# How to make the transsition from working a normal local job, to pro photographer?



## Life (Jan 18, 2015)

I am in a crossroad per say and would like advice from someone who may have been here done that. Right now, I work a min wage job, really want to get to be pro and do that as my income, not cooking. Ive been wanting to do this for years now, but im finally close to making the transition, but how? I have a woman to support, bills to pay. How could I take the leap, with not really any money, just experience.


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## jsecordphoto (Jan 18, 2015)

Are you taking in any income through photography at all right now?


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## Ream (Jan 18, 2015)

I have been at a similar crossroad, with a few differences.. I am a stay@home Mom.. I started small portrait jobs with a cheap point & shoot GE. I then took $1,000.00, bought a CanonRebelT3i, backdrops, lighting, & a remote! Read.Read.Read... Learn.Learn.Learn.. And I say this because, if you start working without learning, you will find yourself stuck, taking quick, cheap pictures, for little - no money, and you will not be flattered @ your own work.. A little depressing.. But once friends & family know you take photos, you will be taking everyone's photo for free.. Shoot more, read more, learn more, so you can charge more.. Learn your own rate and then absolutely charge people your rate + printing.... I have spent so much money out of pocket for under bidding jobs.. Don't get discouraged. You can do it!


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## EIngerson (Jan 18, 2015)

There are plenty of successful photographers. If you can support yourself through photography, great. but it's not an easy venture to establish a lucrative business. Making a living and being financially stable can be two different things. You can be an outstanding photographer, but if you are not business savvy, it's not going to work. I recommend getting a job with benefits. 

This is just $.02 from the peanut gallery. Take it for what it's worth.


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## Ream (Jan 18, 2015)

Ream said:


> I have been at a similar crossroad, with a few differences.. I am a stay@home Mom.. I started small portrait jobs with a cheap point & shoot GE. I then took $1,000.00, bought a CanonRebelT3i, backdrops, lighting, & a remote! Read.Read.Read... Learn.Learn.Learn.. And I say this because, if you start working without learning, you will find yourself stuck, taking quick, cheap pictures, for little - no money, and you will not be flattered @ your own work.. A little depressing.. But once friends & family know you take photos, you will be taking everyone's photo for free.. Shoot more, read more, learn more, so you can charge more.. Learn your own rate and then absolutely charge people your rate + printing.... I have spent so much money out of pocket for under bidding jobs.. Don't get discouraged. You can do it!


Also... It takes time.. It's not anything like cooking, or reading a recipe..  I promise! It is always rewarding though! Just set your limits. Don't cut yourself short.. Bid high.. What type of equipment do you have now? What area of photography are you most interested in?


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## Ream (Jan 18, 2015)

EIngerson said:


> There are plenty of successful photographers. If you can support yourself through photography, great. but it's not an easy venture to establish a lucrative business. Making a living and being financially stable can be two different things. You can be an outstanding photographer, but if you are not business savvy, it's not going to work. I recommend getting a job with benefits.
> 
> This is just $.02 from the peanut gallery. Take it for what it's worth.


So true.. Photography is an expensive hobby and an even more expensive business.! $$$$$$$ Money to drive, money to shoot, money to edit, money to print, money to advertise..... It's an expensive love..


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## The_Traveler (Jan 18, 2015)

I looked at your portfolio on 500px. 
No people.
You need to get some experience with what you want to make $ at.


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## imagemaker46 (Jan 18, 2015)

What type of equipment do you have?
What experience do you  have?
What area of photography are you interested in?
Biggest question, What do you have that will set you apart from the everyone else?

I took a look at your portfolio and while there are some really nice images, there are also 10,000 images that look the same being uploaded every day to the web.  I can see that you enjoy what you do with a camera, don't ever lose that feeling.  To be honest I was shooting the same type of thing when I was 16 years old, I've been shooting since I was 13, I'm near 60 now and still shooting, no bugs, no trees, no flowers, no animals, anymore.  Bugs, trees, flowers and animals are a hobby. It's not easy jumping into this business anymore, you should be concentrating on people, none of what shoot, will buy your images. 

If this is the only area of photography that you are interested in or have experience in keep doing it, look locally for any galleries that may be interested in hanging some prints.


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## Vtec44 (Jan 18, 2015)

Being a a full time photographer requires you to be both an artist and a business person.  What kind of photography do you want to focus in and do you have a business plan?  Being a good photographer alone doesn't automatically give you a successful photography business.  The right clients have to find you.  What are you doing now to have the right clients find you?  Are the right clients finding you?


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## dennybeall (Jan 18, 2015)

Look at the business side. Where is the money - people and buildings, perhaps events, children or sports teams BUT Not hardly animals unless you specialize in pets.
What's in your portfolio? stuff that doesn't make money pretty much.
re-focus!


