# Getting Photo Passes to Concerts.



## Stephen.C

Well, I'm looking into getting a more commercial portfolio together, and I plan to shoot some concerts with media passes.
I called a general venue producer ( live nation ) and he said that for that particular company they do not do passes, the band's press do the photo passes. 
So, I emailed a few band's press people..Heres what I wrote.

"Hello,
My names Stephen Cameron.
I'm emailing about acquiring a Photographer's Pass to your show at the House Of Blues in Boston Feb 19th. 
I'm a Junior in Highschool, but very avid on photography and plan on going to a photography college. I am trying to build a more commercial portfolio. 
I am not affiliated with any company, but I am thinking about selling to stock photograph sites.
I am willing to give Matador Records a percentage of the profit, If I do sell any.
I'd greatly appreciate it if you could email me back, or call me at ###-###-####.
Thank you for your time.
Stephen Cameron"

What do you think? Any tips, advice, critique are extremely welcome. 
Anything to get my foot in the door.
Thanks!


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## Rekd

It never hurts to ask. I wouldn't expect too much though. You'd be better off talking to some buddies at school that are in a band and tag along with them at practice. It won't be anything like a club, especially lighting, but you may be able to put a small portfolio together and work with that. 

Not having a portfolio is a killer. Not being able to get any gigs without a portfolio is a killer. It's a vicious circle but you can't really get anything unless you have something, if you know what I mean. Unless you can find another angle.

And I'm not sure I'd send that letter. Tone it down on the charity a bit and find something to offer them instead of a measly pittance from a stock site. (Think poster sized print of each member or...) 

One more thing: Are there age limits at this venue you're trying to get into?


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## MSnowy

Let them know that your covering different events in the Boston area and you would like the opportunity to get some pictures at their up coming show. You could also let them know that you will be using photos from these shoots to build a porfolio to get into photography school. I'd leave out the selling part completely.


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## Stephen.C

Thank you both very much.

Redk, I like your idea about the prints, but I feel like it would be a huge hassle to ship, and also price wise, it would cost more to do that than to buy tickets in the first place. 
Also, I checked, and there isn't an age requirement for the shows I asked about. 

Also a good idea MSnowy. The selling part was a decision for me, I dont feel like they'll get excited / offended by it, but I feel the need to offer them something because they probably won't get any publicity from my shots. 
I'll def tweak it some more, I'm not really in a major hurry, so Trial and Error will be good. A friend told me that alot of kids shoot at this one venue in Boston, bummer is that its outdoors, so they wont be open until May.

Thanks Again!


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## CCericola

Unfortunately if they do let you shoot you will not be able to sell any of the pictures. The record company holds all the likeness rights to their artists and will prosecute you.


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## Destin

Dude, don't bother selling the photos. Just use them for your port and let it be. They are much more willing to let you shoot if, like stated above, you leave that part out. 

Tell them you need to build a portfolio to get into school (already stated). 

Instead of poster sized prints, how bout you just offer to email them high res copies of some of the better shots. Yeah, I know giving away image files is taboo around here, but when you can't sell them anyway it doesn't really matter. This way it doesn't cost you anything out of pocket, and they still get photos.


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## Stephen.C

Can't sell them? Oh well, didn't plan on it anyways...
I like your Idea Destin. I'd probably do that.

I was told to contact some no name bands, and just get some shots of people no one has heard of to start. 
Not a bad idea, Ill still try to get the big names too though. 

Thanks guys.


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## Destin

Stephen.C said:


> Can't sell them? Oh well, didn't plan on it anyways...
> I like your Idea Destin. I'd probably do that.
> 
> I was told to contact some no name bands, and just get some shots of people no one has heard of to start.
> Not a bad idea, Ill still try to get the big names too though.
> 
> Thanks guys.



One other thing that you might wanna try is looking into Big name Christian bands coming to your area. 

I have gotten access to shoot two of the biggest Christian artists in the world (toby mac, and skillet). Photos are on my site here The security at Christian concerts isn't generally as tight, and they are more willing to give young photogs like us a shot.


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## Formatted

> Dude, don't bother selling the photos



Ye don't sell them, give them free to newspapers and magazines and get your name out.


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## Rekd

> I am not affiliated with any company, but I am thinking about selling to stock photograph sites.





Stephen.C said:


> Can't sell them? Oh well, didn't plan on it anyways....



Contradict much? :er:


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## orljustin

Stephen.C said:


> "Hello,
> My names Stephen Cameron.
> I'm emailing about acquiring a Photographer's Pass to your show at the House Of Blues in Boston Feb 19th.
> I'm a Junior in Highschool, but very avid on photography and plan on going to a photography college. I am trying to build a more commercial portfolio.
> I am not affiliated with any company, but I am thinking about selling to stock photograph sites.
> I am willing to give Matador Records a percentage of the profit, If I do sell any.
> I'd greatly appreciate it if you could email me back, or call me at ###-###-####.
> Thank you for your time.
> Stephen Cameron"
> 
> What do you think?



I'd suggest writing like a grown up.

"Greetings,

My name is Stephen Cameron, and I am writing to inquire about the possibility of acquiring a Photographer's Pass for the upcoming show by _____ at House of Blues/Boston on February 19th.

Currently, I am a junior in high school, but I have great plans for my photography career.  I have experience photographing high school events such as Band Nite 2010 and Junior Prom 2010.  Shooting your act's show would allow me to gain some experience in concert photography that would likely prove invaluable.

I do not plan on licensing the resulting images, but do plan on including them in my portfolio.  As I would hold copyright as the photographer, I would certainly be interested in discussing licensing the images to you, if you find them usable.

Thank you for your consideration.

Stephen Whatever"


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## Stephen.C

Rekd said:


> I am not affiliated with any company, but I am thinking about selling to stock photograph sites.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stephen.C said:
> 
> 
> 
> Can't sell them? Oh well, didn't plan on it anyways....
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Contradict much? :er:
Click to expand...


Haha yeah...sorry about that. I dont feel like trying stock photography out, but thought i'd maybe.  

Thanks for the tips.


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## gsgary

Tell them one of your assignments at college is live performance, works most times


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## Formatted

> Tell them one of your assignments at college is live performance, works most times



I thought you would be anti-this, I'm disappointed!


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## Stephen.C

Haha, I dont want to lie too much, because what if I have to fill out forms? 
Don't want to get into trouble for something dumb like that.


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## KmH

CCericola said:


> Unfortunately if they do let you shoot you will not be able to sell any of the pictures. The record company holds all the likeness rights to their artists and will prosecute you.


Likeness rights?

Do you mean Right of Publicity?

I believe that would be owned by the individual, not a recording company.

Right of Publicity is state law, not Federal law like copyright is, so there are 50 different versions.


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## Stephen.C

I'm not going to sell them, I'll use for portfolio and give the band / artist the files. Its my way of saying Thanks =) 

I revised what I wrote, its a little more formal.
I have sent emails to 
-Interpol
-Bright Eyes 
-Queens of the stone age
Yesterday, and have not gotten a reply yet. They would all be playing at the house of blues in boston.

Today, I sent two emails, One to the oprehem threate regarding a Christian rock band ( Hillsong Uprising ) that is coming.
Second is to a Jazz Club that has live music.

Im okay with shooting unknowns, because its the image not the person...Anything to get me familiar, and get my foot in the door.


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## jaymitch

Hey Stephen, I have shot several bands.  Most of which I have gained access by simply writing their manager and asking for a photo pass.  I told them it was for portfolio purposes as well and in most cases it was.  Just remember your not always going to get a yes but keep trying and be professional when your there....it will pay off.  I have been asked to shoot bands because of the way I handled myself on previous occasions.  
Always offer to send the band or their managers copies of the pics at no charge.  Things like that go a long way.


