# Well I guess I'll be buying my cameras off the internet from now on



## StreetShark (Jul 19, 2007)

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## Garbz (Jul 20, 2007)

Yep I buy them from photostores which deal with high volumes of professional gear and thus don't question their customers. I would have probably done the same as you in your situation.

I understand what walmart was trying. They just wanted a sale. But the guy at the local store did he have an SLR? If so he's just a bad salesman. He shouldn't be questioning you.


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## three_eyed_otter (Jul 20, 2007)

Personally, I would buy local if they price-matched the larger online retailers.  The thing is I just don't understand why they refuse to price-match when I'm standing right there, cash in hand and all they tell me is the online boys have an advantage.  I'm standing there thinkin' "ok on this sell their profit margin would be smaller but instead they rather have the item sit on their shelf for another two months.", it's the whackiest way to run a business to me.  

But really you shouldn't feel bad; I pre-ordered a printer online from CompUSA and the guy working the printer/photo area couldn't find the printer even though I told him three times "it's over there w/the photo printers."  And then when he did listen he walked right past it!  ugh:banghead: get me outta here!

have a good one
3Eo


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## jstuedle (Jul 20, 2007)

I too found a long time ago the online is where it's at. B&H, Adorama and Calumet. We have a small pro store near us, I go there when I need it NOW. Like the time I dropped my SB-80DX. Needed one that evening and got a new SB-800. They don't price match so that's all the business they get from me. If you have got to go to the idiot store, wear a rig on your shoulder, it keeps the riff-raff down.


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## table1349 (Jul 20, 2007)

three_eyed_otter said:


> Personally, I would buy local if they price-matched the larger online retailers.  The thing is I just don't understand why they refuse to price-match when I'm standing right there, cash in hand and all they tell me is the online boys have an advantage.  I'm standing there thinkin' "ok on this sell their profit margin would be smaller but instead they rather have the item sit on their shelf for another two months.", it's the whackiest way to run a business to me.
> 
> But really you shouldn't feel bad; I pre-ordered a printer online from CompUSA and the guy working the printer/photo area couldn't find the printer even though I told him three times "it's over there w/the photo printers."  And then when he did listen he walked right past it!  ugh:banghead: get me outta here!
> 
> ...



Having dealt with a very good photography shop for 30 years I can tell you why they can't price match.  Often, even though it is not supposed to be this way, the cost for the photography shop is the same and I have even seen it be a few dollars higher than some of the reputable on line stores.  I know this for a fact as I help out the owner from time to time so I have seen the books and what they pay. Have even verified this on orders from some of the big companies when we place orders.  The average profit margin for a photography shop for something like the 24-70 f2.8 L from Canon is $75.00 if they sell it at the recommended price.  Not much profit margin on a high priced item like that.  The owner will come as close as he can to the online prices, with shipping included, and still be able to pay the employees and keep the lights on.  If he can come within 10% of the advertised price at one of the reputable online prices I buy there.  The service they provide is never appreciated until they are no longer there to ask.


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## Iron Flatline (Jul 20, 2007)

gryphonslair99 said:


> Having dealt with a very good photography shop for 30 years I can tell you why they can't price match.  Often, even though it is not supposed to be this way, the cost for the photography shop is the same and I have even seen it be a few dollars higher than some of the reputable on line stores.  I know this for a fact as I help out the owner from time to time so I have seen the books and what they pay. Have even verified this on orders from some of the big companies when we place orders.  The average profit margin for a photography shop for something like the 24-70 f2.8 L from Canon is $75.00 if they sell it at the recommended price.  Not much profit margin on a high priced item like that.  The owner will come as close as he can to the online prices, with shipping included, and still be able to pay the employees and keep the lights on.  If he can come within 10% of the advertised price at one of the reputable online prices I buy there.  The service they provide is never appreciated until they are no longer there to ask.


Amen. Most people don't think about how retail works, they just want their lowest price. But then all of the sudden all that's left standing is Wal-Mart, and all you get is a dimwit making recommendations about photo equipment. Tomorrow he'll be over in lawn-mowers, with the same skill set. 

People, support your photo store. This isn't about charity. If you support specialized businesses you can actually get quality advice and service. 

Camera stores don't earn money on cameras, it barely covers the cost of sales, rent, etc. They earn money on smaller items such as camera straps and memory cards, or disposables like paper and ink. 

BUY FROM A CAMERA STORE. And _PLEASE _don't sing me a self-righteous song about being poor, the 5% difference is a wise investment in the future of your hobby. 

For those of you living far away from a photo store, buy from a good online photo retailer.


