# Portrait Lighting Set



## mangorockfish (Apr 20, 2018)

Has anyone ever bought one of the light sets off Ebay that has a couple of soft boxes some umbrellas, light stands and continuous lights.  All of this for like $83.  Are the boxes and umbrellas worth having?  Seems like the stands and bulbs would come to more than $83.  Just curious.


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## Jeff15 (Apr 21, 2018)

There is no such thing as a free lunch.


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## Designer (Apr 21, 2018)

mangorockfish said:


> Has anyone ever bought one of the light sets off Ebay that has a couple of soft boxes some umbrellas, light stands and continuous lights.  All of this for like $83.  Are the boxes and umbrellas worth having?  Seems like the stands and bulbs would come to more than $83.  Just curious.


I've purchased some inexpensive umbrellas and light stands via mail order, but no continuous lighting.  Continuous lighting is not as good as one would hope, except perhaps for video.  When you want to order, look for flash lighting.  

Inexpensive gear is just what you would expect.  The performance is generally not as good as the upper end stuff, and cheap gear may start to fall apart in a few years, but just to try something out it is not all bad.  Go ahead and order some inexpensive stands and modifiers, but don't put a lot of faith in continuous lighting, especially for things like portraiture.  Cont. lighting will be fine for still life photography.  Eventually you will want some flashes (either speedlights or studio strobes).


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## tirediron (Apr 21, 2018)

Seen them, never bought one, and DO NOT recommend it!  On it's own, a decent light-stand should cost at least that much.  As designer mentioned, continuous lighting, and especially this sort of cheap, low-powered continuous lighting isn't going produce many good results.  I would strongly suggest saving up a bit more money and buying some better, entry-level strobes such as the Flashpoint series sold by Adorama.  In the long run, you will be MUCH farther ahead.


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## Derrel (Apr 21, 2018)

Well...the issue is mostly that low-cost continuous lights are dim...requiring ISO 400,500,or even 800, and slow shutter speeds for people pictures. For product photos, for-sale photos, or still-life and tabletop set-ups, continuous lights and small f/stops (like f/11 or f/16) and longer shutter times, like 1 to 6 seconds at lower ISO values like 100 to 200 are not a problem. YES, slooooow shutter speeds are VERY common with close-up photos made with low-powered lights, and using a tripod and the self-timer delay is the standard operating procedure. LONG shutter speeds, in the 1- to 6-second range, usually provide a sharp,crisp photo as long as good camera technique is used. Longer speed shots( like 1 to 6 seconds) are often better for sharpness than the _slow-but-instantaneous_ speeds in the 1/3 to 1/8 second range.

Anyway...I reallllllllllly prefer electronic flash with modeling lamps (low-proced studio type monolight flashes) for photos shot using light stands and light modifiers like softboxes or umbrellas. The modeling lights give you a preview of what the flash *Pop!* will do, and you can literally see to focus, see what the light is doing, see where the shadows fall. Adorama's Flashpoint-branded flashes are available in lower-cost "budget" models at around $49-$60 for the low-powered units. Something in the 100- to 150-Watt seconds of power, per flash is ample for most indoor, small-scale shooting scenarios.

Adorama's 320-type models cost more, but have user-replaceable flash tubes, so they start at around $99...and are the correct basic power level for most indoor beginning flash users. Powerful monolight flash units like 300 or 400 Watt seconds are not necessary for most uses.

You _could learn_ a good deal with a low-priced,continuous lighting kit, but I do not think it's really the "best" choice to start out with. Still...it's only $83...and it CAN do a lot.


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## mrca (Apr 22, 2018)

To put things into perspective for you, one of my rolling light stands cost $250.  Just the stand.  $83 for new lights, stands and modifiers?  One bit of advice important in photo gear, buy the quality  you need the first time or you will buy twice.  Those stands will last  my entire career and  make adjusting them and rolling them precisely into place a pleasure the whole time.


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## Derrel (Apr 22, 2018)

THIS looks to me to be the best all-around value in a low-cost yet capable monolight: Flashpoint Studio R2

Why? It has 300 Watt-second power at full output, plenty of power for use with a d-slr or mirrorless digital camera at today's ISO levels of 100 to 400. It uses the Bowens S-type accessory mount system, which is very popular. Price is $109. Modeling light and flashtube are both user-replaceable. Priced fairly for the power level...not $249,not $279, but rather $109. Has a BUILT-IN radio triggering receiver. Has a PC cord connection receptacle and an optically-triggered "slave" triggering system,so another camera's flash unit can be used to fire the flash, if desired.

