well as the time that should be spent on developing expertise and learning how to do contracts and licensing and pricing, etc. etc. This is why I think pricing for creative work can be challenging.

Get on American Society of Media Photographers - Homepage or PPA and start learning how to do contracts, etc. Both of these pro photographers organizations I think have links to the same price quote resource. Even if you work out something in trade you'll need to contract usage of the photos. And I wouldn't give her _all_ the photos - provide select photos for her promotional use.

I'd think about a special discount for the day for customers who get pet portraits done, then go back to your regular pricing. Otherwise this is a day's work for free plus time later spent editing, getting the photos out to customers, etc. all done for free. This should be worked into a business plan, or if you don't yet have one that's something you could work on. Otherwise you might find you've spent more time working for free than making any money. Which is fine if it's for a charitable cause such as a rescue shelter, etc. and it's your choice to donate your time and ability to charity.

edit - If she doesn't want use of the photos then you're apparently going to be working for free (giving free portraits to her customers for the day) and paying her, and she benefits if doing this brings customers in which helps her make money (which has value) - so you better determine how much you want to spend for promoting your business. Figure out how this will bring other customers to you - will you be able to display samples of your work for a specified time in her shop? leave your business cards? What happens after this?

ASMP does webinars, no cost and you don't have to be a member; you may want to see if they have any coming up that might be helpful.


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## Destin (Aug 24, 2017)

vintagesnaps said:


> Think about that Destin - free photos for advertising_ and_ framed prints?? Figure out a value for using the place of business for a day and offering photos to customers, what is that worth? Is it the same as what it will cost you to print and frame photos for her to use to decorate her place of business?
> 
> It doesn't cost _nothing_ - there's value to your time, the camera/equipment (which was hardly free), the time spent learning and practicing and developing skills - as well as the time that should be spent on developing expertise and learning how to do contracts and licensing and pricing, etc. etc. This is why I think pricing for creative work can be challenging.
> 
> ...



He's charging the clients for the sitting and photos and making money off of them. She is allowing him to use her studio to bring in new customers him. 

And you're saying she should pay him, while he uses her studio to make money? Are you nuts?

And yes. I'm saying that if this was me I'd give her a handful of digital files to use for advertising purposes and a few prints to decorate the studio. You're there shooting images and making money that you would otherwise not be making. 

The least you can do is thank her for that. And it makes the most economical sense to do so in a barter fashion that's costs you the least out of pocket as possible. If you give her a few digital files that costs nothing. A few 11x14 framed prints to decorate her business costs peanuts.. for me you're talking maybe $15-20 per print. 

That's better than giving her 10-15% of your profits from the day which costs you a lot of money and has less perceived value anyhow.


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## vintagesnaps (Aug 24, 2017)

I may have misread, I thought the OP wasn't charging customers for the portraits, and was paying the shop owner something (thru a percentage). But the OP isn't there using the pet grooming business for the day shooting and making all that much money if just getting a sitting fee... and part of that apparently will go to the shop owner, so the OP is putting money into this it sounds like. 

It could be beneficial to both the OP and shop owner, it's a matter of figuring out a fair exchange. It doesn't sound like the shop owner is incurring any cost for doing this while the OP would be, although something should be done to compensate the owner to allow the photographer to set up for the day. 

You can't just look at the cost of some ink squirted on a piece of paper, it's the cost of the paper and ink and frames and time spent framing... _and_ the cost/value of time spent learning, cost of any courses taken, value of time spent developing skills to become a good photographer, etc. 

It's like taking your car to a good mechanic, you're not just paying for parts, you're paying for repair time as well as the training and experience that went into the person becoming a good mechanic and developing a good reputation.


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