# Worthy of Charging?



## ajcv75

Hi guys, this is my first post on this site! A little about me, I have been in photography since 10th grade but it wasn't until recently I started formal training under the NYIP Professional Photography course. I have upgraded my dslr Nikon bodies from the D3100 - D7000 -D610. Now I have been contacted by an individual to shoot formal pictures in a prom but they can't pay me per say for those hours. Specifically, it's more like whoever wants to take pictures and pays me, then they get a picture taken. My question, which sounds sad, is how should I go at it? Are my pictures worthy of being sold? By no means do I say this as if I'm sinking myself but rather would love to have the eye of other photographers see and constructively criticize my work. I will post the link to my portfolio and would love to hear your input. Thank you so much! 

www.angelcuadradophotography.com


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## Designer

If you can be paid up front, that is preferential to trying to be paid later.  If they pay, give them a link to a place where they can download the photo.  If you can't be paid at the time, post very small photos with an option to get a larger file upon payment.


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## tirediron

Designer said:


> If you can be paid up front, that is preferential to trying to be paid later.


In general, yes, but for a beginner, I would recommend against it.  Unless you're very confident in your work (and the question about being worthy of charging indicates you're not) it's a sort of security blanket; in other words, if something goes wrong and someone doesn't like their images, the client hasn't paid you anything so they don't have a lot of room to complain, whereas if they've paid you $50 or $100...  you have a lot more of an obligation.

Your work looks decent; I have the impression you perhaps don't have a lot of experience in posing people, you seem to be using off-camera lighting so that's a good start, but you need to be prepared for the odd-ball stuff.  Very tall, very short, and/or very fat people.  Light skin/dark skin couples... There's a LOT to think about to do this well.

That said, I do a lot of this sort of work at events, and it's a lot of fun.  It's important to remember that you're going for a mean, rather than individual optimum, that is:  You need to choose a lighting that will work well for most circumstances because you likely won't have time to adjust for each client.


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## ajcv75

tirediron said:


> Designer said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you can be paid up front, that is preferential to trying to be paid later.
> 
> 
> 
> In general, yes, but for a beginner, I would recommend against it.  Unless you're very confident in your work (and the question about being worthy of charging indicates you're not) it's a sort of security blanket; in other words, if something goes wrong and someone doesn't like their images, the client hasn't paid you anything so they don't have a lot of room to complain, whereas if they've paid you $50 or $100...  you have a lot more of an obligation.
> 
> Your work looks decent; I have the impression you perhaps don't have a lot of experience in posing people, you seem to be using off-camera lighting so that's a good start, but you need to be prepared for the odd-ball stuff.  Very tall, very short, and/or very fat people.  Light skin/dark skin couples... There's a LOT to think about to do this well.
> 
> That said, I do a lot of this sort of work at events, and it's a lot of fun.  It's important to remember that you're going for a mean, rather than individual optimum, that is:  You need to choose a lighting that will work well for most circumstances because you likely won't have time to adjust for each client.
Click to expand...

Thank you! In your experience, as a beginner I should just take their information, give them mine and make each customer a password protected page for them to see their work? If I do that, how should I sell the images? Do packages work best rather than single images? I'm sorry for asking so much, I am aware there are many aspects to the business side of photography. Also wanted to know more about that Mentoring Program. Could you PM me the info?


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## ajcv75

Designer said:


> If you can be paid up front, that is preferential to trying to be paid later.  If they pay, give them a link to a place where they can download the photo.  If you can't be paid at the time, post very small photos with an option to get a larger file upon payment.


Thank you so much for the information! I will have that in mind for the next time!! I appreciate it!!


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## tirediron

I rarely take payment in advance.  My system is to have a form on a clipboard (actually several clipboards) for the client to fill out while they're waiting.  Name, tel #, address, e-mail, etc.  They hand me their form and I write their name on a whiteboard and the first shot is always a 'prison line-up' shot with them holding their name up; that way I can always go back and figure out who's who.

I then do a rough process on all the keepers (WB, colour, crop, straighten) and e-mail proofs (72ppi, max 300 pixels on the long edge, with a shallow opacity watermark across the image), and they tell me what they want, I have it printed and mail/deliver it.  I don't offer packages, but there's nothing wrong with them, it's just not my thing.  I prefer to e-mail the client directly (assuming they don't live nearby; if they do, I always try and visit them in their home) rather than just posting a gallery as it helps to establish and maintain communication and they're more likely to purchase. 

Make sure you have your prices plainly visible as well as mailing/delivery fees and expect to have 20-25% 'tire-kickers', that is people who sit for a photo and are never heard from again.

