# What full frame should I get?



## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

I am into portraits and nature photography, I have a side business doing portraits, but not weddings, but might get into it down the road. Really trying to find a camera that can do it all but won't break the bank to bad.

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## ronlane (Dec 28, 2016)

jtfurry92 said:


> I am into portraits and nature photography, I have a side business doing portraits, but not weddings, but might get into it down the road. Really trying to find a camera that can do it all but won't break the bank to bad.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk



Welcome to the forum. You've hit on what you like to shoot and thoughts of what else you might add. But other information that would be helpful to us is what equipment you currently have? You say that you have a side business, so you have to have some gear. Are you locked into one system because of glass and accessories or  are you open to anything?

Getting a camera and equipment that will do it all isn't a cheap thing and one camera really won't do it all.


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## waday (Dec 28, 2016)

In addition to Ron's set of questions, what is your budget?


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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

So I have a sigma 1.4 35mm and a canon 50mm 1.4, canon 80d but really am shooting towards doing portraits, just starting up in portraits and have been enjoying it, and have been thinking about getting into it more. I am gradually getting equipment since photography can be a spendy hobby. 

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## astroNikon (Dec 28, 2016)

There's not many options on FF cameras.
Canon 6D, 5dmIII / IV ....
Nikon D610, D750, D810 ...

It all comes down to budget and specific camera system (ie, any existing lenses that are for Crop or FF, etc).


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## ronlane (Dec 28, 2016)

astroNikon said:


> There's not many options on FF cameras.
> Canon 6D, 5dmIII / IV ....
> Nikon D610, D750, D810 ...
> 
> It all comes down to budget and specific camera system (ie, any existing lenses that are for Crop or FF, etc).



Astro, you left off a couple there.  Canon 5D mk II, 5Ds, 5DsR, 1Dx and 1Dx mk II, Nikon D4, D4s and D5.

For portraits and fashion and landscape the 5Ds or 5DsR could be somthing to look at with those 50mp files.


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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

Ok cool! I will look into those!

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## waday (Dec 28, 2016)

jtfurry92 said:


> have been thinking about getting into it more.


Then, perhaps, do you want to dip your feet in a little more before jumping off the deep end?

That is, why not continue working with what you have prior to sinking thousands of dollars into a hobby? Do you take pictures in natural light? Do you use any kind of off-camera lighting/modifying? Maybe start there, rather than a new camera?


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## robbins.photo (Dec 28, 2016)

jtfurry92 said:


> Ok cool! I will look into those!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk



Check the price tags first.. then you'll get why Astro left them off the original list.. lol


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## ronlane (Dec 28, 2016)

@waday, come on man. Think of the entire community. If he doesn't buy the high end FF bodies and lenses and accessories, then our used market will slowly deplete.


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## ronlane (Dec 28, 2016)

robbins.photo said:


> jtfurry92 said:
> 
> 
> > Ok cool! I will look into those!
> ...



5Ds and 5Dsr are in the same price as the 5d mk III and IV.


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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

I've been doing photography for about 6 years now and I think I'm ready for it, and have a friend who is looking to have me join him in shooting some weddings, so I've been saving for a nice camera and feel I'm ready for the jump. Would rather have the nice equipment and ready to go especially if I plan on getting into the wedding game. 

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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

ronlane said:


> robbins.photo said:
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> 
> > jtfurry92 said:
> ...


Might just have to continue saving haha any money I get for photography I put towards new equipment 

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## ronlane (Dec 28, 2016)

Well if you are planning on getting into the wedding game, make a list of body and lenses and then double it so that you have back-ups for everything.  But then again, that is a whole other topic.


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## astroNikon (Dec 28, 2016)

ronlane said:


> astroNikon said:
> 
> 
> > There's not many options on FF cameras.
> ...


Yes, I accidentally left the older 5D & 5Dm2 off ds etc, but I took into consideration his statement "but won't break the bank to bad"  and kept it to the lower cost options.


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## astroNikon (Dec 28, 2016)

ronlane said:


> Well if you are planning on getting into the wedding game, make a list of body and lenses and then double it so that you have back-ups for everything.  But then again, that is a whole other topic.


and then at least another 1x for supplemental lighting.