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## Rekd

jaymitch said:


> Hey Stephen, I have shot several bands. Most of which I have gained access by simply writing their manager and asking for a photo pass. I told them it was for portfolio purposes as well and in most cases it was.



Were these top bands or garage bands? Because the managers of the bigger bands won't let you in for "a portfolio". 

The name-bands I've shot are Rob Zombie, Korn, Hatebreed, Lamb of God and N.E.R.D.S. and I only got in because I was credentialed with other things at the venues.


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## jaymitch

Rekd said:


> jaymitch said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Stephen, I have shot several bands.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Were these top bands or garage bands? Because the managers of the bigger bands won't let you in for "a portfolio".
> 
> The name-bands I've shot are Rob Zombie, Korn, Hatebreed, Lamb of God and N.E.R.D.S. and I only got in because I was credentialed with other things at the venues.
Click to expand...


The vast majority were at the time unknown bands and more localized groups.  Your right on with the bigger bands though...it is a lot harder to get them to allow you in unless you are somebody.
When I first started shooting bands I was doing photo work for a really small skate mag that had a music section.  It took a lot of work on my part but it got my foot in the door with some managers and bands.

I've shot..Kid Rock, Static_X, The Roots, John Legend, Alicia Keys and Powerman 5000(Rob Zombie's little Bro)

The Powerman show actually got me the chance to shoot StaticX.  A bunch of really good guys.

HAve you done any recently?  Its been awhile since I shot my last band.  I miss it though, it really is a good time.


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## kasperjd4

^ Ahh man that would be amazing to shoot Static-x. They were my favorite childhood band!!

I actually have my first concert shoot tomorrow. I work freelance for a magazine who is covering it, so I just called the promoter and told them I was with this magazine and we'd like to cover your show, can I have a press pass please. They contacted the band for me and I got a press pass and a +1. It was easy and everyone has been amazingly helpful and nice. Just be professional. 

Also, my editor told me it was a good idea to get a conformation e-mail along with a cell phone number of someone who is in charge and will be there. Just in-case there is any trouble with the bouncers at the door. That way you can show them the e-mail saying you are supposed to be shooting there, and if that doesn't work you can call one of the head people inside and they can come walk you in. 

I think it's pretty obvious you wont get into a big band name show saying you're working on your portfolio. Start small, work your way up, it's all about making contacts and good relationships with the people you work with.


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## Formatted

> I'm not going to sell them, I'll use for portfolio and give the band / artist the files. Its my way of saying Thanks =)



lol...


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## Village Idiot

Rekd said:


> jaymitch said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Stephen, I have shot several bands. Most of which I have gained access by simply writing their manager and asking for a photo pass. I told them it was for portfolio purposes as well and in most cases it was.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Were these top bands or garage bands? Because the managers of the bigger bands won't let you in for "a portfolio".
> 
> The name-bands I've shot are Rob Zombie, Korn, Hatebreed, Lamb of God and N.E.R.D.S. and I only got in because I was credentialed with other things at the venues.
Click to expand...

 
Which is even harder when there's no local music publications.


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## Cinka

Stephen, I can give you two examples: 

Me: 
I ran an online music magazine for 10 years. Getting into gigs was tough even when the magazine was doing well. It meant tracking down the band managers, booking agents, and venues. It always felt like a wild goose hunt. I got into some great shows and it was awesome, but NEVER had the opportunity to sell or publish my images. It was too much work for no money. 

My awesome friend Mike: 
Works for a music themed clothing retailer, has access to lots of bands. He started showing up to small gigs where they didn't care if you took photos and gave images to the bands for free. Over a year, he showed up to any gig he could, continued giving bands free photos and submitted them to local papers - again for free. From what I understand, he's still not making a lot of money, but does occasionally make a little doing band promos and once in a while the local paper sends him out. He's gotten his name out there and is now invited to more shows. He's putting in 110%. He now runs an online music magazine which gives him a little more clout when talking to bands and managers and a "reason" for wanting to shoot the concert. Not just cause it would be fun, the images will actually be used for something. Again, no money. 

Problem with concert photography is saturation. There's about 1000 guys and girls clamoring for the same gigs. NO ONE buys concert photos and the ones you see in Rolling Stone are done by staff photographers. Build your port, kick ass, do a lot of free work, try to get hired by a magazine or local events paper. You have to really want it.

Concert photography is awesome, but it doesn't pay unless you're working for a newspaper or magazine. - AND THEN...they send you out to shows THEY want to cover...not necessarily the ones you want to see.


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## KmH

Cinka said:


> My awesome friend Mike:
> ... Over a year, he showed up to any gig he could, continued giving bands free photos and submitted them to local papers - again for free. From what I understand, he's still not making a lot of money,....


Gee, I wonder why he's not making a lot of money? :er:


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## Stephen.C

This money thing keeps coming up so much! 
I really am not doing it for the money at all. 
I would like to build a portfolio, and have some fun. 
If you check out my flickr is mostly macro and some bmx or skating photos, a few landscapes too. 
What is really lacking, mostly because I dont have the subjects, is the people photos.
I need to get on that! 
BTW go go new forum!! its so awesome =D I like to like!


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## 90c4

Don't offer to give your work away for nothing.  Once you do that, you can't go up.  And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass.  Shoot a small band at a club that doesn't care.  There are only so many passes available for a given show and all a publicist cares about his how many eyeballs will be seeing your images, not helping someone they've never met with his portfolio.  I see you're in Boston - I shot two bands last night, George Clinton at House of Blues and Akron/Family at the Brighton Music Hall.  There were several people at the second show with cameras and although I was on the list there, I don't think anybody would have cared if I wasn't.  Build your portfolio with shows like that.  Big name artists aren't impressive in a portfolio - excellent shots are.


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## Rekd

90c4 said:


> And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass.


 
Wait, _what_? 

Are you his mom? :meh:


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## Stephen.C

I appreciate your tips some of them are def helpful, but did comr across in parts of it as a "pro" who doesnt want any competition. 
I'm asking for a photo pass to get photos just like someone on an assaignment.


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## e.rose

90c4 said:


> And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass.



I understand and appreciate the thought that passes aren't just handed out willy-nilly, especially to someone with no media connections... but to say one *shouldn't* be asking is silly.

Why not?

Because someone will *probably* say no?

But "probably" isn't the same as "definitely"... and there's always the chance that someone might say *yes*....

You better believe if a show comes to town that I wanna shoot... I'm gonna ask for a press pass.

If they say "yes", I'll be damn glad I asked... and if they say "no"... no harm, no foul.  My life isn't over.  I'll move onto the next thing.


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## Stephen.C

Yep, thats how i feel e.rose.
Also, when do the bands / venues usually respond to an email?
Thanks


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## RauschPhotography

To be completely honest, I wouldn't expect a response. Why? You're not a contact of the bands, the manager, or the label. Not to mention you said that you're in high school (No offense.. they'll think amateur just from that line.) Also, look at the artists you've been trying to reach.. Interpol? Queens of the Stone Age? Chances are they already have a hired photographer for their shows. I've done band photography for quite a while now, and it's because of the contacts I've had. Luckily, I had known the publicists and owners of a few labels, and have had the chance to meet the bands that I had shot before. A lot of the time, I'd show up for the show early, help set up, shoot during the show, and take over merch if they needed afterward. I've had some really great opportunities, but none of them would be possible without connections with the label and higher ups. 

It's not going to come easy, but you'll probably want to work on your connections if you plan on getting a photo pass while not on assignment.


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## e.rose

Stephen.C said:


> Also, when do the bands / venues usually respond to an email?


 
I would say, whenever they damn well please.  :lmao:  Some probably won't even respond at all.


