# Carousel



## manny212 (May 5, 2016)

Alex is a 14 year old model with Ford here in Miami . Was instructed to capture sexy but juniorish ??? HAHA ! Oh well off we went , this is so far  one of my favorites as well as agencies so far . 





Alex by manny herreria, on Flickr


Yep , I am aware the horses head is cutoff , as well as her left shoe , although I'm glad I got the converse sticker in there . HAHA 

I must admit I've never shot on a carousel , quite fun but can be constricting due to backgrounds and all the people around . UGH PEOPLE !! HAHAHA !! 

Oh yea mom was on set .


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## manaheim (May 5, 2016)

Well, my honest reaction was, "Hm, fairly hot girl... wait.. she looks young... omg, she's 14?! I'm no longer comfortable with my reaction to this picture."

So...... sexy but juniorish I think you may have hit, though I wonder if it's 2 points further into sexy than it should be. And, honestly, I think for me its related to her suit. That is a seriously plunging neckline on that bathing suit and it got my attention.

Also... on another note, something about her being completely perpendicular to the camera doesn't feel quite right to me. I think it's because it squares her off and we're not seeing some of the curves. A slight tilt outward (knees more towards the camera, or possibly even sitting side-saddle with the knees facing generally forward) might be a more complimentary shot.

HOWEVER... all of the above is with very limited experience shooting people.

Whatever the case, it's a nice shot (also accepting some of the limitations you already cited... as you noticed, shooting people on carousels is really really challenging, and I think you did a very nice job in general of it)


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## mmaria (May 5, 2016)

sexy but juniorish!!!?
Oh God!


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## manny212 (May 5, 2016)

manaheim said:


> Well, my honest reaction was, "Hm, fairly hot girl... wait.. she looks young... omg, she's 14?! I'm no longer comfortable with my reaction to this picture."
> 
> So...... sexy but juniorish I think you may have hit, though I wonder if it's 2 points further into sexy than it should be. And, honestly, I think for me its related to her suit. That is a seriously plunging neckline on that bathing suit and it got my attention.
> 
> ...



I agree fully with your feeling . These bigger fashion agencies are looking for this . I know it may sound strange and look strange to the laymen , but in my ( Jaded ) world this is absolutely normal ( crazy I know )!!! 

Frontal on this suit is a no go . If this was a bit much , the frontal is out of the question , trust me . 

Now a word , as I mentioned the mom was on set , you would all be surprised at how encouraging these moms are about this . They are no doubt great moms but they are all for it . This girls mom is also a model so she gets it . I ALWAYS ASK THE MOTHER , when i feel something might be questionable . BTW this is their wardrobe etc .. 

Oh and the older girls I shoot 21, 22, etc. Have no problem disrobing anywhere , anytime . The nature of this beast . Kinda F---ed up. 




mmaria said:


> sexy but juniorish!!!?
> 
> 
> 
> Oh God!




Direct quote from agency . FORD . not some mom and pop agency on the street corner . And they loved !!!! Go figure ! 



Here are a couple more mundane ? ones .


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## tirediron (May 5, 2016)

14 did NOT look like that when I was 14!!  I think you did well, but better you than me.


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## manny212 (May 5, 2016)

tirediron said:


> 14 did NOT look like that when I was 14!!  I think you did well, but better you than me.



John no doubt. It's strange because people in the industry love this type of stuff. 

I should probably keep these off forums, only because peoples reactions... I get it. 

BTW any of those big editorials, fashion I mean, they are just kids, both men and women, for the most part. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk


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## tirediron (May 5, 2016)

I understand, and I'm not offended by your work; more wondering about the mental state of the person who coined the phrase "junior but sexy" and thought it appropriate.


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## manny212 (May 5, 2016)

tirediron said:


> I understand, and I'm not offended by your work; more wondering about the mental state of the person who coined the phrase "junior but sexy" and thought it appropriate.


Yea john,  bad play on words and maybe I should have clarafied. This young young will be able to play both markets ( a positive) . There will be some junior fun stuff she'll be able to do, and with the right styling and makeup etc, do older  stuff as well. 

My bad for not explainig. 

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## Designer (May 5, 2016)

tirediron said:


> I understand, and I'm not offended by your work; more wondering about the mental state of the person who coined the phrase "junior but sexy" and thought it appropriate.


These people are in advertising, so they know what "sells".  If "sexy but juniorish" is troublesome, then you're probably on the right track for morals, but advertising is something else, not entirely directed by morals.


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## Designer (May 5, 2016)

manny212 said:


> I should probably keep these off forums, only because peoples reactions... I get it.