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## Alex_B (Jul 20, 2007)

Iron Flatline said:


> BUY FROM A CAMERA STORE. And _PLEASE _don't sing me a self-righteous song about being poor, the 5% difference is a wise investment in the future of your hobby.



Most of my equipment, which is quite alot, has been bought online at one of my favourite online shops. Why? because most people at the local high street (photography) shops treated my as if I was an idiot. I got the following:

- I was told rubbish since they wanted to sell something I did not want to buy. (Plain lies that is ...)

- I was told rubbish because the salesperson was totally unqualified ( ...)

- I was treated arrogantly and partially even ignored since they thought I was not going to spend a lot of money. (Quite rude I'd say.)

I am willing to pay more at a local shop, if I get good advice and service there. I am also willing to pay more if I get things instantly instead of waiting a couple of days.

However recent experiences (several local shops on several occasions) made me give up on local shops, my recent dSLR, 3 expensive lenses, several filters and various gear was hence bought online or directly at the manufacturer.

The only shop where I still go to from time to time, where people are friendly and qualified, is the local Calumet. This shop is the only survivor in my list.


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## Iron Flatline (Jul 20, 2007)

Well, yeah, no arguing with that. There are definitely some idiotic photoshops out there. 

In Los Angeles we have Samy's and Bel-Air. Going to a chain like Ritz Camera is sad though, those guys are so incentivized by the manufacturers that they're incapable of giving good advice. 

Bah, what can ya' do.


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## Big Mike (Jul 20, 2007)

A few days ago, I went to my local 'used camera shop'.  It's just a little old shop run by a little old man.  His prices on most stuff is pretty high but I like to support the shop.  I bought a monopod and I was quite pleased to find a 77mm Circular Polarizer of only $40.

On another note, I was pleasantly surprised when I checked my mail yesterday.  There was a flyer for Vistek, which is a large camera shop with stores in large cities across Canada...well, now they have one in Edmonton as well.  :thumbup:


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## WDodd (Jul 20, 2007)

I don't doubt that a lot of small local camera shops pay more for their equipment. Large stores like Wal-Mart, K-Mart, and online merchants like Amazon wield the power to say you can either give us your stuff to sell cheaper or we won't sell it. 

Just think if Wal-Mart says to Canon, "You need to sell us stuff at a 5% discount or we won't sell your product" and Canon says nope. Wal-Mart then says the same thing to Nikon and if they say, "Yes" then you have Wal-Mart being an exclusive Nikon dealer. 

I'm not even sure if Wal-Mart sells dSLR's because I don't shop there but this was just an example of the power that a large retailer like that wields. I work in the produce industry and Wal-Mart negotiates the prices for apples before the harvest season even starts. They pick what they want to pay essentially because we can't afford to not have their business. 

I bought probably bought 75% of my gear from B&H, I like being able to call them up and have someone to talk to about what I'm thinking about getting and having immediate knowledgeable answers. Plus their prices are near, if not the best around.


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## Big Mike (Jul 20, 2007)

I used to like buying local...the local chain store has a Canadian price match policy...but even still, the prices for most anything is at least 10% higher, usually more, than what it costs in the US.  The Canadian dollar is just about on par with the US dollar, as opposed to being near $0.70 just a few years ago.  Because of this, it's much cheaper for me to order from the US...and I have spent quite a bit in the last few months.


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## YoungPic (Jul 20, 2007)

with reading all these stories and comments it seems that alot of the sales people at the average camera store, not every single one but the majority, don't quite have the qualifications, i called my local camera store to see if they had any 120 film, the guy on the other end had no clue what i was asking, so i just hung up, and when i go into a store and i ask to see something or to get someone to help me seems quite a task since im only 16 and they think i wont buy anything, then i say ok ill be back, and i bought a camera and lens, so i have had my share of frustrations at stores, but to shop online for me is a bit of a mental hurlde becasue i like to have the item when i pay for , like i pay for it and its in my hand, and then theres shipping and borders so i think even though some stores are frustrating i will shop in person rather than online


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## Alex_B (Jul 20, 2007)

YoungPic said:


> since im only 16 and they think i wont buy anything,



I am 35 and it still happens to me  I just forget to shave, wear my old hiking fleece and some comfty run down (literally) sneakers ... and they just ignore me  ... once they even told me they could probably not help me and turned away!!


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## ANDS! (Jul 20, 2007)

Walmart sells dSLRS, but not the high end ones.  Definitely Canon Rebels, and they carry the D40's and the D80 as well.

The only camera shops in my area are Ritz - and I'd just as soon buy online.  

As for them pushing one camera over another, they might not have had the one you wanted, and simply was trying to deflect that fact into a "this one is better".  Bad form either way.


