# Camera choice for  young beginner



## JimPD (Nov 2, 2007)

I am looking to buy a digital SLR for my 13 y.o. daughter who is becoming interested in photography and already quite proficient with photoshop etc with her old digital snapper.

Looking for best combination of features / settings / adjustments while retaining ease of use. Also good quality while not being too expensive. Facility for changing lenses, adding external flashes, fitting filters would be good.
What best fits the bill? Any strongly recommended models for this situation?


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## Buszaj (Nov 2, 2007)

An entry level body would be perfect. They are not expensive and provide good image quality. Take a look at the Canon Rebels, and the Nikon D40 or D80. There are also cameras from Olympus, Pentax, and Sony. Depending on what your daughter likes to shoot the most, you can then narrow down your lens choice. A lot of the cameras also come with kit lenses.


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## JerryPH (Nov 2, 2007)

D80 for a 13 year old? I hardly consider a D80 "entry level" in any manner.

I would even question a dSLR for a 13 year old. A nice P&S with some manual control is more than enough to introduce them to photography and let them decide if this is for them long term. A D40 or D80 would make an excellent 16th birthday gift, though... if they've stuck with it since age 13 (or whatever the equivalent is at that time) and shown a continued interest in photography. I am not saying that this is the case with this child, but the vast majority of kids today stick with something for a few weeks, mayby a couple of months, then put it away in the closet to forget, only to be replaced by the next $500-$1000 technological infatuation.


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## Buszaj (Nov 2, 2007)

very true Jerry, that would be my bad saying D80. I said that because the OP said an SLR, so I thought of that body. But the fact that kids, including myself, stay with something for a bit, then leave. A high-end P&S would suffice.


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## AlejandroHernandez (Nov 2, 2007)

Well, I'm only 15 years old and I have a Canon 350D with an inexpensive monolight kit. The image quality is great, specially under sunlight. It costed just $445 (body only) at B&H and the CF card + the lens was like $100.

I'm really interested in photography, but i'm more into filmmaking, so photography it's like a hobbie but i'm planning to make money with it in any way. Don't buy her a P&S, the quality will never be as great as a DSLR. Almost everyone have a digital camera these days. Let her start with the best.


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## usayit (Nov 2, 2007)

Two recommendations that I can give from personal experience:

1) Canon G5 used - $150-200 USD
- Good size to feel comfortable.. SLR like.  Small enough for young sized hands.
- Light weight.
- Lots of SLR like features...
- Enough sensor for decent PS work and sizable prints
- Hot shoe with full TTL compatibility with Canon Flashes if she does move into flash photography
- Both P&S modes (landscape, portrait.. etc), as well as TV, AV, Manual
- Zoom
- Good optics
- Optical viewfinder which lends itself to shooting and bracing the camera as you would an SLR.  Other P&S do not have an optical viewfinder.
- RAW capable which lends itself for more advanced options in PS.
- If you want something cheaper... the G3 is a good 4mp version
- Willing to spend more.. the G6 is even nicer.

2) Pentax *ist D, DS, or DL used - $300-450 (with kit lens)
- More than enough to follow your daughter's growing interest with years of service.
- Small compact lightweight body
- If your daughter's interest grows into more specific needs, there is a wonderful selection of older manual focus K-mount lenses that can be purchased with little cash.  Fully backwards compatble with these old K-mounts.  
- It is a full featured SLR.. enough said.

There will always be an argument to get the best.. but at this point it is not necessary (might even be worth it).  You can always graduate to something better at a later date.  Its nice to foster a child's interest in something BUT realize that their interest are ever changing.  It is not necessary to start with the best.. sometimes it is actually counter productive!!  (sometimes.. something is so nice that it becomes a distraction)

Quick snapshot of my son with the G5 with 420EX bounce flash:








When I got to be of age to start understanding value in terms of $$$.... my father always tried to place value into perspective by translating purchases in terms of days or hours of work.   Its very easy for someone to say.. only $450 ....  Granted for some, that is a weeks worth of wages.  A "weeks worth of time" is a lot easier to grasp than 450 of those green things in daddy's wallet.  As a teen, I was saving up for my first car.. worked my butt off just to realize I could not afford but only junk.  After weeks and weeks of fustration looking through car classifieds, Dad doubled my earnings simply because he saw how hard I worked.  Now that was a lesson learned!!