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## Stephen.C

Yeah I see, and understand that


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## 90c4

If you don't have a reason to be in the photo pit, you shouldn't be there.  You'll just be in the way of other people trying to do their job.



e.rose said:


> 90c4 said:
> 
> 
> 
> And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I understand and appreciate the thought that passes aren't just handed out willy-nilly, especially to someone with no media connections... but to say one *shouldn't* be asking is silly.
> 
> Why not?
> 
> Because someone will *probably* say no?
> 
> But "probably" isn't the same as "definitely"... and there's always the chance that someone might say *yes*....
> 
> You better believe if a show comes to town that I wanna shoot... I'm gonna ask for a press pass.
> 
> If they say "yes", I'll be damn glad I asked... and if they say "no"... no harm, no foul.  My life isn't over.  I'll move onto the next thing.
Click to expand...


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## e.rose

90c4 said:


> If you don't have a reason to be in the photo pit, you shouldn't be there.  You'll just be in the way of other people trying to do their job.
> 
> 
> 
> e.rose said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 90c4 said:
> 
> 
> 
> And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I understand and appreciate the thought that passes aren't just handed out willy-nilly, especially to someone with no media connections... but to say one *shouldn't* be asking is silly.
> 
> Why not?
> 
> Because someone will *probably* say no?
> 
> But "probably" isn't the same as "definitely"... and there's always the chance that someone might say *yes*....
> 
> You better believe if a show comes to town that I wanna shoot... I'm gonna ask for a press pass.
> 
> If they say "yes", I'll be damn glad I asked... and if they say "no"... no harm, no foul.  My life isn't over.  I'll move onto the next thing.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

 
I would say if you were granted a photo pass by the "powers that be"... then you have a very valid reason to be in the photo pit.    I'm not going to be in the way of those other people "doing their job" any more than I would be had I been assigned by a small music blog to shoot the show.  A body is a body, whether it's someone shooting for their portfolio, or someone shooting on an assignment.  Furthermore, if I was a photographer assigned to shoot a show for a publication, I would be much more concerned with getting good images than I would be with the reason that the other photographers are there.

Like I said... if by the grace of God I ever get granted a press pass, whether or not I'm working for a publication, I'm going to take it.  If the "powers that be" saw fit to give me one... no other photographer is going to convince me of why I "shouldn't" be there.  While they're busy fuming over the fact that a non-credentialed photographer is shooting the show to build their portfolio, I'll be busy getting shots, not worrying about the fact that they're pissed that I'm there.

I ain't scurred...


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## RauschPhotography

e.rose said:


> 90c4 said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you don't have a reason to be in the photo pit, you shouldn't be there.  You'll just be in the way of other people trying to do their job.
> 
> 
> 
> e.rose said:
> 
> 
> 
> I understand and appreciate the thought that passes aren't just handed out willy-nilly, especially to someone with no media connections... but to say one *shouldn't* be asking is silly.
> 
> Why not?
> 
> Because someone will *probably* say no?
> 
> But "probably" isn't the same as "definitely"... and there's always the chance that someone might say *yes*....
> 
> You better believe if a show comes to town that I wanna shoot... I'm gonna ask for a press pass.
> 
> If they say "yes", I'll be damn glad I asked... and if they say "no"... no harm, no foul.  My life isn't over.  I'll move onto the next thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I would say if you were granted a photo pass by the "powers that be"... then you have a very valid reason to be in the photo pit.    I'm not going to be in the way of those other people "doing their job" any more than I would be had I been assigned by a small music blog to shoot the show.  A body is a body, whether it's someone shooting for their portfolio, or someone shooting on an assignment.  Furthermore, if I was a photographer assigned to shoot a show for a publication, I would be much more concerned with getting good images than I would be with the reason that the other photographers are there.
> 
> Like I said... if by the grace of God I ever get granted a press pass, whether or not I'm working for a publication, I'm going to take it.  If the "powers that be" saw fit to give me one... no other photographer is going to convince me of why I "shouldn't" be there.  While they're busy fuming over the fact that a non-credentialed photographer is shooting the show to build their portfolio, I'll be busy getting shots, not worrying about the fact that they're pissed that I'm there.
> 
> I ain't scurred...
Click to expand...

 
Even though you may not hear back, it doesn't hurt to try. Who knows? Could be an awesome experience, should they allow you to.


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## kasperjd4

90c4 said:


> And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass.


 
For my magazine, unless the Editor has already set everything up for me, she just tells me what I'm covering and gives me the promoter's # and I contact the promoter/venue to get the press pass and set up the shoot. It's not as simple as them telling me to do something and me just go do it.

To Stephen.C: 

Try calling the Promoters instead of e-mailing. Maybe a week before the show, if you can find the # for the promoters. Give them a call and talk, tell them what you're doing, be professional and just ask. That way you might know right away instead of sitting around waiting for e-mails.


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## Formatted

> Because someone will *probably* say no


 
Whilst I appreciate what your trying to say about "if you don't ask you don't get" which is completely true. But in this case he shouldn't ask. It really depends on what kind of band you are trying to photograph but if your not there to do a job then your not going to get in its a simple as that.


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## Destin

Formatted said:


> Because someone will *probably* say no
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whilst I appreciate what your trying to say about "if you don't ask you don't get" which is completely true. But in this case he shouldn't ask. It really depends on what kind of band you are trying to photograph but if your not there to do a job then your not going to get in its a simple as that.
Click to expand...

 
I'm calling bull. You never know. There is always a chance that you can get in. 

For example: I just sent an email out to the second biggest Christian music festival in the country, called Kingdombound, asking for a photo pass. Said pass would get me into over 30 concerts, with some of the biggest names in Christian music (Toby Mac, Skillet, Thousand Foot Krutch, Casting Crowns, The newsboys, jeremy camp just to name a few). I offered up a cd of all the photos from the week in exchange for a photo pass. They just told me that I have a decent chance of getting one, and they will let me know for sure in a few weeks (the festival isn't until June). I asked, and figured it was a one in a million chance. But now they are heavily considering it. You NEVER know what they will say, and if you can get in to build your port, then go for it. It never hurts to ask!


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## Rekd

Destin said:


> Formatted said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Because someone will *probably* say no
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Whilst I appreciate what your trying to say about "if you don't ask you don't get" which is completely true. But in this case he shouldn't ask. It really depends on what kind of band you are trying to photograph but if your not there to do a job then your not going to get in its a simple as that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I'm calling bull. You never know. There is always a chance that you can get in.
> 
> For example: I just sent an email out to the second biggest Christian music festival in the country, called Kingdombound, asking for a photo pass. Said pass would get me into over 30 concerts, with some of the biggest names in Christian music (Toby Mac, Skillet, Thousand Foot Krutch, Casting Crowns, The newsboys, jeremy camp just to name a few). I offered up a cd of all the photos from the week in exchange for a photo pass. They just told me that I have a decent chance of getting one, and they will let me know for sure in a few weeks (the festival isn't until June). I asked, and figured it was a one in a million chance. But now they are heavily considering it. You NEVER know what they will say, and if you can get in to build your port, then go for it. It never hurts to ask!
Click to expand...

 
Sweet! Be sure to post back some shots here!


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## 90c4

Sure, if you ask enough for anything you might get what you're looking for.  You can also ask for a free ticket every time you go to the movies, and maybe they'll eventually give you one.  But you should really think twice before offering up your work in exchange for a pass.  Aside from it showing your not a professional, it hurts all professional photographers.  Once you start giving your work away for nothing you can't easily start charging.  Even if you CAN get a pass, if you don't have a purpose to be there you shouldn't be there.  It's like going to a food pantry if you're making six figures.  Sure, they'll give you free food if you ask for it, but there's only so many spots available and if you don't have a reason to be there, you shouldn't be there.  I shot 7 bands since Wednesday and 3 of them didn't require a pass, although I had one.  Why not start shooting bands that don't require media credentials?  Publicists can't stand getting calls and emails from people who aren't on assignment.


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## Stephen.C

You're from MA, where are some places that dont need you to have passes?