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## JenR (Jul 20, 2007)

I'm actually glad to hear that others are having the same rotten experiences as I am. I thought it was just me.   I feel like I get stereo-typed as a "snapshooter with an expensive camera" as soon as I walk in the door.  Yes, I have a D50, not a D80 or D200; but I know how to use it! 

As much as I want to support my local camera shop, I get the heebie-jeebies every time I go in there. The salespeople are generally rude and incredibly condescending. When I was shopping for my flash, the guy wouldn't even get the SB-600 or SB-800 out of the display case. He kept saying "The SB-400 is much more flash than you will ever need.". I'm not sure why he thought that; since all he knew was that I had a Nikon camera and do more people photos than anything else. I was prepared to spend $300+ for the SB-800, but he wouldn't even show it to me. He lost that sale...  :mrgreen:


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## WDodd (Jul 20, 2007)

I stopped in Ritz camera at the nearby mall just because I was there and I had been wanting to get an RC-5 remote control. Since I knew what I wanted I just asked the salesperson for it and immediately her response was, "We don't have that." I'm like are you sure? I ended up having to explain to her what it was and she still insisted they didn't have it. 

Long story short I ended up getting her to get the manager and have him pull one out of the display case for me. Simply ridiculous.


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## Seefutlung (Jul 20, 2007)

I've had two on-line purchases go bad.  One just last week.  I hate buying online. I tend to buy at Canoga Camera here in SoCal. For an extra 8.5% I get over the counter service with internet pricing.

Admittedly, that 8.5% starts getting significant real quick ... so on large purchases online is the way to go ... but whenever possible I say buy local. 

Gary


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## Alex_B (Jul 20, 2007)

Seefutlung said:


> I've had two on-line purchases go bad.



sad to hear ...

.. actually, I never buy at the cheapest online store, I usually find the cheapest, and then buy somewhere where it is 1-3% more expensive and where the shop got lots of good feedback at independent sites.


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## sabbath999 (Jul 20, 2007)

OK, well since I don't live within 100 miles (that's about 161 kilometers for those of you who live where people use civilized measurements for roads) it is not much of an issue for me. I order it online, or I wait until I happen to be in town... and I am not very good at waiting.

What really bugs me isn't that the locals don't have the same price... I understand that... what annoys me is when companies like Best Buy or Walmart will not give you their website price on something... not that I do a lot of camera shopping at Walmart.

Often, the camera will be 10 percent cheaper online from Best Buy & the other big box retailers than buying it in their own store, and they offer you free shipping online.

There is no sense in that.


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## Alex_B (Jul 20, 2007)

sabbath999 said:


> Often, the camera will be 10 percent cheaper online from Best Buy & the other big box retailers than buying it in their own store, and they offer you free shipping online.
> 
> There is no sense in that.




Same with a large retailer in Germany. so i asked them, and they told me that the online shop and the local shops are actually separate companies, and the online shop does not need to pay all the staff and the rent for places in expensive spots.


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## StreetShark (Jul 20, 2007)

Garbz said:


> Yep I buy them from photostores which deal with high volumes of professional gear and thus don't question their customers. I would have probably done the same as you in your situation.
> 
> I understand what walmart was trying. They just wanted a sale. But the guy at the local store did he have an SLR? If so he's just a bad salesman. He shouldn't be questioning you.


Yea the local shop doesn't sell D-SLR bodys any more because walmart moved in (small down) and screwed over all the local shops. He only sells lenses, filters, high end bodys, etc.


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## Mosis (Jul 20, 2007)

Just got myself a Canon S3 from an online shop...
$289 with shipping fee and tax, never found a better deal than that in a local store.
So far Im happy with it:mrgreen:


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## tempra (Jul 20, 2007)

Worked out that over the last couple of years I've saved more than £1,200 (thats around $2,400 US) by buying online as opposed to local - mind you, there are no local camera shops left anymore, just Jessops and they are in financial trouble.


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## three_eyed_otter (Jul 20, 2007)

> For an extra 8.5% I get over the counter service with internet pricing.


 
This is what I'm asking for.  I'd pay the local tax on most purchases if they would at least match the internet price.  I mean most of the camera shops in my area have been in business for quite awhile, which implies they already do a decent local business.  Why not beef up this local business by giving me the price match when I ask for it.  The profit margin may be smaller on my purchase, but like I said, they obviously already have a base of clients so why not throw me (or the next fellow) a bone?

have a good one
3Eo


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## WDodd (Jul 20, 2007)

That is so true. I know if it were my business, I'd rather have some profit than no profit.


