# How to structure your posts to get critiques on your work (C&C)



## Overread

A key part to getting good advice from other members on your photography is communicating this need from yourself to the rest of the membership. I have seen too many people just post a single photo or 20 photos with C&C requested and no additional information provided - simply put if you give nothing for people to work with they can't give you much back. 
So here is a guide for structuring your posts so that you can greatly increase your chances for getting good feedback and also a way to help further you learning yourself.

1) The fewer the better. Detailed comments take time to write well and when a person sees 20 images in a single post it puts them straight off commenting. Further those people on slower connections will find such threads take so long to load that they click off them instead of wait. So post fewer images - post you best. 1-5 images is around the sorts of numbers you should think and make sure they are well selected for what you want to show and not just random selections.

2) The how - an image alone does not convey how you took that photo &#8211; in fact its very hard for anyone to work it out and that will hamper the responses you get if people don't know your level of understanding or what you have to work with at the time - so always try to include the following:

a) Settings - aperture, shutter speed, ISO and shooting mode (manual, program, auto, etc...). If you can't remember these details they are saved over every digital shot taken - just go to the image file on your computer; right click it; go to properties; in the properties window go to the details tab; scroll down to find the settings that you took the shot at.

Also NEVER hide the mode you shot it - if you took it in auto then that is the mode you took it in - your not a lesser photographer for doing so, you just using one feature of your camera to get you the best result at the time. Others can then chime in to advise how you could use other modes to get the same result or better and to be able to recreate the look you got as well.

3) Gear - what camera, any tripod used, what lens etc... tell us what you used to take the shot. This is key as it gives us an idea of your setup and any possible limitations it is having on your shot - or any advantages that you are not using.
Also if your using a compact camera do state if it has manual control settings (aperture shutter speed etc...) or not - this is important as there is no point having people tell you to use a faster shutter speed if you have no direct control over it

4) Lighting - were you shooting in bright sunlight, a dark room, at night etc.. - sure some of this we can tell from a shot, but some we can't - so give us an idea



Ok that is the technical side of taking the shot - but there is also another side to things as well - a very key side that many people often overlook, especially at the start. So try to include the following as well:

1) What look were you going for in the shot = what were you trying to display to the viewer in the shot you took. Also tell us if you think its worked or not (in your view) and what you might like to get better in the image. This is a form or teaching you to think about your shooting and also start being self critical of the results you are getting. Its key that you go through this process yourself since otherwise you won't be able to further your own studies - its also a very good display that your taking things seriously and not just looking for free handouts.

2) What you would do next time if given the chance - it might be what your asking others, but tell us your thoughts on it as well. What (if anything) would you change if given a second chance at the shot - would you use different gear, focus on a different area, compose differently, go back in different lighting etc... 

Always post an image in the thread with image tags - never post links to an image alone. People are often to lazy to follow image links and some image hosts can have a lot of bloat on their websites which makes them slow to load (photobucket, imageshack and flickr do not have such bloat). Thus always have the image in the post itself - you can link to more examples if you so desire.
And finally remember to use an appropriate image size as well - 600pixels on the longest side should be the smallest you upload for such commenting and larger images are easier to commet on as more details are clearer - I recomend images of 800pixels on the longest side be posted to the forum and you can then link to larger examples below a smaller image if you so disire. 

Ok that looks like a lot to put into this, but you get out what you put in - put nothing into a post and you can expect to get less to nothing back out of it. Put the effort into the post - self assess and view your own work with a critical eye and you can help yourself a lot.
Further when getting comments always respect and remember the fact that people are taking their free time to comment on your work and though some posts might seem harsh, do remember that many people just have  direct way of speaking on the internet and that they do not necessarily mean to be nasty, but that they are trying to help by setting a high standard and getting you to meet that standard.

In all keep shooting - have fun and good luck 
oh and have a watch of this - its well worth it: 
Zack Arias - Atlanta based editorial music photographer » Transform :: A short film for ScottKelby.com

I will also recommend his other "critique video" posts on his blog to watch as well - even if your not into people shooting and the industry side of things you can still learn a lot (plus they are fun to hear!)

Further please give this thread a read here and be considerate when posting your images:
http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/...-gallery/183599-notice-image-sizes-forum.html


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## Saddlebreds4me

Invaluable input!  Thanks Overread for posting that...it helps so much.


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## manaheim

Man I wish we stickied things... :thumbup:


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## Overread

if it gets stickied too quick nobody will notice it


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## Bitter Jeweler

Thanks. This is helpful to some of us new folks.


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## gdruss

Thanks.  I know this will help.  I realized after I did my first C & C that I should've put in more info.  Thanks!


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## Roey

Thanks for posting that link to the Zack Arias video.  Its time to get back in the game.

Peace,

Roey.