No, Manny, I disagree with that.  If the moderators censor something, then so what?  Meanwhile, you are able to show us a side of modeling that few of us will ever know in person.  I say your photography is very welcome here!


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## DanOstergren (May 5, 2016)

She's gorgeous, and I can definitely see why an agency like Ford Models would pick her up. She has a face that will get her very far in the fashion and advertising industry. I love the expression you captured in the first one; did you have an assistant or did she have a friend who was out of frame conversing with her and helping you get natural expressions? 

I'm not surprised at all that she is 14, especially considering she is signed with Ford Models. Portraying young models this age and even as young as 12 as adults has been the norm for a very long time, and in the past the models were not always treated with any dignity at all ("pose nude or a more eager model will get your job"). There have been many positive changes in the industry over recent years regarding the safety and integrity of these young girls though. She definitely doesn't look her age, but at least it's reassuring to know that a lot has been done to make sure these girls aren't taken advantage of like they were in the past.


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## chuasam (May 5, 2016)

Great Image! but I can see how her age conflicts with the North American so called sensibilities about sexuality.


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## DanOstergren (May 5, 2016)

chuasam said:


> Great Image! but I can see how her age conflicts with the North American so called sensibilities about sexuality.


Ironic isn't it?


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## manny212 (May 5, 2016)

DanOstergren said:


> She's gorgeous, and I can definitely see why an agency like Ford Models would pick her up. She has a face that will get her very far in the fashion and advertising industry. I love the expression you captured in the first one; did you have an assistant or did she have a friend who was out of frame conversing with her and helping you get natural expressions?
> 
> I'm not surprised at all that she is 14, especially considering she is signed with Ford Models. Portraying young models this age and even as young as 12 as adults has been the norm for a very long time, and in the past the models were not always treated with any dignity at all ("pose nude or a more eager model will get your job"). There have been many positive changes in the industry over recent years regarding the safety and integrity of these young girls though. She definitely doesn't look her age, but at least it's reassuring to know that a lot has been done to make sure these girls aren't taken advantage of like they were in the past.


Thank you Dan to answer your first question, no I did not have an assistant on this job, we had a great rapport all day. I told her have fun dint pose, smile laugh be happy down you worry I'll get it. And bam she went off, she's a natural so not too difficult. 

The second part yes, it's always been that way. And you are correct the girls were back in the day mistreated. Ironically enough I've seen a huge  shift, it seems the young boys are the ones I'm a litte trouble. I hate to say exploited but it's what they are. That worries me tons more than the young girls. My two cents after 30 years in this Gane. 

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## DanOstergren (May 5, 2016)

manny212 said:


> DanOstergren said:
> 
> 
> > She's gorgeous, and I can definitely see why an agency like Ford Models would pick her up. She has a face that will get her very far in the fashion and advertising industry. I love the expression you captured in the first one; did you have an assistant or did she have a friend who was out of frame conversing with her and helping you get natural expressions?
> ...


That makes me worry for some of my friends who are climbing the ranks in the industry. The best we can do is hope they are smart, and for us to perpetuate good behaviour as the photographers. Lead by example.


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## manny212 (May 5, 2016)

DanOstergren said:


> manny212 said:
> 
> 
> > DanOstergren said:
> ...


That's what I tell my young friends here too. And yes the days of the freaky photog  but for a stray few come to end. 

Agencies vete thier photogs quite well these days. At least the ones I work with down here. 

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## manaheim (May 5, 2016)

You should see my fourteen year old.  I showed a picture of her to a buddy of mine and he was like "Whoa, she's hot.  What is she? 25?"  I'm like "No. That's my 12 year old daughter."

He looks at me and has this look of sheer horror on his face.

Anyway... no reason to not post. Your photos are very nice, interesting topic, and this is a photography forum after all.  We're about the photography more than anything else.  Please keep posting.


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## mmaria (May 6, 2016)

I read this thread with great interest because it's nice to have these information. I've just started to talk with agencies, and shoot models.. (and apparently I have no idea what is fashion and what goes into test shooting...an agency asked me if I would be interested in shooting fashion and they told me that models need simple shots without too much editing, simple wardrobe and minimal makeup and to see some agencies in Paris and Milan (in my head fashion is something different)...so I'm going to see, browse some agencies and what are they looking for and see if I can do that)

I'm not going into "omg, that's just wrong"  (which is my personal opinion) because I understand that's how stuff works and I would like to know the truth about the industry.

Keep posting and telling us some info


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## manaheim (May 6, 2016)

I wonder if they do their own editing. That wouldn't surprise me.


