# Advice needed for sports shots



## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

Hey there,
I have a fairly new camera so I am still learning all the bells and whistles, so please bear with me..
However, I have been taking some pictures at my son's baseball games. 
The still shots of him on the field look great. I am having trouble with action shots. When he is swinging the bat, the bat comes out very blurry.
Also, I took some of him jumping up to catch a ball and he is blurred.
I had the camera on Sports mode which is what the manual said to use for action shots. Any suggestions?  he has a big game tonight and I would like to get this figured out.  
My camera is a Canon EOS 40D and I am using a Canon 70-300 lens.
Thanks for the help.


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## JimmyO (Apr 24, 2008)

Kinda confusing but ill try to help you out.

In order to stop motion you need to increase the shutter speed. But in order to do there needs to be atiquite lighting. You will also need to make sure you have the largest aperture (smallest F number) and using a high iso will also help. In order to do all this you will need to shooting in manual mode.

good luck!


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## Big Mike (Apr 24, 2008)

Welcome to the forum.  I just typed out a response to someone else...but I think the message applies here as well.



> Welcome to the forum.
> 
> The first step should be to learn a few basics about photography. An exposure is controlled by three things; the shutter speed, the aperture and the ISO. And of course, everything is about light.
> 
> ...


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

JimmyO said:


> Kinda confusing but ill try to help you out.
> 
> In order to stop motion you need to increase the shutter speed. But in order to do there needs to be atiquite lighting. You will also need to make sure you have the largest aperture (smallest F number) and using a high iso will also help. In order to do all this you will need to shooting in manual mode.
> 
> good luck!


 

Thanks so much for trying to help.  I looked back at one of the pictures where he is jumpng up to catch and his whole body is a blur.  The ISO was 800.


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## Big Mike (Apr 24, 2008)

> My camera is a Canon EOS 40D and I am using a Canon 70-300 lens.


Part of the problem is that this lens has a small max aperture...especially at the long end of the zoom.  Pro sports shooters use telephoto lenses with wider apertures...like a 300mm F2.8 or a 400mm F2.8.  These lenses, however, are large, heavy and very expensive....unfortunately, that's what it takes to get those great sports shots.


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

Big Mike said:


> Part of the problem is that this lens has a small max aperture...especially at the long end of the zoom. Pro sports shooters use telephoto lenses with wider apertures...like a 300mm F2.8 or a 400mm F2.8. These lenses, however, are large, heavy and very expensive....unfortunately, that's what it takes to get those great sports shots.


 
Oh great, LOL.  This is a nicely priced lens and what was recommended to me by the pros at the camera shop.  So, can I make do with this?  Any recommendations on settings to try out?  Manual mode is new to me, so I am a little skeptical.  Do I need to increase from 800 to 1600 or is that too much?  Also what about shutter speed and aperture? I am so sorry for all the questions.


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## KOrmechea (Apr 24, 2008)

That lens should be good on a sunny day and if you're just starting out, it's fine.

A shutter speed of at least (or is it "most"?) 1/500 is generally recommended for stopping action.  Adjust the aperture and ISO from there.  Or, if you don't feel too comfortable in full manual, try shooting in Tv mode (you choose shutter speed and the camera chooses the aperture).

That being said, I see nothing wrong with a slightly blurred bat.  A bat is made to be swung.  Swinging is (generally) a fast action.  A slight blur helps convey that and (I feel) makes the shot more exciting.  However, that's not to say that it's the only way to do it.

Experiment (especially on someone else's kid)!  You'll soon learn what you like and don't, what turns out well and what doesn't.   That's half the fun.  

Good luck.


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

KOrmechea said:


> That lens should be good on a sunny day and if you're just starting out, it's fine.
> 
> A shutter speed of at least (or is it "most"?) 1/500 is generally recommended for stopping action. Adjust the aperture and ISO from there.
> 
> ...


 

Thanks I was getting stressed about having wasted my money on the lens I have.  Also, the bat is very blurred.  It makes the picture look bad. And the ones of him jumping up are so blurry you cant even make out who the kid is.  More blur than I want, LOL


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## Big Mike (Apr 24, 2008)

As mentioned, that lens isn't well suited for sports/less than great light.  It's a fine lens in great light...but keep in mind that pro sport shooters use lenses that cost upwards of $5000...and yours was what, a couple hundred?  So you can't expect the results to be the same as what you see in Sports Illustrated


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

Big Mike said:


> As mentioned, that lens isn't well suited for sports/less than great light. It's a fine lens in great light...but keep in mind that pro sport shooters use lenses that cost upwards of $5000...and yours was what, a couple hundred? So you can't expect the results to be the same as what you see in Sports Illustrated


 
My lens was around 800.oo.  I certainly dont expect Sports I Illustrated quality pics.  I just hope to get nice pictures of an 8 year old baseball game.  I know others who do not have as nice of a camera and they are able to get the swings and jumps with no blur.  I guess it will take time and trial and error.  I was just hopng to get suggestions on maybe a few settings to try.  
I am right up on the fence or on the field for the pictures.  The lighting has been good as these games are usually in the afternoon or middle of the day.


