# Be careful of where you pre-order your D4 at!



## JerryPH (Mar 1, 2012)

Hey guys, just a little thing to watch for... some places that are accepting pre-orders for the D4 are charging your credit card the FULL PRICE and not doing what most others are doing... which is accepting your order and not charging your credit card until they ship yours.

This is what B&amp;H tried to do to me... I now have 1 additional month of interest charges for $6000US on my credit card to pay... and no D4 in my hands.  *Thanks B&H, but I am **never** buying from you guys again.*

*I'm placing my order over at Adorama, who, after I called and confirmed, said they would not charge my credit card until they shipped.*

Nice way to lose a customer that gives you several thousand dollars a year in sales B&amp;H!  My money all goes to Adorama from now on!


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## DorkSterr (Mar 1, 2012)

I've never bought from B&H always from Adorama and now I'm thankful for it. Thanks for the heads up. Runs to look for latest statment*


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## o hey tyler (Mar 1, 2012)

Well, I'd be pretty upset too.


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## 480sparky (Mar 1, 2012)

Have you contacted B&H and voiced your displeasure?  That would be the first thing I would do.

That said, this is why I always pay cash for my gear.  I NEVER put toys on credit.... that's for the stuff I must have, not want.


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## SCraig (Mar 1, 2012)

As has been mentioned, have you called B&H and asked about this?  I've ordered from B&H many, many times, have never had any problems whatsoever, and have always found their service to be absolutely first class.


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## Trever1t (Mar 1, 2012)

Well not so for me, and many others who have pre-ordered from B&H. I just checked and there's only a hold for the amount but NO CHARGES on my CC. As far as I know you are the only person who has reported a charge from a pre-order...perhaps you should call B&H?


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## cgipson1 (Mar 1, 2012)

B&H initially pulled the cash out of my checking account... but it was back in the next day.... so no big deal! Clerical error or something. B&H is very reputable and easy to work with...  as is Adorama.


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## analog.universe (Mar 1, 2012)

480sparky said:


> Have you contacted B&H and voiced your displeasure?  That would be the first thing I would do.
> 
> That said, this is why I always pay cash for my gear.  I NEVER put toys on credit.... that's for the stuff I must have, not want.



Calling and saying something would be my first move.


...but about not putting toys on credit.  I use my credit card for as much as possible because of cash back and rewards points and all that stuff.  As well, my card has 0% interest, so, not only do I accumulate rewards using the card, I also accumulate interest on my checking account, since the money sits there and grows until the credit card bill comes in.

Putting stuff on credit, and having an outstanding balance that you can't really afford are two entirely different things.


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## jwbryson1 (Mar 1, 2012)

The B&H website says that nothing will be charged to your account until the item ships, so clearly, something is awry with this order.  I have never had a problem with B&H.  I love it because if I order before 3 or 4pm, I get the item at my home in Maryland the NEXT DAY with UPS Ground.  That's amazing to me.

I find Adorama is good too but their sales people are REALLY pushy in my experience, so I stick with B&H.


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## analog.universe (Mar 1, 2012)

jwbryson1 said:


> The B&H website says that nothing will be charged to your account until the item ships, so clearly, something is awry with this order.  I have never had a problem with B&H.  I love it because if I order before 3 or 4pm, I get the item at my home in Maryland the NEXT DAY with UPS Ground.  That's amazing to me.
> 
> I find Adorama is good too but their sales people are REALLY pushy in my experience, so I stick with B&H.



This has been my exact experience as well.  I shopped at Adorama once and their customer service turned me right off.  B&H has always been helpful and responsive.


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## Bitter Jeweler (Mar 1, 2012)

Two sides to every story...


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## Robin Usagani (Mar 1, 2012)

I dont expect many members order one on this forum


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## molested_cow (Mar 1, 2012)

I never place an order that they don't have in stock. If I find that they don't have it, I just cancel the order and go to someone else. That means I don't pre-order things too.


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## CCericola (Mar 1, 2012)

B&H and Adorama are both very nice companies. In fact the owners of the two companies are cousins. So, in a sense, no matter who you prefer, your money is pretty much staying in the family.


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## Overread (Mar 1, 2012)

Have you tried contacting View Profile: henryp - Photography Forum & Digital Photography Forum to inquire further. He's the online customer relations and general sorting things out person.


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## bullitt411 (Mar 1, 2012)

Not surprising to me at all, I don't trust B&H as far as I can throw the entire retail store location.  I purchased what was suppose to be a refurbished D7000 from them a few months ago.  What I received in the box was a used camera someone had just traded in to them the day before.  How do I know this?  The camera was still dirty from use, was missing all the accessories from the box and was still tagging photo's I took (to test) with the previous owners email address, who I contacted and they told me they had just a day earlier traded in the unit for a D700.  When I went to B&H to return the camera they initially went to their box o crap bin to fish me out the missing accessories, thinking I was going to keep the camera if they gave me all the stuff that was missing from the box!  Cost me 2 wasted trips into manhatten and tied my money up for a week.  Ended up purchasing the camera at Adorama.


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## jwbryson1 (Mar 1, 2012)

Bitter Jeweler said:


> Two sides to every story...



