# oh... hm... I need a bit of encouragement ...



## mmaria (Nov 11, 2015)

so.....

My whole "photography life" is online. I'm serious. The only photographers I spoke to live are @limr , her boyfriend, and a former member of this forum (I'll mention also @binga63 and @The_Traveler via Skype)... Every conversation I had about photography was online. 

I finally decided to see is there any photo clubs around my area. I figured it's time to enter the real world and hopefully meet some photographers. Maybe I'll meet someone interesting, maybe I'll go to an exhibition or two, maybe I'll learn something etc.

I sent an email to the only photo club I could go to. They haven't replied for a few days and I decided to call a number on their website.  

The person I spoke with is a member of the jury on various international competitions, has some photography title idk what was it and all in all we had a very pleasant conversation. 

He started to talk about courses they organize and I said that the courses aren't the reason I called, I called because I would like to meet other photographers, be a part of exhibitions etc.... and I said something like "I don't need a course, I'm into photography for a few years now..."  and there was the trouble... 

Completely unexpected trouble!  I couldn't even say I'm a photographer. I felt completely incompetent and felt like my place isn't in any exhibition. Oh God, I don't even have any picture I could print and hang somewhere and show to other photographers! 

I know I know stuff about photography and editing it's not about that. I could talk about that... but showing pictures to other photographers who are good in what they do ... In real life! Standing beside them. Oh God no! I can't do it. Saying out loud, in real life "Yes, I'm a photographer".  I can't! Is anything I've done worthy of showing? I don't even know how much my picture (any of my picture) is worth (in money)? Am I any, and I mean any good?

I calmed down after initial "almost panic attack" and I'm not panicking now a few hours after the conversation, not at all, but I'm not any better in terms of thinking about this whole mess... seriously thinking of giving up. I don't want to give up but I don't have enough of courage for this. It took me 6 years to make that move and start to ask questions about photography in my area. 
6 years to feel that I'm ready to print something and show the print to someone I could see in person! And now I know I'm not ready at all.

I could also say that I'm a communicative/outgoing person and I'll rather talk in person than writing online, but it seems that with photography I'm really not anything like that.

I'm blushing even while writing this. How to gather the courage and not go away from this? What can I tell to myself?
I don't want to give up, I want to be able to say "At least I tried".


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## Designer (Nov 11, 2015)

I think your anxiety is fairly common among newly-created artists.  You know you are an artist, but nobody else knows that.  The feeling that you have is like trying to imagine going naked in public.  Right now you are insecure, but after you realize that everybody else is naked too, then you begin to relax.


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## The_Traveler (Nov 11, 2015)

My experiences with other photographers, particularly in clubs, is that they are less than they seem at first.
It's nice to have friends who are photographers if only because you can talk about common joys.
I go to a local club but don't expect really to learn anything; I go for the comradery.
In terms of how you will 'measure up', you have nothing to be concerned about.
I've never seen any of your work large enough to see the technical stuff but that's really ancillary.
You have what most people don't have - and never get.
You have a vision, you know what you want to create and see - everything else can be learned if you need it.

I remember the first work of yours I saw, that picture, taken through a doorway at a low angle, of an old woman in the next room and I thought at that time that you really had something that can't be taught, that feeling for how to make an image that conveys what you see.

L


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## soufiej (Nov 11, 2015)

I guess I never have understood all this angst over photography.  What is the big deal about not being good enough?  Good enough for what?  Good enough for who?  

Who exactly is your competition?  Who is the judge of what you do?    

The entire world has become political.  No matter where you go, there will be someone who wants you to be inferior to them.   You will be, when you allow yourself to be.  If you are willing to become intimidated by the opinion of someone you don't know from Adam, then that's your decision.  

Strap on a pair!  Tell me just what you have to lose?  

If this is a hobby for you, then who cares what you turn out?  You do it for your enjoyment and you will only allow someone to take that enjoyment away from you if you are willing to be intimidated by them.  Or harassed by them.  Or talked down to by them.  

You have two feet, you can walk away if someone starts.  This isn't a life long commitment you're making.  You can find someone who is willing to discuss photography with you.  If they don't exist in this group, then you tried and you don't go back.  There are cliques which appeal to snobs.  Ignore them unless you are willing to be a snob too.  

I play guitar and I go to the guitar forums on occasion.   They're constantly filled with people who are so intimidated by others they don't even know.  The fear of the unknown mostly.  

What if I embarrass myself?  

You won't be the first.  Or the last.  

They really don't seem to grasp the idea everyone has some talent and your talent doesn't need to be the same as their talent.  

They simply can't grasp the idea everyone starts somewhere.  No matter who you are, there will be someone better than you and someone who doesn't know something you do.  

Then, one day, they finally work up the courage to head to a jam session and they find most people at a jam are also there looking for someone to play with.  And to have a good time.  

Most jams are very easy going places and they'll allow you to sit back and play rhythm or they'll hand you a simple lead for a few bars of a 12 bar blues.  Very, very few jams are the type where someone is out to be the ass who makes everyone else miserable.  The groups tend to weed those folks out.  

And when these players come back from their first jam, they almost always find they are better players because they put themself in a position that was outside of their comfort zone of sitting alone in their bedroom.  Pretty soon they're making the jam a regular occurrence.  

If you want to not be part of a group, sit at home.  If you want to be intimidated by someone on the phone, sit at home.  If you want to never be told you have something interesting to say, sit at home.

If you want none of that, go to the club.


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## tirediron (Nov 11, 2015)

I've seen several stand-out images posted here, so why not just get off your butt and re-process them for printing and have them printed???????  You don't have to make wall art, but some nice 8x10s or 11x14s, 3-4, that would be more than a respectable portfolio for a local club.  As Lew mentions, your 'old woman' shot was really good, and you've done a couple of recent ones that would be equally strong...  quit the pity-party and get on with it!