Also, got a respond from the jazz club I emailed, they don't allow photographers due to the clubs small size, therefore the photographer would be in the way of someone's view. 
She was very nice responding though, and I appreciate it.

Also, you keep mentioning money. I do not plan to make money off of concerts. I know a "pro who" used to shoot concerts, and he never made any money off of it, and told me that its incredibly difficult to make money from it. I am making a portfolio, not a living.


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## 90c4

Almost any small club.  Brighton Music Hall, Great Scott, Johnny D's, etc.  A lot of people bring their cameras, whether they are permitted to or not.  I mention money because when you give your work away for nothing you are taking money from a professional photographer's pocket.  Your friend didn't make any money at concert photography because he wasn't delivering the shots people were willing to pay for was giving his work away for nothing.  I shot a number of festivals last summer as media and own copyright to my work.  One of the festivals had 30 photographers, all just volunteers.  Afterward, they realized that you get what you pay for and the volunteers' photos weren't usable, so they HIRED me to shoot next year.  Another festival liked my shots more than their hired photographer's shots, so they LICENSED mine and HIRED me to cover next year's too.  This isn't big money, but right there it's 5 figures between the licensing and next year's gigs. See this chart here before thinking about working for nothing: http://www.aphotoeditor.com/2011/01/12/thinking-of-working-for-free


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## bigtwinky

Read through parts of the suggestions and they all seem good.  Maybe this was said before, but here are my thoughts:
- definately do not sell these images and don't mention that you will.  You are building a portfolio.  Thats all you are doing.

- until you can get a decent portfolio going, I'd suggest offering them the images for their use, as long as they are ok with you keeping them for your portfolio

- you have to have some work to show if you go after the medium or bigger name bands.  Most band publicists get a bunch of requests and only give out a few passes.  No name local gigs will usually let you shoot.  Hell, I usually pay my $10 ticket and they have no issues with me taking images.  I then send the band a link to the images and allow them to use the watermarked images for facebook or other social media.   Check out small venues to see their up and coming shows, contact these small bands (can usually be found via facebook or myspace) and offer 5 free shots from the show with the right to shoot the show.  Build local relationships.  Arcade Fire is a huge band now, but they started really small locally here in Montreal.  I did some shots for the members of Hollerado and a month later, they are nominated for best new artists at the canadian juno awards (same as grammies here).

- keep in mind that this is a business.  So make your salespitch to them while being in their shoes.  What will this give the band.  They want to know where the images will be seen, thats what publicity is all about.  Unless you come on to a kind soul, it will be a hard sell.  So sometimes, just getting the backing of your school paper will help.  Or...do what I did and research online magazines in your area that would do some reporting on concerts.  Chat with them and see if you can drop their name as to where the images will be seen.  Quoting how many hits a month the sites get is a great idea, gives the publicist an idea of scope.

- touching on the above point, do you have any contacts?  Networking is huge in this business.  Friends of friends.  Parents of friends...  

- never mention (not that you did, just saying) that you are a fan of the band and would love to take images of them.  Publicists will say that if you are a fan, buy a ticket.

- most bands and shows do a 3 songs and out.  They might kick you out after 1.  Or after 15 mins.  Know this.  Sometimes saying that you are fine with a 3 song and out will show you know a bit of the business.  And FYI, some will kick you out after 3 songs, some won't allow you to shoot from the pit but ok from the venue.

- know how to act when shooting a show from the pit.  Dont block the view of the fans, they are paying for tickets.  You are shooting for the band and for them, not for you (well, you are shooting for you, but if you piss anyone off, you ain't coming back).  Know how to act with other photographers in the area.

So to sum up.... get some starter portfolio shots with no name bands.  
Once you have some work to show, get a small web page together with your best shots
Approach the band's management with the "what will I give them" idea in mind
Know how to act, be professional, get ready for alot of rejection


And photopasses are for those who get them.  Not for just anyone.  But those who get them need to be ok to give something back.  This whole "you should shoot for a publication to get them" is BS.  If someone can get them without having a publication, it means that either they have something to offer the band (or they have good contacts).

I shot a pro soccer game last year.  Had a great time.  My in?  The local school board.  I had done some event shooting for them a few times and they were giving some awards to kids at half time.  They asked me to shoot (for free) the giving of the awards.  I said sure, but I want a pass to shoot the whole game.  They got me that, it was paiement enough.


----------



## Rekd

bigtwinky said:


> Read through parts of the suggestions and they all seem good.  Maybe this was said before, but here are my thoughts:
> - definately do not sell these images and don't mention that you will.  You are building a portfolio.  Thats all you are doing.
> 
> - until you can get a decent portfolio going, I'd suggest offering them the images for their use, as long as they are ok with you keeping them for your portfolio
> 
> - you have to have some work to show if you go after the medium or bigger name bands.  Most band publicists get a bunch of requests and only give out a few passes.  No name local gigs will usually let you shoot.  Hell, I usually pay my $10 ticket and they have no issues with me taking images.  I then send the band a link to the images and allow them to use the watermarked images for facebook or other social media.   Check out small venues to see their up and coming shows, contact these small bands (can usually be found via facebook or myspace) and offer 5 free shots from the show with the right to shoot the show.  Build local relationships.  Arcade Fire is a huge band now, but they started really small locally here in Montreal.  I did some shots for the members of Hollerado and a month later, they are nominated for best new artists at the canadian juno awards (same as grammies here).
> 
> - keep in mind that this is a business.  So make your salespitch to them while being in their shoes.  What will this give the band.  They want to know where the images will be seen, thats what publicity is all about.  Unless you come on to a kind soul, it will be a hard sell.  So sometimes, just getting the backing of your school paper will help.  Or...do what I did and research online magazines in your area that would do some reporting on concerts.  Chat with them and see if you can drop their name as to where the images will be seen.  Quoting how many hits a month the sites get is a great idea, gives the publicist an idea of scope.
> 
> - touching on the above point, do you have any contacts?  Networking is huge in this business.  Friends of friends.  Parents of friends...
> 
> - never mention (not that you did, just saying) that you are a fan of the band and would love to take images of them.  Publicists will say that if you are a fan, buy a ticket.
> 
> - most bands and shows do a 3 songs and out.  They might kick you out after 1.  Or after 15 mins.  Know this.  Sometimes saying that you are fine with a 3 song and out will show you know a bit of the business.  And FYI, some will kick you out after 3 songs, some won't allow you to shoot from the pit but ok from the venue.
> 
> - know how to act when shooting a show from the pit.  Dont block the view of the fans, they are paying for tickets.  You are shooting for the band and for them, not for you (well, you are shooting for you, but if you piss anyone off, you ain't coming back).  Know how to act with other photographers in the area.
> 
> So to sum up.... get some starter portfolio shots with no name bands.
> Once you have some work to show, get a small web page together with your best shots
> Approach the band's management with the "what will I give them" idea in mind
> Know how to act, be professional, get ready for alot of rejection
> 
> 
> And photopasses are for those who get them.  Not for just anyone.  But those who get them need to be ok to give something back.  This whole "you should shoot for a publication to get them" is BS.  If someone can get them without having a publication, it means that either they have something to offer the band (or they have good contacts).
> 
> I shot a pro soccer game last year.  Had a great time.  My in?  The local school board.  I had done some event shooting for them a few times and they were giving some awards to kids at half time.  They asked me to shoot (for free) the giving of the awards.  I said sure, but I want a pass to shoot the whole game.  They got me that, it was paiement enough.


 
Excellent post. Lots of very good advice.


----------



## bigtwinky

Why thank you.

Most of it actually comes from reading stuff online.  Blogs, videos.... and when you think about it, alot is just coming sense.


----------



## Rekd

Yes, it is a lot of common sense, and you can find it by simply reading it elsewhere. But you put it all together in a nice tidy package.


