# re-shooting something for a client - do i charge?



## de_tec_tive (Jun 6, 2013)

I have a new client and I just supplied them with the images, and they've come back saying they'd like two changes to how they were shot which were never mentioned before - they're watches and they want them set to a specific time, and in the box they're in they'd like the foam removed.

i'm not sure what the usual protocol is, as it's a new client and we agreed on a flat fee per image. with my other clients i work on an hourly rate and would bill them for this. should i be charging the full price to do it again? i can't afford to piss them off as i'm low on work at the moment 

thanks very much


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## beanerbeta (Jun 6, 2013)

It depends, did you impress them with the first shots? How much work is involved with retaking the photo? 
Honestly, thinking with a business perspective, they've seen how you shoot, and if they like they're going to go back with you because its a logical business option, I would definitely charge them again, but with also explaining, my time cost money and it was your fault to not say that they wanted it shot that way in the first place.


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## Light Guru (Jun 6, 2013)

When not to charge for rework:  When you didn't photograph what the client specified BEFORE the shoot. 

When to charge for rework:  When the client suddenly changes their mind on what they want or they failed to tell you important information BEFORE the shoot.

If you want to go easy on them you could offer them a discount on the reshoot.


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## Gavjenks (Jun 6, 2013)

Yes you should charge them for fixing their mistakes.  Pretty easy to explain

"Dear so-and-so, Yes, I would be happy to reshoot these photographs for you. There will be a (prorated) charge for this service, since these details were not specified prior to the original shoot. I estimate that with transportation and the amount of time it will take to reshoot these two details, $__[some fraction of the cost of original shoot, roughly proportional to time spent doing this compared to original shooting time and transit]__ is a fair amount.  Please let me know if this is acceptable, and we can arrange a date and time."


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## Ballistics (Jun 7, 2013)

de_tec_tive said:


> I have a new client and I just supplied them with the images, and they've come back saying they'd like two changes to how they were shot which were never mentioned before - they're watches and they want them set to a specific time, and in the box they're in they'd like the foam removed.
> 
> i'm not sure what the usual protocol is, as it's a new client and we agreed on a flat fee per image. with my other clients i work on an hourly rate and would bill them for this. should i be charging the full price to do it again? i can't afford to piss them off as i'm low on work at the moment
> 
> thanks very much



Did you photograph the watches reading 10:10?


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## Patrice (Jun 7, 2013)

I think you should have asked the client how they wanted the watch staged in the first place. When you say 'foam' in the box are you referring to packing foam? If so you should have known to take that out anyway. As for the time shown on the watch, 10 after 10 is pretty standard.

Chalk this up to lesson learned and graciously offer to do the reshoot at no cost, you'll have a much better chance at repeat business in the future.


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## Ballistics (Jun 7, 2013)

Patrice said:


> Chalk this up to lesson learned and *graciously offer to do the reshoot at* *no cost*, you'll have a much better chance at repeat business in the future.



No, by all means this is poor business sense. You won't make money by babysitting other people and fixing their mistakes.  

If there's no contract, or directions to follow, and they never articulated what they wanted to begin with, it's their dime, not yours. They can't suddenly know what they want after you shoot.


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## ronlane (Jun 7, 2013)

You delivered the product agreed upon and then they changed their minds, then it's a new shoot, charge them as if it were. (Just make sure to get the details on the contract).


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## jwbryson1 (Jun 7, 2013)

Patrice said:


> 10 after 10 is pretty standard.



:shock:  Whoa.  Why?  I just Google Imaged a bunch of watches and more than 1/2 of them were set to 10:10...


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## Ballistics (Jun 7, 2013)

jwbryson1 said:


> Patrice said:
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> 
> > 10 after 10 is pretty standard.
> ...



Because usually 10:10 shows the entire watch and it's features without the hands obstructing the view of anything.


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## sm4him (Jun 7, 2013)

Ballistics said:


> jwbryson1 said:
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> > Patrice said:
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L. I. B. :lmao:
I can go to bed now, I've learned my new thing today. 

Question: For someone who does product type shoots, should the contract include when a reshoot would be done and what the reshoot fee would be? I'm honestly just asking, because I don't know if that's typical with contracts, but it seems to me like it should be.


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## Ballistics (Jun 7, 2013)

sm4him said:


> Ballistics said:
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> 
> > jwbryson1 said:
> ...



It could,if you want to be extremely thorough. But keep in mind the more that's in your contract, the more you are obligated to. If you asked this question to 5 different photographers, you're going to most likely get 5 different answers.


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## tirediron (Jun 7, 2013)

sm4him said:


> Ballistics said:
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> 
> > jwbryson1 said:
> ...


I probably wouldn't simply because that could carry the connotation that things might not be as they should after the first go.


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## Gavjenks (Jun 7, 2013)

Unless he advertised himself as some kind of expert watch photographer or something, he should not just be expected to know that 10:10 is a standard. Notice that like 2/3 of the people here didnt know that.

And I assume the foam is like nice fine black luxury goods foam with an indentation molded for the band. If so I would have assumed leaving it in too, similar to velvet behind jewelry. If it was foam packing peanuts then I doubt they would have re contacted him at all... cause that would be dumb


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## Josh66 (Jun 7, 2013)

The 10:10 thing is pretty standard, like a few others said...

Since they are asking for a reshoot specifically because they don't like where the hands are, I'm kinda thinking that they weren't at 10:10, lol.

As far as whether to charge for a reshoot or not - IMO, if it's your fault, do it for free.  If they're asking for additional things that weren't covered in the initial contract, bill them.