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## JacaRanda (Nov 11, 2015)

mmaria said:


> What can I tell to myself?



'Self, I see how different opinions are because I spend enough time reading posts on TPF'.  You can't please everyone, so make your art to please yourself.  There are enough of us out there to always have someone that will enjoy your vision.


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## jcdeboever (Nov 11, 2015)

I hope you find a club or photo buddy mmaria. Don't quit, that's easy. I joined one right about the same time I joined here. The salty guy from the group took me under his wing. Funny thing is, I suspect he is not well liked by the majority in group because he speaks his mind. He is accomplished and yells at me a lot.. But I like it, my wife does the same thing so I feel at home. He says I'm in to much of a hurry.  He is becoming a good friend and I learn a lot from him. I'm the only one in the group that is not a professional so it's a little intimidating. Last meeting I was totally lost, just listened and viewed. They are a room full of Derrel's which is a good thing but my head can get that spinning feeling. I make good coffee I'm told.[emoji4] 

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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## vintagesnaps (Nov 11, 2015)

What I remember first seeing your photos is that you showed some talent, and probably would continue to learn and practice and get even better as you go. You've only been a photographer for 6 years, that isn't very long for those of us who have been photographers for, um years...

Maybe just go to one meeting, as a visitor/guest, and see what it's like. It might be a good fit for you, or not. You've only talked to one person so far, go see what the rest of the bunch is like.

There isn't a club in my area but I enjoy art exhibit openings, they give you little snacks on little sticks, and there's wine! I find that going to an event etc. might just be a one time thing, or it might lead to some other opportunity - just try going once and see where it leads (or doesn't). Then if you want to join and get a portfolio together people here could help you with that.

And when you feel nervous, remind yourself to breathe (really, helps you be a little more calm). I would still get nervous/excited to talk to a group or whatever, even after years of running meetings etc. I think it's a matter of getting over the hump, getting started and then the nervous excitement eases up. Breathe!!! lol


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## sabbath999 (Nov 11, 2015)

I'm not a very social person so I won't be of any help to you on this.

I recently drove 12 hours to Ann Arbor to do the FPP Photo Walk because I wanted to meet some of the folks from the FPP podcast, and a few of their associates who I enjoy listening to. That's just about the only "social" I have done over the last 35 years of photography (not counting exhibit openings when I do a show).

All I can say is never worry about what others think of your work, don't give them purchase in your head. Do what you want, be who you want, shoot what you want any way you want to and if others like it that's just dandy... if they don't, well, that's their problem.


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## limr (Nov 11, 2015)

First, you are your own worst critic and you're much better than you think you are.

Second, don't worry so much about what the others may think. Chances are, they are just as insecure, and if they're not, then they're probably overrating themselves  Screw 'em!


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## weepete (Nov 11, 2015)

Let me assure you mmaria that your work is simply excellent and absolutley deserves a place in a gallery. Latley I've only seen you get better as you refine your ideas and it is absolutley working. Now I've spent a bit of time in some art galleries in various countries, been to a fair few local art shows too and if I saw your shots there you bet I'd be stopping to look.


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## snowbear (Nov 11, 2015)

You have a camera on the way -- you are not allowed to quit.  Seriously, you do fine work so don't worry about it; get a few of your better shots printed and see what happens.


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## DarkShadow (Nov 11, 2015)

Yes Your work is very good.Keep doing what your doing.


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## pgriz (Nov 11, 2015)

Marija, you go excellent work.  You've got the eye.  Take your work that you have on Flickr and print a few  - mainly to understand how the printed image will look.  You have enough to put together a theme.  When I originally joined my local camera club, I felt very intimidated at the beginning.  There were people there with so much experience, so much good gear!  And then, looking that the images in the competitions - I found that the range of ability was very wide.  Certainly some images were breath-takingly beautiful.  But so many more were "pretty" but rather conventional and formulaic.  So many were trying to imitate other images that they saw and admired.  When I put my images up in the competitions, they actually were somewhere in the middle of the pack - not the best, but certainly not the worse either.  I would say your eye is actually better than mine, and your processing skills are better as well.  Put on your brave face, print some of your images and share them.  Remember, the only things they can give you are their opinions.  

You ARE a photographer.  You don't need to convince anyone of that.  You do want to share and learn.  That's what it is all about.


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## EIngerson (Nov 11, 2015)

You're an OUTSTANDING PHOTOGRAPHER Marija. Just get involved and get the experience dealing with it. You'll find that you are far better than you give yourself credit for.

As far as getting into exhibitions, go to a few and feel things out. I think you'll do an amazing job.


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## Vtec44 (Nov 11, 2015)

The question is why are you afraid of showing people your work?


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

First: Thank you all for saying all of this I'll reply everyone after this post.

Second: let me clarify something, this is not just some local camera club. We don't have a local camera club. This club is located 60 miles from my town and it's called (literally translated) "University photo-cinema club" and the work they display is really good. They host and organize many international exhibitions and competitions.

They don't do meetings, gatherings or photo walks or anything similar.

Most of the members there are 20-30 years older than me and their experience is much longer than that. They display their work all over the world and many of them work as photographers. I'm, on the other hand, someone who's thinking about photography in English because I just speak about photography online and I need time to think how certain setting are said in my own language. I have 0 (zero!) experience in anything that's related to competitions and exhibitions and any photographic related events.

Here's their invite for the exhibition that'll be open on Friday


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

Designer said:


> I think your anxiety is fairly common among newly-created artists.  You know you are an artist, but nobody else knows that.  The feeling that you have is like trying to imagine going naked in public.  Right now you are insecure, but after you realize that everybody else is naked too, then you begin to relax.