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## bribrius (Jan 18, 2015)

Life said:


> I am in a crossroad per say and would like advice from someone who may have been here done that. Right now, I work a min wage job, really want to get to be pro and do that as my income, not cooking. Ive been wanting to do this for years now, but im finally close to making the transition, but how? I have a woman to support, bills to pay. How could I take the leap, with not really any money, just experience.


how are you supporting a woman on a min wage job????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????


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## runnah (Jan 18, 2015)

Stick with cooking. The earning potential is much higher than photography.


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## Light Guru (Jan 18, 2015)

Life said:


> I am in a crossroad per say and would like advice from someone who may have been here done that. Right now, I work a min wage job, really want to get to be pro and do that as my income, not cooking. Ive been wanting to do this for years now, but im finally close to making the transition, but how? I have a woman to support, bills to pay. How could I take the leap, with not really any money, just experience.



You don't just leap.  You work extremely hard on the side establishing a photography business while at the same time working your day job. You build it up to a level that it's not a leap it's simply stepping from one side to the other. 

I recommend you read the the book Quitter by Jon Acuff
Quitter: Closing the Gap Between Your Day Job & Your Dream Job: Jon Acuff: 9780982986271: Amazon.com: Books


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## Forkie (Jan 19, 2015)

Currently going through this transition myself.  I plan on it being a gradual process.

I am a pro-photographer as my day job, but work for someone else on a company payroll with no options for career progression with this company (I'm the only photographer, so there is nowhere above me for me to progress to) so, I plan to slowly switch it over to go full-time freelance. 

I've spent the last year doing freebies in my spare time and taking advantage of as many portrait photography work in my day job as possible to build my portfolio and have my first paid, unsolicited by me, headshot session on Friday which for me is a perfect achievement in the timeframe I had in mind (I'd like to be able to leave my job at or just after next Christmas). 

I plan to do as many private jobs as possible, taking annual leave from my day job to give me time to do the private work and once my private work pay almost matches my current salary, then  (and only then) I will consider leaving the job and going freelance full time.


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## imagemaker46 (Jan 19, 2015)

A good friend of mine and a pretty good photographer had been working at the same camera store for 25 years, he shot weddings on the side, had all the best gear but was getting fed up with the direction the store was going,(started selling cell phones as a main) he figured he could do ok freelancing.  A year later he is supported 100% by his wife, doesn't know what direction to go. He doesn't regret quitting, but he has replaced one stress with another one.  Leaving full time jobs these days without having a solid plan. Huge mistake.


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## Life (Jan 19, 2015)

First answers first. Yes I do make some money off of photography. A few local jobs here and there.
I have been learning and learning and learning. Course after course, class after class, book after book  It's getting expensive 
I shoot a Nikon D7100, with a Nikon 18-70 ( my portait lens ) and also a Nikon 80-200mm f2.8 ( certain portaits ). I have a small studio setup, 2 flashes. 2 stands, 4 umbrellas, a couple backdrops, diffusers, gels, stands etc.

And no thanks, I don't plan to keep on cooking... 

It's not min wage either whoever said that .

There is a lot of very good points here and advice thank you!


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## tirediron (Jan 19, 2015)

runnah said:


> Stick with cooking. The earning potential is much higher than photography.


 The same can be said of pan-handling!


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## KmH (Jan 19, 2015)

Going Pro: How to Make the Leap from Aspiring to Professional Photographer
How to Start a Home-Based Photography Business (Home-Based Business Series)


> How could I take the leap, with not really any money, just experience.


Other people have done it having little money to start, but not very many.
Most of those that were successful usually had well developed business, marketing and salesmanship skills.

According to the Department of Labor, in the USA today the average gross income for retail photographers is about $32,000 a year.
In fact, most retail photographers in the US today earn an income below the poverty line and support their 'business' with other income from a 'day' job or a spouse.
Only 15% or so of professional photographers earn gross income at or above $50,000 a year.

Out of gross income self-employed workers have to pay a variety of federal, state and local taxes.
For instance - your employer deducts FICA taxes from your paycheck.. The amount you see on your pay check stub is 1/2 what is paid. Your employer is required by law to pay the other half. _When you become self employed you will have to pay it all_. Being self employed your state will likely require you to pay unemployment insurance taxes - that are currently paid in total by your employer.

The point being that after taxes and based on a gross income of $32,000 a year something like $8000 of your income (25% or more) will go to taxes leaving you about $24,000.
If your business is not profitable you will have to support yourself, your woman, and your business with that $24,000 until your business starts turning a profit.