----------



## vfotog

I think that some of the advice may be good for many people, but not the OP. Reread what he's written. I think most of this information isn't tailored to a very inexperienced high school kid. Stephen, you say you want to put together a commercial portfolio. Portfolios represent your best work. and the KIND of work you do. Do you have an interest in a specific area of photography yet? What do you excel in? That's what should be in your portfolio. A product photographer shouldn't have wedding photos in their port, a fashion fotog wouldn't show concert stuff, etc. Is music photography your career goal? Otherwise, it won't really add anything of much value to your portfolio. Since you say you don't expect to do it for money, perhaps you should concentrate on what you do anticipate earning some income on. Cos if you don't plan on making a living, if it's just a fun hobby, you sure don't even need a portfolio. 

Concert photography isn't the same skill set as a product photography or portrait photography, etc. It's not easy. You have to deal with a moving subject, crazy and ever-changing lighting, and a loud and not always pleasant environment.  It's not reasonable to expect a space in the pit of a name band so you can learn on the job. If you want to shoot performances, start shooting and learn before you manage to alienate people. The business just isn't that big that you won't get the reputation of being the annoying high school kid. Your school must have concerts and plays; shoot those. It's high school. There have to be kids in bands; offer to shoot them. See if you even enjoy it or whether it's even suited to your strengths as a photographer. A lot of people aren't adept at it no matter how much they love music. Or photography. 

There's no point in trying to start at the top. You'll gain more skill and respect by learning first and understanding how things work. You say you're a junior in HIGH SCHOOL. There are age restrictions for even being in a lot of clubs. Have you done the research on the business side of all of this? What do you do if the group or the promoter or the club hands you a piece of paper and wants you to sign it? If it's a rights grab or some other contract, will you understand it? And the bottom line is that unless you've been held back a few years in school and therefore older, you're probably NOT old enough to legally sign it without your parents or legal guardians having to sign it too. If you have to bring your parents along, it's too soon and you certainly won't be taken seriously. It could be a real headache for a club to have a minor in the pit. You need to learn to walk before you decide to run a marathon.


----------



## bigtwinky

vfotog said:


> I think that some of the advice may be good for many people, but not the OP. Reread what he's written. .


 
Hmmm...



> Well, I'm looking into getting a more commercial portfolio together, and I plan to shoot some concerts with media passes.


 
Seems to me that the OP wants to shoot concerts.  I think it might be a misunderstanding of what a commercial portfolio is, but he clearly did state that he wants to shoot concerts, not products or weddings.  I guess my commercial, he means that he would be hired on to do gigs.



> Cos if you don't plan on making a living, if it's just a fun hobby, you sure don't even need a portfolio.


 
Disagree with this.  If shooting concerts is a fun hobby, then you still need a portfolio.  Getting the good gigs means someone will review your work.  Either the band's publicist or the editor of the paper.  Either way, you need some solid work to present.  

I agree with the not starting at the top part.  Work your way up, learn the ropes.  I'm not convinced the OP wanted to start shooting top named bands, but that is the goal, right?  Like anything else, you need to work your way up, but you still need those goals.  Well, I need those goals so I have something to aim for and progress towards.  To me, sounds like the OP has a decent head on his shoulders and is trying things out.

Throwing out there that he needs to know what type of photography he wants to do and focus on that is not sound IMO.  At the OPs age, experimenting with various types of shooting is great.  Who knows, maybe he has already done that and decided that concerts would be great and fun.  Hell, thats why I shoot them.  I've loved music, love live shows, love photography.   I take Joey L as an example.  He started shooting shows when he was under 18.  Heck, I think he's 20 now.  He was shooting with a point and shoot and got noticed.  He then progressed to more editorial stuff.  Not saying everyone is a Joey L, but if you have a want and a drive to do something, do it.  You'll never know unless you dive head first into it.


----------



## vfotog

bigtwinky said:


> vfotog said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think that some of the advice may be good for many people, but not the OP. Reread what he's written. .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmmm...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I'm looking into getting a more commercial portfolio together, and I plan to shoot some concerts with media passes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Seems to me that the OP wants to shoot concerts.  I think it might be a misunderstanding of what a commercial portfolio is, but he clearly did state that he wants to shoot concerts, not products or weddings.  I guess my commercial, he means that he would be hired on to do gigs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cos if you don't plan on making a living, if it's just a fun hobby, you sure don't even need a portfolio.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Disagree with this.  If shooting concerts is a fun hobby, then you still need a portfolio.  Getting the good gigs means someone will review your work.  Either the band's publicist or the editor of the paper.  Either way, you need some solid work to present.
> 
> I agree with the not starting at the top part.  Work your way up, learn the ropes.  I'm not convinced the OP wanted to start shooting top named bands, but that is the goal, right?  Like anything else, you need to work your way up, but you still need those goals.  Well, I need those goals so I have something to aim for and progress towards.  To me, sounds like the OP has a decent head on his shoulders and is trying things out.
> 
> Throwing out there that he needs to know what type of photography he wants to do and focus on that is not sound IMO.  At the OPs age, experimenting with various types of shooting is great.  Who knows, maybe he has already done that and decided that concerts would be great and fun.  Hell, thats why I shoot them.  I've loved music, love live shows, love photography.   I take Joey L as an example.  He started shooting shows when he was under 18.  Heck, I think he's 20 now.  He was shooting with a point and shoot and got noticed.  He then progressed to more editorial stuff.  Not saying everyone is a Joey L, but if you have a want and a drive to do something, do it.  You'll never know unless you dive head first into it.
Click to expand...


it's not really clear what his intentions are. He says he wants a COMMERCIAL portfolio, which implies making money. OTOH, he says he doesn't want to make money. But he says he wants to sell to stock.It sounds like the goals aren't really defined, so I was hoping to get a clearer picture. He hasn't even said whether he's ever shot any performances. If he really hasn't, it's hard to know if he has the skills to go in that area. A lot of kids (and adults) want to shoot music cos it SEEMS so glamorous. Which of course, most of the time it isn't. Of course, he doesn't have to have a genre picked at this age, but he may have a few areas he's interested in if he wants to go to "a photography school". Unless you live in a town of 100 where pro photographers are going to be scarce, there aren't a lot of photo generalists that shoot everything. Of course, he NEEDS a portfolio if he wants to get work, but if he's asking to shoot shows because it's his hobby, don't know a lot of publicists that are going to go for that. And his initial letter talked about offering the label "a percentage of the profit." He's gotta do the research and learn how this stuff works. And the age is still a big thing. He's offering a financial arrangement that as a minor will require his parents involvement. There's nothing wrong with being young but young and savvy is better. Learning your craft first tends to be a more practical and successful route.


----------



## Stephen.C

BigTwinky, Thanks for the help, your posts are always filled with awesome information.



bigtwinky said:


> vfotog said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think that some of the advice may be good for many people, but not the OP. Reread what he's written. .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmmm...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I'm looking into getting a more commercial portfolio together, and I plan to shoot some concerts with media passes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Seems to me that the OP wants to shoot concerts.  I think it might be a misunderstanding of what a commercial portfolio is, but he clearly did state that he wants to shoot concerts, not products or weddings.  I guess my commercial, he means that he would be hired on to do gigs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cos if you don't plan on making a living, if it's just a fun hobby, you sure don't even need a portfolio.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Disagree with this.  If shooting concerts is a fun hobby, then you still need a portfolio.  Getting the good gigs means someone will review your work.  Either the band's publicist or the editor of the paper.  Either way, you need some solid work to present.
> 
> I agree with the not starting at the top part.  Work your way up, learn the ropes.  I'm not convinced the OP wanted to start shooting top named bands, but that is the goal, right?  Like anything else, you need to work your way up, but you still need those goals.  Well, I need those goals so I have something to aim for and progress towards.  To me, sounds like the OP has a decent head on his shoulders and is trying things out.
> 
> Throwing out there that he needs to know what type of photography he wants to do and focus on that is not sound IMO.  At the OPs age, experimenting with various types of shooting is great.  Who knows, maybe he has already done that and decided that concerts would be great and fun.  Hell, thats why I shoot them.  I've loved music, love live shows, love photography.   I take Joey L as an example.  He started shooting shows when he was under 18.  Heck, I think he's 20 now.  He was shooting with a point and shoot and got noticed.  He then progressed to more editorial stuff.  Not saying everyone is a Joey L, but if you have a want and a drive to do something, do it.  You'll never know unless you dive head first into it.
Click to expand...