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## DSLR noob (Jul 20, 2007)

I have a GREAT little camera shop privately owned near me. He has a table of opened, used, and older filters grouped by sizes (A table with 52-62mm, a table with 67mm-77mm etc.) where you can get any 3 filters for $12 regardless of company add $1 for each polarizer. He gave me a brand new unopened 52mm Circular Polarizer WITH the MSRP sticker on th eback clearly reading $69.95 for $20 and also gave me a 52mm lens cap for one of my FD lenses I had never had a cap for. I love that place and the guy is very straightforward and honest.


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## table1349 (Jul 21, 2007)

Ok, I just had to reply to some of the threads since my last post.  When I said photography shop.  Wally World, Best Buy, Circit City, Ritz camera etc is not what I meant.  I mean the good old fashion mom and pop one owner one store photography shop.  Most of the people in the box stores are lucky to know which end of the viewfiner to look through.  I don't even walk into the camera areas in these stores as I don't want to listen to the little sales person tell someone that _"You can use any flash with that camera.  They are all really made by the same people. They just put different names on them so they can charge different prices. They all work the same no matter what camera is on."_ 



> This is what I'm asking for. I'd pay the local tax on most purchases if they would at least match the internet price. I mean most of the camera shops in my area have been in business for quite awhile, which implies they already do a decent local business. Why not beef up this local business by giving me the price match when I ask for it. The profit margin may be smaller on my purchase, but like I said, they obviously already have a base of clients so why not throw me (or the next fellow) a bone?


In a real photography store, the bone you are talking about is called going out of business.   These stores were established long before the internet and digital.  They lived on local film business.  They all had darkrooms and hand processed film, not machine processed it.  Some did move up to machine processing for snapshot type prints but still offered hand processing.  Then handled everything needed for photography.  New and used.  Not just cameras and a couple of tripods but everything.  30 years ago there were 5 true photography shops in my city of 400,000.  Now there is one.  The one I deal with.  

Three went under completely and the 4th is basicly an overblown Ritz.  He can order anything you want but only keeps a few bodies on hand and the most common lenses plus a few tripods, filters etc.  Half of his space is devoted to a gallery where you can buy the works of others.  

The Canon 24-70mm f2.8 I used as an example in my first post is exactly what I am talking about.  B&H price as of today for that lens is $1139.00.  Price the photography store PAYS for that lens $1225.00.  What bone does he have to throw to you.  Shipping for that lens from B&H to here $16.00 so the B&H total is $1155.  Still below what the mom and pop store pays to get it from Canon.  You want him to price match, loose money and still eat?  

So why does the Mom and Pop not buy the same lens from B&H and sell it.  B&H is a reputable company, they are a authorized Canon dealer.  You want your warranty to not be questioned if you have to send it in for warranty work then your receipt needs to say B&H for that serial numbered lens that Canon knows they shipped to B&H.  The local photography store is also an authorized Canon dealer.  Buying a couple of Canon cameras wholesale does not make you an authorized Canon dealer.  So for me if the local dealer can come within 10% of the B&H price with shipping, I buy there.  The people there are knowledgeable, helpful and curteous, plus I don't have to wait for it to arrive or pay extra to get it here quickly.

Now don't get me wrong,  I like and have used B&H and continue to do so.  They have always in my experience been a good company to deal with.  That is why the local shop tries to come close when they can, because the owner will tell you B&H is a good and reputable company as well.  But I'm in the heart of the midwest and tomorrow afternoon I can't just stroll into B&H and get the service I would like.  We are too far apart.  There is a place here that I can and that service is worth a few dollars to me.


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## three_eyed_otter (Jul 21, 2007)

> I mean the good old fashion mom and pop one owner one store photography shop.


 
Well in San Antonio, the only mom/pop stores we have are mexican food restaurants and I'd bet we have the whole country beat in that dept.  I was referring to the Ritz/Wolfe jobbers.  

have a good one
3Eo


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## carusoswi (Jul 21, 2007)

It is pretty obvious to me that most here have never owned a business or experienced the hopelessness that one feels when the infrastructure that supported acceptable business practice starts to crumble.  One comment "that a long time local shop already has a base of local business, so, why not cut 'me' a break" is an example of lack of understanding that a business sustains itself by supporting established customers and by adding new ones.  For every new customer, an old one either expires or loses interest in photography.

What with digital taking over the camera market, there are fewer and fewer revenue producing sources for the small camera shop.  Giant big-box computer stores have cornered the market on photo paper.  The revenue stream has shifted from camera shops to those types of stores and to manufacturers of printer inks, etc.

By what means is a shop owner to generate cash to pay bills (even if he/she personally works the shop during all its open hours)?  If the owner wants to actually derive a life from his/her entrepreneurship, it requires him/her to take at least a little time off - and that requires hiring help.  What can he/she offer the help in the way of an incentive so that the help (if they have the talent and inclination) will stay long enough to become qualified to answer questions and give the kind of service the lack of which is expressed in this thread?