Well your analogy of being naked where everyone is also naked made me smile.
The difference is that they're comfortable that way and I'm not. 
I think it would be easier for me to visit a nudist beach somewhere, than showing my photographs to these guys.


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

The_Traveler said:


> My experiences with other photographers, particularly in clubs, is that they are less than they seem at first.
> It's nice to have friends who are photographers if only because you can talk about common joys.
> I go to a local club but don't expect really to learn anything; I go for the comradery.





The_Traveler said:


> In terms of how you will 'measure up', you have nothing to be concerned about.


 I saw these guys in various juries  and with various diplomas, on photographs, on their website. As I already mention they have certain photography ranks or "how do you say that" from "The International Federation of Photographic Art".
So, I really can't measure up with them but I hope they (or at least one of them) won't be jerks and I'll learn something from them.



The_Traveler said:


> I've never seen any of your work large enough to see the technical stuff but that's really ancillary.


I agree and I'm not that concerned about technical stuff because I'll revisit and re-edit every picture I intent to print. The next trouble is "Which one I could print and show?"



The_Traveler said:


> You have what most people don't have - and never get.
> You have a vision, you know what you want to create and see - everything else can be learned if you need it.


 ok...  I'm going to copy this, to be able to read it when I need it. 
Thank you for saying that!



The_Traveler said:


> I remember the first work of yours I saw, that picture, taken through a doorway at a low angle, of an old woman in the next room and I thought at that time that you really had something that can't be taught, that feeling for how to make an image that conveys what you see.


 Oh God, I don't even know the picture you mentioned... because I have a couple of photographs that fits in the description


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

soufiej said:


> I guess I never have understood all this angst over photography.  What is the big deal about not being good enough?  Good enough for what?  Good enough for who?
> 
> Who exactly is your competition?  Who is the judge of what you do?


well... in general picture, I'm competing with myself.
Good enough for what? Good enough for the world to see what I've done.
I could show the world how I draw and I won't be nervous even for a bit because I can't draw, that's the fact and it won't change. I'm not embarrassed by it nor I want to be good at it because I simply can't draw. It's not my thing.
Photography, hair cutting, driving and similar... I want to be good at it. I want to be better all the time. I want to be capable. I care about it.


> The entire world has become political.  No matter where you go, there will be someone who wants you to be inferior to them.   You will be, when you allow yourself to be.  If you are willing to become intimidated by the opinion of someone you don't know from Adam, then that's your decision.


 That's true but... If someone who wants me to be inferior to them is a complete jerk regardless of photography I won't feel inferior because I don't feel inferior to those kind of people. 
I immediately assumed that all of those "masters of photography" are good people and are willing to help. I'm afraid of their legitimate (according to their experience)  opinion.



> Strap on a pair!


 love this!



> Tell me just what you have to lose?


 this got me thinking.... so... For the most part, I think I do ok. I'll never be good enough but I'm ok. My photograph was never "evaluated" by anyone else except this forum. And for the most of the compliments I get on this forum I think it's because I'm fairly ok as a person when participating on the forum.
 I'm terrified to show my photograph in real life because they don't know me as a person, they'll evaluate just a photograph, not the photographer. TPF is a safe place, real life isn't.



> If this is a hobby for you, then who cares what you turn out?  You do it for your enjoyment and you will only allow someone to take that enjoyment away from you if you are willing to be intimidated by them.  Or harassed by them.  Or talked down to by them.
> 
> You have two feet, you can walk away if someone starts.  This isn't a life long commitment you're making.  You can find someone who is willing to discuss photography with you.  If they don't exist in this group, then you tried and you don't go back.  There are cliques which appeal to snobs.  Ignore them unless you are willing to be a snob too.


That perfectly makes sense in every part of my life but photography. It turned out that I'm much more sensitive about it than I thought I'd ever be.



> I play guitar and I go to the guitar forums on occasion.   They're constantly filled with people who are so intimidated by others they don't even know.  The fear of the unknown mostly.
> 
> What if I embarrass myself?
> 
> ...


I'm not thinking in the terms of embarrassing myself in front of anyone but I am intimidated.


ok... just to say... this really helps!

Replying on what you all said got me really thinking and I'm really grateful.

Got to save this whole thread.


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

tirediron said:


> I've seen several stand-out images posted here, so why not just get off your butt and re-process them for printing and have them printed???????  You don't have to make wall art, but some nice 8x10s or 11x14s, 3-4, that would be more than a respectable portfolio for a local club.  As Lew mentions, your 'old woman' shot was really good, and you've done a couple of recent ones that would be equally strong...  quit the pity-party and get on with it!


Love the tone! Thank you 

but but but... (it's not local club, you have to read what I wrote additionally)
could you, would you, will you go on my flickr or fb (not everything is same) and post links on what images you think are worthy of printing?

Please


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

JacaRanda said:


> mmaria said:
> 
> 
> > What can I tell to myself?
> ...





I know that everyone won't like what I do. That's premise I started with. I'm not trying to please anyone but I really want that at least one person finds interesting what I do


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

jcdeboever said:


> I hope you find a club or photo buddy mmaria. Don't quit, that's easy. I joined one right about the same time I joined here. The salty guy from the group took me under his wing. Funny thing is, I suspect he is not well liked by the majority in group because he speaks his mind. He is accomplished and yells at me a lot.. But I like it, my wife does the same thing so I feel at home. He says I'm in to much of a hurry.  He is becoming a good friend and I learn a lot from him. I'm the only one in the group that is not a professional so it's a little intimidating. Last meeting I was totally lost, just listened and viewed. They are a room full of Derrel's which is a good thing but my head can get that spinning feeling. I make good coffee I'm told.[emoji4]


 Oh lol thank you for making me laugh!

