# Sony a7R, you want one.....



## cosmonaut

If you shoot landscapes you want it. I hate to use the old terms, awesome, amazing, stunning ect. How about smoking' ?




Cherokee Rock Village, 2-22-2014 by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr




Little River by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr




Dawn at the Lake by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr









Little River by Cosmonaut's, on FlickrGull in flight by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr


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## Stevepwns

Yes I do want one, with an A mount.....

Does this mean you will be releasing your A99 from service?  

What do you think about the 2 compared?


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## ELSELS

WOW!! and how about a few more KOOL terms like:

SONY_TANTALIZINGLY_GOOSEBUMPER_GREAT ...! 

Or maybe that's a tad too long and drawn out...

How about fantastically, 
*Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious  :smileys:

 - What will SONY's 2014 new cameras be like..?*


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## cosmonaut

I can't let the a99 go as it's my working event camera. The a7R doesn't come close in performance to the a99. The a7R focus doesn't track nearly as well, the shutter is loud, battery life not good enough, slow FPS ext. The a99 is more for a working pro the a7R is a better landscape camera. I wouldn't dare use it on a paid event. Maybe a second camera or a backup.



Stevepwns said:


> Yes I do want one, with an A mount.....
> 
> Does this mean you will be releasing your A99 from service?
> 
> What do you think about the 2 compared?


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## Stevepwns

cosmonaut said:


> I can't let the a99 go as it's my working event camera. The a7R doesn't come close in performance to the a99. The a7R focus doesn't track nearly as well, the shutter is loud, battery life not good enough, slow FPS ext. The a99 is more for a working pro the a7R is a better landscape camera. I wouldn't dare use it on a paid event. Maybe a second camera or a backup.
> 
> 
> 
> Stevepwns said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes I do want one, with an A mount.....
> 
> Does this mean you will be releasing your A99 from service?
> 
> What do you think about the 2 compared?
Click to expand...



Wow after the reviews I read I would not have expected that response.  Thanks for the information.  I will surely keep that in mind.


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## robbins.photo

cosmonaut said:


> I can't let the a99 go as it's my working event camera. The a7R doesn't come close in performance to the a99. The a7R focus doesn't track nearly as well, the shutter is loud, battery life not good enough, slow FPS ext. The a99 is more for a working pro the a7R is a better landscape camera. I wouldn't dare use it on a paid event. Maybe a second camera or a backup.
> 
> 
> 
> Stevepwns said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes I do want one, with an A mount.....
> 
> Does this mean you will be releasing your A99 from service?
> 
> What do you think about the 2 compared?
Click to expand...


Ok, so based on what your telling me, the thing has a loud shutter, slow autofocus, shoots slow and has terrible battery life.  Why is it I want one again?  Lol


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## bribrius

The shutter sound on cameras is often overlooked until after purchase and is probably not discussed enough. And it should be imo as it can be crucial. In a good portion of events you would not want to interrupt with a loud shutter sound. Quiet is good.


some really great photos in this thread. The bird I could imagine better, but the landscape photos are truly wonderful.


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## brunerww

robbins.photo said:


> ...Why is it I want one again?  Lol



It seems that landscape photographers love this camera.  Other folks, not so much.


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## robbins.photo

brunerww said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...Why is it I want one again? Lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems that landscape photographers love this camera. Other folks, not so much.
Click to expand...


Ok, well that would make sense really.  For landscapes the shutter noise wouldn't be an issue, you generally have a month of sundays to autofocus and you can always carry plenty of extra batteries.. lol


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## cosmonaut

What what I mean is it's an amazing camera. The image quality is by far the best I have seen. Most normal shooters that don't need blinding fast AF, 10 FPS, focus that will track fast moving objects. 
For travel, vacation chasing the kids around the park and stunning wall hanging landscapes and your good. Don't take it to the Super Bowl if your workin' for a livin' and shooting for cash. That's what I mean.







robbins.photo said:


> cosmonaut said:
> 
> 
> 
> I can't let the a99 go as it's my working event camera. The a7R doesn't come close in performance to the a99. The a7R focus doesn't track nearly as well, the shutter is loud, battery life not good enough, slow FPS ext. The a99 is more for a working pro the a7R is a better landscape camera. I wouldn't dare use it on a paid event. Maybe a second camera or a backup.
> 
> 
> 
> Stevepwns said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes I do want one, with an A mount.....
> 
> Does this mean you will be releasing your A99 from service?
> 
> What do you think about the 2 compared?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Ok, so based on what your telling me, the thing has a loud shutter, slow autofocus, shoots slow and has terrible battery life.  Why is it I want one again?  Lol
Click to expand...