B&H and the like used to be the shops you could explore from the back of a catalogue.  Now, they have pretty much become the source for camera equipment.

I shop them and have used them.  But, I bought both of my film SLRs at local shops.  I'm not saying that any of you are wrong to save dollars by shopping online, but you should be aware that doing so does have consequences - positive and negative - on photography.  

The local shop doesn't match online prices because it doesn't make business sense for him/her to do so.  If you are selling an item with less margin that you need in order to pay for the item and contribute to defraying your overhead, you are only contributing to your own eventual demise.  You cannot make up losses by selling more merchandise and creating ever increasing losses.

In the end, we all lose, really.  

I remember when the big box computer stores first arrived on the scene.  CompUSA (it wasn't called that at first) was selling software with a no questions asked guarantee - just to get people into the door.  If you didn't like the software for any reason, you could return it for refund or exchange (even if you had made an illegal copy).

Prices were cheaper . . . and customers flocked to the stores.

Today, you will notice that prices among all the "competing" big box computer stores are almost identical.  The main difference is that the small mom and pops operated by folks who were really excited about computers are all gone, unable to support the overhead involved in operating a store because the big volume migrated to the big box stores.

The same has happened in photography, stationery/office supplies, audio equipment, etc.  Once they own the market, the big guys don't need to worry about service (and have so many locations, they have difficulty in hiring/keeping qualified help).

In my view, it's a constant downward spiral in terms of service that we have traded-in for a temporary price advantage.

Sorry to rant, but this thread touched a nerve.

Caruso


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## Alex_B (Jul 21, 2007)

carusoswi said:


> It is pretty obvious to me that most here have never owned a business or experienced the hopelessness that one feels when the infrastructure that supported acceptable business practice starts to crumble.



i understand part of that rant. but why am i treated arrogantly by the shops, as if they like to scare away potential customers just because they do not wealthy or professional enough?

strange enough they seem to make good profit, and they can afford to have each and every Nikon, Canon and whatever lens above the 2000USD margin in stock. 

Maybe the situation in Germany is different than in the US.


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## montresor (Jul 21, 2007)

I've always been a bit of an anti-booster when it comes to Cleveland, which can be all too provincial and narrow-minded a place, but after reading this thread, I have to admit how lucky I am to live in a town where there's a big pro photography store downtown (you Clevelanders know which one I'm talking about, at East 30th and Carnegie!). I can go in and get anything I need for just about any format, and I know I'll never talk to anyone who isn't 100% knowledgable about the field. Wide range of equipment, film, etc. What they don't have there, they can get for you.

For those of you here locally who want a heart-stopping experience, visit the big place sometime and have a look at the new acquisition in their rental/leasing department, a Cambo Wide DS. Holy mackerel....


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## three_eyed_otter (Jul 21, 2007)

> It is pretty obvious to me that most here have never owned a business or experienced the hopelessness that one feels when the infrastructure that supported acceptable business practice starts to crumble. One comment "that a long time local shop already has a base of local business, so, why not cut 'me' a break" is an example of lack of understanding that a business sustains itself by supporting established customers and by adding new ones.


 
Well obviously this means me so perhaps some personal history might alleviate the presumption.  Up until May 2007 I worked for a mom/pop flower shop delivering flowers (part-time).  I have watched this business get squeezed and kicked around for about the past 7 years by the likes of franchise flower stores, the landlord, the grocery stores, the wholesalers who "don't sell arrangements to the public"; yeah right, the super walmarts, the super targets, SAMs Club, and Costco, oh and the internet as well, all taking their bite of the flower market.  On top of this the owner has a husband who had a stroke and is pretty much a useless jerk (apparently bad/angry attitudes can become an issue w/severe stroke victims) in a wheelchair that she must take care of personally so as not to have all of her savings and retirement disappear before she's deceased.  I have watched how a franchise put a store less than 300 yds. around the corner (technically this is another local business) and compete for the same business.  I have been a bone thrower for this flower shop and have watched the loyalty it has created when a person has the opportunity to overlook the fact that they can buy their groceries for dinner as well as the flowers for the dinner table arrangement in the same place.If a mom/pop camera store can't support the local snapshooters(mainstreamers) while giving the "in the know" hobbyist/professional a bone in order to expand the network then perhaps they are the ones who are unaware of the dividends at hand.
I apologize for offending anyone but I find it impossible to support a business that is incapable of meeting me at least somewhere in between.  I believe ultimately ppl make repeated purchases from ppl they like, but I at least need a reason to come in the door in the first place.  

have a good one
3Eo


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## WDodd (Jul 21, 2007)

montresor said:


> I've always been a bit of an anti-booster when it comes to Cleveland, which can be all too provincial and narrow-minded a place, but after reading this thread, I have to admit how lucky I am to live in a town where there's a big pro photography store downtown (you Clevelanders know which one I'm talking about, at East 30th and Carnegie!). I can go in and get anything I need for just about any format, and I know I'll never talk to anyone who isn't 100% knowledgable about the field. Wide range of equipment, film, etc. What they don't have there, they can get for you.
> 
> For those of you here locally who want a heart-stopping experience, visit the big place sometime and have a look at the new acquisition in their rental/leasing department, a Cambo Wide DS. Holy mackerel....