If I meet one good person there I'll feel like I accomplished a lot. 

(although a room full of Derrel's isn't something I imagine as that good because then people would talk primarily about equipment and i don't talk about equipment)


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

vintagesnaps said:


> What I remember first seeing your photos is that you showed some talent, and probably would continue to learn and practice and get even better as you go. You've only been a photographer for 6 years, that isn't very long for those of us who have been photographers for, um years...
> 
> Maybe just go to one meeting, as a visitor/guest, and see what it's like. It might be a good fit for you, or not. You've only talked to one person so far, go see what the rest of the bunch is like.
> 
> ...


 
6 years seemed to me like eternity, but you're right, I have so many years ahead of me. 

They don't have meetings, the man I spoke with told me that membership fee is paid in February and I should contact them in February and we'll talk details then unless I actually meet someone of them in the exhibition next week. So I have time to prepare myself psychologically, see what they did so far, pick up myself after this mess and prepare prints.

I know I want to join because I don't have many options in this state at all... the problem here is am I good enough to join. 

Breathing...I'll remember that


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

sabbath999 said:


> I'm not a very social person so I won't be of any help to you on this.
> 
> I recently drove 12 hours to Ann Arbor to do the FPP Photo Walk because I wanted to meet some of the folks from the FPP podcast, and a few of their associates who I enjoy listening to. That's just about the only "social" I have done over the last 35 years of photography (not counting exhibit openings when I do a show).
> 
> All I can say is never worry about what others think of your work, don't give them purchase in your head. Do what you want, be who you want, shoot what you want any way you want to and if others like it that's just dandy... if they don't, well, that's their problem.


 well I was doing exactly that since I started with photography. 
I do what I like to do and someone likes it someone doesn't but showing pictures online isn't same as being a part of an exhibition and show your photography to the photographers that are really good in what they do. I've never done photo walks either (except walking and taking pictures with Leo and her boyfriend )
I need to find a way to think like that even in real life.


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

limr said:


> First, you are your own worst critic and you're much better than you think you are.
> 
> Second, don't worry so much about what the others may think. Chances are, they are just as insecure, and if they're not, then they're probably overrating themselves  Screw 'em!




Oh woman!

"Screw 'em" part helps a lot! 

...and I'll certainly use your other suggestion


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

weepete said:


> Let me assure you mmaria that your work is simply excellent and absolutley deserves a place in a gallery. Latley I've only seen you get better as you refine your ideas and it is absolutley working. Now I've spent a bit of time in some art galleries in various countries, been to a fair few local art shows too and if I saw your shots there you bet I'd be stopping to look.


aaaawwwwwwwww Pete 

All I heard is that you said you'd stop to look. That's exactly what I would like to achieve! (if I actually reach that point)


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

snowbear said:


> You have a camera on the way -- you are not allowed to quit.  Seriously, you do fine work so don't worry about it; get a few of your better shots printed and see what happens.


I wouldn't stop with photography and sharing it online. I just want to step out in the real world with it and I'm absolutely terrified.


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

DarkShadow said:


> Yes Your work is very good.Keep doing what your doing.


I will... but that means I'll share what I do online


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

pgriz said:


> Marija, you go excellent work.  You've got the eye.  Take your work that you have on Flickr and print a few  - mainly to understand how the printed image will look.  You have enough to put together a theme.  When I originally joined my local camera club, I felt very intimidated at the beginning.  There were people there with so much experience, so much good gear!  And then, looking that the images in the competitions - I found that the range of ability was very wide.  Certainly some images were breath-takingly beautiful.  But so many more were "pretty" but rather conventional and formulaic.  So many were trying to imitate other images that they saw and admired.  When I put my images up in the competitions, they actually were somewhere in the middle of the pack - not the best, but certainly not the worse either.  I would say your eye is actually better than mine, and your processing skills are better as well.  Put on your brave face, print some of your images and share them.  Remember, the only things they can give you are their opinions.
> 
> *You ARE a photographer.  You don't need to convince anyone of that.  You do want to share and learn.  That's what it is all about.*


awww Paul ... just.... just... 

Would you pls, take the time and suggest what I could print?


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

EIngerson said:


> You're an OUTSTANDING PHOTOGRAPHER Marija. Just get involved and get the experience dealing with it. You'll find that you are far better than you give yourself credit for.
> 
> As far as getting into exhibitions, go to a few and feel things out. I think you'll do an amazing job.



No I'm not but you like to give compliments 

so.. hm... just do it!?

That simple!?


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

Vtec44 said:


> The question is why are you afraid of showing people your work?


I'm not afraid showing it to "people"... I'm afraid to show it to the photographers who won numerous awards and have 30+ years of experience.
... because their opinion worth more than opinion of people who aren't into photography and don't understand it.


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## mmaria (Nov 12, 2015)

Ok... I just want to say a big fat THANK YOU ALL for doing this for me!

It really really helps because you made me think more and made me come to some conclusions that'll help me.

I'll go now and give you a big fat like  

I really appreciate your support


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## tirediron (Nov 12, 2015)

There are a number that would look good in print, but a few of my choices are:

"Going into the water"
"Marija Smanja Portrait"
Marija Smanja Boudoir" (The overhead of the dark-haired lady holding her hand to the side of her face)
"Diesel"
"Years"


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## EIngerson (Nov 12, 2015)

mmaria said:


> EIngerson said:
> 
> 
> > You're an OUTSTANDING PHOTOGRAPHER Marija. Just get involved and get the experience dealing with it. You'll find that you are far better than you give yourself credit for.
> ...