Which story are you doubting?


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## jriepe (Mar 1, 2012)

Bitter Jeweler said:


> Two sides to every story...



Three sides.  My side, your side and the right side.

Jerry


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## Derrel (Mar 1, 2012)

bullitt411 said:


> Not surprising to me at all, I don't trust B&H as far as I can throw the entire retail store location.  I purchased what was suppose to be a refurbished D7000 from them a few months ago.  What I received in the box was a used camera someone had just traded in to them the day before.  How do I know this?  The camera was still dirty from use, was missing all the accessories from the box and was still tagging photo's I took (to test) with the previous owners email address, who I contacted and they told me they had just a day earlier traded in the unit for a D700.  When I went to B&H to return the camera they initially went to their box o crap bin to fish me out the missing accessories, thinking I was going to keep the camera if they gave me all the stuff that was missing from the box!  Cost me 2 wasted trips into manhatten and tied my money up for a week.  Ended up purchasing the camera at Adorama.



Now THAT is an interesting, and very troubling story....


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## mishele (Mar 1, 2012)

Long time no see JerryPH. Came back to rant, did ya? lol
Hope you come back to answer questions. 
Glad you got it worked out.


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## jwbryson1 (Mar 1, 2012)

Jerry must be pissed.  He's posted the same story at the Strobist group on Flickr.  I can't imagine why B&H would do that.


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## mishele (Mar 1, 2012)

Yeah, he is prolly going through all the forums....lol


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## MLeeK (Mar 1, 2012)

It's not even legal to charge until something ships. They can put a HOLD on funds for an amount of time, but can't charge till it ships


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## Overread (Mar 1, 2012)

We are quite sure its not a hold?
I've seen someone get very very irate at a retailer for putting a hold on funds for an order that was then cancelled. Turned out all the guys raging at the store was for nothing because it was the banks that were holding funds as they were processed through their system rather than the shop itself (the guy was also irate for the order being cancelled after processing even though he was told in advance that it would be because he lived in the wrong country to get an order that expensive posted to him ).


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## Ronaldo (Mar 1, 2012)

Something doesn't sound right here.  Maybe someone did make a mistake - - but I can't imagine this is policy.


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## KmH (Mar 1, 2012)

MLeeK said:


> It's not even legal to charge until something ships.


Huh?

Photographers do it all the time.


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## Trever1t (Mar 1, 2012)

So do airlines....just sayin'


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## 480sparky (Mar 1, 2012)

MLeeK said:


> It's not even legal to charge until something ships. ........



So I can't buy stamps at the Post Office?


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## ph0enix (Mar 1, 2012)

Schwettylens said:


> I dont expect many members order one on this forum



From what I've read, at least a few have.


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## HelenOster (Mar 4, 2012)

jwbryson1 said:


> I find Adorama is good too but their sales people are REALLY pushy in my experience, so I stick with B&H.





analog.universe said:


> I shopped at Adorama once and their customer service turned me right off.



I'm really so very sorry to see this. We absolutely discourage any kind of behaviour like this. If you have an opportunity to email me with further details so we can ID the sales associate(s) involved we would certainly want to address it with him / them as quickly as possible. Helen@adorama.com


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## 2WheelPhoto (Mar 4, 2012)

BHPHOTO has always done me right


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## IgsEMT (Mar 4, 2012)

I'm with other on contacting B&H. I never had any issues you're describing. Even when I ended up making errors in my order, they were more then willing to help me correct them.
Give them a call.
Good Luck


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## henryp (Mar 4, 2012)

JerryPH said:


> Hey guys, just a little thing to watch for... some places that are accepting pre-orders for the D4 are charging your credit card the FULL PRICE and not doing what most others are doing... which is accepting your order and not charging your credit card until they ship yours.
> 
> This is what B&amp;H tried to do to me... I now have 1 additional month of interest charges for $6000US on my credit card to pay... and no D4 in my hands.  *Thanks B&H, but I am **never** buying from you guys again.*



I am sorry for your dissatisfaction. FOR US customers paying with a credit card we only charge when an item's shipped. We do put a lien, a pre-authorization, of course.
The sole exception is drop-ship items; for those we charge when the order's submitted to our vendor.

For US customers paying with another payment method, and for all non-US customers, we charge when the order is submitted to us.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/HelpCenter/Payments.jsp?cm_sp=Footer-_-Help-_-Payments

JerryPH, I see you're from Canada. That raises two issues. The first is that you're a non-USA customer. The second is that Nikon USA's rules prohibit authorized US retailers from shipping any digital slr to any address outside the USA. If you have a US shipping address, that's fine, but if your order was submitted to us with a Canadian ship-to address we may be obliged to cancel and refund.



MLeeK said:


> It's not even legal to charge until something  ships. They can put a HOLD on funds for an amount of time, but can't  charge till it ships


I believe you are mistaken.



bullitt411 said:


> Not surprising to me at all, I don't trust  B&H as far as I can throw the entire retail store location.  I  purchased what was suppose to be a refurbished D7000 from them a few  months ago.  What I received in the box was a used camera someone had  just traded in to them the day before.