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## robbins.photo

cosmonaut said:


> What what I mean is it's an amazing camera. The image quality is by far the best I have seen. Most normal shooters that don't need blinding fast AF, 10 FPS, focus that will track fast moving objects.
> For travel, vacation chasing the kids around the park and stunning wall hanging landscapes and your good. Don't take it to the Super Bowl if your workin' for a livin' and shooting for cash. That's what I mean.



Lol.. I get ya.  Looks like the IQ really is fantastic.  I wouldn't mind having something smaller than my DSLR, something I could carry with me when the DSLR is really overkill.  I just haven't found one yet with an EVF that I really like or think would suit my needs.  My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.  The other consideration of course is that for the kind of money I'd be putting into a mirrorless could by me some really nice stuff for the DSLR I already have, so most likely I'll also be waiting for them to come down in price a tad before I really start taking serious interest.


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## vipgraphx

robbins.photo said:


> My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.




I think if you look at the starting point of mirror less and where they are now is a great indicator that mirror less is here to stay. The features and things that you can do with these stomps all over DSLR no questions asked. Its only going to get better. There are flaws in them but there are flaws in every camera.

Have you tested the A7 or any other mirror less camera? Not just in the store but I like to say the best buy challenge, hahahahaah. Once you have really shot with one for at least a few weeks when you go back to DSLR it seems that they are just so far behind (feature wise).

I understand not wanting to dive in just yet but two things are going to happen. Either they are going to replace DSLR in the future or they are going to figure out a way to get those cool ass features into DSLRs. Like Pre Chimping and  Focus Peaking to start with. Not sure how they would but thats the only way I think DSLR will be able to last in the future&#8230;IMO.


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## robbins.photo

vipgraphx said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think if you look at the starting point of mirror less and where they are now is a great indicator that mirror less is here to stay. The features and things that you can do with these stomps all over DSLR no questions asked. Its only going to get better. There are flaws in them but there are flaws in every camera.
> 
> Have you tested the A7 or any other mirror less camera? Not just in the store but I like to say the best buy challenge, hahahahaah. Once you have really shot with one for at least a few weeks when you go back to DSLR it seems that they are just so far behind (feature wise).
> 
> I understand not wanting to dive in just yet but two things are going to happen. Either they are going to replace DSLR in the future or they are going to figure out a way to get those cool ass features into DSLRs. Like Pre Chimping and  Focus Peaking to start with. Not sure how they would but thats the only way I think DSLR will be able to last in the future&#8230;IMO.
Click to expand...


Oh I think mirrorless itself will be around for a long time, just not convinced that the current mirrorless systems will use the same lenses as the next generation or generation after that, and I'm not yet convinced that if I do invest in Mirrorless system X now that it won't be replaced with Mirrorless system Y in a year or so and X gets abandoned.  That's really one of the main reasons why I'll be waiting for a while myself before taking that next step.


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## vipgraphx

robbins.photo said:


> vipgraphx said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think if you look at the starting point of mirror less and where they are now is a great indicator that mirror less is here to stay. The features and things that you can do with these stomps all over DSLR no questions asked. Its only going to get better. There are flaws in them but there are flaws in every camera.
> 
> Have you tested the A7 or any other mirror less camera? Not just in the store but I like to say the best buy challenge, hahahahaah. Once you have really shot with one for at least a few weeks when you go back to DSLR it seems that they are just so far behind (feature wise).
> 
> I understand not wanting to dive in just yet but two things are going to happen. Either they are going to replace DSLR in the future or they are going to figure out a way to get those cool ass features into DSLRs. Like Pre Chimping and  Focus Peaking to start with. Not sure how they would but thats the only way I think DSLR will be able to last in the future&#8230;IMO.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Oh I think mirrorless itself will be around for a long time, just not convinced that the current mirrorless systems will use the same lenses as the next generation or generation after that, and I'm not yet convinced that if I do invest in Mirrorless system X now that it won't be replaced with Mirrorless system Y in a year or so and X gets abandoned.  That's really one of the main reasons why I'll be waiting for a while myself before taking that next step.
Click to expand...



