# NEED HELP - PLEASE read!  Wedding Snafu



## JReichert (Apr 29, 2012)

[h=6]I did a last-minute wedding, end of last month.  The bride's mother is  the one who found me, contacted me, set up the initial meeting, and paid  for half of my fee as well as signed the contract with the groom's  father.  She's been a pleasure to work with so far.  In the package I  quoted them was a photobook and a canvas print, everything else  discounted à la carte. 

 The bride's mother informed me a few  days after the wedding that her daughter was no longer talking to her.   Which came as no real surprise, because in all honesty the daughter was a  real PIA during the initial meeting and the whole wedding day,  especially to her mother.  The bride's mother tells me her daughter is  still, a month later, not talking to her.

 And now my dilemma.

 The mother all along has stated that she would like the print and the  bride and groom can of course have the photobook.  In emails since the  wedding (while I was developing their CD of low-res, watermarked images)  the bride & groom said that they want everything - both photobook  AND print.  I explained that the bride's mother wanted the print and  they would have to discuss it with her, to which they kept responding,  "We're not talking to her."   ...... ooooo-kay.

 I met with them  in person to give them the CD last week and they were kind of aloof,  asked where the photobook was (um, YOU have to pick the photos,  remember?) and then mentioned the print, to which I again responded  with, "(The bride's) mother said that she would like it and you should  talk with her to get this cleared up," and they AGAIN responded with,  "Well, we're not speaking with her right now, and we'd like it."  I  changed the subject and we parted shortly thereafter.

 I sent  them a reminder email about letting me know the images they'd like for  the photobook and again reminding, a bit more bluntly, that as the  bride's mother paid for half of my fee and signed the contract, I'm  contractually obligated to honor HER wishes.  I said that I would like  the groom's father's information so that I can speak with him about  this.

 To which they responded (verbatim), "Hi Joanna, I realize  that you signed a contract with my mother but this is Matt and My  wedding photos we would like the 11x14 print, His parents who also  signed the contract want us to have that print so I hope we can wok this  out and we will have the photos for the book by the 7th."

 Note that they did NOT give me the groom's father's info as I requested.

 So I'm at this stupid crossroads that I absolutely did NOT foresee and  I'm at a loss.  Legally, I'm beholden to the bride's mother and the  groom's father.  I can say, too bad so sad to the bride & groom and  just give the mother the print, but then I've been negligent as far as  the father's wishes go (even though I've not been successful at  contacting him thus far.)

 My last ditch effort will be to offer  them, at a cost equal to the price of the original canvas print, 2  smaller prints so that both bride & groom and bride's mother can  have a print.  But that feels like giving in and it's ridiculous that  I'm stuck in the middle of this childish squabbling.

 Any thoughts on this???  I'm losing sleep over this.  : ([/h]


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## mirrorrim (Apr 29, 2012)

Can you ask the bride's mother for the groom's father's information? 

If you can't get ahold of him to confirm what the B&G said, I would go with the mother's wishes. She paid you and she's the one who has been communicating with you. It doesnt matter that they were the bride and groom and it's photos of their wedding, the mother is the one who paid you and signed the contract. She owns whatever she paid for. She has told you to give the B&G the photobook and that she wants the print, so that is what you do.

You can tell them politely again that legally you must follow the contract and they must work out what happens to the items with the mother. You can't break the law! Then offer them something they can pay for, if they must have their own print. 

(Also, on a side note, I would create a photobook with photos you like, have them proof it, make what changes they want, etc because it's much less hassle and headache).


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## Kerbouchard (Apr 29, 2012)

Along the same notes, you have a contract.  You need to honor it.  It really is that simple.

Have you talked to the estranged Mom?  Talking to the B&G in this case is almost pointless.  Your contract is with the Mom.  Either return the money or honor her wishes.  Legally, you don't have a choice.

On the flip side, it's going to cost you less than a hundred bucks to produce two of the prints.  You could just throw it in to both parties, minimize the bad will, and move on with a lesson learned.


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## CCericola (Apr 29, 2012)

I would ask your lawyer what to do so you are not in breach of contract. If you don't have one, find one. Lawyer services, like insurance is a necessity.


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## BlairWright (Apr 29, 2012)

Give everything to the mother and let her take care of the dirty family cr@p, you contracted with the mother and father.

Good luck, it's unfortunate that they are so classless that they pulled you into a family feud.


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## Dominantly (Apr 29, 2012)

The only people you should be concerned with, are the people who signed a contract with you and paid you for your services. Everyone else really doesnt matter, even if it's their day that was photographed.
I wouldnt come out of pocket for them either, I might do a discount, but that's it considering the position they are trying to put you in.


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## IByte (Apr 29, 2012)

Don't get involved honor the contract when things cool down then negotiate.


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## Kerbouchard (Apr 29, 2012)

Dominantly said:


> The only people you should be concerned with, are the people who signed a contract with you and paid you for your services. Everyone else really doesnt matter, even if it's their day that was photographed.
> I wouldnt come out of pocket for them either, I might do a discount, but that's it considering the position they are trying to put you in.



It is easier to say and do that than to live with a review from the bride that says the photographer did not deliver 'her' picture.

There is a difference between being 'right' and running a business.  One way costs you about 30 bucks.  The other can cost you your business.  Nobody wants a review saying the photos weren't delivered.

Honestly, it's not that much money...just fix it and get out of the fray.  This isn't something you want to get caught up in.


