# Printer Choice?



## CanadianMe (Mar 21, 2008)

I am trying to decide between these two printers. I have a decent all in one now but would prefer a dedicated printer of some quality and larger print capabilities. These are both in the price range I am looking to spend. I have 5 prints sold from photos I have taken and the money I am getting will pay for one of them and my first set of ink, and I would prefer to print my own work rather than farm it out. Both these will suffice in quality for  what I am charging for my Prints.  

First is

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=182&modelid=12892

The Second is

http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/...infoType=Specs&oid=53540919&category=Products

The Epson at this point is the front runner, looking for anyone who owns or has worked with either of these and if they have opinions on them. Thanks.


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## ksm (Mar 21, 2008)

I own and use the Epson R1800> Great printers vivid colors, B&W prints are more the acceptable (although if B&Ws are you primary reason R2400 wouldbea better choice). 

I bout mine 6 months a bo and it cost me twice the amount than that. I think the reason for the price drop is that EPSON is trying to get rid of their stock because the R1900 has come out as a replacement. Soyou might want to look intothe R1900, main difference is it uses some improved inks


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## Helen B (Mar 21, 2008)

Have you thought about the Epson R2400? The R2400 uses the same ink as the 4800, albeit in much larger cartridges. This gives you a source of relatively cheap, genuine Epson ink, and it allows you to use a CIS (continuous ink supply) with the R2400. The R1800 ink isn't used by any of the larger Epsons, so it isn't available in bulk. If you do a lot of printing the capital cost of the printer will be dwarfed by the ink costs.

Furthermore the R2400 has light black and light light black (!) ink, and this greatly improves the B&W output. 

I have an R2400, and until recently I also had an R800 (the small version of the R1800, that uses the same ink). The R800 ink was great for glossy prints, but not as good quality as the R2400 ink for matte papers. I don't know how the replacement for the R1800 (the R1900) compares. 

Best,
Helen


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## ksm (Mar 21, 2008)

I own and use the Epson R1800> Great printers vivid colors, B&W prints are more the acceptable (although if B&Ws are you primary reason R2400 wouldbea better choice). 

I bought mine 6 months ago and it cost me twice the amount. I think the reason for the price drop is that EPSON is trying to get rid of their stock because the R1900 has come out as a replacement. So you might want to look into the R1900, main difference is it uses some improved inks


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## CanadianMe (Mar 21, 2008)

Thanks will look into the 2400 also. The 1900 is a possibility also, but looks like I will be going Epson and now just making the final decision on which one.


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## chinpokojed (Mar 21, 2008)

One thing not mentioned is that the Canon printer you're referring to uses aqueous dye based inks and the Epson uses aqueous pigment based inks. Dye prints will start to show fading within 10 years, whereas pigments can last over 100 (depending on media, if it's coated, and exposure to direct sunlight).

That being said we're very happy with both our Canon and Epson printers (Canon iPF9000 & Epson 9800), I feel like our Canon is the most reliable, but that the Epson has a slightly better color gamut.

We're actually trying to decide if we should get a second Canon iPF9000, or try the new Epson 11880, now that's a tough decision!  :mrgreen:


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## CanadianMe (Mar 22, 2008)

Well went out just to look at printers today and the last stop I found a great deal. Picked up the R1800 for $349.00 and it is eligible for the $100.00 mail in rebate Epson is offering on this printer. So basically it will cost $249.00, just cannot believe the deal, it was the last Unopened one that had in stock, they have 2 others but they are open box sales thus making them in illegible for the rebate. 

 Why I always look through what they have, the salesperson was even surprised they had an un open one. Whoohooo, wow, cannot believe I have it, so that allowed me to buy roll of paper 13" x 32' and 50 sheets of 8.5" x 10" and all Ultra Premium Luster Paper and a set of ink. Went and saw the print Quality and was able to compare the Epson R2400, R1900 and R1800 and I am no expert but could not really see any difference but was wowed by them all, they all come out looking as good as any lab I have seen photos from.


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## One Sister (Mar 31, 2008)

Are you all selling prints made with your Epson printers?  I use my Epson printers for dye sublimation, image transfers and brochures and such but I have been pretty happy with my Kodak Professional 1910 Digital Photo Printer for prints.  I started with the Kodak Professional 1400 Digital Photo Printer but I wanted to use cheaper media, hence the 1910s print kit media.