In this case, I would do it for free.


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## imagemaker46 (Jun 7, 2013)

Depends on a few things.  Is this a client that throws a lot of work your way and you have a good working relationship with?  It was a change after the fact and therefore it is the responsibility of their art department to give you all the details before the shoot.  If they are a good client and you want to keep them as a good client you might want to bite the bullet and tell them you'll re-shoot it at no charge this time around.  In this day and age there is the risk of the client just dropping you from any other shoots in the future.  All comes down to your working relationship.


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## de_tec_tive (Jun 7, 2013)

thanks guys - I had no idea about the 10:10 thing either! They asked me to set the time to 1:50 to show most of the face. And no I did not leave foam in the box that was just packing foam, that would be really dumb - it was the moulded foam, one piece in the lid and one in the base with the watch on it, they want the lid one removed because there's a logo inside the lid.

I replied to client and said that as they did not specify these details first I will need to charge them at 50% for the reshoot, and asked them to have a think about anything else they might want before I go ahead with the shoot. I don't have a response yet, but it's a long weekend here so I might not hear back until tuesday.

thanks for all your help!


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## de_tec_tive (Jun 7, 2013)

imagemaker46 said:


> Depends on a few things.  Is this a client that throws a lot of work your way and you have a good working relationship with?  It was a change after the fact and therefore it is the responsibility of their art department to give you all the details before the shoot.  If they are a good client and you want to keep them as a good client you might want to bite the bullet and tell them you'll re-shoot it at no charge this time around.  In this day and age there is the risk of the client just dropping you from any other shoots in the future.  All comes down to your working relationship.



it's a new client, i'm hoping to get more work from them in the future but this is the first job i've done for them, hence the confusion about how to go about things and not wanting to annoy them. i guess it is a possibility that they'll be mad and not give me work in the future, but i don't see the point in doing all the work again from scratch for free, my rate was cheap already. i just needed reassurance that it was OK to charge for this


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## manaheim (Jun 7, 2013)

Your CONTRACT (and please tell me you have one) should clearly specify re-shoot charges.  I have this and have it signed by anyone I do work for, and yes ABSOLUTELY I charge them.  HOWEVER...

1. I have everything they want in writing before the shoot.
2. If I genuinely feel I've given them what they asked for, then I let them know there will be an additional charge for a reshoot.
3. If I do not, then I don't.
4. If I think there are quality issues that are my fault, I don't.
5. If they're a really good customer and it's a rare thing, then I don't. (or I'll minimize it)
6. ANY TIME I don't charge for the reshoot, I'll say "Normally I would charge a re-shoot fee, but in this case I am not because XXXX".  The point is they should know I take my contract seriously, but take our relationship even more seriously.


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## kja6 (Jun 7, 2013)

If the "details" of the watch are covered up (like you blocked the brand name by having it at 12:00 or you blocked the scrolling date by having an arm at 3:00, etc.) then, as a photographer, it's the photographer's fault.

Now, this 10:10 business? Absurd. That's ridiculous if no details were covered up. Say you had it at 8:22 and everything was still showing but the client wanted it at 10:10 - that's just being a douche. Charge them again. If you had blocked up important details on the watch, then that's a photographer's error - kinda like having hair in their face for a portrait, corporate headshot - then don't re-charge.

And unless the watch was an Omega or Rolex AND the foam was PINK or extremely hideous, then re-charge them. I'm sure the OP used their best judgement as a photographer whether or not the foam should've been there. Could've been the nicest-looking foam in the world.

.... 10:10.... really?


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## Ballistics (Jun 7, 2013)

kja6 said:


> If the "details" of the watch are covered up (like you blocked the brand name by having it at 12:00 or you blocked the scrolling date by having an arm at 3:00, etc.) then, as a photographer, it's the photographer's fault.
> 
> Now, this 10:10 business? Absurd. That's ridiculous if no details were covered up. Say you had it at 8:22 and everything was still showing but the client wanted it at 10:10 - that's just being a douche. Charge them again. If you had blocked up important details on the watch, then that's a photographer's error - kinda like having hair in their face for a portrait, corporate headshot - then don't re-charge.
> 
> ...



10:10 is as absurd as the rule of thirds. It is literally the watch industry standard(next to 1:50). Not saying that he should reshoot for free because it's not at 10:10, however, to say that it is absurd makes no sense. It's even mentioned on the watch wikipedia page... that's how standard it is.


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## de_tec_tive (Jun 8, 2013)

manaheim said:


> Your CONTRACT (and please tell me you have one) should clearly specify re-shoot charges.  I have this and have it signed by anyone I do work for, and yes ABSOLUTELY I charge them.  HOWEVER...
> 
> 1. I have everything they want in writing before the shoot.
> 2. If I genuinely feel I've given them what they asked for, then I let them know there will be an additional charge for a reshoot.
> ...



no i do not have a contract, i've never used one for this kind of work before (clearly i'm learning alot, which is why i joined this forum). could you please help me and point me in the direction of some example contracts I can work from to draw up for future use? i also need to put one together for future use etc, if anyone can help me out with that i'd be really grateful


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## manaheim (Jun 9, 2013)

de_tec_tive said:


> manaheim said:
> 
> 
> > Your CONTRACT (and please tell me you have one) should clearly specify re-shoot charges. I have this and have it signed by anyone I do work for, and yes ABSOLUTELY I charge them. HOWEVER...
> ...



Let me google that for you


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