# old cameras as an investment?



## yellow ant (Feb 13, 2015)

Is it worth buying old cameras as an investment?

You can get them cheap at the moment, especially in auctions but is it only worth investing in the high end models and will it take to long for them to become valuable?


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## Buckster (Feb 13, 2015)

Other than pretty pricey cameras like Hassey's and Leicas and a few other collectibles, there's not much value in old cameras, which for the most part are dropping in value over time, not rising.  

Even for the ones that may rise over time, I'm not seeing them rise much nor very quickly.  I can't even say for sure that they'll keep pace with inflation, so if in 50 years you can get $1500 for something you buy for $1000 today, that $1500 may only be worth $900 in today's dollars.


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## Ysarex (Feb 13, 2015)

Yep, if you know which ones to buy. That's the tricky part. Rare is usually a good feature. For example this should increase in value:







And this should decrease in value:






Joe


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## photoguy99 (Feb 13, 2015)

Generally, no.

Even the ones that increase in value don't increase fast enough to keep up with a decent index fund. Generally.

Collectibles are all this way. High risk and low return. That's the opposite of an investment.


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## vintagesnaps (Feb 13, 2015)

I love old cameras, but most don't have much value. You'd probably have to do some research to find out what might be worth collecting (like Leica rangefinders).

I agree it seems to be that way with antiques and collectibles in general, value may or may not go up over time.


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## limr (Feb 13, 2015)

I think the only way you'd really make any money from the old cameras is if you learn how to restore and flip them. And yes, it depends on what you restore/collect. Some cameras will always carry a premium, but you have to know what they are.


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## TCampbell (Feb 13, 2015)

Joe, I think you're too harsh on that AE-1.  In a couple thousand years, a collector would pay quite a price for that AE-1.


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## photoguy99 (Feb 13, 2015)

Let's say you bought a Leica M3 setup in 1955 for about $500 (roughly what a camera and lens would have cost you then). If we assume a very conservative 5% interest rate over the next 60 years, until today, that camera needs to be worth almost $10,000 to make up with simply putting that money in a savings account, CDs, or some similar reasonable investment.

If you'd put it in the stock market and managed it carefully but conservatively, the camera needs to be worth nearly $30,000 to hold steady with the money.

And that's one of the very best choices you could have made in terms of investing in a collectible item.


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## Ysarex (Feb 13, 2015)

TCampbell said:


> Joe, I think you're too harsh on that AE-1.  In a couple thousand years, a collector would pay quite a price for that AE-1.



OK, but I think you'd need to start grinding up a few thousand a year starting right now so by then you could have raised up the "rarity" factor -- hmmm maybe a few thousand a month.

Joe


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## Overread (Feb 13, 2015)

Well if you bought new gear before the recession then most of the lenses went UP in value significantly so. I sold the 70-200mm f2.8 IS that I bought pre-recession for the same price I bought it for after (lenses were, in fact, one of the BEST things you could have bought).


As for old film stuff; eh some of it might well become very popular and valuable. Mass produced products oft fall out of favour really fast and get dumped/crushed/smashed up quick too. So what you end up with in a few generations is very little left. You can thus see a recovery of the market in the future for vintage and in the VERY distant future as well (just look at those old cars that are now collectables - even reliant robbins!)

The thing its is a gamble - you won't know what will and won't climb and what will and won't crash. You also don't have any idea when - it could be in 5 years - 50 years or 100 years. Now if you've got a spare room/garage/barn/lockup you could deck it out to store camera gear long term in good condition and "invest" into it. 

Just remember its going to be the kind of thing your kids will profit from if anyone will (most likely)


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## chuasam (Feb 13, 2015)

Just use them and take pictures like they were meant to do


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## runnah (Feb 13, 2015)

Depends, I mean I have an old A1 that was signed by George Washington which is worth quite a bit. Not as much as my old Nikon that was signed by Jesus.