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## ronlane (Dec 28, 2016)

@astroNikon, I wasn't talking about the older stuff either. I was joking a little with the 1D and 5D but the 5Ds and 5DsR are newer than the 5D mk III and are in the $3,000 - $3,500 range now, which is about what the 5D mk III and IV are.


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## waday (Dec 28, 2016)

ronlane said:


> @waday, come on man. Think of the entire community. If he doesn't buy the high end FF bodies and lenses and accessories, then our used market will slowly deplete.


Touche!

OP, have you thought about renting a body and some lenses and trying "the wedding game"? After photographing a friend's wedding, I know that I'll likely never want to shoot weddings, and I have actively avoided several other friends' weddings/parties/etc. Too much work for a hobby.


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## robbins.photo (Dec 28, 2016)

ronlane said:


> robbins.photo said:
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> > jtfurry92 said:
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Well 5Dsr runs about $3700 retail, 5ds about the same, the 5d mark III is about 3 grand, the 5d Mark IV about $4600  

The D5 about $6500 or so, just given the original posting and the request "not to break the bank" my guess is most of these will be more than what the OP will want for their first full frame.  Granted, could be wrong.. but eh..


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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

waday said:


> ronlane said:
> 
> 
> > @waday, come on man. Think of the entire community. If he doesn't buy the high end FF bodies and lenses and accessories, then our used market will slowly deplete.
> ...


That's a really good idea without buying all the equipment, definitely gonna think about doing that first! Thanks!

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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

robbins.photo said:


> ronlane said:
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> > robbins.photo said:
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Ya not sure I wanna go that big, just really wanna want a nice full frame, that way I have a nice crop sensor and full frame giving me options

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## Derrel (Dec 28, 2016)

Nikon D750 is basically, the "wedding camera for the masses", competes now against the notably earlier Canon 5D Mark III. The D750 has the better sensor and the wider dynamic range. The Nikon D600 is available VERY low-priced used; the replacement D610 is a better-spec'd camera than the now-aging Canon 6D, which is an economy-based AF camera...11 AF points, 1 cross-sensor point...very 2005 Canon, as far as an AF system in the 6D. The D600-series Nikons have 39 AF points, not 11, and more cross-type sensors too. The higher end Nikons have a 51-point AF system.

"What full frame" is a tricky question. You can allow a 50mm lens to tie you to a future of Canon, or you could move to Nikon, or Sony, and those are different systems. I dunno...Kirk Tuck, famous pro commerical portrait shooter, REALLLLLLLLY loves the Sony system for portraiture. And he LOVES the 70-200 f/4 zoom they have...not the big, 2.8, but their f/4 model. he is actually a proponent of the f/4 70-200 lenses from Canon, and Nikon. Tuck has bought and used more camera system than any p;erson I know of, save for Steve Huff.

I personally LOVED the Canon 5D-III when I demo'd it. I liked the Nikon D4 as well, same day, side by side tests of those two. I ended up buying a Nikon D3x used, best camera ever made, for my uses.

I would strongly consider used, heavily depreciated bodies. Nikon D600,Nikon D800, Nikon D3x, D4, Canon 5D-III, Canon 6D, all bought used, with $1,000 or more right off the top for you compared to new. Right now we are in-between generations: the newest Canon high-MP cameras? Ugh...might as well by a Sony or a Nikon and get much better sensor performance for that type of ridiculously-high MP count.


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## astroNikon (Dec 28, 2016)

jtfurry92 said:


> Ya not sure I wanna go that big, just really wanna want a nice full frame, *that way I have a nice crop sensor* _and full frame_ giving me options


Is your existing 80D & lenses part of your financial equation ??


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## Derrel (Dec 28, 2016)

You wanna SEE the difference between a Sony-sensored Nikon D750, and a Canon 5D-III. From a wedding shooter? Want to literally SEE what a 14.7 stop dynamic range camera can do? This article pisses off Canon people, so...

Nikon D750 Review: Nikon... You've Created a Monster

Look around: there is another web article in how the new Sony-made sensors offer wedding/event/p[ortrait shooters the ability to protect highlights, then "LIFT" the shadows in software, with fantastic results, eliminating the absolute need for fill-flash in many common situations.