But thats just about what happens with DSLR's????? Other than lenses. New models come out and replace older models. As far as the lenses I don't see how they would be changing their mounts in the future. I think they just will be adding to the arsenal. It would not make sense but then again I am not in the right person to make that or those decisions.


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## robbins.photo

vipgraphx said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vipgraphx said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think if you look at the starting point of mirror less and where they are now is a great indicator that mirror less is here to stay. The features and things that you can do with these stomps all over DSLR no questions asked. Its only going to get better. There are flaws in them but there are flaws in every camera.
> 
> Have you tested the A7 or any other mirror less camera? Not just in the store but I like to say the best buy challenge, hahahahaah. Once you have really shot with one for at least a few weeks when you go back to DSLR it seems that they are just so far behind (feature wise).
> 
> I understand not wanting to dive in just yet but two things are going to happen. Either they are going to replace DSLR in the future or they are going to figure out a way to get those cool ass features into DSLRs. Like Pre Chimping and  Focus Peaking to start with. Not sure how they would but thats the only way I think DSLR will be able to last in the future&#8230;IMO.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I think mirrorless itself will be around for a long time, just not convinced that the current mirrorless systems will use the same lenses as the next generation or generation after that, and I'm not yet convinced that if I do invest in Mirrorless system X now that it won't be replaced with Mirrorless system Y in a year or so and X gets abandoned.  That's really one of the main reasons why I'll be waiting for a while myself before taking that next step.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> But thats just about what happens with DSLR's????? Other than lenses. New models come out and replace older models. As far as the lenses I don't see how they would be changing their mounts in the future. I think they just will be adding to the arsenal. It would not make sense but then again I am not in the right person to make that or those decisions.
Click to expand...


Well that's just it, I don't have quite that much faith in the idea that they won't be changing mounts - I mean I'm not a Sony expert by any means but don't they have like 3 mounts already.. the A, the E and the FE - and while they might decide to stay with one the might not.  They seem to be jumping around quite a bit and frankly that just makes me nervous.

The other thing I'm waiting on is the next generation of EVF systems - that will most likely be when I start seriously looking at getting a mirrorless.


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## Gavjenks

> Ok, so based on what your telling me, the thing has a loud shutter, slow autofocus, shoots slow and has terrible battery life. Why is it I want one again? Lol


^
This.

For the same money (at every tier: a7 = 6D, a7r = something like 5D, etc.) I can get a full frame camera in Nikon or Canon that has *none of those issues* at all. PLUS light-speed optical viewfinding. And *just as good of image quality* because they are all using the same modern generation equally sized digital sensors.

"Here are some good photos I took" isn't an argument for why somebody would want one of these cameras. You need to demonstrate:
A) Why you can't take the _same _photos as easily with a traditional full frame SLR, OR
B) why the features of the mirrorless are currently more convenient or powerful to make it attractive even thought image quality is equal. And currently, what you seem to be saying is "Actually the features are crap by comparison" Other than size, which is fairly irrelevant for pros or high end amateurs already lugging many pounds of gear.


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## sashbar

robbins.photo said:


> My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.



I am worried about a long term support for DSLR   Mirrorless will be OK it seems. 
Just think about it: a mechanical mirror is expensive and complicated to manufacture, it can break, it shakes the camera, it is noisy, spreads dust around, has limited frames per second capability and takes a lot of space. An SLR system is preferred for now by most to an EVF of a mirrorless camera, because the quality of an EVF is poor. But it will not stay poor for long. 
An EVF will INEVITABLY trounce an OVF, all it needs is more powerful processors and better electronics, and it all gets better every year.  A mechanical mirror does not get any better.  I want to see the new FUJI X-T1 EVF which looks like a sign of things to come. Today's EVF in most mirrorless cameras that I saw is like a 1960-s color TV with its small screen, color cast and overall poor picture quality. Tomorrow it will be like a wide screen plasma. Well, maybe day after tomorrow. From what I have heard X-T1 EVF is already larger than any current OVF, including Canon 1D. (Jessops in London started selling it yesterday). And if the picture/screen quality is good enough, and you can look through the EVF and clearly see the real DoF, as captured in your image, a focus peaking, if you can clearly see in the dark (unlike OVF),  if you can embed a hystogram and pretty much anything you wish, why on earth would you prefer a mirror? It is a XX century technology... As I said it is all about a processor speed.  X-T1 already has 8 fps. And inte future it will not be limited by the mirror. 
I am not talking about the next year or so, but long term it is just inevitable. 
Small size is the main advantage of a mirrorless because it is still lagging behind a DSLR in many ways, but it will all change rather soon. As soon as they start competing with DSLR in operational speed, we will see "pro size" mirrorless bodies. I have no doubts about it. 
I can bet that in 10 years a pro camera of choice for a sports shooter will be a mirrorless camera with an electronic shutter and with 30 fps. A DSLR can not even theoretically match that.