I would add a $29, 9.5-foot tall light stand, and a 40-inch or so umbrella, and have a capable light, a light stand, and an umbrella. With that you'd have decent equipment that would allow you to do a lot of set-ups. One, decent light and a 40-inch umbrella can do a LOT of stuff! Ignore those who are constantly suggesting 60- and 72-inch umbrellas; believe me, that size of an umbrella is a PITA much of the time. To start off, keep the umbrella size in the 30- to 43-inch range!

Do not spend a lot of money on light modifiers until you really know what you want to buy. Stick to inexpensive to moderately-priced Made in China modifiers; there are lots of YouTube videos online, and you can watch those and see how various soft boxes and octaboxes perform.


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## lance70 (Apr 25, 2018)

I wouldn't recommend that purchase either.....are you set on continuous lighting? Asking because a good deal on a quality light would be a Flashpoint 320M, you can use a cheap umbrella at first and get a softbox or octabox down the line.


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## mangorockfish (Apr 25, 2018)

I know Derrel has recommended the 320Ms in the past and also has recommended the Flashpoint Studio R2.  I'm new to this so which would be the best to start out with?  Thanks


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## ronlane (Apr 25, 2018)

Derrel has pretty much wrapped it up for you there. I use the Flashpoint stuff and it is just fine to get you going. Looking at the new studio stuff, if you don't plan on having it outside, that would be a great way to go. The addition of the Bowen's mount, which the earlier stuff did not have, is great.


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## smoke665 (Apr 25, 2018)

mangorockfish said:


> off Ebay that has a couple of soft boxes some umbrellas, light stands and continuous lights.



Yes, I have. If you want to throw away $83, I'll send you my address so you can mail it to me, then I'll send you $30 back.  That way it won't be a complete loss for you, as you can go to Lowes and buy a reflector and LED flood light that will give you more light than you can get out of the CFL bulbs they use in them. 

I have both Alien Bees and Impact strobes. I can tell you that both do the job, but the ABs are built like tanks compared to the Impacts, plus the folks at Paul C. Buff, Inc. | Professional Photographic Lighting have customer service that is beyond good.


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## Derrel (Apr 25, 2018)

I think the new Flashpoint R2 300
is the better value over the 320M model. The R2 series uses the Bowens mount accessories, which is the better system.


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## texxter (Apr 25, 2018)

mangorockfish said:


> Has anyone ever bought one of the light sets off Ebay that has a couple of soft boxes some umbrellas, light stands and continuous lights.  All of this for like $83.  Are the boxes and umbrellas worth having?  Seems like the stands and bulbs would come to more than $83.  Just curious.



I assume you have to work with a limited budget and want to get good value for little money.   If you do have a larger budget, then it makes sense to spend more.   And I agree with the recommendation of going with electronic flash instead of continuous light because flash gives you more lumens per dollar, and they can be really small.  LED lights are coming as an alternative to traditional continuous lighting, but they are still expensive.  So flash is the way to go.

With a small amount of money it would be best to buy just ONE light with one modifier and one light stand.  It may seem limiting, but it really isn't if you're just starting out.   Instead of a strobe that requires AC or a big battery pack go with a portable off-camera flash.  Smaller flashes can be had for little money and they work really well.  You can buy one used for under $50, get an inexpensive stand and umbrella, together with a remote trigger, and you'll be in business.  The Strobist website  is a good resource, and you can find a gear guide there as well.  One huge advantage of flashes that fit in your pocket is portability and the ability to travel light while still having access to manufactured light.


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## fotodoug (Jul 10, 2018)

I've been a commercial photographer for roughly 45 years now...I'm retired, but still love to take photos.  I've owned hundreds of thousands of $ in equipment, but I still subscribe to the old cliche..."It's not the arrow, it's the Indian".  This portrait of an old friend was taken with less than $30 worth of Ikea lights...




...with a camera that cost less than $300.00.  Experiment, make your own soft boxes...if you have a decent camera, you don't need flash.  Avedon didn't start out with anything but imagination, and talent.  You can't buy a good game...it's the Indian!


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## mrca (Jul 13, 2018)