Dodd camera??? Thats where I bought my first dSLR.


I hate to be brutally honest but there is just no place for Mom and Pop stores anymore. They can't compete and the big superstores make sure its that way. When it comes down to it most people would rather save a buck than support a local shop, if they even know the local shop exists. Gone are the days where you have a town hardware store, a bakery, a farmers market, a meat market/butcher, and whatever else. I've seen all these things either find a niche in the market or close in my rural area.

I live and grew up on a farm and its the same way. We have a small farmers market and we can't compete with a grocery store. No one wants to make a special trip to get fresh homegrown produce when they can pick it up at the grocery store for cheap stuff from Argentina.


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## Garbz (Jul 21, 2007)

It's not a case really of the mom and pop stores being screwed by Walmart et al but being abandoned by the industry as a whole. Think about it like this. Do you think Walmart would be even remotely interested in stocking the pro-sumer equipment if it couldn't sell it to average joes? The mum and dad businesses were founded on the basis that photography was a unique art form. It is really the manufacturer's push for more profits by creating a pro-sumer market with cheap SLRs like the D40 400D k100D E-410 etc that drove the market from a unique hobby enjoyed by a few dedicated amateurs and seasoned professionals, to being a DSLR in nearly every house and mums setting up studios in the spare room of their house.

Photography and associated equipment became a commodity, which caused large chain companies to become interested in the first place. The mom and dad stores became an endangered species long before Walmart started stocking cameras.

Just my analysis of the situation. May not be 100% right.


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## table1349 (Jul 21, 2007)

WDodd said:


> Dodd camera??? Thats where I bought my first dSLR.
> 
> 
> I hate to be brutally honest but there is just no place for Mom and Pop stores anymore. They can't compete and the big superstores make sure its that way. When it comes down to it most people would rather save a buck than support a local shop, if they even know the local shop exists. Gone are the days where you have a town hardware store, a bakery, a farmers market, a meat market/butcher, and whatever else. I've seen all these things either find a niche in the market or close in my rural area.
> ...




If this be the case then keep this in mind as well.  Gone are the days of having a legitimate right to ***** about the lousy service you get from the *big box I don't give a damn cause you are only one person* stores.

You willfully abandoned that right when you abandoned those mom and pop businesses that knew the value of service.  I learned long ago, money like a camera body or just about anything else is just a tool, not a god.  If I have enough to meet my basic needs I'm good.  If I have a little extra to play that is great.  So always getting the cheapest price isn't everything to me.  Service comes at a cost and so does the lack of it when those businesses are no longer there.


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## WDodd (Jul 21, 2007)

gryphonslair99 said:


> If this be the case then keep this in mind as well.  Gone are the days of having a legitimate right to ***** about the lousy service you get from the *big box I don't give a damn cause you are only one person* stores.
> 
> You willfully abandoned that right when you abandoned those mom and pop businesses that knew the value of service.  I learned long ago, money like a camera body or just about anything else is just a tool, not a god.  If I have enough to meet my basic needs I'm good.  If I have a little extra to play that is great.  So always getting the cheapest price isn't everything to me.  Service comes at a cost and so does the lack of it when those businesses are no longer there.



Thats why I don't see a problem with buying from B&H while they have the best prices around you can also call them up and talk to someone who is knowledgeable and in most cases shares a passion for photography. 

I wouldn't say that the people who are passionate and friendly are gone but they are surely harder to find.


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## droyz2000 (Jul 21, 2007)

The store that I go to in Ohio does a some price matching. They are willing to lower their prices to a certain extent. The thing that I like is that I can talk to people and try out the item that I would like to purchase before i buy it. The other nice thing is that if I have a problem I can take it right back and I do not have to pay to have it shipped back and then back to me again. I enjoy the local store experience.