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## chuasam (Feb 13, 2015)

That's nothing compare to the Leica I used to take a picture of Jesus and the Nikonos that Noah used on the Ark


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## dxqcanada (Feb 13, 2015)

limr said:


> I think the only way you'd really make any money from the old cameras is if you learn how to restore and flip them. And yes, it depends on what you restore/collect. Some cameras will always carry a premium, but you have to know what they are.



... and even then you still don't make much money ... take it from me, I know.


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## dxqcanada (Feb 13, 2015)

The only way to make money from vintage cameras is to get a hold of them from the source ... and you have to know (at the time) that it is worth something to somebody.


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## bribrius (Feb 13, 2015)

collect what you love.  If you make money eventually great. If you dont, no regrets.


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## limr (Feb 13, 2015)

dxqcanada said:


> limr said:
> 
> 
> > I think the only way you'd really make any money from the old cameras is if you learn how to restore and flip them. And yes, it depends on what you restore/collect. Some cameras will always carry a premium, but you have to know what they are.
> ...



I know, my boyfriend does this too.


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## bribrius (Feb 13, 2015)

Ysarex said:


> Yep, if you know which ones to buy. That's the tricky part. Rare is usually a good feature. For example this should increase in value:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i wouldn't be surprised if it was the other way round actually.]


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## Ysarex (Feb 14, 2015)

bribrius said:


> Ysarex said:
> 
> 
> > Yep, if you know which ones to buy. That's the tricky part. Rare is usually a good feature. For example this should increase in value:
> ...



I would be shocked.

The top camera is a 1956 Swedish Army special edition Leica III of which only 125 were made (extreme winterized version with ball-bearing shutter -- don't drool on your keyboard). One sold last year for $65,000.00. In 2009 a copy in like condition sold for $38,000.

A Canon AE-1 sells for under $50.00 at Goodwill: shopgoodwill.com - 19970123 - Canon AE-1 35mm SLR w 50mm f 1.8 Lens - 2 14 2015 6 02 00 PM

Joe


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## bribrius (Feb 14, 2015)

About the last thing i would do is buy a Leica for a investment.


Ysarex said:


> bribrius said:
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The leica will probably drop in value. The ae1 increase.


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## gsgary (Feb 14, 2015)

bribrius said:


> About the last thing i would do is buy a Leica for a investment.
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> 
> Ysarex said:
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Mine is worth 3 times what I paid for it


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## bribrius (Feb 14, 2015)

gsgary said:


> bribrius said:
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> > About the last thing i would do is buy a Leica for a investment.
> ...


It changes with generations. It is the generation that makes the prices. The younger up coming generation is about to discount your leica to no end. You should sell it now while the price is high.


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## gsgary (Feb 14, 2015)

bribrius said:


> gsgary said:
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> > bribrius said:
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No chance I have bought them for life and to use as much as possible


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## bribrius (Feb 14, 2015)

gsgary said:


> bribrius said:
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> > gsgary said:
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collecting is weird. we have a large amount of brass, candle holders, ship lanterns, baseball cards. Hang on to for personal reasons. My old man started getting into it about 40 years ago. The peak for baseball cards was about fifteen years ago i would guess. High higher dollar ones seem to be maintaing, dropping a little not keep up with inflation. The lower dollars drop lower. They hit there peak. 10k collections fifteen years ago are being sold for 3k now. Different generation. what keeps up the prices at all is the generations passing on now.  The ship lanterns and brass have kept along fine. But only amongst serious collectors. Who are becoming few and far between.  If he/we were just in it for the money, we would have dumped it all about fifteen years back during the peak..  couple generations from now it may come back, you never know. This generation coming up doesnt really give a ratz azz though. Which is why i wouldnt invest in a leica.


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## gsgary (Feb 14, 2015)

My friend has over 1000 cameras, every M Leica and every R Leica, loads of Nikons, most cameras you can think of


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## bribrius (Feb 14, 2015)

gsgary said:


> My friend has over 1000 cameras, every M Leica and every R Leica, loads of Nikons, most cameras you can think of


collecting what you love if fun. Putting the money aside.  I still love one of  the old mans ship lanterns he bought years back even though the value dropped from 4k to like 3k. He bought it for 500 bucks so whatever....