There's a great post on the mentorship scheme you can read by following the link in my sig.


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## ajcv75

tirediron said:


> I rarely take payment in advance.  My system is to have a form on a clipboard (actually several clipboards) for the client to fill out while they're waiting.  Name, tel #, address, e-mail, etc.  They hand me their form and I write their name on a whiteboard and the first shot is always a 'prison line-up' shot with them holding their name up; that way I can always go back and figure out who's who.
> 
> I then do a rough process on all the keepers (WB, colour, crop, straighten) and e-mail proofs (72ppi, max 300 pixels on the long edge, with a shallow opacity watermark across the image), and they tell me what they want, I have it printed and mail/deliver it.  I don't offer packages, but there's nothing wrong with them, it's just not my thing.  I prefer to e-mail the client directly (assuming they don't live nearby; if they do, I always try and visit them in their home) rather than just posting a gallery as it helps to establish and maintain communication and they're more likely to purchase.
> 
> Make sure you have your prices plainly visible as well as mailing/delivery fees and expect to have 20-25% 'tire-kickers', that is people who sit for a photo and are never heard from again.
> 
> There's a great post on the mentorship scheme you can read by following the link in my sig.


This is super great! Thank you


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## jennings_w

FYI, you need a minor fix to your website. In your portfolio section, relabel "Shootings" to "Portraits". To a native English speaker, this does not come across as how you intended. When most people hear "shootings", they think gun shots.


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## Derrel

Take a modest on-the-spot amount of payment...say $10 or so, at least...that cuts the tire kicker factor in half....a "free sitting" can be interpreted to mean that your work isn't any good. Almost every parent will want a nice, formal prom photo, but *make sure to get some up-front cash* from each prom couple. As Tirediron mentioned, have the prices plainly posted, get good, adequate contact information from, BOTH the boy AND the girl, and a quick description of the people who are in the shots, so there are no accidental "oops!" deliveries later. Of course, start with the camera's counter set to DSC_0001, and so on.

I looked at this: Shootings

You can do this.

Keep in mind--without ANY up-front sitting fee, if you shoot 50 couples, you will have in-hand, at night's end... let me do the math...lemme see...Zero. But 50 times $10 is....why....it's five HUNDRED dollars...huh..better re-check my math here....yep, keeps coming up as $500 dollars!

If you shoot for FREE, you leave the prom with zero payment in-hand.


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## ajcv75

jennings_w said:


> FYI, you need a minor fix to your website. In your portfolio section, relabel "Shootings" to "Portraits". To a native English speaker, this does not come across as how you intended. When most people hear "shootings", they think gun shots.


Will do thank you for that!


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## ajcv75

Derrel said:


> Take a modest on-the-spot amount of payment...say $10 or so, at least...that cuts the tire kicker factor in half....a "free sitting" can be interpreted to mean that your work isn't any good. Almost every parent will want a nice, formal prom photo, but *make sure to get some up-front cash* from each prom couple. As Tirediron mentioned, have the prices plainly posted, get good, adequate contact information from, BOTH the boy AND the girl, and a quick description of the people who are in the shots, so there are no accidental "oops!" deliveries later. Of course, start with the camera's counter set to DSC_0001, and so on.
> 
> I looked at this: Shootings
> 
> You can do this.
> 
> Keep in mind--without ANY up-front sitting fee, if you shoot 50 couples, you will have in-hand, at night's end... let me do the math...lemme see..50 times $10 is....why....it's five HUNDRED dollars...huh..better re-check my math here....yep, keeps coming up as $500 dollars!
> 
> If you shoot for FREE, you leave the prom with zero payment in-hand.


Great tip!! Thank yoy so much for the information and the help!! I will do this!!


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## Watchful

I noticed on your site, the "portfolio" link is inactive, it should link to a page that lists the items in the drop down menu with an interesting looking page itself in case someone wants to view the dropdown menu as a page to select from. It can have the links that are in the menu and give a small thumbnail image for each type of photography.

Here are a few other items on your main page that need to be addressed:
Due to the site trying to turn letter combinations into faces, "x m l n s : o g " (no spaces) is turned into a face.

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From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201

type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head


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From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201

type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head


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From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201

type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head


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From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201

type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head


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From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201

type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head


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type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head


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From line 5, column 1; to line 5, column 62

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From line 201, column 61; to line 201, column 105

wn-hover"><ul id="nav" data-content-field="navigation">↩ ↩↩


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From line 65, column 26; to line 65, column 38

main-nav"><ul id="nav">↩ ↩↩


*Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.