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## Derrel (Dec 28, 2016)

You want a NICE full-frame sensor AND a crop sensor? Buy a used Nikon D800. Then you would get a 36-million pixel FF camera, and a handy 1.5x FOV crop to 15.8 MP in crop-frame capture: on the SAME BODY.  All with the press of the FUNC. button, and one click of the command wheel.


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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

astroNikon said:


> jtfurry92 said:
> 
> 
> > Ya not sure I wanna go that big, just really wanna want a nice full frame, *that way I have a nice crop sensor* _and full frame_ giving me options
> ...


If I'm getting what your asking right, I plan on keeping all those and not selling them to get a full frame body only and eventually get more lenses, I'm just building up my inventory to the point of somewhat satisfaction, which I probably won't ever be haha since photography will always evolve and will always be something better haha but for right now all I want haha


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## jtfurry92 (Dec 28, 2016)

Derrel said:


> You want a NICE full-frame sensor AND a crop sensor? Buy a used Nikon D800. Then you would get a 36-million pixel FF camera, and a handy 1.5x FOV crop to 15.8 MP in crop-frame capture: on the SAME BODY.  All with the press of the FUNC. button, and one click of the command wheel.


I've started down the canon path and wanna stick with it I've already put a good chunk of money towards the equipment so I would like to stay with it, maybe eventually getting another camera like Sony, my brother uses Sony and they make some awesome cameras 

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## OGsPhotography (Dec 28, 2016)

Im on a similar path, I think the 5dm3 ( or 4) is where I'll end up, thinking 3-5 years down the road. 10k is scary compared to another 1k for a 70 or 80d.

First, Im going to keep adding glass; 24-70 2.8 , macro 100L, 85 1.2, then another body in the xxD line so at events I can have  24-200 covered. That'll be 7-10k.

Only after that I'll add FF cameras and ditch the stm glass and 50mm and be forced to add wide angle lens FF to my wish list. Baby steps.


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## TCampbell (Jan 10, 2017)

This is mostly a budget question... 

So "probably" what you want (if you could have anything and money is no object) is a 5D IV.  The 5D IV looks and feels nearly identical to the 5D III, but the IV offers 30 MP, a big boost in dynamic range and ISO performance, and a few other conveniences (some of which you may or may not care about... the 5D IV has a built-in GPS, WiFi, and NFC whereas the 5D III does not.)  There's a slight bump to the focus system on the 5D IV over the 5D III but you may not even notice it.

I'm cautious to recommend either a 5Ds or 5Dsr.  These are 50 MP cameras.  The only difference between the "r" and non-r versions is the low-pass anti-aliasing filter.  The 5Ds has one.  The 5Dsr doesn't.  The low pass filter is designed to substantially reduce "moiré" pattern but to do this the filter also fractionally softens the image.  But "moiré" typically doesn't show up in "nature".  It tends to show up in patterns (man made things.)   So for fashion photography or architecture photography you might see moiré... but in true nature landscapes you would probably never encounter it so for those uses the 5Dsr is the better body.  The 5Ds and 5Dsr are ideal for photographers who plan to make large physical "prints" of their images and need the very high resolution sensor to support the print size.  The 5D IV (with it's 30 MP sensor) has significantly better ISO performance and significantly more dynamic range.  

The 1D X and 1D X II are flagship bodies, lower sensor resolution, better dynamic range, but incredibly performance for action photography.  

ALL of these are what I would regard as "technical" camera bodies.  Meaning... they aren't for beginners.  They outperform entry-level bodies by leaps and bounds BUT you do have to invest some time to learn how to use them to get the performance that they can offer.

The 6D is the "entry level" full frame body.  It's much easier to use (not as much of a "technical" camera) but it doesn't have the performance of the current crop of 5D and 1D series bodies.


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## weepete (Jan 11, 2017)

IMO the only choice from canon at the moment is the 5DIV. The 5DS and 5DSR are more high res studio cameras (though the 5DSR has a lot of potential as a landscape camera too) they have lower high ISOs (only 6400) and limited DR.


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