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## Sherman Banks

Great job Overread!  Hopefully everyone can heed to your advice here and I'm sure we'll see the quality of the critiques improve here.  I'm glad you put this together and if it doesn't get stickied, I'll bump it everyday for you!


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## CyclonePWR

Yeah thanks much, I'll be sure to include those things. I think it should really help out my learning process.


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## AlexColeman

Very nice, someone needed to compile these.


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## biancarose

Thanks for the info. The next time I post I am going to include everything I can. I know for myself a lot of the time, I am just tapping and twisting and changing things on my camera and IDK what I am shooting in LOL

But, knowing that all of this will help, the next time I go to take pictures, I am going to get all the info and come back, and be waiting for some awesome feedback!! LOL


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## Mtalicarox

Great advice. I was gonna post a pic up right now for advice but will now wait until I am home and can get that info off my PC to avoid the quetions.. thanks again!


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## TwoRails

Very nice post, Overread!  In regards to the number of shots to post; even folks with broadband, such as myself, will not wait for a large number of photos to load.   If it's been 5 - 10 seconds and only 3 or 4 of 20 have loaded so far, I'm out of there.

Links have two effects.  Yes, first a lot of folks are "lazy" and don't want to go off on "tangents" and links, but there's a second side to that:  security.   You often don't really know where you are being redirected too.  For "old timers" here, you can feel pretty safe if they post a link.  

However, and this is meant with no disrespect to the newer members, you just don't know what someone is linking to.  I rarely click links but have run into several links from newer members that that take you to someplace that has nothing to do with the post or the photo(s) being posted.  It might be a political site or even some "hotty" poster girl the  OP might have the hots for.  The bad thing here is it very easily could lead you to a malicious site, giving you a virus or the like.  

If it isn't already, links that go to "somewhere else" should be against the rules for the safety of members.


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## Jon_Are

Great post.

Bumping so it doesn't slip off the radar.

Jon


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## sburatorul

bump again!


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## ben306

Some very good advice which I shall try and take on board in the future.

Thanks


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## Bitter Jeweler

Why isn't this a Sticky? Well, not that people actually read the stickies anyway. But it would at least be something to point to.

I'd like to also comment on posters who throw in pics that are self admittedly "not very good". Is it just my assumption that we should post what we feel are our "best" images?


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## manaheim

They don't tend to sticky posts here very often, unfortunately...


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## Overread

An interesting point Bitter - critique on our best work helps us move on from what is currently out best to the next level. However sometime a shot goes wrong, or not as well as we normally would get and sometimes that stops you. If you can't really work out exactly what went wrong with then that can come back and bit you later - best to get some input and keep advancing all in one go.

Also often your best work might be in a limited field area - take me I can take a reasonable shot of an animal - take me and give me people and things start to fall apart. I am sure I can do better, but its a different area with different requirements that I dont know or have - so whilst the shots are lower than my average they are the highest of that area.


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## Bitter Jeweler

Good point Overread. I think I meant that as "best of a given subject".
I shoot all over the place, so to take me as an example, if I go out and shoot people, I will put what I feel are the strongest images for critique. I am not good at shooting people, it's not my strength, but thats the area I need the most improvement.

From what I have seen though, is people putting stuff and saying they are not very good, and not asking how to make them better. How can anyone help, if they don't even know what you are asking? Often, it's just "I'll throw these in". Instead of saying "I know this is out of focus, but what do you think of the composition"...


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## Overread

When I started photography I was plagued by a problem - I didn't quite know what I wanted to improve in a shot to start with - heck I didn't really know what I was taking photos to show either. There is a period of time where people have to be broken into photography - a time when you start to work out what the camera is capable of showing - then trying to control what it shows to show what you want.
Some people start off with a good eye and that can help a lot since they can compose right - but technical might suffer - more people master the basic technical first and the vision comes later.

So sometimes we have shots and we just don't really know what we want changed - this is a tircky time as what people are really asking is for others to show their eye to the learner - the learner then emulates and starts to learn. Essentially its copycat work but its still very important - heck most drawing schools get students copying the works of others - how to draw a hand etc- - then once you have built up the copy skills of a few styles/ideas you can go on to use them together.


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## Crushy

Thanks, ill be sure to follow this from now on.


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## DavidElliot

this is very helpful. thanks for posting this for everyone


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## Omitinibu

I look forward to taking pics just so i can post them with all this information.. so i can properly have my work critiqued.. thnx for the info


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## InTheShoot

Great advice - thanks so much!  Now that you have brought attention to it, it seems rather obvious that the more information given about technique and equipment would lead to better advice given in return - Most especially for those of us (ME!) who are so new to the world of photography that we don't even know what half the functions on our equipment are or what it is that makes a photo work/not work!


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## Elisa Kraft

cool post - Thanks


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## inTempus

I've found that misleading subject lines work great for drawing in viewers.  