Yup! that simple.


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## Vtec44 (Nov 12, 2015)

mmaria said:


> I'm not afraid showing it to "people"... I'm afraid to show it to the photographers who won numerous awards and have 30+ years of experience.
> ... because their opinion worth more than opinion of people who aren't into photography and don't understand it.



IMHO, opinion is just that an opinion.  You'll just take what works for you and leave the rest out.  Because someone has 30+ years of experience, it doesn't automatically make his/her opinion is right for you.  Because someone has won many awards, it doesn't automatically make his/her opinion right for you either.  That is obviously just my opinion and it may or may not be right for you.


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## Achaicus (Nov 12, 2015)

Whether you have experience or not there is the desire to communicate on a level that is beyond the details, that gets into answers to why. I don't go trying to talk about my hobbies in another language, but since I am learning and interacting in spanish regularly I understand not having a perfect grasp on how to say things and how that can completely derail your desire to communicate at the level you wish to. 

My take is that you might explain that your photography jargon familiarity is in another language than the one they use and see how that is responded to. They either will accommodate you and attempt to understand or they won't and you can choose what to do at that point. You might find that some do and some don't, or that some continue to make that effort and others loose interest. But you don't know until you try. 

But put the issue of language familiarity out there, you never know one of them might be able to talk with you in language you know.


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## charchri4 (Nov 12, 2015)

I just wanted to say this is a great thread and thank you for posting and responding everyone!


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## vintagesnaps (Nov 12, 2015)

Now I get what you're talking about, a juried exhibit. Here a club usually meets once a month, has a program/speaker; the club may hold competitions, photo walks or other events.

I've done submissions to juried exhibits, that's what this seems like. I've gotten some photos accepted and some didn't. I just keep trying. It seems to depend on the number of submissions, the juror(s), how well your photo fits into their competition or theme, etc. etc.

I saw an interview with a quilt judge (obviously not photography related, but she judged exhibits) who said sometimes a work may not be accepted not because it isn't good enough, but because the juror(s) have to think about how everything will look displayed together, if the show will be cohesive, so choices are made with that in mind.

Sounds like going to their upcoming event will give you an idea what type photos they accept and display, and give you an opportunity to meet and chat with their experienced photographers. I'd look at it as a learning opportunity -  be a sponge and soak it all in.

Here are a couple that I've had photos accepted into if it would help to see what's done here. Send me a message if you have questions.
LightBox Photographic Gallery & Fine Printing | Astoria, Oregon
7th Annual International Juried Plastic Camera Show
These are smaller galleries/competitions; on an international scale with a large exhibition there may be a lot of entries so they may only accept a small percentage. So be prepared that yours may not be accepted - this time; doesn't mean you wouldn't be able to get photo(s) into an exhibit in the future.


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## pgriz (Nov 12, 2015)

mmaria said:


> pgriz said:
> 
> 
> > Marija, you go excellent work.  You've got the eye.  Take your work that you have on Flickr and print a few  - mainly to understand how the printed image will look.  You have enough to put together a theme.  When I originally joined my local camera club, I felt very intimidated at the beginning.  There were people there with so much experience, so much good gear!  And then, looking that the images in the competitions - I found that the range of ability was very wide.  Certainly some images were breath-takingly beautiful.  But so many more were "pretty" but rather conventional and formulaic.  So many were trying to imitate other images that they saw and admired.  When I put my images up in the competitions, they actually were somewhere in the middle of the pack - not the best, but certainly not the worse either.  I would say your eye is actually better than mine, and your processing skills are better as well.  Put on your brave face, print some of your images and share them.  Remember, the only things they can give you are their opinions.
> ...



Here are some I really love:

I don't like flickr's sharpening
I was fascinated by her hands... I just had to take a few shots of them
nature and wildlife, my way ;)
Jimmy Choo
girl on the bench

It shows a rather wide range of abilities and sensitivity.  

If you are going to put your work into a juried show, you obviously need to know what the overall theme or intent is of the show.  But if you are going to meet photographers and talk shop, then the images you've got should be good to show your range and skills.


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## charchri4 (Nov 12, 2015)

You missed my fav
marija smanja

IMO your work is breathtaking but if you really want to win the day just bring wine any snack with bacon.  Yeah it's cheating but nothing better than bacon to break the ice!


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

tirediron said:


> There are a number that would look good in print, but a few of my choices are:
> 
> "Going into the water"
> "Marija Smanja Portrait"
> ...


thank you!


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

EIngerson said:


> mmaria said:
> 
> 
> > EIngerson said:
> ...


we'll see


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

Vtec44 said:


> mmaria said:
> 
> 
> > I'm not afraid showing it to "people"... I'm afraid to show it to the photographers who won numerous awards and have 30+ years of experience.
> ...


Oh, really good logic. Makes perfectly sense and I really needed to hear something like this.

Thank you!


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

Achaicus said:


> Whether you have experience or not there is the desire to communicate on a level that is beyond the details, that gets into answers to why. I don't go trying to talk about my hobbies in another language, but since I am learning and interacting in spanish regularly I understand not having a perfect grasp on how to say things and how that can completely derail your desire to communicate at the level you wish to.
> 
> My take is that you might explain that your photography jargon familiarity is in another language than the one they use and see how that is responded to. They either will accommodate you and attempt to understand or they won't and you can choose what to do at that point. You might find that some do and some don't, or that some continue to make that effort and others loose interest. But you don't know until you try.
> 
> But put the issue of language familiarity out there, you never know one of them might be able to talk with you in language you know.


Thank you for stepping in


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

charchri4 said:


> I just wanted to say this is a great thread and thank you for posting and responding everyone!


why this is a great thread?


