# Well that didn't last long, D850 dethroned.



## benhasajeep (Oct 28, 2017)

DXO released test results / score for the new Hasselblad X1D-50c.  Listed score of 102 for the Hassy.  Of course the Hassy is a 51mp sensor in a much larger format sensor, D850 60% the size of the Hassy sensor.  One thing I didn't realize is it's a 15bit system.  Of course the Hassy is $9k for just the body.


----------



## jaomul (Oct 28, 2017)

I'm not sure about dxomark, but even so the hassy hasn't got fast lenses and the iso is the only area it clearly beats the Nikon, but the faster Nikon lenses make up the difference, so in theory the Nikon in real life should have the edge


----------



## tirediron (Oct 28, 2017)

That's sort of like saying my $75,000 pick-up truck lost out to a $250,000 Aston-Martin Vantage in acceleration tests.  Yeah... I can live with that.


----------



## SquarePeg (Oct 28, 2017)

$75K for a pick up?   Egads man!


----------



## zombiesniper (Oct 28, 2017)

SquarePeg said:


> $75K for a pick up?   Egads man!


That's 75k Canadian pesos....so about $16.99 USD.


----------



## tirediron (Oct 28, 2017)

zombiesniper said:


> SquarePeg said:
> 
> 
> > $75K for a pick up?   Egads man!
> ...


  And no, I didn't pay 75K for a vehicle...  I think my pick-up was more in the 30K range.


----------



## smoke665 (Oct 28, 2017)

SquarePeg said:


> $75K for a pick up?   Egads man!



75k was last years prices. The 2018 Fords  F-250 single-rear-wheel will start at $82,130; the F-350 SRW, $83,305; the F-350 dual-rear-wheel, $84,780; and the F-450 4x4, $88,395 (all prices include a $1,295 destination fee). Ford said if customers order the F-450 and check all the option boxes, they could spend as much as $96,000. Prices on average jumped 15k when they went to the all aluminum body, which is why we bought the previous year.


----------



## smoke665 (Oct 28, 2017)

benhasajeep said:


> DXO released test results / score for the new Hasselblad X1D-50c.  Listed score of 102 for the Hassy.  Of course the Hassy is a 51mp sensor in a much larger format sensor, D850 60% the size of the Hassy sensor.  One thing I didn't realize is it's a 15bit system.  Of course the Hassy is $9k for just the body.



I'm sorry, I know there are Nikon fans that think it's the only brand and it is a quality camera,  but for price of an 850 I can get a Pentax K1 with a choice of quality glass. In a side by side image comparison I seriously doubt you would be able to tell the difference in quality between the two.


----------



## jaomul (Oct 28, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> benhasajeep said:
> 
> 
> > DXO released test results / score for the new Hasselblad X1D-50c.  Listed score of 102 for the Hassy.  Of course the Hassy is a 51mp sensor in a much larger format sensor, D850 60% the size of the Hassy sensor.  One thing I didn't realize is it's a 15bit system.  Of course the Hassy is $9k for just the body.
> ...



I am a Nikon user, I nearly went the Pentax route except where I live Pentax is hard to buy, so support and accessories were space.

No doubt most cameras in same class these days are very close on image quality, the difference of a few dxomarks means very very little


----------



## smoke665 (Oct 28, 2017)

jaomul said:


> xcept where I live Pentax is hard to buy, so support and accessories were space.



I think that pretty much applies to anywhere. You HAVE TO REALLY WANT a Pentax to go through the trouble of ordering online. Course given the fact that brick and mortar stores are fading away, it may come to that with all brands.


----------



## jcdeboever (Oct 28, 2017)

I did play around with the Fujifilm GFX and I wanted to bring her home, I"m sure she would have been happy and not yelled at me. Man, it was impressive.


----------



## BananaRepublic (Oct 29, 2017)

tirediron said:


> That's sort of like saying my $75,000 pick-up truck lost out to a $250,000 Aston-Martin Vantage in acceleration tests.  Yeah... I can live with that.



Wonder which would burn more gas. Is the vantage a v8 or v12


----------



## fmw (Oct 29, 2017)

If you were to give me a Hasselblad, I would sell it immediately.  Possibly the worst value in the camera world.  Expensive and delicate.  If you want expensive and sturdy this is one.


----------



## Derrel (Oct 29, 2017)

The king is dead, long live the king!

(  The king is dead, long live the king! - Wikipedia!  )


----------



## chuasam (Oct 29, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> benhasajeep said:
> 
> 
> > DXO released test results / score for the new Hasselblad X1D-50c.  Listed score of 102 for the Hassy.  Of course the Hassy is a 51mp sensor in a much larger format sensor, D850 60% the size of the Hassy sensor.  One thing I didn't realize is it's a 15bit system.  Of course the Hassy is $9k for just the body.
> ...