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## gordon77 (Jul 21, 2007)

when i was thinking about buying a 30d i went shopping around for a good 3-4 weeks. the large department stores/internet had the best prices by a long shot but the knowledge of the sales ppl there is basically nill. i ended up paying about 10% more for my gear at a small photo store that employs about 7 ppl. they were so nice and actually reccomended the 400d and a nice lens, cards and cleaning kit over the 30d. this speaks volumes to me - they sold me something that suited me (amature) rather than selling something that would have made them more money. i found out later on in the purchase process that they only employ staff that are qualified and experienced in photography. i am so stoked with the service that they gave me, i would never have got that from the internet or a department store. reading the above by the sounds of it i am lucky that i have a store with such service, i will never shop anywhere else.


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## MikeR (Jul 21, 2007)

StreetShark said:


> Today I went out to pu[SIZE=-1]rchase a new D-sl[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]r and came home with out one. I went to walma[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]rt and they had just sold the[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]re last [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]rebel XT *(all I can affo*[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]*rd)* [/SIZE]
> 
> 
> 
> [SIZE=-1]so then I *went the ci*[/SIZE]*[SIZE=-1]rcut city and the chick the[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]re t[/SIZE][SIZE=-1]ried to sell a Long zoom Came[/SIZE]*[SIZE=-1]*ra *[/SIZE]


 

[SIZE=-1]There is noting wrong with the XT, I'm stilll shooting with a Digital Rebel (300D) and put more cash into higher quality glass.[/SIZE]

That is why Circuit City is in trouble, also CompUSA

I shop B&H now, the Ritz store near me have uneducated people behind the counter. this is not to say that it's this way all over.


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## Stratman (Jul 21, 2007)

Had a local shop even came close to what I paid for my camera, I would have bought it locally. I saved $130.00 buying online through Amazon. If there had been only a $50.00 difference, I would have more than likely bought it locally.  I did, however, buy a few things from a local shop, used, and also bought a new filter locally. I won an auction for a K1000 on ebay, the K1000 came with the SMC-M 50mm f1.4, and both camera and lens were near mint condition. So i also started bidding on 50mm f2 lenses on ebay, to put on the K1000, and was able to get one, in very good shape for $20.00 shipped. Then took the K1000 to the local shop < Creve Couer Camera> looking to get either a flash, or a tripod. No decent flashes, but they did have a bogen/manfrotto 3001 there, and i traded the K1000 straight up for it. Nice deal, the 50MM f1.4 ended up costing me about $20.00 after all was said and done, AND i now have a decent starter tripod.


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## lifeafter2am (Jul 21, 2007)

I am all about supporting your local shops.  I live in a surf town, and you see the people, who may charge a little more, but care about the culture and the spirit of surfing.  It is because of this, that I will always spend the extra money to support these shops.

*That being said*: I bought my camera from an online retailer.  There is one local camera shop here, and I called, because like some of you, I am willing to pay the extra money to have someone to talk to, and to walk out with it right away.  The difference in price between the online retailer and my local shop was $600!!!!  If it was $300, I would have thought about it, if it was $200 I would have done it, but $600 is alot of money.  Now like I said, I am all about supporting local shops, but I was also raised to be money conscious, and that is just a lot of extra money.  Even the markup on the lenses is high .... alas they do have a printing shop though, and I will use them whenever I need a good print.  

If I can support them I will, filters etc.  

Just my 2 cents.  :er:


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## domromer (Aug 13, 2007)

I like the idea of buying local, but sometimes I can't convince myself it's worth it. Yesterday I went looking for a camera bag. I found in here in town for 65$. I found the same bag online for 39.95 and free shipping. I can't bring myself to pay $25 more for the same bag.


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## photogincollege (Aug 14, 2007)

I'm not sure if there are any local shops here but i would gladly pay extra to support them. I am lucky enough though to have knowledgable people at ritz.


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## Sideburns (Aug 14, 2007)

bought my rebel XT from best buy, because it was on sale for about 100 less than any other places...and the only local store I knew of at that time wasn't even local...it was a chain..."Black's photo"

I guess there is one here, but it has a huge Konica Minolta sign in the front, so I doubt I'll be goin in any time soon...it's really old and I saw it on the drive during work yesterday.  Looked kinda ghetto.

I'd love to support a nice camera shop locally, but there's nothing around here like that...


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## three_eyed_otter (Aug 15, 2007)

> I guess there is one here, but it has a huge Konica Minolta sign in the front, so I doubt I'll be goin in any time soon...it's really old and I saw it on the drive during work yesterday. Looked kinda ghetto.