  I was just wondering about archival issues with the Epsons.  What do you all think?


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## Helen B (Mar 31, 2008)

Epsons are very common among 'fine art' printers, and the longevity of their Ultrachrome pigment-based inks is generally regarded as being good. They also make very good B&W prints.  

Here are some life ratings from Wilhelm Research. Treat them as comparative numbers that don't/can't tell the full story. The three numbers are estimated life ratings in 'years' for an unframed print on display, a print framed behind normal glass and  print in dark storage in an album. All for glossy paper.

Kodak dye-sub 'Xtralife': 10; 26; >100
Fuji Crystal Archive (traditional silver halide colour paper): 40; 26; >100
Epson 1400 ('Claria' dye ink): 'in test'; 98; >200
Epson R1800 (pigmented ink): 34; 104; >300
Epson R2400, colour mode (pigmented ink): 60; 85; >300
Epson R2400, B&W mode (pigmented ink): >100; >200; >300

Based on Wilhelm's testing, the Epson pigmented inks look like they could last longer than the Kodak dye-sub prints. Some prints made on matte rag papers have even longer predicted life ratings than the glossy paper.

Best,
Helen
Epson R1800:


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## veriwide (Apr 8, 2008)

Hi there - first post here.  Apparently  the 1800 does not have a 'Black" only print option.  This site claims a driver is available to 'fix' this. Does any one know anything about it ?

http://www.euristis.com/blog-note/index.php/2007/05/13/black-and-white-driver-for-epson-r1800-r800/


Also, is the black ink on the 1800 really black or does it have gray mixed in ?

I use a Epson 870 in the black ink only setting to very satisfactory effect for my purposes and was thinking that the smaller pico dots of the 1800 would be undetectable with the 1800.  What say you ?

thanks


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## chinpokojed (Apr 8, 2008)

veriwide said:


> Hi there - first post here.  Apparently  the 1800 does not have a 'Black" only print option.  This site claims a driver is available to 'fix' this. Does any one know anything about it ?
> 
> http://www.euristis.com/blog-note/index.php/2007/05/13/black-and-white-driver-for-epson-r1800-r800/
> 
> ...



Not sure about a black only print driver, but the R1800 has both a Matte Black and a Photo Black for printing on both Matte and Glossy medias. Personally I think you get better results doing black and white prints on the Canon pigment printers then on the Epson, but I haven't done much testing on Epson's newest batch of printers (the 880 series). 

As far as a detectable dot pattern I think it depends on what media you're using, and how closely you look.  With a powerful enough loupe you can see dots with even the latest and greatest printers, but how will your clients view it? 

Nice info from Wilhelm Research Helen - always good to give people some perspective as to the importance of coating / placing prints behind glass.  I believe the media with the highest uncoated Wilhelm rating is still Epson's Ultrasmooth matte photo paper (although Epson is not the actual manufacturer).

Personally I believe that almost all the _pigment_ inks on the market are about equal as far as longevity, and the larger factor is choosing the right media, coating combination.


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## PaulBennett (Jun 5, 2008)

Not an easy choice.  I've been researching 13"x19" printers, and following prices of NIB Canon Pro9000s on eBay. Those auctions are now ending under $300. The Canon SLR+printer rebate have flooded the market with (dye ink) Pro9000's and I see Canon is extending the rebate to (pigment ink) Pro9500's so they will hit eBay soon at $400-450.

I was finally able to visit a retail store which has all brands and models, and the salesmen helped greatly.  I came away helped by their details and opinions, which are naturally a composite of his customers opinions. Apparently the Epson mechanism does full bleed (borderless) on all paper types but the Canon needs really stiff paper otherwise count on 1.4" borders. Epson has made improvements in anti-head clogging.  The R1900 isn't a good choice for b/w quality.

The archival 100+ year pigment vs 30 year dye has also swayed me to the Epson R1900. Biggest negative is small ink cartridge capacity. Wish they would follow Hp in offering XL cartridges. Although replacing all 8 colors is about $100+, they all don't run out simultaneously but I'm figuring on $4 dye cost per 13"x19" print.

I found complaints about Epson (and perhaps others) not honoring the 1 yr warranty with sales through non-authorized dealers which includes Amazon. Which sucks as their price is $497 + free shipping.

So I've decided to pass up the attractive $300 eBay Canon Pro9000 printers in favor of the Epson R1900 at full $550 bought from retail store.


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