If this was a recent event I'd be happy to investigate this for you. Right now I cannot confirm or deny your allegations so I will limit myself to saying I am sorry if this did happen and if it has not yet been made right I will do all I can to see it is made right as speedily as possible.


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## Derrel (Mar 4, 2012)

henryp said:


> JerryPH said:
> 
> 
> > Hey guys, just a little thing to watch for... some places that are accepting pre-orders for the D4 are charging your credit card the FULL PRICE and not doing what most others are doing... which is accepting your order and not charging your credit card until they ship yours.
> ...



So which is it: "we may be obliged to cancel and refund"??? That's wishy-washy and indefinite. Or, following Nikon USA's rules, *WILL B&H ACTUALLY cancel and  refund orders with Canadian ship-to addresses*?


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## henryp (Mar 4, 2012)

Derrel said:


> So which is it: "we may be obliged to cancel and refund"??? That's wishy-washy and indefinite. Or, following Nikon USA's rules, *WILL B&H ACTUALLY cancel and  refund orders with Canadian ship-to addresses*?



I'm working from home right now so do not know the details of this transaction. If he has a US ship-to address, the order's kosher and will proceed. If he has a Canadian ship-to address we'll contact him, ask if he has a US address we can use and if not, will be obliged to cancel and refund.

Addendum -- in another forum JerryPH posted that he alled our customer service department and cancelled this order, so in this case the issue is moot.


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## HelenOster (Mar 5, 2012)

CCericola said:


> B&H and Adorama are both very nice companies. In fact the owners of the two companies are cousins. So, in a sense, no matter who you prefer, your money is pretty much staying in the family.


This is an interesting rumour that surfaces from time-to-time across the Internet as fact! Both businessses are entirely independent and not connected fiscally in any way at all.


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## henryp (Mar 5, 2012)

HelenOster said:


> CCericola said:
> 
> 
> > B&H and Adorama are both very nice companies. In fact the owners of the two companies are cousins. So, in a sense, no matter who you prefer, your money is pretty much staying in the family.
> ...


I was told once they may be related by marriage but in a close-knit community it's quite possible many people there are related by marriage to one degree or another.

FWIW a piece in the NYTimes this week said, "... one out of every 200 males on earth is related to Genghis Khan." So I guess many of us are related, one way or another.


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## bullitt411 (Mar 5, 2012)

bullitt411 said:


> Not surprising to me at all, I don't trust   B&H as far as I can throw the entire retail store location.  I   purchased what was suppose to be a refurbished D7000 from them a few   months ago.  What I received in the box was a used camera someone had   just traded in to them the day before.





henryp said:


> If this was a recent event I'd be happy to investigate this for you.  Right now I cannot confirm or deny your allegations so I will limit  myself to saying I am sorry if this did happen and if it has not yet  been made right I will do all I can to see it is made right as speedily  as possible.



Henry, 

Thanks for the offer to investigate the matter, but as far as I'm concerned I've moved on.  I spent a few hours on the phone with customer service in regard to the incident, apologies all around from your end.  At the end of the day that's carrion comfort to be apologized to.  It doesn't address the larger issue of B&H misrepresenting an item and costing me my time, money spent commuting to and from the store 2 times and the inconvenience of tying up my camera purchase funds for a week.

If you want proof of the transaction to satisfy your curiosity in my allegation, the return was processed on 01/18/12 with the credit # 372330661

I'm sure this isn't common practice from B&H as a store, but this was my personal experience.

Dennis


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## lemonart (Mar 5, 2012)

Never had an issue with B&H.  In fact, being in Canada with the dollar the way it is, I usually end up getting a deal... Even after B&H takes care of customs for me (which is an amazing option for Canucks).

Adorama doesn't offer this service.  They are also very good but because of the customs option I prefer B&H.  I hate having to pay a second time to receive my gear.  I prefer to rip the bandaid off all at once 

Lem


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## henryp (Mar 6, 2012)

bullitt411 said:


> Thanks for the offer to investigate the matter, but as far as I'm concerned I've moved on.


It seems perhaps you have not, as you raised the issue here. I am sorry for our error and the inconvenience it caused and apologize.



> I'm sure this isn't common practice from B&H as a store, but this was my personal experience.


In fact, it is not "common practice from B&H as a store." Nevertheless, we owe you an apology and we apologize.


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## o hey tyler (Mar 6, 2012)

henryp said:


> bullitt411 said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks for the offer to investigate the matter, but as far as I'm concerned I've moved on.
> ...



Would you have preferred that he raised the issue at Store Ratings & Reviews - ResellerRatings.com - Find Trusted Stores ? That probably would have been the more appropriate place to do it, rather than a photography forum... Where people buy from B&H.


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## zx7dave (Mar 6, 2012)

Pre-ordered at Camera's West....they do not charge your card till your name comes up.


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## digital flower (Mar 7, 2012)

Isn't this type of thread the same thing JerryPH used to complain about?


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## henryp (Mar 7, 2012)

zx7dave said:


> Pre-ordered at Camera's West....they do not charge your card till your name comes up.


You're in Seattle. Neither would we.


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