# Pulling my hair out! (back focus? blur? Nikon D7000 and my 24-77mm and portraits)



## Suziellen (Dec 10, 2012)

(Typo in my heading...I meant 24-70mm)Okay here's the deal. I've been doing natural light portrait photography for over a year now and I am two seconds away from pulling my hair out.

The last 5-6 shoots I have been having this interesting little issue. If it's me then someone please tell me what I am doing wrong and if it's possibly my camera, what can I do?

I can't submit a sample image right now but will later if it will help. 
I did two shoots yesterday. One with a couple outdoors in a wooded area. I shoot on AF-S so that I can pick my focal point, recompose (I use the middle point) and snap the image. The problem is.....it is focusing on the tree branches behind it or whatever is behind it....even though when I look back through the images on my camera, the little red square shows the focus being on the couples faces....
I had a shoot in the afternoon with a mom,dad, and little girl. Focal point was clearly on them but the barn behind them was in focus and they were not. It's ruining my shoots and this keeps happening! There was low light yesterday and I always shoot above 1/60 shutter (I shoot on manual) and when doing groups try to keep above fstop 3 so I don't get out of focus faces due to tooo shallow DOF...

Can someone please give me some insight....
One frustrated photographer






SUE_4827 by suellencarter, on Flickr


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## The_Traveler (Dec 10, 2012)

not without a picture - which is worth 10,000 words


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## Suziellen (Dec 10, 2012)

I know. I will post one as soon as I get home from work. What's the best way to post a photo? I've used Flikr in the past.


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## BrianV (Dec 10, 2012)

A picture showing the problem is a must for these situations. 

I would also suggest that you try a test shot with the camera, one using Autofocus as you normally do AND a second shot using Manual Focus. A lot of things can cause consistent back-focus, with an AF camera it can be the mechanism is out of alignment. If manually focused images and AF images, the main mirror can be off.

My favorite subject for testing focus...

Before: bad front-focus,







AFTER adjusting the lens:






"Boring", yes- but it does show the amount of error. This particular lens- someone that knew me from a different forum asked me to look at it, he got a great price on it, and it was near mint condition. It left the factory requiring adjustment. 50 years ago.


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## BrianV (Dec 10, 2012)

Suziellen said:


> I know. I will post one as soon as I get home from work. What's the best way to post a photo? I've used Flikr in the past.




For this type of discussion- how about uploading the image as an attachment, just fo to "advanced" for the reply, and then "Manage Attachments".

From your description, I suspect the camera is out of calibration. I've had this happen to me, the AF mechanism was consistently focusing behind the subject.


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## gardy (Dec 10, 2012)

try focusing on a ruler placed at a 45 degree angle, any back focus should present itself, if its not too much you can use the AF fine tune in camera


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## cgipson1 (Dec 10, 2012)

what focus mode are you using? and how do you have it setup?


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## Vtec44 (Dec 10, 2012)

My D7000 had a similar problem, back focusing about 3ft behind the subject if you're about 15ft away.  I sent it to Nikon and they fixed it.


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## Suziellen (Dec 11, 2012)

I will give this a try this weekend. It's dark at 4:30 when I get off work. I see what you are saying though.


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## Suziellen (Dec 11, 2012)

Vtec44 said:


> My D7000 had a similar problem, back focusing about 3ft behind the subject if you're about 15ft away.  I sent it to Nikon and they fixed it.



Did it cost a lot?


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## Suziellen (Dec 11, 2012)

cgipson1 said:


> what focus mode are you using? and how do you have it setup?




AF-S....I focus on my subject and then recompose if needed.


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## Vtec44 (Dec 11, 2012)

Suziellen said:


> Vtec44 said:
> 
> 
> > My D7000 had a similar problem, back focusing about 3ft behind the subject if you're about 15ft away.  I sent it to Nikon and they fixed it.
> ...



It was within the warranty period so only shipping and insurance to Nikon.


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## Suziellen (Dec 11, 2012)

BrianV said:


> Suziellen said:
> 
> 
> > I know. I will post one as soon as I get home from work. What's the best way to post a photo? I've used Flikr in the past.
> ...