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## Overread (Apr 29, 2012)

Can't you just sell the Bride and Groom an additional fullsized print? You'll still be honouring your contract with the Brides mother and providing her with one, whilst at the same time providing the Bride and Groom with what they want. The only problem I could foresee there is if you've signed over copyright to the brides mother or if some work for hire law requires permission of the Brides mother for you to sell an additional print of the shot. That being the case speak to the mother yourself to arrange permission (only if needed - I suspect no such permission is needed). 

Failing that do as suggested above, simply have a second print made (at your own cost) and take a slight hit to your earnings in order to preserve face and the services you offer. 

It sounds like the argument is only internal to the family and, at the moment, isn't focused upon you; you're just caught in the crossfire so I'd take the fastest and least resistive way out - a free one-off print to the Bride and Groom.


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## JReichert (Apr 29, 2012)

Except it's _not_ a simple print.

If it were a print, even though they're the ones being unreasonable, I'd do it in a heartbeat to get out of this mess and only lose, what, $8?  What I offered them was a giclée canvas gallery wrap, about $70 my cost.  And I'm sorry, but I'm dead broke at the moment - my 'real job' ended in September and I'm only working 2 days a week at minimum wage and can't find anything else around here.  I'm not going to eat the cost of another giclée canvas.  I'm just starting out in the business aspect of photography and until now, my work has 'free, they buy prints' for the things I care about - animal shelters, etc. - and things that are mutually beneficial - shooting for local restaurants to improve their 'look', they buy prints and give me free food and practice.

I haven't done anything unreasonable at this point and I don't care if this particular bride & groom can't pull one over on me - I'm leaving for Maine June 2nd to hike the Appalachian Trail and afterwards, God willing, we're moving to Tennessee, states away.  But I DO care about being fair in business, and that's how I want to get this resolved.


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## Overread (Apr 29, 2012)

Then offer to sell the Bride and Groom an additional print and call it a day. Ball is then in their court to pay you for the print and its their choice.


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## KmH (Apr 29, 2012)

Per your request, I read it.

Having the bride's mother, and the groom's father sign the contract, instead of having the bride and groom sign the contract, is the root of your problem.

I have no solution suggestions for you.


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## jamesbjenkins (Apr 29, 2012)

Overread said:


> Then offer to sell the Bride and Groom an additional print and call it a day. Ball is then in their court to pay you for the print and its their choice.



If it were me, this is exactly what I'd do.


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## raider (Apr 29, 2012)

give them what they want along with the bill - payable up front.  give the mother what she is contractually obligated.


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## IgsEMT (Apr 29, 2012)

CCericola said:


> I would ask your lawyer what to do so you are not in breach of contract. If you don't have one, find one. Lawyer services, like insurance is a necessity.


Ditto


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## BlairWright (Apr 30, 2012)

IgsEMT said:


> CCericola said:
> 
> 
> > I would ask your lawyer what to do so you are not in breach of contract. If you don't have one, find one. Lawyer services, like insurance is a necessity.
> ...



How could this be breach of contract if the bride and groom didn't sign the contract? The OP mentioned that they didn't want to spend the 70 bucks on another Giclee' so I can only assume that the 500 for a lawyer consultation is more than likely out of the picture too. Lastly, what would the lawyer say? pay me more and I'll get you out of this in court? No, they would write a letter to the bridge and groom which wouldn't help anything and cost 50-10 times what another Giclee would (which sounds like would fix this).

Lawyers are handy to have in your back pocket but they aren't always the answer, this society leans on them way too much IMO.


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## CCericola (Apr 30, 2012)

The breach of contract has absolutely nothing to do with the bride and groom and only to do with the people who signed the contract. And yes, if I was the mother and you did not deliver what I asked then you would be in breach of our verbal contract that the book be delivered to the bride and the print to me.

If you cannot afford a lawyer then you should not be in the wedding business. Just like starting any business you need Capitol from loans, saving or investors to pay for what you need.

Just hope this only ends up costing the OP $70 instead of thousands if the bride and groom decide to sue. If they sue for any reason and the OP is off hiking  on the court date, the OP loses.


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## imagemaker46 (Apr 30, 2012)

JReichert said:


> Except it's _not_ a simple print.
> 
> If it were a print, even though they're the ones being unreasonable, I'd do it in a heartbeat to get out of this mess and only lose, what, $8?  What I offered them was a giclée canvas gallery wrap, about $70 my cost.  And I'm sorry, but I'm dead broke at the moment - my 'real job' ended in September and I'm only working 2 days a week at minimum wage and can't find anything else around here.  I'm not going to eat the cost of another giclée canvas.  I'm just starting out in the business aspect of photography and until now, my work has 'free, they buy prints' for the things I care about - animal shelters, etc. - and things that are mutually beneficial - shooting for local restaurants to improve their 'look', they buy prints and give me free food and practice.
> 
> I haven't done anything unreasonable at this point and I don't care if this particular bride & groom can't pull one over on me - I'm leaving for Maine June 2nd to hike the Appalachian Trail and afterwards, God willing, we're moving to Tennessee, states away.  But I DO care about being fair in business, and that's how I want to get this resolved.



I would give the mother the print that was promised to her as per the contract, offer the bride a simple 11x14 print, that won't cost you $70. Do the photo book, get the rest of the money that is owed to you. Close up your photo business until you find another full time job that allows you to play "professional photographer" again. This is one of those no win situations that has to be cleaned up and walked away from.


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## gsgary (Apr 30, 2012)

$70 is a drop in the ocean if you charged a proper rate for the job


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## imagemaker46 (Apr 30, 2012)

gsgary said:


> $70 is a drop in the ocean if you charged a proper rate for the job



Don't think so, sounds more like another weekend wedding professional.


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