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## robbins.photo

sashbar said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am worried about a long term support for DSLR   Mirrorless will be OK it seems.
Click to expand...


Will mirrorless be the next big thing?  Maybe.  But does that mean that the first mirrorless systems on the market continue to receive long term support? No, that doesnt necessarily follow.

So for me it makes more sense to wait and keep an eye on the market for now.  It just doesn't make good financial sense to spend the kind of money I'd have to spend to go mirrorless at this point.  

I'd rather wait for more options and for a system that I'm confident will get the long term support I'm looking for before making that kind of investment.

For me this isn't about DSLR vrs mirrorless- it's about making sure that I don't end up investing money in a system that for whatever reason doesn't take hold and ends up getting abandoned.

So yes mirrorless on the whole might well end up replacing DSLR, but that doesn't help me much if I buy mirrorless system A now and it turns out they switch to system B in a year or so and I end up having to buy B because they won't be making anything else for A.



Sent from my LG-LG730 using Tapatalk


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## vipgraphx

robbins.photo said:


> Well that's just it, I don't have quite that much faith in the idea that they won't be changing mounts - I mean I'm not a Sony expert by any means but don't they have like 3 mounts already.. the A, the E and the FE - and while they might decide to stay with one the might not.  They seem to be jumping around quite a bit and frankly that just makes me nervous.  The other thing I'm waiting on is the next generation of EVF systems - that will most likely be when I start seriously looking at getting a mirrorless.



There is only two mounts A and E the FE is full frame E mount. Just like in nikon same mount but lenses are either FF or CF


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## robbins.photo

vipgraphx said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well that's just it, I don't have quite that much faith in the idea that they won't be changing mounts - I mean I'm not a Sony expert by any means but don't they have like 3 mounts already.. the A, the E and the FE - and while they might decide to stay with one the might not. They seem to be jumping around quite a bit and frankly that just makes me nervous. The other thing I'm waiting on is the next generation of EVF systems - that will most likely be when I start seriously looking at getting a mirrorless.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is only two mounts A and E the FE is full frame E mount. Just like in nikon same mount but lenses are either FF or CF
Click to expand...


Okdoke.. well that's good info to have - from just looking at stats it looks like Sony builds a pretty nice camera overall, so it might be something worth considering a little further down the road.


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## vipgraphx

Yeah in time  only when your ready


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## Derrel

vipgraphx said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well that's just it, I don't have quite that much faith in the idea that they won't be changing mounts - I mean I'm not a Sony expert by any means but don't they have like 3 mounts already.. the A, the E and the FE - and while they might decide to stay with one the might not.  They seem to be jumping around quite a bit and frankly that just makes me nervous.  The other thing I'm waiting on is the next generation of EVF systems - that will most likely be when I start seriously looking at getting a mirrorless.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is only two mounts A and E the FE is full frame E mount. Just like in nikon same mount but lenses are either FF or CF
Click to expand...