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

vintagesnaps said:


> Now I get what you're talking about - a juried exhibit. Here a club usually meets once a month, has a program/speaker; the club may hold competitions, photo walks or other events.
> 
> I've done submissions to juried exhibits, that's what this seems like. I've gotten some photos accepted and some didn't. I just keep trying. It seems to depend on the number of submissions, the juror(s), how well your photo fits into their competition or theme, etc. etc.
> 
> ...


thank you!
I checked those sites but I'll check them in detail later


(my eyes hurt a lot, can't look at the monitor, have to go home to take out my contacts but I have two meetings I have to attend in a few minutes )


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

pgriz said:


> mmaria said:
> 
> 
> > pgriz said:
> ...


Thank you!


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## mmaria (Nov 13, 2015)

charchri4 said:


> You missed my fav
> marija smanja
> 
> IMO your work is breathtaking but if you really want to win the day just bring wine any snack with bacon.  Yeah it's cheating but nothing better than bacon to break the ice!


I don't eat bacon, nor I would bring it anywhere  

It'll be ok even without the bacon


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## charchri4 (Nov 13, 2015)

mmaria said:


> charchri4 said:
> 
> 
> > I just wanted to say this is a great thread and thank you for posting and responding everyone!
> ...



Because you came to the group open and honest with a real concern and put yourself in a very venerable position.  That in-itself is extraordinary but this community rallied around you with open and honest feedback offering useful suggestions and perspective to you.  This goes far beyond was my shutter speed too fast to the very human side of this art form that is rarely revealed or discussed.  Of course it is helpful that you are an extraordinary artist but still this thread is what community is all about.  I would like to suggest that the response and feed back on your work in this community is no less valid, critical or useful than any you would get from this group you want to exhibit at.


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## charchri4 (Nov 13, 2015)

mmaria said:


> charchri4 said:
> 
> 
> > You missed my fav
> ...



Well OK so you are not perfect everyone has a fault I guess.  Hopefully it came through that I was just trying to lighten the mood and be silly anyway.


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## limr (Nov 13, 2015)

This one absolutely needs to be printed:



I was fascinated by her hands... I just had to take a few shots of them by Marija Smanja, on Flickr


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## tirediron (Nov 14, 2015)

mmaria said:


> ...It'll be ok even without the bacon


NOTHING can be truly okay without bacon!


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## snowbear (Nov 14, 2015)

limr said:


> This one absolutely needs to be printed:
> 
> 
> 
> I was fascinated by her hands... I just had to take a few shots of them by Marija Smanja, on Flickr



And this one.
marija smanja


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## PhotoKromze (Nov 15, 2015)

mmaria said:


> so.....
> 
> My whole "photography life" is online. I'm serious. The only photographers I spoke to live are @limr , her boyfriend, and a former member of this forum (I'll mention also @binga63 and @The_Traveler via Skype)... Every conversation I had about photography was online.
> 
> ...



I guess I could lend you an ear, although I am pretty sure that would more be the ears of a student learning from the master. You at least got in touch with a photography club, I didn't find any near me, the one around 25 miles away is pretty exclusive.

So yeah, I live my photographic life online too. Refreshing every 5 minutes to check for any comment I might have received in relation to my pictures.

So, in case you want to talk, drop me a line, or a half.. I'll be more than happy to help with whatever I have learnt (basically next to nothing as of now)


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## binga63 (Nov 15, 2015)

I know I don't say much here and I should....

mmaria your work is lovely, but, I will not suggest which image deserves to get printed. 

You need to print the one that speaks to you, the image that draws you back and gives 'you' an emotional reaction....

That way when you speak about it, the words will be yours and not given from outside, but spoken from your heart.

 You are developing your own style ...I see it each time you show an image. 

You are a photographer and let no one tell you differently.


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## cauzimme (Nov 16, 2015)

Do you need to produce series ?
If so, you should definitively print the old person serie. It's my favorite.






And you could also do a serie with those photos, they are consistant, beautiful and poetic.

Don't worry, you're a great artist, a great photographer and the day you will stop wondering, questionning yourself and putting your work in perspective, you will stop learning and you will stop growing, so insecurity is a good thing. It makes you want to be better, to do good, it can bring the best of you, in the end, it's fuel


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## Village Idiot (Nov 17, 2015)

Dude...my most popular picture on Flickr is a shoe. It hit somewhere int the top 10 on Explore and has a crazy amount of views, faves, etc...

It's a fricking old shoe laying on a sidewalk I snapped jokingly with an off camera flash when walking along with some photographer friends one day. People will praise the dumbest stuff, so whatever you put time and effort into has got to be way better than that shoe.


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## FITBMX (Nov 17, 2015)

Your work is good enough to show to anyone out there, and if they don't think you have skill or should not continue, then they are egotistical idiots that aren't worth your time! 
As long as YOU like your photos that is all that really matters!


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## Raj_55555 (Nov 18, 2015)

Okay, I went to their website and went through the catalogs they had for 2012-2014. I think some of the entries in there are simply extraordinary, while some others are pretty ordinary. I think I agree with what village idiot said, People will praise the dumbest stuff and ignore the greatest of art, so don't heed to everyone who has an opinion (except mine of course ).

As for you work, it has improved leaps and bounds in the past one year. You are incredibly good at what you do, and some of your photographs are definitely better than some I saw in the catalogs. To even think for a second that you'd give up on photography because of someone else's opinion is unacceptable. 

Having said that, I think it's a natural cycle for everyone to go through the imposter syndrome once they've reached a certain level in their skillset. It's kind of the reverse of the Dunning Kruger effect, you are grossly underestimating your skills and are thus demoralizing yourself. There have been times when, upon seeing some of the masterclass work, I've pondered why I'm into photography at all when I have no chance to match their level of skill. I'm sure you'll get back to your feet in no time like I do after a couple of days of sulking! 