If you would like some C&C on new images, try a subject line like:

"I am DONE with photography, my wife just tried to kill me!"

or

"ANDS! sent me naked pictures of himself, should I report it to a moderator?"

or even

"I THINK I JUST GOT A PICTURE OF A UFO!!!!111!!"

The downside is that many times you won't get the C&C you're looking for and the thread will veer off into a flame war.  But you will have 15 minutes of fame and your page views will be through the roof.

Something to ponder.


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## EhJsNe

Very well put!

I thing tho....In paragraph number 1, you have a typo...you have you, and it should be your.

OMG! THAMRSEN! I remember a while back when people were posting crazy thread topics...(You had the Im done with photography thing, you said you sold all your gear and I got pissed at you cuz I wanted you 5d and then I read the thing and I was all "damn, now I cant get the 5d" and someone else had the Alex Coleman Broke his camera...,) then someone posted an artistic nude C&C and a bunch of people went to it thinking it was just another crazy thread title.....lets not have to deal with that again.....


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## vivbao

Thank you overread for the advice!


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## blash

thank you for taking the time to write this overread. Stuff like this needs to be said AND STICKIED.

bumped for great justice :thumbup:


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## Overread

Going to give this a little bump, I see quite a few new members out for some adivce so I hope this thread can give them a bit of help and direction along the way


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## camz

I've been here over two months and was totally ignorant of this thread.  Thanks for the guidelines Overread. :thumbup:


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## gl600

Thanks for the advice!


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## bennielou

Well done.


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## kkamin

I disagree.  I don't know what authority you are operating from, but you are perpetuating an almost super natural importance with gear, and, by having the photographer state their intentions upfront, it ends up affecting the viewers interpretation of the images.  It creates a bias.  You want the viewers' initial impressions to be unbiased in order to learn how they are viewing the work.  One of the hardest skills an artist must learn is to see through the eyes of the audience, or with fresh eyes.  Artists become very attached with their work and it is easy to allow their own perceptions to become skewed.  It is often said that success of a work of art is how happy the artist is with their intent being interpreted.  

#1 (only exception), yes, presenting a couple images is better than many if you want to get feedback.

#2-#4 Why does any of this matter in the least?  Who cares what tripod I used.  Who cares what shutter speed I used.  A crit isn't centered around tech talk--if my subject is blurry, someone can tell me they'd rather see the subject sharper, but they don't need to give me a shutter speed recommendation--that advice goes into the 'photography talk' sections.  The idea is to present your finished work, i.e. the photograph, and have people talk about that.  

This thread of yours shouldn't be directed at the people asking for a crit, but to the people giving a crit.  That is the problem on most forums.  People have a hard time talking about what they see: composition, formal qualities, lighting, themes or messages, colors or tones, posing (where applicable), overall aesthetic, etc.

Usually, all someone who wants a crit needs to say is *c&c please*.

The non-technical advice you are giving, again, is something that should not a part of the initial posting.  Once people start responding to the work, it is then fine to start sharing what you were trying to do.  But if you state that up front you are creating a bias in responses.  And there is a danger in steering the responses in the direction of what you want to hear.

Again, I don't know what authority you are operating from, but I think it is somewhat irresponsible to post this as a self proclaimed sticky.  *

Bottom line:* photography gear is a tool.  It is irrelevant to getting a crit.  People shouldn't be thinking about what gear you used while they look at your work.  This too could create some bias.  If someone shot on a Hassleblad, people might give the image more credit than it is worth.  Or conversely, if someone is an adamant Nikon hater, they might react badly to the image.  Anyways, if you were an author and wanted to post a short story for review, would you include?: typed on Microsoft Word, used spell check and grammer check, accepted a few sentence syntax recommendations by the program...  No, you present your story to be judged on its own accord.  The story is what is up for critical analysis.

Again, the person wanting a crit should usually just present their work and hope articulate, insightful people will share their impressions of the work.

: )


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## Bitter Jeweler

kkamin, that's all well and good, but what most people are posting on here are "test shots" and "random snaps". A lot of people come here for technical advice, and without some info, it's hard to help.

I could agree with most of your post, if only people were posting well thought out, polished images for critique. But guess what! That is largely* NOT* the case in this forum.


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## Overread

Photography has nothing to do with writing books  
What word processor you used in truth will have no effect on your work - however what camera you use does (sorry guys but seriously it does). I try not to fall into the "its all about tech" or the "its all about composition" groups since both groups are rather silly things that focus on the extremes of each area - though inexperience and coming from a more technical background mean that I tend to look more toward gear than artistry (however I do put a part about non-tech bits in the article). 