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## Big Mike (Apr 24, 2008)

> My lens was around 800.oo.


Oh, you must have the 70-300 *IS*?

That is certainly a nicer lens than the non-IS 75-300 version.  The Image Stabilization will help to fight blur from camera shake...but unfortunately, it doesn't help to fight against blur from moving subject.  Better to have it than not...but not as good as a larger aperture.



> The lighting has been good as these games are usually in the afternoon or middle of the day.


Can you show us some examples, along with the EXIF date (the shooting info like shutter speed, aperture, ISO etc)?

That might help us to diagnose what is going on with your blurry photos.


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

Big Mike said:


> Oh, you must have the 70-300 *IS*?
> 
> That is certainly a nicer lens than the non-IS 75-300 version. The Image Stabilization will help to fight blur from camera shake...but unfortunately, it doesn't help to fight against blur from moving subject. Better to have it than not...but not as good as a larger aperture.
> 
> ...


 
Yes, mine has IS.  So, are you saying its not a piece of crap after all, LOL.    How do I post a picture?


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## Big Mike (Apr 24, 2008)

No, it's not a piece of crap  

But it certainly wouldn't be my first choice for sports.

THIS thread should show you how to post images etc.


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

Here is one picture.
Settings: (these were Auto in Sports mode):  
ISO 800
F/5
1/13


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## Big Mike (Apr 24, 2008)

Well there you go.  Your shutter speed was 1/13...where it should have been 1/250 or 1/500.  It's not just your son that is blurry...so there is also blur from camera shake going on here.  IS will help with that, but it's not a miracle cure.

Looking at your settings...the light levels were low.  Even if you had bumped the ISO up to 1600, your shutter speed would only have been 1/25 or 1/30...which still isn't nearly fast enough.

You need to be 4 or 5 'full stops' faster....and you just aren't going to be able to do that, with that equipment and especially in that poor light.

Try again when it's actually a nice bright day and see if you don't get better results.


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

And another.
Settings:
ISO 800
F/5
1/30


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

Last one
Settings:
ISO 800
1/15
F/5


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## prodigy2k7 (Apr 24, 2008)

One problem I have with my Canon 70-300 lens is I always wondered why they came out blurry after basically holding the camera very still, high shutter speeds (500 -640 minimum)...

I learned that lower quality lenses arent very crisp and sharp when they are "fully open" (low F number, such as 4.0 of 5.6)

TO get crisp pictures it should be around F9 to F11. But since you seem to have low light conditions...

I am a notice from experience with the same lens...


Edit: Mine is the Non *IS* lol


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## StoryBookPhotography (Apr 24, 2008)

Big Mike said:


> Well there you go. Your shutter speed was 1/13...where it should have been 1/250 or 1/500. It's not just your son that is blurry...so there is also blur from camera shake going on here. IS will help with that, but it's not a miracle cure.
> 
> Looking at your settings...the light levels were low. Even if you had bumped the ISO up to 1600, your shutter speed would only have been 1/25 or 1/30...which still isn't nearly fast enough.
> 
> ...


 

Those were the Auto settings the camera set while in Sports mode.


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## Big Mike (Apr 24, 2008)

> Those were the Auto settings the camera set while in Sports mode.


Firstly, there really isn't anything that the 'picture modes' do that the other modes can't do.  They just let the camera do the thinking (which probably isn't a good idea, since it doesn't have a brain ).
It would be much better for you to learn about exposure (shutter speed & aperture) and then you can consciously think about what the camera is doing.

That being said, the settings that the camera set in sports mode...are probably what I would have set...the aperture was probably at it's max and the ISO was fairly high.  The slow shutter speed was just a result of the low light levels.  If you had manually set a faster shutter speed...the photos would have been underexposed...probably quite a bit by the time it was fast enough to freeze the action.

To say it another way...there was nothing that you could have done to get sharp shots in this situation...except bump up the ISO a bit more...but that probably wouldn't have been enough.

I guess you could have used a big flash...but they probably don't want you firing a flash at the players 

Your options for the future are to get a 'faster' lens (larger aperture) or shoot when the light is better.


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## Tiberius47 (Apr 24, 2008)

StoryBookPhotography said:


> Hey there,
> I have a fairly new camera so I am still learning all the bells and whistles, so please bear with me..
> However, I have been taking some pictures at my son's baseball games.
> The still shots of him on the field look great. I am having trouble with action shots. When he is swinging the bat, the bat comes out very blurry.
> ...



First of all, get it out of the PIC modes.  You've got a good camera there and you won't get very far if it's always on automatic.  Read the tutorials in my signature, they'll give you a good foundation in basic photographic technique.

For sports, I'd recommend that you set the camera to Tv mode (Shutter priority) and set the shutter speed to about 1/500.  This should be fast enough to freeze most movement, giving you nice sharp photos.