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## DHammer (Nov 3, 2007)

Personally I would go with the Canon Rebels. My daughter is 13 and taking photography as an elective in High School, its a film course and she was originally disappointed it wasn't digital. But now that she is deep into it she loves it. So to learn a SLR (digital or film) early in life will be a huge advantage later. And with the 40d and other new camera's recently released, you can pick up nice used dslr very inexpensively, hell I just filled in a hole or two in my film gear for next to nothing everyone is upgrading. So if you look into some camera store or ebay I bet you can find a digital rebel at a nice pice.


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## Keagle (Nov 3, 2007)

I'm 14 and I got my 350D for my birthday, however I paid half. I love it, and it's great fun. I used to love taking pictures with the old P&S, and now it's just fantastic.


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## luis_relampago (Nov 3, 2007)

A DSLR for a 13 year old it's great, times are changing and kids this days are more attracted to technology and learning a DSLR system at that age will be nothing out of the ordinary, my son is only 6 years old and he knows how to manually focus and shoot my cameras and he loves photography he wants a digital P&S for Christmas and I will definitely buy it for him and I will keep encourage him to photography.


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## ZIN (Nov 3, 2007)

I just googled canon rebel to see the price and saw this...
http://www.bestpricecameras.com/prodetails.asp?prodid=713192
whats up with this price ????
Is this for real???


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## Docfeelgood (Nov 3, 2007)

Im 14 and went for a panasonic f2z ,something like that anyway, its like a bridge camera so you cant change the lens, but its good for stating and my images come out good enough.


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## jols (Nov 3, 2007)

my son is 6 and has a cheap p/s from ebay.  he thinks its great and so do i as when im shooting hes happy too.

i would say it all depends on your budget.  say whay you want to pay and buy the best you can with that.


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## JerryPH (Nov 3, 2007)

ZIN said:


> I just googled canon rebel to see the price and saw this...
> http://www.bestpricecameras.com/prodetails.asp?prodid=713192
> whats up with this price ????
> Is this for real???


 
Thats a known "bait and switch" company.  Its a scam.


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## britonk (Nov 3, 2007)

Personally I didn't have my first DSLR until I was 21 but having to wait until then made it more the fun and made me appreciate it more. Unless you have money to burn I would recommend a high end compact like some of the Panasonic Lumix cameras. They are quite good but don't cost quite what even a basic DSLR will set you back.


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## chrisk121 (Nov 3, 2007)

Cheap P&S with manual capabilities. If she stays interested, Rebel XT(i), small enough for children's hands.


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## JIP (Nov 3, 2007)

People!! People!!! 13 is not that young.  I think some of you passing judgement on this 13 year old without even knowing anything are jumping the gun a little.  First of all a budget for this 13 year old's gift would be helpful then people might be able to recommend something more specific.  Second, I think a gret way to handle this might be a gift card of some kind mabye not with a specific dollar amount in mind but just say it is for a DSLR.  This way you can put your daughter a little more in the driver seat.  If you have a good camera store near you with sales people who are knowledgeable take her there and let her pick it out and find one that fits her hands and needs the best. Again you can do this with a non-amount specific gift card just on her birthday out a note or some kind of card from the camera shop and take her there and let her figure it out.  Also honestly you should go with either a Nikon or a Canon.  And one more thing anyone who does not think the D80 is a beginner camera has alot to learn themselves.


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## usayit (Nov 3, 2007)

passing judgement?

My experience.... teaching a young kid a new hobby by starting them with the best equipment teaches them one thing... that the most important way to become successful at something is to buy expensive stuff.  It becomes all about the equipment.. not about the hobby or skill itself.  It is part of the reason why many teachers of photography try to get all their students to shoot a few assignments in complete manual exposure.  To help teach exposure not just buy the camera with the best meter.  (It also doesn't help teach them the value of hard earned wages.)