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## minicoop1985 (Feb 14, 2015)

Collection by longm1985, on Flickr

Here's my collection. I don't collect as an investment. I just collect what I like or has meaning to me.


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## bribrius (Feb 14, 2015)

minicoop1985 said:


> Collection by longm1985, on Flickr
> 
> Here's my collection. I don't collect as an investment. I just collect what I like or has meaning to me.


give you fifty cents...  sorry. i said prices have dropped and i am generation x so you know i don't give a .......


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## minicoop1985 (Feb 14, 2015)

That might buy you the Graflex Graphic 35 that doesn't work... lol


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## bribrius (Feb 14, 2015)

minicoop1985 said:


> That might buy you the Graflex Graphic 35 that doesn't work... lol


cool cameras.  just joshing ya.


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## snowbear (Feb 14, 2015)

It depends on the camera; like investing in old cars: you might get your money's worth out of a '67 Pontiac GTO, but probably not an '87 Plymouth Horizon.


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## Dave442 (Feb 17, 2015)

My '68 442 certainly gave me my money's worth, but I bought the car very cheap in '77 and sold it 30 years later with a lot of use during that time.  With decent digital having been around now for about ten years the market for old film cameras is probably still on the cheap side. In another fifty or so years some of that stuff you can pick up for under $100 today may have some value, or may be worthless. I found most old cameras, like old cars, are fun to collect, but a pain to use and maintain compared to their newer counterparts.


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## Authentic Southerner (Feb 18, 2015)

For what it is worth I will share my point of view... take it with a grain or maybe a shaker of salt !

I have had a few hobbies over the years... guns, motorcycles, vintage stereo equipment, cameras, etc etc...

This is how I have always looked at it.  If I can find a gun/motorcycle/piece of stereo equipment/camera that I can use and enjoy and more likely than not sell a few years later for the same or more, then I have had a very good day....and like most things, buying high and selling low is never a good idea... So if you can somehow buy something you can use and enjoy before it gets hot with the mainstream and sell it at the top of popularity then you are on the right side of the money..

My goal has always been to buy low before something catches on and/or when prices are low....enjoy the hell out of the item and if/when I sell, hope I can at least get my money back...

I can't afford to buy Leica... but there are obscure well thought of cameras/glass out there that may not appreciate in value, but will at least hold their value...personally I think the Minolta CLE is an example of that sort of camera although prices have been moving up for quite awhile now...  

Investment grade gear scares me.... you are almost afraid to use it.... I can buy a Browning Superposed shotgun, hunt with it and shoot it and more likely than not get my money and some back in a few years...If you buy a matched pair of Purdey SxS shotguns in 99% condition, it is probably a bad idea to be out dove hunting with them !  just my two cents


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## photoguy99 (Feb 18, 2015)

None of this stuff will keep up with the S&P500 in their best years, and most of this stuff will do a LOT worse.

If you're going to be accepting that much risk, you gotta see some decent returns on the high end, and NONE of this stuff, not even the rarest and most precious Leica, Ford GT, Ferrari Whatevertheheck, NONE of it, will beat the S&P500.

That makes it a terrible investment. As something to buy and enjoy? Great. Do that. Don't expect to retire on it.


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## bhop (Feb 20, 2015)

I bought my M6 for around 1100 bucks a few years ago.  I think I can sell it for around 1500 now.  Baller status!


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## chuasam (Feb 21, 2015)

gsgary said:


> My friend has over 1000 cameras, every M Leica and every R Leica, loads of Nikons, most cameras you can think of


Does he take many pictures?


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## gsgary (Feb 22, 2015)

chuasam said:


> gsgary said:
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> > My friend has over 1000 cameras, every M Leica and every R Leica, loads of Nikons, most cameras you can think of
> ...


Yes, nearly every day


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