http://www.dslrbodies.com/newsviews/can-you-trust-the-camera.ht

"What *Sony did in a decade is end up with five different "lens sets*," none of which got particularly deeper (more apps), and some of which are incomplete. Those sets are crop sensor Alpha (DT), full frame Alpha, crop sensor NEX (E), full frame "NEX" (FE), and the bolted to body things like the RX1 and RX10. So what prompted this article? A comment by a Sony executive _on the day they launched the A6000 (NEX E mount) that they were going to concentrate on FE! _Say what? "

and then farther along in the story, THom wrote: "But Sony? The Alpha full frame lens line seems to have stalled. The Alpha DT line is like Canon and Nikon's crop sensor DSLR lines: extremely incomplete. The E-mount lenses seem to be stalled at the moment, and it's really only in the FE mount that we're seeing lots of new lenses in a Road Map, though this is more catching up with a basic lens set than a deeper or broader exploration of what their cameras can do. 
Which brings me around to the question in the headline. *Can we trust the camera makers?* Are we buying into lens sets that, like the Canon EF mount or the Nikon F mount, will still work on our cameras of the future? Or are we buying into lens sets that have some risk of being never broadened the way we want?"


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## Stevepwns

Derrel said:


> vipgraphx said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well that's just it, I don't have quite that much faith in the idea that they won't be changing mounts - I mean I'm not a Sony expert by any means but don't they have like 3 mounts already.. the A, the E and the FE - and while they might decide to stay with one the might not.  They seem to be jumping around quite a bit and frankly that just makes me nervous.  The other thing I'm waiting on is the next generation of EVF systems - that will most likely be when I start seriously looking at getting a mirrorless.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is only two mounts A and E the FE is full frame E mount. Just like in nikon same mount but lenses are either FF or CF
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> http://www.dslrbodies.com/newsviews/can-you-trust-the-camera.ht
> 
> "What *Sony did in a decade is end up with five different "lens sets*," none of which got particularly deeper (more apps), and some of which are incomplete. Those sets are crop sensor Alpha (DT), full frame Alpha, crop sensor NEX (E), full frame "NEX" (FE), and the bolted to body things like the RX1 and RX10. So what prompted this article? A comment by a Sony executive _on the day they launched the A6000 (NEX E mount) that they were going to concentrate on FE! _Say what? "
> 
> and then farther along in the story, THom wrote: "But Sony? The Alpha full frame lens line seems to have stalled. The Alpha DT line is like Canon and Nikon's crop sensor DSLR lines: extremely incomplete. The E-mount lenses seem to be stalled at the moment, and it's really only in the FE mount that we're seeing lots of new lenses in a Road Map, though this is more catching up with a basic lens set than a deeper or broader exploration of what their cameras can do.
> Which brings me around to the question in the headline. *Can we trust the camera makers?* Are we buying into lens sets that, like the Canon EF mount or the Nikon F mount, will still work on our cameras of the future? Or are we buying into lens sets that have some risk of being never broadened the way we want?"
Click to expand...



This is exactly why I have not bought anything new or upgraded anything.  I really like my Sony, I want them to keep producing lens for the A mount.  Upgrade their FF body....   but they seem real bi-polar with their mounts and camera systems in general.  In the back of my mind I figured I would give them this year to show me they are going to continue with what they already have.  If by the end of the year they havent shown me enough, Im moving on to Nikon.


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## vipgraphx

Stevepwns said:


> If by the end of the year they havent shown me enough, Im moving on to Nikon.



never can go wrong with a NIKON


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## goodguy

There is no argument that the A7 is a great camera but frankly in its price range I would rather go for the Nikon D610.
I think in general mirrorless cameras offer small body with small lenses creating a small pretty powerful package but for those who want low light good performance they need fast lenses which are by their nature big so even if I would use a converter I think the overall result will be small camera and a huge honking lens on it, it would look silly and defeat the point of having a small power package.
So A7 is a good camera to a certain crowd but still lacks the flexibility of a DSLR.
I think there is place in the camera market both to mirrorless and DSLR and I have no doubt that Sony and other makers will make better and better mirrorless cameras, the future is going to be very interesting


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## goodguy

cosmonaut said:


> If you shoot landscapes you want it. I hate to use the old terms, awesome, amazing, stunning ect. How about smoking' ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cherokee Rock Village, 2-22-2014 by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Little River by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dawn at the Lake by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Little River by Cosmonaut's, on FlickrGull in flight by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr


BTW by looking at these pictures its obvious to me that the one who should get the credit to them is the photographer and not so much the camera, I am sure if you were there with a Sony a57 or even a37 the results would have been just as breath taking, I love these pictures!!! :hail:


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## jaomul

It seems that these Sony cameras excel in image quality. They are an inexpensive option in terms of fullframe cameras but their limitations are in my opinion to great for cameras that still cost a lot of money. 