However, the lens you are using is rather slow (only f5.6 when it's zoomed all the way in), so you'll probably have to increase the ISO in order to get properly exposed images.  Don't be too reluctant, as the 40D's performance at higher ISO ratings is very god, and you won't get much noise in the pictures.  in Tv mode, you can bump the ISO up to 3200, which is two stops more than 800.


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## JustAnEngineer (Apr 24, 2008)

I have the same EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM lens and 40D camera.    With image stabilization, I can get semi-decent shots at 1/25s hand-held when zoomed in at 300mm, *if* the subject is still.  I shot this one the evening that UPS delivered the new lens:
http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee120/JustAnEngineer/Wildlife/IMG_0414a.jpg

You're trying to take photos of fast-moving athletes.  You'll need to get the shutter speed up around 1/250 or faster to really freeze the action.

When you're in a low-light situation, I'd suggest making certain that ISO extension is turned on (so that you can select 3200), going to Av mode, setting ISO to 3200 and aperture to maximum (f/5.6 at maximum zoom or f/4 at the widest), and hoping that there is enough light that the camera's metering comes up with a decently-fast shutter speed. 

There is some increase in graininess at ISO 1600 and 3200 compared to 800 or less, but this would be better than the subject blurring that you're getting at the very long exposures.

Since a big flash would probably distract the players, your next step would be to get a larger lens that could gather more light.


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## Jeff Canes (Apr 24, 2008)

I my opinion with your camera and lens you should be able to get good photos in daytime with good light, maybe even at night with some luck. 

I Not sure what the camera is doing in Sports mode. Personally I avoid those exposure modes that are the traditional point & shot ones. _I think all of those P&S modes adjust the ISO and that is your main problem (at less they do on my 10D)_. IMO only use the traditional SLR exposure mode of shutter or aperture priority and program  and using the dials to override as needed. These modes do not adjust the iso.

Up the shutter speed as everyone has recommends. As for ISO personally I like to shot baseball around 400 to 600 iso in the daytime. At night 800 or 1600 and never higher, but your 40D is better at 3200 that most older cameras. 

Get a monopod it lighten the camera load

Also at night you need to change the light metering to spot mode or use the back dial to override exposure to the minuses side. Why because if you are using the ambient light mode the camera will include the darker areas and require a lower shutter speed that maybe to slow.


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## uplander (Apr 26, 2008)

You have a great camera and a decent lens although not the best lens for what you are trying to accomplish at night games. Everyine gave great advice and yet to a novice it will all sound very daunting. 

Your camera manuel does a very good job of explaining all its features. Read each suggestion in the posts above and find the corresponding section in your manuel to explain how to set the camera controls such changing the ISO setting. Expiriment with some shots to see how it effects your pics. Try this with Apeture Piority  (Av) , shutter priority (Tv) ans so on to understand all the functions of the camera. 

Don't try to learn it all in one sitting but try something today, something later on or tomorrow and so on. In no time you will be getting fantastic shots with that camera and lens.

The tutorials in Tibeious's signature line will be a great benefit also by understanding what aperture, shutter speed , ISO, ect. are and how the effect getting a good exposure.


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## 391615 (Apr 30, 2008)

I have a 70-300 sigma for my Pentax, it runs at f5.6 at 300mm, which is what I use for most sport shots. Ive been taking sport shots for about 6 months, I've only just started to do some night sports. I'm finding that even with ISO 1600, I have shutter speeds of 30-90. Not good enough unless panning a player or taking a still shot. The lense is great for daytime shots, but for those night time shots I get blur on movement. I realize that if I want good shots, I need a Canon eos 10mp which shoots 10fps, these are cheap now the MKIII are out now with 21mp. I think to take good shots you will at least need a 300mm f2.8, or 400mm f2.8 which is 3 times as much however. IT depends what you want to take photos of. I am trying to take Football photos, and think I need a 400mm f2.8, but then even a 600mm f4.0 is better depending on distance.


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## prodigy2k7 (Apr 30, 2008)

I think that in any fast moving sports you need bare minimum 1/250 shutter. IT depend son what sport but I wouldnt feel well if I was taking shots near 250 or below.


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## 391615 (May 4, 2008)

Yes and No!

You shouldn't ever be really taking sports photos from a still position with the movement coming straight through your field of veiw. I'm not 100% sure on other sports but shooting Aussie Rules football, you quite often look for shots with the player running toward you trying to catch the football. so the blur isn't too harsh. there are a lot of shots with slight movement, and most running shots are panned. I had a panned shot in perfect focus the other night, didn't get the ball in the shot, but If you have the right technique, I don't believe you need up to 1/250, so long as you are using a monopod.

Ps I will concede this will not work with baseball/softball, and agree 1/250 would be in order. 




prodigy2k7 said:


> I think that in any fast moving sports you need bare minimum 1/250 shutter. IT depend son what sport but I wouldnt feel well if I was taking shots near 250 or below.


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## ryan7783 (May 4, 2008)

StoryBookPhotography said:


> I just hope to get nice pictures of an 8 year old baseball game.




wow what inning were they in?


har har har.


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