The thing is this if I see a blurry shot I need to know how it was taken in order to know what its blurry. Sure I can guess why it might be blurry and what might be possible solutions but there is no point me writing out a long list of detailed manual exposure suggestions to get the responce back that the OP only has a point and shoot camera with no manual controls. Further knowing what additional gear was used might very well show that there is something being used that might be hindering or might be used to a better advantage.
You can't ignor the gear component of a photo and infact if anything its a safe component to post since it won't bias the responce (sure if someone hate nikon they might bash the image - but chances are that sort of person won't know very much anyway. How much people attribute to the views of others is their own choice) whilst (as you go on to say) posting other detials I suggest might very well blurr the view to the viewers of the image. 


The main focus is, I agree, to give up a lot of info all in one post and the reason for that is whilst discussion is a great thing it does not always happen and thus the photographer after C&C has to do more than just show image and ask for input since they might only get a line or two back.

There is also another side to this and that is showing a willingness to learn. Posting 3 or4 images and then C&C please is not showing anything but the images and a little line about what you want. I can garantee most people that see that kind of post won't go into any great depth of posting replies unless they happen to know the photographer who took them or happen to be in a dull spot and the shots say something more to them... mostly people will not bother. You have to show that you are willing and part of that is talking about your work upfront - maybe only go as far as technical and capture details (so not as to bias the viewing) or maybe not. The point it is shows that you are putting more effort in and that makes responders more likley to give a better responce back.

As for my authoritory - I'm a guy (though that might be up for debate I guess since you can't all see me ) on the internet. Same as the rest of you


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## adversus

I for one am glad this was bumped, I can see both Overread's and kkamin's points, and I'll keep both in mind while posting my stuff for C&C!

The newbie says thanks


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## kkamin

Bitter Jeweler said:


> kkamin, that's all well and good, but what most people are posting on here are "test shots" and "random snaps". A lot of people come here for technical advice, and without some info, it's hard to help.
> 
> I could agree with most of your post, if only people were posting well thought out, polished images for critique. But guess what! That is largely* NOT* the case in this forum.



I respect what you are offering the community here by helping advance the pursuit of artistry in photography with enthusiasts.  I think you know how I feel about it.  I see photography as all art or visual communication and the technical as means to an artistic end.  So I think it is great to help people realize the enormous power they have in their hands to express themselves.  I think photography appeals to so many people as a hobby because it is so easy to produce an image.  Hit a button.  Taking a picture takes literally a fraction of a second.  Compare that to painting or sculpture.  But the danger in that simplicity is that many people just stop there, at the button push, but wonder why their images are not better.   Here is an excerpt from "The Photographer's Eye", by Michael Freeman.

"One important reason why intuitive rather than informed photography is so common is that shooting is such as easy, immediate process.  Whether the level of thought and planning that goes into a photograph, from none to considerable, the image is created in an instant, as soon as the shutter is pressed.  This means that the picture can always be taken casually and without thought, and because it can, it often is."

------------------------

I know these forums are frequented by mainly hobbyists.  But I still think if there was enough articulate artists on the forums to give insightful feedbacks it would be enormously beneficial to anyone.  The images we create have an emotional and intellectual impact on the viewer, and to be able to relay our experience back to the photographer is a way for that photographer to mature.


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## kkamin

Overread said:


> Photography has nothing to do with writing books
> What word processor you used in truth will have no effect on your work - however what camera you use does (sorry guys but seriously it does).



I think it does if you consider your gear as just a tool.  I think camera and lenses are beautiful pieces of technology, but I don't see them contributing to my photographs anymore than Frank Lloyd Wright contributes the sophisticated, mechanical, dump truck that poured cement at the Guggenheim, a key factor in the architecture.  

Some of the most beautiful photographs I have seen are Daguerreotypes made over a hundred years ago, captured with very primitive camera and lenses.    

There are some specialized areas of photography that require exceptional pieces of technology, such as underwater photography, commercial quality sports photography, high speed night time photography, shooting into the sun, etc.  But most people have subject matter that can be shot with almost any D-SLR.  

Of course there are aesthetic differences in what different camera sensors produce, and if you use crappy lenses it will degrade your image.  But if you have gear that is at a competent level, which does not take much, the image quality is all in the hands of the photographer.  The camera is not in their hands but is located in their head.  When someone hires a photographer, they do not hire the gear, they hire the person who has the capacity to produce the compelling images.  What goes in front of the camera is a thousand times more difficult to master than any technical aspect of capture.

I tend to wonder that people who insist on the importance of gear are just not overly preoccupied with it.  I worked as a chef for fifteen years (before school and during school), and if you made me use a $10 knife, but it was sharp, it would not hinder my culinary art one bit.  I would still find a way to produce my vision.  I use a better knife that costs much, much more, because it is more comfortable to hold for long shifts, it won't chip easily, it's stainless steel, and the edge holds better, but it has no relationship over what I produce. 