I’d rather use a canon than sully my hands with a Pentax.


----------



## benhasajeep (Oct 29, 2017)

chuasam said:


> smoke665 said:
> 
> 
> > benhasajeep said:
> ...



I would take a Pentax K1 anyday!  Any Canon I would want is way more expensive than a K1 and a very good lens.  So, I would probably take a Pentax over a Canon first (at this time).


----------



## tirediron (Oct 29, 2017)

I've always been a fan of Pentax, and if they were a little more accessible and third-party accessories more available, I would use them instead of Nikon.  They've always been #1 in value-for-money in the camera world IMO.


----------



## chuasam (Oct 29, 2017)

tirediron said:


> I've always been a fan of Pentax, and if they were a little more accessible and third-party accessories more available, I would use them instead of Nikon.  They've always been #1 in value-for-money in the camera world IMO.


but the fact that they're the unloved brand with 1.5% market share. You'll never be able to find in store support or likely to find someone who shares the system. So much dicking around just to save a bit of money...nah
Easier to stick with the main brands and get the support that is vital.


----------



## smoke665 (Oct 29, 2017)

benhasajeep said:


> I would take a Pentax K1 anyday! Any Canon I would want is way more expensive than a K1 and a very good lens. So, I would probably take a Pentax over a Canon first (at this time).



And for about $1500 more than an D850 with lens, you could get a Pentax 645z with a good prime, and be hands down superior in every way. I'm sorry, just not seeing the value in the D850. Not knocking those that adhere to the Nikon brand, just not for me.


----------



## Vtec44 (Oct 29, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> And for about $1500 more than an D850 with lens, you could get a Pentax 645z with a good prime, and be hands down superior in every way. I'm sorry, just not seeing the value in the D850. Not knocking those that adhere to the Nikon brand, just not for me.



I love the Pentax 645z and I use the Pentax 645 system along side with my Nikon FF's, but there are so many draw backs like frame rate, low light focus, shutter speed just to name a few.  I guess it would depend on the type of photography you do to pick a 645z over a D850.  Both are great cameras.


----------



## benhasajeep (Oct 29, 2017)

chuasam said:


> tirediron said:
> 
> 
> > I've always been a fan of Pentax, and if they were a little more accessible and third-party accessories more available, I would use them instead of Nikon.  They've always been #1 in value-for-money in the camera world IMO.
> ...



I have not been in a "camera" store in probably 5 years when our only local one closed!  And not many would do anything for an inoperative camera other than to send it in.  Which you could easily do on your own.  I doubt 90% or more people who own camera equipment has been in a "camera" store in the past year!  Unfortunately they are a dying breed.  Online retailers and big box stores have made it really hard for them.  

I have a lot of Nikon gear.  That comes with using it for a long time.  And I think it's very good if not near the best.  But I still pay attention to other makers.  And if I see something that appears to be good or better than what I have.  I would have no issue in acquiring it!  I may have Nikon "blinders" but they are not down too far over my eyes!


----------



## smoke665 (Oct 29, 2017)

chuasam said:


> but the fact that they're the unloved brand with 1.5% market share. You'll never be able to find in store support or likely to find someone who shares the system. So much dicking around just to save a bit of money...nah
> Easier to stick with the main brands and get the support that is vital.



It's not about the money, it's about the actual value received, when comparing apples to apples. We have two camera stores in the entire state with limited inventory. My last two Pentax bodies, and last 4 lenses have been ordered online, with excellent customer service and technical support when I needed it. If I determined that Nikon, Canon or Fuji fit my needs better I wouldn't have a problem with any of them, if they survived a head to head comparison. Again it's the value inherent in the item. Never been one to buy something just because of the name. Maybe if I wanted a Nikon or a Canon I could even find limited inventory at someplace like Best Buy, but my experience with the people there is that I find them not much above the Micky D level. I keep expecting them to ask me if I want a hot apple pie with that!!!


----------



## Derrel (Oct 29, 2017)

chuasam said:
			
		

> but the fact that they're the unloved brand with 1.5% market share. You'll never be able to find in store support or likely to find someone who shares the system. So much dicking around just to save a bit of money...nah
> Easier to stick with the main brands and get the support that is vital.



BUT WAIT...don't you have an Olympus camera you really like? And don't they have like 2.2% market share? LOL

I dunno..."support" is wayyyy over-rated in my opinion.


----------



## benhasajeep (Oct 29, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> benhasajeep said:
> 
> 
> > I would take a Pentax K1 anyday! Any Canon I would want is way more expensive than a K1 and a very good lens. So, I would probably take a Pentax over a Canon first (at this time).
> ...