On one hand, you say that photography is all about the photographer and not the camera.

YET.. you shove an expensive camera in their hands.


When I said that sometimes really nice stuff just becomes a distraction.. I meant it from personal experience.... You don't by a grand piano for a young student.


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## JIP (Nov 3, 2007)

A D40/80 or some kind of Rebel are far from a grand piano.  The OP says her daughter wants to graduate from a P+S to a DSLR so you have to say WAIT!!!! she's not ready!! it will cost too much!!!! it is too big a step!!! I am sorry a D40/80/Rbel is nowhere near some big advanced expensive camera that should be limited to professionals or advanced amatuers.  The girl alredy has a P+S and her mother wants to get her somethng better I am sure your personal philosophy on materialisim has a place but really does it belong here??? again, (and no offense to those of you who own them) a D40/80 or a Rebel is one step up from a point and shoot camera and the natural progression for someone who is getting more into photography and wants to pursur it as a hobby as I think the OP stated her daughter wants to do.


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## usayit (Nov 3, 2007)

Yes.. that's exactly what I"m sayin.. If you don't agree... thats your issue.

I guess you didn't see that an DSLR was listed in my recommendation.


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## Sideburns (Nov 20, 2007)

I will have to disagree with some.  13 is a young adult.  If you feel you have the budget get her an XT...the only reason would be if you don't have the budget.  I was 12 building computers...you'd think a kid would be irresponsible or change their interest.  If you teach her a little about exposure and whatnot...she'll keep it around with her.


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## Viperjet (Nov 20, 2007)

I have to say that the D80 would be a very good choice.  The only drawback being that it is a little pricey (at least for me...).  I think it runs about $1200? I like the menus on the D80 because there's a lot of stuff that can be done in camera on the D80 that I can't do on my Canon XTi.

The Canon Eos Rebel XTi is a very solid camera as well.  That's the camera that I own, and I like it a lot.  It has less menu functions, but that's no biggie.

Overall...

*D80
Pros:
*Very extensive menus
Nice sized grip
10 megapixels
3FPS frame rate
2 scroll wheels for adjusting apertures/exposures...etc
Awesome sounding shutter!

*Cons:
*Expensive
The grip could be a little on the big size for 13 year old gal...
A little bigger and heavier than the XTi
The menus can get a little intimidating

*XTi
Pros:
*A little lighter than the D80
Smaller grips
10 megapixels
3FPS frame rate
Very easy and user friendly menus 
Cheaper (I got mine from B&H Photo for $650 for the camera body)


*Cons:
*The grip could be a little _too_ small and uncomfortable after a while
1 scroll wheel (ugh I wish it had two, because otherwise I have to hold down another button to adjust the aperture if I'm shooting in manual.)
Menus possibly a little too small
Lame sounding shutter  



Hope this helps!!


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## Imgfascination (Nov 21, 2007)

ZIN said:


> I just googled canon rebel to see the price and saw this...
> http://www.bestpricecameras.com/prodetails.asp?prodid=713192
> whats up with this price ????
> Is this for real???



This is the camera body only.  NO lenses.  It still seems a little too low in price though.


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## RKW3 (Nov 21, 2007)

I am 14 years old who plans on getting a DSLR for christmas. If you guys see the pictures I post you can tell I'm very dedicated to photography and I've already learned a lot of stuff in photoshop.

13 is only 1 year younger than me, haha. If she is as passionate about photography as I am, a D80 is the minimum you can get her! Haha. I'm hoping my parents will get me a used D200, .


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## Michael L. (Nov 21, 2007)

Think about it... a decent point and shoot is only a little cheaper than a Canon Rebel XT or Nikon D40 body with a kit lens. If she's really dedicated, buy her a Rebel XT or XTi, D40, or D80 with a kit lens and let her play around with it for a while. If she's still interested a little while down the road, tell her that she can work to buy some more lenses that she wants, be it chores around your house or a job at the local McDonalds. I worked full time 2 summers ago when I was 13 so I could buy my Rebel XT with a kit lens and another 50mm f/1.8... I think you're doing her a major favour buying her the whole thing.