Overread said:


> though inexperience and coming from a more technical background mean that I tend to look more toward gear than artistry (however I do put a part about non-tech bits in the article).



I agree.  And I honestly feel the technical side of photography is important, but once it is grasped you need to content with creating some cool images--whether to please yourself or others.   Tools are just tools.  They are meant to bring some type of vision to fruition.  You should respect your tools and care for them, but they are meant to be utilized for their purpose.  Photography is pure visual communication, even if someone doesn't realize it--when I view an image I have a strong visceral, emotional reaction as well as an intellectual reaction to it.  A photograph can make me feel everything is right in the world or it can make me feel like charging the streets and protesting.  

The technical is definitely important when learning a craft but then the universe opens up and you are left with the capability of profoundly expressing yourself in a visual language.

-------------------------------

I do think the problem is not people asking for a crit but the people who give crits.  "I don't like it."  or  "It looks over processed." doesn't help anyone, but does piss off the photographer.  

I think we'll disagree.  I still think people are looking to get a sense how their images impact the viewer.  Not on a technical level but on an emotional and intellectual level.  I really don't care what f/stop someone shot at or what camera body they used.  I just know they made an image and it is creating a response in me.


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## LaFoto

Well, kkamin, also pay attention to the kind of forum Overread put his advice into ... this is "The Beginners' Forum", not one of the Galleries, where - so we all should assume - people already KNOW how to present their work, and have made a decision when they either do or don't add all this technical and "intentional" stuff to their photo presented. 

So for those who first in their lives start sharing photos with other viewers, some of them beginners like themselves, some more advanced readers of "The Beginners' Forum", some even pros who still don't deem it beneath themselves going to a "Beginners' Forum" to give some advice, Overread's initial post is helpful.

Agreed, some don't want to share every detail of their thinking when they took the photo right away but rather hear their viewers' thoughts first.

But what is the case with many beginners is - they never really THINK about why they took this or that particular photo. And in encouraging them to put into writing what made them want to frame this or that particular scene helps everyone starting out in this wonderful hobby of ours reflect more on what they are doing and *why *they did things just the way they did. And to reflect on why like this and not in any other way is a major step towards better photography. I think...


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## Overread

And yet I say again photography is not making buildings nor cutting potatos. Of course one can use lesser gear to very very good effect I have never disagreed with that. However when a person is looking to learn and develop as a photographer knowing what gear they have is important to the person who is going to comment. As I said there is no point telling the person to use features that their gear can't produce because they don't have it - whilst alternative methods using the gear they do have will go unmentioned because people don't know they have it. That is why I say list the gear, the settings and such. You are telling people what creative tools you do have and use as well as how you use them - surely how you use creative tools is a massivly key part in any art form. No matter how good your eye is if you can't hold a bush and paint straight nor use a camera correctly you won't ever be able to get the right images. 

And many here are at that learning level - they are learning to use the tools of the trade; some start from an artistic background and their composition is natural and fluide whilst others start from the technical - they both however have to know how to turn the camera on to create anything. 


And I don't disagree that the level of critique is often low - often its shockingly poor and haphazard - which is why I wrote this. I can't force people to give good critique and most discussions that try to encourage it (on most large photography forums not just here) tends to just get people saying "I don't give it anymore". The fact that most of those tend to be longer term members of the site only harms beginners views as it appears all the "pros" have given up and its beginners aiding beginners.
So I target the other half - get those asking to put up the effort first - if it might attract one or two really good and thought out replies back than the photographer has gained something; and if not the exercise in thinking about their photography (from a technical, artistical or both viewpoints) is something they can at least walk away with.

LaFoto (Welcome back Corinna!!) also makes the point (so I won't repeat) above getting beginners to really think about what they are creating - and getting people to talk about (or write about) what they have created is a big step along that path. I know myself that I wasn't really thinking (and I still often don't) about what I am creating until people started to ask me the question and I had to answer.


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## kkamin

LaFoto said:


> Well, kkamin, also pay attention to the kind of forum Overread put his advice into ... this is "The Beginners' Forum", not one of the Galleries, where - so we all should assume - people already KNOW how to present their work, and have made a decision when they either do or don't add all this technical and "intentional" stuff to their photo presented.



I 100% agree with you.  If people are posting their work to the 'Beginner's Forum' and not a gallery for a crit, I think his guidelines are great.  The reason I was writing a rebuttal to this thread is that it is a hyperlink in his signature and he is very active all over the forum.  People are linking to this from all sections and people are often unaware of where it is located, so I personally don't see it in the context of the 'Beginner's Forum' anymore.  It just seems like a list of guidelines in general to receive a critique.