I think a year or two may make a big difference here. If these cameras had better batteries and focus systems they would elevate from good to great. For sure they have all some people need, but if you drop a 4 figure sum on a camera it has to do most things we'll and some things great


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## Greiver

vipgraphx said:


> robbins.photo said:
> 
> 
> 
> My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think if you look at the starting point of mirror less and where they are now is a great indicator that mirror less is here to stay. *The features and things that you can do with these stomps all over DSLR no questions asked. Its only going to get better.* There are flaws in them but there are flaws in every camera.
> 
> Have you tested the A7 or any other mirror less camera? Not just in the store but I like to say the best buy challenge, hahahahaah. Once you have really shot with one for at least a few weeks when you go back to DSLR it seems that they are just so far behind (feature wise).
> 
> I understand not wanting to dive in just yet but two things are going to happen. Either they are going to replace DSLR in the future or they are going to figure out a way to get those cool ass features into DSLRs. Like Pre Chimping and  Focus Peaking to start with. Not sure how they would but thats the only way I think DSLR will be able to last in the futureIMO.
Click to expand...

That's highly subjective.


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## Gavjenks

> They are an inexpensive option in terms of fullframe cameras


They cost almost exactly the same as equivalent full frame cameras.
Sony A7 and Canon 6D for instance are two equivalently low end full frame cameras in mirrorless and SLR respectively, and are sold within dollars of one another.


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## jaomul

Gavjenks said:


> They are an inexpensive option in terms of fullframe cameras
> 
> 
> 
> They cost almost exactly the same as equivalent full frame cameras.
> Sony A7 and Canon 6D for instance are two equivalently low end full frame cameras in mirrorless and SLR respectively, and are sold within dollars of one another.
Click to expand...

Yes exactly what I said. Same price approx as Nikon and Canon's cheapest options. Inexpensive


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## Gavjenks

jaomul said:


> Gavjenks said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are an inexpensive option in terms of fullframe cameras
> 
> 
> 
> They cost almost exactly the same as equivalent full frame cameras.
> Sony A7 and Canon 6D for instance are two equivalently low end full frame cameras in mirrorless and SLR respectively, and are sold within dollars of one another.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yes exactly what I said. Same price approx as Nikon and Canon's cheapest options. Inexpensive
Click to expand...


Um no but that's only Sony's cheapest option TOO.
When you look at Sony's more expensive options (A7r, etc.), it becomes equal to Nikon and Canon's more expensive options (5D models, etc.).
You have to always compare apples to apples, and when you do, it is exactly the same.

In no way is it logical to say there is any sort of cost savings in full frame bodies by going mirrorless.


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## vipgraphx

Gavjenks said:


> Um no but that's only Sony's cheapest option TOO. When you look at Sony's more expensive options (A7r, etc.), it becomes equal to Nikon and Canon's more expensive options (5D models, etc.). You have to always compare apples to apples, and when you do, it is exactly the same.  In no way is it logical to say there is any sort of cost savings in full frame bodies by going mirrorless.



Actually your wrong. The a7r is compared to he d800. 36mp to 36mp is more apples to apples right??? The canon 5d models are not 36 mp.   


Now comparing apples to apples a7r to d800 it is cheaper.


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## Gavjenks

D800 $2400 Used Nikon D800 Digital SLR Camera (Body Only) 25480B B&H Photo
A7r $2300 Sony a7R Mirrorless Digital Camera ILCE7R/B Sony a7R at B&H Photo

Yeah man... HUGE savings there. I could buy like 15 sandwiches for that.


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## robbins.photo

Gavjenks said:


> D800 $2400 Used Nikon D800 Digital SLR Camera (Body Only) 25480B B&H Photo
> A7r $2300 Sony a7R Mirrorless Digital Camera ILCE7R/B Sony a7R at B&H Photo
> 
> Yeah man... HUGE savings there. I could buy like 15 sandwiches for that.