 
May get lucky and come across some ole geezer who can't afford a decent storefront but has 50 yrs. of great photos and stories.ldman:

have a good one
3Eo


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## carusoswi (Aug 15, 2007)

The Mrs. and I were having a conversation generic to this thread this morning as we traveled back from Cherry Valley, NY.  Along the road we passed a sign for one of those large "buy whatever you need for your home from us and eliminate the middle man" type of stores.  I think someone earlier hit the point I would make . . . it's less a matter of the local mom/pop price matching (they cannot and stay in business), as it is a decision by the manufacturer that the service mom/pop can offer is not of sufficient value to support mom/pop by controlling the number of distribution channels so that mom/pop do not get submerged by alternate routes to market.

The business in question is an aggressive marketer in the "buy direct" category who, according to their advertising, has such purchasing power that the manufacturers (of a vast array of home/home construction materials/furnishings) are willing to sell to them at next to manufacturing cost.

Obviously, few businesses can be this important to so many vendors.  The ploy is nothing more than an alternate route to market by any manufacturer who agrees to sell the subject firm.

Customers who get sucked in by the slick TV advertising will be presented in short order with evidence of how they saved $x.00 off of mfr suggested pricing, but, deprived of information they need to compare the actual bottom line installed price.

With photo equipment, the comparison exercise is much more basic and stark.  The mail order houses are contrasted to local stores under the burden of local overhead, local taxes, limited market reach, high labor costs and limited access to qualified labor.

The equipment you buy is essentially the same, no matter where you purchase.  If you are knowledgeable, local support becomes a non-issue.

Reality does not favor local photo shops.

Caruso


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## Don Simon (Aug 15, 2007)

I will buy from shops who offer good prices _and_ good service, regardless of whether they're local, far away or online.

My local camera shop doesn't always have the most competitive prices but occasionally it has deals. If (as is sometimes the case) it can then offer me the product at only slightly more than an internet seller then I will happily buy it there and have the advantage of having it instantly rather than waiting for delivery.

Or a short train journey away there is the best camera shop I have yet found. Prices are excellent (they sell online too), staff are knowledgeable and helpful, and best of all, if you ask for something and they don't have it, they will get it in. It doesn't have to be a £1000 lens. I have seen their staff on photo forums responding to requests for viewfinder magnifiers and other small accessories. By contrast my experience with big internet sellers (and big stores in general) has generally been that if it's not currently "ranged" then as far as they're concerned it doesn't exist.

Finally there is a shop in London - a chain store but a decent one - who I also buy from sometimes. Their prices are close enough to internet ones. Obviously they are not exactly a small local store and they do a lot of business, but still, being a physical store rather than a purely online seller they offer advantages. Once I found a problem with an SLR I bought from them. It was about a month after I bought it, and I took it back to them expecting to be told to mail the camera off for service. Instead they took the camera body and gave me a brand new replacement, practically no questions asked. They accepted the hassle of filling in the forms and returning the camera in order to keep this customer happy. Now there may be online sellers who offer that kind of service but I haven't found any yet.

Having said that, the big chainstores (like Jessops in this country) can be truly appalling... they may have internet prices, but often have sub-internet service. Then there are the local stores who do themselves no favours by not only charging a lot for their products but also making no effort at customer service. If the choice is between these shops and, say, Amazon, I have no reason not to buy from Amazon.

If I can find an equivalent of someone like B&H here then I will be happy to buy most of my equipment online. In the meantime, I'd rather give my money to people who go out of their way to be helpful, and I haven't yet found an online-only shop - or an electrical retailer which sells cameras - who are willing to order small items for a handful of customers on request or haggle on price.


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## bellacat (Aug 16, 2007)

I have not found a local shop here in northern California since i moved here from Los Angeles but i will say back in so cal i would try to buy everything from my local community shop than to go to the big guys. As it is, when ever i have serious questions I will ask them before i go to someplace like Best Buy. Now that said I did find a knowledgeable person at my Best Buy who helped me tremendously. Still I have not decided what DSLR i want to buy but I'm hoping that if Canon releases a new one to upgrade from the 30D then my decision will be made for me 

bottom line i think its worth spending the extra buck or two to support a local shop but when the money is really tight or the price difference is just too huge to pass up then i will buy my equipment through a huge store.


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## Zoso (Aug 16, 2007)

wtf some salesman are the scum of the earth they dont give a **** what you need they just want to make a sale infuriates me

I've wanted to buy things online but I'm too scared I like to buy then and there  Having said that my main problem is lack of what I can buy then and there lame :x


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## redchaser (Aug 17, 2007)

We have an excellent local photo shop here and I support them when and how I can, because their advice has been invaluable.  I wasn't able to buy my latest camera/lenses from them becaus they only sell Cannon, Nikon and Olympus and I was set on Pentax, but I did get my tripod and Crumpler bag from them.  On these items their price was pretty close to online shops to boot.  On bodies and lenses they are more expensive then the big boys but that's just the nature of the business and volume buying.


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