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## Overread

Interesting point - however you also have to remember that beginners post outside of the beginners area. Infact the posting of images into the beginners section is a more recent change to TPF; in the past all images were posted into the galleries.
I would argue that most more experienced photographers are more intune with how they wish to post and with what kind of responces they want back so the guidlines I have written likley won't affect them since it might not be what they are looking for specifically. However for the many who might not be quite as far along its a refrence point (search google and you can find 1000s) that people can choose to look and that I choose to promote which can help to garner critique in a fashion.


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## LivinMoore

Being new here I found this very helpful! Thank you!


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## bumpylemon

i agree. i should have read this before i posted 30 images for C&C. i went back in fixed it though!


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## v3nom

Found this very usefull, sure wish i'd seen it earlier. Perhaps this could be stickied for myself and other new members that may be wanting some critique?


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## Scarecrow

wow like many other new comers i wish I would of seen this earlier before I started posting all my pics.


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## lyonsroar

I find it helps to use a photo of an attractive female as your avatar. Many comments and critiques. 

I kid..I kid...


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## Scarecrow

so the exray of my head won't do?


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## Ulriksen

I am new to the forums, Id like to say thanks for «clarifying» this


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## Meekminx

Thank you so much, Overread! 

I wonder though- Will a long, detailed post cause many people to just skip your thread? The whole "TL;DR" comes to mind. 

The information is wonderful and I would learn so much more if I included everything you list, but I would hate for it to discourage members from actually reading it all.


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## Bitter Jeweler

I think, the more effort you put into your post, the more detailed responses you get. At least I'd like to think so.


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## Overread

I agree with Bitter - provided that you space out your comments with paragraphs and don't repeat too often most of the regular members will appreciate the added detail. Also putting more up front helps to display that you are serious about things and thus is far more likely to encourage people to spend more time over a reply to you. 


One or two might post TLDR, but chances are that means they don't have much to say anyway


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## GeorgieGirl

What is TLDR???


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## sm4him

Bitter Jeweler said:


> I think, the more effort you put into your post, the more detailed responses you get. At least I'd like to think so.


I don't know; I'm thinking I put TOO much into mine and all the text before the pictures turned people off...on the other hand, it may have been the pictures that turned them off, so I guess I should live in my happy, deluded little world where I think it was all the text...


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## sm4him

lyonsroar said:


> I find it helps to use a photo of an attractive female as your avatar. Many comments and critiques.
> 
> I kid..I kid...


Oh, great, that explains it...just yesterday I added an avatar, and also posted a C&C request...had only one response to it...so if my avatar was female, that means it was lacking the other qualifier... :lmao:


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## Overread

GeorgieGirl said:


> What is TLDR???



Too Long Didn't Read 

*awaits other people to put in comical definitions of it*


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## Meekminx

Oh! 

YAY! I prefer providing more details than less. I feel including everything you can does help cut down on some of the assumptions that get blown out of proportion.


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## dots

a TWDLR? Someone who over edits for the sake of it.


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## Demers18

I just read this and think it's worthy of a bump 

Thanks Overread


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## Archer

Thanks. Just what I was looking for the other night. Now if I can figure out how to post   (gotta go through the tutorial again)


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## Tradewinds

Still great information for those of us new to the forum and photography. I subscribed to the thread for future reference. Thanks for the guidance.

Mike


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## rell804

Here is a picture i took at Night Time from Elevated View of Downtown Richmond VA. I really just wanted a Sharp Image, it turned out Decent In my opinion, but really wanna hear what others have to say.

Camera:
Canon T3 with Stock Lens Nothing Fancy, Straight out the Box.

Settings:
0"8
5.6
AV Setting
One Shot Mode
ISO On Auto
Standard 3, 0, 0, 0


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## rell804

Ooops posted this in wrong spot, can someone move this or i have to repost????


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## kateean2

if it gets stickied too quick nobody will notice it


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## Blitz55

Going to keep this in mind. 
I think I am guilty of it a bit.

I think it comes from not knowing so much about it to provide people with info. When you're new, you kind of want to snap away and then post it and just see what the thoughts are and maybe in discussing that you will be asked about shutter speed or fstop or what ever technical question they may need to give a good critique.

A thread like this is very helpful to anyone who reads it and is new to posting on here.
Thanks.


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## julianliu

great guidelines. thank you for sharing them.


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## Goldcoin79

Maybe I have missed something but in what part of the forum would you post you pictures for critique?


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## Overread

Goldcoin - You can post your photos in any of the galleries we have. Each gallery allows for critique, although its often beneficial to specifically state that you're after critique in the title and thread itself. The only gallery where there is no critique allowed is the "Just for Fun" gallery.


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## soccerjay

Wait why the heck is this not stickied yet....lucky for me (nooob) i found the link in a fellow post, wish i had seen this earlier....


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## Designer

soccerjay said:


> Wait why the heck is this not stickied yet....lucky for me (nooob) i found the link in a fellow post, wish i had seen this earlier....