I would love a MF digital, or even a Pentax MF film camera.  I made a mistake and sold the majority of my Bronica Equipment.  That was a very boneheaded move.    I am not sure for what I am doing right now, if buying a MF digital body is wise.


----------



## benhasajeep (Oct 29, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> chuasam said:
> 
> 
> > but the fact that they're the unloved brand with 1.5% market share. You'll never be able to find in store support or likely to find someone who shares the system. So much dicking around just to save a bit of money...nah
> ...


I agree it's about value for what you get.  Pentax K1 is probably the best "value" out there at the moment.  And anyone who has said their lenses are subpar obviously has not used one.  Pentax was the first company to make 10million slr's.  Unfortunately they let "money" men take over the company and putting out the "best" is not on their list of things to do.  And basically all they did was sell the company several times!  At the detriment of the company and it's marketshare!


----------



## Derrel (Oct 29, 2017)

benhasajeep said:


> smoke665 said:
> 
> 
> > benhasajeep said:
> ...



The 645z was/is a very nice imager! The sheer size of the new "MF" digital sensors in most cases is not "that much bigger" than FX digital, or 24x36mm sensor size. Ken Rockwell has a pretty good article on what he calls mezzo-format, or the new medium format sensor size, which is what most mfrs. are using now.

I saw a comparison of the 654z I think it was versus the 36-MP Nikon D800 some time back; there was not that much difference, and in the AF arena, the Nikon was more capable than the Pentax was.

The 645z was atrociously poor at video...horrific rolling shutter issue...but at high ISO levels, that BIG sensor and its BIG pixel wells was really quite,quite impressive!


----------



## chuasam (Oct 29, 2017)

Derrel said:


> chuasam said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Olympus actually has about 25% market share in the mirrorless market.


----------



## Solarflare (Oct 30, 2017)

I couldnt care less what DxOMark says. *shrug*


----------



## benhasajeep (Oct 30, 2017)

Solarflare said:


> I couldnt care less what DxOMark says. *shrug*


DXO is just another metric to make a decision from!  As you are researching for your purchase.  Can't use it soley for your purchase decisions!


----------



## astroNikon (Oct 30, 2017)

I'm glad I read this thread.  I'll dispose of my thoughts of upgrading to the D850 and get the Hasselblad  instead.

by the way, is the Hassy under $400 dollars with kit lens  and tripod, UWA lens, NDs and cleaning kit ?


----------



## pixmedic (Oct 30, 2017)

benhasajeep said:


> Solarflare said:
> 
> 
> > I couldnt care less what DxOMark says. *shrug*
> ...



the interesting thing about researching cameras is that 90% of the information is subjective. 
actual camera specs are really the only hard facts. the rest is more or less opinion, or at the very least, *involves *some opinions.
better images? a lot of subjectivity there.  a lot also depends on the reviewer and their capability. 
AF might be based more on facts, but that too somewhat depends on the reviewer and the hope that they know how to properly use the camera and the AF mode for what they are shooting. 
nothing beats having the camera in hand to test yourself.


----------



## smoke665 (Oct 30, 2017)

pixmedic said:


> nothing beats having the camera in hand to test yourself.



Unfortunately, given the fact that retail locations are fading away, how do you test one without buying it?


----------



## pixmedic (Oct 30, 2017)

smoke665 said:


> pixmedic said:
> 
> 
> > nothing beats having the camera in hand to test yourself.
> ...




well, im often in the same boat. 
for a number of years i was upgrading cameras once, sometimes twice a year. couldnt always get one in hand to test. 
I basically looked at as many reviews as i could find.  i was invested in Nikon so...it was really a matter of just deciding if the newer camera
was an upgraded i wanted or not. 
when we switched to fuji i spent weeks looking up reviews on various cameras and lenses, youtube videos...
dxomark, dpreview, f-stoppers, forum posts...any place where i could see what an owners opinion of the camera was. moreso if they were actual photographers and could explain in better detail the functionality of the camera, and how they like the end results. 
thats about as good as i could do short of having a camera to test myself. honestly, it works pretty well.


----------



## jaomul (Oct 30, 2017)

pixmedic said:


> smoke665 said:
> 
> 
> > pixmedic said:
> ...



The key is being able to sort the important stuff from the less important and maybe the truth from the bs. I have bought some cameras in a local shop but their prices can be up to 50% more than online so can't always support local.

I stopped buying a Nikon magazine when it compared a d3200 with a d3300 and gave the 3300 five stars for image quality and  the 3200 only three stars, though six months before the d3200 got five stars. I had done enough research and comparison as I was looking for a second small camera. I considered this review dishonest, especially as the general target market for these cameras are new to dslr and would probably swallow the bs hook line and sinker


----------