Lets go back to that $32,000 in gross income, because we can use that number to calculate how much revenue your business will need to do.
First - Your income (salary) from a photography business is part of your cost-of-doing-business. Your income is not profit.
So lets assume your photography and products are priced so that 20% of the revenue your photography generates is income.
The math is simple - $32,000 / 20% = $160,000 per year in gross revenue your new business needs to generate to provide you with gross income of $32,000.
If your business skills aren't all that good maybe your business only generates income at the rate of 15% instead of 20%
$32,000 / 15% = $213,333 in gross revenue needed to generate the same $32,000 in income.
If you only generate $160,000 in gross revenue and income is 15% of that revenue your income goes down to $24,000 a year, and that is gross income, not take home pay.


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## Tabe (Jan 19, 2015)

Life said:


> It's not min wage either whoever said that .



Uh... you did:



Life said:


> Right now, I work a min wage job


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## Life (Jan 19, 2015)

XD. lol i'm so used to saying that. I got a raise not that long ago.


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## KmH (Jan 19, 2015)

Substantial raises are not very common, so would that mean your pay is now just slightly above minimum wage?


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## Life (Jan 19, 2015)

Unfortunately yes. $9... But it does make the paycheck that much higher. We are used to living with the bare minimum. But being able to make a little more money would certainly be great and that's what I'm trying to do. It seems my issue is the whole marketing thing right now. I have family who can help me greatly with the business side of things. I'll certainly read up on this books and links you are showing here. Thanks everyone


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## dennybeall (Jan 20, 2015)

Annual income for photographers is mentioned  in another post.
Anytime an annual earnings figure is published for a business that does not have significant inventory and is not tax deductible for the client you need to take that figure with a dash of doubt.
Having had three different businesses that met that criteria I can tell you the tax return does not accurately reflect annual earnings.


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## Microbois (Jan 22, 2015)

I don't mean to discourage you, but earning money from photography is very tough nowadays, especially if you're just starting off. Sure, there are some areas of photography that can pay better than others, but don't worry, the competition is already there chasing that very little money that can be made out of it.

Just to give you an idea, my son plays minor hockey at an elite level, and I purchased 2 large pictures of 10" x 18" format for 10$/each during a tournament. One was an individual picture of my son, and the other one was a team picture. Obviously, the photographer was back the next day and he printed them all for the players. I was one of the last person to purchase his prints, and based on the remaining pictures I've seen, I would estimate he didn't sell more than 4 or 5 pictures to our entire team. That's a lot of work taking pictures of 17 players, and printing them all just to sell a couple in the end... Overall, he's done it with all the teams participating to the tournament, so maybe it was worthwhile in the end, but he spent 4 full days shooting and spent money to get the prints done. He also had to pay someone for 3 days sitting at a table to sell those prints in the arena. Once all his expenses are factored in, I doubt he made more than 100$ to 150$ / day, and it only lasted 4 days. Now he has to look for another gig...

My only suggestion to you would be to keep your day job, and try doing photography on the side. When comes the day where you have so much lucrative photography related work that you are forced to take some time off from your day job, then that will be a good sign that you are building a serious business. Until then, it's not the occasional gigs that will put food on your table every day. More over, you'll have to be a much better business man than you are a photographer because in the end, you are in the business of selling your pictures, and if you're not really good at that, you will fail miserably.

Good luck!


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## KmH (Jan 22, 2015)

dennybeall said:


> Anytime an annual earnings figure is published for a business that does not have significant inventory and is not tax deductible for the client you need to take that figure with a dash of doubt.
> Having had three different businesses that met that criteria I can tell you the tax return does not accurately reflect annual earnings.


Tax avoidance is legal, tax evasion isn't.
There are a lot of people in federal prisons right now who got caught evading taxes.
when does wesley snipes get out of jail? - Google Search

Businesses that do not have significant inventory and that can be conducted to a large extent on a cash basis have long been targeted by the IRS for more scrutiny than other businesses.

A backhanded recommendation to file false tax returns is not good business advice. LOL.


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## dennybeall (Jan 22, 2015)

Wow, thanks so much for that information, Had no idea.....


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## Life (Jan 23, 2015)

Wesley snipes is not in jail..? lol. Anyway. Thanks for all the advice and your time guys


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## Mr. Innuendo (Jan 30, 2015)

I'm not of the opinion that there's not money to be made being a photographer. I'm not of the opinion that being a cook will provide a better income. Those will only be true if you allow them to be true.

I became a full-time photographer out of necessity. I worked in a different industry for the better part of 20 years, and walked away from it in 2013. 

I ended up moving to Florida. I took as many piecemeal jobs as I could find, and I found a lot of them. Many here will cringe, but you wanna' know where I found the best paying ones? Craig's List. Yep; that bane of the professional photographer's existence actually panned out. I've done shoots that pay upwards of $50.00 and  $60.00 an hour, and there's zero _anything _for me to do after pressing the shutter. I literally hand the card over to the company which hired me. This company, by the way, advertises all over the country. Now, there's no shortage of people who would say "I would never work for that low an amount", and that's fine. Stay at home and I'll take the money. I don't care what anyone says, grossing $350.00 for a day's worth of shooting, and zero editing, ain't bad.