Someone suggested that it become a sticky, and I thought it had, but not yet.


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## JimMcClain

Overread said:


> In all keep shooting - have fun and good luck
> oh and have a watch of this - its well worth it:
> Zack Arias - Atlanta based editorial music photographer » Transform :: A short film for ScottKelby.com


That link is broken. Here's a replacement:


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## weddinglight

Very Nice post there .And nice videos in photography in a Paris


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## mgblunt

Overread said:


> A key part to getting good advice from other members on your photography is communicating this need from yourself to the rest of the membership. I have seen too many people just post a single photo or 20 photos with C&C requested and no additional information provided - simply put if you give nothing for people to work with they can't give you much back.
> So here is a guide for structuring your posts so that you can greatly increase your chances for getting good feedback and also a way to help further you learning yourself.
> 
> 1) The fewer the better. Detailed comments take time to write well and when a person sees 20 images in a single post it puts them straight off commenting. Further those people on slower connections will find such threads take so long to load that they click off them instead of wait. So post fewer images - post you best. 1-5 images is around the sorts of numbers you should think and make sure they are well selected for what you want to show and not just random selections.
> 
> 2) The how - an image alone does not convey how you took that photo &#8211; in fact its very hard for anyone to work it out and that will hamper the responses you get if people don't know your level of understanding or what you have to work with at the time - so always try to include the following:
> 
> a) Settings - aperture, shutter speed, ISO and shooting mode (manual, program, auto, etc...). If you can't remember these details they are saved over every digital shot taken - just go to the image file on your computer; right click it; go to properties; in the properties window go to the details tab; scroll down to find the settings that you took the shot at.
> 
> Also NEVER hide the mode you shot it - if you took it in auto then that is the mode you took it in - your not a lesser photographer for doing so, you just using one feature of your camera to get you the best result at the time. Others can then chime in to advise how you could use other modes to get the same result or better and to be able to recreate the look you got as well.
> 
> 3) Gear - what camera, any tripod used, what lens etc... tell us what you used to take the shot. This is key as it gives us an idea of your setup and any possible limitations it is having on your shot - or any advantages that you are not using.
> Also if your using a compact camera do state if it has manual control settings (aperture shutter speed etc...) or not - this is important as there is no point having people tell you to use a faster shutter speed if you have no direct control over it
> 
> 4) Lighting - were you shooting in bright sunlight, a dark room, at night etc.. - sure some of this we can tell from a shot, but some we can't - so give us an idea
> 
> 
> 
> Ok that is the technical side of taking the shot - but there is also another side to things as well - a very key side that many people often overlook, especially at the start. So try to include the following as well:
> 
> 1) What look were you going for in the shot = what were you trying to display to the viewer in the shot you took. Also tell us if you think its worked or not (in your view) and what you might like to get better in the image. This is a form or teaching you to think about your shooting and also start being self critical of the results you are getting. Its key that you go through this process yourself since otherwise you won't be able to further your own studies - its also a very good display that your taking things seriously and not just looking for free handouts.
> 
> 2) What you would do next time if given the chance - it might be what your asking others, but tell us your thoughts on it as well. What (if anything) would you change if given a second chance at the shot - would you use different gear, focus on a different area, compose differently, go back in different lighting etc...
> 
> Always post an image in the thread with image tags - never post links to an image alone. People are often to lazy to follow image links and some image hosts can have a lot of bloat on their websites which makes them slow to load (photobucket, imageshack and flickr do not have such bloat). Thus always have the image in the post itself - you can link to more examples if you so desire.
> And finally remember to use an appropriate image size as well - 600pixels on the longest side should be the smallest you upload for such commenting and larger images are easier to commet on as more details are clearer - I recomend images of 800pixels on the longest side be posted to the forum and you can then link to larger examples below a smaller image if you so disire.
> 
> Ok that looks like a lot to put into this, but you get out what you put in - put nothing into a post and you can expect to get less to nothing back out of it. Put the effort into the post - self assess and view your own work with a critical eye and you can help yourself a lot.
> Further when getting comments always respect and remember the fact that people are taking their free time to comment on your work and though some posts might seem harsh, do remember that many people just have  direct way of speaking on the internet and that they do not necessarily mean to be nasty, but that they are trying to help by setting a high standard and getting you to meet that standard.
> 
> In all keep shooting - have fun and good luck
> oh and have a watch of this - its well worth it:
> Zack Arias - Atlanta based editorial music photographer » Transform :: A short film for ScottKelby.com
> 
> I will also recommend his other "critique video" posts on his blog to watch as well - even if your not into people shooting and the industry side of things you can still learn a lot (plus they are fun to hear!)
> 
> Further please give this thread a read here and be considerate when posting your images:
> Notice on image sizes in the forum | Photography Forum


Thank you for this post I now have a better understanding of what is expected of me when I request a critique .