In other words, I would set her up with a decent body and let her sort out what she wants to do from there iwth lenses and other accessories, otherwise she is likely to give it up. A camera (or anything else for that matter) isn't very special when someone just hands it to you. She'll be more likely to enjoy it and understand the investment if she has some of her money into it, not to say she would give it up easily.


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## domromer (Nov 21, 2007)

Man what ever happened to kids working for things they wanted. When I was younger and wanted expensive items my parents would make me pay for at least half of it.  I think an 800$ camera is a little much for a 13 year old. I agree with some other posters that maybe an advanced point and shoot might be better.

When I think of all the different career paths I thought of between 13-18, my parents would be very poor if they bought me everything I would need to be a writer/rock star/photographer/cinematographer/pro surfer/Vet/stunt man/


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## soylentgreen (Nov 21, 2007)

It appears a entry level DSLR is in your best interest. Take her to the store to try out the Canon Rebl XTi. Sony, Panasonic,  and others. I will not mention the Nikon D40 or D40x since they are a POS. IMO. (Come on Nikon...you couldn't come up with anything better?) Just start her off with the stock lens in the 17-85 or 18-55mm range till she decides on what she needs. Than make her baby-sit and save up to buy them.


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## Stratman (Nov 21, 2007)

here's a good deal on a nice DSLR, AND they have a $100 rebate offer good until Jan 31 2008  so after the rebate, $439 for a nice kit !

http://www.amazon.com/Pentax-Digita...=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=photo&qid=1195699095&sr=1-3


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## LeftBehind (Nov 21, 2007)

I'm 16, got my DSLR when i was 15.I have to agree with  domromer , what happened to kids working? Hell i'm only 16 and am disgusted to hear at the amount of money parents  are pouring into their kids.  A kid at school got a d80 for christmas [yes, this earl, wtf?] and his dad is planning on still giving him a top of the line flash and prime lens for him to open on christmas day.
What's worse?
Our parents make equal pay working in the same office and mine told me they could not afford to buy me a camera, and although i knew they could, i decided not to take their decision as a bad thing, but to give me motivation to get a full time job during the summer, and now work part time while going to school.
Every kid who is denied something love has so many doors of opportunity and motivation opened for them and i think a parent should learn what doors to open, and which to close. My parents offered a ride to my work during the summer, for example, to help.

Edit:

Good recommendation Stratman.


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## Stratman (Nov 21, 2007)

:thumbup:


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## domromer (Nov 22, 2007)

JIP said:


> People!! People!!! 13 is not that young.  I think some of you passing judgement on this 13 year old without even knowing anything are jumping the gun a little.  First of all a budget for this 13 year old's gift would be helpful then people might be able to recommend something more specific.  Second, I think a gret way to handle this might be a gift card of some kind mabye not with a specific dollar amount in mind but just say it is for a DSLR.  This way you can put your daughter a little more in the driver seat.  If you have a good camera store near you with sales people who are knowledgeable take her there and let her pick it out and find one that fits her hands and needs the best. Again you can do this with a non-amount specific gift card just on her birthday out a note or some kind of card from the camera shop and take her there and let her figure it out.  Also honestly you should go with either a Nikon or a Canon.  And one more thing anyone who does not think the D80 is a beginner camera has alot to learn themselves.




On what planet is an $800 camera for beginners?


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## Fullboar (Nov 22, 2007)

I am a newbie to digital SLR's. I own a couple of 35mm SLR's that I haven't used in years since I got a couple of digital point and shoot cameras (Fuji 4900, Fuji 5500 and Fuji 6500). Now that the kids are getting a little older I have time to get back into photgraphy. I would say find a camera that feels best in hand and fits your budget. Remember this is a 13 yo girl so she will have small hands. You dont want to set her up with a camera she doesn't like even if you like it and think thats what she needs. I would say try as many as you can but dont forget the Olympus E410 and E510 lightest and smallest of all the digital SLR's as well as there lenses. I tried them all and it felt the best which was great because I wanted it for a walk around camera and I also really liked the Canon 40D who know's that could be a good christmas present for myself I mean the wife. I see so many poeple with great SLR's that dont take them anywhere because "there to big and bulky to cary around".