I do agree with John about printing your images, but also think binga63, a.k.a Chris, has a point as well. I'll list out the images I like the best from your work, and you choose which are the ones that you like best.





















And of course my personal fav for a very different reason


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

first, I'll quote myself from a previous post and then explain why I'm late to reply to you all



mmaria said:


> (my eyes hurt a lot, can't look at the monitor, have to go home to take out my contacts but I have two meetings I have to attend in a few minutes )


so... I had some troubles with my eyes, couldn't use computer, and after a few days I went in another state and had laser eye surgery. Recovery was longer than expected and that's why I couldn't post till now.

anyway... I'm going to say a thing or two now


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

charchri4 said:


> mmaria said:
> 
> 
> > charchri4 said:
> ...


this is really nicely said charchri and I truly appreciate the help I got from everyone


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

charchri4 said:


> Well OK so you are not perfect everyone has a fault I guess.


 lol, true


> Hopefully it came through that I was just trying to lighten the mood and be silly anyway.


 of course... I smiled, don't worry


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

limr said:


> This one absolutely needs to be printed:
> 
> 
> 
> I was fascinated by her hands... I just had to take a few shots of them by Marija Smanja, on Flickr


 it will be printed  

ty


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

tirediron said:


> mmaria said:
> 
> 
> > ...It'll be ok even without the bacon
> ...


I'm really tempted to hit one big fat disagree!



I really am


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

snowbear said:


> limr said:
> 
> 
> > This one absolutely needs to be printed:
> ...


that one too.... ty


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

binga63 said:


> I know I don't say much here and I should....
> 
> mmaria your work is lovely, but, I will not suggest which image deserves to get printed.
> 
> ...


At first I was  that you didn't suggest anything but then I simply understood what are you trying to say and I did some thinking about it.
It helped me a lot because I realized that I could stand in front of every one of my picture and said something from the bottom of my heart... but I don't have an emotional reaction on every picture of course (and it won't be that easy in real life of course, but I'll try)

ty and ty for letting me know the picture


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

cauzimme said:


> Do you need to produce series ?
> If so, you should definitively print the old person serie. It's my favorite.
> 
> 
> ...


I don't need to produce series.


Everything you said is true about insecurity... but I've never been so insecure that it could be called as "panic attack"  

thank you cauzimme for your suggestions, for your encouraging words and the tone of your post


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

Village Idiot said:


> Dude...my most popular picture on Flickr is a shoe. It hit somewhere int the top 10 on Explore and has a crazy amount of views, faves, etc...
> 
> It's a fricking old shoe laying on a sidewalk I snapped jokingly with an off camera flash when walking along with some photographer friends one day. People will praise the dumbest stuff, so whatever you put time and effort into has got to be way better than that shoe.


oh LOL that's great  

ty


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

FITBMX said:


> Your work is good enough to show to anyone out there, and if they don't think you have skill or should not continue, then they are egotistical idiots that aren't worth your time!
> As long as YOU like your photos that is all that really matters!


awwwwww ty!


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## mmaria (Dec 9, 2015)

Raj_55555 said:


> Okay, I went to their website and went through the catalogs they had for 2012-2014. I think some of the entries in there are simply extraordinary, while some others are pretty ordinary. I think I agree with what village idiot said, People will praise the dumbest stuff and ignore the greatest of art, so don't heed to everyone who has an opinion (except mine of course ).
> 
> As for you work, it has improved leaps and bounds in the past one year. You are incredibly good at what you do, and some of your photographs are definitely better than some I saw in the catalogs. To even think for a second that you'd give up on photography because of someone else's opinion is unacceptable.
> 
> ...


awww Raj! thank you for everything you said...

I wish I could give you a better response but I'm just awwww

thank you


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## runnah (Dec 9, 2015)

You can do it!


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## astroNikon (Dec 9, 2015)

Village Idiot said:


> Dude...my most popular picture on Flickr is a shoe. It hit somewhere int the top 10 on Explore and has a crazy amount of views, faves, etc...
> 
> It's a fricking old shoe laying on a sidewalk I snapped jokingly with an off camera flash when walking along with some photographer friends one day. People will praise the dumbest stuff, so whatever you put time and effort into has got to be way better than that shoe.


Because that photo has sole .. or soul ...   

Which is what mmaria's photos convey.  they're not just snapshots they convey some feeling or emotion out of the viewer.  I don't think you'll have a problem with other photographers.


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## mmaria (Dec 10, 2015)

runnah said:


> You can do it!


awww ty


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## mmaria (Dec 10, 2015)

astroNikon said:


> Village Idiot said:
> 
> 
> > Dude...my most popular picture on Flickr is a shoe. It hit somewhere int the top 10 on Explore and has a crazy amount of views, faves, etc...
> ...


awwwww 

funny and very nice... ty for saying this


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## pgriz (Dec 10, 2015)

Marija, I've kinda been absent, but that time out let my thoughts ferment a little.  Here's my thinking.  Your images are very, very good, but for another reason than technical.  The best photographs, in my mind, are those that allow the viewer to add his or her own interpretation to what they are seeing in your image.  It's like a dance, in which the two partners don't just go through the motions of memorized steps, but react to each other.  Your images create the setting into which a viewer can enter and participate.  Your images don't tell us what to see - but they suggest a possibility, which the viewer can then interpret and engage with.  Each viewer can have a different experience with the images you show - and that ability to create an "unfinished" photograph that encourages a viewer to supply the missing narrative, is a wonderful ability indeed. 