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## donny1963

Yeah I would agree with that,  I see people just post a portrait, and then say nothing, people will check it out and they think to them self,
"yup, that's a portrait"  and then move on,  As you stated always a good idea to lead some one to a comment, and that is a fairly easy thing to do, both positive and neg lol

I like this post..









Overread said:


> A key part to getting good advice from other members on your photography is communicating this need from yourself to the rest of the membership. I have seen too many people just post a single photo or 20 photos with C&C requested and no additional information provided - simply put if you give nothing for people to work with they can't give you much back.
> So here is a guide for structuring your posts so that you can greatly increase your chances for getting good feedback and also a way to help further you learning yourself.
> 
> 1) The fewer the better. Detailed comments take time to write well and when a person sees 20 images in a single post it puts them straight off commenting. Further those people on slower connections will find such threads take so long to load that they click off them instead of wait. So post fewer images - post you best. 1-5 images is around the sorts of numbers you should think and make sure they are well selected for what you want to show and not just random selections.
> 
> 2) The how - an image alone does not convey how you took that photo &#8211; in fact its very hard for anyone to work it out and that will hamper the responses you get if people don't know your level of understanding or what you have to work with at the time - so always try to include the following:
> 
> a) Settings - aperture, shutter speed, ISO and shooting mode (manual, program, auto, etc...). If you can't remember these details they are saved over every digital shot taken - just go to the image file on your computer; right click it; go to properties; in the properties window go to the details tab; scroll down to find the settings that you took the shot at.
> 
> Also NEVER hide the mode you shot it - if you took it in auto then that is the mode you took it in - your not a lesser photographer for doing so, you just using one feature of your camera to get you the best result at the time. Others can then chime in to advise how you could use other modes to get the same result or better and to be able to recreate the look you got as well.
> 
> 3) Gear - what camera, any tripod used, what lens etc... tell us what you used to take the shot. This is key as it gives us an idea of your setup and any possible limitations it is having on your shot - or any advantages that you are not using.
> Also if your using a compact camera do state if it has manual control settings (aperture shutter speed etc...) or not - this is important as there is no point having people tell you to use a faster shutter speed if you have no direct control over it
> 
> 4) Lighting - were you shooting in bright sunlight, a dark room, at night etc.. - sure some of this we can tell from a shot, but some we can't - so give us an idea
> 
> 
> 
> Ok that is the technical side of taking the shot - but there is also another side to things as well - a very key side that many people often overlook, especially at the start. So try to include the following as well:
> 
> 1) What look were you going for in the shot = what were you trying to display to the viewer in the shot you took. Also tell us if you think its worked or not (in your view) and what you might like to get better in the image. This is a form or teaching you to think about your shooting and also start being self critical of the results you are getting. Its key that you go through this process yourself since otherwise you won't be able to further your own studies - its also a very good display that your taking things seriously and not just looking for free handouts.
> 
> 2) What you would do next time if given the chance - it might be what your asking others, but tell us your thoughts on it as well. What (if anything) would you change if given a second chance at the shot - would you use different gear, focus on a different area, compose differently, go back in different lighting etc...
> 
> Always post an image in the thread with image tags - never post links to an image alone. People are often to lazy to follow image links and some image hosts can have a lot of bloat on their websites which makes them slow to load (photobucket, imageshack and flickr do not have such bloat). Thus always have the image in the post itself - you can link to more examples if you so desire.
> And finally remember to use an appropriate image size as well - 600pixels on the longest side should be the smallest you upload for such commenting and larger images are easier to commet on as more details are clearer - I recomend images of 800pixels on the longest side be posted to the forum and you can then link to larger examples below a smaller image if you so disire.
> 
> Ok that looks like a lot to put into this, but you get out what you put in - put nothing into a post and you can expect to get less to nothing back out of it. Put the effort into the post - self assess and view your own work with a critical eye and you can help yourself a lot.
> Further when getting comments always respect and remember the fact that people are taking their free time to comment on your work and though some posts might seem harsh, do remember that many people just have  direct way of speaking on the internet and that they do not necessarily mean to be nasty, but that they are trying to help by setting a high standard and getting you to meet that standard.
> 
> In all keep shooting - have fun and good luck
> oh and have a watch of this - its well worth it:
> Zack Arias - Atlanta based editorial music photographer » Transform :: A short film for ScottKelby.com
> 
> I will also recommend his other "critique video" posts on his blog to watch as well - even if your not into people shooting and the industry side of things you can still learn a lot (plus they are fun to hear!)
> 
> Further please give this thread a read here and be considerate when posting your images:
> Notice on image sizes in the forum


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## JinxyCatInk

Awesome advice, i will be noting this down!


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