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## JodieO (Nov 22, 2007)

JerryPH said:


> D80 for a 13 year old?
> 
> I would even question a dSLR for a 13 year old.


 
why not? My 11 year old has a D70. He's learning all sorts of things from it... I was 15 when I bought my first SLR... wish I had it earlier.

he's so funny, I just had two more SB-800s and SU-800 ship, and he's been eyeing them up since they got here - he seems to like when I get new "toys"   He keeps asking me when my D3 will get here - maybe he thinks he is going to get my D200 or my D2X once it arrives?  lol!


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## JodieO (Nov 22, 2007)

usayit said:


> passing judgement?
> 
> My experience.... teaching a young kid a new hobby by starting them with the best equipment teaches them one thing... that the most important way to become successful at something is to buy expensive stuff. It becomes all about the equipment.. not about the hobby or skill itself. It is part of the reason why many teachers of photography try to get all their students to shoot a few assignments in complete manual exposure. To help teach exposure not just buy the camera with the best meter. (It also doesn't help teach them the value of hard earned wages.)
> 
> ...


 
Umm... why can't you teach a child to shoot manual on a more expensive DSLR???

But I would hardly consider a Nikon D40 to be the best.... uh... by FAR! I personally would get one that he won't grow out of quickly. A D40 could last him a couple years... if he starts really loving photography and wants to go shoot some nature with a telephoto lens or do some amazing macro work, he's going to be stuck with a P&S that he has outgrown. At least a D40 will give him a little more options than a P&S. I'd hardly consider a D40 equivalent to a grand piano.... :lmao:

I'm just big on not getting my kids things they will outgrow quickly... for goodness sakes, I just bought them each horses (at ages 8 and 11) and each one has a full-sized adult-sized horse.... ones that they can grow up and still ride and they won't outgrow. I apply that theory to nearly everything in their lives.

So you buy him a D40... and if he ends up not sticking with it, sell it, give it to one of the siblings, or use it yourself... not a waste, that's for sure.


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## soylentgreen (Nov 22, 2007)

Sorry to bust everyone's bubble, but "cheap" and "DSLR" do not go together. There really is no such thing.  Any camera system he decides on will be in the $550-800 (w/ kit lens; minus memory cards, extra battery, etc.) range if there is any quality to be had. If JimPD is willing to support his daughter's creativity and buy her a camera, than so be it. I am all for it. If I were to buy someone a camera to learn from, it certainly wouldn't be one too limited that they will  have to upgrade too soon as their learning curve improves. I will actually target a mid-level DSLR if I were so inclined. But that's just me. 30D, D70, D80ish. I rather have the functions and not need it; than need it and not have it. The money is not the issue here, it's getting the right tool for the job. And as always, you pay for what you get. Better quality equates to more $$$$. Like i posted earlier, take her to the stoe and let her try them out. Bring a memory card so you can compare the results later at home.(Shoot in large JPEG since most RAW files require their own program to decode)  Most stores let you tinker around with them. It will be her decision as to which camera "feels best" for her to use and how intuitive the functions woek for her. I still say she needs to baby-sit to pay for additional lenses though. It's two-fold...she gets paid and captive models to photograph.:mrgreen:


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## Alex_B (Nov 22, 2007)

soylentgreen said:


> Sorry to bust everyone's bubble, but "cheap" and "DSLR" do not go together.



Well, but "cheap" is totally relative. If you take the whole camera segment, dSLRs ar ecertainly not "cheap". But if you compare dSLRs with dSLRs then some are cheap and others expensive.

So a photographer who shoots with 4K - 12K cameras everyday, would certainly buy his young doughter a cheap dSLR unter 1K. 
It always depends on the scale you live in. 
Just a week ago I recommended my father to get a cheap dSLR for himself because that would be good enough for him since he is not a pro. Since he was first looking at the 1D series of Canon, he got my message.

BTW, with cheap I do not mean bad in this context.