Ok, so we've established that there isn't a huge price difference between the Sony and the Nikon, and we've established you need to start patronizing a cheaper deli.  Good to know.. lol


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## vipgraphx

Gavjenks said:


> D800 $2400 Used Nikon D800 Digital SLR Camera (Body Only) 25480B B&H Photo A7r $2300 Sony a7R Mirrorless Digital Camera ILCE7R/B Sony a7R at B&H Photo  Yeah man... HUGE savings there. I could buy like 15 sandwiches for that.



Umm That used vs new, try new prices genius !  Then you will see the difference.  2399 vs 2799  = $400 not everyone buys used.


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## Gavjenks

Oh missed that. Fair enough, but still only a 14.3% price difference... 

It would mean that I could hang onto my overpriced deli habit for longer, though!


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## robbins.photo

Gavjenks said:


> Oh missed that. Fair enough, but still only a 14.3% price difference...
> 
> It would mean that I could hang onto my overpriced deli habit for longer, though!



Well see there, now you can stop skimping on the extras and actually order them with the mustard.  Happy Day!  Win Win!!!  Synergy Dance!!!

Lol


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## cosmonaut

Well you are right Nikon has been king of the hill for a long time and i don't see anyone knocking them off anytime soon. I do respect Nikon and their old school approach. I mean when I use my D800 for long exposures I still have to mirror up and take care in getting the shot. I do like my a99 though. No flipping mirror, super quite shutter I almost don't need to use a remote. The EVF is a God send sometimes when I am shooting in really low light. Focus peaking also takes the work out of getting the foreground sharp. 
 Many years ago different camera systems all were about the same maybe the buttons were in different spots but now days systems all miles apart from each other and getting further apart every day.



vipgraphx said:


> Stevepwns said:
> 
> 
> 
> If by the end of the year they havent shown me enough, Im moving on to Nikon.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> never can go wrong with a NIKON
Click to expand...


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## cosmonaut

Check out the video reviews on the a6000 and it's focus. It's blinding fast and can track better than most DSLRs. Sony's technology seems to work from the bottom up I expect the next round of the full frame mirror less cameras are going to be the best period.



robbins.photo said:


> cosmonaut said:
> 
> 
> 
> What what I mean is it's an amazing camera. The image quality is by far the best I have seen. Most normal shooters that don't need blinding fast AF, 10 FPS, focus that will track fast moving objects.
> For travel, vacation chasing the kids around the park and stunning wall hanging landscapes and your good. Don't take it to the Super Bowl if your workin' for a livin' and shooting for cash. That's what I mean.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Lol.. I get ya.  Looks like the IQ really is fantastic.  I wouldn't mind having something smaller than my DSLR, something I could carry with me when the DSLR is really overkill.  I just haven't found one yet with an EVF that I really like or think would suit my needs.  My other concern is that mirrorless is relatively new - and I'm a little worried about investing in a system until I know it's something that is going to get long term support.  I just really haven't gotten that impression yet from a lot of these newer systems.  The other consideration of course is that for the kind of money I'd be putting into a mirrorless could by me some really nice stuff for the DSLR I already have, so most likely I'll also be waiting for them to come down in price a tad before I really start taking serious interest.
Click to expand...


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## Kolia

I played with an a7 at the Sony store. Very nice machine !

Still saving for a a99 tho.


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## mckeonkent

Photoshop CC/CS6 has a new A7-A7r 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





download for their DNG Converter that as of this date will not open the files, so until this is fixed, it is useless.


A7R is a compact, high resolution camera with outstanding image quality that is ideal for landscape photography, street photography and studio photography but with enough versatility to be used for general purpose and travel.


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## vipgraphx

Been reading articles past few days and looks like sony is coming out with a newer A mount soon. With all the new stuff sony is putting out it really is scary to think that they are going to constantly be releasing newer gear that makes consumers wish they had waited a little longer. I think this is something that Nikon and Canon do better is that they are not so fast to release new cameras every month , hahahahaha Sony reminds me of the cell phone industry where phones are constantly getting out done. There is good and bad to this but clearly it seems more of about business practice disguised as better tech for the user. They just released the A6000 with the worlds fastest auto focus system now this new camera is supposed to be even faster and better&#8230;&#8230;WOW&#8230;.I am not sure I can take this type of craziness&#8230;.Makes thinking about just going back to nikon maybe better because there upgrades are usually not that big and don't leave you wanting to upgrade so fast.


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