# Boundaries and photos for loved ones



## andrewdoeshair (May 29, 2016)

I couldn't think of a good way to word the title, but what I'm trying to bring up is whether or not you'll hand over the whole unedited session to a friend or family member, or stick to sending them your picks after you're happy with them.

I was asked to take pictures at a family gathering on Easter, and I had a lot of fun doing it. I felt like I captured several small stories throughout the day and represented all the key moments very well within the (30 or so) images I shared with my family. Then I got the "what about that one picture of me with so and so?" and "didn't you take more than this?" emails. My wife rolled her eyes and said "we didn't want you to pretend to be a photographer, we just wanted pictures. Send them all, you don't have to edit them..."

Another time I was staying in a cabin with friends and I got a few shots of a friend on a tire swing with her baby. She asked me if she could have them, but I declined and asked her if she'd mind letting me get them home to edit them first. Then she said "I have an app on my phone, I can edit them here" and everything got awkward so I gave in.

Sometimes I feel like I'm taking myself too seriously by wanting to keep my images until they're exactly how I want them, but if I'm not taking it seriously I don't really even want to take pictures, it's not as fun. I've started leading with a disclaimer when anyone asks me to take pictures, saying up front that they'll get a set of photos after editing, but again, I may be wrong for doing that.

Where do you stand? Would you take pictures and then hand them all over to a friend or family member, the good and the bad, all unedited, or would you not?


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## KmH (May 30, 2016)

How is this *Off Topic Chat* - A place to talk about anything outside the topic of photograph - since it's about photography?

*Photographic Discussions*


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## andrewdoeshair (May 30, 2016)

Sorry. I didn't know where else it would fit. I'll be more careful about that in the future.


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## goooner (May 30, 2016)

Tell them that you are taking RAW photos, and they can't open/edit them without professional software


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## Overread (May 30, 2016)

Shooting in RAW certainly stops them just having every shot like they want. 

However you also have to appreciate that for most people ap hoto today is disposable. They are quick snaps taken in the instant and posted on facebook and then forgotten. Heck I know people who insist upon taking photos at key events or such and will never even look at them. They might glance at the back of the camera but otherwise they do nothing with them. The "act" of taking the photo is important to them.


In the end you draw your own line; remembering that you'll only be "that great photographer" if you only let out edited shots. Non-photographers will be confused as to why you don't just give them all out or why you have to edit or etc... but the thing is they are used to point-shoot-print type cameras. The camera does all the thinking for them so its harder for them to appreciate what goes into a quality photo - or even just a good intermediate one. 
They also expect "the photographer"to get a great shot with every single click - yep every shot you take must be outstanding and thus any you don't give to them are clearly shots you're holding back for selfish reasons. 


I'd say stick to your guns but don't be afraid to just post a few happy snaps now and then - they won't ruin you as a photographer and you won't get shot for it


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## nerwin (May 30, 2016)

I edit them and send them what I think are the best shots.

But because I'm not on Facebook anymore, its rather difficult now. No one in my family seems to use email anymore. Its always Facebook...Facebook and Facebook....


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## snowbear (May 30, 2016)

One of the reasons I don't shoot family things.


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## tirediron (May 30, 2016)

I never hand over any images to ANYONE that I'm not absolutely happy with.  The way to think about it is this:  If your artistic pursuit was painting would the same friend have said, "Oh I have a pallet & some paints right here, I'll finish your painting"?  Exactly the same thing.  Just tell people that you will get them the images as quickly as you can and explain that quality takes time.


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## JustBen (May 30, 2016)

I stick to my rule that nobody gets my photos straight out of the camera. I shoot in RAW so i have to develop them anyway, and no matter who that person is i will develop them and then pick the ones i like. 
If somebady asks why they can't have them right away i tell them it's because i shoot in RAW, that stops everybody in their tracks, because they have no idea what i am talking about


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## Bebulamar (May 30, 2016)

At one time I shot a wedding for a friend. After the reception I gave her the unprocessed film because I had to leave and moved to another state that night. Having done that but in your situation I would stick to your gun and not sending out any unedited photos. The photo isn't 100% yours unless it's approved by you.


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## kdthomas (Jun 2, 2016)

tirediron said:


> I never hand over any images to ANYONE that I'm not absolutely happy with.  The way to think about it is this:  If your artistic pursuit was painting would the same friend have said, "Oh I have a pallet & some paints right here, I'll finish your painting"?  Exactly the same thing.  Just tell people that you will get them the images as quickly as you can and explain that quality takes time.



Bingo ... I never ... _ever_ ...  let work go out that I don't believe in. If it was for money and I didn't like any of them ... I honestly think I would just refund the cash with an apology.