Fotodoug, I agree you can make great photos with just a camera.  If a photographer takes to time to learn to find good light.  However, first, that is limiting to places and situations where there is good light.  But I believe that is where a novice should start, first recognizing good or nearly good light.  Then learn to modify the nearly good light using things like inexpensive reflectors and scrims in conjunction with thing like window, doorway or under overhang light that starts with soft directional light.  This requires little if any investiment, some white cardboard or foam core, a $ 10 white  bed sheet from walmart,  a roll of gaffer tape or a clamps.   Then when the photographer sees the background that can't be used because there is no good or nearly good light to modify, get one light and learn how to use it in conjunction with the already  owned modifiers.   You are right, you can't buy a good game, but without lights and modifiers, you will be limited .   I can place my  subject in the middle of a foot ball field at high noon and produce a studio quality image.   Not so much  with a camera alone.  I can knock down  the over head light  with a scrim or translucent umbrella,  adjust shutter speed/ neutral density filter to set background density relative to my ultimate subject exposure, apply soft directional light with a battery powered strobe mounted to a moderate low wind ok octa and fill with a second stobe.  Can pick up a free kicker/ hair light moving the subject to the back of the overhead diffuser or a third light.   Or could build a black subtractive side, a translucent side and top and if needed, add a reflector front.   Either will look nothing what is available from a camera or a AC light from home depot that can't be used without an outlet.  For soft light, don't need to build a soft box.   Hang any diffusion material, a sheet, translucent shower curtain in front of your light.  It has the added benefit you can vary the distance between the diffusion material and light that can't be changed with a soft box.      I do that the rare times I want soft light out of a fresnel.  (skittish animals, some babies for no popping light or to change up the look without setting up strobes for a couple of shots).  You are absolutely right you can make wonderful photos with only a camera, and I believe that is a place to start, then add gear as the need arises.


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## fotodoug (Jul 13, 2018)

mrca said:


> Fotodoug, I agree you can make great photos with just a camera.  If a photographer takes to time to learn to find good light.  However, first, that is limiting to places and situations where there is good light.  But I believe that is where a novice should start, first recognizing good or nearly good light.  Then learn to modify the nearly good light using things like inexpensive reflectors and scrims in conjunction with thing like window, doorway or under overhang light that starts with soft directional light.  This requires little if any investiment, some white cardboard or foam core, a $ 10 white  bed sheet from walmart,  a roll of gaffer tape or a clamps.   Then when the photographer sees the background that can't be used because there is no good or nearly good light to modify, get one light and learn how to use it in conjunction with the already  owned modifiers.   You are right, you can't buy a good game, but without lights and modifiers, you will be limited .   I can place my  subject in the middle of a foot ball field at high noon and produce a studio quality image.   Not so much  with a camera alone.  I can knock down  the over head light  with a scrim or translucent umbrella,  adjust shutter speed/ neutral density filter to set background density relative to my ultimate subject exposure, apply soft directional light with a battery powered strobe mounted to a moderate low wind ok octa and fill with a second stobe.  Can pick up a free kicker/ hair light moving the subject to the back of the overhead diffuser or a third light.   Or could build a black subtractive side, a translucent side and top and if needed, add a reflector front.   Either will look nothing what is available from a camera or a AC light from home depot that can't be used without an outlet.  For soft light, don't need to build a soft box.   Hang any diffusion material, a sheet, translucent shower curtain in front of your light.  It has the added benefit you can vary the distance between the diffusion material and light that can't be changed with a soft box.      I do that the rare times I want soft light out of a fresnel.  (skittish animals, some babies for no popping light or to change up the look without setting up strobes for a couple of shots).  You are absolutely right you can make wonderful photos with only a camera, and I believe that is a place to start, then add gear as the need arises.


Yes, you can do all that...but if you want to be a lumberjack, you don't first buy a saw mill.  If you first learn how to see light, how to interpret what you see, and how to look for the places that kind of light exists, you learn what light is and why it is the only thing important in photography.  If you can make wonderful photos with existing light, it becomes easy to do it with anything else.  I don't think I am disagreeing with you...I just think that people get caught up in equipment and miss what photography is all about....................LIGHT!


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## mrca (Jul 13, 2018)

I think we agree completely.   That C word, camera, is nothing but a recorder, a LIGHT recorder.   When painters apprenticed with a master, they didn't start painting masterpieces, they started making paint,  the medium they worked in,   Photographers need to do the same.   And as your wonderful photo shows,  you don't need expensive gear to make great images.  As a matter of fact, none at all.  I think what misleads beginners is they hear all the manufacturers ads for the latest greatest one trick pony gimmick.    Also, they see folks like us using some specialized gear, sometimes in some unconventional ways and believe it is the gear  that makes the photo.  The gear makes the photo no more than the saw makes the furniture or the house.   Had a mentor that  when I got a few new lights hung them all for a shot out doors.  It was a good shot and expected kudos on a job well done.  Instead, he asked why I used lights. Just because I had them?  Then sent me down another path when he said,  you had a rare overcast day in your area, soft light.  Why didn't you subtract light on the shadow side  to get the desired contrast ratio, no lights need be hung or torn down, no battery packs.  Just a piece of black fabric or a tree trunk or dark wall.  With your experience, you can reach into a bag of tricks and have 3 or 4 ways to accomplish your vision, and if there with minimal or no gear, will usually get the shot.  It's not the  gear, it's the  person "making" the shot.  And for me, sometimes having to "adapt, improvise, over come" per Clint in Heart Break Ridge, is not only the challenge of location work but is really fun.


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