First off, don't make a TPF account, to belittle me because of my age. I may have misused the word "commercial" but what I mean is, I want to do some photography that COULD turn into a career. Take a look at my flickr, is there anything that I could show to a business and say "hire me?" No, obviously not. You focus on my age, which already makes me completely disregard anything that you say. 

Stock photography sites..Thats pretty much the only way I can sell the photos I take now, which is why I mentioned it. 

Also, I come here, asking about photo passes. Don't try to talk me out of it, stop wasting your time typing. 
So many things in your post just piss me off. I know what is in a concert, hot shot. You don't have to tell me that the guy runs around and there are flashing lights. 

Man when someone asks a question about an area when someone *can* get paid, it really brings out the nay-sayers. 
If you don't have any helpful information about the question that I asked, then don't even bother to post.


----------



## vfotog

Stephen.C said:


> First off, don't make a TPF account, to belittle me because of my age. I may have misused the word "commercial" but what I mean is, I want to do some photography that COULD turn into a career. Take a look at my flickr, is there anything that I could show to a business and say "hire me?" No, obviously not. You focus on my age, which already makes me completely disregard anything that you say.
> 
> Stock photography sites..Thats pretty much the only way I can sell the photos I take now, which is why I mentioned it.
> 
> Also, I come here, asking about photo passes. Don't try to talk me out of it, stop wasting your time typing.
> So many things in your post just piss me off. I know what is in a concert, hot shot. You don't have to tell me that the guy runs around and there are flashing lights.
> 
> Man when someone asks a question about an area when someone *can* get paid, it really brings out the nay-sayers.
> If you don't have any helpful information about the question that I asked, then don't even bother to post.



first of all, it won't be productive to throw a hissy fit. It's a sign of immaturity. I didn't belittle you at all. I did point out some roadblocks that exist because of your age. I gave you practical advice and information based on the real world. If someone is much older and highly experienced the advice is going to be a lot different than if you're underage. Since you're a minor, it's going to be a liability issue for venues to have you in their pit. You can't sign a release or contract without your parents co-signing. Telling you that is not belittling or critical. That's just facts. Playing the victim instead of learning from others who give you information you don't like isn't going to help you. It won't get you where you want to go. If you develop and display an attitude every time someone tells you no, or something you don't want to hear, you've got a rough road ahead. I gave you helpful information that would decrease your chances of looking really stupid and getting your emails, etc thrown in the trash by venues and bands. It's not mean to tell you to research first. Btw, IF the work was good enough to get accepted by a stock agency, again, you need to be of legal age. I looked at your Flickr. Some of these images are very nice but there weren't any concert shots. Even if you weren't a minor, there's nothing there that's going to convince a venue, let alone a corporate venue like HOB, to let you shoot there. I've been shooting concerts for over 25 years. It's a different skill set from what it appears you've been shooting so far. You can choose to be pissed or you can learn from what people post to try and help you.


----------



## Stephen.C

vfotog said:


> Stephen.C said:
> 
> 
> 
> First off, don't make a TPF account, to belittle me because of my age. I may have misused the word "commercial" but what I mean is, I want to do some photography that COULD turn into a career. Take a look at my flickr, is there anything that I could show to a business and say "hire me?" No, obviously not. You focus on my age, which already makes me completely disregard anything that you say.
> 
> Stock photography sites..Thats pretty much the only way I can sell the photos I take now, which is why I mentioned it.
> 
> Also, I come here, asking about photo passes. Don't try to talk me out of it, stop wasting your time typing.
> So many things in your post just piss me off. I know what is in a concert, hot shot. You don't have to tell me that the guy runs around and there are flashing lights.
> 
> Man when someone asks a question about an area when someone *can* get paid, it really brings out the nay-sayers.
> If you don't have any helpful information about the question that I asked, then don't even bother to post.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> first of all, it won't be productive to throw a hissy fit. It's a sign of immaturity. I didn't belittle you at all. I did point out some roadblocks that exist because of your age. I gave you practical advice and information based on the real world. If someone is much older and highly experienced the advice is going to be a lot different than if you're underage. Since you're a minor, it's going to be a liability issue for venues to have you in their pit. You can't sign a release or contract without your parents co-signing. Telling you that is not belittling or critical. That's just facts. Playing the victim instead of learning from others who give you information you don't like isn't going to help you. It won't get you where you want to go. If you develop and display an attitude every time someone tells you no, or something you don't want to hear, you've got a rough road ahead. I gave you helpful information that would decrease your chances of looking really stupid and getting your emails, etc thrown in the trash by venues and bands. It's not mean to tell you to research first. Btw, IF the work was good enough to get accepted by a stock agency, again, you need to be of legal age. I looked at your Flickr. Some of these images are very nice but there weren't any concert shots. Even if you weren't a minor, there's nothing there that's going to convince a venue, let alone a corporate venue like HOB, to let you shoot there. I've been shooting concerts for over 25 years. It's a different skill set from what it appears you've been shooting so far. You can choose to be pissed or you can learn from what people post to try and help you.
Click to expand...


Nah,I didn't throw a hissy fit. I already said I didn't have concert stuff..I'm trying to get into it to build a portfolio. The only attitude I have had was towards you, not to everyone critiquing. I've learned from almost everyones posts, because most of them have been full of useful information. 
I've signed contracts before, So I'm not too sure about all this liability stuff. When Red Bull came to Boston for an event, I got a photopass and I signed all sorts of things even though they knew I was 16.
Honestly, I'm going to keep trying. I found a website with a list of a bunch of venues. The worst they can say is no.


----------



## Rich F

Some pretty good advice here... I forgot that I joined this forum until I got an email today saying that it had been redesigned....

I just started shooting about a year ago and have really taken a liking to concert photography. Pretty much local bands to this point. But I just got an email response from Epitaph records telling me that I'm on the list with a photo-pass for the upcoming *Social Distortion* show.

I emailed them and told them that I am interested in shooting the show and will be providing the images to local papers and the examiner.com website. These aren't lies either. I'm going to shoot the show. And when I get home, I'll choose the best six images and email them to a few papers. I also have a friend that is going to write a review of the show for the Examiner website. She will be using my photos for her post.
By shooting a bunch of local acts and sending this link to my Bands and Music Flickr set I was granted the pass....

So, like a lot of people had said - shoot some local acts to build your portfolio. If you send the link to the PR people of a band, they might be more inclined to give you a pass.....

Good Luck,

-Rich
My New Blog


----------



## Stephen.C

Thanks rich.
You have some great shots there!


----------



## vfotog

Stephen.C said:


> Nah,I didn't throw a hissy fit. I already said I didn't have concert stuff..I'm trying to get into it to build a portfolio. The only attitude I have had was towards you, not to everyone critiquing. I've learned from almost everyones posts, because most of them have been full of useful information.
> I've signed contracts before, So I'm not too sure about all this liability stuff. When Red Bull came to Boston for an event, I got a photopass and I signed all sorts of things even though they knew I was 16.
> Honestly, I'm going to keep trying. I found a website with a list of a bunch of venues. The worst they can say is no.