I tried to upload it this way and it wouldn't let me. I did put a sooc image above from Flikr. I don't know if you can see all the information. I think this image was at 35mm, 125 shutter, iso 320 and fstop 3.5 (a little lower than I would use normally). Needed more light as it was very dark out.


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## orb9220 (Dec 11, 2012)

For flickr insert pic here in the forums when you click on share be sure to click the radio button from Html to BBcode and copy and paste that into threads here. Flicr html code will not work.
.


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## The_Traveler (Dec 11, 2012)

It might be more informative if you loaded the full resolution image to Flickr rather than a downsampled one.
The DOF for f 3.5 at the exif given is

assuming 8 feet lens- subject   near 7 far 9.3
              10 feet                     near 8.5 far 12.5

That is barely enough to cover the front to back of 3 people posed together.
If you didn't get the focus point exactly in the right place it is possible that her face might be out of the dof.

It does seem more oof than it should, however.
I suggest you actually do a real test with controlled dof, camera placement and focus rather than depending on a shot that might have been mishandled.


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## Lipoly (Dec 11, 2012)

Here is a higher res version: All sizes | SUE_4827 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!


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## cgipson1 (Dec 11, 2012)

Lipoly said:


> Here is a higher res version: All sizes | SUE_4827 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!



You have no Exif data available on that shot... so we can't see how you had the camera setup. Are you using SPOT (S) focus mode? Which AF-S mode are you using (AF-Area Modes: Auto, S, d9, d21, d39 and  3d)????

Spot focus will allow you to pick EXACTLY where you want focus to be.

I know you didn't ask for C&C... but... your framing.... having that building corner coming out of the guys head, not really attractive... and the image is unnecessarily high contrast the way you framed it.


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## gardy (Dec 11, 2012)

Suziellen said:


> Vtec44 said:
> 
> 
> > My D7000 had a similar problem, back focusing about 3ft behind the subject if you're about 15ft away.  I sent it to Nikon and they fixed it.
> ...



I had to send my d90 in last month for the same thing and it ended up being 150$ ish for adjusting the focus and a full cleaning, it wa not under warrantee


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## The_Traveler (Dec 11, 2012)

Unless you are purposefully shooting a small image, this is still a downsized image and the figures are small in it.
At 300 % you can see however that it looks like the edge of the barn (?) is in quite sharp focus, his hair is reasonable but her face is OOF.
I looked at this in ViewNX which sometimes will show the focal point, in case you had missed, but nothing appeared.
You would be best off to actually shoot a shot specifically to test front/back focus.


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## Lipoly (Dec 11, 2012)

cgipson1 said:


> Lipoly said:
> 
> 
> > Here is a higher res version: All sizes | SUE_4827 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
> ...



Just to clarify, I am not the OP, just linked to a higher res version.


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## gardy (Dec 11, 2012)

http://focustestchart.com/chart.html
Go here and print out the chart and take some sample following the instructions on the page and post them up, that would help out a lot


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## Suziellen (Dec 11, 2012)

The_Traveler said:


> It might be more informative if you loaded the full resolution image to Flickr rather than a downsampled one.
> The DOF for f 3.5 at the exif given is
> 
> assuming 8 feet lens- subject near 7 far 9.3
> ...




I have other photos that may represent the issue better. I will do a controlled test and post with a full resolution photo. In the case of this photo due to the dof I think her face was and would have been slightly out of focus regardless, however when you zoom in (which you probably can't due to my photo sharing option) the barn right behind them is in focus but when I look back through my focal point is on the dad. So, even if this were a misshandled shot (I was frustrated half way through the shoot because of this issue) shouldn't atleast the dad be in focus and not the subject behind him?

I will do a real test and get back to you. I really appreciate any feedback you have to offer. If it's me then I need to figure out what I am doing and fix it!


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## Suziellen (Dec 11, 2012)

gardy said:


> Nikon D70 Focus Chart
> Go here and print out the chart and take some sample following the instructions on the page and post them up, that would help out a lot




Great! I will do this as soon as I can and post photos.