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## domromer (Nov 22, 2007)

Maybe I'm just jealous because a 13 year old has a D80 on her shortlist of possible cameras! I'm 28 and just bough the D80, my most expensive body yet. (got my eos3 used)


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## JodieO (Nov 22, 2007)

domromer said:


> Maybe I'm just jealous because a 13 year old has a D80 on her shortlist of possible cameras! I'm 28 and just bough the D80, my most expensive body yet. (got my eos3 used)


 

  Well, you have to understand everyone has different priorities and expenses in life... while two people may have the same income, one may have a really crappy car and a great camera, while the other may have a really good car and a crappy camera.... it's just life.. :mrgreen:

I still have issues looking at young people today.  I am 31.  When I was 19, I got married (not because I had to if you KWIM! ) and at 20, I bought my first house, at 23, I bought my second house.  By the time I was 25, I had a very succesful business that I ran by myself - bringing in more income than my own father.  So I get irritated when I see for instance, my 18-year-old stepdaughter who thinks that everyone should be paying her gas money and car insurance..... until I realize, that everyone has different situations in life....

I know you were probably half kidding, but when I read people thinking that a 13-year-old doesn't need a decent camera - it kinda strikes a nerve with me, because when I was 20 years old, my own parents kept telling me I didn't need a house (especially with how expensive houses are *eyeroll* - yeah, uh... just because her house cost her $40,000 20 years ago doesn't mean they are still that price! )  Expensive or not is all relative.


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## domromer (Nov 22, 2007)

My main thing is I can't imagine trusting a 13 year old with something that expensive that is portable.  Maybe kids are different now, but I couldn't keep track of anything when I was that age. 

All this being said I do understand buying expensive things for kids. When I stopped growing at 15. I raced bikes and my parents bought me a $1000 ( which I had to pay back at 100$ per week) road bike. Most people my age bought cars for this amount but I got a bike instead. Which I still have! 

In summation. If it was my kid they would need to pay for half. You tend to treat things different if you have sunk 400$ of your own money into it. If they wanted something that expensive they would need to work for it.  But hey thats me. If you have the money and you want to buy it for your kids go right ahead. I'd like my kids to understand the value of money and the work that goes into earning it.


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## JodieO (Nov 22, 2007)

domromer said:


> In summation. If it was my kid they would need to pay for half. You tend to treat things different if you have sunk 400$ of your own money into it. If they wanted something that expensive they would need to work for it. But hey thats me. If you have the money and you want to buy it for your kids go right ahead. I'd like my kids to understand the value of money and the work that goes into earning it.


 
I agree with that theory for a lot of things, but I was under the impression this was probably a Christmas gift - which to me, a $400 Christmas gift is fine.

My 11-year-old just saved up for an IPOD. He knew he could get it for Christmas for free, but instead, he wanted it before Christmas, so he saved up and bought it himself.

Getting a Christmas gift to me is in a different category than learning the value of money - you can learn the value of money as a kid and still get something nice for Christmas, at least in MY world 

But I surely wouldn't squash a kid's interests by 1.  Not getting something that will be flexible enough to last several years, and 2. Telling them something is too expensive and making them work months for it if it is feasible as a Christmas present or birthday gift (great for a child to understand generosity and gift giving as well).


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## Alex_B (Nov 22, 2007)

domromer said:


> My main thing is I can't imagine trusting a 13 year old with something that expensive that is portable.  Maybe kids are different now, but I couldn't keep track of anything when I was that age.



There are kids and kids ... if I at that age had gotten such a camera, I would have been overprotective and would have defended it with my life, knowing how much it costs.

But then I know kids that would forget it on the train ...


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## Antithesis (Nov 22, 2007)

I think someone on here was saying they recently got a d50 for like $300, I bet if you watch ebay for a couple weeks you can snipe a d40 or a d50 for around there. The digital rebels and XT's can be had for pretty cheap. At that rate by the time she outgrows the kit lens she can get a little nicer one for her birthday or next christmas or w/e. I think it's wonderful that a kid that age has an interest in photography. I wish I would have stuck with it when my dad tried to explain it to me when I was that age. I just didn't have the patience to wait for the film.


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