Stephen, you may have signed stuff, but that doesn't mean it was enforceable. Could very well mean someone on their end wasn't doing their job. Actually, the worst thing that could happen is not just their saying no, but that they say no and remember you later on down the road as the underage guy trying to get a pass with nothing to back it up. What's so horrible about shooting at the level you're at first? Shooting high school, maybe some college bands will give you some practice and portfolio pieces. Here's a link to a slideshow of some of my music stuff. You're probably too young to recognize these artists but you can get the idea of my style.


----------



## Stephen.C

I'm willing to take that risk. I'll get good photos, then once that band comes back around to my town, i'll have a portfolio to show them. 
Yeah I know most of the artists.


----------



## Village Idiot

90c4 said:


> Don't offer to give your work away for nothing. Once you do that, you can't go up. And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass. Shoot a small band at a club that doesn't care. There are only so many passes available for a given show and all a publicist cares about his how many eyeballs will be seeing your images, not helping someone they've never met with his portfolio. I see you're in Boston - I shot two bands last night, George Clinton at House of Blues and Akron/Family at the Brighton Music Hall. There were several people at the second show with cameras and although I was on the list there, I don't think anybody would have cared if I wasn't. Build your portfolio with shows like that. Big name artists aren't impressive in a portfolio - excellent shots are.



News flash, no bar or club that host anyone but mildly known local bands in Baltimore will allow you in with anything more than a P&S, and sometimes you're better off hiding that in your drawers. If I were to try and walk into Ram's Head Live in the Inner Harbor to shoot a band as not so well known as SOJA, OK Go, Bad Fish, or other similar bands, they'd start laughing at me at the door and wouldn't quit until I was outside.

Not getting photo passes means I can't shoot. Hell, even when photographing Shadows Fall at Sonar's club stage, which is tiny and has no pit, they wouldn't have let me in without a photo pass.


----------



## Stephen.C

Village Idiot said:


> 90c4 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Don't offer to give your work away for nothing. Once you do that, you can't go up. And if you're not on assignment from a publication you shouldn't be asking for a photo pass. Shoot a small band at a club that doesn't care. There are only so many passes available for a given show and all a publicist cares about his how many eyeballs will be seeing your images, not helping someone they've never met with his portfolio. I see you're in Boston - I shot two bands last night, George Clinton at House of Blues and Akron/Family at the Brighton Music Hall. There were several people at the second show with cameras and although I was on the list there, I don't think anybody would have cared if I wasn't. Build your portfolio with shows like that. Big name artists aren't impressive in a portfolio - excellent shots are.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> News flash, no bar or club that host anyone but mildly known local bands in Baltimore will allow you in with anything more than a P&S, and sometimes you're better off hiding that in your drawers. If I were to try and walk into Ram's Head Live in the Inner Harbor to shoot a band as not so well known as SOJA, OK Go, Bad Fish, or other similar bands, they'd start laughing at me at the door and wouldn't quit until I was outside.
> 
> Not getting photo passes means I can't shoot. Hell, even when photographing Shadows Fall at Sonar's club stage, which is tiny and has no pit, they wouldn't have let me in without a photo pass.
Click to expand...


Yeah. I've been going to different venue's websites and most of them have a strict no camera rule.


----------



## bigtwinky

One concert photography I like is Todd Owyoung.  He got his start by having one really nice publicist allow him access to the show when he was a no-name.
So yeah, try the big bands.  You'll be rejected 99% of the time, but all you need is that 1%


----------



## o hey tyler

Destin said:


> Stephen.C said:
> 
> 
> 
> Can't sell them? Oh well, didn't plan on it anyways...
> I like your Idea Destin. I'd probably do that.
> 
> I was told to contact some no name bands, and just get some shots of people no one has heard of to start.
> Not a bad idea, Ill still try to get the big names too though.
> 
> Thanks guys.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One other thing that you might wanna try is looking into Big name Christian bands coming to your area.
> 
> I have gotten access to shoot two of the biggest Christian artists in the world (toby mac, and skillet). Photos are on my site here The security at Christian concerts isn't generally as tight, and they are more willing to give young photogs like us a shot.
Click to expand...

 
Yeah, but then you have to sit through Christian rock music though...


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## Destin

o hey tyler said:


> Destin said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stephen.C said:
> 
> 
> 
> Can't sell them? Oh well, didn't plan on it anyways...
> I like your Idea Destin. I'd probably do that.
> 
> I was told to contact some no name bands, and just get some shots of people no one has heard of to start.
> Not a bad idea, Ill still try to get the big names too though.
> 
> Thanks guys.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One other thing that you might wanna try is looking into Big name Christian bands coming to your area.
> 
> I have gotten access to shoot two of the biggest Christian artists in the world (toby mac, and skillet). Photos are on my site here The security at Christian concerts isn't generally as tight, and they are more willing to give young photogs like us a shot.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Yeah, but then you have to sit through Christian rock music though...
Click to expand...


Dude, have you ever listened to skillet? They get played on secular (non-christian) stations alllllll the time. One of the best rock bands out right now, their show was amazing!


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## o hey tyler

Destin said:


> o hey tyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Destin said:
> 
> 
> 
> One other thing that you might wanna try is looking into Big name Christian bands coming to your area.
> 
> I have gotten access to shoot two of the biggest Christian artists in the world (toby mac, and skillet). Photos are on my site here The security at Christian concerts isn't generally as tight, and they are more willing to give young photogs like us a shot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, but then you have to sit through Christian rock music though...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Dude, have you ever listened to skillet? They get played on secular (non-christian) stations alllllll the time. One of the best rock bands out right now, their show was amazing!
Click to expand...

 
No, I don't listen to "Skillet". But I can assure you, I do not want those guys cooking my home fries. 

I don't listen to the Radio, and if I did, it wouldn't be Christian music. Sorry.


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## vfotog

bigtwinky said:


> One concert photography I like is Todd Owyoung.  He got his start by having one really nice publicist allow him access to the show when he was a no-name.
> So yeah, try the big bands.  You'll be rejected 99% of the time, but all you need is that 1%



but Todd didn't go after "big" bands immediately. He shot everything, from college stuff to places with open camera policies to what he could get passes to. He got as much experience as he could. Going after big names when you've never shot _any _shows? Nowadays kids want to start at the top, but it sure doesn't hurt to develop some skill first.


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## bigtwinky

Totally agree. He did pay his dues and worked hard. I didn't want to imply in any way that he only is who he is because of that one publicist. Not at all.
But... he did have some images to show a publicist, again, back when he was a no name. And that publicist did take a chance and let him shoot...which gave him his break... after paying his dues in the clubs (which is where I am now lol)

Thank you very much vfotog for that clarification.


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## bentcountershaft

In my eyes, the biggest hurdle you'll be facing is your age.  If you were 21 it would open up a lot more opportunities.  See if you can find out who the smaller, local promoters are in your area that book shows in all age venues.  Almost all of the bands you find this way will be locals but that doesn't matter, build relationships.  It doesn't matter what kind of music it is, even if you hate it, just go shoot it.  Give the bands free license to use the images on their myspace/facebook pages and if they want anything else make them pay.  Get to know as many people as you can in the business, venue owner/managers especially.  If the promoters you hook up with are growing you may be able to grow with them.  You shoot some of the local bands they've booked and maybe he'll help you shoot a regional band or two that he brings in and you can grow from there.  The main thing to remember is to shoot, shoot and keep shooting.  It takes a lot of practice to consistently deliver in this type of photography.  You'll probably learn best by shooting in as many different venues/lighting situations as possible so shoot anywhere that will give you the time of day.  Don't forget free events in the parks and what not.  Get there early, ask someone setting stuff up who's in charge and find out if it's ok to shoot.  Good luck.


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## Stephen.C

All good tips / concerns guys. I'm taking everything into consideration. 
I've emailed some more, and done some more research on bands. I do check to make sure that they are in-fact all ages. 
The hardest part, for me atleast, is finding the small, upcoming bands. But I shall keep trying.