Thinking back, I think we even talked about this a year or so back.  You showed us some images without explaining the context, and we had a pretty good time figuring out what we thought we saw.

The danger in showing your work, may be that people (well, some of them, anyways) may have expectations of a completely "finished" presentation, where you essentially tell them what they are supposed to see.  And yet, those kind of images can be very pretty, but are often static - because once you've digested the presented material, there's nothing more to do there.  Whereas an image with ambiguity, with a meaning hinted at, but not said explicitly, is a much more subtle and difficult process of creation.  I aspire to that level of ability, and sometimes despair at being able to achieve it.  I see it in the work of Chris Crossley, and in Judi Smelko, and several other photographers who don't post on TPF.  Do you remember Frederico (Invisible)?  He had some very intriguing images and made us work a little in seeing and projecting our interpretations.  

Really good artists can hint at a reality and have the viewer then participate in creating it.  You do that.


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## mmaria (Dec 11, 2015)

pgriz said:


> Marija, I've kinda been absent, but that time out let my thoughts ferment a little.  Here's my thinking.  Your images are very, very good, but for another reason than technical.  The best photographs, in my mind, are those that allow the viewer to add his or her own interpretation to what they are seeing in your image.  It's like a dance, in which the two partners don't just go through the motions of memorized steps, but react to each other.  Your images create the setting into which a viewer can enter and participate.  Your images don't tell us what to see - but they suggest a possibility, which the viewer can then interpret and engage with.  Each viewer can have a different experience with the images you show - and that ability to create an "unfinished" photograph that encourages a viewer to supply the missing narrative, is a wonderful ability indeed.
> 
> Thinking back, I think we even talked about this a year or so back.  You showed us some images without explaining the context, and we had a pretty good time figuring out what we thought we saw.
> 
> ...



oh Paul... 

I... 
I... I really don't know what to say on all of this... I'm speechless. Really. 

I've never thought that I could get this kind of opinion on my photographs. It's close to unbelievable to me... I actually imagined that you're saying this to some other photographer out there and I just happen to read it.

I'm trying really hard to find words to express how I feel after I read your post for a few times, but I can't find proper words. I'm really touched by the effort and time you spend thinking about my photographs. (I think I just cried a bit)... and for saying something I really wanted to achieve with my photography and wasn't sure I'm able to.

Thank you!!!


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## pgriz (Dec 11, 2015)

Sometimes words get in the way.  You asked the question, and I gave you my answer.  But at a more fundamental level, you expressed a doubt, and I am holding up the mirror to you so you can see that the doubt is unwarranted.  Some doubt is always healthy, and provides the push to get better.  Too little doubt and you have arrogance and complacency.  Too much doubt is like a drug overdose - it can kill your initiative and will.  Your talent has already convinced us of your rather unique vision and ability.  Now, you have to believe it yourself.


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## James W. (Dec 13, 2015)

mmaria,

Sometime ago a photographer told me that the most important thing in photography is confidence in the camera and the person behind the camera (i.e, you).  I can't possibly imagine one reason why you should be intimidated by someone else's work or that person on a personal level.  The best photographers didn't get there by being jerks, so regardless of their personality, they will at least put on a polite smile.  7 pages of people saying great things won't help if you don't believe in yourself, so own your personality, your craft, and your vision.  Then take all that and go to this exhibition, put your work on display for the other members, and only then will you get the answer you seek of whether you are able to make the grade or not.

Good luck!

--James


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## mmaria (Dec 15, 2015)

pgriz said:


> Sometimes words get in the way.  You asked the question, and I gave you my answer.  But at a more fundamental level, you expressed a doubt, and I am holding up the mirror to you so you can see that the doubt is unwarranted.  Some doubt is always healthy, and provides the push to get better.  Too little doubt and you have arrogance and complacency.  Too much doubt is like a drug overdose - it can kill your initiative and will.  Your talent has already convinced us of your rather unique vision and ability.  Now, you have to believe it yourself.




Thank you!

I must say that I feel just a bit better... two days ago on a conference I gathered courage and approached a professional photographer. I envied him, I must admit, because he does what I'd like to do. We talked about his commercial and his personal work etc.. After we talked a bit he gave me his website address and I look at it later. 
I expected much more from him. Sadly but, he not being great photographer made me feel better about my own photography.

I think I'll never be able to feel confident about my photography, which is good in a way that I'll constantly learn trying to be better, but it's not good because I don't have confidence in certain situations like this one.

I guess I'll learn it with time... and the support I got from this thread!


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## mmaria (Dec 15, 2015)

James W. said:


> mmaria,
> 
> Sometime ago a photographer told me that the most important thing in photography is confidence in the camera and the person behind the camera (i.e, you).  I can't possibly imagine one reason why you should be intimidated by someone else's work or that person on a personal level.  The best photographers didn't get there by being jerks, so regardless of their personality, they will at least put on a polite smile.  7 pages of people saying great things won't help if you don't believe in yourself, so own your personality, your craft, and your vision.  Then take all that and go to this exhibition, put your work on display for the other members, and only then will you get the answer you seek of whether you are able to make the grade or not.
> 
> ...


Thank you James for saying all of this ... you're completely right.

I feel better than I was when the thread started  and words like this really helped me. I think I need to realize that I should have confidence even if it's based just on me as a person oh...idk... I need to find a way to clear the thoughts in my head...


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## James W. (Dec 15, 2015)

mmaria said:


> James W. said:
> 
> 
> > mmaria,
> ...



That's the spirit!  Best way to clear thoughts, take more photos, but for fun, not for a project.  Obviously I don't know who you are as a person, but I will assume that you are a humble person.  So continue to be humble, but with an internal confidence.  A fire in the heart can sometimes be better than a fire in the eye.

--James


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