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## Suziellen (Dec 11, 2012)

Lipoly said:


> cgipson1 said:
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> > Lipoly said:
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I appreciate the CC...I have to laugh because I didn't choose to set it up like this. I have others where the barn is the whole background . The dad wanted the chair here so we took a few like this...I try to accomodate clients to a point (they happen to be family too). Not something I would have chosen. I completely agree with you. 
Isn't there a way to upload photos with all the data? If so, when I do a real test I will uplad a couple photos with all the data attached. I need to learn how to use this forum better so people can actually offer assistance lol. Thanks for your input! AF-S. I spot focus using the center spot I've read it can be the most accurate.  Let me get back to you with some real information so you guys can look at all the data. THanks again.


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## cgipson1 (Dec 11, 2012)

Lipoly said:


> cgipson1 said:
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> > Lipoly said:
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yea...I caught that after I posted... post still stands though!  Thanks!


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## cgipson1 (Dec 11, 2012)

Suziellen said:


> Lipoly said:
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> > cgipson1 said:
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Where was the actual focus in this shot? It should have been someones  (Dad?) eyes.. with adequate DOF to cover all of the subjects. Center  point on the shot is on the Dad's left shoulder.


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## Suziellen (Dec 16, 2012)

gardy said:


> Nikon D70 Focus Chart
> Go here and print out the chart and take some sample following the instructions on the page and post them up, that would help out a lot


Is this way to small to see? I tried to just attach it? To me it looks like it is back focusing? What are your thoughts?


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## The_Traveler (Dec 16, 2012)

certainly looks like it.


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## gardy (Dec 16, 2012)

Suziellen said:


> View attachment 28860
> 
> 
> gardy said:
> ...



It does look back focused to me, how close was the chart to the camera when it was taken? And what focal length and aperture was it taken at? Te DOF seems pretty large to me, when I shot the same chart with my 24-70 I had very little in focus at 2.8. Also your d7000 has an autofocus fine tune in the menus, you might try dialing some in and taking test shots along the way to see if you can get the in focus area more centered


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## Suziellen (Dec 16, 2012)

gardy said:


> Suziellen said:
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> > View attachment 28860
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I had my 24-70 on but my stinking tri pod won't hold that heavy lens at a 45 degree angle (maybe it's having issues to.. Sheesh) so I stuck a light lens on. The DOF is larger than 2.8. It was shot at F4.5 35mm. I will do it again with my 24-70 at 2.8 to get it narrowed down. I am thinking it isn't my lens now...I am thinking it's my camera. Even having a larger DOF the line and wording should be in focus and it looks like it's off just like when I am shooting with it. I will continue to investigate with the autofocus fine tune and seeing if I can fix the issue. If nothing else I am learning my camera more.


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## gardy (Dec 16, 2012)

Suziellen said:


> gardy said:
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> > Suziellen said:
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You could always tape the chart to something rigid and place the chart at 45 degrees and have the camera level, from the looks of it, the autofocus fine tune might be able to get you to where you need, when I had this problem it was so far off I had around the 10mm in focus and you the txt was completely blown out, your looks like it could be a simple fine tune adjust, hopefully. I know this can get frustrating as I just dealt with it last month


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## Derrel (Dec 17, 2012)

I looked at the largest version available on your Flickr page,and the focus is clearly, and obviously, on the grass on the ground,well behind the chair. As you can easily see, the grass on the ground in front of the man's feet is decidedly OUT of focus....the people are "almost" within the band of focus, but are unfortunately, in front of the plane of good focus. Bummer. This is a pretty classic example of back-focusing.


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## Biplab Dey (Dec 17, 2012)

Suziellen said:


> (Typo in my heading...I meant 24-70mm)Okay here's the deal. I've been doing natural light portrait photography for over a year now and I am two seconds away from pulling my hair out.
> 
> The last 5-6 shoots I have been having this interesting little issue. If it's me then someone please tell me what I am doing wrong and if it's possibly my camera, what can I do?
> 
> ...



apply AF fine tune option


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