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## bentcountershaft

Something I just thought of:  Every musical equipment store I've ever been in has had a bulletin board for bands.  Check there for upcoming shows.  Maybe after you feel confident enough put a small flier up if they'll let you.


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## Stephen.C

bentcountershaft said:


> Something I just thought of:  Every musical equipment store I've ever been in has had a bulletin board for bands.  Check there for upcoming shows.  Maybe after you feel confident enough put a small flier up if they'll let you.



Thats a fantastic idea! Thank you!


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## Formatted

> Maybe after you feel confident enough put a small flier up if they'll let you.



Very good idea, little laminated flier with some of your best work plus your website, phone number and e-mail.


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## c.cloudwalker

I don't think age matters so much as how you act. I shot my first concert at 16 but I wasn't your average 16 yo either. Almost never used a pass but when I did it was often a home made media ID card 

I've used a lot of different ways of getting backstage (more interesting to me than the actual concert) from pretty girls to paying off a security guy. If you look and act like you belong there you will rarely get thrown out. Or, at least, I didn't.

Of course, things have changed in this industry with everyone trying to squeeze every penny they can out of everything but I'm sure they are still ways to get in. You just need to get creative.

And I totally disagree with the person who said you don't belong there. Sounds to me like one of those photogs who is afraid of the younger, upcoming generations. If you can find a way, you DO belong there. 

Good luck to you.


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## Stephen.C

c.cloudwalker said:


> I don't think age matters so much as how you act. I shot my first concert at 16 but I wasn't your average 16 yo either. Almost never used a pass but when I did it was often a home made media ID card
> 
> I've used a lot of different ways of getting backstage (more interesting to me than the actual concert) from pretty girls to paying off a security guy. If you look and act like you belong there you will rarely get thrown out. Or, at least, I didn't.
> 
> Of course, things have changed in this industry with everyone trying to squeeze every penny they can out of everything but I'm sure they are still ways to get in. You just need to get creative.
> 
> And I totally disagree with the person who said you don't belong there. Sounds to me like one of those photogs who is afraid of the younger, upcoming generations. If you can find a way, you DO belong there.
> 
> Good luck to you.


 
Thanks man, thats what I like to hear.


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## c.cloudwalker

No need to thank me. 

1/ I believe in going after what I want and I see no reason for others not to do it too.

2/ Photography is a creative endeavor and, to me, it means being creative in every aspect of it, including getting backstage at concerts 

Now, I said I wasn't an average 16 yo and that is true when it comes to the big names in the arts. I grew up surrounded by very well known artists so that I felt very comfortable around these people whether I knew them or not and it helped when trying to get backstage. I was not impressed by the fame and so I didn't act like a fan.

But that is something you can learn to do. Actually, you need to learn to do it. Ask for an autograph and you'll most probably get thrown out. Just tell yourself these people are no different, which btw they are not for the most part, keep it professional and you'll be fine. Especially if you can deal with the fact that you will not always get what you want. Just keep in mind that it is a numbers game: the more you ask/try, the more chances you will get in from time to time.

And if you play your hand right, someday you will get invited to shows rather than having to ask for a pass.


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## vfotog

c.cloudwalker said:


> I don't think age matters so much as how you act. I shot my first concert at 16 but I wasn't your average 16 yo either. Almost never used a pass but when I did it was often a home made media ID card
> 
> I've used a lot of different ways of getting backstage (more interesting to me than the actual concert) from pretty girls to paying off a security guy. If you look and act like you belong there you will rarely get thrown out. Or, at least, I didn't.
> 
> Of course, things have changed in this industry with everyone trying to squeeze every penny they can out of everything but I'm sure they are still ways to get in. You just need to get creative.
> 
> And I totally disagree with the person who said you don't belong there. Sounds to me like one of those photogs who is afraid of the younger, upcoming generations. If you can find a way, you DO belong there.
> 
> Good luck to you.



wow, in a later post you talk about being "professional"? There's nothing professional about using girls and paying off guards and making counterfeit passes. You're lucky you didn't get arrested for trespassing. It all depends on whether someone is serious about being a photographer or just some loser who wants to trick people so he can hang backstage. Sorry, but even if you weren't asking for autographs, you were still acting like a stalker fan.


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## Stephen.C

vfotog said:


> c.cloudwalker said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't think age matters so much as how you act. I shot my first concert at 16 but I wasn't your average 16 yo either. Almost never used a pass but when I did it was often a home made media ID card
> 
> I've used a lot of different ways of getting backstage (more interesting to me than the actual concert) from pretty girls to paying off a security guy. If you look and act like you belong there you will rarely get thrown out. Or, at least, I didn't.
> 
> Of course, things have changed in this industry with everyone trying to squeeze every penny they can out of everything but I'm sure they are still ways to get in. You just need to get creative.
> 
> And I totally disagree with the person who said you don't belong there. Sounds to me like one of those photogs who is afraid of the younger, upcoming generations. If you can find a way, you DO belong there.
> 
> Good luck to you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wow, in a later post you talk about being "professional"? There's nothing professional about using girls and paying off guards and making counterfeit passes. You're lucky you didn't get arrested for trespassing. It all depends on whether someone is serious about being a photographer or just some loser who wants to trick people so he can hang backstage. Sorry, but even if you weren't asking for autographs, you were still acting like a stalker fan.
Click to expand...



Was he bothering anyone or was he doing it to take photos? 
Gotta do what you gotta do, hell he could be a "pro" now, because of the shots he got.


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## c.cloudwalker

vfotog said:


> wow, in a later post you talk about being "professional"? There's nothing professional about using girls and paying off guards and making counterfeit passes. You're lucky you didn't get arrested for trespassing. It all depends on whether someone is serious about being a photographer or just some loser who wants to trick people so he can hang backstage. Sorry, but even if you weren't asking for autographs, you were still acting like a stalker fan.


 
Wow, I just had to LOL at this one. But you are right, I'm a loser. Although one who doesn't care much what others think and also one with about 25 years of making a living with a camera. :lmao:

Also, getting backstage was good practice for my later work as a PJ. I'm sure you can figure this one out.


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## o hey tyler

Johnkeit said:


> you may be able to put a small portfolio...


 
Where might you be able to put a small portfolio?


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## e.rose

o hey tyler said:


> Johnkeit said:
> 
> 
> 
> you may be able to put a small portfolio...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Where might you be able to put a small portfolio?
Click to expand...

 
I have a feeling that guy is going to turn out to be some sort of a weird spammer... he's pulling up ancient threads and posting fragmented sentences in all of them...


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## o hey tyler

e.rose said:


> o hey tyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Johnkeit said:
> 
> 
> 
> you may be able to put a small portfolio...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Where might you be able to put a small portfolio?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I have a feeling that guy is going to turn out to be some sort of a weird spammer... he's pulling up ancient threads and posting fragmented sentences in all of them...
Click to expand...


But... But I really wanted to know where he put his small portfolio.


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## e.rose

o hey tyler said:


> e.rose said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> o hey tyler said:
> 
> 
> 
> Where might you be able to put a small portfolio?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have a feeling that guy is going to turn out to be some sort of a weird spammer... he's pulling up ancient threads and posting fragmented sentences in all of them...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> But... But I really wanted to know where he put his small portfolio.
Click to expand...

 
En su CULOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!








(sorry... couldn't help it... college roomie and I used to run around campus yelling that at each other all the time.  :lmao


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## Desiree M. Boom

Maybe you have some sort of venue where starting local bands practice? I know we here in my city do. Or maybe there's people in your school who just started a band? Perhaps you could go there one day, and go around ask the bands if they would like you to shoot photo's for them, so that they don't have to worry about getting the funds for promo-shots, and you can build a portfolio. That way you scratch each other's backs, I think.


----------