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## chuasam (May 7, 2016)

manny212 said:


> Alex is a 14 year old model with Ford here in Miami . Was instructed to capture sexy but juniorish ??? HAHA ! Oh well off we went , this is so far  one of my favorites as well as agencies so far .
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Including the whole shoe or the horse head would not Improve the shot. It's about the model here. 

If there's anything I would change is that I'm not fond of eyes going right to the corner where you see more whites than iris.  

Other than that, this is an amazing photo.


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## DanOstergren (May 7, 2016)

mmaria said:


> I read this thread with great interest because it's nice to have these information. I've just started to talk with agencies, and shoot models.. (and apparently I have no idea what is fashion and what goes into test shooting...an agency asked me if I would be interested in shooting fashion and they told me that models need simple shots without too much editing, simple wardrobe and minimal makeup and to see some agencies in Paris and Milan (in my head fashion is something different)...so I'm going to see, browse some agencies and what are they looking for and see if I can do that)
> 
> I'm not going into "omg, that's just wrong"  (which is my personal opinion) because I understand that's how stuff works and I would like to know the truth about the industry.
> 
> Keep posting and telling us some info


I'm so excited for you Marija!


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## DanOstergren (May 7, 2016)

manaheim said:


> I wonder if they do their own editing. That wouldn't surprise me.


I've never heard of an agency doing that, but in all honesty if they had a really good retoucher I wouldn't mind.


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## mmaria (May 8, 2016)

DanOstergren said:


> I'm so excited for you Marija!


 we'll see if we could manage something ... I'll let you know what happens


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## manny212 (May 8, 2016)

mmaria said:


> DanOstergren said:
> 
> 
> > I'm so excited for you Marija!
> ...



Yes please keeps posted !! Happy for you


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## KC1 (May 8, 2016)

Which is why 14 year old girls need to have the parents make the decisions for them. Kids often don't chose what's best for themselves, kids would rather stay up all night, eat candy for breakfast and not take baths, but is that in their best interest?
Like I said, I don't blame her for the choice, I blame her parents for placing more value on a dollar than on the human experience that she will never have the chance to live out at 14. She has the rest of her life to model, but a short time to be a kid that will be gone forever.


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## FITBMX (May 8, 2016)

To me this isn't really any different than than sports, acting, or whatever else is out there. As long as she isn't being taken advantage of, and loves doing it, then more power to her! Whatever makes you happy is what you should do!
I used to race BMX, and one year when our locale track held one of the national qualifiers, which was a big deal. There was one kid that was around 11 years old that was racing, you have to race in three heats and then the final. And during his final heat he wreck, he still qualified because he finished when another kid that went down with him couldn't finish. But the kid that finished broke his left hand, and couldn't hold onto the handle bar. So him and his parents duct taped his broken hand to the bars, you run the brake with your right hand so he was good to go. And he placed high enough in the final to qualify for the nationals.
This stuff happened all the time! Now your teen modeling does not seem so bad now, does it? 


As for the photo, I think it is a great shot across the board, great job!


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## chuasam (May 8, 2016)

KC1 said:


> Which is why 14 year old girls need to have the parents make the decisions for them. Kids often don't chose what's best for themselves, kids would rather stay up all night, eat candy for breakfast and not take baths, but is that in their best interest?
> Like I said, I don't blame her for the choice, I blame her parents for placing more value on a dollar than on the human experience that she will never have the chance to live out at 14. She has the rest of her life to model, but a short time to be a kid that will be gone forever.


The career of a model isn't very long. If she hasn't signed on to a big agency by 21 she's gonna have a hard time trying to make it. Many big names started at age 12 (Milla Jovovich). Claudia Schiffer started at 18. 

Teenage years and living it out is overrated.


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## manny212 (May 10, 2016)

FITBMX said:


> To me this isn't really any different than than sports, acting, or whatever else is out there. As long as she isn't being taken advantage of, and loves doing it, then more power to her! Whatever makes you happy is what you should do!
> I used to race BMX, and one year when our locale track held one of the national qualifiers, which was a big deal. There was one kid that was around 11 years old that was racing, you have to race in three heats and then the final. And during his final heat he wreck, he still qualified because he finished when another kid that went down with him couldn't finish. But the kid that finished broke his left hand, and couldn't hold onto the handle bar. So him and his parents duct taped his broken hand to the bars, you run the brake with your right hand so he was good to go. And he placed high enough in the final to qualify for the nationals.
> This stuff happened all the time! Now your teen modeling does not seem so bad now, does it?
> 
> ...



Thanks and yea man that duct tape I tell ya , works for everything  HA!


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## FITBMX (May 10, 2016)

manny212 said:


> Thanks and yea man that duct tape I tell ya , works for everything  HA!



It is truly God's greatest gift to man!!!


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