As an aside my problem is actually getting my my family to *permit *me to photograph them. One of the things I do is hands ... my mom doesn't like the way her hands have aged, and doesn't seem to realize that's *why* I want to photograph them. She's not going to be around forever, and I want to remember her artistically, but ... oh well. I hate makeup and I have a sister who refuses to get in front of the camera without makeup, but ... oh well ... what are you gonna do? I don't like it but I make the choice to accept it


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## weepete (Jun 2, 2016)

I'm the same, I don't give out unedited shots. Just tell them those shots didn't make the cut and have been deleted.


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## Dave442 (Jun 2, 2016)

I think you may have sent out too many photos. Spend some extra time really knock it down to just a few of the very best. Just keep doing it that way so they become used to it. 

It can help you be a critic of your own photos, it lets you spend less time processing photos, it helps show your best work, you have left out a bunch of people so those left out don't feel so bad. 

If you had a number of small stories in the overall set, then break them up and release each story on its own. 

I'd rather show a family friend one photo of someone they would not even sit at the same table with and have them comment that it's a great photo rather then make them look at 30 photos. 

Don't tell them you want to edit the photos, no excuses, just give them a firm but polite No. If they are insistent then give them a price per photo (or let them know there is a cost involved) to have you deliver something immediately. 

There is a big demand for delivering photos as things are happening. I'm sure people at an Easter event want to put their photo on FB on Easter and not five weeks later, even more so for a birthday (where all of a sudden people think the persons' birthday is the day they post your photo and start sending happy birthday wishes to the person).


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## Kirstend (Sep 3, 2016)

goooner said:


> Tell them that you are taking RAW photos, and they can't open/edit them without professional software



Good idea. I so dislike situations like that! I feel your pain lol.


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## Tim Tucker (Sep 3, 2016)

Lordy, lordy. Reading through this it seems that many of you have mistaken your families for clients or photo editors. 

I'm no professional but if I take my camera to a family event then the family are nearly always ask to see what I've shot. I'll show them as well.
If there's a photo that they particularly want because it has so-and-so in it (who they haven't seen for 50 years etc...) or because they like the way they look. Then they can have it with nothing more than WB and sharpening. Even if it's slightly out of focus. 

If I'm doing formal shots and prints then I will edit and make sure of focus, everyone smiling etc. But my family can have any shot that they've become attached to, even there and then if they want a spontaneous moment for Facebook etc (especially if I was never going to bother editing it myself). I'll always try and make it better, but I'd never delete it because it didn't match up to my 'artistic sensibilities'. They're family, make them smile not groan.


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## JoeW (Sep 3, 2016)

Multiple answers (b/c the variables to this situation are many).

1.  I generally agree with the position of:  no work goes out unless you've approved it.  That said, this makes the most sense for a professional or one who is hoping to make money off of their work (b/c your work is your best promotional piece--so you want it to draw fans and people who'll pay you).  If you are NOT doing this for money, you do NOT plan ever to have this as a business, than I think this rule is less likely to apply.

2.  You created some issues by making it a negotiation rather than a "this is my rule."  For instance, when the friend who said they could edit in their phone asked you for the photos, it sounded like you said "do you mind if I edit them first" to which she replied to your question by saying "nah, I've got software on my phone--I can do it."  And she probably thought she was doing you a favor.  If you have a rule that says "I don't give out RAW files" then say that...."sorry, I only give out edits...you'll see these in a week."

3.  Interesting about people saying "didn't you take more?"  I usually get the opposite response.  I'll take an interesting candid and someone (like my wife) will say "they aren't going to want to see that--look at all of the wrinkles in her face.  She's not smiling.  Delete!"  If you've done edits and people say "what about those pictures of me on the swing?" you can I say "I deleted those--I didn't like the result."  B/c effectively you have--they didn't make your approved edits list.

4.  You need to decide your policy on dealing with family.  For instance, I shoot weddings.  But I also bring my camera to family weddings where I'm a guest.  I tell the pro there "I won't get in your way, just here to shoot a lot, tell me if I'm blocking a shot."  I'll shoot a lot and then work to get edits to the bride and groom quickly (b/c I'll beat the photographer they booked and my value will usually be...getting a lot of good photos fast...and then the photographer they hired will provide the great portraits that have been finely edited, and the classic wedding photos later on for the album a month after they get back from the honeymoon.  Other family events (like big birthdays and reunions) I edit to my heart's content and people see the photos a month afterwards (which irritates some who want them sooner).  But everyone in the family has come to know--if you want to see photos the next day, don't count on me...b/c I'm going to edit them all, send out a lot of them, and I won't make exceptions for anyone...even my favorite niece.  And so I no longer get any guff from people about "what about the phone of me when I was on the ...." or "how much longer before we see the pictures?"

What you're a victim of is a combination of a world where everyone has a camera-phone with a cheap set of templates (so expecting instant gratification and looking for snapshots, not pictures) and you not doing a better job managing and setting expectations.


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