From line 362, column 351; to line 362, column 967

/noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="#justgoshoot #peoplescreatives #visualsoflife #funkopop #smallfigure #…ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="571ab52888eb5164e8b337c5" data-type="image" />↩

Attributes for element img:
Global attributes
alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
src - Address of the resource
srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
usemap - Name of image map to use
ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
width - Horizontal dimension
height - Vertical dimension
*Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.

From line 393, column 167; to line 394, column 576

/noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="Por ahí en Bayamón↩#justgoshoot #peoplescreatives #visualsoflife #funkopop #smallfigure #pr #longexposure #flash #photo…ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="5719ac9df0bc3393da5adc1a" data-type="image" />↩

Attributes for element img:
Global attributes
alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
src - Address of the resource
srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
usemap - Name of image map to use
ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
width - Horizontal dimension
height - Vertical dimension
*Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.

From line 423, column 368; to line 423, column 1001

/noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="#justgoshoot #peoplescreatives #visualsoflife #funkopop #smallfigure #…ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="5718f9cd554f016efb058dcb" data-type="image" />↩

Attributes for element img:
Global attributes
alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
src - Address of the resource
srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
usemap - Name of image map to use
ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
width - Horizontal dimension
height - Vertical dimension
*Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.

From line 456, column 170; to line 458, column 579

/noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="The One with the Funko Pop!↩↩@popvinyl @daily_funko #showcase #chandler #comedy #photography #nikon #commentonthis # followmyart …ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="5718257975bcc074369ceef8" data-type="image" />↩

Attributes for element img:
Global attributes
alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
src - Address of the resource
srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
usemap - Name of image map to use
ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
width - Horizontal dimension
height - Vertical dimension
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From line 479, column 1; to line 479, column 44

/div>↩↩↩↩↩<style type="text/css" id="design-grid-css">↩#bloc

Contexts in which element style may be used:
If the scoped attribute is absent: where metadata content is expected.
If the scoped attribute is absent: in a noscript element that is a child of a head element.
If the scoped attribute is present: where flow content is expected, but before any other flow content other than inter-element whitespace and style elements, and not as the child of an element whose content model is transparent.
Content model for element div:
Flow content.
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eWrapper"><section id="page">↩


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>↩ <center><a hre
Good Luck.


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## table1349

Watchful said:


> I noticed on your site, the "portfolio" link is inactive, it should link to a page that lists the items in the drop down menu with an interesting looking page itself in case someone wants to view the dropdown menu as a page to select from. It can have the links that are in the menu and give a small thumbnail image for each type of photography.
> 
> Here are a few other items on your main page that need to be addressed:
> Due to the site trying to turn letter combinations into faces, "x m l n s : o g " (no spaces) is turned into a face.
> 
> *Error*: Attribute xmlnsg not allowed here.
> 
> From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201
> 
> type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head
> 
> 
> *Warning*: Attribute with the local name xmlnsg is not serializable as XML 1.0.
> 
> From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201
> 
> type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head
> 
> 
> *Error*: Attribute xmlns:fb not allowed here.
> 
> From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201
> 
> type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head
> 
> 
> *Warning*: Attribute with the local name xmlns:fb is not serializable as XML 1.0.
> 
> From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201
> 
> type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head
> 
> 
> *Error*: Attribute xmlns:website not allowed here.
> 
> From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201
> 
> type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head
> 
> 
> *Warning*: Attribute with the local name xmlns:website is not serializable as XML 1.0.
> 
> From line 1, column 16; to line 2, column 201
> 
> type html>↩<html xmlnsg="Open Graph protocol" xmlns:fb="http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" x…lns:website="http://ogp.me/ns/website" lang="en-US" itemscope itemtype="WebPage - schema.org" >↩<head
> 
> 
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> 
> From line 5, column 1; to line 5, column 62
> 
> ↩<head> ↩↩<meta http-equiv="X-UA-Compatible" content="IE=edge,chrome=1">↩↩<met
> 
> 
> *Error*: Duplicate ID nav.
> 
> From line 201, column 61; to line 201, column 105
> 
> wn-hover"><ul id="nav" data-content-field="navigation">↩ ↩↩
> 
> 
> *Warning*: The first occurrence of ID nav was here.
> 
> From line 65, column 26; to line 65, column 38
> 
> main-nav"><ul id="nav">↩ ↩↩
> 
> 
> *Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.
> 
> From line 362, column 351; to line 362, column 967
> 
> /noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="#justgoshoot #peoplescreatives #visualsoflife #funkopop #smallfigure #…ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="571ab52888eb5164e8b337c5" data-type="image" />↩
> 
> Attributes for element img:
> Global attributes
> alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
> src - Address of the resource
> srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
> sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
> crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
> usemap - Name of image map to use
> ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
> width - Horizontal dimension
> height - Vertical dimension
> *Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.
> 
> From line 393, column 167; to line 394, column 576
> 
> /noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="Por ahí en Bayamón↩#justgoshoot #peoplescreatives #visualsoflife #funkopop #smallfigure #pr #longexposure #flash #photo…ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="5719ac9df0bc3393da5adc1a" data-type="image" />↩
> 
> Attributes for element img:
> Global attributes
> alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
> src - Address of the resource
> srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
> sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
> crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
> usemap - Name of image map to use
> ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
> width - Horizontal dimension
> height - Vertical dimension
> *Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.
> 
> From line 423, column 368; to line 423, column 1001
> 
> /noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="#justgoshoot #peoplescreatives #visualsoflife #funkopop #smallfigure #…ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="5718f9cd554f016efb058dcb" data-type="image" />↩
> 
> Attributes for element img:
> Global attributes
> alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
> src - Address of the resource
> srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
> sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
> crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
> usemap - Name of image map to use
> ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
> width - Horizontal dimension
> height - Vertical dimension
> *Error*: Element img is missing required attribute src.
> 
> From line 456, column 170; to line 458, column 579
> 
> /noscript><img class="thumb-image" alt="The One with the Funko Pop!↩↩@popvinyl @daily_funko #showcase #chandler #comedy #photography #nikon #commentonthis # followmyart …ocal-point="0.5,0.5" data-load="false" data-image-id="5718257975bcc074369ceef8" data-type="image" />↩
> 
> Attributes for element img:
> Global attributes
> alt - Replacement text for use when images are not available
> src - Address of the resource
> srcset - Images to use in different situations (e.g., high-resolution displays, small monitors, etc)
> sizes - Image sizes between breakpoints
> crossorigin - How the element handles crossorigin requests
> usemap - Name of image map to use
> ismap - Whether the image is a server-side image map
> width - Horizontal dimension
> height - Vertical dimension
> *Error*: Element style not allowed as child of element div in this context. (Suppressing further errors from this subtree.)
> 
> From line 479, column 1; to line 479, column 44
> 
> /div>↩↩↩↩↩<style type="text/css" id="design-grid-css">↩#bloc
> 
> Contexts in which element style may be used:
> If the scoped attribute is absent: where metadata content is expected.
> If the scoped attribute is absent: in a noscript element that is a child of a head element.
> If the scoped attribute is present: where flow content is expected, but before any other flow content other than inter-element whitespace and style elements, and not as the child of an element whose content model is transparent.
> Content model for element div:
> Flow content.
> *Warning*: Section lacks heading. Consider using h2-h6 elements to add identifying headings to all sections.
> 
> From line 315, column 25; to line 315, column 43
> 
> eWrapper"><section id="page">↩
> 
> 
> *Error*: The center element is obsolete. Use CSS instead.
> 
> From line 490, column 9; to line 490, column 16
> 
> >↩ <center><a hre
> Good Luck.


Works for me.


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## Derrel

Worked great for me  as well...no issues.


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## Vtec44

We all have to start somewhere and it's up to you if you want to take on this gig or not.  Will it worth your time?  Can you use the photos for your own portfolio to attract more clients?  Do you want to do this?  Those are the questions that you have to answer yourself honestly.


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## TheLibrarian

Teenage kid working at Disney world charges $25 to get your picture taken coming down the log flume or standing with Mickey in pretty uninspired situations. 

Kids at prom should have a camera but so should people at amusement parks.


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## table1349

Actually the photographers at Disney are paid by the hour not the photos they sell.  They don't sell photos.  Disney sells photo passes.  All of the photos go to one central database under the pass holders name.  The have loads of photographers assigned to various areas who take photos for anyone all that want.  Most people by a photo pass upfront which gives them all of the photos that are taken of them and their group for download later.  
Disney PhotoPass® Service


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## table1349

While I agree with Vtech, keep in mind every kid with a phone, what kid doesn't have a phone, is going to have a camera with him or her.  If they are looking for photos of the formal part of the prom you are looking at basically having a setup that matches the theme of the prom.  Couples, groups come and have their photo taken.  

Personally these days I am not so sure there is any money to be made in it.  You better bet would to pursue the pre prom business, where you are hired by the parent to take quality photos prior to prom.  The parents are more likely to be paying clients the the prom attendees themselves.


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