I write and shoot for a new magazine here in town. How the Hell I ended up with a gig where someone would pay me twenty-five cents a word for an article is beyond me, but that's another example of a gig found on Craig's List. I also write and shoot for their blog for the same rate. This has turned out to be a pretty sweet gig. My association with that magazine has now put me on a sort of photographer "A-List" locally, which also pays dividends in the form of other gigs. People love having "the guy from that magazine" shooting their family portrait.

The bottom line here is that you want to make money.

Look _everywhere _for jobs. If someone wants to pay you $75.00 for a simple head shot when you want to charge them $100.00, take the $75.00. Why? Because it's better than _not _having $75.00 and, really, it's not rocket science.

You have to hustle. You don't have to be the guy who gives away the farm, but you need to be the guy who people will think of when they need a photographer.

Yesterday I accepted a gig in exchange for two VIP tickets to a charity event. Why did I do that? Because a lot of high-rollers attend this event. These same high-rollers read our magazine and, by default, see my pictures and read my articles. When they need a photographer for something, they just may decide they want "that guy from that magazine".

Don't be afraid to fail. Don't be afraid to work for less than another guy, but don't be afraid to stick to your guns when your price is higher than someone else. It's a balancing act and, once you figure out how to stay on the tightrope, you'll probably find that you're doing okay.


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## KmH (Jan 30, 2015)

Yep. Don't be afraid to fail.
But, for every story like yours there are a 1000 others that don't have a happy ending.

What did you do before you walked away?


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## Mr. Innuendo (Jan 30, 2015)

KmH said:


> Yep. Don't be afraid to fail.
> But, for every story like yours there are a 1000 others that don't have a happy ending.



This is true.

The pertinent question, though, is _why _are there 1,000 others that don't have a happy ending?

Personally, I believe failure only happens when failure is allowed. For me, I couldn't afford to fail with photography. It was all I had. I was going to be pretty screwed if it didn't work out, so having it not work out was never on my radar. I couldn't let it be.

I truly believe that a person can succeed at whatever they want to succeed at, provided they're willing to weather the storm.



> What did you do before you walked away?



I worked for an artist management firm in Los Angeles, and at a fairly high level. I was what most people would refer to as an "agent". It was fun for a long time, and the money was great, but it was literally sucking the will to live right out of me. Now, I bust my ass to make a tenth of what I made at the agency, but I'm infinitely happier.


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## astroNikon (Jan 30, 2015)

There's money to be made as a photographer
But you have to be better than all the others

Know not just how to use your camera but how to "mold" lighting to create the best image that you possible can.

Your competition is everything from the people doing stuff for free, to people charging enough to break even, to the full-time professional photographers that make their livelihood at it.  You have to rise up above the low-end jobs and get to the high-end jobs.  To do that you need to be able to nail every shot, in every situation.  That's a professional photographer.


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## pixmedic (Jan 30, 2015)

astroNikon said:


> There's money to be made as a photographer
> But you have to be better than all the others
> 
> Know not just how to use your camera but how to "mold" lighting to create the best image that you possible can.
> ...




your photography doesnt have to be better than the others....your marketing and business plan does.


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## imagemaker46 (Jan 30, 2015)

What is "mold" lighting, i've never heard this before.


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## pixmedic (Jan 30, 2015)

imagemaker46 said:


> What is "mold" lighting, i've never heard this before.



its for when you want to take pictures of fungus.


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## KmH (Jan 30, 2015)

Yep.
There are plenty of mediocre photographers out there that are making good money doing photography.
They make money because they are are good at doing business.


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## imagemaker46 (Jan 31, 2015)

...and there are plenty of mediocre photographers working 15 hours a day, undercutting other mediocre photographers. There is more to life than always being on the clock, at some point it does kill you.  Once the hobby becomes the job, that's when you can sit back and wonder why it isn't as much fun anymore.  There are always exceptions.  I really enjoy shooting and editing and the computer work, it's the other 99% of the work I don't always enjoy.


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## Vtec44 (Jan 31, 2015)

There's good money to be made being a full time photographer.  You have to work much harder than everyone out there.  Differentiate yourself and find the right clients are the two most important things.  It's not easy but nothing is easy in life.


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## vintagesnaps (Jan 31, 2015)

If you're as good as Scott you might have a shot at it, but if you follow what's going on in the world of photography this doesn't seem like the best time to try to go into business for yourself as a photographer.

If the OP comes back, I'd see if there's anything in your area that offers information on what fields of work are good to go into, who's hiring, any job training that might be available, job fairs, etc. and figure out what would be some good options for you. Photography could be a sideline and then see if it develops into anything more from there.


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